RE: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
Perhaps this belongs on the user list, but I think it is relevant for
the discussion at hand. You all seem to regard all of the Struts taglibs
as one item, for which JSTL is an alternative. While this is certainly
true for the logic: and bean: tags, I have not seen a replacement for
the
html: form tags (that is, html:form and all the controls) in JSTL.
The user guide
(http://jakarta.apache.org/struts/userGuide/building_view.html#form_bean
s)
suggests we replace
input type=text name=username
value=%= loginBean.getUsername() /
with
html:text property=username/
Does the use JSTL camp prefer this,
input type=text name=username
value=c:out value=${loginBean.username}/
or am I missing some basic JSTL?
Shai.
PS: There is a documentation error there; the original JSP should be
input type=text name=username
value=%= loginBean.getUsername() %/
--^
Shai.
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RE: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
You are right, JSTL doesn't completely remove the need for Struts specific
tags.
I think for the purposes of this discussion, the next generation would be
JSTL plus the struts-el taglib and when we talk about the Struts tags, we're
really talking about the traditional, non-el tags.
So keep using the html:form and other Struts tag and consider migrating to
the EL versions if you are using JSTL.
Steve
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: September 1, 2003 1:17 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465]
- Enhancement of the html:link tag)
Perhaps this belongs on the user list, but I think it is relevant for
the discussion at hand. You all seem to regard all of the Struts taglibs
as one item, for which JSTL is an alternative. While this is certainly
true for the logic: and bean: tags, I have not seen a replacement for
the
html: form tags (that is, html:form and all the controls) in JSTL.
The user guide
(http://jakarta.apache.org/struts/userGuide/building_view.html#form_bean
s)
suggests we replace
input type=text name=username
value=%= loginBean.getUsername() /
with
html:text property=username/
Does the use JSTL camp prefer this,
input type=text name=username
value=c:out value=${loginBean.username}/
or am I missing some basic JSTL?
Shai.
PS: There is a documentation error there; the original JSP should be
input type=text name=username
value=%= loginBean.getUsername() %/
--^
Shai.
---
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confidential or legally privileged information that is intended
only for the individual or entity named in the e-mail address. If
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contents of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have
received this e-mail transmission in error, please reply to the
sender, so that arrangements can be made for proper delivery, and
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RE: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
-Original Message- From: Ted Husted [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: August 29, 2003 6:08 PM Each of us can only offer support from our own experience. If a person is not using the html taglib, then they might not know the html taglib solution. But if they are using JSTL, they might know a JSTL solution. Agreed, but I don't think we're *that* rusty on the Struts tags yet that we wouldn't be able to offer useful advice :-). There's no limit on the number of responses we can post to a question. If someone else knows the html taglib solution, then they can post that solution too. Yes, I had a very ... ummm ... interesting off-list discussion recently where I was trying to explain that to someone. I guess it's as much about perception as anything. I don't want to give the impression that the Struts tags are somehow unsupported or that JSTL is the *only* way to work. Also, in many people's eyes Struts 1.1 was only just released so any perceived change in the level support might be viewed negatively. I'm very happy for JSTL to be the recommendation, provided the commitment to the Struts tags until the end of their lifetime is clear and I feel sure it will be. ... -Ted. (Hey, maybe I should start answering the html taglib questions with the Velocity Tools solution!) That would certainly help dispel the Struts only works with JSPs myth. But I believe the standard answer to questions is, No! is crap. You want to use Perl :-) Steve - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
Craig R. McClanahan wrote: I'm -1 on making Struts 1.2.x dependent on Servlet 2.3 / JSP 1.2. Ditto. Contrary to popular brief, a great number of organizations have *not* migrated to 2.3/1.2, including some of the largest companies in the world. -Ted. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
