Re: [Biofuel] soap or mono- and diglycerides
On Mon, Sep 11, 2006 at 07:14:40AM +0200, Tonom?r Andr?s wrote: Hi Rafal, Do not overcomplicate yourself. 1. Make sure that your oil is dry. 2. Make sure that your methanol dry, and lye fresh 3. Reaction parameters - time, temperature, agitation are OK. 4. Settlig time 24 Hours + 5 Wash test from the upper layer of reaction wessel. - If failed try +1gr lye. For example 5.5gr / liter wash test faild, try 6.5 then 7.5 ... (if more then 10gr, then something else is really bad) DO more test batches at a time with 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 gr lye and see wash test. I guess I need to do that ie. process small samples with increasing amount of lye. Or do the poor man's titration. Or both... A washtest is only passed when separating within minutes no matter how long and hard you shake it. It did - much quicker than my previous tests - but there's still about 1 centimeter (in 0.5 litre PET bottle) of white foam layer between water and biodiesel. and the best advice, read JTF website :))) I have, and I'm still reading it back again after each test I make :) If you are unconfy with titration try base - base 2 stage. (not for testbatch) But You HAVE TO LEARN TITRATION. Titration is not a problem. My last two batches had increased lye amount after I titrated the oil. I surely still need a bit of practice and feel of it, but I've titrated about ten samples so far, and I'm not scared of it. Let me know how it goes, I can assure you I will let everybody know once I succeed :) I'm just surprised that it looks I need much more lye. I didn't expect, when titrating with phenolophtalein, the colour should be so intensive. For me it was clear enough last time (1.35g KOH more / 1l). Thanks for word of advice. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] soap or mono- and diglicerides
On Mon, Sep 11, 2006 at 10:11:35AM -0400, Joe Street wrote: Try vacuum dewatering the feedstock before processing and be good and sure about having anhydrous chemicals and you won't have soap. If you are then still getting emulsions, your process is not going far enough. Yes, it looks like. Processing time is 2h, temperature in range of 60-64 degC, agitation using medium-size aquarium water pump - I think it's enough for 5l test container. Maybe I should redesign the container's inlet and outlet (both in the same lid - two plastic pipes of different length). -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] soap or mono- and diglycerides
On Sat, Sep 09, 2006 at 05:05:59PM -0700, Ken Provost wrote: On Sep 9, 2006, at 4:31 PM, Rafal Szczesniak wrote: I'm talking about the result I get from the washing test. I know the soap formation is only possible in presence of water dissolving the lye. That's probably why aggresive mixing in the test could produce the soap in my case. Except by the time you're washing, the NaOH will be so dilute it shouldn't produce any additional soap. I think all your glycerides and all your soap will be present already -- if you want to know the relative proportions, an FFA assay or gas chromatogram are possible ways. One of the reasons I raised this question is that I'd like to know for sure, after my product fails the wash test, whether I should increase the amount of lye or decrease it. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] soap or mono- and diglicerides
Hi all, Could you tell me how can I tell the difference between emulsion caused by unfinished process (glicerides left in the product) and caused by soap formation (too much lye) ? I have a feeling I misinterpret the result I get from the wash test... -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] soap or mono- and diglycerides
On Sat, Sep 09, 2006 at 02:18:17PM -0700, Ken Provost wrote: On Sep 9, 2006, at 11:12 AM, Rafal Szczesniak wrote: Hi all, Could you tell me how can I tell the difference between emulsion caused by unfinished process (glycerides left in the product) and caused by soap formation (too much lye) ? I suppose you could use gentle acidification followed by assaying the resulting FFA (soap will produce FFA, mono- and diglycerides won't). Sounds complicated. In general, soap formation is a result of too much water in the reaction, not too much lye. The concentra- tions of NaOH you're working with (even when somewhat excess- ive) are not high enough to saponify the oil itself -- in the absence of water, only the FFA originally present will form soap. Yes, I know that. I'm talking about the result I get from the washing test. I know the soap formation is only possible in presence of water dissolving the lye. That's probably why aggresive mixing in the test could produce the soap in my case. I'm trying to find out whether emulsion I get comes from soap or unfinshed reaction. The product seems to have pH 7 (tested with the litmus paper). -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] titrating a virgin oil (cont.)
