Re: [OSM-talk-be] SOTM 2016

[joost schouppe]

Yeah, it's all confirmed and actually already online at
2016.stateofthemap.org - location will be the VUB
However, the team decided to wait with massive communication until a
blogpost is online too. That should be later today.

Maybe we could translate that blogpost and put it on OSM.be too?

2015-12-02 7:15 GMT+01:00 Marc Gemis :

> Great :-)  I have to read a Russian blog post to learn that SOTM will
> be held on September 23-25, 2016.
>
> regards
>
> m
>
> [1] http://shtosm.ru/all/bryusselskaya-kartografiya/ (with google
> translate on of course)
>
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[OSM-talk-be] SOTM 2016

[Marc Gemis]

Great :-)  I have to read a Russian blog post to learn that SOTM will
be held on September 23-25, 2016.

regards

m

[1] http://shtosm.ru/all/bryusselskaya-kartografiya/ (with google
translate on of course)

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Re: [OSM-talk-be] Taalfaciliteiten + taalgrens + straatnamen

[Nicolas Pettiaux]

Le 2015-12-01 14:32, Marc Gemis a écrit :
On Tue, Dec 1, 2015 at 1:48 PM, Sander Deryckere  
wrote:

@Marc: Nominatim is hardly a reference for this.


I know, but when you first visit OpenStreetMap and look for your
street, you are using Nominatim. If your street is not found, OSM is
"worthless" and you might never return to it.
The first impression is important in this case.

Any solution for this problem is fine for me.


regards

m

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I also tend to think that we should find a solution the let any user 
find the street with any name in Nominatim, especially in this bilingual 
region. I think that our united and peaceful Belgian OSM community can 
lead the way here again.


For example, I find particularly irritating to note that some commercial 
car guidance (often called "car gps") with included commercial maps or 
commercial mapping systems on the web, do offer the region of Brussels 
(which is bilingual but to a much larger extend French rather than 
Flemish) in Dutch / Flemish by default. And not a bilingual version 
which would be at least normal (for me)


Thanks for the work

Nicolas
--
Nicolas Pettiaux, phd  - nico...@pettiaux.be
Dans une société libre, la connaissance est librement accessible à tous
OpenForum.be [1] - où l'on discute OpenAccess et libre accès, les 2è
jeudi à 18h30

Links:
--
[1] http://OpenForum.be

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Re: [OSM-talk-be] Taalfaciliteiten + taalgrens + straatnamen

[Marc Gemis]

On Tue, Dec 1, 2015 at 1:48 PM, Sander Deryckere  wrote:
> @Marc: Nominatim is hardly a reference for this.

I know, but when you first visit OpenStreetMap and look for your
street, you are using Nominatim. If your street is not found, OSM is
"worthless" and you might never return to it.
The first impression is important in this case.

Any solution for this problem is fine for me.


regards

m

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Re: [OSM-talk-be] Taalfaciliteiten + taalgrens + straatnamen

[Sander Deryckere]

2015-12-01 12:35 GMT+01:00 Jo :

> That is indeed a hard nut to crack. It's also an edge case (fortunately
> not too many of them)
>
> To make the name tag more complete we could add the translation between
> parentheses. I realise it's not the standard way of working that we use for
> the 'easier' cases.
>
> Jo
>
>
How are municipalities with language facilities normally mapped? I see two
different approaches. In Comines-Warneton, all streets are named FR-NL,
while in Mesen, the streets are only named with the Dutch name.

I think we should just put one language in the name tag, and the other in
the name:lg tag. The existence of such a name:lg tag represents the
facilities given to speakers of other language (they are able to see a
localised map, use search tools in their language, ...), while it
differentiates the language-facilities case from the completely bilingual
region of Brussels. Giving only one name also matches the current naming of
the municipality (it sais "Comines-Warneton", not "Comines-Warneton -
Komen-Waasten").

 @Marc: Nominatim is hardly a reference for this. It already has problems
when a way is only on the boundary between two municipalities, even when
both municipalities use the same name.

I think, if tools are able to search all name:* tags, they would be able to
find all streets. And if they allow binding addr:street to a name:left or
name:right of a street, they would also be able to bind the above addresses
to streets.

It's true that current tools can't display the French name of the above
situations. But that's because Komenweg has no translation to French
translation. More complicated tools could gain the capability to render
names as GRB does (on the right side of the road if the name is different
on both sides, similar to current boundary tags). And in that case, they
could display the French name on the right side. But that won't happen in
the next 5 years I suppose.

