Re: [biofuel] More reason for Unrest?

[MH]

 motie wrote:
> 
> http://www.tompaine.com/feature.cfm/ID/7230/view/print
> 
> Secret Draft Of `Patriot II'
> Justice Department Drafts Sweeping Expansion Of Anti-Terrorism Act
> 
> Charles Lewis is the founder and executive director of the Center for
> Public Integrity. Adam Mayle is a James R. Soles Fellow at the
> Center.
> 
> Editor's Note: The following report is available at The Center for
> Public Integrity's Web site.
> 
> (WASHINGTON, Feb. 7, 2003)


 Regarding the US Patriot Act II
 from The Center for Public Integrity. 

 Commentary

 Even in Wartime, Stealth and Democracy Do Not Mix
 By Charles Lewis 
 
http://publicintegrity.org/dtaweb/report.asp?ReportID=506&L1=10&L2=10&L3=0&L4=0&L5=0

 WASHINGTON, Feb. 12, 2003 -- A few days ago, the Center for Public Integrity 
obtained
 a copy of draft legislation that the Bush Administration has quietly prepared 
as a bold,
 comprehensive sequel to the USA Patriot Act. This proposed law would give the 
government
 breathtaking new powers to further increase domestic intelligence-gathering, 
surveillance
 and law enforcement prerogatives, and simultaneously decrease judicial review 
and public
 access to information.

 We took the unprecedented (for us) step of posting the entire bill on our Web 
site. Why?
 Because democracy is supposed to be a contact sport, with many and diverse 
participants,
 and we quickly discovered that practically no one on Capitol Hill in either 
party or in
 the national news media had ever even heard of the Domestic Security 
Enhancement Act of 2003,
 much less read it. Senate inquiries about the likelihood of ãPatriot IIä 
legislation have
 been publicly and privately rebuffed for months, dozens of specific written 
questions to the
 Justice Department about implementation of the first Patriot Act simply never 
answered. 

 In a national crisis atmosphere of fear, paranoia and patriotism in the wake 
of September 11th,
 the Bush Administration introduced and got the Patriot Act enacted into law 
almost unanimously
 in just a few weeks, warp speed for Congress. The Senate Judiciary Committee 
had an hour and a half
 hearing in which Attorney General John Ashcroft testified but took no 
questions. In the House,
 meanwhile, there was no testimony from opponents of the bill.

 So now, with troops amassing on the border of Iraq, we learn that for months 
the staff of
 Attorney General John Ashcroft has been secretly planning another tectonic 
shift in the historic
 constitutional balance between security and liberty, further encroachments 
against the hard-earned,
 legally protected, right-to-know about our government in this country. Was the 
Bush Administration
 waiting for the bombs bursting in Baghdad to spring this latest, urgent, 
national security legislation
 on the American people and Congress, another drive-by mooting of our customary 
democratic discourse
 and deliberative processes? I donât know, but it is certainly not an unfair 
question to ask, given
 recent events. 

 What seemed to be merely self-serving shenanigans by the latest occupant of 
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue
 in the months prior to September 11th actually now appears to have been the 
dawnâs early light of a
 wholesale assault on access to information in this country. 

 It was before the worst terrorist act on American soil that George W. Bush, in 
his last hours as
 governor of Texas, had his official records packed up and shipped to his 
fatherâs presidential library,
 attempting to remove them from the usual custody of the Texas State Library 
and Archives and the
 strong Texas public information law. Similarly, so was Vice President Richard 
Cheneyâs refusal to
 release basic information about his meetings with energy company campaign 
contributors on government
 time and property. So was the secret Justice Department subpoena of Associated 
Press reporter
 John Solomonâs telephone records to attempt to learn the identity of a 
confidential source.
 The Reporters Committee found that ãthe Justice Department did not negotiate 
with Solomon or his
 employer, did not say why the reporterâs phone records were essential to a 
criminal investigation,
 and did not explain why the information could not be obtained any other way.ä 

 In the immediate aftermath of 9/11, Ashcroft issued a chilling memorandum 
about the Freedom of Information,
 advising federal officials that ãwhen you carefully consider FOIA requests and 
decide to withhold records,
 in whole or in part, you can be assured that the Department of Justice will 
defend your decisions unless
 they lack a sound basis or present an unwarranted risk of adverse impact on 
the ability of other agencies
 to protect other important records.ä Just three weeks later, with no fanfare 
or public debate, President
 Bush signed Executive Order 13233, sharply restricting public access to the 
White House documents of
 former presidents, including Ronald Reagan and his father. 

 Within six months of the Septembe

Re: [biofuel] The oil in Iraq

[MH]

 Iraq didn't bomb the US but
 the US/UK continues bombing Iraq. 

 U.S. Bombing Watch:  When was the last time the U.S. Bombed Iraq?
 Archive from 2000 to 2003 
 "Colorado Campaign for Middle East Peace" 
 http://www.ccmep.org/usbombingwatch/2003.htm


 The bombing continues in Iraq and
 the concerns of the U2 fly overs. 
 Listen in with Realplayer (aka RealAudio)

 February 10, 2003
   ** Chief U.N. Inspectors Cite An Encouraging Iraqi "Change Of Heart"; 
Democracy
   Now! Confronts Chief Inspector Hans Blix About No-Fly Zones 

   ** Justice Department Secretly Drafts Legislation To Strengthen The Patriot 
Act 

   ** "Infrastructure Of Concealment, Deception And Intimidation" Ð Is This 
About Iraq,
   Or Britain? Britain Admits Its Latest 'Intelligence' Report Was Plagiarized 
 http://www.webactive.com/webactive/pacifica/demnow/200302arch.html 


 February 11, 2003
 From Hawaii To Maine, Over 70 City Councils And State Legislatures Have Passed
 Resolutions Saying No To War: We Hear From Elected Officials In Maine, Chicago,
 Baltimore, Des Moines, Oregon And Cleveland 
 Listen in with RealPlayer (aka RealAudio)
 http://www.webactive.com/webactive/pacifica/demnow/200302arch.html 

 Cities for Peace
 U.S. City and County Council Resolutions Opposing War in Iraq
 More Resolutions: Universities -- Labor -- International 
 http://www.ips-dc.org/citiesforpeace/resolutions.htm 

 

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Re: [biofuel] US News and World Report: Cover Story

[robert luis rabello]

Keith Addison wrote:

> >You think Jesus would drive a diesel with biodiesel in it? I guess he
> would at that. And/or a bicycle. I dunno... I like donkeys, I wish I
> had a donkey.

A teenaged boy wanted to get his driver's license, so he approached his
father and asked if he could take a driver's ed course.  The father considered
this request and made two stipulations:

"You must improve your grades this term, and you must cut your long hair."

The boy disciplined himself, studied three nights a week and made certain
every assignment had been completed and handed in.  When report card time came
around, the boy proudly showed his father a big improvement in his academic
achievement.

"Can I get my license now?" the boy queried.

"You haven't cut your hair," his father replied.

Without skipping a beat, the boy responded: "Well dad, I've done some
research.  I've learned that Jesus, your favorite role model, had long hair, and
if long hair was good enough for him, it's good enough for me."

The father pondered this for a moment.  "You're right," he said.  "But if 
you
research a little bit more, you'll learn that Jesus WALKED everywhere he went!"

robert luis rabello
"The Edge of Justice"
Adventure for Your Mind
http://www.1stbooks.com/bookview/9782



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Re: [biofuel] The oil in Iraq

[Keith Addison]

>I personaly think he is right.
>
>Greg H.

There's been a lot of information - as opposed to opinionated 
frothings - posted here in the last few days, and previously, that 
scotches everything he says in at least three different ways. But 
he's right?

Keith

>- Original Message -
>From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: 
>Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 14:05
>Subject: Re: [biofuel] The oil in Iraq
>
>
> > I have an old friend who has lived in the USA for the last 15 years (he's
> > English)
> > I recently wrote the following to him...
> > We're all waiting for the war here in the expectation that it will turn
>the
> > local economy down a few notches. I've yet to meet a single person in
> > support. What are your feelings on the issue?
> > to which he replied... (slightly editid)


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RE: [biofuel] US News and World Report: Cover Story

[Keith Addison]

>Interestingly enough your website may have contributed to this article in a
>round about way.  About a month ago, US News asked for reader reaction to
>the question, "What would Jesus drive?"  I couldn't resist and sent in a
>letter that was later published on their website.  I closed with a reference
>to your website, pointing anyone who was interested in learning more about
>biodiesel there.  I bet they used your website in their research.
>
>Reader's letters can be read here:
>
>http://www.usnews.com/usnews/world/letters/suv1.htm
>
>Keep up the good work!
>
>Ryan

O-ho! I bet they did too. Thankyou Ryan. I just received an 
announcement about it from the NBB's Jenna Higgins:

>U.S. News Features Biodiesel in 
>"01-1451601-0-5853-1/tyWSdbPmvAmAtvz/GFhjr3N-W1687V>LIVING WITHOUT 
>OIL"
>
>Dear Biodiesel Bulletin Subscriber,
>
>Click on 
>"01-1451601-0-5853-1/tyWSdbPmvAmAtvz/GFhjr3N-W1687V>Living Without 
>Oil-As war looms, the search for new energy alternatives is all the 
>more urgent" to read the cover story of the latest U.S. News & World 
>Report. Biodiesel is prominently featured, along with other 
>alternative fuels.
>
>Join BIODIESEL ALLIANCE!
>Would you like to be supportive of biodiesel and receive more timely 
>information like this, and about new developments and opportunities 
>to take action?

etc.

... But maybe us here's ahead of them there, eh? No mention of the 
NBB in that story. 

You think Jesus would drive a diesel with biodiesel in it? I guess he 
would at that. And/or a bicycle. I dunno... I like donkeys, I wish I 
had a donkey.

Letters:

>Americans love the freedom, power, and status that their vehicles 
>provide. Who knows, Jesus may be the biggest car enthusiast ever, 
>and he may find Reverend Ball's views "socially irresponsible." 
>Wouldn't that be ironic!

LOL!

Jesus sure was notable for being devoted to his sense of freedom, 
power, and status above all else... Methinks he failed to get the 
message, at least one. Lots of dysfunctional bipolar reasoning as 
usual - don't look at the substance, just blame them for trying to 
impose their views. How convenient.

Best

Keith


>-Original Message-
>From: Keith Addison [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 7:10 PM
>To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [biofuel] US News and World Report: Cover Story
>
>
>Thanks Ryan - very good:
>
>  "If George Bush had pointed to the wreck of the World Trade
>Center, and said, `We must correct this problem,' and the only way is by
>raising the cost of gasoline on a phased-in basis, it would have worked," he
>says. "It was the golden opportunity missed."
>
>Yea, verily.
>
>Keith


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[biofuel] Re: cost of gasoline, ethanol mixture @ 76 stations

[murdoch]

One of the ideas mentioned in the oft-mentioned Taken-for-a-Ride by Doyle is
that Bush Sr. did seem somewhat to support Ethanol, as has seemingly Bush Jr.
While ethanol proponents will argue that Political Support of "Big Ethanol" does
not amount to competent support of ethanol in general, I think that generally
the Bushes seem to at least want to support ethanol to the extent they can win
Midwestern votes.  I don't know how to guage whether they've been good
supporters of the general biofuel cause.  I personally would initially say no.

