Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Hi Nick: Like you, there was a time, not too long ago, when I was determined not to buy an IPhone or an IPad, in fact, I used to refer to all IDevices as "OICrap". A couple of years ago, however, I got an IPhone. I became convinced that that was the way to go, especially since I commute to work on the bus. Anyway, I read as much as I could about the device before I got it. There is a verry good resource called Applevis.com which has a lot of information on all Apple products. Anyway, my IPhone is still working well and I am still enjoying it. Kevin Huber On 3/17/17, Nick Sarames via Talk wrote: > Without veering too much off topic, is there some preliminary advice you > can give for trying to learn how to navagate a touch screen? Full > disclosure, I'm a button man. > > On 3/17/2017 9:34 AM, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote: >> I was one of lthose who thought I would never want a touch screen >> device. I started llistening to a podcast about the ipod touch. The >> more I listened, I said to myself, I want one. I was amazed with what >> Apple did with accessibility on a touch screen device. So in 2010, I >> bought a ipod touch 4th generation and Haven't looked back. I like the >> fact I can buy a off the shelf device and do everything I would do with >> a specialized player and a whole lot ;more. >> >> -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen >> Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:11 AM >> To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List >> Cc: Reeva Webb ; Dennis Long >> Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account >> >> I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal with >> touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an earlier note, >> the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and your i whatevers >> think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. >> I can't figure out how to run my IPod. >> 73 >> Butch >> WA0VJR >> Node 3148 >> Wallace, ks. >> >> >> On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Russ Kiehne >> via Talk wrote: >> >>> In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader >>> stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It >>> has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does >>> everything they do and a lot more. >>> >>> -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM >>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long >>> Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account >>> >>> You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had >>> in the >>> past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a >>> electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook >>> and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't >>> have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening >>> with >>> zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm >>> seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find >>> myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. >>> >>> >>> "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised >>> night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho >>> >>> Reeva >>> >>> On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>> I agree with you completely! >>> >>> -Original Message- >>> From: Talk >>> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] >>> On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM >>> To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List >>> Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account >>> >>> Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a >>> touch >>> screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that >>> worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone >>> 73 >>> Butch >>> WA0VJR >>> Node 3148 >>> Wallace, ks. >>> >>> >>> On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: >>> >>>> I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will >>>> become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more >>&
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
Hi. I totally agree with you. Not to menschen that voc rehab agencies always pushed JAWS over Window-Eyes due to them being sued by FS if they didn't approve of JAWS over any other product. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Singing Sparrow via Talk Sent: Sunday, March 19, 2017 9:50 PM To: Steve Nutt; Window-Eyes Discussion List; 'Reeva Webb' Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account I like windows but I am leaning more towards a mac because of the things that people have to go through for windows. I mean, come on; I mean with the way that window eyes and jaws are competing with each other even though that VFO has them both under their banner it is very sad that things have come to this parting of the markets i mean that since VFO has both jaws, window eyes, magic and zoomtext the markets aren't going to be very friendly in the long run; and as to a mac you don't have to worry about if your windows computer goes by the way side that you have to re-register your copy of windows 10 with a mac all Mac OS versions are free and that the built in screen reader "voiceover" is totally built into the OS. that makes a mac a very viable option and yes they are mor expensive then a window computer but they are built to last; also you can run windows on a mac as well, so you do have the best of both worlds. 3/19/2017 2:24 PM, Steve Nutt via Talk wrote: > Hi Reeva, > > I'm with you here. Even the Chromebook is really getting good now. If I > could find a good audio editing program for the Chromebook, I'm almost done > with PCs. > > All the best > > Steve > > -Original Message- > From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+steve=comproom.co...@lists.window-eyes.com] > On Behalf Of Reeva Webb via Talk > Sent: 16 March 2017 06:54 > To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long > > Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account > > You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the > past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a > electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and > soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to > spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt > fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously > considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using > my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. > > > "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised > night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho > > Reeva > > On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" > wrote: > > I agree with you completely! > > -Original Message- > From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] > On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk > Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM > To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List > Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account > > Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch > screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that > worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone > 73 > Butch > WA0VJR > Node 3148 > Wallace, ks. > > > On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: > >> I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will >> become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more >> things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market >> for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I >> phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet >> searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece >> of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of > time. >> -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk >> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM >> To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' >> Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account >> >> Greetings all. >> >> I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. >> We are promised CSUN updates in April. >> >> In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry >> going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the >> pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO >> leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible > information sources. >> Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its spo
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Some of these other Screen Readers are just not in the same level of Quality and Features as JAWS and Window Eyes. Unless the other Screen Reader Companies have something JAWS might want, they are probably Safe from a Hostile Take Over. -- Dave ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
There is another screen reader called System Access by Serotek. I wonder if they will be the next one to be aquired by VFO? -Original Message- From: Steve Nutt via Talk Sent: Sunday, March 19, 2017 12:36 PM To: 'Loy' ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Hi, I hope not. It's not a bad screen reader. Not as good as WE, but not bad. All the best steve -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+steve=comproom.co...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Loy via Talk Sent: 17 March 2017 14:57 To: Pamela Dominguez ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account The only other screen reader I know of is Dolphin and who knows it may be next on VFO's list of Acquisitions . - Original Message - From: Pamela Dominguez via Talk To: ukekearu...@valtdnet.com ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Sent: Friday, March 17, 2017 10:51 AM Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account I remember when this all went down, I referred to VFO as a monopoly, and was smartly chastized for it. I don't know why. To me, it seems like it has taken over everything. Isn't that a monopoly? Pam. -Original Message- From: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:34 PM To: 'Tony C' ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/geodom%40opton line.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. http://www.avg.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/loyrg2845%40gm ail.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/steve%40compro om.co.uk. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/russ94577%40gmail.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
I like windows but I am leaning more towards a mac because of the things that people have to go through for windows. I mean, come on; I mean with the way that window eyes and jaws are competing with each other even though that VFO has them both under their banner it is very sad that things have come to this parting of the markets i mean that since VFO has both jaws, window eyes, magic and zoomtext the markets aren't going to be very friendly in the long run; and as to a mac you don't have to worry about if your windows computer goes by the way side that you have to re-register your copy of windows 10 with a mac all Mac OS versions are free and that the built in screen reader "voiceover" is totally built into the OS. that makes a mac a very viable option and yes they are mor expensive then a window computer but they are built to last; also you can run windows on a mac as well, so you do have the best of both worlds. 3/19/2017 2:24 PM, Steve Nutt via Talk wrote: Hi Reeva, I'm with you here. Even the Chromebook is really getting good now. If I could find a good audio editing program for the Chromebook, I'm almost done with PCs. All the best Steve -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+steve=comproom.co...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Reeva Webb via Talk Sent: 16 March 2017 06:54 To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho Reeva On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" wrote: I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account Greetings all. I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. We are promised CSUN updates in April. In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that although often people exchange useful information, the leadership fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's behaviours. Vaughan. --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Socia
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
Hi, I hope not. It's not a bad screen reader. Not as good as WE, but not bad. All the best steve -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+steve=comproom.co...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Loy via Talk Sent: 17 March 2017 14:57 To: Pamela Dominguez ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account The only other screen reader I know of is Dolphin and who knows it may be next on VFO's list of Acquisitions . - Original Message - From: Pamela Dominguez via Talk To: ukekearu...@valtdnet.com ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Sent: Friday, March 17, 2017 10:51 AM Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account I remember when this all went down, I referred to VFO as a monopoly, and was smartly chastized for it. I don't know why. To me, it seems like it has taken over everything. Isn't that a monopoly? Pam. -Original Message- From: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:34 PM To: 'Tony C' ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/geodom%40opton line.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. http://www.avg.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/loyrg2845%40gm ail.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/steve%40compro om.co.uk. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
Hi Reeva, I'm with you here. Even the Chromebook is really getting good now. If I could find a good audio editing program for the Chromebook, I'm almost done with PCs. All the best Steve -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+steve=comproom.co...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Reeva Webb via Talk Sent: 16 March 2017 06:54 To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho Reeva On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" wrote: I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: > I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will > become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more > things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market > for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I > phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet > searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece > of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. > > -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk > Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM > To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' > Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account > > Greetings all. > > I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. > We are promised CSUN updates in April. > > In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry > going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the > pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO > leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. > > Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain > blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. > > One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that > although often people exchange useful information, the leadership > fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its > developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on > the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique > VFO's behaviours. > > Vaughan. > > > --- > This email and any attachments may contain information that is > confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the > intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or > duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have > received this email in error please notify the author immediately and > erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social > Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message > or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. > > --- > ___ > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the > author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. > > For membership options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/tch828%40media combb.net. > For subscription options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > List archives can be found at > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > ___ > Any views or opinions presented in this
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
