RE: boiler insulation

[Anthony Dixon]

Hi Geoff,
So would you be kind enough to pass on some of  Lindsay's Aster tweeks 
please. (Is he on line?). Or you going to watch us struggle!.
I can grease you palm with Glenfiddock to make it worth your while. A 
Watney's is a bit too cheap in this case!.

 Casing Temps.:-
 This is an interesting subject, and could vary greatly between model 
designs, fuels used, materials, builder etc.  There seems to be a lot 
of  theories regarding the hot air or insulation variables.
 Does anyone else have actual temperature data for comparisons, in 
addition to the brief
temp readings I put out. I would be very interested in seeing more data, 
and it would be good to back up the opinions, don't ya think?. And help 
save someone's Ruby investment.
 We still do not know which engine our Dutch collegue is referring too?.

 Scotsman Question:-
 What makes you suspect no oil is reaching the outside cylinders?. 
Apart from none disappearing from the oil tank between steamups.
 It is all good to know info.
 Best regards,
 Tony D.
 At 04:27 PM 10/4/02 -0700, Geoff Spenceley wrote:
>Hi, Steve, Tony, and Zbigniew,
>
>Thanks for all the information on boiler insulation,  it's very informative
>with great ideas and  I shall keep it my files for future reference! Thanks
>to all three of you--and others who contributed! But as that knowledgeable
>Dutchman noted, he'll probably use the air space for the time being, so
>will I. The damp air in Humboldt County should do it and I can breath in a
>little hot air, er,  with Tony's help!
>
>But for now I am working on reducing the play in the reversing of the
>valve gear  of the Aster Flying S, some of which I have accomplished (with
>a Sherline I've owned for 25 years!)!). I have also received some great
>ideas from Lindsay Crow, the renowned Aussie who has assembled 57 Asters!
>Also, I  worry about  the the way the lubricator is placed.- I suspect that
>there may be a problem with oil reaching the outside cyls. More coming from
>Lindsay on that too, which should  help.
>
>These Ausssies have some wonderful Railroads too with wonderful GTGs.  but
>remember: You can call an Englishman an Aussie, but never, NEVAH I say;
>call an Aussie an Englishman, those ex-convicts will kill you.
>
>Geoff.
>
>
>
>
>
>
 

RE: boiler insulation

[Geoff Spenceley]

Hi, Steve, Tony, and Zbigniew,

Thanks for all the information on boiler insulation,  it's very informative
with great ideas and  I shall keep it my files for future reference! Thanks
to all three of you--and others who contributed! But as that knowledgeable
Dutchman noted, he'll probably use the air space for the time being, so
will I. The damp air in Humboldt County should do it and I can breath in a
little hot air, er,  with Tony's help!

But for now I am working on reducing the play in the reversing of the
valve gear  of the Aster Flying S, some of which I have accomplished (with
a Sherline I've owned for 25 years!)!). I have also received some great
ideas from Lindsay Crow, the renowned Aussie who has assembled 57 Asters!
Also, I  worry about  the the way the lubricator is placed.- I suspect that
there may be a problem with oil reaching the outside cyls. More coming from
Lindsay on that too, which should  help.

These Ausssies have some wonderful Railroads too with wonderful GTGs.  but
remember: You can call an Englishman an Aussie, but never, NEVAH I say;
call an Aussie an Englishman, those ex-convicts will kill you.

Geoff.





 

Re: Admin -- was: please remove me from the e-mail list. Thank you

[Leo Starrenburg PA5LS]

>don't clog up everybody's mailbox with this kind of traffic.

How about a "please" ?

>thanks.

>\dmc

>ps: i took care of this guy.

Hmmm, with this attitude I wonder who would take care of you..





 

Re: boiler insulation

[Anthony Dixon]

Hi Geoff,
   I agree that Aster appears to rely on the air gap between boiler and 
casing for keeping the casing temperature down, and it seems to do a good 
job for them.
   But did you see my e mail earlier this week about casing temperature 
tests carried out on my Duchess, now being repaired after the the meltdown 
you saw at Pleasanton?. As follows:-
   Temperatures taken at 1st boiler band immediately behind smokebox.
   Casing Surface - no insulation (i.e. air gap) = 180c
   With Fibreglass insulation at 1mm thick = 155c (Casing Paint blistered)
   With Generic Ceramic sheet  = 135c (as used on 
earlier engines)
   With Aster Ceramic sheet = 145c (as supplied for 
temp. comparisons.

