[Talk-GB] TfL Cycling Infrastructure Database
Transport for London (TfL) have created a new database of cycling infrastructure, containing 240,000 assets, covering all of Greater London. This groundbreaking database contains every cycle infrastructure asset within Greater London, including assets on and off-carriageway. The assets surveyed are: cycle parking; signals; signage; traffic calming measures; restricted points (e.g. steps); advanced stop lines; crossings; cycle lanes/tracks; and restricted routes (e.g. pedestrian only routes). TfL is keen to make this available to the OpenStreetMap community under a compatible open license, to ensure maximum use of the CID. TfL is also potentially willing to consider tool development to help facilitate sensitive merging in of this data. There is a new Wiki page, giving full details, at: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/TfL_Cycling_Infrastructure_Database Demonstrator map: - A demonstrator map, for the purposes only of evaluation by the OSM community at this stage, has been created by CycleStreets. This demonstrator map contains only one of the 25 areas that have been surveyed. We are specifically seeking comments on data quality and usefulness of this data from the OSM community. Initial analysis by CycleStreets is that the data is of excellent quality, and very suitable for conflation into OSM, to increase both comprehensiveness and metadata quality. https://tflcid.cyclestreets.net/ (Use the controls on the right to change feature type.) Usage notes: The controls on the right of the map allow the different feature types to be selected. The OSM layer (available at zoom level 19+) also provides a live feed from the OSM API, to enable quick comparisons. The two photos of each asset are in the process of being supplied; those already available and cleared in GDPR terms are included in the popup. It is stressed that at this point, no permission is given for re-use of the data in any way, but TfL strongly intends to make this available in future. All 25 areas would be covered in the final data release, not merely the one shown currently in the demonstrator map. Feedback is very strongly encouraged, as soon as possible. What are people's thoughts? Martin, ** CycleStreets - For Cyclists, By Cyclists Developer, CycleStreets ** https://www.cyclestreets.net/ ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] TfL Cycling Infrastructure Database
Firstly, exceptionally pleased that TfL see OSM as *the* major people access cycling data :D Their data is highly accurate, and there's definitely going to need to be some clever conflation tooling. Bike stands are fine, but advance stop lines, etc. are specialist subjects in my book. I'm sightly overawed by the quantity and am unsure whether volunteers are going to be able to get through it, but again that is something you'll be talking about in your report, no? There would need to be some tool development regardless of who does the conflation. Also, you could start some discussion in the talk tab of that wiki page if there's anything that needs thrashing out. ...and now I know what a "Sheffield" bike stand is :) Regards, Jez On Fri, May 10, 2019 at 3:42 PM Martin Lucas-Smith - CycleStreets < list-osm-talk...@cyclestreets.net> wrote: > > > Transport for London (TfL) have created a new database of cycling > infrastructure, containing 240,000 assets, covering all of Greater London. > > This groundbreaking database contains every cycle infrastructure asset > within Greater London, including assets on and off-carriageway. The assets > surveyed are: cycle parking; signals; signage; traffic calming measures; > restricted points (e.g. steps); advanced stop lines; crossings; cycle > lanes/tracks; and restricted routes (e.g. pedestrian only routes). > > TfL is keen to make this available to the OpenStreetMap community under a > compatible open license, to ensure maximum use of the CID. TfL is also > potentially willing to consider tool development to help facilitate > sensitive merging in of this data. > > There is a new Wiki page, giving full details, at: > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/TfL_Cycling_Infrastructure_Database > > > Demonstrator map: > - > > A demonstrator map, for the purposes only of evaluation by the OSM > community at this stage, has been created by CycleStreets. > > This demonstrator map contains only one of the 25 areas that have been > surveyed. > > We are specifically seeking comments on data quality and usefulness of > this > data from the OSM community. Initial analysis by CycleStreets is that the > data is of excellent quality, and very suitable for conflation into OSM, > to > increase both comprehensiveness and metadata quality. > > https://tflcid.cyclestreets.net/ > (Use the controls on the right to change feature type.) > > Usage notes: The controls on the right of the map allow the different > feature types to be selected. The OSM layer (available at zoom level 