A major theme in Doyle's book is that in the various stages of the clean air
wars, the Oil Companies and Refiners and auto companies would be under years of
pressure to improve things, would constantly cry that they were being treated
unfairly and the technology could not be forced, and so on, and then, lo and
behold at the 11th hour they'd come out that indeed they might be able to come
out with some previously non-doable or never-mentioned-thing, like Reformulated
Gas.  I mention it here because in my view the Oil company arguments that they
would be better off with RFG rather than oxygenated gasoline were another
example of this last-minute "we have a *better* solution" idea.  This idea of
mine is mitigated by a conversation I had with an official who as part of a team
on behalf of Cal. taxpayers had flown to the Midwest, tried to research things,
etc.  

My extremely imperfect recollection is that his belief (not the official belief
of the team, just his informal comments to me) was that in some ways, if clean
air was the goal, that there is an argument for both RFG or Ethanol, but that
ethanol had limited value and was, in his words, an older technology.  

I, personally, think it was *extremely* important to get some steady inclusion
of ethanol in our gasoline.  The oil refiners and companies have it good enough.
Let them sell us some of this other much-touted stuff, and let's see how it
goes.  So far, it seems like it is going *much* more smoothly than we were all
lead to believe with the doomsday predictions of the WSPA et. al. for the damage
this would supposedly cause our pocketbooks.  There was also some very obscure
claim I heard once as to supposed bad effects to the air from ethanol mixture
use, and I have heard nothing locally recently about setbacks in progress toward
clean air from ethanol or otherwise.  So, everything seems to be going pretty
well for some ethanol mixture use in one of the world's more watched driving
markets.  At least, if anything is going awry, it has not yet been covered that
I'm aware.

I'd like to keep my eye out for confirmation as to your statements about 76
using 15% and the other gasoline stations staying with the end-of-2003
guidelines.  The 76 use I do believe, I was just keeping in mind that their pump
stickers say it "might" include ethanol.

I was disappointed to still see the MTBE stickers on one of the other big
stations I was recently in.  Don't recall which company it was.



On Wed, 12 Feb 2003 16:55:28 -, you wrote:

>Union 76 were the first California company to switch from MTBE to 
>Ethanol (I believe that they use 15% ethanol).  By now most other 
>companies have also switched and the rest will be using ethanol as 
>their oxygenate by the end of this year.
>
>California asked for a waiver from using an oxygenate as gasoline can 
>be produced that burns just a cleanly without it.  However, the Bush 
>administration said no.  In this case I think I agree as this does 
>also help reduce dependence on foreign oil.


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[biofuels-biz] Re: cost of gasoline, ethanol mixture @ 76 stations

[murdoch]

One of the ideas mentioned in the oft-mentioned Taken-for-a-Ride by Doyle is
that Bush Sr. did seem somewhat to support Ethanol, as has seemingly Bush Jr.
While ethanol proponents will argue that Political Support of "Big Ethanol" does
not amount to competent support of ethanol in general, I think that generally
the Bushes seem to at least want to support ethanol to the extent they can win
Midwestern votes.  I don't know how to guage whether they've been good
supporters of the general biofuel cause.  I personally would initially say no.

A major theme in Doyle's book is that in the various stages of the clean air
wars, the Oil Companies and Refiners and auto companies would be under years of
pressure to improve things, would constantly cry that they were being treated
unfairly and the technology could not be forced, and so on, and then, lo and
behold at the 11th hour they'd come out that indeed they might be able to come
out with some previously non-doable or never-mentioned-thing, like Reformulated
Gas.  I mention it here because in my view the Oil company arguments that they
would be better off with RFG rather than oxygenated gasoline were another
example of this last-minute "we have a *better* solution" idea.  This idea of
mine is mitigated by a conversation I had with an official who as part of a team
on behalf of Cal. taxpayers had flown to the Midwest, tried to research things,
etc.  

My extremely imperfect recollection is that his belief (not the official belief
of the team, just his informal comments to me) was that in some ways, if clean
air was the goal, that there is an argument for both RFG or Ethanol, but that
ethanol had limited value and was, in his words, an older technology.  

I, personally, think it was *extremely* important to get some steady inclusion
of ethanol in our gasoline.  The oil refiners and companies have it good enough.
Let them sell us some of this other much-touted stuff, and let's see how it
goes.  So far, it seems like it is going *much* more smoothly than we were all
lead to believe with the doomsday predictions of the WSPA et. al. for the damage
this would supposedly cause our pocketbooks.  There was also some very obscure
claim I heard once as to supposed bad effects to the air from ethanol mixture
use, and I have heard nothing locally recently about setbacks in progress toward
clean air from ethanol or otherwise.  So, everything seems to be going pretty
well for some ethanol mixture use in one of the world's more watched driving
markets.  At least, if anything is going awry, it has not yet been covered that
I'm aware.

I'd like to keep my eye out for confirmation as to your statements about 76
using 15% and the other gasoline stations staying with the end-of-2003
guidelines.  The 76 use I do believe, I was just keeping in mind that their pump
stickers say it "might" include ethanol.

I was disappointed to still see the MTBE stickers on one of the other big
stations I was recently in.  Don't recall which company it was.



On Wed, 12 Feb 2003 16:55:28 -, you wrote:

>Union 76 were the first California company to switch from MTBE to 
>Ethanol (I believe that they use 15% ethanol).  By now most other 
>companies have also switched and the rest will be using ethanol as 
>their oxygenate by the end of this year.
>
>California asked for a waiver from using an oxygenate as gasoline can 
>be produced that burns just a cleanly without it.  However, the Bush 
>administration said no.  In this case I think I agree as this does 
>also help reduce dependence on foreign oil.


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http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
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http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm
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Re: [biofuel] my first batch, got some questions

[girl mark]

My first question is did you do a titration?  often if something like that 
happens there is either not enough of something, or not enough agitation 
(probably not your problem in a blender)  or the temperature is a factor 
(which is kind of rare for a blender batch).

it sounds like you got a partial reaction of some kind. and yes it is 
possible that there's something odd about the drygas I guess, not sure what 
it could be since I've never failed a test batch with the types of drygas I 
tried. You can take the honey colored biodiesel looking stuff you describe, 
and redo the same reaction with more of the lye and methanol- kind of 
irrelevant exactly how much methanol I think (try the rest of your bottle 
of drygas if you got a 354 ml bottle)  and a little less lye.
the reason for the less lye is that if you overdo the lye on a re-reaction 
it is possible to have the whole thing turn to soaps (glop... gel looking 
stuff).
If you didn't use enough lye the thing you're describing might happen.  If 
you didn't do a titration or you may have had any kind of inaccuracy in 
measurement (very easy to botch if using eyedroppers for instance- I do 
titration several times till I get a consistent result)- then try doing 
trial and error mini batches- make a few of these liter tests using the 
amount of lye you used and then a little more and a little more in the one 
after that. On a full size batch you'd want to get the amount of lye just 
right to get quality fuel...
good luck,
mark



At 10:19 PM 2/12/2003 +, you wrote:
>so i made my first batch of bioD, i don't know if i got it right i
>used the test batch meathod, wich is very easy, maybe you guys can
>help me, i used a drygas that said it was methanol, and lye, and
>brand new vegtible oil, but, it seems to me that the batch didn't
>work well althoe it is still settleing, about (2 hours now), there is
>only a very thin thin layer of light light brown stuff on the bottom,
>and the rest is what look like honey colored bioD, do i just need to
>wait longer, or do you think that the drygas i used was not 98%pure
>methanol where are you guys getting ur methanol? i used all
>the right amounts of the ingredents,(for sure), and it was mixed well
>in the blender, as the recipe said,
>
>
>
>Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
>http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
>
>Biofuels list archives:
>http://archive.nnytech.net/
>
>Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address.
>To unsubscribe, send an email to:
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the 
>Yahoo! Terms of Service.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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[biofuels-biz] Business that isn't (was California solar penalty)

[Darryl McMahon]

I expect this will get bounced from [EMAIL PROTECTED] and 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (not subscribed).

murdoch wrote: 

> You ask and suggest if there is a business opportunity here.  I think
> Darryl's website seems to indicate that he's sort of in the business
> already here, but I don't know.
> 
I am not in this business.  I would like to be, and I have some qualifications, 
but 
no luck finding paying customers.  Could have something to do with the fact 
that I 
am up-front about *all* the costs involved, and do the math for those that are 
interested, and when they see there is no economic payback to be had with 
residential (on-grid) PV in this area (subsidized electrical rates, no credits 
for 
PV installation, relatively poor insolation).  I do talk about the 
environmental 
payback, but that just isn't enough.  And I walk the talk - I've had PVs of 
various 
sorts for years (still have them on house, electric car and electric boat).  

When I then try to show them solar that is cost-effective (space heating, 
passive 
or active, pool heating or domestic hot water - a little more complex here 
where we 
go below freezing and stay there for up to 4 months a year), well, that's not 
nearly so interesting as PVs.  Funny how someone that is gung-ho on 
net-metered, 
grid-tied PV (not permitted here) figures that a solar pool heater is too 
complicated and too much plumbing.

Similar experiences with EVs.  I've driven them for almost 25 years now, so I'm 
fairly convinced that they exist and work.  They are not a panacea.  Again, I 
promote them, but I am honest about their drawbacks.  So, once again, no paying 
customers.  Funny how someone who wants a non-polluting car doesn't see why 
they 
should have to pay a price similar to a new OEM gasser to get one with similar 
capabilities (other than range between refueling stops).

Same with wind power in residential areas.  People call wanting a wind turbine 
in 
their backyard - which measures 20 feet by 24 feet.  I know the questions to 
ask 
now to save myself a trip to even look.  I love windpower, but you can't just 
stick 
a 1000 watt genny on a pole in a high density housing area.

I had a few calls last fall about how to reduce electrical bills when prices 
soared 
after deregulation. So I put the information together, drafted up some 
brochures 
and let some folks know I would be prepared to review their bills and their 
consumption and make some recommendations on how to bring their bills under 
control 
(at a reasonable hourly rate).  Even got a mention on the main local TV news. 
Once 
the government announced they would cap the price, all interest disappeared.  
So I 
put the information up on the website.  Maybe someone will benefit that way.

Recently, I tried to convince the local municipality they should encourage 
residents to harvest rainwater (cisterns, barrels, swales, gardens) rather than 
spending many millions of dollars on flashflood management measures being 
proposed. 
 Nope, but they are going to upgrade the water treatment and pumping facilities 
(more millions) so they can keep up with increased lawn watering demand in our 
increasingly hot summers.  Should have just spent the time on my own garden - 
would 
have been more productive.

So, I try to earn an income related to big automated systems.  Pays most of the 
time.  I'd love to make a living selling sustainable energy systems, efficiency 
and 
"common" sense, but I just can't seem to find any paying customers.  So the 
computer money pays the bills so I can dabble with EVs and AE/RE/SE in my spare 
time and write the occasional article.