   In this case the air gap does not appear effective in keeping the casing 
temperature down, but I suggest Asters "air gaps" between casing and boiler 
at the smokebox are more generous at 2-2.5mm plus. And they have a 3mm plus 
gap towards the firebox and cab.
I only have the U1-232 and King George for reference, and not familiar with 
their other designs.

   There is not doubt that in my case the insulation and type makes a 
difference compared to
relying on air gap only. But I think there are other factors, in that 
Asters smokebox is made up from .060-.080" brass sheet. And outer casing 
.032" sheet.
   Whereas the Duchess smokebox is a machined brass tube, with a  generous 
.125" or 187" wall thickness x approx. 2'' long x approx. 2" dia. as I 
recall (engine not with me at present), with a casing at .032" thick.
   I suggest that Asters thinner materials in the smokebox and casing allow 
a faster dispersion of heat, and cooler surface temps. Whereas the 
thicker  smokebox material of the Duchess retains more heat and heat 
buildup over time. Which in turn is transferred to the thinner casing, 
leading to higher surface temps, with which a plain 1mm air gap cannot cope.

   I have been looking at using a alumina ceramic solid walled tube between 
the boiler and casing, and no fibre materials at all. As solid ceramic is a 
total insulator to over 1000F. This would keep the boiler heat in i.e. 
better effieciency, and maintain casing at ambient temp.
   Standard size ceramic tubes at 2" dia and 1mm wall are available, or can 
be ground to final sizes. (On my new lathe!).

   Paint:-
   Although the soft solder on the Duchess boiler band gave way, (now being 
silver soldered) and paint top coat and clearcoat blistered. The orange 
undercoat was not burnt or discoloured.
   We suspect the semimat finish colour paint coat and gloss clear coat 
were incompatable also, as there are signs of "orange peeling". Paint 
"experts" at suppliers, and hot rod decoration associates we have 
questioned, state that a mat clear coat over mat paint is ok, or gloss over 
gloss ok. But not gloss over mat or vice versa. Apparently base pigments 
are different and one attacks the other over time and do not set up/harden 
off  correctly.
   Also the top coat did not appear to adhere to the undercoat. So there 
may be a surface prep finish here also.

All this fun and a Weetabix soaked in Watneys for breakfast keeps us 
keeps active!.
Regards,
Tony D.


>Mike,
>
>Whoops! I should know how to spell Vegemite,  I eat it all the time!!
>Marmite too! Mellows the Tanqueray.
>
>I like your  "On the matter of insulation remember that whatever we use, it
>is the layer of air trapped between boiler shell and wrapper that provides
>the reduction in heat transfer"
>
>Perhaps this is why Aster doesn't put insulation on all their boilers? Just
>a good air space.
>
>Geoff
>
>
>Hi All,
> >
> >Here in Oz we eat Weetbix (no a) and Vegemite (no a), but I have never
> >combined them together.
> >
> >On the matter of insulation remember that whatever we use, it is the layer
> >of air trapped between boiler shell and wrapper that provides the reduction
> >in heat transfer.  The cardboard, fiberglass, weetabix packet, cork etc
> >provides a nice way of keeping that air space intact.  A side benefit would
> >be less chance of burning the paint on the outer wrapper too.
> >
> >cheers,
> >Mike Bickford
> >Berowra & Nalya Tramway
> >Sydney, Australia
> >- Original Message -
> >From: "Bruce Gathman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >To: "Multiple recipients of sslivesteam" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 10:33 PM
> >Subject: Re: boiler insulation
> >
> >
> >On Wed, 2 Oct 2002 22:50:21 +0100, "mart.towers"
> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>- Original Message -
> >>From: "Ciambrone, Steve @ OS" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >>To: "Multiple recipients of sslivesteam" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >>Sent: Wednesday, October 02, 2002 10:14 PM
> >>Subject: RE: boiler insulation
> >>
> >>
> >>> Weetabix packet?  USA translation Please.
> >>
> >>Weetabix - a kind of dessicated, compressed, wheat grain residue, sold in
> >>briquette form.
> >>
> >>In comparison, the southern US 'grits' are a s

Admin -- was: please remove me from the e-mail list. Thank you

[Dave Cole]

At 10:17 AM -0700 10/4/02, Ted Calavan wrote:
>
>
>--- Ted Calavan
>--- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>--- EarthLink: The #1 provider of the Real Internet.
>

quick reminder, folks:

if you want to sign off the list (or need a different kind of echo or 
you want to go on vacation or you've changed isps or ...) please look 
at the list guidelines

http://www.45mm.com/sslivesteam_guide.html

or, worst case, send me personal e-mail.

don't clog up everybody's mailbox with this kind of traffic.

thanks.

