A reason Why Narrator will be better as a Screen Reader

[George Savory via Talk]

On 8/27/18, Nick Sarames via Talk  wrote:
> But sometimes it's true. So many key commands we associate with WE or
> Jaws (or an e-mail client for that matter) are actually Microsoft commands.
>
> On 8/27/2018 5:41 PM, geodom--- via Talk wrote:
>> Whatever company you call blames the other guy, rather than themselves
>> or their products.  Pam.
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk
>> Sent: Monday, August 27, 2018 10:46 AM
>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>> Cc: Tony C
>> Subject: Re: Considering VoiceOver
>>
>> Yep! They always blame it on anything except jaws. lmao.
>>
>> -Original Message- From: geodom--- via Talk
>> Sent: Monday, August 27, 2018 9:09 AM
>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>> Cc: geo...@optonline.net
>> Subject: Re: Considering VoiceOver
>>
>> Oh yeah!  So Microsoft can ping pong it back to them!  Right!  Pam.
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk
>> Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2018 7:15 PM
>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>> Cc: Tony C
>> Subject: Re: Considering VoiceOver
>>
>> Jaws still isn't that great. lol. If I set jaws to load at the log on
>> screen, and the PC goes to sleep, when I wake it up jaws will not speak.
>> I
>> have to hope and cross my fingers and try logging in. then I can start
>> window eyes because jaws still will not run. Once I start WE then I can
>> turn
>> it off and start jaws and it speaks. I left jaws back in 2004 because it
>> didn't work well with a site builder I ws using and WE worked just fine.
>> I
>> have never had a productive encounter with FS tech support. 95 percent of
>> the time they tell you to contact Microsoft. LIKE, WHAT?
>>
>> -Original Message- From: geodom--- via Talk
>> Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2018 2:34 PM
>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>> Cc: geo...@optonline.net
>> Subject: Re: Considering VoiceOver
>>
>> But I could do more with window eyes with the computer right out of the
>> box.
>> Pam.
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Dennis Long via Talk
>> Sent: Friday, August 24, 2018 11:31 PM
>> To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
>> Cc: Dennis Long
>> Subject: RE: Considering VoiceOver
>>
>> Jaws is a very good screen reader.  People need to give it time.  You
>> didn't
>> learn WindowEyes over night and you won't learn Jaws over night either.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Talk
>> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
>> On Behalf Of CJ MAY via Talk
>> Sent: Friday, August 24, 2018 4:12 AM
>> To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
>> Cc: CJ MAY
>> Subject: RE: Considering VoiceOver
>>
>> I did consider going down this route but I am basically lazy and it would
>> mean learning a new operating system. I am so familiar with the Microsoft
>> operating system and Windows that in the end I bit the bullet and went
>> over
>> to Jaws.
>> Do I still miss Window-eyes? Yes, but migrating to Jaws hasn't been as
>> challenging as I feared and it helped being so familiar with the Windows
>> operating system.
>>
>> Alison
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Talk  On
>> Behalf Of George Savory via Talk
>> Sent: 23 August 2018 18:57
>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
>> Cc: George Savory 
>> Subject: Considering VoiceOver
>>
>> Listers,
>> Been using Win-Eyes  since Win-Eyes 3X. As Win-Eyes will not be updated,
>> I
>> am strongly considering going to VoiceOver on Apple. Using VoiceOver on
>> my
>> iPhone with Safari works perfectly. I don't know if Jaws will ever work
>> well
>> with websites that use calenders; besides, I won't have to be upgrading a
>> screen reader  everytime there is an upgrade
>> ___
>> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the
>> author
>> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>
>> For membership options, visit
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/chrisalismay%4
>>
>>
>> 0gmail.com.
>> For subscription options, visit
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
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>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>>
>> ___
>> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the
>> author
>> and do not

Re: Considering Voice over

[George Savory via Talk]

Jaws is indeed a good screen reader, but websites like megabus.com
require you to select the month and day you will be travelling. That's
where VoiceOver shines. It is frustrating with Jaws to select the
month and day of travel.  I recently had to interact with the U.S.
postal website. Again it was a challenge with Jaws and those drop down
menus.  had to revert to Win-Eyes, but VoiceOver gets the job done.
It is the reason I am leaning towards a Mac. I guess an iPad could get
things done too.

