[biofuels-biz] Plaese Help!
Please can you help me. After making Bio Diesel for over twelve months and only using oil from the same fish and chip shop which is Canola Oil and is always liquid, I tried some restaurant oil which is thick like porridge. I tried heating the oil up before making the bio Diesel and it has separated perfectly when warm but goes thick again when left over night. I have tried different tirations but always it goes back to a thick consistency. I do hope someone can help me sort out this problem. Thank you Frank Murray Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.399 / Virus Database: 226 - Release Date: 10/9/02 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Sell a Home with Ease! http://us.click.yahoo.com/SrPZMC/kTmEAA/MVfIAA/9bTolB/TM -~- Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuels-biz] Ethanol in Australia
G'day all I made some phone calls about trying to purchase ethanol (sugar cane spirit) to use to make my bio-diesel (rather than using methanol) and it was suggested that I needed to contact the Australian Taxation Office to apply for a permit to use X amount of litres before I would be able to purchase any. Any body else had this experience in Australia? Regards Steven Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Sell a Home with Ease! http://us.click.yahoo.com/SrPZMC/kTmEAA/MVfIAA/9bTolB/TM -~- Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuels-biz] RE: UK veg oil 'crisis'
Kerrie Missed it. Heard a brief bit on BBC local news this morning about police in Wales looking for people using cooking oil in their vehicles after the local ASDA supermarket was selling out of oil in record time Any chance you could summarise? Later. Bit on ITV UK national news at 6 about people getting caught in Wales. Also showed a man from Wales(didn't catch the name) who was doing it legally twin tank style... I think from the info I have seen, people charged were running both home brew bio-d and WVO Also for anyone who has not seen it Skys report http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,31500-12139669,00.html Darren Hill -Original Message- From: Kerrie Thornton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 09 October 2002 13:37 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [vegoil-diesel] Listen to Radio 2 now. There is a discussian of Vege fuel on radio 2 now, 13:30 UK time. this follows a story in the times this morning. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Home Selling? Try Us! http://us.click.yahoo.com/QrPZMC/iTmEAA/MVfIAA/9bTolB/TM -~- Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuels-biz] RE: UK veg oil 'crisis'
Is anyone working on a type of oil that won't give off the tell-tale odor? -Original Message- From: Darren [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 10, 2002 4:21 PM To: Vegoil-Diesel; Biofuels-Biz; Biofuel group Subject: [biofuels-biz] RE: UK veg oil 'crisis' Kerrie Missed it. Heard a brief bit on BBC local news this morning about police in Wales looking for people using cooking oil in their vehicles after the local ASDA supermarket was selling out of oil in record time Any chance you could summarise? Later. Bit on ITV UK national news at 6 about people getting caught in Wales. Also showed a man from Wales(didn't catch the name) who was doing it legally twin tank style... I think from the info I have seen, people charged were running both home brew bio-d and WVO Also for anyone who has not seen it Skys report http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,31500-12139669,00.html Darren Hill -Original Message- From: Kerrie Thornton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 09 October 2002 13:37 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [vegoil-diesel] Listen to Radio 2 now. There is a discussian of Vege fuel on radio 2 now, 13:30 UK time. this follows a story in the times this morning. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Plan to Sell a Home? http://us.click.yahoo.com/J2SnNA/y.lEAA/MVfIAA/9bTolB/TM -~- Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuels-biz] Canakci/Van Gerpen
The main focus of the Canakci/Van Gerpen report was the probability that water production was inhibiting the reaction and this was where I, myself, was unhappy with Alek's foolproof method (again, many thanks to Aleks as I would not have found the report without his pioneering research). Take the water out of the reaction and we might have a very useful process . Paddy Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Plan to Sell a Home? http://us.click.yahoo.com/J2SnNA/y.lEAA/MVfIAA/9bTolB/TM -~- Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuels-biz] Hydrated ethanol/diesel fuel blends
http://www.eidn.com.au/energyerdcemulsions.htm Emulsions of Hydrated Ethanol in Hydrocarbon Fuels By Apace Research Ltd EXECUTIVE SUMMARY Accountability Project Need In response to adverse environmental impacts from mass consumption of fossil petroleum fuels as well as international crude oil reserves being finite, most countries are attempting to find answers to meeting future demand for fuel for transport. Internationally there is growing acceptance that renewable ethanol fuel produced from biomass, with its associated environmental benefits, will be the transport fuel of choice for the future. In the United States, Brazil and Sweden there is already widespread use of ethanol fuel and/or ethanol/petroleum fuel blends, while in many other countries, including Australia, such blends are being introduced. Ethanol/petroleum fuel blends directly address vehicle emissions and transport fuel security of supply issues. In addition to reducing currently regulated vehicle emissions, the renewable ethanol content of these fuels can result in a net reduction in the emission of carbon dioxide. Use of ethanol/petroleum fuel blends initially in the existing vehicle fleet is essential to develop the technology and infrastructure necessary to support widescale production and use of ethanol fuel. This project addresses the need to optimise the physicochemical properties of ethanol/petroleum fuel blends, to ensure that the maximum possible environmental and economic benefits are derived from the use of such blends. Project Objectives The project objectives were in two main parts: Part (a) To optimise the chemistry of the copolymers comprising the DALCO emulsifier for use by fuel distributors in order to increase the specific activity of those copolymers and reduce the cost of hydrated ethanol/diesel fuel emulsion production. Part (b) To optimise the chemistry of the copolymers comprising the DALCO emulsifier initially for use by researchers and regulatory authorities to produce stable emulsions of hydrated ethanol in petrol in order to identify any advantageous physicochemical properties of such hydrated ethanol/petrol emulsions compared with the properties of conventional anhydrous ethanol/petrol solutions. Findings and Conclusions It is Concluded from the results of this project that the lowest cost method of manufacturing PEOPS copolymer, the major constituent of the DALCO emulsifier, produces a product with high specific activity. The indicated cost of the optimised DALCO emulsifier in commercial scale quantities is below $1,000 per tonne. At $1,000 per tonne, the emulsifier contributes approximately 1.3 cents to the per litre cost of hyd.ethanol/diesel emulsion. This cost is less than for previous DALCO formulations and is considered likely to prove economically viable. It is also concluded that potential problems in the commercial use of hyd.ethanol/diesel emulsion have been overcome by optimisation of the DALCO emulsifier. The DALCO emulsifier can also produce hyd.ethanol/petrol emulsion with potential advantageous physicochemical properties compared to anhyd.ethanol/petrol solution. Applications Emulsions of hydrated ethanol in petroleum fuels directly address vehicle exhaust emissions and transport fuel security of supply issues of growing international concern. Most importantly, the renewable ethanol content of these fuels can result in a net reduction in the emission of carbon dioxide. Exhaust emissions from diesel engines are a major contributor to air pollution in urban centres in both developed and developing countries. The negative impact of diesel engine exhaust emissions on air quality and human health are now widely recognised. In developed countries authorities such as the Environmental Protection Agencies (EPA's) are increasingly regulating diesel engine exhaust emissions through new emissions standards for diesel engines. Hydrated ethanol/diesel fuel emulsion, or diesohol, represents a new and potentially cost effective option for significantly reducing particulate and NOx emissions from diesel engines, both in developed and developing countries. Internationally there is considerable potential for both short and long term applications of the diesohol technology. This is in large part due to diesohol being compatible with the existing fuel/vehicle infrastructure. Existing unmodified diesel engined vehicles can use diesohol interchangeably with diesel fuel. Moreover, diesohol is also compatible with and enhances any emissions reductions achieved by advances in diesel engine design and by the reformulation of diesel fuel. The hydrated ethanol/petrol emulsion researched in this project directly addresses issues relating to the use of ethanol/petrol blend in unmodified vehicles. Such an emulsion has a lower vapour pressure, greater water tolerance and, potentially, reduced NOx emission on combustion compared to the 10%