Hi all, For those who are interested. Just to let you know - I did another test with lye amount increased by the titration result, but it failed - emulsion (a bit less, but still). There're two possible reasons for that. One is that I had an accidental spill of methoxide when adding it to the oil Not much, but who knows what's enough... Another is that I should probably try to titrate with more intensive colour of phenolophtalein solution to say that's it. I'm going to do one more try with more lye. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] tirating a virgin oil
On Mon, Aug 21, 2006 at 10:08:58AM -0400, Thomas Kelly wrote: Rafal, 1 - 2L test batches w. virgin oil . Good 99% pure KOH V. Good (If you are concerned about the purity and have NaOH of known purity you can test the KOH) I know that. However, KOH that I've bought doesn't look perfectly fresh ie. it is not completely translucent, as my NaOH was a couple of months ago. Now, I have both of them slightly calcinated which shows up as a trace of dust (really, just a little bit) on the bottom of a bottle I use to mix the methoxide solution. Temp and agitation also sound good. If there is water in the methanol you will make more soap (emulsion) and there will be less methanol --- incomplete reaction (emulsion). No, the methanol is also very pure - the same supplier. I started with pure and a bit expensive chemicals, to gain more experience and avoid troubles that might be caused by urity. As I understand it, you have done test batches w virgin oil and have gotten unsatisfactory results emulsions upon washing. You are concerned about incomplete reactions. That's right. Question #1: Are you careful to exclude the glycerine byproduct from the wash? Last time I settled the mixture of ester and glycerine byproduct for 24 hours and got nice separation. I carefully removed glycerine from the bottom (similar construction to the test processor on JtF pages) _and_ I settled the ester with just a bit of byproduct on the bottom (difficult to remove completely) for the next 12 hours. Then I syphoned off a 200 ml sample for test using elastic pipe, from the middle of the container. Nice, clean and pale yellow product. My only concern is that it's not transparent, but rather cloudy - likely due to incomplete reaction. Question #2: The oil titrated at 0.925 ml of .99KOH.. This is significant. Have you run a batch with an additional .9 - 1.0 g KOH/L you got from titration? Not yet - that's why I'm asking for your opinion. After the mails I've received I'm going to try it. I tried it once, with NaOH, but I didn't add such a small amount (divided by 1.4), but rather 20% more. I was afraid of the lye calcination, so I tried to add more, according to what I read. That was probably too much - no luck and washing problems. 3.5g 100%NaOH/L of oil = 4.9 g 100%KOH/L of oil Of course, I realise that. Add 0.9 - 1.0 g of the KOH (from titration) you would be using 5.8 - 5.9 g of KOH/L of oil. This additional .9 -1.0 g represents an increase of 18 - 20% over the amount used for virgin oil w/o FFAs. When you consider that your KOH may be less than 99% pure, the amount needed would be even higher. This could very well be the cause of the incomplete reaction. Treat the virgin oil as if it was WVO. Include your titration results in the amount of KOH to be added and run a batch exactly as you have before. Let us know how it worked out and we'll proceed from there. Surely I will. Of course you could go out and buy some high quality veg oil that titrates zero, but then we would not get the answer to the puzzle. Exactly. Besides, led by curiousity, I tried to titrate a better oil I had. It was also pure rapeseed oil, just the quality was better. Titration result was .750ml or so. I wonder, what would be the result when a really fine quality oil was tested (sunflower perhaps)... -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] tirating a virgin oil
On Mon, Aug 21, 2006 at 09:57:30AM +0200, Tonom?r Andr?s wrote: Hi Rafal, If it is virgin oil from the supermarket, you should not worry about water. Yes, that's exactly what it is. Cheap brand made for a supermarket by a known oil producer (n-th pressing of residues after they make their own good oil, probably...). I had the same problem in my early batches, and I think it is the lye. do some additional test batches with more and more lye. This eay you have an idea and a feel for the process. ok, I will. According to titration results. What you should look for is a perfect wash test. Increase the lye in the batch until you can shake the hell out of it in the wash test and still get perfect separation within minutes. This is what I would be doing. Thanks for your suggestion. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] tirating a virgin oil
Hi, Recently I've came through problems with testing a cheap virgin oil in my test processor which every time ended up with incomplete reactions (emulsion problems). I did make the process longer (2 hours) and at higher temperature (60-63 degC) - still nothing, though by product separation is very nice. Today, I tried to titrate the oil and - to my surprise - it took 0.925ml of KOH solution. This was my first experience with titration, so I can also tell that the phenolophtalein solution turned pale (but noticable) magenta for about 15 secs (as described at JtF) after 0.925ml. After adding 1.05ml the colour got more intensive for longer time. My main question is - is it normal in case of cheap oils ? I suppose they contain (as other oils) some amount of FFAs, but so much ? Additional matter is whether I got titration right. I mean, interpreting the colours. I'm running out of ideas what could be wrong in the process, so any help is appreciated. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] tirating a virgin oil
