[RCSE] Full size electric aircraft

[Phil Townsend]

http://blog.wired.com/cars/2008/08/the-company-cla.html


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Re: [RCSE] Tullahom Fall Soaring Contest Typo

[Chuck Anderson]

While the Coffee Airfoilers have been holding 
sailplane contests for a long time, it's not been 
quite that long.  It should have read " for the last 38 years."


At 08:00 PM 8/6/2008, you wrote:
Why are we not flying all classes both days as 
we have been doing for the last 338 years.


Chuck

At 05:25 PM 8/6/2008, you wrote:

The Tullahoma, Tn Coffee Airfoilers announce 
the Fall RC Soaring Contest for RES and 
Unlimited sailplanes September 13/14 at the 
club field with pilots meeting scheduled for 
9:00 am.  We will fly RES on Saturday the 13th 
and Unlimited on Sunday the 14th. The format 
will be Man-on-Man ­ task to be 
determined.  Awards:  1st, 2nd, and 3rd for 
each day. Come join us at one of the finest 
flying sites in the Southeast.  CD Don 
Cleveland: contact 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
For field information see http://www.cafes.net/herb/


Don
www.donclevelandrealty.com




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Re: [RCSE] "I have a Challenge for JR/Spectrum DSM Radios!"

[Mike Lachowski]

Now that's Hot.


Actually, with anything new, there are always non-believers or rumors 
that have a life of their own on the Internet.



Happy JR 12X pilot with some Nats wood.


[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Too bad its going to have to wait!
 
I don't know if you guys can read, or read the Model Airplane News, or 
some of the others, but on the back page JR DSM and Spectrum have 
thrown down the gauntlet, put their systems where their money is..and 
have set up monthly challenges to their systems.
 
For instanceCal Orr challenge them to send him 40 systems to have 
on simultaneously, while testing with what I guess is a Spectrum 
Analyzer and other stuff.I suppose because there has been the 
rumor about 40 monkeys at 40 radios all wiggling the sticks 40 times 
per ...etc
 
Anyway, the next one was a heat test...they put an RX with remote into 
an oven powered up with test gear and found that at about 200+ degrees 
the case melted but the RX kept on working.


Looks like they are serious about this 2.4 stuff and aren't waiting 
for some to find a glitch...they want to show us, or I should say 
prove to us that their system really works, not just seems to work in 
model airplanes just fine.


What an expensive and whacky way to show their customers that their 
DSM system really is/ working./
// 
Got to love fellow sailplaners who also sell radios :-)
 
They must think we are all from Missouri !
 
Can't wait to see what challenges they give themselves next.


Gordy
Home for the week




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Re: [RCSE] Tullahom Fall Soaring Contest

[Chuck Anderson]

Why are we not flying all classes both days as we 
have been doing for the last 338 years.


Chuck

At 05:25 PM 8/6/2008, you wrote:

The Tullahoma, Tn Coffee Airfoilers announce the 
Fall RC Soaring Contest for RES and Unlimited 
sailplanes September 13/14 at the club field 
with pilots meeting scheduled for 9:00 am.  We 
will fly RES on Saturday the 13th and Unlimited 
on Sunday the 14th. The format will be 
Man-on-Man – task to be 
determined.  Awards:  1st, 2nd, and 3rd for each 
day. Come join us at one of the finest flying 
sites in the Southeast.  CD Don Cleveland: 
contact 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
For field information see http://www.cafes.net/herb/


Don
www.donclevelandrealty.com




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[RCSE] Albuquerque Soaring Association F5J World Challenge

[bgtwining]

This year's F5J World Challenge will be held at the Macintosh sod farm (east
of Albuquerque) on September 13th and 14th. There will be open flying on the
12th. The web site for information and sign-ups can be found at the
following link.

http://www.soarabq.org/f5j_wc_2008/f5j_main.shtml

We would love to have a big turnout and our CD Phil Gilbert is doing his
best to call in great weather. Sign up while your frequency is clear.