[biofuels-biz] Tree for oil production
Hello to all, some time ago, someone named a tree that produces a fruit that cointain 30% of oil. Yield 900 to 9000 kg/hectarie, and grow with rain falls beetwen 5 to 25 inches per year. I can«t remember the name of this tree. It«s was some thing like pinoteus or pinoleticus... Someone can help me?? Thank you, Mauro Knudsen. - Y! Messenger en tu celular: prob el nuevo Yahoo! Messenger para SMS aqu [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Sell a Home for Top $ http://us.click.yahoo.com/RrPZMC/jTmEAA/MVfIAA/9bTolB/TM -~- Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuels-biz] Tree for oil production
Mauro, Was it, Oil from Sapium sebiferum seeds can potentially be a substitute for petroleum. Scheld et al. (1980) reports yields of S. sebiferum seeds ranging from 4,000 to 10,000 kg/ha, and estimates that 25 barrels of oil per year can be produced as a source of energy. In addition to its biomass and energy value, S. sebiferum has been extensively planted and propagated for ornamental purposes (Duke 1983). Hakan At 11:33 PM 10/10/2002 -0300, you wrote: Hello to all, some time ago, someone named a tree that produces a fruit that cointain 30% of oil. Yield 900 to 9000 kg/hectarie, and grow with rain falls beetwen 5 to 25 inches per year. I can«t remember the name of this tree. It«s was some thing like pinoteus or pinoleticus... Someone can help me?? Thank you, Mauro Knudsen. - Y! Messenger en tu celular: prob el nuevo Yahoo! Messenger para SMS aqu [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Sell a Home for Top $ http://us.click.yahoo.com/RrPZMC/jTmEAA/MVfIAA/9bTolB/TM -~- Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] home heating
Another reason for a new tank is because of the algae stuff from diesel clinging to the walls of the old tank could clog filters etc. I also don't think too many residences up here don't own their own tank - besides why would the fuel co want to try and take 20 year old tanks out of peoples basements, could be serious liability if they spilled a drop and left an odour in the house. I also remember the big fuel spike a couple of years ago, from $0.35 to $0.65/litre. Message: 18 Date: Thu, 03 Oct 2002 10:01:29 -0500 From: rgord [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: home heating BigK fuels in Toronto says with BD no mods are req'd. Check out their site - I e-mailed them and got prompt response, good faq on site as well -I'll have to check current prices it was at $0.45/litre http://www.bigkfuels.com/ Darn too bad I'm not close enough to do business with them! I found it interesting that they will provide a tank. I never considered the notion of the tank belonging to somebody else... could an oil co. confiscate your tank if you took your business elsewhere?! Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Home Selling? Try Us! http://us.click.yahoo.com/QrPZMC/iTmEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] WVO source data
Does anyone have any solid industry numbers for the typical WVO generated by various types of facilities such as typical fast food outlets, etc.? Thanks [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Sell a Home with Ease! http://us.click.yahoo.com/SrPZMC/kTmEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Digest Number 1154
Dear Sir, Thanks a lot for your mail. We are an oil field Company. You may visit us at www.dewanchandgroup.com We want establish fewbio diesel plants in Maharashtra state of INDIA. There is lot of rice husk rice bran wild plants bearing non edible oil.We want to convert them to bio diesel as alternative fuel.We want know about Indian Standards, if any, from you as we are new to this business. We would also like to know about international stds. Furthe we would like to know whoo can provide us plant on turn key basis at what cost? Delivery period around three months. Capacity 600,000 Liters per month. You may contact me on [EMAIL PROTECTED] / [EMAIL PROTECTED] / [EMAIL PROTECTED] / [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thanks regards. -mglabhe --- biofuel@yahoogroups.com wrote: Yahoo! Groups Sponsor Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] There are 19 messages in this issue. Topics in this digest: 1. Biodiesel w/ diesel on boilers or funaces From: chris chris [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2. biodiesel in a month From: chris chris [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3. US green group says diesel soot is big cancer risk From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4. Re: oil furnace From: Bob Coyne [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5. Diesel engine, as a ready to use energy saving technology. From: Hakan Falk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6. Small ethanol production - aqueous ethanol From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7. Re: School busses From: Shaen Rooney [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8. RE: Small ethanol production - aqueous ethanol From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9. Re: oil furnace From: rgord [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10. Re: Diesel engine, as a ready to use energy saving technology. From: Steve Spence [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11. Replacing 5% petrol with bio-fuels can save India Rs 4000 cr From: Steve Spence [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12. Re: biodiesel in a month From: Steve Spence [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13. Re: Re: Legal Obstacles for Biodiesel From: murdoch [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14. Re: Hybrid Diesel Motorcycle From: Steve Spence [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15. Re: Re: Legal Obstacles for Biodiesel From: murdoch [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16. Re: Re: The Debate Over Diesel From: Steve Spence [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17. home heating From: Lisa [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18. Re: Diesel engine, as a ready to use energy saving technology. From: Hakan Falk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19. Re: home heating From: studio53 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message: 1 Date: Tue, 08 Oct 2002 21:40:34 +0800 From: chris chris [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Biodiesel w/ diesel on boilers or funaces Hi does anyone here have tested to add biodiesel on diesel boilers or funaces? We want to purchase a diesel driven boiler or furnace but afraid of the pollution it will expel. What is the ratio on the biodiesel and diesel? How about on diesel trucks? What is the best ratio for a truck to pass the emission test on a opacity machine? _ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com Message: 2 Date: Tue, 08 Oct 2002 21:54:24 +0800 From: chris chris [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: biodiesel in a month Is it true that you have to consume the biodiesel within a month? Why? Does it apply to all kinds of biodiesel regardless of the raw materials used? _ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com Message: 3 Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 23:09:07 +0900 From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: US green group says diesel soot is big cancer risk Like the other US diesel-bashers, PIRG seems to ignore the fact that the EPA study was of older diesels, and the new clean-diesel technology. And of course they ignore the potential of biodiesel, which can also do a lot to improve the older diesels.