I expect my future foray into biodiesel will yield similar results.  It works, 
I 
will use it, nobody else around here will pay attention.

Darryl McMahon


Darryl McMahon  48 Tarquin Crescent,
Econogics, Inc. Nepean, Ontario K2H 8J8
 It's your planet.  Voice: (613)784-0655
 If you won't look  Fax:   (613)828-3199
 after it, who will?http://www.econogics.com/


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[biofuels-biz] storage tanks

[Jack Young]

Yesterday I talked to the folks at Huisman's and they thought that by the
time the sale actually rolled around on Saturday they would get some tanks.
If they do have some they probably won't be sold until the afternoon.  The
trick about getting a good deal at an auction is that you have to be willing
to go there and check it out yourself and then wait around until they are
sold.

However, if you are interested and don't want to make the trip I will be at
the auction yard at about 9:30 on Saturday morning.  I can look for them and
you can call me on my cell phone (530.219.7900) to get the scoop.

Please get directions and auction terms at http://www.huismanauction.com/

Anything else I can do to help?

Best,
Jack Young
www.jacksauctions.com
530.219.7900 (voice)
530.795.5536 (fax)
>

> >
> > On Sun, 9 Feb 2003, Jack Young wrote:
> >
> > > As I mentioned earlier, I am and Auctioneer.  Often at auctions I run
> across storage tanks on trucks or trailers.  These are usually water
tanks.
> Seems to me that they would be good for a group (or BD Co-op) that was
> interesting in buy large amounts of BD for distribution purposes.
> > >
> > > I am working an auction in Galt this Saturday that usually has these
> types of tanks.  The auction is at
> > >
> > > http://www.huismanauction.com/
> > >
> > > Last month these went for very cheap.  Is anyone interested?  If so I
> can check ahead of time and let you know.
> > >
> > > Best,
> > > Jack Young
> > > www.jacksauctions.com
> > > 530.219.7900 (voice)
> > > 530.795.5536 (fax)
> > >
> > >
> >
>



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[biofuel] my first batch, got some questions

[mikedee100 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>]

so i made my first batch of bioD, i don't know if i got it right i 
used the test batch meathod, wich is very easy, maybe you guys can 
help me, i used a drygas that said it was methanol, and lye, and 
brand new vegtible oil, but, it seems to me that the batch didn't 
work well althoe it is still settleing, about (2 hours now), there is 
only a very thin thin layer of light light brown stuff on the bottom, 
and the rest is what look like honey colored bioD, do i just need to 
wait longer, or do you think that the drygas i used was not 98%pure 
methanol where are you guys getting ur methanol? i used all 
the right amounts of the ingredents,(for sure), and it was mixed well 
in the blender, as the recipe said, 



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RE: [biofuel] Huge Fee Increases Proposed for Solar Energy in Ca l ifornia

[Crabb, David]

I apologize for not being more clear in my question.

I can see that it is as you say.. control and greed.

What I am interested in is the reason given for the proposed increase.

I hardly think they are going to say: "We propose increases because we want
to 
increase our 'under the table' payouts for our friends as well as to finance
our 
corporate stock purchase plan for our Executives.  In addition this extra
money 
will help us stifle possible competition"

Next thing you know, the water utility company will charge people for
getting 
bottled water delivered.   "Since they arent using as much water"



Message: 8
   Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 09:21:09 -0800 (PST)
   From: James Slayden <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: RE: Huge Fee Increases Proposed for Solar Energy in Cal ifornia

Um, what could be the rational for this??  Control and greed!  =)  Those
two things usually amount to most difficulties in the world.

On Mon, 10 Feb 2003, Crabb, David wrote:

> What could be the possible rationale for this?
> 


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[biofuel] way to dry ethanol

[mikedee100 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>]

so does this work to dry ethanol, does anyone know or tryed it?, try 
the secnd like first, it is  alink from the fist link posted, about 
1/4 down the page

http://www.journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_link.html#anhydrous

`leads to this link, wich seems faily simple and cheap

http://www.thomasregister.com/olc/adcoa/molecula.htm



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[biofuel] storage tanks

[Jack Young]

Yesterday I talked to the folks at Huisman's and they thought that by the
time the sale actually rolled around on Saturday they would get some tanks.
If they do have some they probably won't be sold until the afternoon.  The
trick about getting a good deal at an auction is that you have to be willing
to go there and check it out yourself and then wait around until they are
sold.

However, if you are interested and don't want to make the trip I will be at
the auction yard at about 9:30 on Saturday morning.  I can look for them and
you can call me on my cell phone (530.219.7900) to get the scoop.

Please get directions and auction terms at http://www.huismanauction.com/

Anything else I can do to help?

Best,
Jack Young
www.jacksauctions.com
530.219.7900 (voice)
530.795.5536 (fax)
>

> >
> > On Sun, 9 Feb 2003, Jack Young wrote:
> >
> > > As I mentioned earlier, I am and Auctioneer.  Often at auctions I run
> across storage tanks on trucks or trailers.  These are usually water
tanks.
> Seems to me that they would be good for a group (or BD Co-op) that was
> interesting in buy large amounts of BD for distribution purposes.
> > >
> > > I am working an auction in Galt this Saturday that usually has these
> types of tanks.  The auction is at
> > >
> > > http://www.huismanauction.com/
> > >
> > > Last month these went for very cheap.  Is anyone interested?  If so I
> can check ahead of time and let you know.
> > >
> > > Best,
> > > Jack Young
> > > www.jacksauctions.com
> > > 530.219.7900 (voice)
> > > 530.795.5536 (fax)
> > >
> > >
> >
>



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Re: [biofuel] Business that isn't (was California solar penalty)

[Hakan Falk]

Welcome to the Club Darryl,

For more than 30 years me and my friends have been involved in
simulations of energy transmission in buildings. We have been
instrumental in getting Sweden way ahead of the rest of the world, with
the most advanced Building Codes. Only the direct projects that
has been done, saves Sweden 100's of millions every year.

http://energysavingnow.com

My friends have in no way made any money on it. I was lucky and
got in parallel involved in CAD/CAM, Networking and other IT projects.

The energy field is very consuming, it is so much to do and so many
things that can be done. The business is however so big and political,
that it is nearly no space to do clever things. Everything seems to
work against you and people seems to be genetically stupid.

When you can point to a very large success, as we can, it is no
recognition in form of financial means in relation to the impact.
Instead you have the feeling that you done something wrong and
the fight goes on in other areas and we are left with some
academic and research recognition.

Do not give up, because the small successes that you see, even
if they are only personal, are very rewarding anyway. Keith is
tackling a wider perspective, but cannot get around the energy
questions, since the are crucial for his goals. I am sure that he
will agree with what I am saying and the issues he deals with
must be even more frustrating. In the process he did however
create this very positive group and facilitated a very inspiring
support and communication between us. A great achievement.

Do not expect huge financial rewards, but you will find fulfillment
and a feeling of doing something important. It is fun also, despite
the constant fighting.

Hakan

At 04:16 PM 2/12/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>I expect this will get bounced from [EMAIL PROTECTED] and
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] (not subscribed).
>
>murdoch wrote:
>
> > You ask and suggest if there is a business opportunity here.  I think
> > Darryl's website seems to indicate that he's sort of in the business
> > already here, but I don't know.
> >
>I am not in this business.  I would like to be, and I have some 
>qualifications, but
>no luck finding paying customers.  Could have something to do with the 
>fact that I
>am up-front about *all* the costs involved, and do the math for those that 
>are
>interested, and when they see there is no economic payback to be had with
>residential (on-grid) PV in this area (subsidized electrical rates, no 
>credits for
>PV installation, relatively poor insolation).  I do talk about the 
>environmental
>payback, but that just isn't enough.  And I walk the talk - I've had PVs 
>of various
>sorts for years (still have them on house, electric car and electric boat).
>
>When I then try to show them solar that is cost-effective (space heating, 
>passive
>or active, pool heating or domestic hot water - a little more complex here 
>where we
>go below freezing and stay there for up to 4 months a year), well, that's not
>nearly so interesting as PVs.  Funny how someone that is gung-ho on 
>net-metered,
>grid-tied PV (not permitted here) figures that a solar pool heater is too
>complicated and too much plumbing.
>
>Similar experiences with EVs.  I've driven them for almost 25 years now, 
>so I'm
>fairly convinced that they exist and work.  They are not a panacea.  Again, I
>promote them, but I am honest about their drawbacks.  So, once again, no 
>paying
>customers.  Funny how someone who wants a non-polluting car doesn't see 
>why they
>should have to pay a price similar to a new OEM gasser to get one with 
>similar
>capabilities (other than range between refueling stops).
>
>Same with wind power in residential areas.  People call wanting a wind 
>turbine in
>their backyard - which measures 20 feet by 24 feet.  I know the questions 
>to ask
>now to save myself a trip to even look.  I love windpower, but you can't 
>just stick
>a 1000 watt genny on a pole in a high density housing area.
>
>I had a few calls last fall about how to reduce electrical bills when 
>prices soared
>after deregulation. So I put the information together, drafted up some 
>brochures
>and let some folks know I would be prepared to review their bills and their
>consumption and make some recommendations on how to bring their bills 
>under control
>(at a reasonable hourly rate).  Even got a mention on the main local TV 
>news. Once
>the government announced they would cap the price, all interest 
>disappeared.  So I
>put the information up on the website.  Maybe someone will benefit that way.
>
>Recently, I tried to convince the local municipality they should encourage
>residents to harvest rainwater (cisterns, barrels, swales, gardens) rather 
>than
>spending many millions of dollars on flashflood management measures being 
>proposed.
>  Nope, but they are going to upgrade the water treatment and pumping 
> facilities
>(more millions) so they can keep up with increased lawn watering demand in 
>our
>increasing

[biofuels-biz] Re: cost of gasoline

[murdoch]

>WOW!! Just saw diesel #2 at the local pump for $1.99  Now biodiesel IS
>competitive, without subsidies!!

Then that's news.  Let's spread the word.


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http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
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[biofuel] Re: cost of gasoline

[murdoch]

>WOW!! Just saw diesel #2 at the local pump for $1.99  Now biodiesel IS
>competitive, without subsidies!!

Then that's news.  Let's spread the word.


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Re: [biofuel] US News and World Report: Cover Story

[murdoch]

>Interestingly enough your website may have contributed to this article in a
>round about way.  About a month ago, US News asked for reader reaction to
>the question, "What would Jesus drive?"  I couldn't resist and sent in a
>letter that was later published on their website.  I closed with a reference
>to your website, pointing anyone who was interested in learning more about
>biodiesel there.  I bet they used your website in their research.
>
>Reader's letters can be read here:
>
>http://www.usnews.com/usnews/world/letters/suv1.htm
>
>Keep up the good work!
>
>Ryan

You too.  

I wonder, if somehow word reaches the author, or if he is reading, if he could
be persuaded at some point, in future articles, to *not* use Mr. Pimentel as the
only source on the ethanol sustainability issue.  I thought it was an excellent
article, but on that issue, it needs to be said that Mr. Pimentel is (as best
I've been able to determine) nearly entirely alone in his views amongst
respected reseachers, he is always the one quoted, and while there are more
respected views than his which question whether ethanol is more than marginally
sustainable, none seem to question the basic issue of sustainability.  The issue
is more widely-debated, with a much wider range of views, than Mr. Pimentel
would ever let on.  

