[OSM-talk] RFC - 'living_street'
Hi again, looks like I have brought a lot of confusion in my previous posts by misuse of the word 'alley'. The latter seems to have too broad range of meanings, and many of them are not what I meant. Just compare http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alley (not good as a 'living_street') and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Alley.JpG (might probably be). Please consider the following proposed definition for a 'living_street': 'living_street' is a: - pubic street or way - in a residential area - intended for mixed vehicle/pedestrian traffic - where vehicles have extra limitations and pedestrians have extra rights as compared to normal streets/ways (details depending on local legislation) - may optionally have a name as a street - may be optionally marked with "Residential Area" traffic sign where appropriate. Please kindly comment/criticize. Regards. Sergey - Original Message - From: "USHAKOV, Sergey" To: Cc: "Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason" Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2009 4:24 AM Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Is 'name' tag mandatory for a 'living_street'? > Hi again and thanks to everyone who responded. > > Meanwhile I've got a feeling that I was maybe not clear enough in > formulating my problem, and Ævar seems to get most close to my idea. > Please > let me formulate the problem in other words. > > In Russia traffic regulations make no difference (besides naming terms) > betwen named streets marked with "Residential Area" sign and un-named > alleys > in residential areas that are not required to be marked with that sign. I > guess that at least some of other countries may have similar regulations. > > With this in mind I would propose to tag as 'living_street" any > street/alley > that allows hybrid (pedestrian/vehicle) traffic with pedestrian priority, > and the 'name' tag being optional for these objects. Does this make sense? > > To Ævar: creation of 'talk-ru' mailing list seems desirable as was already > mentioned on the Russian forum as a limitation. BTW, wiki RU namespace is > also still pending ( > http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Wiki#multilingual_name_spaces ) > despite of significant activity. Can you help in getting it created? > > Regards, > Sergey [...] ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Potlatch "connection to server failed"
richard fairhurst wrote: > > Joe Richards wrote: > > I have a fairly large set of edits in Potlatch, but when > > I click 'save', I get "Sorry the connection to the Openstreetmap > > server failed. Any recent changes have not been saved. > > Would you like to try again [retry] [cancel]". Obviously my > > internet connectivity is fine, and I can bring up another tab > > with Potlatch, make edits and save them. How can I > > preserve all the editing I've done in this session? > > There's an intermittent issue here > (http://trac.openstreetmap.org/ticket/1904) and we're still trying to track > it down. It's not something I've been able to reproduce as yet. In the > meantime, though I know it's little consolation, I'd encourage you to follow > the suggestion on the help page and save often. > > If you can pop in on IRC then someone may be able to look in the server > logs and report back on what error is being generated. > i'm seeing this error this evening as well. i've asked on IRC as suggested -- no one's able to help, or maybe no one's awake. :-) i'll leave my browser window up, in case someone wants me to retry, but in the meantime if someone wants to check logs my osm ID is "pgf", and the requesting IP address is 24.xx.85.42. paul =- paul fox, p...@foxharp.boston.ma.us (arlington, ma, where it's 63.1 degrees) ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] best GPX collection tool for Palm Treo 650
Joe Richards wrote: > What's the best tool for collecting GPX trails and adding OSM waypoints for > Palm OS? > A search for PALM in the OSM wiki http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Special:Search?search=Palm&go=Go leads to: - http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Making_Tracks_with_Homebrew-ware#Palm_OS + http://www.abmh.de/en/osm4treo/ + http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OSM2Palm + http://coto.marsrakete.de/projects/cotogps/ + http://www.cetusgps.dk/ + ... Best regards, Michael. PS: although I own a Palm TX I don't use it for OSM... ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Is 'name' tag mandatory for a 'living_street'?