My original point really was that if the standard for Struts continues to be 2.2/1.1 that we should be careful not to reply to the How do I do this with html:??? questions with the stock answer of use JSTL. If we're supporting Struts tags then I believe we should first answer the question that was asked and *then* offer the advice that JSTL offers an alternative *if* their environment supports it. I feel it's become a bit too easy to give the JSTL answer and not deal with the issue as presented. And I do feel that if there are gaps in the functionality provided by the current supported environment we should at least consider additions, particularly if someone has gone to the trouble of providing a patch. If someone doesn't want to deal with Struts taglib issues than that's fine, but if there's no one left who's prepared to provide support then at that point (and I'm not suggesting that we're anywhere near yet) I would urge that we reconsider the required platform. Please read this as a gentle reminder/prompt for discussion, rather than a stern lecture. It's not my intention to cause any offence and it's something I need to be aware of as much as anyone. O _ /|\ soapbox- |x| / \ - me, no longer on it :-) Steve -Original Message- From: Ted Husted [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: August 29, 2003 1:44 PM To: Struts Developers List Subject: Re: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag) Craig R. McClanahan wrote: I'm -1 on making Struts 1.2.x dependent on Servlet 2.3 / JSP 1.2. Ditto. Contrary to popular brief, a great number of organizations have *not* migrated to 2.3/1.2, including some of the largest companies in the world. -Ted. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
Each of us can only offer support from our own experience. If a person is not using the html taglib, then they might not know the html taglib solution. But if they are using JSTL, they might know a JSTL solution. There's no limit on the number of responses we can post to a question. If someone else knows the html taglib solution, then they can post that solution too. In my experience, all it takes is a few secondary posts that start out with If you aren't using Servlet 2.3 and/or can't use JSTL, then try this instead ..., and others in the community will soon follow your lead. I do agree that it is important to keep in mind that not everyone can use JSTL, or Servlet 2.3. This is especially in larger companies where server upgrades are a major budget item. But what's most important is getting the community to support itself. Fielding these questions on the list is wonderful thing for Committers to do, but, strictly speaking, it is not our primary responsibility. We need Committers to keep the codebase and documentation up to date, but anyone in the community can provide support on the user list. If there's no one left to provide support, then that we would mean that we've lost our community =:( The User list is a place where users can help other users, and when we post to the user list, it's really just because we're users too. =;0) -Ted. (Hey, maybe I should start answering the html taglib questions with the Velocity Tools solution!) Steve Raeburn wrote: My original point really was that if the standard for Struts continues to be 2.2/1.1 that we should be careful not to reply to the How do I do this with html:??? questions with the stock answer of use JSTL. If we're supporting Struts tags then I believe we should first answer the question that was asked and *then* offer the advice that JSTL offers an alternative *if* their environment supports it. I feel it's become a bit too easy to give the JSTL answer and not deal with the issue as presented. And I do feel that if there are gaps in the functionality provided by the current supported environment we should at least consider additions, particularly if someone has gone to the trouble of providing a patch. If someone doesn't want to deal with Struts taglib issues than that's fine, but if there's no one left who's prepared to provide support then at that point (and I'm not suggesting that we're anywhere near yet) I would urge that we reconsider the required platform. Please read this as a gentle reminder/prompt for discussion, rather than a stern lecture. It's not my intention to cause any offence and it's something I need to be aware of as much as anyone. O _ /|\ soapbox- |x| / \ - me, no longer on it :-) Steve -Original Message- From: Ted Husted [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: August 29, 2003 1:44 PM To: Struts Developers List Subject: Re: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag) Craig R. McClanahan wrote: I'm -1 on making Struts 1.2.x dependent on Servlet 2.3 / JSP 1.2. Ditto. Contrary to popular brief, a great number of organizations have *not* migrated to 2.3/1.2, including some of the largest companies in the world. -Ted. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Ted Husted, Junit in Action - http://www.manning.com/massol/, Struts in Action - http://husted.com/struts/book.html, JSP Site Design - http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ISBN=1861005512. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