I do not ask that the author ignore the claims of this or that researcher, but
he might like to be aware that Mr. Pimentel does not necessarily represent the
mainstream of thinking on these matters, nor even the mainstream of government
analyses.  Rather, he comes across as the carefully-protected darling of
anti-ethanol forces, partly because they can find so very few others to echo his
views.  The author may wish to consider that there may be several different
plausible explanations as to why Mr. Pimentel is nearly alone in his views.

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Re: [biofuel] biodiesel using ethanol

[James Slayden]

hrmm, in re-reading kavitha post It sounds like something else.  Maybe
just a partially reacted batch.  I wonder if a re-reaction w/ 3.5gm/L of
lye would have pushed the reaction to completion.

James

On Wed, 12 Feb 2003, girl mark wrote:

> no it doesn't
> mark
> 
> 
> At 12:21 PM 2/12/2003 -0800, you wrote:
> >sounds like GLOP!!  Have you done the tirtations for the oil?  tell us a
> >little about the oil your using.
> >
> >James Slayden
> >
> >On Wed, 12 Feb 2003, kavitha palaniappan wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > I have dropped the idea of using acid catalyst and I started
> preparing
> > > biodiesel with ethanol and KOH.  But,  even now, I face the same
> > > problem.  I just don't get two layers!  I get a uniform mass of
> biodiesel
> > > which is orangish brown in color and its viscosity is reduced to a
> > > considerable extent when compared to that of raw oil.  I tried with
> > > different oil:ethanol ratios and the result is the same!  And then, I
> > > tried water washing to separate the glycerol and the result was even
> more
> > > disappointing!  The whole mass turned into a thick, creamish white
> > > liquid!  I allowed it to settle overnight and no change!
> > >
> > > I didn't come across any such problems when I used methanol and NaOH
> with
> > > the same oil.  I clearly got two layers, one biodiesel and another
> > > glycerol.  In fact, then, I did not even go for water washing as I
> felt
> > > that it was a pretty good separation!
> > >
> > > Why is this process not working out with ethanol?  I'm also sure
> about
> > > the quality of ethanol that I am using, as it is a laboratory
> reagent.
> > > And, KOH was also completely soluble in ethanol unlike NaOH. So, no
> > > problem with ethanol and KOH.  Finally, where is the mistake lying?
> Can
> > > anybody help me?
> > >
> > > Kavitha.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -
> > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
> > >
> >http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.h
> ml
> > >
> > > Biofuels list archives:
> > > http://archive.nnytech.net/
> > >
> > > Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address.
> > > To unsubscribe, send an email to:
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> > >
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> > >
> >
> >
> >Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
> >http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.
> tml
> >
> >Biofuels list archives:
> >http://archive.nnytech.net/
> >
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> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> 
> 
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> 
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Re: [biofuel] biodiesel using ethanol

[James Slayden]

I think without knowing what the titration came out to be and what he used
for processing it is probably some BD mixed with some unreacted mono and
di-glycerides.

James

On Wed, 12 Feb 2003, girl mark wrote:

> that also doesnt mean this in this case
> mark
> 
> 
> At 12:23 PM 2/12/2003 -0800, you wrote:
> >Whoops, forgot to note about the creamish color of your wash, that was
> >emulsion, which usually indicates that your process didn't go far enough
> >in the begining.
> >
> >Put all your calculations together and send it to the list for review
> and
> >there will be some great responses.
> >
> >James Slayden
> >
> >On Wed, 12 Feb 2003, kavitha palaniappan wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > I have dropped the idea of using acid catalyst and I started
> preparing
> > > biodiesel with ethanol and KOH.  But,  even now, I face the same
> > > problem.  I just don't get two layers!  I get a uniform mass of
> biodiesel
> > > which is orangish brown in color and its viscosity is reduced to a
> > > considerable extent when compared to that of raw oil.  I tried with
> > > different oil:ethanol ratios and the result is the same!  And then, I
> > > tried water washing to separate the glycerol and the result was even
> more
> > > disappointing!  The whole mass turned into a thick, creamish white
> > > liquid!  I allowed it to settle overnight and no change!
> > >
> > > I didn't come across any such problems when I used methanol and NaOH
> with
> > > the same oil.  I clearly got two layers, one biodiesel and another
> > > glycerol.  In fact, then, I did not even go for water washing as I
> felt
> > > that it was a pretty good separation!
> > >
> > > Why is this process not working out with ethanol?  I'm also sure
> about
> > > the quality of ethanol that I am using, as it is a laboratory
> reagent.
> > > And, KOH was also completely soluble in ethanol unlike NaOH. So, no
> > > problem with ethanol and KOH.  Finally, where is the mistake lying?
> Can
> > > anybody help me?
> > >
> > > Kavitha.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -
> > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
> > >
> >http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.h
> ml
> > >
> > > Biofuels list archives:
> > > http://archive.nnytech.net/
> > >
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> > > To unsubscribe, send an email to:
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> > >
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> > >
> >
> >
> >Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
> >http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.
> tml
> >
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> >http://archive.nnytech.net/
> >
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> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> 
> 
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> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
> 
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> 
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Re: [biofuel] biodiesel using ethanol

[girl mark]

that also doesnt mean this in this case
mark


At 12:23 PM 2/12/2003 -0800, you wrote:
>Whoops, forgot to note about the creamish color of your wash, that was
>emulsion, which usually indicates that your process didn't go far enough
>in the begining.
>
>Put all your calculations together and send it to the list for review and
>there will be some great responses.
>
>James Slayden
>
>On Wed, 12 Feb 2003, kavitha palaniappan wrote:
>
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I have dropped the idea of using acid catalyst and I started preparing
> > biodiesel with ethanol and KOH.  But,  even now, I face the same
> > problem.  I just don't get two layers!  I get a uniform mass of biodiesel
> > which is orangish brown in color and its viscosity is reduced to a
> > considerable extent when compared to that of raw oil.  I tried with
> > different oil:ethanol ratios and the result is the same!  And then, I
> > tried water washing to separate the glycerol and the result was even more
> > disappointing!  The whole mass turned into a thick, creamish white
> > liquid!  I allowed it to settle overnight and no change!
> >
> > I didn't come across any such problems when I used methanol and NaOH with
> > the same oil.  I clearly got two layers, one biodiesel and another
> > glycerol.  In fact, then, I did not even go for water washing as I felt
> > that it was a pretty good separation!
> >
> > Why is this process not working out with ethanol?  I'm also sure about
> > the quality of ethanol that I am using, as it is a laboratory reagent.
> > And, KOH was also completely soluble in ethanol unlike NaOH. So, no
> > problem with ethanol and KOH.  Finally, where is the mistake lying? Can
> > anybody help me?
> >
> > Kavitha.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
> > 
> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
> >
> > Biofuels list archives:
> > http://archive.nnytech.net/
> >
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> > To unsubscribe, send an email to:
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> >
>
>
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>
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>
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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Re: [biofuel] biodiesel using ethanol

[girl mark]

no it doesn't
mark


At 12:21 PM 2/12/2003 -0800, you wrote:
>sounds like GLOP!!  Have you done the tirtations for the oil?  tell us a
>little about the oil your using.
>
>James Slayden
>
>On Wed, 12 Feb 2003, kavitha palaniappan wrote:
>
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I have dropped the idea of using acid catalyst and I started preparing
> > biodiesel with ethanol and KOH.  But,  even now, I face the same
> > problem.  I just don't get two layers!  I get a uniform mass of biodiesel
> > which is orangish brown in color and its viscosity is reduced to a
> > considerable extent when compared to that of raw oil.  I tried with
> > different oil:ethanol ratios and the result is the same!  And then, I
> > tried water washing to separate the glycerol and the result was even more
> > disappointing!  The whole mass turned into a thick, creamish white
> > liquid!  I allowed it to settle overnight and no change!
> >
> > I didn't come across any such problems when I used methanol and NaOH with
> > the same oil.  I clearly got two layers, one biodiesel and another
> > glycerol.  In fact, then, I did not even go for water washing as I felt
> > that it was a pretty good separation!
> >
> > Why is this process not working out with ethanol?  I'm also sure about
> > the quality of ethanol that I am using, as it is a laboratory reagent.
> > And, KOH was also completely soluble in ethanol unlike NaOH. So, no
> > problem with ethanol and KOH.  Finally, where is the mistake lying? Can
> > anybody help me?
> >
> > Kavitha.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
> > 
> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
> >
> > Biofuels list archives:
> > http://archive.nnytech.net/
> >
> > Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address.
> > To unsubscribe, send an email to:
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
> >
>
>
>Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
>http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
>
>Biofuels list archives:
>http://archive.nnytech.net/
>
>Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address.
>To unsubscribe, send an email to:
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>
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>Yahoo! Terms of Service.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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Re: [biofuel] banning the oil field & illiteracy

[Lisa]

>The problem with oil field service is that the guys work so many
> hours, 60 to 80 a week is standard.  How do they find time to study?
> This is the problem we find with many working illiterates, the jobs
they
> get pay so poorly that they have to work tons of overtime to support
a
> family.  This leaves no time to learn new skills to get a better
job.
>
> I wish I had the solution.
>
> Bright Blessings,
> Kim


This situation reminds me of a Thomas Jefferson quote I recently
discovered.  Although it is geared toward governmental greed, it is
striking how applicable the circumstances are to the modern condition
known as "wage slavery"!


"If we run into such debts as that we must be taxed in our meat and in
our drink, in our necessaries and our comforts, in our labors and our
amusements, for our callings and our creeds, as the people of England
are, our people, like them, must come to labor sixteen hours in the
twenty-four, and give the earnings of fifteen of these to the
government for their debts and daily expenses;
.
And the sixteenth being insufficient to afford us bread, we must live,
as they do now, on oatmeal and potatoes, have no time to think, no
means of calling the mismanagers to account; but be glad to obtain
subsistence by hiring ourselves to rivet their chains around the necks
of our fellow sufferers;
.
And this is the tendency of all human governments. A departure from
principle in one instance becomes a precedent for a second, that
second for a third, and so on 'til the bulk of the society is reduced
to be mere automatons of misery, to have no sensibilities left but for
sinning and suffering...
.
And the forehorse of this frightful team is public debt. Taxation
follows that, and in its train wretchedness and oppression."
.
~ Thomas Jefferson ~






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Re: [biofuel] The oil in Iraq

[Greg and April]

I personaly think he is right.

Greg H.