Regards,
Sander
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Re: [OSM-talk-be] Taalfaciliteiten + taalgrens + straatnamen

[Marc Gemis]

Some remarks (I know we are not mapping for XXX)

* Putting both Dutch and French names under name, breaks OsmAnd's
capability to tell the name in Dutch or French as far as I know. It
now tells both names
* name:left and name:right are not recognized by Nominatim AFIAK. So
searching for only Komenweg will fail.

I'm not saying that we have to adapt our current mapping, just
pointing out a few flaws in the data & tools for our complex
situation.

regards

m

On Tue, Dec 1, 2015 at 12:21 PM, Sander Deryckere  wrote:
> How should this way be tagged? http://www.openstreetmap.org/way/30126046
>
> The right side is in Heuvelland (Flanders), and has only a Flemish name:
> Komenweg
>
> The left side is in Comines-Warneton (Wallonia), which is a French-speaking
> municipality with Dutch language facilities, so has a name in both
> languages: Chemin des Quatre Rois - Vierkoningenweg.
>
> Now, for names that differ by language, we usually write them as name:nl and
> name:fr. For streetnames that differ by side of the street, we usually write
> them as name:left and name:right. But how should this be combined (note that
> two municipalities with language facilities might also border each other).
>
> What do you think about the following tags?
>
>> name=Komenweg - Chemin des Quatre Rois
>>
>> name:right=Komenweg
>>
>> name:left=Chemin des Quatre Rois
>>
>> name:left:fr=Chemin des Quatre Rois
>>
>> name:left:nl=Vierkoningenweg
>
>
> Also note that the street continues towards the boundary between Heuvelland
> and Mesen (which is a Flemish municipality with French language facilities).
> There if could be tagged
>
>
>>
>> name=Komenweg - Vierkoningenstraat
>>
>> name:right=Komenweg
>>
>> name:left=Vierkoningenstraat
>>
>> name:left:fr=Rue des Quatre Rois
>>
>> name:left:nl=Vierkoningenstraat
>
>
> You might wonder why I use name:left:fr instead of name:fr:left. Well, I
> figured I couldn't make a name:fr tag as there's no translation of Komenweg.
> So name:left:fr looks as a conceptual subtag of the existing name:left.
>
> What do you think of it? Someone has other opinions?
>
> Regards,
> Sander
>
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Re: [OSM-talk-be] Taalfaciliteiten + taalgrens + straatnamen

[Jo]

That is indeed a hard nut to crack. It's also an edge case (fortunately not
too many of them)

To make the name tag more complete we could add the translation between
parentheses. I realise it's not the standard way of working that we use for
the 'easier' cases.

Jo

2015-12-01 12:21 GMT+01:00 Sander Deryckere :

> How should this way be tagged? http://www.openstreetmap.org/way/30126046
>
> The right side is in Heuvelland (Flanders), and has only a Flemish name:
> Komenweg
>
> The left side is in Comines-Warneton (Wallonia), which is a
> French-speaking municipality with Dutch language facilities, so has a name
> in both languages: Chemin des Quatre Rois - Vierkoningenweg.
>
> Now, for names that differ by language, we usually write them as name:nl
> and name:fr. For streetnames that differ by side of the street, we usually
> write them as name:left and name:right. But how should this be combined
> (note that two municipalities with language facilities might also border
> each other).
>
> What do you think about the following tags?
>
> name=Komenweg - Chemin des Quatre Rois
>
> name:right=Komenweg
>>
> name:left=Chemin des Quatre Rois
>>
> name:left:fr=Chemin des Quatre Rois
>>
> name:left:nl=Vierkoningenweg
>>
>
> Also note that the street continues towards the boundary between
> Heuvelland and Mesen (which is a Flemish municipality with French language
> facilities). There if could be tagged
>
>
>
>> name=Komenweg - Vierkoningenstraat
>>
> name:right=Komenweg
>>
> name:left=Vierkoningenstraat
>>
> name:left:fr=Rue des Quatre Rois
>>
> name:left:nl=Vierkoningenstraat
>
>
> You might wonder why I use name:left:fr instead of name:fr:left. Well, I
> figured I couldn't make a name:fr tag as there's no translation of
> Komenweg. So name:left:fr looks as a conceptual subtag of the existing
> name:left.
>
> What do you think of it? Someone has other opinions?
>
> Regards,
> Sander
>
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[OSM-talk-be] Taalfaciliteiten + taalgrens + straatnamen

[Sander Deryckere]

How should this way be tagged? http://www.openstreetmap.org/way/30126046

The right side is in Heuvelland (Flanders), and has only a Flemish name:
Komenweg

The left side is in Comines-Warneton (Wallonia), which is a French-speaking
municipality with Dutch language facilities, so has a name in both
languages: Chemin des Quatre Rois - Vierkoningenweg.