19+) > also provides a live feed from the OSM API, to enable quick comparisons. > The two photos of each asset are in the process of being supplied; those > already available and cleared in GDPR terms are included in the popup. > > It is stressed that at this point, no permission is given for re-use of > the > data in any way, but TfL strongly intends to make this available in > future. > All 25 areas would be covered in the final data release, not merely the > one > shown currently in the demonstrator map. > > > Feedback is very strongly encouraged, as soon as possible. What are > people's thoughts? > > > Martin, ** CycleStreets - For Cyclists, By Cyclists > Developer, CycleStreets ** https://www.cyclestreets.net/ > > > ___ > Talk-GB mailing list > Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb > ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] TfL Cycling Infrastructure Database
On Fri, 10 May 2019, Jez Nicholson wrote: Their data is highly accurate, Yes, that seems to me as well to be the case. We're just awaiting more images to be uploaded to the site (every feature has two images, but not all are GDPR-cleared yet). I'd welcome as many eyes as possible on the sample data to get a good assessment of the data quality. https://tflcid.cyclestreets.net/ and there's definitely going to need to be some clever conflation tooling. Bike stands are fine, but advance stop lines, etc. are specialist subjects in my book. I'm sightly overawed by the quantity and am unsure whether volunteers are going to be able to get through it, but again that is something you'll be talking about in your report, no? Yes, that will be a key issue. Bear in mind that the sample data is only one of *25* areas, so there's a lot of data. Clearly, pre-translations in the data to convert the CID schema to OSM tagging would remove a lot of manual work, and a conflation tool could work on a similar basis to the England Cycling Data project tool [1]. I think there's scope for some pre-processing (e.g. eliminating locations in the CID data that clearly already exist in OSM based on a nearness search), and the ability for multiple features to be done at once, e.g. a screen where say 10-20 cycle parking locations could be reviewed at once. Again, views on this would be extremely welcome. There would need to be some tool development regardless of who does the conflation. Indeed. I'd welcome pointers to up-to-date information on the state of such tools at the moment, e.g. the JOSM tool, and other developments currently happening. [1] See images on: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/England_Cycling_Data_project Martin, ** CycleStreets - For Cyclists, By Cyclists Developer, CycleStreets ** https://www.cyclestreets.net/ ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] TfL Cycling Infrastructure Database
This looks very interesting, well worth investigating, but could any comments be posted here please - We get notifications, they're recorded & date sorted. I've yet to see a wiki discussion that doesn't become incoherent after a dozen posts. . DaveF On 10/05/2019 17:03, Jez Nicholson wrote: Firstly, exceptionally pleased that TfL see OSM as *the* major people access cycling data :D Their data is highly accurate, and there's definitely going to need to be some clever conflation tooling. Bike stands are fine, but advance stop lines, etc. are specialist subjects in my book. I'm sightly overawed by the quantity and am unsure whether volunteers are going to be able to get through it, but again that is something you'll be talking about in your report, no? There would need to be some tool development regardless of who does the conflation. Also, you could start some discussion in the talk tab of that wiki page if there's anything that needs thrashing out. ...and now I know what a "Sheffield" bike stand is :) Regards, Jez On Fri, May 10, 2019 at 3:42 PM Martin Lucas-Smith - CycleStreets < list-osm-talk...@cyclestreets.net> wrote: Transport for London (TfL) have created a new database of cycling infrastructure, containing 240,000 assets, covering all of Greater London. This groundbreaking database contains every cycle infrastructure asset within Greater London, including assets on and off-carriageway. The assets surveyed are: cycle parking; signals; signage; traffic calming measures; restricted points (e.g. steps); advanced stop lines; crossings; cycle lanes/tracks; and restricted routes (e.g. pedestrian only routes). TfL is keen to make this available to the OpenStreetMap community under a compatible open license, to ensure maximum use of the CID. TfL is also potentially willing to consider tool development to help facilitate sensitive merging in of this data. There is a new Wiki page, giving full details, at: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/TfL_Cycling_Infrastructure_Database Demonstrator map: - A demonstrator map, for the purposes only of evaluation by the OSM community at this stage, has been created