On 8/25/18, Manny Gee via Talk  wrote:
> Aloha to all,
>
> I too am in the same boat.
>
> I am inclined, to agree with Denis, to give Jaws a try, since going over
> to Mac is having to learn 2 system, is the operating system and the
> voice-over.
>
> I find that the iPad is easier to learn than the Mac.
>
> I have a jaws question.
>
> Does Jaws have a configuration setting that mimics Window Eyes.
>
> Also, how do you stop Jaws from announcing the alt key, the tab key etc.
>
> Good luck to all,
>
> Manny
>
>
>
> ___
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Re: ChromeBook Accessibility

[George Savory via Talk]

Hi Rod,
I agree with you. I am very comfortable using VoiceOver on my iPhone.
The support is robust just as on Windows.
Using Jaws or Win-Eyes on travel websites, you must select the month
and day of travel. This process was easy using VoiceOver on my iPhone.
It was frustrating with Jaws or Win-Eyes on my desktop.  I am sure
support would have been there if Win-Eyes was still around.
Thanks, I will look into the mini Mac.

On 8/24/18, Rod Hutton via Talk  wrote:
> Hi George,
>
> I can't speak to ChromeOS, but, getting back to the matter of Macs, I'm not
> sure what you mean by websites that use calendars.
> As for keeping track of personal calendar events and reminders, I find my
> iPhone a breeze with Siri, such that I don't have to use anything else but
> my voice, since I have learn how Siri thinks and how to edit everything even
> when I make mistakes.
> Of course, I always have the option of editing the calendar and reminders
> manually with the touch screen, but this is not very often, now that my
> scheduling system is all set up.
> As for a Mac computer and the screen reader, at $449 US, you really can't go
> wrong picking up a Mac Mini, although many complain about it being an
> out-of-date machine.
> I see now that I went a bit overboard in buying a Macbook Pro, since, for
> me, a Mac Mini would have done the job just fine.
> The Mac Mini is simply an aluminum tower which lies flat in the footprint of
> a regular size apple pie, and then all you need is a keyboard and a monitor
> whose role could be filled nowadays by most flat-screen TVs and an HDMI
> cable.
> They come standard with a 500 GB spinning hard drive, and VoiceOver works
> fine with this setup.
> Admittedly, navigating the macOS and editing documents is quite a different
> experience, insofar as each control you want to use is not immediately in
> focus as we are accustomed to in Windows, requiring a repetitive process of
> interacting and un-interacting with each control.
> Personally, I have chosen to push myself to get comfortable with macOS,
> seeing the benefits of being in the Apple ecosystem even with my PC.
> It all comes down to what you want for yourself, and what you believe about
> the manufacturers you want to associate with, and, in this light, I don't
> think there are any right or wrong answers.
> My wife jokes with me that I always seem happier when I use my Mac than when
> I use my comfortable Windows 10 machine.
> As I've mentioned before, I always wanted to use a Mac, and so I suppose I'm
> still in the grips of my honeymoon with it.
> Interesting, though, I still count on having my Windows PC around, and so
> maybe I'll always have one.
> I will say that Window-Eyes going out of support was the trigger event which
> caused me to buy my Macbook Pro, as I sought to diversify my accessibility
> toolbox, and even to expand out of the Windows world, just incase I needed
> to access websites which Windows screen readers might have trouble with.
> Safari on the Mac has proven to be very robust in my web work, even though I
> had some challenges up to quite recently.
> However, I've learned the little tricks and the special hotkeys necessary to
> access all of the different parts of web pages, and so now my browsing
> competence on the Mac is on par with that on Windows with Firefox, whether I
> use Window-Eyes or NVDA or Narrator.
> Anyway, I'll leave off for now, and wish all of us well as we navigate this
> very technical world in which we find ourselves. Smile
>
> All the best,
>
> Rod
>
> Sent from Outlook for Windows
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk  On
> Behalf Of George Savory via Talk
> Sent: August 23, 2018 7:45 PM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
> Cc: George Savory 
> Subject: ChromeBook Accessibility
>
> How good is a ChromeBook with web accessibility?
>
> On 8/23/18, George Savory  wrote:
>> Listers,
>> Been using Win-Eyes  since Win-Eyes 3X. As Win-Eyes will not be
>> updated, I am strongly considering going to VoiceOver on Apple. Using
>> VoiceOver on my iPhone with Safari works perfectly. I don't know if
>> Jaws will ever work well with websites that use calenders; besides, I
>> won't have to be upgrading a screen reader  everytime there is an
>> upgrade
>>
> ___
> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author
> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>
> For membership options, visit
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Re: Considering VoiceOver