I haven't seen a patch for the tags (except for James, David and Aaron) in quite a while because the response to maintaining/enhancing the tags is so negative. Most of us who really use/customize the tags have gone our own way already. Edgar -Original Message- From: Steve Raeburn [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, August 29, 2003 7:10 PM To: Struts Developers List Subject: RE: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag) I feel it's become a bit too easy to give the JSTL answer and not deal with the issue as presented. And I do feel that if there are gaps in the functionality provided by the current supported environment we should at least consider additions, particularly if someone has gone to the trouble of providing a patch. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
I would like to see those responses. Edgar -Original Message- From: Ted Husted [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, August 29, 2003 8:08 PM (Hey, maybe I should start answering the html taglib questions with the Velocity Tools solution!) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
David Graham wrote: IMO, Struts 2.x should attempt to get out of the taglib business altogether. Until then, we should just let the tags be and maintain Struts 1.x as Servlet 2.2 minimum requirement. +1 And along the way, we can start distancing the core distribution from the taglib distribution. The action/config packages and the taglib packages live on two different layers. One is controller and the other is view. IMHO, the underlying architecture of Struts will be much more apparent once we make each of the tablibs (original, EL, and Faces) separate deliverables with their own release cycles. Many Jakarta products have subproducts with their own CVS. Perhaps there should be a Struts taglib CVS where all three packages could live. -Ted. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] -Enhancement of the html:link tag)
On Fri, 29 Aug 2003, Steve Raeburn wrote: My original point really was that if the standard for Struts continues to be 2.2/1.1 that we should be careful not to reply to the How do I do this with html:??? questions with the stock answer of use JSTL. Point well taken -- I've been guilty of that one too. Although, as Ted points out, most of us only answer what we know, and for me personally it's to the point where I always have to RTFM to answer a question on the bean and logic tags, since I use the JSTL versions every day :-). Craig - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
Many Jakarta products have subproducts with their own CVS. Perhaps there should be a Struts taglib CVS where all three packages could live. -Ted. +1 What about also doing this for the contrib components? Some of these are really only concepts or proposals rather than production quality code. struts-sandbox? Steve - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
--- Rick Hightower [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am not a voter, but I think Comments below... Rick Hightower Chief Technology Officer Trivera Technologies http://www.triveratech.com 520 290 6855 (Phone) 520 977 8605 (Mobile) -Original Message- From: Steve Raeburn [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 9:20 PM To: Struts Developers List Subject: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag) I'm not singling Vic out for this (honest) but... The standard advice we are now giving everyone is use JSTL, which I wholeheartedly agree with and have said myself. However, I think we need to make sure that we still adequately support non-JSTL solutions and continue to consider bug fixes/enhancements to Struts tags EVEN where it would duplicate JSTL functionality because Struts still supports JSP 1.1/Servlet2.2. I don't think fixing non-JSTL tags should take priority. I think deprecated tags like logic:iterate, and their ilk should receive very little attention. BTW I am going to make a concerted effort to contribute to this project. Please excuse me while I am new if I make any snafu. (I have some stuff and ideas in the works. Mostly bug fix type ideas.) I haven't considered whether this particular enhancement would fall into the category of something we should do, it just prompted me to raise the issue. If we've reached the stage where the recommendations we are making *require* JSTL, then I think it's time to be honest about the required platform for Struts and up it to 1.1/2.3 I think Struts 1.2 and higher should *require* JSTL tags, and overlapping Struts tags should be deprecated (aren't they already). If this is not feasible for Struts 1.2, then Struts 1.3 or 1.5 or 1.whatever. What's the rush? Why does Struts 1.x need to require JSTL? They are independent technologies that can be used together if the developer chooses. The Struts tags work in their current form and I agree that enhancing them is time better spent elsewhere. But fixing bugs is still necessary so that the tags are as stable as possible for the people still stuck on Servlet 2.2 containers. IMO, Struts 2.x should attempt to get out of the taglib business altogether. Until then, we should just let the tags be and maintain Struts 1.x as Servlet 2.2 minimum requirement. David Use JSTL instead of Struts-Equivalent Tags Use core:out instead of bean:write Use core:set instead of bean:define Use JSTL core:if and core:forEach instead of Struts logic:* Use frmt tags in place of bean:message (if possible) Use JSTL EL Engine in Your Own Custom Tags I don't know how well the JSTL i18n support plays with the Struts i18n support as I am only familiar with the latter and not the former at least not on a carnal level. Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: August 27, 2003 8:28 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag DO NOT REPLY TO THIS EMAIL, BUT PLEASE POST YOUR BUG RELATED COMMENTS THROUGH THE WEB INTERFACE AVAILABLE AT http://nagoya.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=21465. ANY REPLY MADE TO THIS MESSAGE WILL NOT BE COLLECTED AND INSERTED IN THE BUG DATABASE. http://nagoya.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=21465 Enhancement of the html:link tag [EMAIL PROTECTED] changed: What|Removed |Added -- -- Status|ASSIGNED|RESOLVED Resolution||WONTFIX --- Additional Comments From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003-08-28 03:27 --- You can/should use JSTL instead. .V - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
On Fri, 29 Aug 2003, David Graham wrote: Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2003 10:26:54 -0700 (PDT) From: David Graham [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Struts Developers List [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Struts Developers List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag) --- Rick Hightower [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am not a voter, but I think Comments below... Rick Hightower Chief Technology Officer Trivera Technologies http://www.triveratech.com 520 290 6855 (Phone) 520 977 8605 (Mobile) -Original Message- From: Steve Raeburn [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 9:20 PM To: Struts Developers List Subject: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag) I'm not singling Vic out for this (honest) but... The standard advice we are now giving everyone is use JSTL, which I wholeheartedly agree with and have said myself. However, I think we need to make sure that we still adequately support non-JSTL solutions and continue to consider bug fixes/enhancements to Struts tags EVEN where it would duplicate JSTL functionality because Struts still supports JSP 1.1/Servlet2.2. I don't think fixing non-JSTL tags should take priority. I think deprecated tags like logic:iterate, and their ilk should receive very little attention. BTW I am going to make a concerted effort to contribute to this project. Please excuse me while I am new if I make any snafu. (I have some stuff and ideas in the works. Mostly bug fix type ideas.) I haven't considered whether this particular enhancement would fall into the category of something we should do, it just prompted me to raise the issue. If we've reached the stage where the recommendations we are making *require* JSTL, then I think it's time to be honest about the required platform for Struts and up it to 1.1/2.3 I think Struts 1.2 and higher should *require* JSTL tags, and overlapping Struts tags should be deprecated (aren't they already). If this is not feasible for Struts 1.2, then Struts 1.3 or 1.5 or 1.whatever. What's the rush? Why does Struts 1.x need to require JSTL? They are independent technologies that can be used together if the developer chooses. The Struts tags work in their current form and I agree that enhancing them is time better spent elsewhere. But fixing bugs is still necessary so that the tags are as stable as possible for the people still stuck on Servlet 2.2 containers. I don't think it's even necessary to *deprecate* the old tags. There are lots of existing apps that use them, and it is rather unfriendly to force people to change all their pages to update to a later Struts build. We should be fixing bugs in the existing tags ... but I don't see much use in adding a whole bunch of new ones. I'm -1 on making Struts 1.2.x dependent on Servlet 2.3 / JSP 1.2. If we're going to maintain backwards compatibility in this sequence, we need to maintain the same base platform as well. IMO, Struts 2.x should attempt to get out of the taglib business altogether. Until then, we should just let the tags be and maintain Struts 1.x as Servlet 2.2 minimum requirement. Earlier, we had talked about using Servlet 2.4 and JSP 2.0 as the basis for Struts 2.x, and I still like that approach, because these specs are close to being finalized, and will certainly be final before we need them. The interesting part of this is going to be the timing -- I would anticipate we'll continue doing production quality releases of 1.2.x, while starting to do some experimental builds in 2.x, in overlapping times. But that's dependent on what the committers are willing and able to work on, of course. David Craig (whose time will free up later on as JavaServer Faces gets done) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