Bruce Twining



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[RCSE] Sold

[Miron Popescu]

Both the Grand Esteem and the electric Polaris has been sold.  Mike
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[RCSE] Tullahom Fall Soaring Contest

[DClevel130]

 
The Tullahoma,  Tn Coffee Airfoilers announce the Fall RC  Soaring Contest 
for RES and Unlimited sailplanes September 13/14 at the club  field with pilots 
meeting scheduled for 9:00  am.  We will fly RES on  Saturday the 13th and 
Unlimited on Sunday the 14th. The format will  be Man-on-Man – task to be 
determined.  Awards:  1st,  2nd, and 3rd for each day. Come join us at one of 
the  
finest flying sites in the Southeast.  CD Don Cleveland:  contact 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) .  For field  information see 
http://www.cafes.net/herb/
 
Don
www.donclevelandrealty.com



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[RCSE] Looking for 50' Hosemonster Tubing - Unlimited Size

[Blayne Chastain]

Mark is out of town this month and I'd like to get my hands on some  
Hosemonster Tubing - 50' / Unlimited.  Anyone have some laying around  
they'd sell me?


Blayne Chastain
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Re: [RCSE] AVA vs Bubble Dancer - Buy vs. Build

[lincolnr]

Well, I don't know the exact definition of woody, but the Ava's wing and tail 
surfaces are primarily wood with carbon reinforcement. Unless that d-tube 
doesn't have any sheeting under it, and I'm not submitting mine for surgery. 
(hmm.., it's unpleasant but I could dig out those smashed tips and look at the 
inner panels). 

What the Ava most definitely is NOT is an EXACT copy of a Bubble Dancer, 
although certainly there is a high level of imitation. I suspect that if you 
could measure precisely enough, you would find that Mark's Bubble Dancer (as 
built by Mark) has performance numbers a little bit better than those of the 
Ava. For one thing, the "foil" shape on the tail is very different. Plus, the 
Bubble Dancer's tips have d-tube sheeting and the Ava's do not. (I have heard 
(or perhaps read?) Mark comment on the performance penalty of not sheeting tips 
a number of times.) Structurally, if I recall correctly the sheeting on the 
Bubble Dancer is just wood, while there's carbon-kevlar cloth on the outside of 
the Ava's d-tube. Also, I think the Bubble Dancer uses hefty wood ribs and 
substantial wood trailing edge where the Ava uses skinny wood with carbon cap 
strips. Hence the infamous picture of the buckling Ava t.e. on landing. I can 
tell you that it seems sturdy when it's in one piece but it kind!
 of crumbles when you break it. Which is ok if you're just going to buy 
replacement parts.

The Ava is built to a high level of workmanship, and I think you'd have to 
build a Bubble Dancer to nearly the same level if you wanted to exceed the 
Ava's performance.

On the other hand, I think the Ava is close enough that you shouldn't feel 
handicapped or use it for excuses. It flies very well. Using it for my LSF hour 
flight felt like cheating.


 Original message 
>Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 09:45:37 -0400
>From: "TJB" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  
>Subject: Re: [RCSE] AVA vs Bubble Dancer - Buy vs. Build  
>To: "Ed Anderson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,,<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
>The AVA is not a woody, so the Bubble Dancer (Mike L won the RES NATS with 
>his) is the best choice if you want to compete in woody events.
>
>T
>- Original Message - 
>From: "Ed Anderson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: ; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2008 7:34 AM
>Subject: [RCSE] AVA vs Bubble Dancer - Buy vs. Build
>
>
>> Lincoln,
>>
>> Build vs. buy;  is it just an economic question?
>>
>> As we all know, the AVA is almost an exact copy of Mark Drela's Bubble
>> Dancer.  It is a little bigger and a little heavier, but other than that, 
>> we
>> can consider it the Bubble Dancer ARF. But is it a good value, or is it a
>> high priced package?
>>
>> A group of guys at my club got together and made up Bubble Dancer kits 
>> this
>> past winter, five of them.  It included a premade molded fuselage and 
>> boom.
>> To create the kits cost around $310.  I don't know how long the build 
>> took.
>> I bought one of the kits, took a look at the build, and sold the kit to
>> another club member.  I bought an AVA.  I am not a builder, and that build
>> would have been way over my head.  For me the cost of the ARF was cheap
>> compared to the time investment to build.
>>
>> Denny, at www.polecataero.com  was selling an EZBD kit for a while for 
>> $340.
>> Based on the work my club members did to create those kits, Denny's kit
>> seems very reasonable in price.  And he claims it is a faster build. 
>> Based
>> on the quality of his other planes, I would trust a kit from Polecat.
>>
>> Now, if someone likes the AVA and wants to build it for themselves, then
>> build the Bubble Dancer.  Based on what I have seen at the field, the 
>> Bubble
>> Dancer is just as much of a super ship as the ARFs that copy it.  And, it 
>> is
>> a real "builder's" plane.  But it takes a lot of work time to build.  If
>> building is your pleasure, it is time is well spent.  However if you look 
>> at
>> it as time equals money or building time subtracts from other activities,
>> then you are doing a make/buy economic decision.
>>
>> If you take the time to build a Bubble Dancer into account, I agree, the
>> AVA, the Topaz, the Soprano and similar ships are a real good value. 
>> Unless
>> you love to build, there is little economic justification to building the
>> kit over the available high quality ARFs.   If you love to build, then the
>> hours spent building are a joy in itself and the money saved is of no
>> importance and an AVA offers little value to someone who loves to build.
>>
>> Ed Anderson
>>
>>> Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2008 00:17:05 -0400
>>> From: Lincoln Ross <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>> To:  Soaring@airage.com
>>> Subject: re: RES vs UNL vs DLG
>>> Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>>
>>> First off, let's put my alleged divinity aside for the duration of this
>>> post.
>>>
>>> People whine too loudly about the super ships in RES. I've beaten some
>>> of them with 25 year old pieces of crap. On a good day it doesn't matter
>>> that  much. Unless