\dmc

ps: i took care of this guy.

-- 
^^^
Dave Cole
Gen'l Sup't:  Grand Teton & Everglades Steam Excursion Co.
   Pacifica, Calif. USA  
List Mom: sslivesteam, the list of small-scale live steamers
   

^^^ 

Re: Lathes for Live Steamers

[Keith Taylor]

Michael,
You will find the Atlas lathes at prices all over the map! I would
expect that an "average" price would be in the $300 - $500 range,
depending on location and accesories. You can easily find parts, not
because it's a Craftsman, because Sears no longer stocks any parts for
them! But Atlas- Clausing the builders, do have very complete stocks of
spare parts and accesories. I still have the Atlas/ Sears lathe given to
me for Christmas in 1961, and it is still a fine machine. For many
years, it was my sole machine tool, and with that little lathe and a
milling attachment, my Dad and I built a 3/4" scale Friends Models Tom
Thumb, which is a good a locomotive today as it was when we built it!
Yes, I have since added to the "lathe collection" and now have the
products of the Derbyshire, Rivett and South Bend lathe companies. But
you will never hear me say anything bad about that little "Craftsman" 6"
swing lathe. It may not be as easy as having a full machine shop, but
with that one tool you CAN build a live steam locomotive. A Jacobs chuck
inthe spindle and the milling attachment even served as my only drill
press for a long time!
Keith Taylor
- Original Message -
From: "mdenning" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Multiple recipients of sslivesteam" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, October 04, 2002 8:18 AM
Subject: Re: Lathes for Live Steamers


> What range of prices should I be looking for an Atlas/Craftsman 6 x 18
?
> Can I assume parts are readily available because it is a "Craftsman"?
> Thanks
> Michael
> Florida
> USA
> Iron Nut
>
> - Original Message -
> From: J.D. Toumanian <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Multiple recipients of sslivesteam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Friday, October 04, 2002 8:01 AM
> Subject: Re: Lathes for Live Steamers
>
>
> > Hello Group,
> > With all the discussions of different lathes used by model
engineers, I
> > am surprised that Atlas/Clausing has not come up.  I love them.
They
> > have flat ways like a Myford, are plenty rigid, and can be had at
> > bargain prices.  Most important to me is that they are American
made,
> > and nearly all parts are still available through Clausing.
> >
> > In recent years, I have become somewhat of a lathe 'collector' I
> > have no fewer than five right now!... All of them made by Atlas:
> >
> > 1 Atlas/Craftsman 618 6" x 18"
> > 2 Atlas QC54 10" x 36"
> > 1 Atlas TH48 10" x 30" turret lathe
> > 1 Atlas/Clausing Industrial 4804 13" x 40"
> >
> > I will be selling the 6 x 18 and one of the QC54s... I think three
> > lathes is plenty!
> >
> > All are excellent machines.  The 6 x 18 is small... bigger than a
> > Sherline but smaller than a Grizzly 9 x 20.  The Clausing Industrial
13
> > x 40 is large and heavy... about the same as a big South Bend
> > (unfortunately parts are rare for it though).  The 10-inchers are my
> > favorites because they are common (made from about 1933 to about
1970)
> > and parts are really cheap.
> >
> > Search on eBay for 'atlas lathe' and you are sure to come up with
lots
> > of machines.  Look at completed auctions to check the going rates
(or
> > ask me!) before bidding.
> >
> > Just more food for thought...
> >
> > Regards,
> > -Jon
> >
>

 

please remove me from the e-mail list. Thank you

[Ted Calavan]

 
 
--- Ted Calavan
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- EarthLink: The #1 provider of the Real Internet.
 

