Re: [Soekris] spontaneous reboot with large packet flows on net5501+lan1741
On 18 Feb 2015, Conrad Kostecki told this: Please note that there is limited power available for the three PCI expansion connectors. There are only 20W available on the 3.3V power pins and 5V pins combined. If a 2.5” hard disk is used, it will also need to share the available power. An onboard DC-DC converter supplies +12V @ 0.3A and 12V @ 0.1A to the PCI connector. If the board is powered by 12V then a bypass circuit will supply up to 1A of the 12V to the PCI connector. Still... power-wise, the only things I have plugged into mine are the lan1741 and a Simtec Entropy Key into the USB port. I'll do a power monitor of the thing with some major network traffic this weekend and see what happens. -- NULL (void) ___ Soekris-tech mailing list Soekris-tech@lists.soekris.com http://lists.soekris.com/mailman/listinfo/soekris-tech
Re: [Soekris] spontaneous reboot with large packet flows on net5501+lan1741
On 17 Feb 2015, n...@esperi.org.uk spake thusly: On 17 Feb 2015, Andrew Atrens told this: It's almost certainly a power issue as power draw for the lan card will not be a static thing - ie will increase when transmitting packets vs idle. Yes, only I'd expect the increase in power draw to be the same when the built-in ports fire up, and *those* work fine. Does the LAN card draw more power than the built-in ports for a given amount of work, or something? As of a few minuts ago, I can verify that there's enough power to really, really run the built-in ports hard even when a lan1741 is installed. I was maxing it out for hours over two built-in ports, ~15,000 packets a second on each port, ~8MiB/s, pretty close to line speed, plus normal (a few packets/sec) ADSL usage on the other two built-in ports. The machine took it happily, even though software interrupt CPU usage often spiked to nearly 100%. This sort of load would have rebooted it within moments if the lan1741 had been participating. -- NULL (void) ___ Soekris-tech mailing list Soekris-tech@lists.soekris.com http://lists.soekris.com/mailman/listinfo/soekris-tech
Re: [Soekris] spontaneous reboot with large packet flows on net5501+lan1741
The net5501 manual states: Please note that there is limited power available for the three PCI expansion connectors. There are only 20W available on the 3.3V power pins and 5V pins combined. If a 2.5” hard disk is used, it will also need to share the available power. An onboard DC-DC converter supplies +12V @ 0.3A and 12V @ 0.1A to the PCI connector. If the board is powered by 12V then a bypass circuit will supply up to 1A of the 12V to the PCI connector. So this is much lower, than you could power with 5A @ 12V.. Cheers Conrad ___ Soekris-tech mailing list Soekris-tech@lists.soekris.com http://lists.soekris.com/mailman/listinfo/soekris-tech
Re: [Soekris] spontaneous reboot with large packet flows on net5501+lan1741
On Wed, Feb 18, 2015 at 02:21:22PM +, Conrad Kostecki wrote: The net5501 manual states: Please note that there is limited power available for the three PCI expansion connectors. There are only 20W available on the 3.3V power pins and 5V pins combined. If a 2.5” hard disk is used, it will also need to share the available power. An onboard DC-DC converter supplies +12V @ 0.3A and 12V @ 0.1A to the PCI connector. If the board is powered by 12V then a bypass circuit will supply up to 1A of the 12V to the PCI connector. Thank you! From this I'm can guess that my issue may not be the OS upgrade from OpenBSD 5.2 to 5.5. It might be that when I upgraded to 5.5 I also turned on the automatic CPU throttling. It might be a good guess that my power situation was marginal before and that allowing the CPU to throttle up to higher speed is occasionally dropping the power below what the level where the PCI bus remains stable? That will be rather easy to test. One thing I do know is that the Intel gigabit boards generate a lot of heat. In fact the heat is the reason I upgraded to the larger rack mount case. -- Chris __o All I was trying to do was get home from work. _`\,_ -Rosa Parks ___(*)/_(*).___o..___..o...ooO..._ Christopher Sean Hilton[chris/at/vindaloo/dot/com] ___ Soekris-tech mailing list Soekris-tech@lists.soekris.com http://lists.soekris.com/mailman/listinfo/soekris-tech
Re: [Soekris] spontaneous reboot with large packet flows on net5501+lan1741