Hi Nick, You may find the following podcast series helpful in this regard: https://blindabilities.com/bapresents/introducing-a-new-series-iphone-101/ Enjoy, Rod -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Nick Sarames via Talk Sent: Friday, March 17, 2017 1:46 PM To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Butch Bussen Cc: Reeva Webb Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Without veering too much off topic, is there some preliminary advice you can give for trying to learn how to navagate a touch screen? Full disclosure, I'm a button man. On 3/17/2017 9:34 AM, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote: > I was one of lthose who thought I would never want a touch screen > device. I started llistening to a podcast about the ipod touch. The > more I listened, I said to myself, I want one. I was amazed with what > Apple did with accessibility on a touch screen device. So in 2010, I > bought a ipod touch 4th generation and Haven't looked back. I like the > fact I can buy a off the shelf device and do everything I would do with > a specialized player and a whole lot ;more. > > -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen > Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:11 AM > To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List > Cc: Reeva Webb ; Dennis Long > Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account > > I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal with > touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an earlier note, > the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and your i whatevers > think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. > I can't figure out how to run my IPod. > 73 > Butch > WA0VJR > Node 3148 > Wallace, ks. > > > On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Russ Kiehne > via Talk wrote: > >> In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader >> stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It >> has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does >> everything they do and a lot more. >> >> -Original Message----- From: Reeva Webb via Talk >> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM >> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long >> Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account >> >> You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had >> in the >> past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a >> electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook >> and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't >> have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening >> with >> zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm >> seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find >> myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. >> >> >> "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised >> night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho >> >> Reeva >> >> On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" >> >> wrote: >> >> I agree with you completely! >> >> -Original Message- >> From: Talk >> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] >> On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk >> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM >> To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List >> Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account >> >> Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a >> touch >> screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that >> worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone >> 73 >> Butch >> WA0VJR >> Node 3148 >> Wallace, ks. >> >> >> On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: >> >>> I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will >>> become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more >>> things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market >>> for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I >>> phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet >>> searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece >>> of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of >> time. >>> >>> -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk >>
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
This is really for UK people on this list. Does anyone know if the APH Orbit Reader 20 will be available in the UK? If so, from where and at what cost? Regards, John Tel: +44 (0) 1442 259243 Mob: +44 (0) 7815 056076 -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+john_farley=btinternet@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Russ Kiehne via Talk Sent: Saturday, March 18, 2017 1:23 PM To: Terri Pannett; Marcie Chaney; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account The APH Orbit Reader 20 will allow you to add a braille display to a smart phone, tablet or ipod touch. -Original Message- From: Terri Pannett via Talk Sent: Friday, March 17, 2017 9:22 AM To: Marcie Chaney ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account I don't think you said anything about braille. Braille has always been important to me, and I wonder if the mainstream phones and computers would support it if the braille notetakers/displays were no longer around. Only blind people who read and write braille exclusively can understand this. Terri Amateur radio call sign KF6CA ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/russ94577%40gm ail.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/john_farley%40 btinternet.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Don't be surprised if the VFO group tries to acquire Sarotec? -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Friday, March 17, 2017 1:14 PM To: Pamela Dominguez ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Pam: VFO is very close to a monopoly. Not quite, as there are other players but certainly close. The point is that it may have become so dominant that it prevents other players from growing their market share or even entering the market. The opinion that someone has offered whereby perhaps VFO will acquire Dolphin is interesting and speculatively possible. Vaughan. On 3/18/2017 3:51 AM, Pamela Dominguez via Talk wrote: I remember when this all went down, I referred to VFO as a monopoly, and was smartly chastized for it. I don't know why. To me, it seems like it has taken over everything. Isn't that a monopoly? Pam. -Original Message- From: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:34 PM To: 'Tony C' ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/geodom%40optonline.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. http://www.avg.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/vdodd001%40vodafone.co.nz. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/russ94577%40gmail.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Many blind people can't afford the high price for braille displays and notetakers. -Original Message- From: Nick Sarames Sent: Friday, March 17, 2017 10:33 AM To: Terri Pannett ; Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Russ Kiehne Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Remember, most blind persons don't use Braille. On 3/17/2017 12:41 PM, Terri Pannett via Talk wrote: Again, braille is not supported the way it should be. 20 cells is just not enough, especially if you want to use braille exclusively and turn off speech. I would never buy an Orbit for that reason. Terri Amateur radio call sign KF6CA ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/nicksarames%40msn.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com . ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Look at it this way, buying a APH Orbet Reader 20 display and a ios or android device will save you a lot of money over buying a Notetaker. Many blind people can't afford $5000 for a Notetaker! -Original Message- From: Terri Pannett Sent: Friday, March 17, 2017 9:38 AM To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account From what people have posted on various lists that I belong to, I understand that using braille on an Apple device would be a challenge. This is because everything is translated into grade 2 instantly so if you don't write fast enough, your text will be garbled. People who prefer braille will still have to use either a braille notetaker or a braille display to read and write braille with an Apple device. I not only object to touch screens, I also object to using complicated Apple and Android devices. If you like your I device, that's fine, but don't force me to buy one. Terri Amateur radio call sign KF6CA ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
The APH Orbit Reader 20 will allow you to add a braille display to a smart phone, tablet or ipod touch. -Original Message- From: Terri Pannett via Talk Sent: Friday, March 17, 2017 9:22 AM To: Marcie Chaney ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account I don't think you said anything about braille. Braille has always been important to me, and I wonder if the mainstream phones and computers would support it if the braille notetakers/displays were no longer around. Only blind people who read and write braille exclusively can understand this. Terri Amateur radio call sign KF6CA ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/russ94577%40gmail.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
that should also give you uncontracted braille instead of contracted braille input and output. On 3/17/2017 5:42 PM, Reg Webb via Talk wrote: You can set braille input and output on the iPhone, contracted, 6 dot, or 8 dot in both cases. ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
You can set braille input and output on the iPhone, contracted, 6 dot, or 8 dot in both cases. -- Reg On Fri, 17 Mar 2017 09:38:15 -0700 Terri Pannett via Talk wrote: > From what people have posted on various lists that I belong to, I understand > that using braille on an Apple device would be a challenge. This is because > everything is translated into grade 2 instantly so if you don't write fast > enough, your text will be garbled. People who prefer braille will still have > to use either a braille notetaker or a braille display to read and write > braille with an Apple device. > > I not only object to touch screens, I also object to using complicated Apple > and Android devices. > > If you like your I device, that's fine, but don't force me to buy one. > > > > Terri Amateur radio call sign KF6CA > ___ > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author > and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. > > For membership options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/regwebb%40btinternet.com. > For subscription options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > List archives can be found at > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Certainly: and although I won't be getting an Orbit Reader as it does not meet my requirements, it might be a game changer for many. My Note-taker gets used less and less often as my iPhone usage with any one of several braille displays increases. Vaughan. On 3/18/2017 2:50 AM, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote: Think about this? You can get a iphone and APH — Orbit Reader 20 for a lot less money than a Notetaker? -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 2:44 PM To: 'Russ Kiehne' ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account I'm similar: IPhone is the device of choice. Might actually get an Ipad. Add a braille display, which isn't carried if not needed, and for personal use - mainstream devices offer so much promise. Not so for me at work though. Vaughan. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+vaughan.dodd001=msd.govt...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Russ Kiehne via Talk Sent: Friday, 17 March 2017 3:09 a.m. To: Reeva Webb; Window-Eyes Discussion List; Dennis Long Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does everything they do and a lot more. -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho Reeva On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" wrote: I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account Greetings all. I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. We are promised CSUN updates in April. In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that although often people exchange useful information, the leadership fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's behaviours. Vaughan. --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Pam: VFO is very close to a monopoly. Not quite, as there are other players but certainly close. The point is that it may have become so dominant that it prevents other players from growing their market share or even entering the market. The opinion that someone has offered whereby perhaps VFO will acquire Dolphin is interesting and speculatively possible. Vaughan. On 3/18/2017 3:51 AM, Pamela Dominguez via Talk wrote: I remember when this all went down, I referred to VFO as a monopoly, and was smartly chastized for it. I don't know why. To me, it seems like it has taken over everything. Isn't that a monopoly? Pam. -Original Message- From: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:34 PM To: 'Tony C' ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/geodom%40optonline.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. http://www.avg.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/vdodd001%40vodafone.co.nz. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Not completely correct: you are accurate in that by default, contracted braille is the default translation, but you can set things so as to input and output in uncontracted Braille. Or - as I do - input in uncontracted and see output in contracted. Braille on an Apple device for me is essential. But if people do not like touch screens, and do not use braille, there are numerous Bluetooth keyboards which solve this problem. Vaughan. On 3/18/2017 5:38 AM, Terri Pannett via Talk wrote: From what people have posted on various lists that I belong to, I understand that using braille on an Apple device would be a challenge. This is because everything is translated into grade 2 instantly so if you don't write fast enough, your text will be garbled. People who prefer braille will still have to use either a braille notetaker or a braille display to read and write braille with an Apple device. I not only object to touch screens, I also object to using complicated Apple and Android devices. If you like your I device, that's fine, but don't force me to buy one. Terri Amateur radio call sign KF6CA ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/vdodd001%40vodafone.co.nz. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
I've been doing a lot of reading up on this, it appears the future of Windows is a universal platform that can run any app written in any programming language. So, in theory, it won't matter what device or platform you're using. With slight modifications, the same universal app could run on any device and/or platform. For example, you could have an app that was written and runs on the Windows desktop, but it will also run on Windows Mobile, i-OS and Android, etc. MS already has accessibility built into many of the controls used in these universal apps and they say they are working to make them even more accessible. If Window-eyes or Jaws could add a little extra support then that's all we would really need. ==Steve ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Well, the best advice I can give is when first trying to use a touchscreen, take your time. Move your finger slowly around the screen. When I first got my iPad Mini 4, I moved my finger too quickly across the screen, causing me to have trouble finding out what was on the screen because my finger was already onto something else before VoiceOver had a chance to tell me what I had touched. It took some self discipline, but once I slowed down, things went much better. You can speed up again when you know your way around. Another piece of advice is just practice, practice. There's even a practice mode in VoiceOver that lets you try out the various gestures without actually activating anything. It's not perfect. No computer is. But it's a pretty impressive achievement all the same what they've been able to create with accessibility on the iDevices. Kind of makes me sad for what accessibility on Windows machines might be or could have been for many years if Microsoft had made a similar effort as Apple has. Evan -Original Message- From: Nick Sarames via Talk Sent: Friday, March 17, 2017 1:46 PM To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Butch Bussen Cc: Reeva Webb Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Without veering too much off topic, is there some preliminary advice you can give for trying to learn how to navagate a touch screen? Full disclosure, I'm a button man. On 3/17/2017 9:34 AM, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote: I was one of lthose who thought I would never want a touch screen device. I started llistening to a podcast about the ipod touch. The more I listened, I said to myself, I want one. I was amazed with what Apple did with accessibility on a touch screen device. So in 2010, I bought a ipod touch 4th generation and Haven't looked back. I like the fact I can buy a off the shelf device and do everything I would do with a specialized player and a whole lot ;more. -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:11 AM To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Cc: Reeva Webb ; Dennis Long Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal with touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an earlier note, the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and your i whatevers think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. I can't figure out how to run my IPod. 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote: In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does everything they do and a lot more. -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho Reeva On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" wrote: I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time.