[biofuel] Re: home heating
regarding price. the smallest oil boiler from omni is about 4 grand plus installation and shipping from the west coast. that is high, but if you burn free oil.. as for biod. in a boiler. sure you can use it, yes you have to use non rubber (silicon) or other gaskets washers etc... but who the hell can afford to burn biod. in a boiler! the methanol alone if at least 40cents a gallon. and the quantity - 600-1000 gallones in winter makes production a mess.. not to mention 100-200 gallones of methanol contaminated glycerine. sure, go for it... but just burn your WVO! --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], Lisa [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Message: 3 Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 16:21:48 - From: dan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: home heating to the person who wants to burn biod. or WVO, check out OMNI by Econo Heal Inc. they have a commercial grade boiler to burn SAE 10 -90 with no modifications and no external air compressor. they lower viscosity with pre heating. www.econoheat.com Cool... it's nice to know that somebody is trying to serve that market... BUT I find it a bit fishy that they don't post prices. If ya have to ask, ya can't afford it? BTW, the current unit *is* a boiler, which may or may not be interchangeable with furnace, which is what I mistakenly (always!) called the darn thing. I don't know if that makes a difference in the possibility of using WVO. --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], studio53 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You can't set a home heating oil furnace to burn more oil. You could change the nozzle size,i.e., a .8 to a 1.5, which means instead of burning 8/10th of a gallon, it burns 1.5 gallons, but nozzle sizes are set by the manufacturer of the furnace based on the size of the chamber. It is very unlikely a maintenance technician would alter this because it would be a liability. Hmmm, I'll have to check on that... I believe one of the things they claim to do (and charge us for!) is calibration or something to that effect. Is it possible that they mean something else with that term? Message: 9 Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 02:55:21 +0900 From: EREN [EMAIL PROTECTED] (by way of Keith Addison) Subject: EREN Network News -- 10/9/02 snip EIA Expects Heating Bills to Increase Up to $300 This Winter snip The Northeast will be hit the hardest, as those using heating oil are forecast to face a 45 percent increase in heating bills. snip now you know why I ask about vegoil in the boiler... the last time fuel oil costs spiked (3 yrs ago?), the oil bills a couple of months topped *$500*! (and that was with the thermostat set below 60F!) Message: 18 Date: Thu, 03 Oct 2002 10:01:29 -0500 From: rgord [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: home heating BigK fuels in Toronto says with BD no mods are req'd. Check out their site - I e-mailed them and got prompt response, good faq on site as well -I'll have to check current prices it was at $0.45/litre http://www.bigkfuels.com/ Darn too bad I'm not close enough to do business with them! I found it interesting that they will provide a tank. I never considered the notion of the tank belonging to somebody else... could an oil co. confiscate your tank if you took your business elsewhere?! Message: 21 Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 14:08:39 -0700 (PDT) From: mother [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Re: home heating since posting this question, i've gotten some more feedback (from a very reputable source) i'll share.. question posed was if buring biodiesel in standard oil furnace, if there were any modifications the needed to be made to furnace: ...the furnace should do fine. if burning 100% biodiesel shaft seals on furnace pump may need attention after a while... this, because BD is more lika solvent, so little rubber washers'll eventually get eaten through ... but, as far as the furnace itself, oil you buy from the heating company is called #2 heating oil, which is just diesel feul with a different name (and different taxes... which is why you never *see* a farmer syphon heating oil outta his furnance into his tractor, but you know he does!)... so if you hava source of good BD (no hushpuppy chips) and are willing to keep an eye on rubber parts on your furnace pump for corrosion, you should be good - i'm gonna giveitatry this year, will report back rj Sounds just like the rubber seal problems in engines... good to hear that they don't anticipate any exotic problems from furnaces/boilers. Wonder how much of a hassle it would be to do a pre-emptive replacement of the endangered rubber parts? Well, most of the info so far seems to point to BD only unless you have a unit specially designed to handle vegoil. :^( My first batch of BD has to be 250 gallons?! EEK! (kidding... I'm not THAT crazy!) Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Plan to Sell
[biofuel] presentation
thanks all.. got more than i can use. won't check the board till after tonight, so don't bother posting. take care..and anyone in rohcester ny contact me [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Sell a Home with Ease! http://us.click.yahoo.com/SrPZMC/kTmEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] home heating
Lisa, I will make a more extensive explanation and see if we can put together some form of conversion advices, but I have not time for this now. Burner/Boiler are mostly combinations of two separate products and tuned to each other at installation. The tuning is the adjustment of the burner flame to the boiler size and design. Flame control is the key and adjustments are done with nozzle size and air feeding. Viscosity is the name of the game and with a standard fuel often from deposit buried in constant earth temperature, it is more or less a fixed variable. It is a fair chance that you can run bio diesel directly without any other conversion than the usual adjustments and in this case any technician can do it for you. Do see to it that you follow the advices about rubber seals etc., that you have for diesel engine conversions. The economics of it is easy, if the bio diesel that you buy have the same or lower price than the heating oil, then it is economical. The chance that it is more expensive is large, since in most countries heating oil has tax exemptions. But on the other hand, you are making your country a favor by using bio diesel, so a small price premium might be worth it. SVO or WVO will absolutely need viscosity adjustment and the easiest way to do it, is by preheating. With some adjustments, you can probably use a fuel heater like the ones from, http://www.diesel-therm.com/ or http://www.biofuels.ca/ and other suppliers. Used motor lubrication oils have the same problems and this is also a market segment for http://www.econoheat.com , it is very likely that you will get it for nothing, like WVO, since most garages pay for the collection and disposal. It has similar and maybe simpler filtering problems as WVO. Also look at http://pulsonex.vitools.com/ for a different heating equipment that can run Bio diesel, SVO and WVO. I find the air conditioning equipment (AC) from http://www.econoheat.com very interesting. It is obviously using the absorption method and it has 35% to 45% of the efficiency of compressor techniques, but it is a good case for a renewal of old technologies. If the energy sources are waste oil, the economy is good with the lower efficiency. I like to talk with them about AC driven by solar heating, since it is done on some large freight ships. It would be a fantastic product. Hakan At 12:47 AM 10/10/2002 -0400, you wrote: Message: 3 Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 16:21:48 - From: dan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: home heating to the person who wants to burn biod. or WVO, check out OMNI by Econo Heal Inc. they have a commercial grade boiler to burn SAE 10 -90 with no modifications and no external air compressor. they lower viscosity with pre heating. www.econoheat.com Cool... it's nice to know that somebody is trying to serve that market... BUT I find it a bit fishy that they don't post prices. If ya have to ask, ya can't afford it? BTW, the current unit *is* a boiler, which may or may not be interchangeable with furnace, which is what I mistakenly (always!) called the darn thing. I don't know if that makes a difference in the possibility of using WVO. --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], studio53 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You can't set a home heating oil furnace to burn more oil. You could change the nozzle size,i.e., a .8 to a 1.5, which means instead of burning 8/10th of a gallon, it burns 1.5 gallons, but nozzle sizes are set by the manufacturer of the furnace based on the size of the chamber. It is very unlikely a maintenance technician would alter this because it would be a liability. Hmmm, I'll have to check on that... I believe one of the things they claim to do (and charge us for!) is calibration or something to that effect. Is it possible that they mean something else with that term? Message: 9 Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 02:55:21 +0900 From: EREN [EMAIL PROTECTED] (by way of Keith Addison) Subject: EREN Network News -- 10/9/02 snip EIA Expects Heating Bills to Increase Up to $300 This Winter snip The Northeast will be hit the hardest, as those using heating oil are forecast to face a 45 percent increase in heating bills. snip now you know why I ask about vegoil in the boiler... the last time fuel oil costs spiked (3 yrs ago?), the oil bills a couple of months topped *$500*! (and that was with the thermostat set below 60F!) Message: 18 Date: Thu, 03 Oct 2002 10:01:29 -0500 From: rgord [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: home heating BigK fuels in Toronto says with BD no mods are req'd. Check out their site - I e-mailed them and got prompt response, good faq on site as well -I'll have to check current prices it was at $0.45/litre http://www.bigkfuels.com/ Darn too bad I'm not close enough to do business with them! I found it interesting that they will provide a tank. I never considered the notion of the tank belonging to somebody else... could an oil co. confiscate your tank if you