- Original Message -
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 14:05
Subject: Re: [biofuel] The oil in Iraq


> I have an old friend who has lived in the USA for the last 15 years (he's
> English)
> I recently wrote the following to him...
> We're all waiting for the war here in the expectation that it will turn
the
> local economy down a few notches. I've yet to meet a single person in
> support. What are your feelings on the issue?
> to which he replied... (slightly editid)
>


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[biofuel] Business that isn't (was California solar penalty)

[Darryl McMahon]

I expect this will get bounced from [EMAIL PROTECTED] and 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (not subscribed).

murdoch wrote: 

> You ask and suggest if there is a business opportunity here.  I think
> Darryl's website seems to indicate that he's sort of in the business
> already here, but I don't know.
> 
I am not in this business.  I would like to be, and I have some qualifications, 
but 
no luck finding paying customers.  Could have something to do with the fact 
that I 
am up-front about *all* the costs involved, and do the math for those that are 
interested, and when they see there is no economic payback to be had with 
residential (on-grid) PV in this area (subsidized electrical rates, no credits 
for 
PV installation, relatively poor insolation).  I do talk about the 
environmental 
payback, but that just isn't enough.  And I walk the talk - I've had PVs of 
various 
sorts for years (still have them on house, electric car and electric boat).  

When I then try to show them solar that is cost-effective (space heating, 
passive 
or active, pool heating or domestic hot water - a little more complex here 
where we 
go below freezing and stay there for up to 4 months a year), well, that's not 
nearly so interesting as PVs.  Funny how someone that is gung-ho on 
net-metered, 
grid-tied PV (not permitted here) figures that a solar pool heater is too 
complicated and too much plumbing.

Similar experiences with EVs.  I've driven them for almost 25 years now, so I'm 
fairly convinced that they exist and work.  They are not a panacea.  Again, I 
promote them, but I am honest about their drawbacks.  So, once again, no paying 
customers.  Funny how someone who wants a non-polluting car doesn't see why 
they 
should have to pay a price similar to a new OEM gasser to get one with similar 
capabilities (other than range between refueling stops).

Same with wind power in residential areas.  People call wanting a wind turbine 
in 
their backyard - which measures 20 feet by 24 feet.  I know the questions to 
ask 
now to save myself a trip to even look.  I love windpower, but you can't just 
stick 
a 1000 watt genny on a pole in a high density housing area.

I had a few calls last fall about how to reduce electrical bills when prices 
soared 
after deregulation. So I put the information together, drafted up some 
brochures 
and let some folks know I would be prepared to review their bills and their 
consumption and make some recommendations on how to bring their bills under 
control 
(at a reasonable hourly rate).  Even got a mention on the main local TV news. 
Once 
the government announced they would cap the price, all interest disappeared.  
So I 
put the information up on the website.  Maybe someone will benefit that way.

Recently, I tried to convince the local municipality they should encourage 
residents to harvest rainwater (cisterns, barrels, swales, gardens) rather than 
spending many millions of dollars on flashflood management measures being 
proposed. 
 Nope, but they are going to upgrade the water treatment and pumping facilities 
(more millions) so they can keep up with increased lawn watering demand in our 
increasingly hot summers.  Should have just spent the time on my own garden - 
would 
have been more productive.

So, I try to earn an income related to big automated systems.  Pays most of the 
time.  I'd love to make a living selling sustainable energy systems, efficiency 
and 
"common" sense, but I just can't seem to find any paying customers.  So the 
computer money pays the bills so I can dabble with EVs and AE/RE/SE in my spare 
time and write the occasional article.

I expect my future foray into biodiesel will yield similar results.  It works, 
I 
will use it, nobody else around here will pay attention.

Darryl McMahon


Darryl McMahon  48 Tarquin Crescent,
Econogics, Inc. Nepean, Ontario K2H 8J8
 It's your planet.  Voice: (613)784-0655
 If you won't look  Fax:   (613)828-3199
 after it, who will?http://www.econogics.com/

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Re: [biofuel] The oil in Iraq

[milliontc]

I have an old friend who has lived in the USA for the last 15 years (he's 
English)  
I recently wrote the following to him...
We're all waiting for the war here in the expectation that it will turn the 
local economy down a few notches. I've yet to meet a single person in 
support. What are your feelings on the issue?
to which he replied... (slightly editid)

 I think Europe is a bunch of moaning ninnies in denial. There is no 
political capital in supporting the US and everyone knows that the US 
will look after the world. For cripes sake we even had to go to Bosnia 
because Europe couldn't sort it out, nobody here wanted that. Nobody 
in Europe seems the least bit disturbed about a repressive regime that 
has killed many of its own people and seeks to increase its ability to kill 
more. The UN is not the world's police and will remain as ineffective as 
ever. Do people in Europe truly think a few weapons inspectors are 
going to change Saddam's mine? Talk about naive. The war f---ing 
sucks, it will result in the death of many Americans, it will cost a 
fortune, so nobody here wants it. If the rest of the first world weren't so 
bloody pathetic there could have been much more political pressure to 
force Saddam out, but short term self interest prevails in Europe.

So while horrible consequences await, the general, though far from 
total, thinking is deal with it now before it festers more. 9/11 had a big 
impact here. That is one big hole in Manhattan, seeing it is 
overwhelming. Doing nothing is not an option. While Iraq is a separate 
issue to Al Queda the big picture is that there are rapid enemies of 
America, humiliated that their dictatorial regimes, propped up by 
Islamic fundamentalism, don't work. They can't stand that so simply 
seek to hate, kill and maim. F--k Europe sitting on their hands looking 
the other way.

Err yeah, America will go to war if it has to.
--
Well, yes and no really

James



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Re: [biofuel] biodiesel using ethanol

[James Slayden]

Whoops, forgot to note about the creamish color of your wash, that was
emulsion, which usually indicates that your process didn't go far enough
in the begining.

Put all your calculations together and send it to the list for review and
there will be some great responses.

James Slayden

On Wed, 12 Feb 2003, kavitha palaniappan wrote:

> 
> Hi,
> 
> I have dropped the idea of using acid catalyst and I started preparing
> biodiesel with ethanol and KOH.  But,  even now, I face the same
> problem.  I just don't get two layers!  I get a uniform mass of biodiesel
> which is orangish brown in color and its viscosity is reduced to a
> considerable extent when compared to that of raw oil.  I tried with
> different oil:ethanol ratios and the result is the same!  And then, I
> tried water washing to separate the glycerol and the result was even more
> disappointing!  The whole mass turned into a thick, creamish white
> liquid!  I allowed it to settle overnight and no change!
> 
> I didn't come across any such problems when I used methanol and NaOH with
> the same oil.  I clearly got two layers, one biodiesel and another
> glycerol.  In fact, then, I did not even go for water washing as I felt
> that it was a pretty good separation!
> 
> Why is this process not working out with ethanol?  I'm also sure about
> the quality of ethanol that I am using, as it is a laboratory reagent.
> And, KOH was also completely soluble in ethanol unlike NaOH. So, no
> problem with ethanol and KOH.  Finally, where is the mistake lying? Can
> anybody help me?
> 
> Kavitha.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> 
> 
> 
> Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
> 
> Biofuels list archives:
> http://archive.nnytech.net/
> 
> Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address.
> To unsubscribe, send an email to:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
> 


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Re: [biofuel] biodiesel using ethanol

[James Slayden]

sounds like GLOP!!  Have you done the tirtations for the oil?  tell us a
little about the oil your using.

James Slayden

On Wed, 12 Feb 2003, kavitha palaniappan wrote:

> 
> Hi,
> 
> I have dropped the idea of using acid catalyst and I started preparing
> biodiesel with ethanol and KOH.  But,  even now, I face the same
> problem.  I just don't get two layers!  I get a uniform mass of biodiesel
> which is orangish brown in color and its viscosity is reduced to a
> considerable extent when compared to that of raw oil.  I tried with
> different oil:ethanol ratios and the result is the same!  And then, I
> tried water washing to separate the glycerol and the result was even more
> disappointing!  The whole mass turned into a thick, creamish white
> liquid!  I allowed it to settle overnight and no change!
> 
> I didn't come across any such problems when I used methanol and NaOH with
> the same oil.  I clearly got two layers, one biodiesel and another
> glycerol.  In fact, then, I did not even go for water washing as I felt
> that it was a pretty good separation!
> 
> Why is this process not working out with ethanol?  I'm also sure about
> the quality of ethanol that I am using, as it is a laboratory reagent.
> And, KOH was also completely soluble in ethanol unlike NaOH. So, no
> problem with ethanol and KOH.  Finally, where is the mistake lying? Can
> anybody help me?
> 
> Kavitha.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> 
> 
> 
> Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
> 
> Biofuels list archives:
> http://archive.nnytech.net/
> 
> Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address.
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[biofuel] Parallel gen system, was: California solar penalty

[Juan Boveda]

Hello Moti.

I would like to share a real case from an electrical system independent 
from a public power grid that later became parallel.

I work in a textile cotton mill established in 1929 in Pilar, a small town 
in Paraguay, in its beginning it had to generate its own electricity, it 
used to run on its own diesel engines generators that were set up because 
the public electric sources were far away ( more than 340 Km) and even 
those mill's generators provide the city's electricity as well, until 
November 1987 when the biggest hydroelectric power plant named Itaipu was 
connected to serve the city and the mill with energy at a lower cost. Now 
Paraguay is using 100% renewable electrical energy from 2 hydroelectric 
dams, one of them is the Itaipu Hydroelectric Power Plant, the biggest of 
all, see some data at:

http://www.solar.coppe.ufrj.br/itaipu_el.html

http://www.itaipu.gov.br/english/dado11.htm

I agree with your idea of a parallel system part of the time connected to 
the public grid and in ours when the public grid fails our own system goes 
on. In our case it was an engineering problem the retrofitting from our own 
generators to the public grid when this was available locally after many 
years.

Until now that parallel system has diesel generators in 380 V, 3 phases 
 for emergency purposes only. We keep the parallel electrical system in 
house with 2 generators set in stand by mode for emergencies ( aprox. 3 
minutes connection). The system is hand operated form the start with 
compressed air of the 750 HP TDI Deutz engines with a 460 KW generator and 
then part of the machinery switch off the grid manually to our generators.

The price of the energy produced from diesel fuel is still high compared to 
the public state owned electric service. We made some calculations of the 
cost to generate with diesel or SVO from cotton seed, compared to the 
opportunity to sell the SVO or refined cotton oil and it came out that is 
better to sell refined cotton oil and soap instead of generate electricity 
from it.

Here, IMO the potential market is good for a system using generators driven 
by SVO or Biodiesel or even Wood Gasification but in remote areas too far 
from power plants (more than 500 Km) because the investment for a 220 KV or 
525 KV transmission power line for a few small towns with a rural 
population under 5000 would be high if there is not a big consuption there.

Regards

Juan

[biofuel] Re: The oil in Iraq

[MH]

 Mon Lee wrote: 
> I was reading on evworld.com about a theory on why we
> are going to war.  It isn't just the oil or it is only
> a small part of it.  It seems that the oil nations are
> moving away from trading w/ US$ but switching to the
> Euro.  What does that mean?  The US $ will take a nose
> dive into the negative side - around 20% to 40%.  We
> have already lose 17% to the Euro in the past year or
> so.
> 
> This theory makes more since to me than just oil or
> Iraq having weapon of mass distruction.


 At this time I've little understanding of why
 the UK/US are gung-ho for war on Iraq.  

 IF its not for the Iraqi natural resources such as oil & water
 and there's little evidence of --
 1)  Weapons of Mass Destruction or
 2)  linking Hussein to al-Qaeda terrorists
 then why ?? 