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Without veering too much off topic, is there some preliminary advice you can give for trying to learn how to navagate a touch screen? Full disclosure, I'm a button man. On 3/17/2017 9:34 AM, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote: > I was one of lthose who thought I would never want a touch screen > device. I started llistening to a podcast about the ipod touch. The > more I listened, I said to myself, I want one. I was amazed with what > Apple did with accessibility on a touch screen device. So in 2010, I > bought a ipod touch 4th generation and Haven't looked back. I like the > fact I can buy a off the shelf device and do everything I would do with > a specialized player and a whole lot ;more. > > -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen > Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:11 AM > To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List > Cc: Reeva Webb ; Dennis Long > Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account > > I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal with > touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an earlier note, > the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and your i whatevers > think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. > I can't figure out how to run my IPod. > 73 > Butch > WA0VJR > Node 3148 > Wallace, ks. > > > On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Russ Kiehne > via Talk wrote: > >> In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader >> stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It >> has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does >> everything they do and a lot more. >> >> -Original Message----- From: Reeva Webb via Talk >> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM >> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long >> Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account >> >> You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had >> in the >> past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a >> electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook >> and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't >> have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening >> with >> zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm >> seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find >> myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. >> >> >> "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised >> night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho >> >> Reeva >> >> On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" >> >> wrote: >> >> I agree with you completely! >> >> -Original Message- >> From: Talk >> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] >> On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk >> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM >> To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List >> Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account >> >> Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a >> touch >> screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that >> worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone >> 73 >> Butch >> WA0VJR >> Node 3148 >> Wallace, ks. >> >> >> On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: >> >>> I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will >>> become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more >>> things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market >>> for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I >>> phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet >>> searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece >>> of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of >> time. >>> >>> -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM >>> To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' >>> Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account >>> >>> Greetings all. >>> >>> I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. >>> We are promised CSUN updates in April. >>> >>> In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry >>> going throu
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Remember, most blind persons don't use Braille. On 3/17/2017 12:41 PM, Terri Pannett via Talk wrote: > Again, braille is not supported the way it should be. 20 cells is just > not enough, especially if you want to use braille exclusively and turn > off speech. I would never buy an Orbit for that reason. > > > Terri Amateur radio call sign KF6CA > ___ > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the > author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. > > For membership options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/nicksarames%40msn.com. > > For subscription options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > List archives can be found at > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > . > ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
I once said, don't force me to buy a computer. On 3/17/2017 12:38 PM, Terri Pannett via Talk wrote: > From what people have posted on various lists that I belong to, I > understand that using braille on an Apple device would be a challenge. > This is because everything is translated into grade 2 instantly so if > you don't write fast enough, your text will be garbled. People who > prefer braille will still have to use either a braille notetaker or a > braille display to read and write braille with an Apple device. > > I not only object to touch screens, I also object to using complicated > Apple and Android devices. > > If you like your I device, that's fine, but don't force me to buy one. > > > > Terri Amateur radio call sign KF6CA > ___ > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the > author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. > > For membership options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/nicksarames%40msn.com. > > For subscription options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > List archives can be found at > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > . > ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
On the other hand, we have a resource we never had before, Ebay. Also, there are more voice activated appliances than ever before including Alexa. It's a tradeoff. On 3/17/2017 12:42 PM, Evan Reese via Talk wrote: > The "vast number of electronic items that have unreadable Screens of all > sizes", includes household appliances now. We had a heck of a time a few > years ago finding a stove we could use. If you haven't looked lately, > just about all of them come with a screen that you have to use to set > the temperature. > Fortunately, a friend of ours found one, just one among a whole bunch of > others on the floor of our nearby home improvement superstore, gas range > that still had knobs on it that you can actually turn. > Try to find a washer or drier that doesn't have a touchscreen you have > to use to run it. Luckily, we haven't yet needed to look for one of > those, but I'm not optimistic we'll be able to find one when we need it > with buttons or knobs you can feel. > Evan > > -Original Message- From: Dave via Talk > Sent: Friday, March 17, 2017 11:07 AM > To: Rick Thomas ; Window-Eyes Discussion List > Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account > > Yes Rick, I reluctantly agree with you that too many things have become > Political. And I for one, do not know how to reverse this politicizing > of every sort of Service the Government or Privet Sector might offer. > > Let's face it, the Blind are a very small group when looking at the > entire population. > > As computers continue to be more and more visually orientated, and more > of the population are operating at a semi-literate level of skills, I > don't see this move towards graphical interfaces to change any time soon. > > And with the extra pressures to bring products to market quickly , the > entire product sufferers because of so many short cuts and compromises > implemented. Accessibility for the Blind? Who has time for that? > > I know some here believe they have more accessibility today, and in some > ways, they are correct. But I find in the work place, accessibility is > slowly going backwards. > > What this means for the Blind person depending upon Screen Readers and > other equipment to be mastered by memorizing a long list of steps, is > not good. > > The lack of Buttons, and the vast number of electronic items that have > unreadable Screens of all sizes, makes working in the typical Office, > or even Warehouse a more difficult task then it was just a few years ago. > > I keep thinking those who are Blind are going to need to Specialize in > something in order to make a living. Just what that "Something" could > be is a question that has many answers, although, those answers are > probably not obvious. > > After spending years in the Computer field, I can no longer find a place > in that field for solid employment.Oh, there are lots of > opportunities, but I haven't figured ut how to over come the lack of > access in some of the equipment or software to be used. > > I am now looking at doing something that requires very little in the way > of electronic gear. Something like re-building Electric Motors. > Electric motors are every where and they do wear out, and need replacing > or rebuilding. > > but, I think it is Odd Ball opportunities like this that might allow > someone blind to live a better life than living on Disability. > > Not Glamorous, or even interesting, but there is a Need, and a person who > is Good, can make some reasonable money doing it. > > sure beats Selling Pencils as my Grand mother once suggested I try, > just after I lost my sight. > > I keep hoping for the Best, but am aware I need to be prepared for less > than Best if need be. > > Grumpy Dave > > > > > ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
From what people have posted on various lists that I belong to, I understand that using braille on an Apple device would be a challenge. This is because everything is translated into grade 2 instantly so if you don't write fast enough, your text will be garbled. People who prefer braille will still have to use either a braille notetaker or a braille display to read and write braille with an Apple device. I not only object to touch screens, I also object to using complicated Apple and Android devices. If you like your I device, that's fine, but don't force me to buy one. Terri Amateur radio call sign KF6CA ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
The "vast number of electronic items that have unreadable Screens of all sizes", includes household appliances now. We had a heck of a time a few years ago finding a stove we could use. If you haven't looked lately, just about all of them come with a screen that you have to use to set the temperature. Fortunately, a friend of ours found one, just one among a whole bunch of others on the floor of our nearby home improvement superstore, gas range that still had knobs on it that you can actually turn. Try to find a washer or drier that doesn't have a touchscreen you have to use to run it. Luckily, we haven't yet needed to look for one of those, but I'm not optimistic we'll be able to find one when we need it with buttons or knobs you can feel. Evan -Original Message- From: Dave via Talk Sent: Friday, March 17, 2017 11:07 AM To: Rick Thomas ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Yes Rick, I reluctantly agree with you that too many things have become Political. And I for one, do not know how to reverse this politicizing of every sort of Service the Government or Privet Sector might offer. Let's face it, the Blind are a very small group when looking at the entire population. As computers continue to be more and more visually orientated, and more of the population are operating at a semi-literate level of skills, I don't see this move towards graphical interfaces to change any time soon. And with the extra pressures to bring products to market quickly , the entire product sufferers because of so many short cuts and compromises implemented. Accessibility for the Blind? Who has time for that? I know some here believe they have more accessibility today, and in some ways, they are correct. But I find in the work place, accessibility is slowly going backwards. What this means for the Blind person depending upon Screen Readers and other equipment to be mastered by memorizing a long list of steps, is not good. The lack of Buttons, and the vast number of electronic items that have unreadable Screens of all sizes, makes working in the typical Office, or even Warehouse a more difficult task then it was just a few years ago. I keep thinking those who are Blind are going to need to Specialize in something in order to make a living. Just what that "Something" could be is a question that has many answers, although, those answers are probably not obvious. After spending years in the Computer field, I can no longer find a place in that field for solid employment.Oh, there are lots of opportunities, but I haven't figured ut how to over come the lack of access in some of the equipment or software to be used. I am now looking at doing something that requires very little in the way of electronic gear. Something like re-building Electric Motors. Electric motors are every where and they do wear out, and need replacing or rebuilding. but, I think it is Odd Ball opportunities like this that might allow someone blind to live a better life than living on Disability. Not Glamorous, or even interesting, but there is a Need, and a person who is Good, can make some reasonable money doing it. sure beats Selling Pencils as my Grand mother once suggested I try, just after I lost my sight. I keep hoping for the Best, but am aware I need to be prepared for less than Best if need be. Grumpy Dave -- Dave ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/mentat1%40dslextreme.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Again, braille is not supported the way it should be. 20 cells is just not enough, especially if you want to use braille exclusively and turn off speech. I would never buy an Orbit for that reason. Terri Amateur radio call sign KF6CA ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
Reg Web, President Trump going blind? You've been wiretapping the green White House! Oh, and from England? Yikes! You're in trouble, you've been spying for the UK5 for a long, long time! Now watch out, we're coming after you!! Sarcasm apart, it would probably be hidden from the public the same way Roosevelt's disability was hidden almost for life! Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