[biofuel] Police looking for cars running on cooking oil- Fryer Fighters
Police looking for cars running on cooking oil Fryer Fighters - A Welsh police team dubbed The Frying Squad has been formed to sniff out motorists who fuel their cars with cooking oil from fish and chip shops in a bid to avoid paying high government fuel taxes. (it's not the taxes, it's the environment, stupid - S. Spence) Three Welsh motorists have already been caught and fined for using waste oil from restaurants selling Britain's favorite deep-fried dish, the Times newspaper reported yesterday (Reuters) Steve Spence www.green-trust.org Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Home Selling? Try Us! http://us.click.yahoo.com/QrPZMC/iTmEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] BIO_JELLY
research http://www.kelseyville.com/biodsl/ http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html http://www.dancingrabbit.org/biodiesel/drbdiesel.html Batch 1 1 litre SVO, 200ml methanol, app 3.5g sodium hydroxide method - food blender blended 1 hr results - high yield of presumably bio-diesel conclusion - need new blender Batch 2 10 Litres SVO, 2 litres methanol, app 35g sodium hydroxide method - custom made 'reactor' (drill and paint stirrer) 1 hr results - high yield but more soap ? conclusion - sodium methoxide mixed properly ? oil temperature ? batch 3 10 litres wvo, 1.5 litres methanol, app 49g sodium methoxide method - (2 base method)(The two-stage adaptation of Mike Pellyâs biodiesel recipe By Aleks Kac) results - strange thick gloop is this FAME ? stage 1 ? or has it gone badly wrong ? if it is fame how do I separate it ? conclusion - biodiesel isn't fun batch 4 2 litres wvo, 0.4 litres methanol, app 13g sodium methoxide method - large pan on ring, continual stirring - more care in mixing the sodium methoxide, better temperature control results - different stringy gloop setting on cooling with the exothermic reaction the mix hardly needed heating only dropping a few degrees in an hour - strands could be seen forming on inspection - strangely I have no desire to put any of these in my car methanol - I'm paying about £1.50 litre roughly $2.30 a litre. I am in the UK and have been unable to source lab supplies locally or at all for that matter as the companies I've approached won't deal on a small scale, hence the adoption of the 2 stage method (no titration) many thanks for any help _ Join the worldâs largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Plan to Sell a Home? http://us.click.yahoo.com/J2SnNA/y.lEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] RE: UK veg oil 'crisis'
Kerrie Missed it. Heard a brief bit on BBC local news this morning about police in Wales looking for people using cooking oil in their vehicles after the local ASDA supermarket was selling out of oil in record time Any chance you could summarise? Later. Bit on ITV UK national news at 6 about people getting caught in Wales. Also showed a man from Wales(didn't catch the name) who was doing it legally twin tank style... I think from the info I have seen, people charged were running both home brew bio-d and WVO Also for anyone who has not seen it Skys report http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,31500-12139669,00.html Darren Hill -Original Message- From: Kerrie Thornton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 09 October 2002 13:37 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [vegoil-diesel] Listen to Radio 2 now. There is a discussian of Vege fuel on radio 2 now, 13:30 UK time. this follows a story in the times this morning. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Plan to Sell a Home? http://us.click.yahoo.com/J2SnNA/y.lEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Re: home heating
dan wrote: regarding price. the smallest oil boiler from omni is about 4 grand plus installation and shipping from the west coast. that is high, but if you burn free oil.. as for biod. in a boiler. sure you can use it, yes you have to use non rubber (silicon) or other gaskets washers etc... but who the hell can afford to burn biod. in a boiler! the methanol alone if at least 40cents a gallon. and the quantity - 600-1000 gallones in winter makes production a mess.. not to mention 100-200 gallones of methanol contaminated glycerine. sure, go for it... but just burn your WVO! Burning WVO might be rather more messy. What's messy about producing 600-1000 gallons of biodiesel in winter? I've heated my home in North Dakota for over a year now on 100% biodiesel, and supplement with electricity. As North Dakota winters can get into -30 to -40 below zero F, we use 600+ gallons every winter. It's just a standard forced-air furnace, the ordinary 20-year-old pressure pump injection, spark ignition type that has been around forever. Homebrew biodiesel needs to be washed, or the excess methanol will eat the seals in furnace pumps in short order. - Chuck Ranum runs Triple-R Recycling in North Dakota, and makes biodiesel from waste cooking oil for himself and for the members of a small local cooperative. They use it in their vehicles, for home-heating, for farm-tractors, and they can't get enough. http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_processor4.html Chuck also said this: It's starting to get colder up here, I'll be weaning the BD down and adding #1 soon... All my production goes to heat mine and my buddies houses the rest of the winter. I'm glad my glycerine sets up solid. Early test show that burning it in a homemade furnace as sandwiches will work quite well. Free heat for the shop this winter! Keith Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Sell a Home for Top $ http://us.click.yahoo.com/RrPZMC/jTmEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Re: home heating
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], mother [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: since posting this question, i've gotten some more feedback (from a very reputable source) this, because BD is more lika solvent, so little rubber washers'll eventually get eaten through ... but, as far as the furnace itself, oil you buy from the heating company is called #2 heating oil, which is just diesel feul with a different name (and different taxes... which is why you never *see* a farmer syphon heating oil outta his furnance into his tractor, but you know he does!)... so if you hava source of good BD (no hushpuppy chips) and are willing to keep an eye on rubber parts on your furnace pump for corrosion, you should be good - i'm gonna giveitatry this year, will report back Your reputable source sounds like an ignorant ass. Not sure what country your in but most any I know, the farmer would pay less tax on tractor fuel than home heating oil. Why would one run a tractor on heating oil? We actually buy taxed diesel to run in the tractors, that way we can use it to fuel the on-road trucks also and if we need to run the tractors on-road we could account for that too. The dye that they use to mark fuel as off-road stays in your injectors and other places they can test for a very long time, if one gets caught using dyed diesel in an on road vehicle the punishments really are severe. The taxes paid are mostly refunded at the end of the year. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Plan to Sell a Home? http://us.click.yahoo.com/J2SnNA/y.lEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] School busses
For: Phew! That's what I call a list of refs. http://www.ehhi.org/diesel/pr_diesel1.html seems to be just what the doctor ordered. Thanks as always. James Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Plan to Sell a Home? http://us.click.yahoo.com/J2SnNA/y.lEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] School busses