 

Re: boiler insulation

[Z.R. Struzik]

> I like your  "On the matter of insulation remember that whatever we use, it
> is the layer of air trapped between boiler shell and wrapper that provides
> the reduction in heat transfer"
> 
> Perhaps this is why Aster doesn't put insulation on all their boilers? Just
> a good air space.
> 
> Geoff

Geoff, 
First many thanks to everyone who replied to my question.
Second: Mike is right that the air *trapped* is a great insulator.
Trapped is important here. If the space is too large, air begins to 
circulate and most of its insulating properties are lost due to the 
way of heat exchange called convection.
I believe this process starts playing a role when the space is about 
1cm which would mean that the 2-3mm space that we usually have between 
the boiler and the wrapper is still well below.
Wool like materials (natural, mineral or glass substitutes) work by
trapping the air in tiny cavities and this is why they can be used to 
fill large spaces and provide great insulation properties of the air.
This of course makes foam plastic a great insulator too and I believe 
this is also the reason why wood and not very dense cardboard are good
insulators. For those ultimately budget oriented;^) old newspapers
provide great thermal insulation!
But there are of course better and much better insulators than the
air. I believe argon is used to fill the space between glass panes 
in, double or triple, insulated windows. Pumping out the air would 
also greatly improve isolation properties.
Asbest and its modern ceramic replacements have much better insulation 
properties, this is why they are used for oven insulation and in our
steamers for insulating the smokebox!
In conclusion - either calculations or tests would probably provide 
the definitive answer. Trapped air in 2-3mm space is great if it does 
not move (entirely enclosed, no holes etc) But we still have another 
way of heat conduction called radiation which will transfer the heat 
from the boiler to the wrapper. Air will probably not shield much of 
this. Better insulator might (eg ceramic sheet).
Ultimately, these are probably not such great heat losses after all,
I would be surprised if they exceed 5% of the total energy used.
So I will probably stick to the empty space since I am concerned
about the moisture accumulation in or under the insulation and the
subsequent corrosion of the boiler. I run engines in the rain 
and high humidity conditions (Netherlands) I have also already 
observed corrosion on the gas tank in the tender, but I must admit
that I left it filled with water for a prolonged period.
This leads me to another question, would it not be better to use
oil (as good a heat conductor as water) or some kind of gel to fill
the container around the gas tank?? I would think that gel providing
either a great heat conduction or heat (storage) capacity might be good.
Happy steaming!
Zbigniew
 

RE: boiler insulation

[Shyvers, Steve]

Geoff,

A good thermal insulator will also have a cellular structure to keep the air
trapped and prevent it from forming convection currents between the boiler
and the wrapper.

Steve

-Original Message-
From: Geoff Spenceley [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Friday, October 04, 2002 9:20 AM
To: Multiple recipients of sslivesteam
Subject: Re: boiler insulation


Mike,

Whoops! I should know how to spell Vegemite,  I eat it all the time!!
Marmite too! Mellows the Tanqueray.

I like your  "On the matter of insulation remember that whatever we use, it
is the layer of air trapped between boiler shell and wrapper that provides
the reduction in heat transfer"

Perhaps this is why Aster doesn't put insulation on all their boilers? Just
a good air space.

Geoff


Hi All,
>
>Here in Oz we eat Weetbix (no a) and Vegemite (no a), but I have never
>combined them together.
>
>On the matter of insulation remember that whatever we use, it is the layer
>of air trapped between boiler shell and wrapper that provides the reduction
>in heat transfer.  The cardboard, fiberglass, weetabix packet, cork etc
>provides a nice way of keeping that air space intact.  A side benefit would
>be less chance of burning the paint on the outer wrapper too.
>
>cheers,
>Mike Bickford
>Berowra & Nalya Tramway
>Sydney, Australia
>- Original Message -
>From: "Bruce Gathman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: "Multiple recipients of sslivesteam" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 10:33 PM
>Subject: Re: boiler insulation
>
>
>On Wed, 2 Oct 2002 22:50:21 +0100, "mart.towers"
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>>
>>- Original Message -
>>From: "Ciambrone, Steve @ OS" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>To: "Multiple recipients of sslivesteam" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>Sent: Wednesday, October 02, 2002 10:14 PM
>>Subject: RE: boiler insulation
>>
>>
>>> Weetabix packet?  USA translation Please.
>>
>>Weetabix - a kind of dessicated, compressed, wheat grain residue, sold in
>>briquette form.
>>
>>In comparison, the southern US 'grits' are a sophisticated & highly
>>palatable breakfast cereal.
>>
>>Art Walker
>
>Is this held in place with Vegamite?
>
>Bruce Gathman
>
>


  

Re: boiler insulation

[Geoff Spenceley]

Mike,

Whoops! I should know how to spell Vegemite,  I eat it all the time!!
Marmite too! Mellows the Tanqueray.