On Sun, Aug 20, 2006 at 06:29:51PM -0400, Thomas Kelly wrote: Rafal, I assume you are doing 1L test batches? Correct me if I'm wrong. Yes. Actually these are 1 or 2l test batches. For agitation I use a small water pump originally designed for larger aquaria and also recently used in water cooling systems for PCs. Manufacturer says it's capacity is 700 liters per hour. Even considering higher viscosity of oil it should be enough for 5l testing container. Do you think it is ? I can provide some pictures if it helps (I've done a bit of documentation). Do you know the purity of the KOH you are using? Yes, it's 99% pure from chemical supplier, though I've noticed it's a little bit calcinated (some flakes are too white, in my opinion). I have also tried NaOH (same purity) before with the same result. I have heard of virgin oil containing some FFA. I have no experience with such oil. It's probably normal, as it sounds impossible to make fresh oil with absolutely no FFAs. The question is - what amount is 'normal' and what is definately not ? -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] safe temperature
On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 01:17:02PM +0900, Keith Addison wrote: Hi Rafal What is max temperature you would consider safe for the process ? I know methanol boils at 64.7 degC, but it starts evaporating before reaching this point. Does that mean the temperature higher than 55 degC kept for, say half a minute, causes that a big part of methanol goes away ? Goes where? If it's a closed processor (as it should be) the methanol vapours won't go very far, most or all of it will condense on the underside of the lid and drop back in again. Well, I've seen some traces of condensation on the walls (it's a test reactor), but it didn't seem to drop back. Have a look at what it says about it here: The 'Deepthort 100B' Batch Reactor http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_processor8.html Thanks, Keith. I've missed this description, though I've read nearly everything at JtF at least a couple of times. I think I'm going to try out adding methoxide in 2-3 phases. I have a feeling that in the end - the hardest part - there's not enough exess methanol. Last time I was careful about the temperature, about measuring the lye and methanol, but still the process doesn't reach completion. Biodiesel phase isn't clear (though the colour is quite right) nor does it separate quickly in the wash test. There's still something wrong... -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] safe temperature
What is max temperature you would consider safe for the process ? I know methanol boils at 64.7 degC, but it starts evaporating before reaching this point. Does that mean the temperature higher than 55 degC kept for, say half a minute, causes that a big part of methanol goes away ? -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] lye-contaminated batch
Hi all, I have a small batch that appars to contain too much lye as wash test shows quite a bit of soap under murky biodiesel (which after all doesn't wash and remain a chicken soup). Is there a good way to reprocess it ? I know I can process unfinished batch (too little lye) as it still contains mono- and diglicerides to be reacted. Theoretically, I could just add low concentrated methoxide or downright pure methanol, reprocess it once again, and lye still present in the batch should take part of a catalyst. Am I correct ? -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] degradation of methoxide solution in time
Hi, Is it possible for methoxide solution to degrade ? I've had 400ml of it in 5l container waiting in a cool and dark place (basement) for a couple of months. It seemed to have a bit of some sediment on the bottom, but recently when I tried to use it, I could clearly see it was quite a bit of white dust (a bit like a light sand). Also, the solution wasn't absolutely clear and translucent, and it lost about 50ml in volume. I thought the container was really hermetic... The solution I'm talking about took 400ml of methanol and 7g of NaOH. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] degradation of methoxide solution in time
On Sun, Jul 16, 2006 at 08:43:29AM -0500, bob allen wrote: the methoxide is reacting with CO2 in the the 4.6 L of air in container, making sodium bicarbonate and or sodium carbonate. That's what I thought. Although my original idea was that lye itself could have reacted with CO2 from air making it less pure NaOH. When dissolving in methanol, NaOH gets into the solution and residue is Na2CO3. The only question is whether or not, sodium bicarbonate affects the biodiesel reaction ? -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] A new website