Very strong arguments for use of bio diesel that is very much cleaner, especially on particles. One other problem is that if the buses were gasoline, the improvement of the situation would maybe reach 30% to 50%. The report would end up disqualifying gasoline too. Unless we use 100% bio diesel, the kids should not go on school buses or even live in a city. It also disqualify any adult variant too. As they also pointed out, the background levels were high. The argument for diesel bashers disqualify all fossil fuel on environmental reasons, as we did not had that feeling before after visiting any city. This arguments also disqualify heating oil and other inefficient heating, like open fire places. It is millions of kids dying from cooking smoke as Keith points out, but they are not children of Americans so they might not count, or if they do, it is 1 American child worth 10,000 in other parts of the world. Please support Keith solar cooking efforts and then we can talk about it, I am sure that he can tell you how to contribute. If you cannot support it financially, help promoting it. Hakan At 09:13 PM 10/10/2002 +0200, you wrote: For: Phew! That's what I call a list of refs. http://www.ehhi.org/diesel/pr_diesel1.html seems to be just what the doctor ordered. Thanks as always. James Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Sell a Home for Top $ http://us.click.yahoo.com/RrPZMC/jTmEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Police looking for cars running on cooking oil- Fryer Fighters
Hi Steve, It is sad isn't it.. If we look back to the sales tax issue on fuel, we have to accept, Big oil = Legislators = Big oil = Government = Big oil and the police becomes protectors of Big oils revenue instead of protectors of the people. Hakan At 01:22 PM 10/10/2002 +, you wrote: Police looking for cars running on cooking oil Fryer Fighters - A Welsh police team dubbed The Frying Squad has been formed to sniff out motorists who fuel their cars with cooking oil from fish and chip shops in a bid to avoid paying high government fuel taxes. (it's not the taxes, it's the environment, stupid - S. Spence) Three Welsh motorists have already been caught and fined for using waste oil from restaurants selling Britain's favorite deep-fried dish, the Times newspaper reported yesterday (Reuters) Steve Spence www.green-trust.org Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Plan to Sell a Home? http://us.click.yahoo.com/J2SnNA/y.lEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Re: Soybean Sulfur Content
Help needed. We were looking for a source for soy oil. Found one that gave an analysis including 0.41% sulfur - 4100 ppm. That sounds very high especially if we need to hit 15 ppm to meet ASTM standards. Does this number sound right? Is it high due to fertilizer the farmers are using? Does the BioD process somehow remove most of this? Craig Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Plan to Sell a Home? http://us.click.yahoo.com/J2SnNA/y.lEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] Police looking for cars running on cooking oil- Fryer Fighters
Holy god of back-asswardness! -Original Message- From: Steve Spence [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 10, 2002 9:22 AM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: [biofuel] Police looking for cars running on cooking oil- Fryer Fighters Police looking for cars running on cooking oil Fryer Fighters - A Welsh police team dubbed The Frying Squad has been formed to sniff out motorists who fuel their cars with cooking oil from fish and chip shops in a bid to avoid paying high government fuel taxes. (it's not the taxes, it's the environment, stupid - S. Spence) Three Welsh motorists have already been caught and fined for using waste oil from restaurants selling Britain's favorite deep-fried dish, the Times newspaper reported yesterday (Reuters) Steve Spence www.green-trust.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Sell a Home with Ease! http://us.click.yahoo.com/SrPZMC/kTmEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Ethanol Wrecks our engines....
Sunflower Keith do you have any articles destroying this statement. It is currently being put out by Big Oil over the addition of 10 - 20% Ethanol in Australias Petrol. The Pres of the biofuel association is pushing it up hill with a very pointy and bendy stick. I would like some real testing results to send off as the situation is reaching almost hysteria, people demanding fuel with out ethanol (That cheap additive put there to make the petrol go further). Damn glad I only have Diesels on Bio. Neil [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Plan to Sell a Home? http://us.click.yahoo.com/J2SnNA/y.lEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] Ethanol Wrecks our engines....
A complete report covering all of the applications of ethanol in gasoline, in new and used engines is ERDC Project No 2511 Field Trials of Ethanol/Petrol Blends This trial showed no harm to any engines, and documented the benefits. If anyone wants a copy (PDF), email me and I will supply Regards Fred Enga -Original Message- From: Neil and Adele Craven [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: October 10, 2002 3:30 PM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: [biofuel] Ethanol Wrecks our engines Sunflower Keith do you have any articles destroying this statement. It is currently being put out by Big Oil over the addition of 10 - 20% Ethanol in Australias Petrol. The Pres of the biofuel association is pushing it up hill with a very pointy and bendy stick. I would like some real testing results to send off as the situation is reaching almost hysteria, people demanding fuel with out ethanol (That cheap additive put there to make the petrol go further). Damn glad I only have Diesels on Bio. Neil [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Home Selling? Try Us! http://us.click.yahoo.com/QrPZMC/iTmEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] Ethanol Wrecks our engines....
Brazil has lots of ethanol powered vehicles. I saw photographs of an engine from a taxicab. The engine had almost 300,000 miles on it and was in for an overhaul. Try that with gasoline. I notice propane also claims 2 to 3x engine life. Kirk http://www.agric.gov.ab.ca/engineer/ana_ethanol.html Alcohol makes an ideal motor fuel for spark ignition engines for many reasons: Alcohol has a high natural octane rating - prevents premature detonation under load Alcohol burns more cleanly because it contains oxygen - less carbon monoxide emissions Alcohol burns slightly cooler extends engine life Alcohol has a higher volumetric efficiency contributes to increased power Most modern gasoline vehicles could operate on pure ethanol with a few basic engine modifications. As well, any gasoline engine can run on commercial blends of up to 15 - 20% (depending on the vehicle) ethanol with gasoline without modifications. In North America, Flexible Fuel Vehicles (FFV) are currently available that will operate on blends of up to 85% ethanol with gasoline (called E85). http://www.parnellusa.com/default.asp?page=educationsubpage=whypropane ENGINE LIFE: Propane's 104 pump octane rating and low carbon and oil contamination characteristics can result in documented engine life of 2 to 3 times that of gasoline. This is one of the prime reasons for propane's popularity in delivery fleets, taxis, buses and industrial engines. http://www.ethanol-crfa.ca/vehicle.htm How does using ethanol-blended gasoline benefit your vehicle? It enhances engine performance. That is why its used by international car racing teams. It is the highest-octane fuel on the market, so it helps your car run more smoothly. Ethanol burns more cleanly and at a slightly cooler temperature than normal gasoline. This means longer sparkplug life and fewer engine deposits, keeping your fuel system clean. Ethanol protects against gas line freezing, since it contains alcohol. All alcohols have the ability to absorb water, and therefore condensation in the fuel system is absorbed and doesnt have the opportunity to collect and freeze. Ethanol-blends help prevent problems during the winter and you dont have to spend extra money on gas-line antifreeze. Google ethanol +engine life 12,800 hits -Original Message- From: Neil and Adele Craven [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 10, 2002 4:30 PM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: [biofuel] Ethanol Wrecks our engines Sunflower Keith do you have any articles destroying this statement. It is currently being put out by Big Oil over the addition of 10 - 20% Ethanol in Australias Petrol. The Pres of the biofuel association is pushing it up hill with a very pointy and bendy stick. I would like some real testing results to send off as the situation is reaching almost hysteria, people demanding fuel with out ethanol (That cheap additive put there to make the petrol go further). Damn glad I only have Diesels on Bio. Neil [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.393 / Virus Database: 223 - Release Date: 9/30/2002 Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Sell a Home with Ease! http://us.click.yahoo.com/SrPZMC/kTmEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] Ethanol Wrecks our engines....