[George Savory via Talk]

Hi Steve,
You have a point, for those tasks of editing a spread sheet or a
PowerPoint presentation I would still have to work with Windows. I
still love the support of Win-Eyes on spread sheets.

On 8/24/18, Steve Nutt via Talk  wrote:
> That doesn't make the whole screen reader as good as Window-Eyes, it just
> means you can successfully browse the web.
>
> Now try to create a Powerpoint presentation, or edit a spreadsheet.
>
> All the best
>
> Steve
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk  On
> Behalf Of George Savory via Talk
> Sent: 24 August 2018 17:02
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
> Cc: George Savory ; Amanda Lee
> 
> Subject: Re: Considering VoiceOver
>
> My experience with VoiceOver on the iPhone is just as good as with
> Win-Eyes.
> I am able to switch from one App to another. I am able to use all the
> navigation aids on a web page such as headings, lists, radio buttons. I am
> able to navigate in a web page or a text document by character, word or by
> lines. I am able to select text and copy it to the clipBoard just as in
> Windows. I am not using a keyboard on my iPhone, just the settings using
> the
> rotor.
>
> On 8/24/18, Amanda Lee via Talk  wrote:
>> I agree with Steve.  I have an IPhone 8 which I use for a number of
>> reasons.
>> I use it with gestures and with a Bluetooth keyboard.  If I had to
>> rely only upon an IPhone for all of my information needs, I would
>> consider myself as being rather unproductive as every bit of access is
>> considerably less productive.  Yes you can navigate to the Apps rather
>> quickly but if you need to switch from one App that you are working in
>> to others or if you want to be able to listen to more than one App, it
>> doesn't always provide the same interaction as Windows does.  Using a
>> keyboard is awkward as unless you are interacting in a text input
>> area, the need to hold down multiple keys to navigate one field at a
>> time is awkward at best!
>>
>> As Steve says, the Screen Reader functionality in VoiceOver just does
>> not compare to that of Window-Eyes and JAWS or NVDA.
>>
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Talk
>>  On
>> Behalf Of Steve Nutt via Talk
>> Sent: Friday, August 24, 2018 4:15 AM
>> To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' 
>> Cc: Steve Nutt 
>> Subject: RE: Considering VoiceOver
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I tell you what, VoiceOver is like Narrator as compared with
>> Window-Eyes and JAWS.  It is not very configurable, unless you know
>> Apple scripting.
>>
>> I'd say it's nowhere near as mature as JAWS or Window-Eyes was.
>>
>> All the best
>>
>> Steve
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Talk 
>> On Behalf Of CJ MAY via Talk
>> Sent: 24 August 2018 09:12
>> To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' 
>> Cc: CJ MAY 
>> Subject: RE: Considering VoiceOver
>>
>> I did consider going down this route but I am basically lazy and it
>> would mean learning a new operating system. I am so familiar with the
>> Microsoft operating system and Windows that in the end I bit the
>> bullet and went over to Jaws.
>> Do I still miss Window-eyes? Yes, but migrating to Jaws hasn't been as
>> challenging as I feared and it helped being so familiar with the
>> Windows operating system.
>>
>> Alison
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Talk 
>> On Behalf Of George Savory via Talk
>> Sent: 23 August 2018 18:57
>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
>> Cc: George Savory 
>> Subject: Considering VoiceOver
>>
>> Listers,
>> Been using Win-Eyes  since Win-Eyes 3X. As Win-Eyes will not be
>> updated, I am strongly considering going to VoiceOver on Apple. Using
>> VoiceOver on my iPhone with Safari works perfectly. I don't know if
>> Jaws will ever work well with websites that use calenders; besides, I
>> won't have to be upgrading a screen reader  everytime there is an
>> upgrade ___
>> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the
>> author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>
>> For membership options, visit
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/chrisali
>> smay%4
>> 0gmail.com.
>> For subscription options, visit
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>> List archives can be found at
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>>
>> ___
>> Any