I'm not singling Vic out for this (honest) but... The standard advice we are now giving everyone is use JSTL, which I wholeheartedly agree with and have said myself. However, I think we need to make sure that we still adequately support non-JSTL solutions and continue to consider bug fixes/enhancements to Struts tags EVEN where it would duplicate JSTL functionality because Struts still supports JSP 1.1/Servlet2.2. I haven't considered whether this particular enhancement would fall into the category of something we should do, it just prompted me to raise the issue. If we've reached the stage where the recommendations we are making *require* JSTL, then I think it's time to be honest about the required platform for Struts and up it to 1.1/2.3 Thoughts? Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: August 27, 2003 8:28 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag DO NOT REPLY TO THIS EMAIL, BUT PLEASE POST YOUR BUG RELATED COMMENTS THROUGH THE WEB INTERFACE AVAILABLE AT http://nagoya.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=21465. ANY REPLY MADE TO THIS MESSAGE WILL NOT BE COLLECTED AND INSERTED IN THE BUG DATABASE. http://nagoya.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=21465 Enhancement of the html:link tag [EMAIL PROTECTED] changed: What|Removed |Added -- -- Status|ASSIGNED|RESOLVED Resolution||WONTFIX --- Additional Comments From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003-08-28 03:27 --- You can/should use JSTL instead. .V - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
--- Steve Raeburn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm not singling Vic out for this (honest) but... The standard advice we are now giving everyone is use JSTL, which I wholeheartedly agree with and have said myself. However, I think we need to make sure that we still adequately support non-JSTL solutions and continue to consider bug fixes/enhancements to Struts tags EVEN where it would duplicate JSTL functionality because Struts still supports JSP 1.1/Servlet2.2. I strongly disagree with that. Duplicating standard functionality is a complete waste of time. If someone wants something available in the JSTL they should just use the JSTL. Struts goal in life isn't to duplicate standards. We should absolutely fix bugs in the existing tags and provide tags that aren't available elsewhere. Having said that, I won't stop you or any other committer from donating time to developing tags that duplicate JSTL functionality. However, I can't justify spending my own time maintaining or fixing bugs in such tags. I haven't considered whether this particular enhancement would fall into the category of something we should do, it just prompted me to raise the issue. If we've reached the stage where the recommendations we are making *require* JSTL, then I think it's time to be honest about the required platform for Struts and up it to 1.1/2.3 I don't see how the Servlet version required for JSTL is relevant to Struts. We're making the reasonable recommendation that people use standard technologies instead of the propriety Struts counterparts. The Struts tags have served us well for a long time but IMO its time to let most of them fade away gracefully. David Thoughts? Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: August 27, 2003 8:28 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag DO NOT REPLY TO THIS EMAIL, BUT PLEASE POST YOUR BUG RELATED COMMENTS THROUGH THE WEB INTERFACE AVAILABLE AT http://nagoya.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=21465. ANY REPLY MADE TO THIS MESSAGE WILL NOT BE COLLECTED AND INSERTED IN THE BUG DATABASE. http://nagoya.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=21465 Enhancement of the html:link tag [EMAIL PROTECTED] changed: What|Removed |Added -- -- Status|ASSIGNED|RESOLVED Resolution||WONTFIX --- Additional Comments From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003-08-28 03:27 --- You can/should use JSTL instead. .V - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
Steve Raeburn wrote: I'm not singling Vic out for this (honest) but... The standard advice we are now giving everyone is use JSTL, which I wholeheartedly agree with and have said myself. However, I think we need to make sure that we still adequately support non-JSTL solutions and continue to consider bug fixes/enhancements to Struts tags EVEN where it would duplicate JSTL functionality because Struts still supports JSP 1.1/Servlet2.2. I haven't considered whether this particular enhancement would fall into the category of something we should do, it just prompted me to raise the issue. If we've reached the stage where the recommendations we are making *require* JSTL, then I think it's time to be honest about the required platform for Struts and up it to 1.1/2.3. I agree the html/logic/bean tags are still supported just not actively enhanced, unless a patch is supplied. Also is the change is simple that would aid in debugging, or the ability of a user to extend a tag if they are in a Servlet 2.2/Jsp 1.1 world. Thoughts? Steve - - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