Yeah, but it goes down great with orange juice. We need ethanol at every gas pump! -Rolf Klein Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Home Selling? Try Us! http://us.click.yahoo.com/QrPZMC/iTmEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Ethanol Wrecks our engines....
Doug, Can I get a copy of the pdf file thanks. Ed - Original Message - From: Doug Foskey [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 8:48 AM Subject: Re: [biofuel] Ethanol Wrecks our engines On Fri, 11 Oct 2002 08:46, you wrote: A complete report covering all of the applications of ethanol in gasoline, in new and used engines is ERDC Project No 2511 Field Trials of Ethanol/Petrol Blends This trial showed no harm to any engines, and documented the benefits. If anyone wants a copy (PDF), email me and I will supply Regards Fred Enga I would like a link to this, as I would like to send it to our local pollie, so he may use it (Aust is looking to use 10-20% ethanol in petrol) regards Doug Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Plan to Sell a Home? http://us.click.yahoo.com/J2SnNA/y.lEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Ethanol Wrecks our engines....
oops fred, can i get a copy of the pdf file thanks Ed - Original Message - From: Fred Enga [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 6:46 AM Subject: RE: [biofuel] Ethanol Wrecks our engines A complete report covering all of the applications of ethanol in gasoline, in new and used engines is ERDC Project No 2511 Field Trials of Ethanol/Petrol Blends This trial showed no harm to any engines, and documented the benefits. If anyone wants a copy (PDF), email me and I will supply Regards Fred Enga -Original Message- From: Neil and Adele Craven [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: October 10, 2002 3:30 PM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: [biofuel] Ethanol Wrecks our engines Sunflower Keith do you have any articles destroying this statement. It is currently being put out by Big Oil over the addition of 10 - 20% Ethanol in Australias Petrol. The Pres of the biofuel association is pushing it up hill with a very pointy and bendy stick. I would like some real testing results to send off as the situation is reaching almost hysteria, people demanding fuel with out ethanol (That cheap additive put there to make the petrol go further). Damn glad I only have Diesels on Bio. Neil [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Plan to Sell a Home? http://us.click.yahoo.com/J2SnNA/y.lEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Ethanol Wrecks our engines....
On Fri, 11 Oct 2002 08:46, you wrote: A complete report covering all of the applications of ethanol in gasoline, in new and used engines is ERDC Project No 2511 Field Trials of Ethanol/Petrol Blends This trial showed no harm to any engines, and documented the benefits. If anyone wants a copy (PDF), email me and I will supply Regards Fred Enga I would like a link to this, as I would like to send it to our local pollie, so he may use it (Aust is looking to use 10-20% ethanol in petrol) regards Doug Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Sell a Home for Top $ http://us.click.yahoo.com/RrPZMC/jTmEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Hydrated ethanol/diesel fuel blends
http://www.eidn.com.au/energyerdcemulsions.htm Emulsions of Hydrated Ethanol in Hydrocarbon Fuels By Apace Research Ltd EXECUTIVE SUMMARY Accountability Project Need In response to adverse environmental impacts from mass consumption of fossil petroleum fuels as well as international crude oil reserves being finite, most countries are attempting to find answers to meeting future demand for fuel for transport. Internationally there is growing acceptance that renewable ethanol fuel produced from biomass, with its associated environmental benefits, will be the transport fuel of choice for the future. In the United States, Brazil and Sweden there is already widespread use of ethanol fuel and/or ethanol/petroleum fuel blends, while in many other countries, including Australia, such blends are being introduced. Ethanol/petroleum fuel blends directly address vehicle emissions and transport fuel security of supply issues. In addition to reducing currently regulated vehicle emissions, the renewable ethanol content of these fuels can result in a net reduction in the emission of carbon dioxide. Use of ethanol/petroleum fuel blends initially in the existing vehicle fleet is essential to develop the technology and infrastructure necessary to support widescale production and use of ethanol fuel. This project addresses the need to optimise the physicochemical properties of ethanol/petroleum fuel blends, to ensure that the maximum possible environmental and economic benefits are derived from the use of such blends. Project Objectives The project objectives were in two main parts: Part (a) To optimise the chemistry of the copolymers comprising the DALCO emulsifier for use by fuel distributors in order to increase the specific activity of those copolymers and reduce the cost of hydrated ethanol/diesel fuel emulsion production. Part (b) To optimise the chemistry of the copolymers comprising the DALCO emulsifier initially for use by researchers and regulatory authorities to produce stable emulsions of hydrated ethanol in petrol in order to identify any advantageous physicochemical properties of such hydrated ethanol/petrol emulsions compared with the properties of conventional anhydrous ethanol/petrol solutions. Findings and Conclusions It is Concluded from the results of this project that the lowest cost method of manufacturing PEOPS copolymer, the major constituent of the DALCO emulsifier, produces a product with high specific activity. The indicated cost of the optimised DALCO emulsifier in commercial scale quantities is below $1,000 per tonne. At $1,000 per tonne, the emulsifier contributes approximately 1.3 cents to the per litre cost of hyd.ethanol/diesel emulsion. This cost is less than for previous DALCO formulations and is considered likely to prove economically viable. It is also concluded that potential problems in the commercial use of hyd.ethanol/diesel emulsion have been overcome by optimisation of the DALCO emulsifier. The DALCO emulsifier can also produce hyd.ethanol/petrol emulsion with potential advantageous physicochemical properties compared to anhyd.ethanol/petrol solution. Applications Emulsions of hydrated ethanol in petroleum fuels directly address vehicle exhaust emissions and transport fuel security of supply issues of growing international concern. Most importantly, the renewable ethanol content of these fuels can result in a net reduction in the emission of carbon dioxide. Exhaust emissions from diesel engines are a major contributor to air pollution in urban centres in both developed and developing countries. The negative impact of diesel engine exhaust emissions on air quality and human health are now widely recognised. In developed countries authorities such as the Environmental Protection Agencies (EPA's) are increasingly regulating diesel engine exhaust emissions through new emissions standards for diesel engines. Hydrated ethanol/diesel fuel emulsion, or diesohol, represents a new and potentially cost effective option for significantly reducing particulate and NOx emissions from diesel engines, both in developed and developing countries. Internationally there is considerable potential for both short and long term applications of the diesohol technology. This is in large part due to diesohol being compatible with the existing fuel/vehicle infrastructure. Existing unmodified diesel engined vehicles can use diesohol interchangeably with diesel fuel. Moreover, diesohol is also compatible with and enhances any emissions reductions achieved by advances in diesel engine design and by the reformulation of diesel fuel. The hydrated ethanol/petrol emulsion researched in this project directly addresses issues relating to the use of ethanol/petrol blend in unmodified vehicles. Such an emulsion has a lower vapour pressure, greater water tolerance and, potentially, reduced NOx emission on combustion compared to the 10%
[biofuel] Re: Legal Obstacles for Biodiesel