 Maybe this war on Iraq will breakdown OPEC and
 cause a uprising in the Saudi Kingdom before the
 EU Euro can replace the US dollar in the world
 crude oil markets. 

 If this war on Iraq causes unrest in the Middle East
 oil region it would be helpful having a large military
 presence there to maintain the peace and avoid
 pollution from burning oil wells.  


 I may have misunderstood but I heard -- 

 the UN resolution 1441 was about
 disarmament and not regime change
 by the means of force 

 and 4 of 5 UN Security Council members with
 veto power are NOT in favor of war.  

 

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Re: [biofuel] Re: cost of gasoline

[James Slayden]

WOW!! Just saw diesel #2 at the local pump for $1.99  Now biodiesel IS
competitive, without subsidies!!

On Tue, 11 Feb 2003, murdoch wrote:

> Taxes on fuels are always something worth keeping in mind, but it is not
> the tax
> component which has changed recently, at all (unless there has been a
> change in
> taxes of which I'm unaware).  It is the price outside the tax component.
> 
> On Tue, 11 Feb 2003 16:37:47 -0800, you wrote:
> 
> >Please keep in mind that the price you pay for gas is inflated
> dramatically
> >by the various governments (Fed, State, City, County, and more). If you
> >check the wholesale prices by investigating the futures market, you will
> see
> >that today's wholesale price is about $1.05. In November last year it
> was
> >about $.75. Some folks have said that the dealer is only making 2-4
> cents a
> >gallon.
> >
> >Food for thought.
> >john
> >>This morning on some TV show I heard someone from San Francisco say
> that
> >>they are paying $2.40 / gal for the premium stuff and about $2.10 for
> >>regular.
> >>
> >>Randy Scott
> >
> >Good.  Let them think a few moments as to what it takes to get a gallon
> of
> >gasoline to their vehicles.  That said, SF is perhaps the highest-priced
> >town
> >I've ever been in, or one of them, depending on the exact item.  There's
> a
> >lot
> >of talk in San Diego about high gas prices, but it doesn't compare to
> SF,
> >the
> >few times I've been there.
> >
> >'Course the few who managed to get EVs there (such as the RAV4 EV
> drivers or
> >the
> >Think drivers) basically won't feel the price rise except indirectly
> (costs
> >born
> >by their fellow residents or for their other cars).
> >
> >
> >
> >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
> 
> 
> Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
> 
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> http://archive.nnytech.net/
> 
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RE: [biofuel] methanol to Africa

[Fred Enga]

Hello Tim,

I have had a positive response from one of our methanol distributors in
Germany, who has expressed interest in meeting your requirements.

The contact is

Thomas Mattis
VLC - GmbH
Bahnstrasse 30 - 32
Fon: + 49 6103 922 409
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Hope this helps you

Fred Enga

-Original Message-
From: Tim Cassidy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: February 6, 2003 10:17 AM
To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [biofuel] methanol to Africa


I need to get between 5,000 and 10,000 liters of methanol per month to
Banjul, The Gambia, West Africa, for a Biodiesel project. I've tried
to contact a number of methanol producers in the U.S. and Europe, but
I've been told that the quantity I need is too small for them to deal
with, or that they don't ship to that region. Any suggestions?

Tim



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[biofuel] Re: California solar penalty

[murdoch]

>--- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, "Darryl McMahon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> I expect net metering has probably been implemented well 
>somewhere.  In Ontario, it 
>> is still not permitted.  Provincial government has been muttering 
>about changing 
>> legislation to permit it for a little less than a year now, but 
>nothing concrete 
>> yet.
>
>I'm in MN USA, and we have Net-Metering on paper only. I tried with 3 
>different Utilities to tie-in with alternative energy produced 
>electricity. Their roadblock is that you have to have their 
>permission to tie into their system. To get permission, you have to 
>meet all imaginable safety specifications. NONE of them have Safety 
>Specifications in place! The best offer I was able to get, was that 
>if I would send $10,000 up-front, they would start a study to 
>determine what safety issues would need to be addressed, and perhaps 
>what Equipment Specs would be needed to comply. They would start the 
>Study immediately upon receipt of my check, and would contact me when 
>additional funds were needed, with no prediction as to what the total 
>cost of the study might be.
>As my needs were only for a temporary connection to conduct some 
>research, I declined their offer. I made temporary connection without 
>their knowledge or permission, conducted the testing I needed to do, 
>and disconnected.
>> 
>> > 
>> The more of this nonsense I see, the more I think grid-tying is a 
>waste for the 
>> typical residential power producer.  (I like the concept, just not 
>the 
>> implementations I am aware of.)
>
>I agree. Is this perhaps a business opportunity for someone to 
>Engineer such systems? The economic realities are that alternatives 
>are barely justifiable in many cases when you figure in Capital costs 
>vs the avoided cost of purchased power. The additional cost of inter-
>tie equipment puts the option out of the financial reach for many.

I had meant to respond to this and a couple of other points that you made that I
thought were good.  Many of us end up "tilting at windmills" and it's a skill to
learn to choose your spots.  

This happened with me recently in trying to get a better phone bill.  It would
have been rewarding to tell my local utility to shove off, and I did for awhile,
but it cost me an attrocious amount of money.  When I realized they held all the
cards, or most of them, I decided to go back and deal with it in a different way
a bit further down the road.  

Likewise, as you suggest, there are probably people who try to do the math, on
their own, and find it difficult to buck the system on net metering, distributed
energy, etc. etc. 

You ask and suggest if there is a business opportunity here.  I think Darryl's
website seems to indicate that he's sort of in the business already here, but I
don't know.

>>  Batteries are a bit of a nuisance, but less 
>> aggravation than paying for gear acceptable to the local utility, 
>extra 
>> installation and inspections, and then dealing with this silliness. 
>
>Retrofitting existing systems would be difficult, but I see a 
>potential for a paralell electrical system, one tied to the grid, and 
>one connected to your personal source, with no intertie between them. 
>Engineering would have to be site-specific.

I also thought this was a good point.  If your local utility does try to screw
you, then I guess a compromise is to forgo the advantages of interconnection and
spend the extra capital (or not) for onsite energy storage.

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[biofuels-biz] Re: California solar penalty

[murdoch]

>--- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, "Darryl McMahon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> I expect net metering has probably been implemented well 
>somewhere.  In Ontario, it 
>> is still not permitted.  Provincial government has been muttering 
>about changing 
>> legislation to permit it for a little less than a year now, but 
>nothing concrete 
>> yet.
>
>I'm in MN USA, and we have Net-Metering on paper only. I tried with 3 
>different Utilities to tie-in with alternative energy produced 
>electricity. Their roadblock is that you have to have their 
>permission to tie into their system. To get permission, you have to 
>meet all imaginable safety specifications. NONE of them have Safety 
>Specifications in place! The best offer I was able to get, was that 
>if I would send $10,000 up-front, they would start a study to 
>determine what safety issues would need to be addressed, and perhaps 
>what Equipment Specs would be needed to comply. They would start the 
>Study immediately upon receipt of my check, and would contact me when 
>additional funds were needed, with no prediction as to what the total 
>cost of the study might be.
>As my needs were only for a temporary connection to conduct some 
>research, I declined their offer. I made temporary connection without 
>their knowledge or permission, conducted the testing I needed to do, 
>and disconnected.
>> 
>> > 
>> The more of this nonsense I see, the more I think grid-tying is a 
>waste for the 
>> typical residential power producer.  (I like the concept, just not 
>the 
>> implementations I am aware of.)
>
>I agree. Is this perhaps a business opportunity for someone to 
>Engineer such systems? The economic realities are that alternatives 
>are barely justifiable in many cases when you figure in Capital costs 
>vs the avoided cost of purchased power. The additional cost of inter-
>tie equipment puts the option out of the financial reach for many.

I had meant to respond to this and a couple of other points that you made that I
thought were good.  Many of us end up "tilting at windmills" and it's a skill to
learn to choose your spots.  

This happened with me recently in trying to get a better phone bill.  It would
have been rewarding to tell my local utility to shove off, and I did for awhile,
but it cost me an attrocious amount of money.  When I realized they held all the
cards, or most of them, I decided to go back and deal with it in a different way
a bit further down the road.  

Likewise, as you suggest, there are probably people who try to do the math, on
their own, and find it difficult to buck the system on net metering, distributed
energy, etc. etc. 

You ask and suggest if there is a business opportunity here.  I think Darryl's
website seems to indicate that he's sort of in the business already here, but I
don't know.

>>  Batteries are a bit of a nuisance, but less 
>> aggravation than paying for gear acceptable to the local utility, 
>extra 
>> installation and inspections, and then dealing with this silliness. 
>
>Retrofitting existing systems would be difficult, but I see a 
>potential for a paralell electrical system, one tied to the grid, and 
>one connected to your personal source, with no intertie between them. 
>Engineering would have to be site-specific.

I also thought this was a good point.  If your local utility does try to screw
you, then I guess a compromise is to forgo the advantages of interconnection and
spend the extra capital (or not) for onsite energy storage.

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http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
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http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm
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Re: [biofuel] tax credits for biodiesel-capable cars as alternative fuel vehicles

[Greg and April]

The trick is to get more people to own and drive diesels in the first place.
Why not first reduce the taxes on dino-diesel to make it more atractive to
use a diesel powered vehical, until the public pefers to gas powered
vehicals, then raise the taxes to make it preferable to use biodiesel?

Once that is done, keep the gasoline tax higher so that gas cost a little
more than dino-diesel, and then have the dino-diesel taxed so that it cost a
little more than bio-diesel.

People will then gravitate towards diesel like they did durring the 70's
energy crunch, and then from there to bio-diesel.

Greg H.


- Original Message -
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ; 
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 09:57
Subject: Re: [biofuel] tax credits for biodiesel-capable cars as alternative
fuel vehicles


> Yes, it's very simple. Apply a higher tax to fossil diesel fuel than
bio-diesel fuel.
>


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[biofuel] Europe imports diesel, exports gasoline to US

[murdoch]

http://biz.yahoo.com/djus/030212/1144000757_1.html

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[biofuels-biz] Europe imports diesel, exports gasoline to US

[murdoch]

http://biz.yahoo.com/djus/030212/1144000757_1.html

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http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
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Re: [biofuel] tax credits for biodiesel-capable cars as alternative fuel vehicles

[malcolm.scott]

Yes, it's very simple. Apply a higher tax to fossil diesel fuel than bio-diesel 
fuel.

> 
> From: Thor Skov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: 2003/02/11 Tue PM 10:26:14 GMT
> To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [biofuel] tax credits for biodiesel-capable cars as alternative fuel 
> vehicles
> 
> 


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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Re: [biofuel] Sorry about multiple postings...

[Greg and April]

I have had that probleb a time or two my self.

Greg H.

- Original Message - 
From: "Appal Energy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 21:12
Subject: [biofuel] Sorry about multiple postings...