[RCSE] Hot information is better than a fixed system :-)

[GordySoar]

The wise guy answer is the Futaba system doesn't need  anything like that.  
Seriously there has been no known problems with the  Futaba 2.4 Fasst systems. 
There WAS a minor issue with the 6014 receiver locking  out in extreme 
temperatures if left in direct sunlight. The case temperature  needed to get to 
160. 
It has been corrected.  
 
 
 
 
Actually this is exactly my point about having a personal way to check our  
installs and systems...everything was okay up tilit got hot. That kind of  
discovery can happen to any new product and usually gets fixed...but its our  
models that I'm worried about.
 
Euro trash is getting so expensive, and hard to get, the good ole days of  
just ordering another one with out letting the wife know are over.
 
Being able to check our system integrity flight by flight is slightly  better 
than assurances that the equipment is good quality.  Two separate  things 
actually.  The integrity of the equipment design and it being  installed in our 
personal model.  That was the reason I asked about the  other brands maybe 
catching up with their own device to check.
 
 
 
 
In a message dated 8/6/2008 4:05:06 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

The wise  guy answer is the Futaba system doesn't need anything like that.  
Seriously there has been no known problems with the Futaba 2.4 Fasst  systems. 
There WAS a minor issue with the 6014 receiver locking out in extreme  
temperatures if left in direct sunlight. The case temperature needed to get to  
160. 
It has been corrected.   


People are really missing out with the Futaba 14MZ. It is the ultimate  
system that won't be surpassed.


Darwin

On Aug 6, 2008, at 11:11 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED])  
wrote:



Hi guys,
 
I was just wondering if anyone heard if they are going to provide a  Flight 
Log type device like the JR DSM system...so that we can be assured of  the best 
possible and safest installations in our planes?
 
With the cost of models going crazy and demand zooming, losing one is  
becoming a whole new level of ouch.

So anyone hear of them offering and on board  checker?

Gordy



 

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 .





=




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[RCSE] Re: Soaring V1 #11513

[DENDKN]

Gordy,
 
Futaba may offer a logging device, but it will not be needed with this  
system to verify the placement of up to four rxs.  With the Futaba Rx  antenna 
system only one Rx is needed for excellent performance in sailplanes,  even 
those 
with extensive carbon structure.
 
Dale Nutter



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Re: [RCSE] Have you been reading the MVSA's flying reports?

[tony estep]

Thanks for the plug, Ben! Our website is always good for a little entertainment 
value -- check it out, folks.

- Original Message 

From: Ben Wilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [RCSE] Have you been reading the MVSA's flying reports?

You should be!

Some great writing on soaring going on there in the Mid-West. Always a 
pleasure to read, with some great photos.

http://www.mvsaclub.com/mvsa/Flying_Reports/Flying_Reports.html

Ben Wilson
Louisville Area Soaring Society
http://www.louisvillesoaring.org

[RCSE] "Has anyone heard if Futa or Airt are going to provide a Flight Log 'r Device?"