Re: Considering VoiceOver

[George Savory via Talk]

My experience with VoiceOver on the iPhone is just as good as with
Win-Eyes. I am able to switch from one App to another. I am able to
use all the navigation aids on a web page such as headings, lists,
radio buttons. I am able to navigate in a web page or a text document
by character, word or by lines. I am able to select text and copy it
to the clipBoard just as in Windows. I am not using a keyboard on my
iPhone, just the settings using the rotor.

On 8/24/18, Amanda Lee via Talk  wrote:
> I agree with Steve.  I have an IPhone 8 which I use for a number of
> reasons.
> I use it with gestures and with a Bluetooth keyboard.  If I had to rely
> only
> upon an IPhone for all of my information needs, I would consider myself as
> being rather unproductive as every bit of access is considerably less
> productive.  Yes you can navigate to the Apps rather quickly but if you
> need
> to switch from one App that you are working in to others or if you want to
> be able to listen to more than one App, it doesn't always provide the same
> interaction as Windows does.  Using a keyboard is awkward as unless you are
> interacting in a text input area, the need to hold down multiple keys to
> navigate one field at a time is awkward at best!
>
> As Steve says, the Screen Reader functionality in VoiceOver just does not
> compare to that of Window-Eyes and JAWS or NVDA.
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk
>  On
> Behalf
> Of Steve Nutt via Talk
> Sent: Friday, August 24, 2018 4:15 AM
> To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' 
> Cc: Steve Nutt 
> Subject: RE: Considering VoiceOver
>
> Hi,
>
> I tell you what, VoiceOver is like Narrator as compared with Window-Eyes
> and
> JAWS.  It is not very configurable, unless you know Apple scripting.
>
> I'd say it's nowhere near as mature as JAWS or Window-Eyes was.
>
> All the best
>
> Steve
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk  On
> Behalf Of CJ MAY via Talk
> Sent: 24 August 2018 09:12
> To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' 
> Cc: CJ MAY 
> Subject: RE: Considering VoiceOver
>
> I did consider going down this route but I am basically lazy and it would
> mean learning a new operating system. I am so familiar with the Microsoft
> operating system and Windows that in the end I bit the bullet and went over
> to Jaws.
> Do I still miss Window-eyes? Yes, but migrating to Jaws hasn't been as
> challenging as I feared and it helped being so familiar with the Windows
> operating system.
>
> Alison
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk  On
> Behalf Of George Savory via Talk
> Sent: 23 August 2018 18:57
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
> Cc: George Savory 
> Subject: Considering VoiceOver
>
> Listers,
> Been using Win-Eyes  since Win-Eyes 3X. As Win-Eyes will not be updated, I
> am strongly considering going to VoiceOver on Apple. Using VoiceOver on my
> iPhone with Safari works perfectly. I don't know if Jaws will ever work
> well
> with websites that use calenders; besides, I won't have to be upgrading a
> screen reader  everytime there is an upgrade
> ___
> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the
> author
> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>
> For membership options, visit
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/chrisalismay%4
> 0gmail.com.
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>
> ___
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> author
> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>
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>
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> ___
> Any views or op

ChromeBook Accessibility

[George Savory via Talk]

How good is a ChromeBook with web accessibility?

On 8/23/18, George Savory  wrote:
> Listers,
> Been using Win-Eyes  since Win-Eyes 3X. As Win-Eyes will not be
> updated, I am strongly considering going to VoiceOver on Apple. Using
> VoiceOver on my iPhone with Safari works perfectly. I don't know if
> Jaws will ever work well with websites that use calenders; besides, I
> won't have to be upgrading a screen reader  everytime there is an
> upgrade
>
___
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Re: Considering VoiceOver

[George Savory via Talk]

Hey Guys,
Thanks for your ideas. Will wait for the upgrade of Narrator. On
websites with calenders, only VoiceOver works for me to select the
day/month and year. Jaws or Win-Eyes are not cutting it.