Sorry, The Soekris Rackmount supply is 12V x 5.0A -- Chris On Feb 17, 2015, at 3:56 PM, Andrew Atrens wrote: 5A should be plenty I'd think .. but I guess it also depends on the voltage .. A few years ago I experienced issues with an ALIX board and a high power Ubiquiti/Atheros-based mini-PCI card .. if memory serves I think it was an XR-2 .. in that case though the miniPCI card would sort of brown out and that could lock up the PCI bus leading to a kernel crash or watchdog reset. In that situation the issue was internal to the PUPS on the ALiX board - a known limitation wrt how how much power could be supplied to the miniPCI slot. On 2015-02-17 2:02 PM, Christopher Sean Hilton wrote: On Tue, Feb 17, 2015 at 01:37:51PM -0500, Andrew Atrens wrote: Hi Nix, It's almost certainly a power issue as power draw for the lan card will not be a static thing - ie will increase when transmitting packets vs idle. That's an intersting theory. I also run an external nic in the PCI slot of a Net5501-60. In my case the OS is OpenBSD 5.5 and the nic card is an Intel dual Gigabit PCI-X unit. I also experience reboots of this configuration under high packet flows. In my case though my machine is in the Net5501 rack mount case with the 5.0A power supply. I will arrange to test by swapping to a newer 5501 rack mount case and retesting. Thanks -- Chris ___ Soekris-tech mailing list Soekris-tech@lists.soekris.com http://lists.soekris.com/mailman/listinfo/soekris-tech
Re: [Soekris] spontaneous reboot with large packet flows on net5501+lan1741
On 17 Feb 2015, Andrew Atrens told this: Hi Nix, It's almost certainly a power issue as power draw for the lan card will not be a static thing - ie will increase when transmitting packets vs idle. Yes, only I'd expect the increase in power draw to be the same when the built-in ports fire up, and *those* work fine. Does the LAN card draw more power than the built-in ports for a given amount of work, or something? Best case is that you have access to a DC-regulated power supply, perhaps one of these - http://www.bkprecision.com/products/power-supplies/1670A-triple-output-30v-3a-digital-display-dc-power-supply.html Boggle. No, I have nothing like that :) and can monitor the current draw as you bring up the board and test .. I do have one of those socket adaptors with an LCD display that shows you current draw, etc, but it only gives instantaneous figures, and of course it sits between the adaptor and the wall, on the wrong side... If the setup is stable on this power source, you can watch how much current the 5501 is drawing and from that figure out how much punch you'll need in a static power source. I'm quite happy to simply upgrade to a better adaptor than the Soekris-EU-supplied wall-wart -- but I have no idea what might constitute 'better' in this case: I am not by any stretch of the imagination an electrical engineer[1], and mostly treat power supplies as magic boxes that make things work :P [1] well, I'm good at killing things with static shocks, but that makes me an electrified engineer, I think... -- NULL (void) ___ Soekris-tech mailing list Soekris-tech@lists.soekris.com http://lists.soekris.com/mailman/listinfo/soekris-tech
[Soekris] spontaneous reboot with large packet flows on net5501+lan1741
So I just bought a lan1741 for my six-year-old net5501 (running the latest stable Linux kernel), because four ports just isn't *enough*. Unfortunately, it seems to not work entirely well. Enough packet flow over any ports on the lan1741 (not necessarily tiny packets either: a few thousand 1500-byte packets a second are enough) causes the net5501 to spontaneously reboot within a couple of minutes. The kernel never gets a look in, as far as I can see: the reset is immediate, nothing is logged, nothing is asserted. There is no such problem with the built-in ports (as long as the flow doesn't also involve a port on the lan1741), so my initial suspicion that the thing might be running out of power seems to be disproved. As it is, I have four ports on this machine that I can use only for things that might just about fill a 10MiB/s network or maybe even less (I haven't looked for the boundaries of this behaviour, though I might get out iperf and try). VoIP works on it, but anything heftier, like wifi, tends to cause reboots as soon as someone tries to, say, run a backup or do an apt-get or a pile of NFS traffic over that interface. So... has anyone seen this sort of thing before? Is this a known problem with the lan1741? -- NULL (void) ___ Soekris-tech mailing list Soekris-tech@lists.soekris.com http://lists.soekris.com/mailman/listinfo/soekris-tech