by CycleStreets. This demonstrator map contains only one of the 25 areas that have been surveyed. We are specifically seeking comments on data quality and usefulness of this data from the OSM community. Initial analysis by CycleStreets is that the data is of excellent quality, and very suitable for conflation into OSM, to increase both comprehensiveness and metadata quality. https://tflcid.cyclestreets.net/ (Use the controls on the right to change feature type.) Usage notes: The controls on the right of the map allow the different feature types to be selected. The OSM layer (available at zoom level 19+) also provides a live feed from the OSM API, to enable quick comparisons. The two photos of each asset are in the process of being supplied; those already available and cleared in GDPR terms are included in the popup. It is stressed that at this point, no permission is given for re-use of the data in any way, but TfL strongly intends to make this available in future. All 25 areas would be covered in the final data release, not merely the one shown currently in the demonstrator map. Feedback is very strongly encouraged, as soon as possible. What are people's thoughts? Martin, ** CycleStreets - For Cyclists, By Cyclists Developer, CycleStreets ** https://www.cyclestreets.net/ ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] TfL Cycling Infrastructure Database
Hi Martin, Hi all, -- Second attempt to send this mail, this time with attachments hosted on cloud (feel free to copy to OSM wiki) Good to see the TfL project moving forward. As background for those that were not aware, Transport for London first approached the OpenStreetMap United Kingdom community interest company towards the end of 2018. We met them twice and helped them to scope out the project that Martin has now picked up via the OSM UK Talent Directory [1]. I realise in my email to this list in March I promised some more background (beyond what had gone into the board meeting minutes, here and on Loomio). I'm not sure I delivered on that promise - March and April is a blur in my memory as work was non-stop. I think the easiest way to rectify that is to share the text from the tender document (see [2]). I also attach the slides from the second meeting we had with TfL. One key extract from that document relates to the desire to investigate how best to integrate this data into OSM. As noted although it is possible to add the CID data to OpenStreetMap using the standard editing tools alone, this was identified as a potentially undesirable solution (to be explored as part of this project) due to the long time it would take and the difficulty of ensuring all data is added. I for one look forward to seeing what Martin discovers as part of the project. I have a small bit of experience using Ilya's conflation tool, but the earlier Potlatch2 merge tool (used on England cycle data) was before I joined OSM. Keen to find out what the current best practice is. The other key extract is related to how the data was collected: - The first phase of the project involved the surveying of greater London that was split into 25 data packages, 13 in Inner and 12 in Outer London. A total of 23,728 km of public highways was surveyed as part of this project. More than 30 surveyors have been on site 7 days a week to record all cycling infrastructure currently in place and over 477,000 asset photographs were captured. - 203,900 points and 34,931 individual lines were captured. The linear features cover a total distance of 2,088km (1 1⁄2 times the length of Britain). - Two photographs were captured of every asset. - Checking and correction has been undertaken to ensure that the quality of the data met the 95% thresholds agreed with TfL. The approach of ground survey data collection, along with the photographs, is essentially the same as we do. I think this has helped to ensure that the data collected is of high quality and accuracy (unlike some other open data we have seen in the past which may have been poorly digitised from within the office). It would be great if we can all take a moment to look at the data, consider the options for getting it in to OSM, and share feedback here for Martin to capture within the project :-) P.S. Whilst this one is London based, the learning from it is valuable to OSM UK as it ticks of some of our aims (increasing the amount of quality data in OSM and promoting the release of open data). What we learn here can be applied to projects as and when then come up throughout the UK, IoM and CI. Thank you, *Rob* [1] https://osmuk.org/join-our-talent-directory/ [2] https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1K3MQtV4-4Kl_ewrLB2lmvV3tnYyYjXpM?usp=sharing ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] TfL Cycling Infrastructure Database