On Sunday 07 June 2009 23:11:16 Paul Johnson wrote: > Jens Müller wrote: > > Living streets are actully _zones_, > > Oh, then it should be tagged area=yes. Surely this isn't what you > meant, though. area=yes is for things that are physically an area. A zone in (European?) traffic law is not an area, it is a piece of the road network that consists of one or more interconnected public streets/roads. Whatever rule is "zoned" applies to the public roads in that piece of network. It doesn't apply to the space inbetween the roads nor does it apply to any connected non-public ways. -- m.v.g., Cartinus ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Potlatch "connection to server failed"
Joe Richards wrote: > I have a fairly large set of edits in Potlatch, but when > I click 'save', I get "Sorry the connection to the Openstreetmap > server failed. Any recent changes have not been saved. > Would you like to try again [retry] [cancel]". Obviously my > internet connectivity is fine, and I can bring up another tab > with Potlatch, make edits and save them. How can I > preserve all the editing I've done in this session? There's an intermittent issue here (http://trac.openstreetmap.org/ticket/1904) and we're still trying to track it down. It's not something I've been able to reproduce as yet. In the meantime, though I know it's little consolation, I'd encourage you to follow the suggestion on the help page and save often. If you can pop in on IRC then someone may be able to look in the server logs and report back on what error is being generated. cheers Richard -- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/Potlatch-%22connection-to-server-failed%22-tp23915756p23916309.html Sent from the OpenStreetMap - General mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] best GPX collection tool for Palm Treo 650
What's the best tool for collecting GPX trails and adding OSM waypoints for Palm OS? ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Is 'name' tag mandatory for a 'living_street'?
Jens Müller wrote: > On 06.06.2009 15:14, Christoph Böhme wrote: >> in Germany a living_street is a designated type of street with a >> special sign [1]. So, I would only use living_street for this type of >> streets. > > Living streets are actully _zones_, so any alley at a living street is > itself a living street. Oh, then it should be tagged area=yes. Surely this isn't what you meant, though. Plus, wouldn't bicycle boulevards qualify as living streets for us North American types that don't have living streets as such? signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Potlatch "connection to server failed"
I have a fairly large set of edits in Potlatch, but when I click 'save', I get "Sorry the connection to the Openstreetmap server failed. Any recent changes have not been saved. Would you like to try again [retry] [cancel]". Obviously my internet connectivity is fine, and I can bring up another tab with Potlatch, make edits and save them. How can I preserve all the editing I've done in this session? ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] How to present OSM to an audience of potential newbies?
On 07/06/2009 13:48, Richard Weait wrote: > What about quality control? > > OpenStreetMap has more surveyors and more quality assurance. Anybody > can fix it. You've seen the failings in commercial maps (slow updates, > limited data, unmapped areas) and in commercial maps you can't fix that. > You, and everybody around you are helping OSM quality control. Here's an example of an OSM win you could use to illustrate this: not only does OSM have the recently opened outer bypass and the severance of the roads it entailed, but Google doesn't even show the inner partial bypass which has been there for years. http://tools.geofabrik.de/mc/?mt0=googlemap&mt1=mapnik&lon=0.03699&lat=52.28129&zoom=15 And here's an example of a new town (Cambourne), developing rapidly, which Google just can't keep up with (let along provide the detail we do), and furthermore gives misleading impression that there are some roads when they are just tracks or footpaths. I think you perceive more of the character of the place from a good OSM mapping (as, to be fair, you can with an up to date OS Landranger map - at a cost of £7 on paper, of course). http://tools.geofabrik.de/mc/?mt0=googlemap&mt1=mapnik&lon=-0.07129&lat=52.21968&zoom=15 Here's another example of a development being built, already 50% occupied. We paid (continue to pay) lots of attention to this one because THERE WAS NO OTHER MAP that people living and moving there could use to direct removal vans and delivery people! http://tools.geofabrik.de/mc/?mt0=googlemap&mt1=mapnik&lon=0.12005&lat=52.23382&zoom=16 (which reminds me, there's also a hotel on the site now, which I must add!) Want to visit Grafham Water for the day? Wot, no visitor centre on Google? http://tools.geofabrik.de/mc/?mt0=googlemap&mt1=mapnik&lon=-0.29186&lat=52.29889&zoom=17 or Ely Cathedral, whose west front abuts Back Hill: http://tools.geofabrik.de/mc/?mt0=googlemap&mt1=mapnik&lon=0.26205&lat=52.39989&zoom=16 or NT's Wimpole Hall: http://tools.geofabrik.de/mc/?mt0=googlemap&mt1=mapnik&lon=-0.04878&lat=52.13965&zoom=15 HTH David ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Addresses and POI
On Sunday 07 June 2009 13:33:21 Richard Fairhurst wrote:
> Lambert Carsten wrote:
> > On Saturday 06 June 2009 15:35:41 Chris Hill wrote:
> > > Yes it is an issue - the few that I have looked at have terms and
> > > conditions that specifically restrict reuse without written permission
> > > - you should expect this on most organisations' websites.
> >
> > The address is not some kind of creative work, there is no database just
> > a website confirming that a known address is theirs. I really don't see
> > how copyright comes into this.