On Wed, Oct 26, 2005 at 06:37:47PM -0700, Jeromie Reeves wrote: snip Indeed. You can already switch to safer and open replacements of web browser and mail reader as well as office suite (especially with just-released OpenOffice 2.0). Isn't it great ? There's a choice finally for average user. This choice exists on Windows to. That's exactly what I meant :) You can either use Windows or FreeBSD, or something else and still benefit from the same software. The core windows OS can be very stable (just needs configured correctly, not hard just takes more then a average Joe). I personally use OO 2.0, Firefox, and Thunderbird (as does my wife) over IE except in those very rare cases where a site is IE only. Avast is hands down the best Windows based AV there is and it is free (for home use) too. No need to. Just wait for unix desktop environments to become mature enough to be widely usable. Define mature enough? It can be said it's mature when you have consistent desktop environment that handles all subsystems for various components of operating system and hardware running it. So far each desktop (mainly KDE and Gnome) differ too much in basic areas to write a single piece of code that fits in both of them. Also, they have different approach to hardware interaction (scanners poorly supported, for instance), and they're way too slow on older boxes (not all machines are modern Intel P4). I think its more the add on software that needs to mature more then the OS and GUI environment. Agreed. One of the issues I find with OSS is there are to many options. Yes, it's great advance and obstacle at once. Since there is not this one app for all monolithic force in OSS, how do you get people to try something new, even if it would work very well for them? The Linux Live CD's help alot. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] A new website
On Thu, Oct 27, 2005 at 04:42:43PM +1000, Doug Foskey wrote: Rafal, congratulations on being part of the Samba team! Thank you very much :) I am constantly amazed how many Biodiesel list members are involved with Open Source software. I think it is mostly because biodiesel homebrewing and open source have (among many others) one thing in common - it attracts people with wide horizons, curious of something new and interesting. A comment to others on Linux: there is now a move by the major Linux developers to standardise the way that Linux is seen by programs, so the old issues of differing packages for different flavours of Linux will then be a thing of the past. The common Linux desktop is ever closer. Yes, many initiatives has been founded in the last 1-2 years focused on forging standards and base recommendations. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] A new website
On Wed, Oct 26, 2005 at 03:08:26PM -0600, Zeke Yewdall wrote: Unfortunately, there are too many specialized engineering software packages that I use every day that can only operate under windows (often they are even picky about the version of windows) for me to consider Linux. Yes, I'm in fortunate position of being a programmer and network engineer. As for now it is a great environment for people of this profession. I must agree though, engineers using CAD software (of various fields) still have a hard time when trying to switch to free unix-like systems. It just needs a bit more time, like many new things. If it was just web browsing, spreadsheets, word processing, and the like, I'd get rid of windows in a heartbeat. I've already dumped IE and outlook. Indeed. You can already switch to safer and open replacements of web browser and mail reader as well as office suite (especially with just-released OpenOffice 2.0). Isn't it great ? There's a choice finally for average user. I want Google or Mozilla to come out with an operating system. No need to. Just wait for unix desktop environments to become mature enough to be widely usable. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] A new website
On Mon, Oct 24, 2005 at 08:49:14AM -0600, Zeke Yewdall wrote: Huh? On 10/23/05, midori [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name=post[1].htm Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-ID: L87Md53d Looks like Midori's address has been forged over the net and used to send out some virus/bug/spyware/whatever. It happens all the time all over the network. Oh, those spammers... :( -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] A new website
On Wed, Oct 26, 2005 at 04:54:01PM +1000, Doug Foskey wrote: Good reason to go Linux. It doesn't really matter. If one of your addresses is publicly available (either on a website or mailing list archives) it will be abused this way sooner or later. I use Linux and FreeBSD all the time and it happened to me too (several times). Naturally, using Windows mail readers exposes you more due to impact the mail worms and viruses have on internet these days, but just using Linux is not an ultimate solution. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] methoxide solution
On Sat, Oct 15, 2005 at 07:00:21AM -0600, Brian Rodgers wrote: Brian, I will Google Magnetic mixer but an explanation from you would be great too. What is? Where to find? Standard lab equipment? Etc. It sounds pretty damn cool. It sounds like a great new toy, but believe me - you don't really need magnetic mixer to prepare methoxide solution :) If you want to play with it, that's a different matter, but it's quite enough to use ordinary thick plastic HDPE bottle carefully swirling it. It takes a bit of time, but hydroxide must be completely dissolved. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] methoxide solution