> Sorry about the multiple postings. Glitch in MS OE. Kept hitting
> "send" and it kept telling me "could not delete."
> 
> Todd Swearingen
> 


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RE: [biofuel] US News and World Report: Cover Story

[Ryan Morgan, Aerials Express]

Interestingly enough your website may have contributed to this article in a
round about way.  About a month ago, US News asked for reader reaction to
the question, "What would Jesus drive?"  I couldn't resist and sent in a
letter that was later published on their website.  I closed with a reference
to your website, pointing anyone who was interested in learning more about
biodiesel there.  I bet they used your website in their research.

Reader's letters can be read here:

http://www.usnews.com/usnews/world/letters/suv1.htm

Keep up the good work!

Ryan

-Original Message-
From: Keith Addison [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 7:10 PM
To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [biofuel] US News and World Report: Cover Story


Thanks Ryan - very good:

  "If George Bush had pointed to the wreck of the World Trade
Center, and said, `We must correct this problem,' and the only way is by
raising the cost of gasoline on a phased-in basis, it would have worked," he
says. "It was the golden opportunity missed."

Yea, verily.

Keith



>http://www.usnews.com/usnews/issue/030217/biztech/17oil.htm
>
>Living Without Oil
>As war looms, the search for new energy alternatives is all the more urgent


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[biofuel] Re: cost of gasoline, ethanol mixture @ 76 stations

[murdoch]

On Wed, 12 Feb 2003 01:42:27 -0800, you wrote:

>
>http://www.ethanolrfa.org/pr020722.html

BP, Shell Oil Products US, and ExxonMobil have announced they will join Phillips
and provide MTBE-free gasoline to California in 2003.  

The last time I was at a Shell station I think they still had MTBE.  I wonder if
these other 3 are sticking to their 2003 goal, if it ever really existed.  I'll
try to keep an eye out next time.
 

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Re: [biofuels-biz] cost of gasoline, ethanol mixture @ 76 stations

[murdoch]

On Wed, 12 Feb 2003 01:42:27 -0800, you wrote:

>
>http://www.ethanolrfa.org/pr020722.html

BP, Shell Oil Products US, and ExxonMobil have announced they will join Phillips
and provide MTBE-free gasoline to California in 2003.  

The last time I was at a Shell station I think they still had MTBE.  I wonder if
these other 3 are sticking to their 2003 goal, if it ever really existed.  I'll
try to keep an eye out next time.
 

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http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
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[biofuel] Does the US tax code favor gas guzzlers?

[murdoch]

On Wed, 12 Feb 2003 13:26:50 +0900, you wrote:

>http://www.ems.org/
>Environmental Media Services - facts and contacts for journalists
>Feb. 10
>Tax Code Encourages Gas Guzzlers, Critics Say
>
>A huge tax break for buyers of the largest SUVs is drawing sharp 

Interesting.  EVworld.com carried an article about this about 10 months before
all those other articles, but I don't know what other articles predated ours.
http://www.evworld.com/databases/storybuilder.cfm?storyid=343

>New York Times, "Bush Proposal May Cut Tax on S.U.V.'s for Business"
>Sierra Club, "Sierra Club to IRS: Audit Gas-Guzzling SUVs"
>Alliance to Save Energy, "SUV Tax Break 'Outrageous'"
>Detroit Free Press, Brian Dickerson column, "Tax Breaks and SUVs a Curious Mix"
>Detroit News, "SUV, Truck Owners Get a Big Tax Break"
>Taxpayers for Common Sense white paper, "A Hummer of a Tax Break"
>Taxpayers for Common Sense, "Senator to Introduce Bill to Close SUV 
>Business Tax Loophole"

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[biofuels-biz] Does the US tax code favor gas guzzlers?

[murdoch]

On Wed, 12 Feb 2003 13:26:50 +0900, you wrote:

>http://www.ems.org/
>Environmental Media Services - facts and contacts for journalists
>Feb. 10
>Tax Code Encourages Gas Guzzlers, Critics Say
>
>A huge tax break for buyers of the largest SUVs is drawing sharp 

Interesting.  EVworld.com carried an article about this about 10 months before
all those other articles, but I don't know what other articles predated ours.
http://www.evworld.com/databases/storybuilder.cfm?storyid=343

>New York Times, "Bush Proposal May Cut Tax on S.U.V.'s for Business"
>Sierra Club, "Sierra Club to IRS: Audit Gas-Guzzling SUVs"
>Alliance to Save Energy, "SUV Tax Break 'Outrageous'"
>Detroit Free Press, Brian Dickerson column, "Tax Breaks and SUVs a Curious Mix"
>Detroit News, "SUV, Truck Owners Get a Big Tax Break"
>Taxpayers for Common Sense white paper, "A Hummer of a Tax Break"
>Taxpayers for Common Sense, "Senator to Introduce Bill to Close SUV 
>Business Tax Loophole"

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[biofuel] Re: The oil in Iraq

[Mon Lee]

I was reading on evworld.com about a theory on why we
are going to war.  It isn't just the oil or it is only
a small part of it.  It seems that the oil nations are
moving away from trading w/ US$ but switching to the
Euro.  What does that mean?  The US $ will take a nose
dive into the negative side - around 20% to 40%.  We
have already lose 17% to the Euro in the past year or
so.

This theory makes more since to me than just oil or
Iraq having weapon of mass distruction.


__
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Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day
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[biofuel] At Last, Evidence

[Keith Addison]

Eat The State!
Vol. 7, Issue #12
12 Feb. 03

A forum for anti-authoritarian political opinion, research and humor

-

Quotes of the Week:

"America has entered one of its periods of historical madness, but 
this is the worst I can remember: worse than McCarthyism, worse than 
the Bay of Pigs and in the long term potentially more disastrous than 
the Vietnam War."

--John le Carre

"I myself feel that our country, for whose Constitution I fought in a 
just war, might as well have been invaded by Martians and body 
snatchers."

--Kurt Vonnegut, quoted in In These Times, 2/17/03.

-

At Last, Evidence

Last Wednesday morning, decorated war hero and current Secretary of 
State Colin Powell--a man who has fought in or helped lead his 
military in a half dozen more wars than all the politicians he now 
works for, combined--went before the United Nations and global 
television viewers and delivered what the Bush Administration has 
withheld for half a year: the firm evidence that it says justifies 
war.

Or not. Powell's lack of rhetorical grandstanding was welcome, as was 
the specificity of his charges. That being said, they still fail to 
justify launching a war.

The first and most obvious problem is that it wouldn't be a launch. 
It'd be a dramatic and gruesome escalation, to be sure, one that even 
its lead architect has compared, publicly and approvingly, to 
Hiroshima. But three presidents have been waging continuous war 
against Iraq's government and its people for a dozen years--from the 
Gulf War to economic sanctions to the unilaterally imposed no-fly 
zones to regular bombings to covert efforts to overthrow or 
assassinate Iraq's leaders to the current, steadily increasing 
bombing runs and psychological pressure on the Iraqis. Powell's 
presentation was not a case for war; it was part of the war itself, 
and should be understood as such.

The problem all along with a level-headed assessment of the Bush 
Administration's myriad justifications for an overt invasion and 
"regime change"--justifications that have been frequently shifting, 
at times contradictory, and often demonstrably false--is that they 
have been in the service of a predetermined conclusion. Regardless of 
whether a decision to invade had been made, and when, there's never 
been a question that Bush and his circle of hawks have wanted war, 
the bigger the better, and that the question in their minds was less 
whether it was justified than how to sell it to allies and to the 
public.

The White House's arguments for war all along have been less 
conclusions based on evidence than evidence based on 
conclusions--less like the determination of a judge, and more like 
the lawyers arguing to the jury. Powell's presentation to the UN, 
with its more concrete evidence and its more sober demeanor, should 
be considered every bit as critically, and skeptically, as those of 
the more hyperbolic prosecutors preceding him.

And, to quote the late, wondrous Peggy Lee: is that all there is? 
Powell's evidence rests primarily on two assertions: that Iraq's 
government cooperates with Al-Qaeda, and that it has also sought to 
hide evidence from UN weapons inspectors.

Assume, fancifully, that every word were true. It was the words not 
present that stand out. There is still absolutely no evidence that 
the Iraqi government, now or at any foreseeable point in the future, 
poses a security threat even to its immediate neighbors--let alone to 
the United States, halfway around the world. There is no evidence 
that Iraq, a country whose military is a fifth of its size ten years 
ago, a country crippled militarily (and in many other ways) by the 
most rigorous sanctions in world history, a country whose every move 
is closely monitored, a country which knows that any aggressive 
twitch would be instantly suicidal, now even possesses the *capacity* 
to inflict harm on *any* other country--let alone is threatening to 
do so, and let alone that the United States is among those threatened.

As a subset of those absent allegations, there is no evidence that 
Iraq possesses even any components of any weapons of mass 
destruction, let alone fully intact and operational weapons, let 
alone the means to deliver them outside its borders, let alone 
halfway around the world.

Powell didn't even try to make such a case; he argued solely that 
Iraq has repeatedly withheld from inspectors information of 
undetermined significance.

Even if true, this does not, legally speaking, justify an invasion; 
it simply permits that decision, in a legal sense. Under the 
resolution the US pushed through the Security Council last fall, 
failure to fully comply gives the United Nations the legal authority 
to authorize the use of force. It does not prove that war is 
necessary, or even that it is the best choice. It certainly does not 
give the United States carte blanche to do

Re: [biofuel] biodiesel using ethanol

[Keith Addison]

>Hi,
>
>I have dropped the idea of using acid catalyst and I started 
>preparing biodiesel with ethanol and KOH.  But,  even now, I face 
>the same problem.  I just don't get two layers!  I get a uniform 
>mass of biodiesel which is orangish brown in color and its viscosity 
>is reduced to a considerable extent when compared to that of raw 
>oil.  I tried with different oil:ethanol ratios and the result is 
>the same!  And then, I tried water washing to separate the glycerol 
>and the result was even more disappointing!  The whole mass turned 
>into a thick, creamish white liquid!  I allowed it to settle 
>overnight and no change!
>
>I didn't come across any such problems when I used methanol and NaOH 
>with the same oil.  I clearly got two layers, one biodiesel and 
>another glycerol.  In fact, then, I did not even go for water 
>washing as I felt that it was a pretty good separation!
>
>Why is this process not working out with ethanol?  I'm also sure 
>about the quality of ethanol that I am using, as it is a laboratory 
>reagent. And, KOH was also completely soluble in ethanol unlike 
>NaOH. So, no problem with ethanol and KOH.  Finally, where is the 
>mistake lying? Can anybody help me?
>
>Kavitha.

Seems I've tried quite hard to tell you this before, and not only me, 
so let me spell it out for you right here:

Ethyl-esters biodiesel
http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_link.html#ethylester

Ethyl-esters biodiesel

Optimization of a Batch Type Ethyl Ester Process -- a recipe for 
biodiesel from ethanol (which you can make yourself), instead of 
methanol (which is toxic, fossil-fuel derived, and you can't make it 
yourself).
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_library/ethyl_esters.html

It's a tricky process, not as simple as making methyl esters. 
Biofuels mailing list member Ken Provost, who has much experience 
making ethyl esters, sent us the following tips&tricks sheet.