If Martin comes to the OSMUK AGM he could do a talk and/or we could host a discussion. Regards, Jez On Tue, May 14, 2019 at 10:11 PM Rob Nickerson wrote: > Hi Martin, Hi all, > > -- Second attempt to send this mail, this time with attachments hosted on > cloud (feel free to copy to OSM wiki) > > Good to see the TfL project moving forward. As background for those that > were not aware, Transport for London first approached the OpenStreetMap > United Kingdom community interest company towards the end of 2018. We met > them twice and helped them to scope out the project that Martin has now > picked up via the OSM UK Talent Directory [1]. > > I realise in my email to this list in March I promised some more > background (beyond what had gone into the board meeting minutes, here and > on Loomio). I'm not sure I delivered on that promise - March and April is a > blur in my memory as work was non-stop. > > I think the easiest way to rectify that is to share the text from the > tender document (see [2]). I also attach the slides from the second meeting > we had with TfL. > > One key extract from that document relates to the desire to investigate > how best to integrate this data into OSM. As noted although it is possible > to add the CID data to OpenStreetMap using the standard editing tools > alone, this was identified as a potentially undesirable solution (to be > explored as part of this project) due to the long time it would take and > the difficulty of ensuring all data is added. I for one look forward to > seeing what Martin discovers as part of the project. I have a small bit of > experience using Ilya's conflation tool, but the earlier Potlatch2 merge > tool (used on England cycle data) was before I joined OSM. Keen to find out > what the current best practice is. > > The other key extract is related to how the data was collected: > >- The first phase of the project involved the surveying of greater >London that was split into 25 data packages, 13 in Inner and 12 in Outer >London. A total of 23,728 km of public highways was surveyed as part of >this project. More than 30 surveyors have been on site 7 days a week to >record all cycling infrastructure currently in place and over 477,000 asset >photographs were captured. >- 203,900 points and 34,931 individual lines were captured. The linear >features cover a total distance of 2,088km (1 1⁄2 times the length of >Britain). >- Two photographs were captured of every asset. >- Checking and correction has been undertaken to ensure that the >quality of the data met the 95% thresholds agreed with TfL. > > The approach of ground survey data collection, along with the photographs, > is essentially the same as we do. I think this has helped to ensure that > the data collected is of high quality and accuracy (unlike some other open > data we have seen in the past which may have been poorly digitised from > within the office). > > It would be great if we can all take a moment to look at the data, > consider the options for getting it in to OSM, and share feedback here for > Martin to capture within the project :-) > > P.S. Whilst this one is London based, the learning from it is valuable to > OSM UK as it ticks of some of our aims (increasing the amount of quality > data in OSM and promoting the release of open data). What we learn here can > be applied to projects as and when then come up throughout the UK, IoM and > CI. > > Thank you, > *Rob* > > [1] https://osmuk.org/join-our-talent-directory/ > [2] > https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1K3MQtV4-4Kl_ewrLB2lmvV3tnYyYjXpM?usp=sharing > ___ > Talk-GB mailing list > Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb > ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] TfL Cycling Infrastructure Database
The demonstrator map showing this data from TfL now has an extensive set of filters for each feature type: https://tflcid.cyclestreets.net/ E.g. for cycle lane/track, you can now filter for segregated, shared, prority at sideroads, full/part time, mandatory, stepped track, etc. These filters match the schema definition at: https://tflcid.cyclestreets.net/TfL_CID_Schema.pdf There are also a lot more images loaded now. My general impression is that the data does seem very accurate. I would welcome more eyes on this, and thoughts generally on the use of this data in OSM. Hopefully the filtering will make this easier to find various kinds of infrastructure. I am about to circulate a suggested mapping of the TfL data to OSM equivalents, where equivalent tags exist, for comments. NB The new filtering controls have a couple of URL persistency bugs - I'll mop these up shortly. So please be aware of this if sending a link. Martin, ** CycleStreets - For Cyclists, By Cyclists Developer, CycleStreets ** https://www.cyclestreets.net/ On Fri, 10 May 2019, Martin Lucas-Smith - CycleStreets wrote: Transport for London (TfL) have created a new database of cycling infrastructure, containing 240,000 assets, covering all of Greater London. This groundbreaking database contains every cycle infrastructure asset within Greater London, including assets on and off-carriageway. The assets surveyed are: cycle