Re: [Soekris] spontaneous reboot with large packet flows on net5501+lan1741
On Tue, Feb 17, 2015 at 01:37:51PM -0500, Andrew Atrens wrote: Hi Nix, It's almost certainly a power issue as power draw for the lan card will not be a static thing - ie will increase when transmitting packets vs idle. That's an intersting theory. I also run an external nic in the PCI slot of a Net5501-60. In my case the OS is OpenBSD 5.5 and the nic card is an Intel dual Gigabit PCI-X unit. I also experience reboots of this configuration under high packet flows. In my case though my machine is in the Net5501 rack mount case with the 5.0A power supply. I will arrange to test by swapping to a newer 5501 rack mount case and retesting. Thanks -- Chris ___ Soekris-tech mailing list Soekris-tech@lists.soekris.com http://lists.soekris.com/mailman/listinfo/soekris-tech
Re: [Soekris] spontaneous reboot with large packet flows on net5501+lan1741
Hi Nix, It's almost certainly a power issue as power draw for the lan card will not be a static thing - ie will increase when transmitting packets vs idle. Best case is that you have access to a DC-regulated power supply, perhaps one of these - http://www.bkprecision.com/products/power-supplies/1670A-triple-output-30v-3a-digital-display-dc-power-supply.html and can monitor the current draw as you bring up the board and test .. If the setup is stable on this power source, you can watch how much current the 5501 is drawing and from that figure out how much punch you'll need in a static power source. Good luck! --Andrew On 2015-02-17 12:25 PM, Nix wrote: So I just bought a lan1741 for my six-year-old net5501 (running the latest stable Linux kernel), because four ports just isn't *enough*. Unfortunately, it seems to not work entirely well. Enough packet flow over any ports on the lan1741 (not necessarily tiny packets either: a few thousand 1500-byte packets a second are enough) causes the net5501 to spontaneously reboot within a couple of minutes. The kernel never gets a look in, as far as I can see: the reset is immediate, nothing is logged, nothing is asserted. There is no such problem with the built-in ports (as long as the flow doesn't also involve a port on the lan1741), so my initial suspicion that the thing might be running out of power seems to be disproved. As it is, I have four ports on this machine that I can use only for things that might just about fill a 10MiB/s network or maybe even less (I haven't looked for the boundaries of this behaviour, though I might get out iperf and try). VoIP works on it, but anything heftier, like wifi, tends to cause reboots as soon as someone tries to, say, run a backup or do an apt-get or a pile of NFS traffic over that interface. So... has anyone seen this sort of thing before? Is this a known problem with the lan1741? ___ Soekris-tech mailing list Soekris-tech@lists.soekris.com http://lists.soekris.com/mailman/listinfo/soekris-tech
Re: [Soekris] spontaneous reboot with large packet flows on net5501+lan1741
5A should be plenty I'd think .. but I guess it also depends on the voltage .. A few years ago I experienced issues with an ALIX board and a high power Ubiquiti/Atheros-based mini-PCI card .. if memory serves I think it was an XR-2 .. in that case though the miniPCI card would sort of brown out and that could lock up the PCI bus leading to a kernel crash or watchdog reset. In that situation the issue was internal to the PUPS on the ALiX board - a known limitation wrt how how much power could be supplied to the miniPCI slot. On 2015-02-17 2:02 PM, Christopher Sean Hilton wrote: On Tue, Feb 17, 2015 at 01:37:51PM -0500, Andrew Atrens wrote: Hi Nix, It's almost certainly a power issue as power draw for the lan card will not be a static thing - ie will increase when transmitting packets vs idle. That's an intersting theory. I also run an external nic in the PCI slot of a Net5501-60. In my case the OS is OpenBSD 5.5 and the nic card is an Intel dual Gigabit PCI-X unit. I also experience reboots of this configuration under high packet flows. In my case though my machine is in the Net5501 rack mount case with the 5.0A power supply. I will arrange to test by swapping to a newer 5501 rack mount case and retesting. Thanks -- Chris ___ Soekris-tech mailing list Soekris-tech@lists.soekris.com http://lists.soekris.com/mailman/listinfo/soekris-tech