For what my non-contributor opinion's worth, I totally agree with David. So far as I know, while JSTL is not _required_ by the standard for JSP 1.2, it does not _require_ 1.2 -- and can be used with 1.1 containers; so saying use JSTL does not translate to upgrade to Servlet 2.3. Shai. -Original Message- From: David Graham [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2003 07:41 To: Struts Developers List Subject: Re: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag) --- Steve Raeburn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm not singling Vic out for this (honest) but... The standard advice we are now giving everyone is use JSTL, which I wholeheartedly agree with and have said myself. However, I think we need to make sure that we still adequately support non-JSTL solutions and continue to consider bug fixes/enhancements to Struts tags EVEN where it would duplicate JSTL functionality because Struts still supports JSP 1.1/Servlet2.2. I strongly disagree with that. Duplicating standard functionality is a complete waste of time. If someone wants something available in the JSTL they should just use the JSTL. Struts goal in life isn't to duplicate standards. We should absolutely fix bugs in the existing tags and provide tags that aren't available elsewhere. Having said that, I won't stop you or any other committer from donating time to developing tags that duplicate JSTL functionality. However, I can't justify spending my own time maintaining or fixing bugs in such tags. I haven't considered whether this particular enhancement would fall into the category of something we should do, it just prompted me to raise the issue. If we've reached the stage where the recommendations we are making *require* JSTL, then I think it's time to be honest about the required platform for Struts and up it to 1.1/2.3 I don't see how the Servlet version required for JSTL is relevant to Struts. We're making the reasonable recommendation that people use standard technologies instead of the propriety Struts counterparts. The Struts tags have served us well for a long time but IMO its time to let most of them fade away gracefully. David Thoughts? Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: August 27, 2003 8:28 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag DO NOT REPLY TO THIS EMAIL, BUT PLEASE POST YOUR BUG RELATED COMMENTS THROUGH THE WEB INTERFACE AVAILABLE AT http://nagoya.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=21465. ANY REPLY MADE TO THIS MESSAGE WILL NOT BE COLLECTED AND INSERTED IN THE BUG DATABASE. http://nagoya.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=21465 Enhancement of the html:link tag [EMAIL PROTECTED] changed: What|Removed |Added -- -- Status|ASSIGNED|RESOLVED Resolution||WONTFIX --- Additional Comments From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003-08-28 03:27 --- You can/should use JSTL instead. .V - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Confidentiality Notice: This email transmission may contain confidential or legally privileged information that is intended only for the individual or entity named in the e-mail address. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or reliance upon the contents of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail transmission in error, please reply to the sender, so that arrangements can be made for proper delivery, and then please delete the message from your inbox. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
JSTL does indeed require JSP 1.2. Quoting [EMAIL PROTECTED]: For what my non-contributor opinion's worth, I totally agree with David. So far as I know, while JSTL is not _required_ by the standard for JSP 1.2, it does not _require_ 1.2 -- and can be used with 1.1 containers; so saying use JSTL does not translate to upgrade to Servlet 2.3. Shai. -Original Message- From: David Graham [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2003 07:41 To: Struts Developers List Subject: Re: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag) --- Steve Raeburn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm not singling Vic out for this (honest) but... The standard advice we are now giving everyone is use JSTL, which I wholeheartedly agree with and have said myself. However, I think we need to make sure that we still adequately support non-JSTL solutions and continue to consider bug fixes/enhancements to Struts tags EVEN where it would duplicate JSTL functionality because Struts still supports JSP 1.1/Servlet2.2. I strongly disagree with that. Duplicating standard functionality is a complete waste of