On Wed, Oct 12, 2005 at 03:57:15PM -0500, Juan B wrote: Hello, It happen to me too, I was wonderigh whether that was ok or not ? any tips !! I suspect the amount of methanol was the reason. I wanted to try out a newly purchased and so I took just 200ml with 3.5g of natrium hydroxide. As much as is needed to do the test on 1 litre of virgin oil. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] methoxide solution
Hi, I've recently bought new fresh methyl alcohol and lye. I have measured out exact amounts, mixed lye with methanol and - a bit of a surprise, the solution haven't actually got warm. No temperature, fumes, whatsoever. Is this normal, or could I have done something wrong ? The chemicals are most probably pure and good quality. Also, lye has been completely dissolved. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.iit.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Warning to List Members
On Sun, Aug 28, 2005 at 11:15:44AM -0700, Rumen Slavov wrote: Hi, Friends, It seems to me all of you are intelligent persons, so I wonder why you are using Microsoft bullsh...? One has really nothing to the other. At the moment, MS software is just easier to use on desktop PCs. It's going to change fairly soon (within next few years, likely), but not yet. As far as it is well known, there is not such animal - virus or worm or Trojan - for Linux! For some time now there are several distribution of Live CD`s, which work even in an empty hard like Knoppix and many others! My OS is Slackware Linux 10.1 and I never had any problems in the net. And it is free of charge. It's Free Software - you can do whatever you want with it. It doesn't mean it has to be free of charge. Just to be clear with exact meaning of term Free Software... The OppenOffice 1.1.4 office is well ahead of MS office - That's absolutely too optimistic statement. I also use Linux and BSD system, as I'm a software developer, but I wouldn't dare to claim that current OpenOffice is better than MS Office. True - it can open .doc files not matter what version of MS Word created them, yet still when it comes to _details_ ie. to read and render file _exactly_ how it was saved, OpenOffice reveals its lacks. Version 2 of this office suite brings significant progress, but it's still unstable. I use OpenOffice to read various MS Office files that come via email, but I prefer to work on native OpenOffice file formats instead of using it as a free replacement for MS Office. It just doesn't work well this way. it opens files no matter which application is involved in the creation ( for example MS office XP can not open document written with MS office 97). Everything can be downloaded free from the net and the distributions are equipped with more than 2000 applications! ... which are often difficult to setup and/or use. Remember, not every user really feels like to explore what to do, to make it actually work like I want it to. It's educative and very interesting - just like biofuel brewing :) - but sometimes people just want to use it... nothing more. All you need is to compile idconfig (the network connection) and you are free of problems. Me, personally, I do not have antivirus - I don`t need it. So do I. But I'm more careful when advocating such a system :-) -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.ists.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] methanol and airmodel engine fuel
On Thu, Jul 21, 2005 at 05:23:11PM -0500, James G. Branaum wrote: I buy my methanol in bulk at the local representative of the refinery. I strongly suspect is probably not available in your area. I also don't think you want to use it unless you make it yourself. What do you mean by making it myself ? Making what ? Sorry, I'm not sure I understood clearly. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.ists.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] methanol and airmodel engine fuel
Hi, As I've found it nearly impossible buy small (1-2 litres) amounts of pure methanol here, in Poland, I've taken closer look at model fuels. They mostly contain methanol (40-85%), castor oil, EDL synthetic oil and additions. Now, castor oil might be even good. EDL definately not - luckily not all fuels do have it. Does anyone know what's in those additions ? I'm not talking about nitromethan here - that one I know about. This leads to a more specific question - how those fuels (after a bit of processing, naturally) can be useful as a source of methanol ? -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.ists.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] methanol and airmodel engine fuel