parking; signals; signage; traffic calming measures; restricted points (e.g. steps); advanced stop lines; crossings; cycle lanes/tracks; and restricted routes (e.g. pedestrian only routes). TfL is keen to make this available to the OpenStreetMap community under a compatible open license, to ensure maximum use of the CID. TfL is also potentially willing to consider tool development to help facilitate sensitive merging in of this data. There is a new Wiki page, giving full details, at: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/TfL_Cycling_Infrastructure_Database Demonstrator map: - A demonstrator map, for the purposes only of evaluation by the OSM community at this stage, has been created by CycleStreets. This demonstrator map contains only one of the 25 areas that have been surveyed. We are specifically seeking comments on data quality and usefulness of this data from the OSM community. Initial analysis by CycleStreets is that the data is of excellent quality, and very suitable for conflation into OSM, to increase both comprehensiveness and metadata quality. https://tflcid.cyclestreets.net/ (Use the controls on the right to change feature type.) Usage notes: The controls on the right of the map allow the different feature types to be selected. The OSM layer (available at zoom level 19+) also provides a live feed from the OSM API, to enable quick comparisons. The two photos of each asset are in the process of being supplied; those already available and cleared in GDPR terms are included in the popup. It is stressed that at this point, no permission is given for re-use of the data in any way, but TfL strongly intends to make this available in future. All 25 areas would be covered in the final data release, not merely the one shown currently in the demonstrator map. Feedback is very strongly encouraged, as soon as possible. What are people's thoughts? Martin, ** CycleStreets - For Cyclists, By Cyclists Developer, CycleStreets ** https://www.cyclestreets.net/ ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] TfL Cycling Infrastructure Database
Hi Looking at the demo I can't think of a reason why OSM would not want this data - I believe we do want this data. Questions I have - * Are the tags suitable for a global database? Can and should they be reused elsewhere in UK? or globally? Is there a need for specific prefixed TfL tags? * Are there clashes with other cycling data in London? What is a resolution strategy? * Will import and integration be performed by automatic processing? Usual OSM import rules? Clash detection and sanity checking? Regards Tony - TonyS999 On 10/06/2019 23:13, Martin Lucas-Smith - CycleStreets wrote: The demonstrator map showing this data from TfL now has an extensive set of filters for each feature type: https://tflcid.cyclestreets.net/ E.g. for cycle lane/track, you can now filter for segregated, shared, prority at sideroads, full/part time, mandatory, stepped track, etc. These filters match the schema definition at: https://tflcid.cyclestreets.net/TfL_CID_Schema.pdf There are also a lot more images loaded now. My general impression is that the data does seem very accurate. I would welcome more eyes on this, and thoughts generally on the use of this data in OSM. Hopefully the filtering will make this easier to find various kinds of infrastructure. I am about to circulate a suggested mapping of the TfL data to OSM equivalents, where equivalent tags exist, for comments. NB The new filtering controls have a couple of URL persistency bugs - I'll mop these up shortly. So please be aware of this if sending a link. Martin, ** CycleStreets - For Cyclists, By Cyclists Developer, CycleStreets ** https://www.cyclestreets.net/ On Fri, 10 May 2019, Martin Lucas-Smith - CycleStreets wrote: Transport for London (TfL) have created a new database of cycling infrastructure, containing 240,000 assets, covering all of Greater London. This groundbreaking database contains every cycle infrastructure asset within Greater London, including assets on and off-carriageway. The assets surveyed are: cycle parking; signals; signage; traffic calming measures; restricted points (e.g. steps); advanced stop lines; crossings; cycle lanes/tracks; and restricted routes (e.g. pedestrian only routes). TfL is keen to make this available to the OpenStreetMap community under a compatible open license, to ensure maximum use of the CID. TfL is also potentially willing to consider tool development to help facilitate sensitive merging in of this data. There is a new Wiki page, giving full details, at: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/TfL_Cycling_Infrastructure_Database Demonstrator map: - A demonstrator map, for the purposes only of evaluation by the OSM community at this stage, has been created by CycleStreets. This demonstrator map contains only one of the 25 areas that have been surveyed. We are specifically seeking comments on data quality and usefulness of this data from the OSM