[GordySoar]

Hi guys,
 
I was just wondering if anyone heard if they are going to provide a Flight  
Log type device like the JR DSM system...so that we can be assured of the best  
possible and safest installations in our planes?
 
With the cost of models going crazy and demand zooming, losing one is  
becoming a whole new level of ouch.

So anyone hear of them offering and on board  checker?

Gordy



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[RCSE] Re: Harley Michaelis' Genie Line of Sailplanes

[Augie McKibben]

For some reason my links were changed in my email.
Here they are again and should be working.
http://www.geniebuild.com/
http://www.geniebuild.com/harleys_genie.html

Thanks you,
Augie

- Original Message - 
From: Augie McKibben

To: soaring@airage.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2008 8:15 AM
Subject: Harley Michaelis' Genie Line of Sailplanes


Harley Michaelis is one of those rare individuals in RC soaring community 
that is both innovative and generous. By continually refining and sharing 
his designs over the past 30 plus years, whether through magazine articles, 
his long standing web site or participating in the soaring community's 
on-line conversations, he has made immeasurable contributions to the world 
of RC soaring.


A couple of years ago, members of the local club I belong to asked if I 
would like to participate in a club build of the Genie. Admittedly, I had no 
experience with Harley's Genie, full house gliders in general and little 
experience with bagging wings. I had always been a proud and staunch wooden 
model builder. I agreed to take on the challenge and during the process of 
researching and building the Genie found a hidden love for the model. The 
design is well thought out from nose to tail with lines that are both 
distinctive and graceful.


As I learned to build my first Genie and then the second and now on my 
third, I have kept in touch with Harley, asking questions and getting 
advice, hopefully getting a little better at building each time. Harley has 
been an inexhaustible source of advice for me. As I learned to fly my first 
full house glider I became more enthusiastic for the Genie. And when my 
second Genie (a Genie Pro) finally moved from the bench to the field, I was 
hooked. Right then and there I could not imagine flying another glider.


A few months ago, I had started a web page to follow my third and eventually 
fourth Genie build http://www.geniebuild.com/ to share my build experience 
and help promote scratch building in general. These pages will go up and 
down as projects are started and completed.


Just as this summer was getting starting, Harley and friend Mark Miller 
(Isthmus Models) had inquired if I would be interested in taking over the 
task of sourcing parts and putting together parts packages for those glider 
guiders that want to build one of the Genie line. Flattered that Harley 
trusts that I can effectively and faithfully carry on supporting and 
promoting the Genie line of sailplane, I have accepted. I will be sourcing 
and shipping the full line of Genie parts, plans and instructions, while 
maintaining the web site and on-line pdf's at it's new address 
http://www.geniebuild.com/harleys_genie.html.


Best regards,
Michael "Augie" McKibben
LSF IV - 7720 


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[RCSE] "Oh Oh, JR/Spectrum is affected by heat!!! Okay the cases are ;-)"

[GordySoar]

I had to visit the library this morning and re read the JR Challenge page,  
the case melted at 300 degrees, and the RX still worked fine.
 
I don't believe it so I've got all my JR Rxs on the BBQ cooking right  now.  
Think the plastic will make my steak taste  funny?
Gordy



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[RCSE] Wanted: Standard AVA Pod

[David Beach]

Have you converted your AVA to 2.4G, and you are not sure what to do with
the old pod?  Why not sell it to me?

Please contact me off line - mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Thanks,
David



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Re: [RCSE] AVA vs Bubble Dancer - Buy vs. Build

[TJB]

The AVA is not a woody, so the Bubble Dancer (Mike L won the RES NATS with 
his) is the best choice if you want to compete in woody events.


T
- Original Message - 
From: "Ed Anderson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: ; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2008 7:34 AM
Subject: [RCSE] AVA vs Bubble Dancer - Buy vs. Build



Lincoln,

Build vs. buy;  is it just an economic question?

As we all know, the AVA is almost an exact copy of Mark Drela's Bubble
Dancer.  It is a little bigger and a little heavier, but other than that, 
we

can consider it the Bubble Dancer ARF. But is it a good value, or is it a
high priced package?

A group of guys at my club got together and made up Bubble Dancer kits 
this
past winter, five of them.  It included a premade molded fuselage and 
boom.
To create the kits cost around $310.  I don't know how long the build 
took.