>
> Chris was expressly talking about contract ("terms and conditions"), not
> copyright.
He also mentioned copyright. I didn't quote that bit.
>
> Please use the legal-talk list for this kind of thing.
I agree, but the original question concerning copyright was asked here.
Jack's idea sounds like a really good idea and it would be a pity if he was
put off by Chris's over cautious (IMHO) answer.
Lambert Carsten
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Re: [OSM-talk] How to present OSM to an audience of potential newbies?
On Sat, 2009-06-06 at 23:17 +0100, Tim Morley wrote: > In a few weeks, I'll have the chance to present OSM to an audience of > youngish (18-30), intelligent, open-minded people, who more than > likely haven't yet come across the project. There may well be people > who are familiar with free and open source software, but that > probably won't be everybody present. > > Are there wiki pages, slideshows, materials, ideas, etc. that you can > show me to help me prepare the presentation? > > Failing that, how do *you* explain to someone that uses Google Maps > every day why you spend your time re-creating the same thing under a > different name? (Slightly provocative question, perhaps, but it must > be a very common one too -- what's your answer?) Dear Tim, You can find videos of Nick Black, Steve Coast and others giving Intro to OSM talks at various sites. Sorry I don't have those links handy. There is another video here http://weait.com And a slide deck in ODF. http://weait.com/IntroToOSM-summercamp.odp You are right to consider your audience as you prepare. My typical 30 min. to 60 min. talk outline for Introduction to OpenStreetMap is approximately: Why do you care about maps in general? <-- Don't skip this! What is OpenStreetMap? OpenGeoData / Open Source Software Why does it exist / How did it start / Who is involved? Show examples of what is done with OpenStreetMap. How does this differ from commercial on-line maps? Show examples of commercial map failings and OSM benefits How to collect data for OSM. How to open an account and start editing. Questions. My next talk is at SouthEast LinuxFest, Clemson, SC Saturday, 13 June 2009. Common questions: Why redo what others have online for free? Many people care about copyright and commercial maps may not allow your desired use of their copyright materials. The general case answer for OpenStreetMap is "you are allowed" even for commercial use. (Check the license for details) What about quality control? OpenStreetMap has more surveyors and more quality assurance. Anybody can fix it. You've seen the failings in commercial maps (slow updates, limited data, unmapped areas) and in commercial maps you can't fix that. You, and everybody around you are helping OSM quality control. Aren't you giving better maps to "The Terrists?" Oh, please. http://weait.com/content/ban-terrorist-tools Best regards, Richard ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Is 'name' tag mandatory for a 'living_street'?
On 06.06.2009 15:14, Christoph Böhme wrote: > in Germany a living_street is a designated type of street with a > special sign [1]. So, I would only use living_street for this type of > streets. Living streets are actully _zones_, so any alley at a living street is itself a living street. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Addresses and POI
Lambert Carsten wrote:
> On Saturday 06 June 2009 15:35:41 Chris Hill wrote:
> > Yes it is an issue - the few that I have looked at have terms and
> > conditions that specifically restrict reuse without written permission
> > - you should expect this on most organisations' websites.
> The address is not some kind of creative work, there is no database just
> a website confirming that a known address is theirs. I really don't see
> how copyright comes into this.
Chris was expressly talking about contract ("terms and conditions"), not
copyright.
Please use the legal-talk list for this kind of thing.
cheers
Richard
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http://www.nabble.com/Addresses-and-POI-tp23900844p23910075.html
Sent from the OpenStreetMap - General mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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[OSM-talk] Tactile_paving=yes/(no) Feature Proposal voting has started
Hello list, please vote on http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/tactile_paving Two projects have been started to make OSM accessible for the blind - please support! thanks. Lulu-Ann -- GRATIS für alle GMX-Mitglieder: Die maxdome Movie-FLAT! Jetzt freischalten unter http://portal.gmx.net/de/go/maxdome01 ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Addresses and POI
On Saturday 06 June 2009 15:35:41 Chris Hill wrote: > Jack Stringer wrote: > > If I gathered the address info from their website then that should not > > be an issue, should it? > > Yes it is an issue - the few that I have looked at have terms and > conditions that specifically restrict reuse without written permission - > you should expect this on most organisations' websites. The address is not some kind of creative work, there is no database just a website confirming that a known address is theirs. I really don't see how copyright comes into this. Lambert Carsten ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