I like your  "On the matter of insulation remember that whatever we use, it
is the layer of air trapped between boiler shell and wrapper that provides
the reduction in heat transfer"

Perhaps this is why Aster doesn't put insulation on all their boilers? Just
a good air space.

Geoff


Hi All,
>
>Here in Oz we eat Weetbix (no a) and Vegemite (no a), but I have never
>combined them together.
>
>On the matter of insulation remember that whatever we use, it is the layer
>of air trapped between boiler shell and wrapper that provides the reduction
>in heat transfer.  The cardboard, fiberglass, weetabix packet, cork etc
>provides a nice way of keeping that air space intact.  A side benefit would
>be less chance of burning the paint on the outer wrapper too.
>
>cheers,
>Mike Bickford
>Berowra & Nalya Tramway
>Sydney, Australia
>- Original Message -
>From: "Bruce Gathman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: "Multiple recipients of sslivesteam" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 10:33 PM
>Subject: Re: boiler insulation
>
>
>On Wed, 2 Oct 2002 22:50:21 +0100, "mart.towers"
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>>
>>- Original Message -
>>From: "Ciambrone, Steve @ OS" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>To: "Multiple recipients of sslivesteam" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>Sent: Wednesday, October 02, 2002 10:14 PM
>>Subject: RE: boiler insulation
>>
>>
>>> Weetabix packet?  USA translation Please.
>>
>>Weetabix - a kind of dessicated, compressed, wheat grain residue, sold in
>>briquette form.
>>
>>In comparison, the southern US 'grits' are a sophisticated & highly
>>palatable breakfast cereal.
>>
>>Art Walker
>
>Is this held in place with Vegamite?
>
>Bruce Gathman
>
>


 

RE: micro torch - which kind to choose?

[Shyvers, Steve]

Matthias,

I use the Bernzomatic "ST900 Lightweight Mini Torch". It is small, light
weight, and connects to a propane bottle via a 4-foot hose. There is an
adjustable nozzle that is used to control flame size, instead of 
adjusting the gas flow. It is for propane, but it is not to be used for MAPP
gas.

I selected this torch because larger torches that are attached directly to
the propane bottle were very cumbersome to use, and showed the same  flame
stability problems when tilted that you experienced.

Steve
 

Re: Lathes for Live Steamers

[Harry Wade]

At 08:18 AM 10/4/02 -0400, you wrote:
>What range of prices should I be looking for an Atlas/Craftsman 6 x 18 ?
>Can I assume parts are readily available because it is a "Craftsman"?
>Thanks
>Michael

  I'm like Jon, I've owned many lathes, restored a few, several
Atlas's, two 618's among them.  The current average going rate for a 618 is
between $350 and $850, depending of course upon condition and included
tooling.  I have seen a 618 sell for $1250 but this was a new machine which
came with every available factory accessory for the price.  One of you
might get lucky and find a forgotten machine in a garage or basement for
$100, it does happen.  One thing to remember when considering a used
machine is tooling (chucks, etc).  New tooling is expensive, relative to
the price of the basic machine, so the more you can get for the price the
better off you are.  If you encounter someone with a lathe for sale alone,
but who has the tooling and is selling that seperately, simply walk away.
  Although the cast iron components will probably not be available
again, the Clausing Corporation, after years of indifferent service and
allowing the Atlas parts stock to be depleted hoping it would die off,
finally realized there were 1000's of these machines still in daily use and
more being rescued and restored to operating condition by people like you
and I, and money to be made, so parts are now and will be available.  It
wouldn't surprise me if someday beds will again be available.
  Another thing to be watchful of is that Sears sold two different
6" lathes, the Atlas-built one, which is what we are talking about here
(Sears #101.21200), and one made for them by AA Tool called the Craftsman
80 (Sears #109.21270).  The AA machines had V-bedways but were in every
other way poorly designed and made and not worth having.