Funny... there's this Frying Squad story from the UK, the World Energy report on a tax crackdown on the guys in Maine, and this from Oz, all more or less at once - from the veg-oil list yesterday: Hi Guys: I briefly heard on the BBC this morning that in Australia people are being ticketed for running diesels on veggie oil and thus not paying a road tax on fuel. Then someone else told me they heard about this in San Francisco, California (which I can't find confirmation of). Anyone know more about this? Lori Best Keith Ummm, FYI!! http://news.yahoo.com/news? tmpl=story2cid=573ncid=757e=1u=/nm/20021009/od_nm/petrol_dc LONDON (Reuters) - A Welsh police team dubbed the Frying Squad has been formed to sniff out motorists who fuel their cars with cooking oil from fish and chip shops in a bid to avoid paying high government fuel taxes. Three Welsh motorists have already been caught and fined for using waste oil from restaurants selling Britain's favorite deep-fried dish, the Times newspaper reported Wednesday. I have halved my motoring costs since I started running my Subaru on cooking oil, the paper quoted one of those stopped as saying. The car runs just as well and even smells a lot better than diesel. The drivers were fined 500 pounds ($780) and warned that persistent offenders may face up to seven years in jail. How does one make WVO burn to smell like diesel fuel? There must be some type of additive, eh? Good reason not to run dedicated WVO and be able to switch back to derv when going through toll booths. Time to take the decals off the windows. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Sell a Home with Ease! http://us.click.yahoo.com/SrPZMC/kTmEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] Re: Legal Obstacles for Biodiesel
And when I tell people things are structured beyond their wildest dream they think I am a conspiracy nut. Sigh. Kirk -Original Message- From: Keith Addison [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 10, 2002 8:31 PM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: [biofuel] Re: Legal Obstacles for Biodiesel Funny... there's this Frying Squad story from the UK, the World Energy report on a tax crackdown on the guys in Maine, and this from Oz, all more or less at once - from the veg-oil list yesterday: Hi Guys: I briefly heard on the BBC this morning that in Australia people are being ticketed for running diesels on veggie oil and thus not paying a road tax on fuel. Then someone else told me they heard about this in San Francisco, California (which I can't find confirmation of). Anyone know more about this? Lori Best Keith Ummm, FYI!! http://news.yahoo.com/news? tmpl=story2cid=573ncid=757e=1u=/nm/20021009/od_nm/petrol_dc LONDON (Reuters) - A Welsh police team dubbed the Frying Squad has been formed to sniff out motorists who fuel their cars with cooking oil from fish and chip shops in a bid to avoid paying high government fuel taxes. Three Welsh motorists have already been caught and fined for using waste oil from restaurants selling Britain's favorite deep-fried dish, the Times newspaper reported Wednesday. I have halved my motoring costs since I started running my Subaru on cooking oil, the paper quoted one of those stopped as saying. The car runs just as well and even smells a lot better than diesel. The drivers were fined 500 pounds ($780) and warned that persistent offenders may face up to seven years in jail. How does one make WVO burn to smell like diesel fuel? There must be some type of additive, eh? Good reason not to run dedicated WVO and be able to switch back to derv when going through toll booths. Time to take the decals off the windows. Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.393 / Virus Database: 223 - Release Date: 9/30/2002 Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Plan to Sell a Home? http://us.click.yahoo.com/J2SnNA/y.lEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] Ethanol Wrecks our engines....
Fred, I like to get the report, send it to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hakan At 03:46 PM 10/10/2002 -0700, you wrote: A complete report covering all of the applications of ethanol in gasoline, in new and used engines is ERDC Project No 2511 Field Trials of Ethanol/Petrol Blends This trial showed no harm to any engines, and documented the benefits. If anyone wants a copy (PDF), email me and I will supply Regards Fred Enga -Original Message- From: Neil and Adele Craven [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: October 10, 2002 3:30 PM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: [biofuel] Ethanol Wrecks our engines Sunflower Keith do you have any articles destroying this statement. It is currently being put out by Big Oil over the addition of 10 - 20% Ethanol in Australias Petrol. The Pres of the biofuel association is pushing it up hill with a very pointy and bendy stick. I would like some real testing results to send off as the situation is reaching almost hysteria, people demanding fuel with out ethanol (That cheap additive put there to make the petrol go further). Damn glad I only have Diesels on Bio. Neil [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Sell a Home with Ease! http://us.click.yahoo.com/SrPZMC/kTmEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] Re: Legal Obstacles for Biodiesel
Hi Kirk And when I tell people things are structured beyond their wildest dream they think I am a conspiracy nut. Sigh. Kirk Yes, sigh. You're right, things are. But also there are conspiracy nuts, eh? Too often I see them go flying off down some blind-alley or other while remaining oblivious to a real conspiracy right under their noses. For two centuries, economists have worried about what Adam Smith described as the tendency of chieftains in a market system to deceive and even to oppress the public. For instance. For one such case, plenty of conspiracy around (even here) that the cancer evidence is all a plot by environmentalists to hurt Big Tobacco. Or was it by socialists? Both, probably. Along with the UN and its plot to impose World Government, yet the same people seem to defend big business while global corporatization somehow escapes them. Closer to home, I think people who jumped to the conclusion that the apparent EPA and NBB exclusion of small-scale biodiesel producers was a conspiracy were wrong. Just neglect, and blindness - the small guys were beneath their radar screen. They see profits of less than $10 million a year as small. It remains to be proven, but it seems the way is clear now. But it was said to be a conspiracy by ADM - not a nice company at all, but let's get it right. Anyway, about this funny - what is it they say about coincidences? One coincidence is a coincidence, two coincidences is suspicious, three coincidences is enemy action. Something like that. Still, I doubt it. Even if so, I'd say it's too late, we're too widespread. Even tracing methanol sales, waste oil collection, etc, as someone just suggested - any real crackdown, would demand huge resources, more than it's worth, and put them in the awkward position of finally having to explain just why they're victimizing people who're probably doing more to save carbon and the environment than they are. Politically, it might be a hot potato. Anyway, at best, I think enforcement nets maybe 10% of any contraband, usually much less. The attraction of the illicit, plus a certain dissatisfaction with central government, might even encourage it. I think it did work that way during Prohibition didn't it? Didn't consumption go up? Best Keith -Original Message- From: Keith Addison [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 10, 2002 8:31 PM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: [biofuel] Re: Legal Obstacles for Biodiesel Funny... there's this Frying Squad story from the UK, the World Energy report on a tax crackdown on the guys in Maine, and this from Oz, all more or less at once - from the veg-oil list yesterday: Hi Guys: I briefly heard on the BBC this morning that in Australia people are being ticketed for running diesels on veggie oil and thus not paying a road tax on fuel. Then someone else told me they heard about this in San Francisco, California (which I can't find confirmation of). Anyone know more about this? Lori Best Keith Ummm, FYI!! http://news.yahoo.com/news? tmpl=story2cid=573ncid=757e=1u=/nm/20021009/od_nm/petrol_dc LONDON (Reuters) - A Welsh police team dubbed the Frying Squad has been formed to sniff out motorists who fuel their cars with cooking oil from fish and chip shops in a bid to avoid paying high government fuel taxes. Three Welsh motorists have already been caught and fined for using waste oil from restaurants selling Britain's favorite deep-fried dish, the Times newspaper reported Wednesday. I have halved my motoring costs since I started running my Subaru on cooking oil, the paper quoted one of those stopped as saying. The car runs just as well and even smells a lot better than diesel. The drivers were fined 500 pounds ($780) and warned that persistent offenders may face up to seven years in jail. How does one make WVO burn to smell like diesel fuel? There must be some type of additive, eh? Good reason not to run dedicated WVO and be able to switch back to derv when going through toll booths. Time to take the decals off the windows. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Sell a Home with Ease! http://us.click.yahoo.com/SrPZMC/kTmEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] Re: Legal Obstacles for Biodiesel