I don't think you said anything about braille. Braille has always been important to me, and I wonder if the mainstream phones and computers would support it if the braille notetakers/displays were no longer around. Only blind people who read and write braille exclusively can understand this. Terri Amateur radio call sign KF6CA ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Yes Rick, I reluctantly agree with you that too many things have become Political. And I for one, do not know how to reverse this politicizing of every sort of Service the Government or Privet Sector might offer. Let's face it, the Blind are a very small group when looking at the entire population. As computers continue to be more and more visually orientated, and more of the population are operating at a semi-literate level of skills, I don't see this move towards graphical interfaces to change any time soon. And with the extra pressures to bring products to market quickly , the entire product sufferers because of so many short cuts and compromises implemented. Accessibility for the Blind? Who has time for that? I know some here believe they have more accessibility today, and in some ways, they are correct. But I find in the work place, accessibility is slowly going backwards. What this means for the Blind person depending upon Screen Readers and other equipment to be mastered by memorizing a long list of steps, is not good. The lack of Buttons, and the vast number of electronic items that have unreadable Screens of all sizes, makes working in the typical Office, or even Warehouse a more difficult task then it was just a few years ago. I keep thinking those who are Blind are going to need to Specialize in something in order to make a living. Just what that "Something" could be is a question that has many answers, although, those answers are probably not obvious. After spending years in the Computer field, I can no longer find a place in that field for solid employment.Oh, there are lots of opportunities, but I haven't figured ut how to over come the lack of access in some of the equipment or software to be used. I am now looking at doing something that requires very little in the way of electronic gear. Something like re-building Electric Motors. Electric motors are every where and they do wear out, and need replacing or rebuilding. but, I think it is Odd Ball opportunities like this that might allow someone blind to live a better life than living on Disability. Not Glamorous, or even interesting, but there is a Need, and a person who is Good, can make some reasonable money doing it. sure beats Selling Pencils as my Grand mother once suggested I try, just after I lost my sight. I keep hoping for the Best, but am aware I need to be prepared for less than Best if need be. Grumpy Dave -- Dave ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Pam And for those who would monopolise, the prospects for screwing more money out of their friends in government agencies don't look so rosy under a Trump administration which would only get interested if the president himself went blind. -- Reg On Fri, 17 Mar 2017 10:51:21 -0400 Pamela Dominguez via Talk wrote: > I remember when this all went down, I referred to VFO as a monopoly, and was > smartly chastized for it. I don't know why. To me, it seems like it has > taken over everything. Isn't that a monopoly? Pam. > > -Original Message- From: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via > Talk > Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:34 PM > To: 'Tony C' ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' > Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account > > Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty > happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful > dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always > at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! > > If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have > been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and > flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal > Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O > Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? > > Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with > the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk > noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless > especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. > > Sincerely, > Olusegun > Denver, Colorado > > > --- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > > ___ > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author > and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. > > For membership options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/geodom%40optonline.net. > For subscription options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > List archives can be found at > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > > --- > This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. > http://www.avg.com > ___ > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author > and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. > > For membership options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/regwebb%40btinternet.com. > For subscription options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > List archives can be found at > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
The only other screen reader I know of is Dolphin and who knows it may be next on VFO's list of Acquisitions . - Original Message - From: Pamela Dominguez via Talk To: ukekearu...@valtdnet.com ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Sent: Friday, March 17, 2017 10:51 AM Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account I remember when this all went down, I referred to VFO as a monopoly, and was smartly chastized for it. I don't know why. To me, it seems like it has taken over everything. Isn't that a monopoly? Pam. -Original Message- From: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:34 PM To: 'Tony C' ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/geodom%40optonline.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. http://www.avg.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/loyrg2845%40gmail.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Somebody asked me why didn't I get office, and download the free window eyes. I ask why I should. I already have the window eyes that I bought on time payments, back when they had them. So, I already have window eyes. So, all I have to do is buy smas. So, I hope they do update it. Pam. -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:45 PM To: 'ukekearu...@valtdnet.com' ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account I feel that the key point as this relates to Window-eyes is missed: if you don't pay - you can presume to not get. The Window-Eyes for Office deal has meant that there is no cash to fix long standing problems or to develop new features. People who make a business choice to develop tools which make our lives better do also have to live. Although I will always remain unhappy with current developments, the software engineers who continue to develop screen readers are tradable - they can sell their skills to someone else. I do believe that the virtual monopoly on screen readers especially for those who are employed is a bad thng. But - it is what we have, and it might be that there is now a huge barrier which prevents others from offering choice to consumers. Tough as it is: we have to make spending choices, and certainly, if financial assistance is there - take it. But: someone produces and sells, someone else buys and consumes. Vaughan. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+vaughan.dodd001=msd.govt...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk Sent: Friday, 17 March 2017 3:34 p.m. To: 'Tony C'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/vaughan.dodd001%40msd.govt.nz. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/geodom%40optonline.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. http://www.avg.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
I remember when this all went down, I referred to VFO as a monopoly, and was smartly chastized for it. I don't know why. To me, it seems like it has taken over everything. Isn't that a monopoly? Pam. -Original Message- From: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:34 PM To: 'Tony C' ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/geodom%40optonline.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. http://www.avg.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Microsoft could developed Narrator to work as good as any screen reader and the cost could be spread out across million and millions of copies of Windows, where a company like VFO or AISquared has to spread out the cost to a few thousand copies of the screen readers sold. Apple did it so why can't Microsoft. The present version of Narrator is only good for some things but useless in many. - Original Message - From: Singing Sparrow via Talk To: Butch Bussen ; Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Sky Mundell Sent: Friday, March 17, 2017 10:11 AM Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Sometimes i wonder what microsoft really saw in window eyes in the first place? I mean they could have advanced narrater to the point it is today with in windows 10 and made it work fluently with all windowsoperating systems. On 3/17/2017 7:57 AM, Butch Bussen via Talk wrote: > Yep, and we don't know what microsoft was paying for the product. > 73 > Butch > WA0VJR > Node 3148 > Wallace, ks. > > > On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Sky Mundell via Talk wrote: > >> Hi Vaughn. When the office deal came out, remember, they have two >> versions >> of Window-Eyes that you can get. The free version, with office, and the >> paid for version which would give you the tech support. >> >> -Original Message- >> From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On >> Behalf Of Vaughan Dodd via Talk >> Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 7:46 PM >> To: 'ukekearu...@valtdnet.com'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' >> Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account >> >> I feel that the key point as this relates to Window-eyes is missed: >> if you >> don't pay - you can presume to not get. The Window-Eyes for Office >> deal has >> meant that there is no cash to fix long standing problems or to >> develop new >> features. >> >> People who make a business choice to develop tools which make our lives >> better do also have to live. Although I will always remain unhappy with >> current developments, the software engineers who continue to develop >> screen >> readers are tradable - they can sell their skills to someone else. >> >> I do believe that the virtual monopoly on screen readers especially for >> those who are employed is a bad thng. But - it is what we have, and it >> might be that there is now a huge barrier which prevents others from >> offering choice to consumers. >> Tough as it is: we have to make spending choices, and certainly, if >> financial assistance is there - take it. But: someone produces and >> sells, >> someone else buys and consumes. >> >> Vaughan. >> >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: Talk >> [mailto:talk-bounces+vaughan.dodd001=msd.govt...@lists.window-eyes.com] >> On >> Behalf Of Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk >> Sent: Friday, 17 March 2017 3:34 p.m. >> To: 'Tony C'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' >> Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account >> >> Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are >> pretty >> happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of >> deceitful >> dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are >> always >> at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! >> >> If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would >> have >> been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With >> impunity and >> flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal >> Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V >> F O >> Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? >> >> Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from >> complying with >> the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk >> noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless >> especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes >> watching. >> >> Sincerely, >> Olusegun >> Denver, Colorado >> >> >> --- >> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. >> https://www.avast.com/antivirus >> >> ___ >> Any views or opinions presented in this email are
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Sometimes i wonder what microsoft really saw in window eyes in the first place? I mean they could have advanced narrater to the point it is today with in windows 10 and made it work fluently with all windowsoperating systems. On 3/17/2017 7:57 AM, Butch Bussen via Talk wrote: Yep, and we don't know what microsoft was paying for the product. 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Sky Mundell via Talk wrote: Hi Vaughn. When the office deal came out, remember, they have two versions of Window-Eyes that you can get. The free version, with office, and the paid for version which would give you the tech support. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 7:46 PM To: 'ukekearu...@valtdnet.com'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account I feel that the key point as this relates to Window-eyes is missed: if you don't pay - you can presume to not get. The Window-Eyes for Office deal has meant that there is no cash to fix long standing problems or to develop new features. People who make a business choice to develop tools which make our lives better do also have to live. Although I will always remain unhappy with current developments, the software engineers who continue to develop screen readers are tradable - they can sell their skills to someone else. I do believe that the virtual monopoly on screen readers especially for those who are employed is a bad thng. But - it is what we have, and it might be that there is now a huge barrier which prevents others from offering choice to consumers. Tough as it is: we have to make spending choices, and certainly, if financial assistance is there - take it. But: someone produces and sells, someone else buys and consumes. Vaughan. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+vaughan.dodd001=msd.govt...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk Sent: Friday, 17 March 2017 3:34 p.m. To: 'Tony C'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/vaughan.dodd00 1%40msd.govt.nz. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/skyt%40shaw.ca . For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Think about this? You can get a iphone and APH — Orbit Reader 20 for a lot less money than a Notetaker? -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 2:44 PM To: 'Russ Kiehne' ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account I'm similar: IPhone is the device of choice. Might actually get an Ipad. Add a braille display, which isn't carried if not needed, and for personal use - mainstream devices offer so much promise. Not so for me at work though. Vaughan. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+vaughan.dodd001=msd.govt...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Russ Kiehne via Talk Sent: Friday, 17 March 2017 3:09 a.m. To: Reeva Webb; Window-Eyes Discussion List; Dennis Long Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does everything they do and a lot more. -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho Reeva On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" wrote: I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account Greetings all. I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. We are promised CSUN updates in April. In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that although often people exchange useful information, the leadership fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's behaviours. Vaughan. --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. ---
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