On 8/23/18, net bat via Talk  wrote:
> try the free n v d a. and jaws is a lot easier to upgrade then the i phone.
> you will have the same problem if you are going to use the i phone.
> it has to be updated about twice per year
> you need a i tunes account and computer to upgrade it.
> and half the time i have to restore the phone because the upgrade failed.
> you will have virtually no access to any files saved on the phone like you
> have
> with windows.
> after about 3 years apple will not give any   more upgrades for the phone.
> the same with a apple mac.
> it gets to the point where you will get a pop up telling you you need to get
> a
> new computer when you try to upgrade safari. my neace hit this point last
> year
> on her 5 year old mac.
> etc. etc.
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: George Savory via Talk
> Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2018 10:57 AM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: George Savory
> Subject: Considering VoiceOver
>
> Listers,
> Been using Win-Eyes  since Win-Eyes 3X. As Win-Eyes will not be
> updated, I am strongly considering going to VoiceOver on Apple. Using
> VoiceOver on my iPhone with Safari works perfectly. I don't know if
> Jaws will ever work well with websites that use calenders; besides, I
> won't have to be upgrading a screen reader  everytime there is an
> upgrade
> ___
> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author
>
> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>
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Re: QUERY

[George Savory via Talk]

Please remember that system restore has many roll back points. I would
select a restore point just before I had accidentally uninstalled a
program. Just be careful not to roll your machine back too far, but
just where you made a mistake. Windows updates would automatically be
restored if any were affected by system restore.

On 7/14/17, anthony borg via Talk  wrote:
> HI CHRIS
>
> I CAN UNDERSTAND YOUR EXPLANATION AND HOW RESKI IT MIGHT BE,
>
>
>
> INFACT THAT'S WHAT I DID, I DOWNLOADED IT FROM THE INTERNET AND REINSTALLED
> IT.
>
>
>
> THE ONLY REASON  THAT I WANTED TO LEARN HOW TO DO SYSTEM RESTORE IS IF IN
> CASE I REPEAT THE SAME MISTAKE, BUT I HAVE TO BE VERY SURE HOW TO DO IT.
>
>
>
> THAT'S WHY I ASKED FOR A GOOD INSTRUCTIONS OF THE PROCEDURE.
>
> MANY THANKS FOR YOUR HELP,
>
>
>
> ALL THE BEST
>
> ___
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> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>
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Re: query

[George Savory via Talk]

Hi,
Use windows system restore found in control panel. It will restore
your PC the way it was before you accidentally removed the program

On 7/13/17, anthony borg via Talk  wrote:
> Hi folks
>
>
>
> I wonder if anyone can help me,
>
>
>
> By mistake I uninstalled a program from the list, so now I want to know how
> to restore it back to the program list again.
>
>
>
> Thanks in advance
>
>
>
> Anthony
>
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WinEyes 9.5.4

[George Savory via Talk]

Hi Doug,
 Was looking forward to upgrade of WinEyes 9.5.4 to 9.5.5. Unable to
access start menu since 9.5.4.  I am using Windows 10, 4GB ram quad
core Gateway. Have to kill and restart WinEyes to be able to access
the start menu Since 9.5.4. Down graded back to avoid this issue.
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Re: Amazon

[George Savory via Talk]

I never have problems accessing Amazon. I spent a little time learning
the layout of the website. It's Easy to use with the navigation keys

On 5/26/15, carl wake via Talk talk@lists.window-eyes.com wrote:
 Anybody having trouble accessing Amazon? Wh you sign in they want you to
 type the letters you see in the image. Is there a way around that?
 Amateur Radio Call Sign ac6rv
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Re: Seeking Your Input

[George Savory via Talk]

Would like support for Microsoft Access

On 5/28/15, Jeremy Curry via Talk talk@lists.window-eyes.com wrote:
 Hello Everyone,

 We are constantly working behind the scenes to improve our products.  If you
 could narrow down the top three requests you would have us add to our screen
 reading product, what would they be?

 Thanks for the input!

 Jeremy

 Jeremy Curry
 Director of Product Management
 Ai Squared, Inc.
 Phone: (802) 362-3612
 Email: jcu...@aisquared.commailto:jcu...@aisquared.com
 Web: www.aisquared.comhttp://www.aisquared.com/

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