I think it did work that way during Prohibition didn't it? Didn't consumption go up? Very much so. And certain families were made. Kirk -Original Message- From: Keith Addison [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 10, 2002 9:32 PM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [biofuel] Re: Legal Obstacles for Biodiesel Hi Kirk And when I tell people things are structured beyond their wildest dream they think I am a conspiracy nut. Sigh. Kirk Yes, sigh. You're right, things are. But also there are conspiracy nuts, eh? Too often I see them go flying off down some blind-alley or other while remaining oblivious to a real conspiracy right under their noses. For two centuries, economists have worried about what Adam Smith described as the tendency of chieftains in a market system to deceive and even to oppress the public. For instance. For one such case, plenty of conspiracy around (even here) that the cancer evidence is all a plot by environmentalists to hurt Big Tobacco. Or was it by socialists? Both, probably. Along with the UN and its plot to impose World Government, yet the same people seem to defend big business while global corporatization somehow escapes them. Closer to home, I think people who jumped to the conclusion that the apparent EPA and NBB exclusion of small-scale biodiesel producers was a conspiracy were wrong. Just neglect, and blindness - the small guys were beneath their radar screen. They see profits of less than $10 million a year as small. It remains to be proven, but it seems the way is clear now. But it was said to be a conspiracy by ADM - not a nice company at all, but let's get it right. Anyway, about this funny - what is it they say about coincidences? One coincidence is a coincidence, two coincidences is suspicious, three coincidences is enemy action. Something like that. Still, I doubt it. Even if so, I'd say it's too late, we're too widespread. Even tracing methanol sales, waste oil collection, etc, as someone just suggested - any real crackdown, would demand huge resources, more than it's worth, and put them in the awkward position of finally having to explain just why they're victimizing people who're probably doing more to save carbon and the environment than they are. Politically, it might be a hot potato. Anyway, at best, I think enforcement nets maybe 10% of any contraband, usually much less. The attraction of the illicit, plus a certain dissatisfaction with central government, might even encourage it. I think it did work that way during Prohibition didn't it? Didn't consumption go up? Best Keith Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Home Selling? Try Us! http://us.click.yahoo.com/QrPZMC/iTmEAA/MVfIAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] Re: Legal Obstacles for Biodiesel
Hi Kirk and Keith, For years now, the police have controlled if the use of tax exempted off road diesel or heating oil have been used in automobiles. Normally the control was if the marked diesel was in the vehicle. Every day it is hundreds of controls in every country. It only needs a very simple directive and they would include check for bio diesel or veg oil. If that happened in a few places, they would catch a few. Since it is good stories, the police have no problems to get them published and it is so new, that it is world news. I am not surprised, but if we make the most of it, it will be negative publicity for the politicians and maybe it can be turned to our advantage. The politicians know that this is crazy and will react on bad publicity. I see this as a possible opportunity if we contact the press and make the most of it. Hakan At 12:32 PM 10/11/2002 +0900, you wrote: Hi Kirk And when I tell people things are structured beyond their wildest dream they think I am a conspiracy nut. Sigh. Kirk Yes, sigh. You're right, things are. But also there are conspiracy nuts, eh? Too often I see them go flying off down some blind-alley or other while remaining oblivious to a real conspiracy right under their noses. For two centuries, economists have worried about what Adam Smith described as the tendency of chieftains in a market system to deceive and even to oppress the public. For instance. For one such case, plenty of conspiracy around (even here) that the cancer evidence is all a plot by environmentalists to hurt Big Tobacco. Or was it by socialists? Both, probably. Along with the UN and its plot to impose World Government, yet the same people seem to defend big business while global corporatization somehow escapes them. Closer to home, I think people who jumped to the conclusion that the apparent EPA and NBB exclusion of small-scale biodiesel producers was a conspiracy were wrong. Just neglect, and blindness - the small guys were beneath their radar screen. They see profits of less than $10 million a year as small. It remains to be proven, but it seems the way is clear now. But it was said to be a conspiracy by ADM - not a nice company at all, but let's get it right. Anyway, about this funny - what is it they say about coincidences? One coincidence is a coincidence, two coincidences is suspicious, three coincidences is enemy action. Something like that. Still, I doubt it. Even if so, I'd say it's too late, we're too widespread. Even tracing methanol sales, waste oil collection, etc, as someone just suggested - any real crackdown, would demand huge resources, more than it's worth, and put them in the awkward position of finally having to explain just why they're victimizing people who're probably doing more to save carbon and the environment than they are. Politically, it might be a hot potato. Anyway, at best, I think enforcement nets maybe 10% of any contraband, usually much less. The attraction of the illicit, plus a certain dissatisfaction with central government, might even encourage it. I think it did work that way during Prohibition didn't it? Didn't consumption go up? Best Keith -Original Message- From: Keith Addison [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 10, 2002 8:31 PM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: [biofuel] Re: Legal Obstacles for Biodiesel Funny... there's this Frying Squad story from the UK, the World Energy report on a tax crackdown on the guys in Maine, and this from Oz, all more or less at once - from the veg-oil list yesterday: Hi Guys: I briefly heard on the BBC this morning that in Australia people are being ticketed for running diesels on veggie oil and thus not paying a road tax on fuel. Then someone else told me they heard about this in San Francisco, California (which I can't find confirmation of). Anyone know more about this? Lori Best Keith Ummm, FYI!! http://news.yahoo.com/news? tmpl=story2cid=573ncid=757e=1u=/nm/20021009/od_nm/petrol_dc LONDON (Reuters) - A Welsh police team dubbed the Frying Squad has been formed to sniff out motorists who fuel their cars with cooking oil from fish and chip shops in a bid to avoid paying high government fuel taxes. Three Welsh motorists have already been caught and fined for using waste oil from restaurants selling Britain's favorite deep-fried dish, the Times newspaper reported Wednesday. I have halved my motoring costs since I started running my Subaru on cooking oil, the paper quoted one of those stopped as saying. The car runs just as well and even smells a lot better than diesel. The drivers were fined 500 pounds ($780) and warned that persistent offenders may face up to seven years in jail. How does one make WVO burn to smell like diesel fuel? There must be some type of additive, eh? Good reason not to run dedicated WVO and be able to switch back to derv when going