I bought one of the kits, took a look at the build, and sold the kit to
another club member.  I bought an AVA.  I am not a builder, and that build
would have been way over my head.  For me the cost of the ARF was cheap
compared to the time investment to build.

Denny, at www.polecataero.com  was selling an EZBD kit for a while for 
$340.

Based on the work my club members did to create those kits, Denny's kit
seems very reasonable in price.  And he claims it is a faster build. 
Based

on the quality of his other planes, I would trust a kit from Polecat.

Now, if someone likes the AVA and wants to build it for themselves, then
build the Bubble Dancer.  Based on what I have seen at the field, the 
Bubble
Dancer is just as much of a super ship as the ARFs that copy it.  And, it 
is

a real "builder's" plane.  But it takes a lot of work time to build.  If
building is your pleasure, it is time is well spent.  However if you look 
at

it as time equals money or building time subtracts from other activities,
then you are doing a make/buy economic decision.

If you take the time to build a Bubble Dancer into account, I agree, the
AVA, the Topaz, the Soprano and similar ships are a real good value. 
Unless

you love to build, there is little economic justification to building the
kit over the available high quality ARFs.   If you love to build, then the
hours spent building are a joy in itself and the money saved is of no
importance and an AVA offers little value to someone who loves to build.

Ed Anderson


Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2008 00:17:05 -0400
From: Lincoln Ross <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:  Soaring@airage.com
Subject: re: RES vs UNL vs DLG
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

First off, let's put my alleged divinity aside for the duration of this
post.

People whine too loudly about the super ships in RES. I've beaten some
of them with 25 year old pieces of crap. On a good day it doesn't matter
that  much. Unless you get extra bonus points for landing a pretty ship,
you can get the same 100 landing points with an old trainer.  I'll admit
that on tough days having an Ava improves your chances. However, the Ava
is quite a deal. $700 or so. A top of the line unlimited like the Supra
is going to run you somewhere between almost twice to almost three times
that. If you insist on someone else building the glider, an Ava or
similar is quite a deal. I figure it would take me more than 100 hours
to build something like that, and it wouldn't be as nice. Would take
less time to get a second job flipping burgers and buy the Ava..

If you want to build gliders yourself, well then things are still cheap,
but there are so few people who want to do that that kits are hard to
find. Remember that these dollars are worth a lot less than the ones we
had in the '80s, when as I recall  people would spend what I recall as
the better part of $300 on a Windsong kit and spend 100 hours BUILDING
it. I spent maybe 60 hours building a Cumic back in 1990, and it turned
out to be a real dog. Not like the Sagitta wings I'd build before.

Actually, I do want to do a little building, but it doesn't make
economic sense when I'm working full time.

Possibly kits will make a comeback when wages in the rest of the world
get close to what they are in the USA. (That's a good thing, by the way,
except maybe for the environment.)

BTW, although I've flown 2M a LOT, I think 100 inches would have been
the better limited size.




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[RCSE] Pike Perfect for Sale

[Mike Verzuh]

Guys,

I have a Pike Perfect SL for sale. It is brand new still not assembled. The
plane is Safety Yellow over Dark Purple. This color is going to really pop
for visibility, and overall the plane is striking. The fuse is a 2.4GHz
friendly version. The Super Light configuration is really outstanding for US
Thermal Duration and light air F3j.

I also have (3) JR 3421 servos with Greening mounts for the flaps and
elevator and (1) JR368 servo for the rudder. All the servos are brand new.

I would consider building this plane for you if desired.

With the Euro still climbing these planes are going to push the $1800 mark
soon if not already. I am asking $1725 for the plane, and wholesale price
for the servos and mounts (DS3421s @ $75ea and DS368 @ $60). I will sell the
servos separately.

This plane won’t last so please give me a call ASAP if you are interested.

Mike Verzuh
RMSA President
(303) 709-3232

[RCSE] Have you been reading the MVSA's flying reports?

[Ben Wilson]

You should be!

Some great writing on soaring going on there in the Mid-West. Always a 
pleasure to read, with some great photos.


http://www.mvsaclub.com/mvsa/Flying_Reports/Flying_Reports.html

Ben Wilson
Louisville Area Soaring Society
http://www.louisvillesoaring.org
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RE: [RCSE] "I have a Challenge for JR/Spectrum DSM Radios!"

[Pat McCleave]

Tom,

Now that's funny stuff.  I don't care who you are.

