Re: [sqlalchemy] Support for Oracle 12c auto increment (IDENTITY) columns?

2016-04-13 Thread Mike Bayer 
three people chimed in on this thread in 20 minutes.  Surely some work 
can be done amongst those interested parties (share email addresses! 
get on irc!)  to try to get this working that I can just review and 
merge ?   :)





On 04/13/2016 07:57 AM, David Moore wrote:





*From: *"Piotr Dobrogost" <p...@2016.groups.google.dobrogost.net>
*To: *"sqlalchemy" <sqlalchemy@googlegroups.com>
*Sent: *Wednesday, April 13, 2016 1:50:19 PM
*Subject: *Re: [sqlalchemy] Support for Oracle 12c auto increment
(IDENTITY) columns?

Mike,

Thanks for your reply!

On Wednesday, April 13, 2016 at 1:15:32 PM UTC+2, Mike Bayer wrote:

We've not started supporting new oracle 12c features as of yet,
in this case it might be possible to get it working with some
dialect flags since we already use "returning" to get at the
newly generated primary key, although testing would be needed
and other assumptions in the dialect might get in the way.


Which flags do you have in mind? Looking at
http://docs.sqlalchemy.org/en/latest/dialects/oracle.html I don't
see anything which might be useful to make it work.

I was surprised Oracle needs different syntax with explicit sequence
in SA. Having one syntax for auto increment column (primary key)
across all backends seems like very important feature to have.  What
is the reason there's no Oracle dialect option to generate and use
suitable sequence for such column? Is there some recipe solving this
problem?


Regards,
Piotr Dobrogost

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 From the license under which you can use this
(http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/licenses/standard-license-152015.html):

*License Rights and Restrictions *
Oracle grants You a nonexclusive, nontransferable, limited license to
internally use the Programs, subject to the restrictions stated in this
Agreement, only for the purpose of developing, testing, prototyping, and
demonstrating Your application and only as long as Your application has
not been used for any data processing, business, commercial, or
production purposes, and not for any other purpose.

--

I suspect you would not be able to use this for developing and testing
sqlalchemy without breaking those terms.  Oracle can get really nasty
about using Developer Days when they think you've broken this agreement.

regards,

Dave Moore

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Re: [sqlalchemy] Support for Oracle 12c auto increment (IDENTITY) columns?

2016-04-13 Thread Mike Bayer 



On 04/13/2016 07:50 AM, Piotr Dobrogost wrote:

Mike,

Thanks for your reply!

On Wednesday, April 13, 2016 at 1:15:32 PM UTC+2, Mike Bayer wrote:

We've not started supporting new oracle 12c features as of yet, in
this case it might be possible to get it working with some dialect
flags since we already use "returning" to get at the newly generated
primary key, although testing would be needed and other assumptions
in the dialect might get in the way.


Which flags do you have in mind? Looking at
http://docs.sqlalchemy.org/en/latest/dialects/oracle.html I don't see
anything which might be useful to make it work.


they're module level flags on the dialect class itself like 
"postfetch_lastrowid" and "preexecute_autoincrement_sequences"




I was surprised Oracle needs different syntax with explicit sequence in
SA. Having one syntax for auto increment column (primary key) across all
backends seems like very important feature to have.  What is the reason
there's no Oracle dialect option to generate and use suitable sequence
for such column? Is there some recipe solving this problem?


Oracle (and Firebird) is the only database backend that until 12c did 
not provide any mechanism for auto-incrementing integer primary key 
columns.  SQLAlchemy doesn't want to get in the business of inventing an 
opinionated system for this.We don't ever dictate any details about 
how the schema is to be designed.








Regards,
Piotr Dobrogost

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Re: [sqlalchemy] Support for Oracle 12c auto increment (IDENTITY) columns?

2016-04-13 Thread David Moore 



- Original Message -


From: "Piotr Dobrogost" <p...@2016.groups.google.dobrogost.net> 
To: "sqlalchemy" <sqlalchemy@googlegroups.com> 
Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2016 1:50:19 PM 
Subject: Re: [sqlalchemy] Support for Oracle 12c auto increment (IDENTITY) 
columns? 



Mike, 


Thanks for your reply! 

On Wednesday, April 13, 2016 at 1:15:32 PM UTC+2, Mike Bayer wrote: 

We've not started supporting new oracle 12c features as of yet, in this case it 
might be possible to get it working with some dialect flags since we already 
use "returning" to get at the newly generated primary key, although testing 
would be needed and other assumptions in the dialect might get in the way. 




Which flags do you have in mind? Looking at 
http://docs.sqlalchemy.org/en/latest/dialects/oracle.html I don't see anything 
which might be useful to make it work. 


I was surprised Oracle needs different syntax with explicit sequence in SA. 
Having one syntax for auto increment column (primary key) across all backends 
seems like very important feature to have. What is the reason there's no Oracle 
dialect option to generate and use suitable sequence for such column? Is there 
some recipe solving this problem? 