Now, for names that differ by language, we usually write them as name:nl
and name:fr. For streetnames that differ by side of the street, we usually
write them as name:left and name:right. But how should this be combined
(note that two municipalities with language facilities might also border
each other).

What do you think about the following tags?

name=Komenweg - Chemin des Quatre Rois

name:right=Komenweg
>
name:left=Chemin des Quatre Rois
>
name:left:fr=Chemin des Quatre Rois
>
name:left:nl=Vierkoningenweg
>

Also note that the street continues towards the boundary between Heuvelland
and Mesen (which is a Flemish municipality with French language
facilities). There if could be tagged



> name=Komenweg - Vierkoningenstraat
>
name:right=Komenweg
>
name:left=Vierkoningenstraat
>
name:left:fr=Rue des Quatre Rois
>
name:left:nl=Vierkoningenstraat


You might wonder why I use name:left:fr instead of name:fr:left. Well, I
figured I couldn't make a name:fr tag as there's no translation of
Komenweg. So name:left:fr looks as a conceptual subtag of the existing
name:left.

What do you think of it? Someone has other opinions?

Regards,
Sander
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Re: [OSM-talk-be] Fwd: Reminder: Call for papers Geospatial devroom @ FOSDEM

[Ben Abelshausen]

Johan,

I would submit a talk myself but I'm not in Belgium at the time FOSDEM is
happening.

All,

Anyone else here who wants to present something? FOSDEM is 100% free (as in
access to the conference) and during the weekend. Maybe about the
AGIV-addressing tool by Sander, or someone who knows the HOT tasking
manager would be great, or whatever?

Joost, about some stats-scripts you created and the tools you used? I don't
know... :-)

Met vriendelijke groeten,
Best regards,

Ben Abelshausen

On Tue, Dec 1, 2015 at 9:26 AM, Johan Van de Wauw  wrote:

> -- Forwarded message --
> From: Johan Van de Wauw 
> Date: Mon, Nov 30, 2015 at 10:21 PM
> Subject: Reminder: Call for papers Geospatial devroom @ FOSDEM
> To: t...@openstreetmap.org
>
>
> Hi all,
>
> Like last year, there will be a geospatial devroom @FOSDEM [1]
> A gentle reminder that the deadline for submitting proposals to the
> geospatial devroom is *tomorrow* already! We hope to see some more
> contributions from the open streetmap community this year, so don't
> hesitate to submit your proposal!
>
> If you don't have time to write an abstract in time, feel free to just
> submit a title - you can still edit the abstract later, but having
> titles fast helps making a balanced program.
>
> Should you have any questions, don't hesitate to get in touch with
> the organisers of the devroom at fosdem-geospatial at gisky.be
>
> Kind Regards,
> Johan
> [1] https://lists.fosdem.org/pipermail/fosdem/2015-November/002292.html
>
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[OSM-talk-be] Fwd: Reminder: Call for papers Geospatial devroom @ FOSDEM

[Johan Van de Wauw]

-- Forwarded message --
From: Johan Van de Wauw 
Date: Mon, Nov 30, 2015 at 10:21 PM
Subject: Reminder: Call for papers Geospatial devroom @ FOSDEM
To: t...@openstreetmap.org


Hi all,

Like last year, there will be a geospatial devroom @FOSDEM [1]
A gentle reminder that the deadline for submitting proposals to the
geospatial devroom is *tomorrow* already! We hope to see some more
contributions from the open streetmap community this year, so don't
hesitate to submit your proposal!

If you don't have time to write an abstract in time, feel free to just
submit a title - you can still edit the abstract later, but having
titles fast helps making a balanced program.

Should you have any questions, don't hesitate to get in touch with
the organisers of the devroom at fosdem-geospatial at gisky.be

Kind Regards,
Johan
[1] https://lists.fosdem.org/pipermail/fosdem/2015-November/002292.html

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