Ethanol-based Biodiesel

1. Get plenty of experience making biodiesel with methanol before you 
try it with ethanol. Get comfortable titrating your oil for FFAs 
(free fatty acids); you'll need to do that when you use ethanol.
http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make2.html#titrate

2. Try to find a source of KOH (potassium hydroxide) to use instead 
of lye with ethanol. Lye (NaOH, sodium hydroxide) will work, but it 
dissolves VERY slowly in ethanol. You'll need to use more of either 
one -- 7g per liter of clean oil with NaOH, 10g per liter of clean 
oil with KOH. More as required per your titration level.

3. Your ethanol will have to be EXTREMELY dry. 199-proof or higher. 
"Absolute" ethanol. Any more than one half of one percent water can 
kill the reaction. Denaturants like methanol, isopropyl alcohol, 
MIBK, etc., are fine. But no water. Ethanol that dry is difficult to 
find cheap, especially in the US. If you want to try to make it 
yourself, you'll need molecular sieve, quicklime, or something else 
to do a "chemical" drying. Distillation alone can't get the water 
under 5% -- still way too much. (See below -- Anhydrous ethanol)

4. If you're interested in ethanol for environmental reasons, be 
careful. Even if you find anhydrous ethanol, it may come from fossil 
fuel. The denatured alcohols used by painters, or in other industrial 
applications, may be anhydrous but still derived from petroleum. In 
fact, since fermentation uses water, it's cheaper to make 200-proof 
starting with petroleum. The only way to know is to call the original 
manufacturer of the formula. Ask if the ethanol is "synthetic" or 
"fermentation". One type of denatured anhydrous ethanol that is 
almost always fermented is "fuel-grade", which is 199-proof denatured 
with gasoline. It's what they add to gasoline to make gasohol.

5. Your oil will also have to be EXTREMELY dry. Heat the oil to 120 
deg C (248 deg F) and hold it there until you can turn off the flame 
and see the bubbling stop almost immediately. You might want to throw 
in some clumping cat litter (bentonite clay) and/or silica gel to 
scarf up any remaining water, let it settle half a day, and take the 
oil off the top. Sometimes that's still not dry enough. Remember -- 
any more than 0.5% water can kill the reaction.

6. Your oil will have to be fairly low in FFAs. You'll want to do a 
titration on every batch to make sure. Anything over 2 ml titration 
(using 0.1% NaOH solution) can cause failure of the glycerine to 
separate -- under 1 ml is a good idea. Most waste oil is too high, 
and either needs to be refined with NaOH first, or cut with clean oil 
to neutralize FFAs.
http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make2.html#deacid

7. You need to use more ethanol to get full conversion. Somewhere 
between 275 and 300 ml per liter of oil is about right for most oils. 
Coconut oil will need more, maybe 350 ml. Theoretical is about 180 ml 
per liter, and the rest is excess to drive the reaction all the way.

8. Even when you do all the above, getting the glycerine to separate 
is a matt

[biofuel] question on acid suppliers,

[mikedee100 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>]

so i notice that to make a better batch of bio diesel with better 
results, and less ffa's, you need sulfuric acid, i have seen many 
recipies that include using sulfuric acid of 95% purity or higher, 
althogh i am not finding any info on where to get this, lol with out 
people thinking you are making bombs, so any help here on where to 
get it would be great thx guys



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[biofuel] biodiesel using ethanol

[kavitha palaniappan]

Hi,

I have dropped the idea of using acid catalyst and I started preparing 
biodiesel with ethanol and KOH.  But,  even now, I face the same problem.  I 
just don't get two layers!  I get a uniform mass of biodiesel which is orangish 
brown in color and its viscosity is reduced to a considerable extent when 
compared to that of raw oil.  I tried with different oil:ethanol ratios and the 
result is the same!  And then, I tried water washing to separate the glycerol 
and the result was even more disappointing!  The whole mass turned into a 
thick, creamish white liquid!  I allowed it to settle overnight and no change!

I didn't come across any such problems when I used methanol and NaOH with the 
same oil.  I clearly got two layers, one biodiesel and another glycerol.  In 
fact, then, I did not even go for water washing as I felt that it was a pretty 
good separation!

Why is this process not working out with ethanol?  I'm also sure about the 
quality of ethanol that I am using, as it is a laboratory reagent. And, KOH was 
also completely soluble in ethanol unlike NaOH. So, no problem with ethanol and 
KOH.  Finally, where is the mistake lying? Can anybody help me?

Kavitha. 






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Re: [biofuels-biz] cost of gasoline, ethanol mixture @ 76 stations

[Tricia Liu]

http://www.ethanolrfa.org/pr020722.html

http://www.ethanolrfa.org/pr020627.html



- Original Message -
From: "murdoch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Cc: ;
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 2:12 PM
Subject: [biofuels-biz] cost of gasoline, ethanol mixture @ 76 stations


> 1.  The cost of gasoline at some local stations in San Diego seems to be
pushing
> upward steadily.  I'd say in the low $1.80s per gallon around where I live
for
> 87 octane, and it can get over $2.00 per gallon for 91 octane.
>
> 2.  I've been making a point of buying down the street at the local 76
station.
> I believe now that 76 is part of "Conoco-Phillips" or some such.  They
have been
> very clear in their "NO MTBE" signs around here for what seems like about
a
> year.  Their signs on their pumps used a wording that said the gasoline
*might*
> contain ethanol, but it was never entirely clear.  I chose to hope that
they
> were including ethanol, because I think the other way to get around the
> Oxygenate rule (reformulated gas) might not be that common and I don't
know if
> it's legal.  I have written them to attempt to get a confirmation that
they
> *are* using a 10% or so (or whatever the standard is, to satisfy the
oxygenate
> requirements) mixture, but have received no response.  A late-night worker
there
> did respond with confidence that they were, but I can't take that as the
final
> answer.
>
> Others may say, "Well, so what, we see ethanol elsewhere all the time."  I
think
> it's important.  There was a *hellacious* battle to get the oil companies
to
> switch away from MTBE in California, and to get them to consider using
ethanol.
> That battle seems to have gone silent for the last year.  Many seem to be
still
> using MTBE, according to some pumps I've seen.
>
> If 76 is doing something good (by the standards of ethanol proponents)
then we
> must give them credit and make it clear that we appreciate the lack of
runaround
> on the issue.  Too often we wait for bad news or resistance to bring
attention
> to a business.
>
> The station I go to charges always within a penny or two of the Shell
Station
> nearby.  So, if 76 is using ethanol and incurring the doomsday extra costs
that
> the Refiners claimed would be incurred if they were forced to use ethanol,
then
> it's not showing at the pump, one bit.  I haven't heard a peep of
complaint from
> 76 about this, and have seen the very large NO MTBE signs at many (all?)
of
> their stations.  Prior to being able to buy this gasoline down the street,
which
> I am assuming has ethanol in it, I had *never* been able to find a single
pump
> in my area that had any ethanol mixed in.  So, while others may take such
> availability for-granted, I think this 76 program is awesome, pending
> verification that in fact they're using ethanol.  I'm still wary on that
point.
>
> If and when further political decisions and events come to a head, I
expect the
> Oil companies to drag out further anti-ethanol arguments, and it would be
nice,
> at that time, to be able to report that at least one of them has not only
been
> implementing a 10% or so mixture of ethanol in some areas, but is doing so
with
> no customer dissatisfaction as to quality or price, and is still able to
do
> excellent profitable gasoline-selling business, so that many of the
arguments
> are just nonsense.  If 76 is really doing this, then I salute them.
>
> Biofuels at Journey to Forever
> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
> Biofuel at WebConX
> http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm
> List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech:
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>
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>
>




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Re: [biofuel] Re: banning the oil field & illiteracy

[Kim & Garth Travis]

Gordon Dempsey wrote:

>
>I felt that this was important to help others help themselves.  As
> industry changes, I hope that there will be a sense of responsibility in the
> industry to educate in some manner, the hard working laborers who are just
> as important in getting the job done as the engineers.
>

Literacy Volunteers of America could sure use you. [Or whatever literacy 
program is in your area] I train for the Brazos Valley and run a small 
literacy program in my own town.  Even with one-on-one tutoring, it 
takes years to bring someone up to full literacy, but it is worth the 
work!!!

   The problem with oil field service is that the guys work so many 
hours, 60 to 80 a week is standard.  How do they find time to study? 
This is the problem we find with many working illiterates, the jobs they 
get pay so poorly that they have to work tons of overtime to support a 
family.  This leaves no time to learn new skills to get a better job.

I wish I had the solution.

Bright Blessings,
Kim


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[biofuel] Mi area BDers

[JOSEPH . MARTELLE]

 >snip< Is there a
>co-op and individual producer in the Detroit, MI/Tri-county area
>willing to "show me the ropes". I would gladly be an active
>participant in a co-op. I think it would be safer to learn from a
>sucessful producer(s) rather than learn by trial and error on my own.
>It appears that one or more of the potential errors could be quite
>harmful.
 >Any assistance would be greatly appreciated.

>Thanks,

>Kevin Flynn

Kevin,
 Yes there are several of us in the area. I'm in Sterling Hts. I'll drop
you a line at your MSN address and we'll talk. Blessings, Joe. :-)








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Re: [biofuels-biz] Q: price for glycerine in EU?

[Martin Brook]

Cheers, what part of belgium r u in?
- Original Message -
From: "Winny De Schryver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 8:05 PM
Subject: RE: [biofuels-biz] Q: price for glycerine in EU?


> Martin
>
> I am in Belgium.
> details from folks in Suffolk didn't come from me, sorry
> Prices of glycerine follow tomorrow.
>
> Winny
>
> > -Oorspronkelijk bericht-
> > Van: Martin Brook [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Verzonden: dinsdag 11 februari 2003 9:24
> > Aan: biofuels-biz@yahoogroups.com
> > Onderwerp: Re: [biofuels-biz] Q: price for glycerine in EU?
> >
> >
> > Hi Winny, Martin Brook here , hope you are keeping well. Could you give
us
> > guide prices forlycerine in any or all of those categories
> > please?y the way
> > I never did ge the details of those folks in Sffolk could yo send
> > them aain
> > please?here abouts are you inIre/Eire?
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Winny De Schryver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: ; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 7:07 PM
> > Subject: RE: [biofuels-biz] Q: price for glycerine in EU?
> >
> >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > Depends on the purity of your product. Is it in the range of 65
> > , 80 , 90
> > or
> > > 95+ % pure ?
> > >
> > > Winny
> > >
> > >
> > > > -Oorspronkelijk bericht-
> > > > Van: pauliusstanciauskas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > > Verzonden: maandag 10 februari 2003 15:08
> > > > Aan: biofuels-biz@yahoogroups.com
> > > > Onderwerp: [biofuels-biz] Q: price for glycerine in EU?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Hello,
> > > > I need information about glycerine price for 1t in EU. I would be
> > > > thankfull for your information.
> > > > Paulius
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Biofuels at Journey to Forever
> > > > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
> > > > Biofuel at WebConX
> > > > http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm
> > > > List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech:
> > > > http://archive.nnytech.net/
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> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Biofuels at Journey to Forever
> > > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
> > > Biofuel at WebConX
> > > http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm
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> > >
> >
> >
> >
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