I was one of lthose who thought I would never want a touch screen device. I started llistening to a podcast about the ipod touch. The more I listened, I said to myself, I want one. I was amazed with what Apple did with accessibility on a touch screen device. So in 2010, I bought a ipod touch 4th generation and Haven't looked back. I like the fact I can buy a off the shelf device and do everything I would do with a specialized player and a whole lot ;more. -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:11 AM To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Cc: Reeva Webb ; Dennis Long Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal with touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an earlier note, the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and your i whatevers think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. I can't figure out how to run my IPod. 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote: In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does everything they do and a lot more. -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho Reeva On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" wrote: I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account Greetings all. I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. We are promised CSUN updates in April. In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that although often people exchange useful information, the leadership fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's behaviours. Vaughan. --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify t
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
Yep, and we don't know what microsoft was paying for the product. 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Sky Mundell via Talk wrote: Hi Vaughn. When the office deal came out, remember, they have two versions of Window-Eyes that you can get. The free version, with office, and the paid for version which would give you the tech support. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 7:46 PM To: 'ukekearu...@valtdnet.com'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account I feel that the key point as this relates to Window-eyes is missed: if you don't pay - you can presume to not get. The Window-Eyes for Office deal has meant that there is no cash to fix long standing problems or to develop new features. People who make a business choice to develop tools which make our lives better do also have to live. Although I will always remain unhappy with current developments, the software engineers who continue to develop screen readers are tradable - they can sell their skills to someone else. I do believe that the virtual monopoly on screen readers especially for those who are employed is a bad thng. But - it is what we have, and it might be that there is now a huge barrier which prevents others from offering choice to consumers. Tough as it is: we have to make spending choices, and certainly, if financial assistance is there - take it. But: someone produces and sells, someone else buys and consumes. Vaughan. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+vaughan.dodd001=msd.govt...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk Sent: Friday, 17 March 2017 3:34 p.m. To: 'Tony C'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/vaughan.dodd00 1%40msd.govt.nz. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/skyt%40shaw.ca . For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/butchb%40shellworld.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
I agree. Our Country is nuts brainwashed when it comes to Capitalism, doesn't really practice it, but uses the concepts to route ever larger amounts of money and assets to the top 1 percent at the cost of the other 99 percent of us. The Middle class is dying, will die at an even faster pace going forward, and those like the sick and disabled are being left for dead in our modern U.S. economic system. There are changes brewing and I wonder how long before it erupts into civil violence and disobedience. The disabled community talks and communicates via the computer but until, unless, boots on the ground do something to hit the mainstream media nothing will get better while the Middle Class is losing jobs, income power and civil rights which will be the main theme of any civil actions that are media worthy. I don't want to get political but everything is indeed political in the end so I will drop it here and just let things play out doing my own thing to try and facillitate change. Rick USA -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+ofbgmail=mi.rr@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Reg Webb via Talk Sent: Friday, March 17, 2017 4:03 AM To: Tony C ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account I happen to think, on a humanitarian rather than on a political level, that some goods and services, defined as essential, should be shielded from market forces. I would include health care (I'm British), and access technology. In this category, people like clinicians and the developers of technology should be paid well for their expertise, but the price should not be armped up by supply and demand, scarcity value, ETC. The prospect of somene else's profit margin, over and above proper salaries, preventing someone with cancer from receiving treatment, or a blind person being able to have the means of cummunicating in a digital world, is obscene. And "That's just the way it is" is defeatist talk in my opinion. -- Reg On Thu, 16 Mar 2017 19:17:48 -0500 Tony C via Talk wrote: > Yeah! but the prices make it to where a fair number of the blind can't buy a screen reader. I know there's a lot of work that goes into creating and keeping a screen reader up to date. But, I also know there are a lot of Government substities for such. Just like the Lighthouse's get donations, grants, and tax exempt status, and yet there products cost twice as much as open market products. Tell me this, how many of the top 10 people at Freedom scifi, or VFO are actually blind??? These top 10 are also the top wage, bonus, expense, earners, and so on and so forth. > > -Original Message- From: Nick Sarames via Talk > Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 6:33 PM > To: Evan Reese ; Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Pamela Dominguez > Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account > > To be fair, the disparity between the price of a screen reader and the > price of a desk top has everything to do with supply and demand. > Fewer consumers are purchasing desk tops. Until most screen reader > users replace their screen readers with Iphone-like products, the > price of a screen reader will likely not decrease much. > > On 3/16/2017 5:35 PM, Evan Reese via Talk wrote: > > Hmmm, how about a screenreader company that charges more for their > > product than a decent desktop these days? Some people might call > > that being "penalized" simply to access their PC, something any > > sighted person can do right out of the box. > > Evan > > > > -Original Message----- From: Pamela Dominguez via Talk > > Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 5:02 PM > > To: Butch Bussen ; Window-Eyes Discussion List > > Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account > > > > Yes. Somebody said about something: "The only way it's hard is if > > you make it hard". Well, it seems to me that that is quight > > subjective. He is speaking from his own experience. Those of us > > who don't rush to get every little new thing don't think that way. > > I don't see why we should be penalized because we don't want a touch > > screen or whatever the newest > thing is. Pam. > > > > -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen via Talk > > Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 1:11 PM > > To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List > > Cc: Reeva Webb > > Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account > > > > I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal > > with touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an > > earlier note, the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and > > your i whatevers think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. > >
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
Hi: My concern is going forward and how the screen readers will work with the new 2017 windows version The Creators. It has allot of new features like virtual reality and other things of a visual nature according to one fellow I talked to recently. Will JAWS and, or, WindowEyes be able to handle the new windows platform without major changes? With the back-out of staff from the WindowEyes project this could be a real problem if the new windows is a major upgrade for them. Rick USA -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+ofbgmail=mi.rr@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:46 PM To: 'ukekearu...@valtdnet.com' ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account I feel that the key point as this relates to Window-eyes is missed: if you don't pay - you can presume to not get. The Window-Eyes for Office deal has meant that there is no cash to fix long standing problems or to develop new features. People who make a business choice to develop tools which make our lives better do also have to live. Although I will always remain unhappy with current developments, the software engineers who continue to develop screen readers are tradable - they can sell their skills to someone else. I do believe that the virtual monopoly on screen readers especially for those who are employed is a bad thng. But - it is what we have, and it might be that there is now a huge barrier which prevents others from offering choice to consumers. Tough as it is: we have to make spending choices, and certainly, if financial assistance is there - take it. But: someone produces and sells, someone else buys and consumes. Vaughan. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+vaughan.dodd001=msd.govt...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk Sent: Friday, 17 March 2017 3:34 p.m. To: 'Tony C'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/vaughan.dodd00 1%40msd.govt.nz. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/ofbgmail%40mi. rr.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archi
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Well said sir. That's more like it. -- Reg On Thu, 16 Mar 2017 20:34:25 -0600 "Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk" wrote: > Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty > happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful > dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always > at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! > > If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have > been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and > flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal > Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O > Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? > > Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with > the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk > noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless > especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. > > Sincerely, > Olusegun > Denver, Colorado > > > --- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > > ___ > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author > and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. > > For membership options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/regwebb%40btinternet.com. > For subscription options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > List archives can be found at > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
I happen to think, on a humanitarian rather than on a political level, that some goods and services, defined as essential, should be shielded from market forces. I would include health care (I'm British), and access technology. In this category, people like clinicians and the developers of technology should be paid well for their expertise, but the price should not be armped up by supply and demand, scarcity value, ETC. The prospect of somene else's profit margin, over and above proper salaries, preventing someone with cancer from receiving treatment, or a blind person being able to have the means of cummunicating in a digital world, is obscene. And "That's just the way it is" is defeatist talk in my opinion. -- Reg On Thu, 16 Mar 2017 19:17:48 -0500 Tony C via Talk wrote: > Yeah! but the prices make it to where a fair number of the blind can't buy a > screen reader. I know there's a lot of work that goes into creating and > keeping a screen reader up to date. But, I also know there are a lot of > Government substities for such. Just like the Lighthouse's get donations, > grants, and tax exempt status, and yet there products cost twice as much as > open market products. Tell me this, how many of the top 10 people at Freedom > scifi, or VFO are actually blind??? These top 10 are also the top wage, > bonus, expense, earners, and so on and so forth. > > -Original Message- From: Nick Sarames via Talk > Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 6:33 PM > To: Evan Reese ; Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Pamela Dominguez > Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account > > To be fair, the disparity between the price of a screen reader and the > price of a desk top has everything to do with supply and demand. Fewer > consumers are purchasing desk tops. Until most screen reader users > replace their screen readers with Iphone-like products, the price of a > screen reader will likely not decrease much. > > On 3/16/2017 5:35 PM, Evan Reese via Talk wrote: > > Hmmm, how about a screenreader company that charges more for their > > product than a decent desktop these days? Some people might call that > > being "penalized" simply to access their PC, something any sighted > > person can do right out of the box. > > Evan > > > > -Original Message----- From: Pamela Dominguez via Talk > > Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 5:02 PM > > To: Butch Bussen ; Window-Eyes Discussion List > > Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account > > > > Yes. Somebody said about something: "The only way it's hard is if you > > make > > it hard". Well, it seems to me that that is quight subjective. He is > > speaking from his own experience. Those of us who don't rush to get every > > little new thing don't think that way. I don't see why we should be > > penalized because we don't want a touch screen or whatever the newest > > > thing > > is. Pam. > > > > -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen via Talk > > Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 1:11 PM > > To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List > > Cc: Reeva Webb > > Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account > > > > I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal with > > touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an earlier note, > > the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and your i whatevers > > think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. > > I can't figure out how to run my IPod. > > 73 > > Butch > > WA0VJR > > Node 3148 > > Wallace, ks. > > > > > > On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Russ Kiehne > > via Talk wrote: > > > >> In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader > >> stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It > >> has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does > >> everything they do and a lot more. > >> > >> -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk > >> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM > >> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long > >> Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account > >> > >> You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had > >> in the > >> past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a > >> electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook > >> and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't > >> have to spend extra money unless you want to.