On Thu, Jul 21, 2005 at 11:39:30AM -0500, James G. Branaum wrote: I have been mixing my own model airplane engine fuel for the last 12 years or so. I normally use 70% methanol, 10% nitro methane (as an igniter) and 20% oil of various make ups. I eschew castor because it gums things up unless it is hot and can render an expensive 4-stroke engine useless due to sticky carbon build up. Where do you dig up your methanol from ? :) I don't have such an experience with model engines but I know that mixture of 80% methanol and 20% castor (no nitromethane) is still the official FAI fuel for contests. Typically the additions to the synthetic oils are things to retard corrosion and improve the burn of the oil itself during combustion as in model engines it is the source of lubrication and adds nothing to the energy developed. Most of the makers of that specific product protect their intellectual property rights viciously as there are different compounds that have different properties under different conditions. That's probably why you can't really find any information about kind of additions at least (not proportions which are significant). -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.ists.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] methanol and airmodel engine fuel
On Thu, Jul 21, 2005 at 06:30:57PM +0200, Bruno M. wrote: Hi Rafal, Maybe this model-fuel is meant for 2takt engines, and thats whats the mixed-in oil is for? Yes, it is typical 2-stroke engine fuel. If it's only oil, you mite be able ( if you've got equipment) to distill the methanol out of it; That's what I also thought, but it would probably require double distillation to obtain methanol of enough purity. but is this stuff water free? as far as I know, it is And I'm afraid that modelairplain-fuel is way to expensive compared to technical water-free methanol. No? Surprise. Seems like technical methanol is triple as much as the fuel. Maybe search a little further for a supplier of chemicals? I have. _Only_ one found supplies a non-company with chemicals (methanol among other stuff). It is however rather an expensive source, though I was happy to find tonight at all. Others say they don't sell methanol in small amounts to a private person due to its poisonness (apparently it's been forbidden to sell it like this... hard to believe). Or ask a producer of automotive fluids ( oils and carwindow antifreez / cleaner ) those winshield antifreez and cleaners (still) contains mostly methanol. [...] [ in most countries of the EU this must now be IPA or Ethanol instead of Methanol, That's the problem. I haven't seen any of those specifics based on methanol. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.ists.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] adding carbon vs. carbon dioxide to the atmosphere
Hi all, One thing that's not entirely clear to me is argument of biofuel not increasing amount of carbon in environment whereas fossil fuels do so. So far I thought the whole problem of global warming was mostly due to rasing amount of carbon dioxide and substances of similar properties, not the carbon itself. Combustion of biofuel certainly leaves amount of circulating carbon at constant level. Doing same with fossil fuel like oil derivatives does not, but (theoretically) in the same time we have to assume that carbon fuel deposits do not take share in carbon in the environment. That's likely to be a common assumption and fairly sensible. The question remains whether preventing the warming is more about limiting amount of carbon introduced from under the ground (which in turn often ends up as carbon dioxide) or rather limiting emission of carbon dioxide itself ? The former is more general approach, and the latter is more concentrating at one problem at a time. It's a bit tricky issue, but it's interesting for clarity in this matter. -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.ists.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] adding carbon vs. carbon dioxide to the atmosphere
On Fri, Jul 15, 2005 at 10:06:05AM -0400, Appal Energy wrote: One thing that's not entirely clear to me is argument of biofuel not increasing amount of carbon in environment whereas fossil fuels do so. Nothing tricky about the issue at all Rafal. Carbon dioxide of plant origin returns to the plants with each growing cycle. This is called carbon neutral. Carbon dioxide of fossil fuel origin is not recycled annually, as it takes millions of years for coal, natural gas and petroleum to regenerate. Therefore it's considered to be carbon positive . That's why I mentioned about assumption of fossil carbon included or not in circulating carbon share. There are arguments that plant-based fuels aren't entirely carbon neutral due to the fossil fuels that go into their production at different steps in the process. However, they remain considerably more carbon negative than fossil fuels. True, agreed. Your trickiness as you call it is really more of a blind rather than anything perplexing, revolving around gross carbon dioxide outputs. Yes, essentially the same amount of carbon dioxide is produced annually, no matter if the sources are plant-based or of fossil origin. However, global CO2 levels essentially plateau after one year's use of plant-based fuels, while they continue to rise under a regimen of fossil fuel use. I meant trickiness rather as the kind of question raised in some talks and debates I've heard. It was the argument as to why plant-based fuels are not so good for warming environment because of emission they introduce anyway. It was a bit like playing with facts to avoid those less comfortable for the speaker. Thank you! -- cheers, Rafal Szczesniak **mir[at]diament.ists.pwr.wroc.pl Samba Team member mi***[at]samba.org +-+ *BSD, GNU/Linux and Samba http://www.samba.org +-+ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