time. If someone wants something available in the JSTL they should just use the JSTL. Struts goal in life isn't to duplicate standards. We should absolutely fix bugs in the existing tags and provide tags that aren't available elsewhere. Having said that, I won't stop you or any other committer from donating time to developing tags that duplicate JSTL functionality. However, I can't justify spending my own time maintaining or fixing bugs in such tags. I haven't considered whether this particular enhancement would fall into the category of something we should do, it just prompted me to raise the issue. If we've reached the stage where the recommendations we are making *require* JSTL, then I think it's time to be honest about the required platform for Struts and up it to 1.1/2.3 I don't see how the Servlet version required for JSTL is relevant to Struts. We're making the reasonable recommendation that people use standard technologies instead of the propriety Struts counterparts. The Struts tags have served us well for a long time but IMO its time to let most of them fade away gracefully. David Thoughts? Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: August 27, 2003 8:28 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag DO NOT REPLY TO THIS EMAIL, BUT PLEASE POST YOUR BUG RELATED COMMENTS THROUGH THE WEB INTERFACE AVAILABLE AT http://nagoya.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=21465. ANY REPLY MADE TO THIS MESSAGE WILL NOT BE COLLECTED AND INSERTED IN THE BUG DATABASE. http://nagoya.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=21465 Enhancement of the html:link tag [EMAIL PROTECTED] changed: What|Removed |Added -- -- Status|ASSIGNED|RESOLVED Resolution||WONTFIX --- Additional Comments From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003-08-28 03:27 --- You can/should use JSTL instead. .V -- Kris Schneider mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] D.O.Tech http://www.dotech.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag)
I am not a voter, but I think Comments below... Rick Hightower Chief Technology Officer Trivera Technologies http://www.triveratech.com 520 290 6855 (Phone) 520 977 8605 (Mobile) -Original Message- From: Steve Raeburn [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 9:20 PM To: Struts Developers List Subject: Support for non-JSTL tags (was RE: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag) I'm not singling Vic out for this (honest) but... The standard advice we are now giving everyone is use JSTL, which I wholeheartedly agree with and have said myself. However, I think we need to make sure that we still adequately support non-JSTL solutions and continue to consider bug fixes/enhancements to Struts tags EVEN where it would duplicate JSTL functionality because Struts still supports JSP 1.1/Servlet2.2. I don't think fixing non-JSTL tags should take priority. I think deprecated tags like logic:iterate, and their ilk should receive very little attention. BTW I am going to make a concerted effort to contribute to this project. Please excuse me while I am new if I make any snafu. (I have some stuff and ideas in the works. Mostly bug fix type ideas.) I haven't considered whether this particular enhancement would fall into the category of something we should do, it just prompted me to raise the issue. If we've reached the stage where the recommendations we are making *require* JSTL, then I think it's time to be honest about the required platform for Struts and up it to 1.1/2.3 I think Struts 1.2 and higher should *require* JSTL tags, and overlapping Struts tags should be deprecated (aren't they already). If this is not feasible for Struts 1.2, then Struts 1.3 or 1.5 or 1.whatever. Use JSTL instead of Struts-Equivalent Tags Use core:out instead of bean:write Use core:set instead of bean:define Use JSTL core:if and core:forEach instead of Struts logic:* Use frmt tags in place of bean:message (if possible) Use JSTL EL Engine in Your Own Custom Tags I don't know how well the JSTL i18n support plays with the Struts i18n support as I am only familiar with the latter and not the former at least not on a carnal level. Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: August 27, 2003 8:28 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: DO NOT REPLY [Bug 21465] - Enhancement of the html:link tag DO NOT REPLY TO THIS EMAIL, BUT PLEASE POST YOUR BUG RELATED COMMENTS THROUGH THE WEB INTERFACE AVAILABLE AT http://nagoya.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=21465. ANY REPLY MADE TO THIS MESSAGE WILL NOT BE COLLECTED AND INSERTED IN THE BUG DATABASE. http://nagoya.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=21465 Enhancement of the html:link tag [EMAIL PROTECTED] changed: What|Removed |Added -- -- Status|ASSIGNED|RESOLVED Resolution||WONTFIX --- Additional Comments From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003-08-28 03:27 --- You can/should use JSTL instead. .V - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