Regards, 
Piotr Dobrogost 
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>From the license under which you can use this ( 
>http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/licenses/standard-license-152015.html ): 

License Rights and Restrictions 
Oracle grants You a nonexclusive, nontransferable, limited license to 
internally use the Programs, subject to the restrictions stated in this 
Agreement, only for the purpose of developing, testing, prototyping, and 
demonstrating Your application and only as long as Your application has not 
been used for any data processing, business, commercial, or production 
purposes, and not for any other purpose. 

-- 

I suspect you would not be able to use this for developing and testing 
sqlalchemy without breaking those terms. Oracle can get really nasty about 
using Developer Days when they think you've broken this agreement. 

regards, 

Dave Moore 

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Re: [sqlalchemy] Support for Oracle 12c auto increment (IDENTITY) columns?

2016-04-13 Thread Piotr Dobrogost 
Mike,

Thanks for your reply!

On Wednesday, April 13, 2016 at 1:15:32 PM UTC+2, Mike Bayer wrote:
>
> We've not started supporting new oracle 12c features as of yet, in this 
> case it might be possible to get it working with some dialect flags since 
> we already use "returning" to get at the newly generated primary key, 
> although testing would be needed and other assumptions in the dialect might 
> get in the way.


Which flags do you have in mind? Looking at 
http://docs.sqlalchemy.org/en/latest/dialects/oracle.html I don't see 
anything which might be useful to make it work.

I was surprised Oracle needs different syntax with explicit sequence in SA. 
Having one syntax for auto increment column (primary key) across all 
backends seems like very important feature to have.  What is the reason 
there's no Oracle dialect option to generate and use suitable sequence for 
such column? Is there some recipe solving this problem?


Regards,
Piotr Dobrogost

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Re: [sqlalchemy] Support for Oracle 12c auto increment (IDENTITY) columns?

2016-04-13 Thread Michal Petrucha 
On Wed, Apr 13, 2016 at 07:15:27AM -0400, Mike Bayer wrote:
> We've not started supporting new oracle 12c features as of yet, in this
> case it might be possible to get it working with some dialect flags since
> we already use "returning" to get at the newly generated primary key,
> although testing would be needed and other assumptions in the dialect might
> get in the way.
> 
> Is there a free XE download for 12c yet?   I can do nothing until I can at
> least install that, unless you were able to work up patches on your end
> (which would be great anyway because I have no time these days).

There is a pre-installed VM with 12c available from
http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/database/enterprise-edition/databaseappdev-vm-161299.html

It's ridiculously slow (orders of magnitude slower than PG/MySQL
running on bare metal), but it works...

Cheers,

Michal

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Re: [sqlalchemy] Support for Oracle 12c auto increment (IDENTITY) columns?

2016-04-13 Thread Mike Bayer 
We've not started supporting new oracle 12c features as of yet, in this
case it might be possible to get it working with some dialect flags since
we already use "returning" to get at the newly generated primary key,
although testing would be needed and other assumptions in the dialect might
get in the way.

Is there a free XE download for 12c yet?   I can do nothing until I can at
least install that, unless you were able to work up patches on your end
(which would be great anyway because I have no time these days).

On Wednesday, April 13, 2016, Piotr Dobrogost <
p...@2016.groups.google.dobrogost.net> wrote:

> Hi all!
>
> At
> http://docs.sqlalchemy.org/en/latest/dialects/oracle.html#auto-increment-behavior
> we read that:
> "With the Oracle dialect, a sequence must always be explicitly specified
> to enable autoincrement."
>
> However, starting with version 12c Oracle supports autoincrement columns
> (see update in this answer http://stackoverflow.com/a/11296469/95735).
>
> Does SQLAlchemy make use of this new feature of Oracle 12c so that it's
> not necessary to explicitly specify sequence in declaration of table
> columns (so that single declaration of such column works for Oracle and
> other databases)? If so, do I have to enable this somehow?
>
> Regards,
> Piotr Dobrogost
>
>
>
>
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> .
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[sqlalchemy] Support for Oracle 12c auto increment (IDENTITY) columns?

2016-04-13 Thread Piotr Dobrogost 
Hi all!

At 
http://docs.sqlalchemy.org/en/latest/dialects/oracle.html#auto-increment-behavior
 
we read that:
"With the Oracle dialect, a sequence must always be explicitly specified to 
enable autoincrement."

However, starting with version 12c Oracle supports autoincrement columns 
(see update in this answer http://stackoverflow.com/a/11296469/95735).

Does SQLAlchemy make use of this new feature of Oracle 12c so that it's not 
necessary to explicitly specify sequence in declaration of table columns 
(so that single declaration of such column works for Oracle and other 
databases)? If so, do I have to enable this somehow?

Regards,
Piotr Dobrogost




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