See Ya,

Pat


 TG Bean <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: 
> 
> Fade in...
> Commentator: We are here at the first national debate of the year. We have 
> our JR 2.4 system and will be flying a foamy during the Presidential debates. 
> The test??? Can our system stand up to possibly the largest interference 
> factor known to man??? The bulls&*t slung by politicianslet's watch.
>  
> Gordy will be our pilot today and as he takes off it is worth noting that the 
> 2.4 system has performed flawlessly for years around Gordy and some have said 
> that as far as this type of test, the system has more than proven itself.
> However it is worth noting that while Gordy can "sling it with the best of 
> them" the type of verbal refuse slung during a Presidential debate has a 
> consistency all its own. 
>  
> Gordy is performing a series of spectacular manuvers while the debate rages 
> on, and as expectedno glitches are noted.
>  
> So is this the ultimate test of this system? It's hard to know for sure, but 
> one thing is positive. If it can stand up to Gordy flying during a 
> Presidential debate, it can handle just about anything.
>  
> Tom
> 
> 
> 
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Tue, 5 Aug 2008 23:49:38 -0400Subject: [RCSE] "I 
> have a Challenge for JR/Spectrum DSM Radios!"To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: [EMAIL 
> PROTECTED]
> 
> Too bad its going to have to wait!
>  
> I don't know if you guys can read, or read the Model Airplane News, or some 
> of the others, but on the back page JR DSM and Spectrum have thrown down the 
> gauntlet, put their systems where their money is..and have set up monthly 
> challenges to their systems.
>  
> For instanceCal Orr challenge them to send him 40 systems to have on 
> simultaneously, while testing with what I guess is a Spectrum Analyzer and 
> other stuff.I suppose because there has been the rumor about 40 monkeys 
> at 40 radios all wiggling the sticks 40 times per ...etc
>  
> Anyway, the next one was a heat test...they put an RX with remote into an 
> oven powered up with test gear and found that at about 200+ degrees the case 
> melted but the RX kept on working.
> Looks like they are serious about this 2.4 stuff and aren't waiting for some 
> to find a glitch...they want to show us, or I should say prove to us that 
> their system really works, not just seems to work in model airplanes just 
> fine.
> What an expensive and whacky way to show their customers that their DSM 
> system really is working.
>  
> Got to love fellow sailplaners who also sell radios :-)
>  
> They must think we are all from Missouri !
>  
> Can't wait to see what challenges they give themselves next.
> Gordy
> Home for the week
> 
> 
> Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? Read reviews on 
> AOL Autos.
> _
> Your PC, mobile phone, and online services work together like never before.
> http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/108587394/direct/01/

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RE: [RCSE] "I have a Challenge for JR/Spectrum DSM Radios!"

[TG Bean]

Fade in...
Commentator: We are here at the first national debate of the year. We have our 
JR 2.4 system and will be flying a foamy during the Presidential debates. The 
test??? Can our system stand up to possibly the largest interference factor 
known to man??? The bulls&*t slung by politicianslet's watch.
 
Gordy will be our pilot today and as he takes off it is worth noting that the 
2.4 system has performed flawlessly for years around Gordy and some have said 
that as far as this type of test, the system has more than proven itself.
However it is worth noting that while Gordy can "sling it with the best of 
them" the type of verbal refuse slung during a Presidential debate has a 
consistency all its own. 
 
Gordy is performing a series of spectacular manuvers while the debate rages on, 
and as expectedno glitches are noted.
 
So is this the ultimate test of this system? It's hard to know for sure, but 
one thing is positive. If it can stand up to Gordy flying during a Presidential 
debate, it can handle just about anything.
 
Tom



From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Tue, 5 Aug 2008 23:49:38 -0400Subject: [RCSE] "I have 
a Challenge for JR/Spectrum DSM Radios!"To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Too bad its going to have to wait!
 
I don't know if you guys can read, or read the Model Airplane News, or some of 
the others, but on the back page JR DSM and Spectrum have thrown down the 
gauntlet, put their systems where their money is..and have set up monthly 
challenges to their systems.
 