Regards,
Harry Wade
Nashville, Tn
 

Re: Lathes for Live Steamers

[mdenning]

What range of prices should I be looking for an Atlas/Craftsman 6 x 18 ?
Can I assume parts are readily available because it is a "Craftsman"?
Thanks
Michael
Florida
USA
Iron Nut

- Original Message - 
From: J.D. Toumanian <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Multiple recipients of sslivesteam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, October 04, 2002 8:01 AM
Subject: Re: Lathes for Live Steamers


> Hello Group,
> With all the discussions of different lathes used by model engineers, I
> am surprised that Atlas/Clausing has not come up.  I love them.  They
> have flat ways like a Myford, are plenty rigid, and can be had at
> bargain prices.  Most important to me is that they are American made,
> and nearly all parts are still available through Clausing.
> 
> In recent years, I have become somewhat of a lathe 'collector' I
> have no fewer than five right now!... All of them made by Atlas:
> 
> 1 Atlas/Craftsman 618 6" x 18"
> 2 Atlas QC54 10" x 36"
> 1 Atlas TH48 10" x 30" turret lathe
> 1 Atlas/Clausing Industrial 4804 13" x 40"
> 
> I will be selling the 6 x 18 and one of the QC54s... I think three
> lathes is plenty!
> 
> All are excellent machines.  The 6 x 18 is small... bigger than a
> Sherline but smaller than a Grizzly 9 x 20.  The Clausing Industrial 13
> x 40 is large and heavy... about the same as a big South Bend
> (unfortunately parts are rare for it though).  The 10-inchers are my
> favorites because they are common (made from about 1933 to about 1970)
> and parts are really cheap.
> 
> Search on eBay for 'atlas lathe' and you are sure to come up with lots
> of machines.  Look at completed auctions to check the going rates (or
> ask me!) before bidding.
> 
> Just more food for thought...
> 
> Regards,
> -Jon
> 
 

Re: Lathes for Live Steamers

[J.D. Toumanian]

Hello Group,
With all the discussions of different lathes used by model engineers, I
am surprised that Atlas/Clausing has not come up.  I love them.  They
have flat ways like a Myford, are plenty rigid, and can be had at
bargain prices.  Most important to me is that they are American made,
and nearly all parts are still available through Clausing.

In recent years, I have become somewhat of a lathe 'collector' I
have no fewer than five right now!... All of them made by Atlas:

1 Atlas/Craftsman 618 6" x 18"
2 Atlas QC54 10" x 36"
1 Atlas TH48 10" x 30" turret lathe
1 Atlas/Clausing Industrial 4804 13" x 40"

I will be selling the 6 x 18 and one of the QC54s... I think three
lathes is plenty!

All are excellent machines.  The 6 x 18 is small... bigger than a
Sherline but smaller than a Grizzly 9 x 20.  The Clausing Industrial 13
x 40 is large and heavy... about the same as a big South Bend
(unfortunately parts are rare for it though).  The 10-inchers are my
favorites because they are common (made from about 1933 to about 1970)
and parts are really cheap.

Search on eBay for 'atlas lathe' and you are sure to come up with lots
of machines.  Look at completed auctions to check the going rates (or
ask me!) before bidding.

Just more food for thought...

Regards,
-Jon
 

Re: boiler insulation

[The Bickfords]

Hi All,

Here in Oz we eat Weetbix (no a) and Vegemite (no a), but I have never
combined them together.

On the matter of insulation remember that whatever we use, it is the layer
of air trapped between boiler shell and wrapper that provides the reduction
in heat transfer.  The cardboard, fiberglass, weetabix packet, cork etc
provides a nice way of keeping that air space intact.  A side benefit would
be less chance of burning the paint on the outer wrapper too.

cheers,
Mike Bickford
Berowra & Nalya Tramway
Sydney, Australia
- Original Message -
From: "Bruce Gathman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Multiple recipients of sslivesteam" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 10:33 PM
Subject: Re: boiler insulation


On Wed, 2 Oct 2002 22:50:21 +0100, "mart.towers"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>
>- Original Message -
>From: "Ciambrone, Steve @ OS" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: "Multiple recipients of sslivesteam" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Wednesday, October 02, 2002 10:14 PM
>Subject: RE: boiler insulation
>
>
>> Weetabix packet?  USA translation Please.
>
>Weetabix - a kind of dessicated, compressed, wheat grain residue, sold in
>briquette form.
>
>In comparison, the southern US 'grits' are a sophisticated & highly
>palatable breakfast cereal.
>
>Art Walker

Is this held in place with Vegamite?

Bruce Gathman