community. Initial analysis by CycleStreets is that the data is of excellent quality, and very suitable for conflation into OSM, to increase both comprehensiveness and metadata quality. https://tflcid.cyclestreets.net/ (Use the controls on the right to change feature type.) Usage notes: The controls on the right of the map allow the different feature types to be selected. The OSM layer (available at zoom level 19+) also provides a live feed from the OSM API, to enable quick comparisons. The two photos of each asset are in the process of being supplied; those already available and cleared in GDPR terms are included in the popup. It is stressed that at this point, no permission is given for re-use of the data in any way, but TfL strongly intends to make this available in future. All 25 areas would be covered in the final data release, not merely the one shown currently in the demonstrator map. Feedback is very strongly encouraged, as soon as possible. What are people's thoughts? Martin, ** CycleStreets - For Cyclists, By Cyclists Developer, CycleStreets ** https://www.cyclestreets.net/ ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] TfL Cycling Infrastructure Database
Whether we want it is not really the issue. I believe the issue is the licensing, and until that is resolved what we may or may not want is irrelevant. Tom On 11/06/2019 10:11, Tony Shield wrote: Hi Looking at the demo I can't think of a reason why OSM would not want this data - I believe we do want this data. Questions I have - * Are the tags suitable for a global database? Can and should they be reused elsewhere in UK? or globally? Is there a need for specific prefixed TfL tags? * Are there clashes with other cycling data in London? What is a resolution strategy? * Will import and integration be performed by automatic processing? Usual OSM import rules? Clash detection and sanity checking? Regards Tony - TonyS999 On 10/06/2019 23:13, Martin Lucas-Smith - CycleStreets wrote: The demonstrator map showing this data from TfL now has an extensive set of filters for each feature type: https://tflcid.cyclestreets.net/ E.g. for cycle lane/track, you can now filter for segregated, shared, prority at sideroads, full/part time, mandatory, stepped track, etc. These filters match the schema definition at: https://tflcid.cyclestreets.net/TfL_CID_Schema.pdf There are also a lot more images loaded now. My general impression is that the data does seem very accurate. I would welcome more eyes on this, and thoughts generally on the use of this data in OSM. Hopefully the filtering will make this easier to find various kinds of infrastructure. I am about to circulate a suggested mapping of the TfL data to OSM equivalents, where equivalent tags exist, for comments. NB The new filtering controls have a couple of URL persistency bugs - I'll mop these up shortly. So please be aware of this if sending a link. Martin, ** CycleStreets - For Cyclists, By Cyclists Developer, CycleStreets ** https://www.cyclestreets.net/ On Fri, 10 May 2019, Martin Lucas-Smith - CycleStreets wrote: Transport for London (TfL) have created a new database of cycling infrastructure, containing 240,000 assets, covering all of Greater London. This groundbreaking database contains every cycle infrastructure asset within Greater London, including assets on and off-carriageway. The assets surveyed are: cycle parking; signals; signage; traffic calming measures; restricted points (e.g. steps); advanced stop lines; crossings; cycle lanes/tracks; and restricted routes (e.g. pedestrian only routes). TfL is keen to make this available to the OpenStreetMap community under a compatible open license, to ensure maximum use of the CID. TfL is also potentially willing to consider tool development to help facilitate sensitive merging in of this data. There is a new Wiki page, giving full details, at: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/TfL_Cycling_Infrastructure_Database Demonstrator map: - A demonstrator map, for the purposes only of evaluation by the OSM community at this stage, has been created by CycleStreets. This demonstrator map contains only one of the 25 areas that have been surveyed. We are specifically seeking comments on data quality and usefulness of this data from the OSM community. Initial analysis by CycleStreets is that the data is of excellent quality, and very suitable for conflation into OSM, to increase both comprehensiveness and metadata quality. https://tflcid.cyclestreets.net/ (Use the controls on the right to change feature type.) Usage notes: The controls on the right of the map allow the different feature types to be selected. The OSM layer (available at zoom level 19+) also provides a live feed from the OSM API, to enable quick comparisons. The two photos of each asset are in the process of being supplied; those already available and cleared in GDPR terms are included in the popup. It is stressed that at this point, no permission is given for re-use of the data in any way, but TfL strongly intends to make this available in future. All 25 areas would be covered in the final data release, not merely the one shown currently in the demonstrator map. Feedback is very strongly encouraged, as soon as possible. What are people's thoughts? Martin, ** CycleStreets - For Cyclists, By Cyclists Developer, CycleStreets ** https://www.cyclestreets.net/ ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb -- Tom Hughes (t...@compton.nu) http://compton.nu/ ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] TfL Cycling Infrastructure Database