For instanceCal Orr challenge them to send him 40 systems to have on 
simultaneously, while testing with what I guess is a Spectrum Analyzer and 
other stuff.I suppose because there has been the rumor about 40 monkeys at 
40 radios all wiggling the sticks 40 times per ...etc
 
Anyway, the next one was a heat test...they put an RX with remote into an oven 
powered up with test gear and found that at about 200+ degrees the case melted 
but the RX kept on working.
Looks like they are serious about this 2.4 stuff and aren't waiting for some to 
find a glitch...they want to show us, or I should say prove to us that their 
system really works, not just seems to work in model airplanes just fine.
What an expensive and whacky way to show their customers that their DSM system 
really is working.
 
Got to love fellow sailplaners who also sell radios :-)
 
They must think we are all from Missouri !
 
Can't wait to see what challenges they give themselves next.
Gordy
Home for the week


Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your budget? Read reviews on 
AOL Autos.
_
Your PC, mobile phone, and online services work together like never before.
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/108587394/direct/01/

[RCSE] AVA vs Bubble Dancer - Buy vs. Build

[Ed Anderson]

Lincoln,

Build vs. buy;  is it just an economic question?

As we all know, the AVA is almost an exact copy of Mark Drela's Bubble
Dancer.  It is a little bigger and a little heavier, but other than that, we
can consider it the Bubble Dancer ARF. But is it a good value, or is it a
high priced package?

A group of guys at my club got together and made up Bubble Dancer kits this
past winter, five of them.  It included a premade molded fuselage and boom.
To create the kits cost around $310.  I don't know how long the build took.
I bought one of the kits, took a look at the build, and sold the kit to
another club member.  I bought an AVA.  I am not a builder, and that build
would have been way over my head.  For me the cost of the ARF was cheap
compared to the time investment to build.

Denny, at www.polecataero.com  was selling an EZBD kit for a while for $340.
Based on the work my club members did to create those kits, Denny's kit
seems very reasonable in price.  And he claims it is a faster build.  Based
on the quality of his other planes, I would trust a kit from Polecat.

Now, if someone likes the AVA and wants to build it for themselves, then
build the Bubble Dancer.  Based on what I have seen at the field, the Bubble
Dancer is just as much of a super ship as the ARFs that copy it.  And, it is
a real "builder's" plane.  But it takes a lot of work time to build.  If
building is your pleasure, it is time is well spent.  However if you look at
it as time equals money or building time subtracts from other activities,
then you are doing a make/buy economic decision.

If you take the time to build a Bubble Dancer into account, I agree, the
AVA, the Topaz, the Soprano and similar ships are a real good value.  Unless
you love to build, there is little economic justification to building the
kit over the available high quality ARFs.   If you love to build, then the
hours spent building are a joy in itself and the money saved is of no
importance and an AVA offers little value to someone who loves to build.

Ed Anderson

> Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2008 00:17:05 -0400
> From: Lincoln Ross <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To:  Soaring@airage.com
> Subject: re: RES vs UNL vs DLG
> Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> First off, let's put my alleged divinity aside for the duration of this
> post.
>
> People whine too loudly about the super ships in RES. I've beaten some
> of them with 25 year old pieces of crap. On a good day it doesn't matter
> that  much. Unless you get extra bonus points for landing a pretty ship,
> you can get the same 100 landing points with an old trainer.  I'll admit
> that on tough days having an Ava improves your chances. However, the Ava
> is quite a deal. $700 or so. A top of the line unlimited like the Supra
> is going to run you somewhere between almost twice to almost three times
> that. If you insist on someone else building the glider, an Ava or
> similar is quite a deal. I figure it would take me more than 100 hours
> to build something like that, and it wouldn't be as nice. Would take
> less time to get a second job flipping burgers and buy the Ava..
>
> If you want to build gliders yourself, well then things are still cheap,
> but there are so few people who want to do that that kits are hard to
> find. Remember that these dollars are worth a lot less than the ones we
> had in the '80s, when as I recall  people would spend what I recall as
> the better part of $300 on a Windsong kit and spend 100 hours BUILDING
> it. I spent maybe 60 hours building a Cumic back in 1990, and it turned
> out to be a real dog. Not like the Sagitta wings I'd build before.
>
> Actually, I do want to do a little building, but it doesn't make
> economic sense when I'm working full time.
>
> Possibly kits will make a comeback when wages in the rest of the world
> get close to what they are in the USA. (That's a good thing, by the way,
> except maybe for the environment.)
>
> BTW, although I've flown 2M a LOT, I think 100 inches would have been
> the better limited size.
>


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