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
I realize that tablets and phones for use to replace or complement a computer are not for everyone. But that as a given, I believe the future of accessibility is going to improve and that even Jaws and Zoom Text or Magic may eventually be obsolete because whatever hardware is the latest rage will eventually be totally accessible. Until then, there are some options to deal with whatever you have to deal with. There are options such as getting a computer from Computers For The Blind, purchasing for a minimal fee NVDA or downloading it free, purchasing Microsoft Office and downloading Window Eyes for Office free or paying a reasonable price for technical support. Then of course, you can buy tablets for very reasonable prices from Amazon which have magnification and speech already on them and finally phones which have accessibility built in. There are truly a lot more options than there were a few years ago. I don't want Window Eyes to go away. But who knows what will come along next Marcie Brink-Chaney? -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+chaneyma=ameritech@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Tony C via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 8:18 PM To: Nick Sarames; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Yeah! but the prices make it to where a fair number of the blind can't buy a screen reader. I know there's a lot of work that goes into creating and keeping a screen reader up to date. But, I also know there are a lot of Government substities for such. Just like the Lighthouse's get donations, grants, and tax exempt status, and yet there products cost twice as much as open market products. Tell me this, how many of the top 10 people at Freedom scifi, or VFO are actually blind??? These top 10 are also the top wage, bonus, expense, earners, and so on and so forth. -Original Message- From: Nick Sarames via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 6:33 PM To: Evan Reese ; Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Pamela Dominguez Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account To be fair, the disparity between the price of a screen reader and the price of a desk top has everything to do with supply and demand. Fewer consumers are purchasing desk tops. Until most screen reader users replace their screen readers with Iphone-like products, the price of a screen reader will likely not decrease much. On 3/16/2017 5:35 PM, Evan Reese via Talk wrote: > Hmmm, how about a screenreader company that charges more for their > product than a decent desktop these days? Some people might call that > being "penalized" simply to access their PC, something any sighted > person can do right out of the box. > Evan > > -Original Message- From: Pamela Dominguez via Talk > Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 5:02 PM > To: Butch Bussen ; Window-Eyes Discussion List > Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account > > Yes. Somebody said about something: "The only way it's hard is if you > make > it hard". Well, it seems to me that that is quight subjective. He is > speaking from his own experience. Those of us who don't rush to get every > little new thing don't think that way. I don't see why we should be > penalized because we don't want a touch screen or whatever the newest > thing > is. Pam. > > -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen via Talk > Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 1:11 PM > To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List > Cc: Reeva Webb > Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account > > I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal with > touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an earlier note, > the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and your i whatevers > think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. > I can't figure out how to run my IPod. > 73 > Butch > WA0VJR > Node 3148 > Wallace, ks. > > > On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Russ Kiehne > via Talk wrote: > >> In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader >> stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It >> has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does >> everything they do and a lot more. >> >> -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk >> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM >> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long >> Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account >> >> You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had >> in the >> past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a >> electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook >> and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Doug Geoffray in an email said that they are testing WE with the insider builds and so far WE is working with it. - Original Message - From: Kenneth Son via Talk To: Nick Sarames ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:55 PM Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Hello list. Speaking of holding VFO accountable,Do Where is any information of the update of Window Eyes for the new release of Windows 10 soon to be released? I have not seen this as of yet. I want to get a new computer in April but if I don't know for sure if Window Eyes works with it, I will have to hold on to this windows 8 computer until I hear of any release of a version that will work with this new update of Windows 10 Creator adition. If Window Eyes is truly dead, I wish VFO would come out with an upgrade plan to Jaws so I can get on with it. Kenneth Son. On 3/16/2017 19:33, Nick Sarames via Talk wrote: > To be fair, the disparity between the price of a screen reader and the > price of a desk top has everything to do with supply and demand. Fewer > consumers are purchasing desk tops. Until most screen reader users > replace their screen readers with Iphone-like products, the price of a > screen reader will likely not decrease much. > > On 3/16/2017 5:35 PM, Evan Reese via Talk wrote: >> Hmmm, how about a screenreader company that charges more for their >> product than a decent desktop these days? Some people might call that >> being "penalized" simply to access their PC, something any sighted >> person can do right out of the box. >> Evan >> >> -Original Message- From: Pamela Dominguez via Talk >> Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 5:02 PM >> To: Butch Bussen ; Window-Eyes Discussion List >> Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account >> >> Yes. Somebody said about something: "The only way it's hard is if you >> make >> it hard". Well, it seems to me that that is quight subjective. He is >> speaking from his own experience. Those of us who don't rush to get every >> little new thing don't think that way. I don't see why we should be >> penalized because we don't want a touch screen or whatever the newest thing >> is. Pam. >> >> -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen via Talk >> Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 1:11 PM >> To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List >> Cc: Reeva Webb >> Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account >> >> I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal with >> touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an earlier note, >> the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and your i whatevers >> think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. >> I can't figure out how to run my IPod. >> 73 >> Butch >> WA0VJR >> Node 3148 >> Wallace, ks. >> >> >> On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Russ Kiehne >> via Talk wrote: >> >>> In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader >>> stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It >>> has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does >>> everything they do and a lot more. >>> >>> -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM >>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long >>> Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account >>> >>> You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had >>> in the >>> past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a >>> electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook >>> and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't >>> have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening >>> with >>> zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm >>> seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find >>> myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. >>> >>> >>> "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised >>> night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho >>> >>> Reeva >>> >>> On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk"
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
The same Microsoft which screwed screen readers out of the development of Edge. Vaughan. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+vaughan.dodd001=msd.govt...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Loy via Talk Sent: Friday, 17 March 2017 3:53 p.m. To: Sky Mundell; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account And the free version for Office was subsidized by Microsoft. - Original Message - From: Sky Mundell via Talk To: 'Vaughan Dodd' ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:53 PM Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Hi Vaughn. When the office deal came out, remember, they have two versions of Window-Eyes that you can get. The free version, with office, and the paid for version which would give you the tech support. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 7:46 PM To: 'ukekearu...@valtdnet.com'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account I feel that the key point as this relates to Window-eyes is missed: if you don't pay - you can presume to not get. The Window-Eyes for Office deal has meant that there is no cash to fix long standing problems or to develop new features. People who make a business choice to develop tools which make our lives better do also have to live. Although I will always remain unhappy with current developments, the software engineers who continue to develop screen readers are tradable - they can sell their skills to someone else. I do believe that the virtual monopoly on screen readers especially for those who are employed is a bad thng. But - it is what we have, and it might be that there is now a huge barrier which prevents others from offering choice to consumers. Tough as it is: we have to make spending choices, and certainly, if financial assistance is there - take it. But: someone produces and sells, someone else buys and consumes. Vaughan. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+vaughan.dodd001=msd.govt...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk Sent: Friday, 17 March 2017 3:34 p.m. To: 'Tony C'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/vaughan.dodd00 1%40msd.govt.nz. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eye
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Hello list. Speaking of holding VFO accountable, Where is any information of the update of Window Eyes for the new release of Windows 10 soon to be released? I have not seen this as of yet. I want to get a new computer in April but if I don't know for sure if Window Eyes works with it, I will have to hold on to this windows 8 computer until I hear of any release of a version that will work with this new update of Windows 10 Creator adition. If Window Eyes is truly dead, I wish VFO would come out with an upgrade plan to Jaws so I can get on with it. Kenneth Son. On 3/16/2017 19:33, Nick Sarames via Talk wrote: To be fair, the disparity between the price of a screen reader and the price of a desk top has everything to do with supply and demand. Fewer consumers are purchasing desk tops. Until most screen reader users replace their screen readers with Iphone-like products, the price of a screen reader will likely not decrease much. On 3/16/2017 5:35 PM, Evan Reese via Talk wrote: Hmmm, how about a screenreader company that charges more for their product than a decent desktop these days? Some people might call that being "penalized" simply to access their PC, something any sighted person can do right out of the box. Evan -Original Message- From: Pamela Dominguez via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 5:02 PM To: Butch Bussen ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Yes. Somebody said about something: "The only way it's hard is if you make it hard". Well, it seems to me that that is quight subjective. He is speaking from his own experience. Those of us who don't rush to get every little new thing don't think that way. I don't see why we should be penalized because we don't want a touch screen or whatever the newest thing is. Pam. -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 1:11 PM To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Cc: Reeva Webb Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal with touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an earlier note, the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and your i whatevers think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. I can't figure out how to run my IPod. 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote: In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does everything they do and a lot more. -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho Reeva On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" wrote: I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:0
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
And the free version for Office was subsidized by Microsoft. - Original Message - From: Sky Mundell via Talk To: 'Vaughan Dodd' ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 10:53 PM Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Hi Vaughn. When the office deal came out, remember, they have two versions of Window-Eyes that you can get. The free version, with office, and the paid for version which would give you the tech support. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 7:46 PM To: 'ukekearu...@valtdnet.com'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account I feel that the key point as this relates to Window-eyes is missed: if you don't pay - you can presume to not get. The Window-Eyes for Office deal has meant that there is no cash to fix long standing problems or to develop new features. People who make a business choice to develop tools which make our lives better do also have to live. Although I will always remain unhappy with current developments, the software engineers who continue to develop screen readers are tradable - they can sell their skills to someone else. I do believe that the virtual monopoly on screen readers especially for those who are employed is a bad thng. But - it is what we have, and it might be that there is now a huge barrier which prevents others from offering choice to consumers. Tough as it is: we have to make spending choices, and certainly, if financial assistance is there - take it. But: someone produces and sells, someone else buys and consumes. Vaughan. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+vaughan.dodd001=msd.govt...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk Sent: Friday, 17 March 2017 3:34 p.m. To: 'Tony C'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/vaughan.dodd00 1%40msd.govt.nz. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/skyt%40shaw.ca . For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not n
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
Hi Vaughn. When the office deal came out, remember, they have two versions of Window-Eyes that you can get. The free version, with office, and the paid for version which would give you the tech support. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 7:46 PM To: 'ukekearu...@valtdnet.com'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account I feel that the key point as this relates to Window-eyes is missed: if you don't pay - you can presume to not get. The Window-Eyes for Office deal has meant that there is no cash to fix long standing problems or to develop new features. People who make a business choice to develop tools which make our lives better do also have to live. Although I will always remain unhappy with current developments, the software engineers who continue to develop screen readers are tradable - they can sell their skills to someone else. I do believe that the virtual monopoly on screen readers especially for those who are employed is a bad thng. But - it is what we have, and it might be that there is now a huge barrier which prevents others from offering choice to consumers. Tough as it is: we have to make spending choices, and certainly, if financial assistance is there - take it. But: someone produces and sells, someone else buys and consumes. Vaughan. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+vaughan.dodd001=msd.govt...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk Sent: Friday, 17 March 2017 3:34 p.m. To: 'Tony C'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/vaughan.dodd00 1%40msd.govt.nz. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/skyt%40shaw.ca . For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
I feel that the key point as this relates to Window-eyes is missed: if you don't pay - you can presume to not get. The Window-Eyes for Office deal has meant that there is no cash to fix long standing problems or to develop new features. People who make a business choice to develop tools which make our lives better do also have to live. Although I will always remain unhappy with current developments, the software engineers who continue to develop screen readers are tradable - they can sell their skills to someone else. I do believe that the virtual monopoly on screen readers especially for those who are employed is a bad thng. But - it is what we have, and it might be that there is now a huge barrier which prevents others from offering choice to consumers. Tough as it is: we have to make spending choices, and certainly, if financial assistance is there - take it. But: someone produces and sells, someone else buys and consumes. Vaughan. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+vaughan.dodd001=msd.govt...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk Sent: Friday, 17 March 2017 3:34 p.m. To: 'Tony C'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/vaughan.dodd001%40msd.govt.nz. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
Tony, I could not agree more! It seems to me that blind folks are pretty happy being ripped off. Petitions fall on deaf ears, elements of deceitful dishonesty beat down like hurricanes and tornados, and stun guns are always at the ready to fire and knock the blind out! If the goings-on had happened in the mainstream, antitrust law would have been cited and everything would have gone under quietly. With impunity and flagrant disregard, the blind continue to borrow the phrase from Animal Farm: "Four legs good, two legs bad!" Milk on Freedom Scientific, V F O Group, AI Square, ... Did I miss any? Hmm, anyone knows what's holding the U.S. Treasury back from complying with the court order by making the dollar bill more accessible? The junk noteteller they choose to hand me is utterly worthless and useless especially in a business environment where I have more prying eyes watching. Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
I agree with you, Butch. I never got used to the Android phone, even with the BrailleEdge connected to it. I wish people wouldn't automatically think that because they can use their I devices and Android devices that Apple and Android is good for everyone. Also, I hate voice commands! The stupid phones don't understand them most of the time. Terri Amateur radio call sign KF6CA ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
I tried to learn how to use a phone running Android and I just couldn't get the knack of it. I went back to using a LG flip phone. No, indeed! One size does NOT fit all! Terri Amateur radio call sign KF6CA ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
They could create an installment plan the way Window Eyes has, (or had), I don't know these days. It wouldn't be hard, but as far as I know, they won't consider it. Evan -Original Message- From: Tony C via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 8:17 PM To: Nick Sarames ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Yeah! but the prices make it to where a fair number of the blind can't buy a screen reader. I know there's a lot of work that goes into creating and keeping a screen reader up to date. But, I also know there are a lot of Government substities for such. Just like the Lighthouse's get donations, grants, and tax exempt status, and yet there products cost twice as much as open market products. Tell me this, how many of the top 10 people at Freedom scifi, or VFO are actually blind??? These top 10 are also the top wage, bonus, expense, earners, and so on and so forth. -Original Message- From: Nick Sarames via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 6:33 PM To: Evan Reese ; Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Pamela Dominguez Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account To be fair, the disparity between the price of a screen reader and the price of a desk top has everything to do with supply and demand. Fewer consumers are purchasing desk tops. Until most screen reader users replace their screen readers with Iphone-like products, the price of a screen reader will likely not decrease much. On 3/16/2017 5:35 PM, Evan Reese via Talk wrote: Hmmm, how about a screenreader company that charges more for their product than a decent desktop these days? Some people might call that being "penalized" simply to access their PC, something any sighted person can do right out of the box. Evan -Original Message- From: Pamela Dominguez via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 5:02 PM To: Butch Bussen ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Yes. Somebody said about something: "The only way it's hard is if you make it hard". Well, it seems to me that that is quight subjective. He is speaking from his own experience. Those of us who don't rush to get every little new thing don't think that way. I don't see why we should be penalized because we don't want a touch screen or whatever the newest thing is. Pam. -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 1:11 PM To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Cc: Reeva Webb Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal with touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an earlier note, the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and your i whatevers think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. I can't figure out how to run my IPod. 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote: In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does everything they do and a lot more. -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho Reeva On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" wrote: I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Yeah! but the prices make it to where a fair number of the blind can't buy a screen reader. I know there's a lot of work that goes into creating and keeping a screen reader up to date. But, I also know there are a lot of Government substities for such. Just like the Lighthouse's get donations, grants, and tax exempt status, and yet there products cost twice as much as open market products. Tell me this, how many of the top 10 people at Freedom scifi, or VFO are actually blind??? These top 10 are also the top wage, bonus, expense, earners, and so on and so forth. -Original Message- From: Nick Sarames via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 6:33 PM To: Evan Reese ; Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Pamela Dominguez Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account To be fair, the disparity between the price of a screen reader and the price of a desk top has everything to do with supply and demand. Fewer consumers are purchasing desk tops. Until most screen reader users replace their screen readers with Iphone-like products, the price of a screen reader will likely not decrease much. On 3/16/2017 5:35 PM, Evan Reese via Talk wrote: Hmmm, how about a screenreader company that charges more for their product than a decent desktop these days? Some people might call that being "penalized" simply to access their PC, something any sighted person can do right out of the box. Evan -Original Message- From: Pamela Dominguez via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 5:02 PM To: Butch Bussen ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Yes. Somebody said about something: "The only way it's hard is if you make it hard". Well, it seems to me that that is quight subjective. He is speaking from his own experience. Those of us who don't rush to get every little new thing don't think that way. I don't see why we should be penalized because we don't want a touch screen or whatever the newest thing is. Pam. -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 1:11 PM To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Cc: Reeva Webb Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal with touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an earlier note, the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and your i whatevers think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. I can't figure out how to run my IPod. 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote: In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does everything they do and a lot more. -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho Reeva On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" wrote: I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
It's not about being penalized - it's about what the market will provide. On 3/16/2017 5:02 PM, Pamela Dominguez via Talk wrote: > Yes. Somebody said about something: "The only way it's hard is if you > make it hard". Well, it seems to me that that is quight subjective. He > is speaking from his own experience. Those of us who don't rush to get > every little new thing don't think that way. I don't see why we should > be penalized because we don't want a touch screen or whatever the newest > thing is. Pam. > > -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen via Talk > Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 1:11 PM > To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List > Cc: Reeva Webb > Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account > > I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal with > touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an earlier note, > the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and your i whatevers > think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. > I can't figure out how to run my IPod. > 73 > Butch > WA0VJR > Node 3148 > Wallace, ks. > > > On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Russ Kiehne > via Talk wrote: > >> In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader >> stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It >> has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does >> everything they do and a lot more. >> >> -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk >> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM >> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long >> Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account >> >> You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had >> in the >> past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a >> electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook >> and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't >> have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening >> with >> zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm >> seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find >> myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. >> >> >> "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised >> night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho >> >> Reeva >> >> On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" >> >> wrote: >> >> I agree with you completely! >> >> -Original Message- >> From: Talk >> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] >> On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk >> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM >> To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List >> Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account >> >> Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a >> touch >> screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that >> worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone >> 73 >> Butch >> WA0VJR >> Node 3148 >> Wallace, ks. >> >> >> On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: >> >>> I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will >>> become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more >>> things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market >>> for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I >>> phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet >>> searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece >>> of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of >> time. >>> >>> -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM >>> To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' >>> Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account >>> >>> Greetings all. >>> >>> I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. >>> We are promised CSUN updates in April. >>> >>> In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry >>> going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the >>> pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO >>>
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
To be fair, the disparity between the price of a screen reader and the price of a desk top has everything to do with supply and demand. Fewer consumers are purchasing desk tops. Until most screen reader users replace their screen readers with Iphone-like products, the price of a screen reader will likely not decrease much. On 3/16/2017 5:35 PM, Evan Reese via Talk wrote: > Hmmm, how about a screenreader company that charges more for their > product than a decent desktop these days? Some people might call that > being "penalized" simply to access their PC, something any sighted > person can do right out of the box. > Evan > > -Original Message- From: Pamela Dominguez via Talk > Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 5:02 PM > To: Butch Bussen ; Window-Eyes Discussion List > Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account > > Yes. Somebody said about something: "The only way it's hard is if you > make > it hard". Well, it seems to me that that is quight subjective. He is > speaking from his own experience. Those of us who don't rush to get every > little new thing don't think that way. I don't see why we should be > penalized because we don't want a touch screen or whatever the newest thing > is. Pam. > > -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen via Talk > Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 1:11 PM > To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List > Cc: Reeva Webb > Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account > > I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal with > touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an earlier note, > the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and your i whatevers > think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. > I can't figure out how to run my IPod. > 73 > Butch > WA0VJR > Node 3148 > Wallace, ks. > > > On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Russ Kiehne > via Talk wrote: > >> In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader >> stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It >> has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does >> everything they do and a lot more. >> >> -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk >> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM >> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long >> Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account >> >> You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had >> in the >> past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a >> electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook >> and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't >> have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening >> with >> zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm >> seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find >> myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. >> >> >> "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised >> night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho >> >> Reeva >> >> On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" >> >> wrote: >> >> I agree with you completely! >> >> -Original Message- >> From: Talk >> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] >> On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk >> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM >> To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List >> Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account >> >> Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a >> touch >> screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that >> worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone >> 73 >> Butch >> WA0VJR >> Node 3148 >> Wallace, ks. >> >> >> On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: >> >>> I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will >>> become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more >>> things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market >>> for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I >>> phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet >>> searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece >>> of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
I'm similar: IPhone is the device of choice. Might actually get an Ipad. Add a braille display, which isn't carried if not needed, and for personal use - mainstream devices offer so much promise. Not so for me at work though. Vaughan. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+vaughan.dodd001=msd.govt...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Russ Kiehne via Talk Sent: Friday, 17 March 2017 3:09 a.m. To: Reeva Webb; Window-Eyes Discussion List; Dennis Long Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does everything they do and a lot more. -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho Reeva On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" wrote: I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: > I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will > become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more > things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market > for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I > phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet > searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece > of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. > > -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk > Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM > To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' > Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account > > Greetings all. > > I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. > We are promised CSUN updates in April. > > In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry > going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the > pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO > leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. > > Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain > blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. > > One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that > although often people exchange useful information, the leadership > fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its > developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on > the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique > VFO's behaviours. > > Vaughan. > > > --- > This email and any attachments may contain information that is > confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the > intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or > duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have > received this email in error please notify the author immediately and > erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social > Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message > or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. > > --- > ___ > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely thos
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Hmmm, how about a screenreader company that charges more for their product than a decent desktop these days? Some people might call that being "penalized" simply to access their PC, something any sighted person can do right out of the box. Evan -Original Message- From: Pamela Dominguez via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 5:02 PM To: Butch Bussen ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Yes. Somebody said about something: "The only way it's hard is if you make it hard". Well, it seems to me that that is quight subjective. He is speaking from his own experience. Those of us who don't rush to get every little new thing don't think that way. I don't see why we should be penalized because we don't want a touch screen or whatever the newest thing is. Pam. -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 1:11 PM To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Cc: Reeva Webb Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal with touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an earlier note, the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and your i whatevers think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. I can't figure out how to run my IPod. 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote: In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does everything they do and a lot more. -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho Reeva On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" wrote: I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account Greetings all. I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. We are promised CSUN updates in April. In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that although often people exchange useful information, the leadership fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Yes. Somebody said about something: "The only way it's hard is if you make it hard". Well, it seems to me that that is quight subjective. He is speaking from his own experience. Those of us who don't rush to get every little new thing don't think that way. I don't see why we should be penalized because we don't want a touch screen or whatever the newest thing is. Pam. -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 1:11 PM To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Cc: Reeva Webb Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal with touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an earlier note, the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and your i whatevers think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. I can't figure out how to run my IPod. 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote: In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does everything they do and a lot more. -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho Reeva On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" wrote: I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account Greetings all. I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. We are promised CSUN updates in April. In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that although often people exchange useful information, the leadership fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's behaviours. Vaughan. --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and at
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
I understand that. And that is great, for you. I just can't deal with touch screens. Give me buttons to push. As I said in an earlier note, the same solution isn't for everyone. You guys and your i whatevers think they solve the world's access problems. Perhaps for some they do. I can't figure out how to run my IPod. 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Thu, 16 Mar 2017, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote: In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does everything they do and a lot more. -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho Reeva On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" wrote: I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account Greetings all. I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. We are promised CSUN updates in April. In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that although often people exchange useful information, the leadership fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's behaviours. Vaughan. --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/tch828%40media combb.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
While I think this is a good thing, Narrator doesn't have near the responsiveness that W.E. or JAWS has, though it's improving. The main reason for any of the actual screen-readers, like W.E. or JFW is the fact that you can script for them and handle certain situations that Narrator just can't handle. Take for example the BARD Express program from NLS. Actually, W.E. is the best working program with BARD Express. In fact, BARD Express works worst of all with Narrator and SuperNova. Narrator, for sure, still has a lot of work to do. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+joseph.norton=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Reeva Webb via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 2:54 AM To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho Reeva On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" wrote: I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: > I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will > become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more > things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market > for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I > phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet > searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece > of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. > > -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk > Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM > To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' > Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account > > Greetings all. > > I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. > We are promised CSUN updates in April. > > In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry > going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the > pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO > leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. > > Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain > blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. > > One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that > although often people exchange useful information, the leadership > fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its > developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on > the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique > VFO's behaviours. > > Vaughan. > > > --- > This email and any attachments may contain information that is > confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the > intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or > duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have > received this email in error please notify the author immediately and > erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social > Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message > or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. > > --- > ___ > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the > author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. > > For membership options, visit > http://lists.
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
You know they make a rubber keyboard that you can roll up and is about the size of one of those little short umbrellas when it's rolled up and when unrolled is the size of a standard keyboard... -Original Message- From: Pamela Dominguez via Talk Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2017 9:49 AM To: Butch Bussen ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Yes, I agree with you on that. I don't have any touch screen devices. I think my laptop can be used in that way, but I am happy to say that it still has a keyboard. And when my cell phone goes, I will be getting another one with buttons. Pam. -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account Greetings all. I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. We are promised CSUN updates in April. In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that although often people exchange useful information, the leadership fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's behaviours. Vaughan. --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/tch828%40mediacombb.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/butchb%40shellworld.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/geodom%40optonline.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. http://www.avg.com ___ Any views or opinions pres
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Yes, I agree with you on that. I don't have any touch screen devices. I think my laptop can be used in that way, but I am happy to say that it still has a keyboard. And when my cell phone goes, I will be getting another one with buttons. Pam. -Original Message- From: Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C ; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account Greetings all. I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. We are promised CSUN updates in April. In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that although often people exchange useful information, the leadership fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's behaviours. Vaughan. --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/tch828%40mediacombb.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/butchb%40shellworld.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/geodom%40optonline.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com --- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. http://www.avg.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
In my case, my ipad mini 4 has taken the place of my victor reader stream first generation, Booksense standard and plextalk pocket. It has more volume, better battery life and better sound. It does everything they do and a lot more. -Original Message- From: Reeva Webb via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:54 PM To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Dennis Long Subject: RE: Failure to hold VFO to account You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho Reeva On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" wrote: I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account Greetings all. I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. We are promised CSUN updates in April. In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that although often people exchange useful information, the leadership fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's behaviours. Vaughan. --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/tch828%40media combb.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/butchb%40shell world.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
I just got an android in Nov. I really like it and use talk back to send tests. It's not perfect, but it's a step in the right direction. I'm76 and fairly computer stupid, but am learning. I put a braille dot where the speaker phone button is, and it works pretty well. Doesn't replace W.E., but is handy. www.harmonicaworkshops.com www.woodeneyemusic.com On Thu, 16 Mar 2017 01:54:26 -0500 Reeva Webb via Talk wrote: > You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the > past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a > electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook > and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't > have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with > zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm > seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find > myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. > > > "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised > night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho > > Reeva > > On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" > wrote: > > I agree with you completely! > > -Original Message- > From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] > On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk > Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM > To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List > Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account > > Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch > screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that > worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone > 73 > Butch > WA0VJR > Node 3148 > Wallace, ks. > > > On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: > > > I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will > > become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more > > things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market > > for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I > > phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet > > searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece > > of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of > time. > > > > -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk > > Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM > > To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' > > Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account > > > > Greetings all. > > > > I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. > > We are promised CSUN updates in April. > > > > In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry > > going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the > > pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO > > leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible > information sources. > > > > Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain > > blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. > > > > One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that > > although often people exchange useful information, the leadership > > fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its > > developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on > > the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's > behaviours. > > > > Vaughan. > > > > > > --- > > This email and any attachments may contain information that is > > confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the > > intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or > > duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have > > received this email in error please notify the author immediately and > > erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social > > Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or > attachments after transmission from the Ministry. > > > > --- > > ___ > > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the > > author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squ
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
Could be that my fingers don't get cold enough! But I sure do use a touchscreen phone with cold fingers! There's still good old winter here in my Denver bush, though today's weather will be nearly 60Plus degrees F. But I'm constantly standing at a bus stop, and, when my bus is late, I'm having to check and double check to be sure I had not missed it. I have to do this on the phone with cold fingers and sometimes with gloves on as well. So, it works for me, but everyone's mileages can and will indeed vary! Sincerely, Olusegun Denver, Colorado --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Personally, I miss the phones with physical buttons/keyboards. Try using a touchscreen with cold fingers and see how far you get. One size does not fit all.--Matt, N1IBB. On 3/15/2017 11:12 PM, Butch Bussen via Talk wrote: Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account Greetings all. I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. We are promised CSUN updates in April. In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that although often people exchange useful information, the leadership fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's behaviours. Vaughan. --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/tch828%40mediacombb.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/butchb%40shellworld.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/mattchao%40verizon.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
You know, this gets me thinking esp. With the conversations I've had in the past week. We're getting what we wanted for years. We can go into a electronics store and buy a iphone, a android phone, a mac, a chromebook and soon windows computers with accessibility out of the box. You don't have to spend extra money unless you want to. While what is happening with zt fusion, something I spent my own money to buy makes me mad. I'm seriously considering just going fully with mainstream products. I find myself using my android devices more and pulling out my laptop less. "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho Reeva On Mar 16, 2017 1:18 AM, "Dennis Long via Talk" wrote: I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: > I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will > become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more > things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market > for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I > phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet > searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece > of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. > > -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk > Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM > To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' > Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account > > Greetings all. > > I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. > We are promised CSUN updates in April. > > In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry > going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the > pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO > leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. > > Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain > blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. > > One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that > although often people exchange useful information, the leadership > fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its > developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on > the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's behaviours. > > Vaughan. > > > --- > This email and any attachments may contain information that is > confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the > intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or > duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have > received this email in error please notify the author immediately and > erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social > Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. > > --- > ___ > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the > author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. > > For membership options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/tch828%40media combb.net. > For subscription options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > List archives can be found at > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > ___ > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the > author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. > > For membership options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/butchb%40shell world.net. > For subscription options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > List archives can be found at > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > > ___ Any v
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
I agree with you completely! -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 11:12 PM To: Tony C; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: > I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will > become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more > things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market > for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I > phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet > searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece > of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. > > -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk > Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM > To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' > Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account > > Greetings all. > > I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. > We are promised CSUN updates in April. > > In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry > going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the > pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO > leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. > > Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain > blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. > > One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that > although often people exchange useful information, the leadership > fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its > developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on > the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's behaviours. > > Vaughan. > > > --- > This email and any attachments may contain information that is > confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the > intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or > duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have > received this email in error please notify the author immediately and > erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social > Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. > > --- > ___ > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the > author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. > > For membership options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/tch828%40media combb.net. > For subscription options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > List archives can be found at > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > ___ > Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the > author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. > > For membership options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/butchb%40shell world.net. > For subscription options, visit > http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > List archives can be found at > http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com > > ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/dennisl1982%40 gmail.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
Hi Vaughan, Check out the latest Ctrl Walt Delete podcast for a critique of the gang of five who have consumers by the short and curlies: http://bit.ly/2mL7GXO Enjoy, Rod -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 5:06 PM To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account Greetings all. I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. We are promised CSUN updates in April. In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that although often people exchange useful information, the leadership fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's behaviours. Vaughan. --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/rod_hutton%40hotmail.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
Problem is you i phone users think everyone can use one and can use a touch screen. They are not for everyone. I think blind folks fall into that worse than any group. if it works for me, it is great for everyone 73 Butch WA0VJR Node 3148 Wallace, ks. On Wed, 15 Mar 2017, Tony C via Talk wrote: I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account Greetings all. I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. We are promised CSUN updates in April. In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that although often people exchange useful information, the leadership fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's behaviours. Vaughan. --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/tch828%40mediacombb.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/butchb%40shellworld.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
RE: Failure to hold VFO to account
Hello Tony. What is the likely chance of that happening? Look at the customer-bass of VFO? VFO's customer-base is massive compared to Window-Eyes. Look at Brian Hartgen and the script writers for JAWS. Brian Hartgen and the JAWS script writers won't give up erning their blood money from blind people. -Original Message- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Tony C via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 2:21 PM To: Vaughan Dodd; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: Re: Failure to hold VFO to account I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account Greetings all. I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. We are promised CSUN updates in April. In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that although often people exchange useful information, the leadership fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's behaviours. Vaughan. --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/tch828%40media combb.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/skyt%40shaw.ca . For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
Re: Failure to hold VFO to account
I really think that in the very near future "adaptive" technology will become a thing of the past. We aren't there yet, but more and more things are becoming voice activated, and voice commanded. The market for such special items as Window-eyes and Jaws is waining. Heck, the I phone out of the box gives the blind user access to GPS, internet searches, txt messageing, etc, without the need of an expensive piece of software that at best in moderately useable. It's just a matter of time. -Original Message- From: Vaughan Dodd via Talk Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2017 4:05 PM To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: Failure to hold VFO to account Greetings all. I've just flicked through the latest edition of Access World from AFB. We are promised CSUN updates in April. In the 21st Century, and with our accessible technology industry going through significant change, not to mention the demise of the pony express, the failure of someone to get down and dirty with VFO leadership suggests to me that we are being let down by credible information sources. Quite reasonably, AFB promotes its sponsorship of the Blind Bargain blogs concerning CSUN events and exhibits, but these don't cut it iehter. One of the disappointing things about services like Apple Vis is that although often people exchange useful information, the leadership fails to critique the shortcomings of Apple with respect to its developments in the specialty area of access. The same seems true on the Windows side of the divide - with no one prepared to critique VFO's behaviours. Vaughan. --- This email and any attachments may contain information that is confidential and subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this email and attachments is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the author immediately and erase all copies of the email and attachments. The Ministry of Social Development accepts no responsibility for changes made to this message or attachments after transmission from the Ministry. --- ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/tch828%40mediacombb.net. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com ___ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com