On Tue, 11 Jun 2019, Tony Shield wrote: Looking at the demo I can't think of a reason why OSM would not want this data - I believe we do want this data. Questions I have - * Are the tags suitable for a global database? Can and should they be reused elsewhere in UK? or globally? Is there a need for specific prefixed TfL tags? I'm about to circulate a proposed mapping of TfL's attributes to OSM tags. In some cases, there is no equivalent, e.g. signage plates/locations do not have an equivalent in OSM). In some cases I believe there are new tags that could be created, e.g. there are a lot of cyclehoop stands which are just arms bolted to an existing signpost, and which there doesn't seem to be an existing OSM tag for (surprisingly). I certainly don't believe that OSM should be creating anything London-specific or maintaining proprietary prefixing. * Are there clashes with other cycling data in London? What is a resolution strategy? * Will import and integration be performed by automatic processing? Usual OSM import rules? Clash detection and sanity checking? Clearly, there is overlap with existing OSM data, in that for instance, a high proportion of the cycle/bus lanes are present, cycle parking is sometimes present (though the TfL data seems more comprehensive to me), etc. TfL seem potentially interested in funding tool development, which in my view should be of a generic nature that supports other conflation efforts. Richard Fairhurst's new tool, and other things like the JOSM conflation tool is amongst others I am currently looking at. I would welcome any pointers to other tools that people would recommend or are aware of. It seems to me that a manual conflation process, assisted by pre-processing to weed out obvious clashes or mismatches, and with workflows optimised towards the large volume of data here (e.g. approving several nearby cycle parking locations in one go) would be the way forward. Again, any views most welcome. Martin, ** CycleStreets - For Cyclists, By Cyclists Developer, CycleStreets ** https://www.cyclestreets.net/ ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] TfL Cycling Infrastructure Database
On Tue, 11 Jun 2019, Tom Hughes wrote: Whether we want it is not really the issue. I believe the issue is the licensing, and until that is resolved what we may or may not want is irrelevant. I have been following up with TfL some of the licensing questions, and am expecting very shortly to send updated information I have from TfL to the Licensing Working Group[1]. I'm awaiting one or two further clarifications before I send that. [1] https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Licensing_Working_Group Martin, ** CycleStreets - For Cyclists, By Cyclists Developer, CycleStreets ** https://www.cyclestreets.net/ ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
[Talk-GB] TfL Cycling Infrastructure Database - conflation
Dear all, As you may recall, Transport for London (TfL) released as open data a major new cycling infrastructure dataset. Various people within the OSM UK community met TfL in the run-up to its release, and it was well-received. The OSM wiki has a project page here: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/TfL_Cycling_Infrastructure_Database and you can browse the data here: https://bikedata.cyclestreets.net/tflcid/ I'm pleased to say that TfL, through a project with London Cycling Campaign, has allocated resources to enable conversion of the data as well as officer time within TfL to help conflate what is a huge dataset. CycleStreets is working with Richard Fairhurst (cycle.travel, and of course well-known as a long-standing member of the community) to get this conversion work done. Richard will be doing the bulk of the scripting work, and is working on converting each of the sections of data. This will naturally be published on Github openly, as will the outputted data. This is reasonably complex work given the number of attributes and the data extent. We are keen to ensure the OSM community is able to scrutinise the conversion easily and have input. Richard will post to this list about the work, as it proceeds. We will be using the previously-discussed conversion table: https://bikedata.cyclestreets.net/tflcid/conversion/ https://github.com/cyclestreets/tflcid-conversion and the remaining issues will be mopped up during the work. The aim of the scripting is to get as much of the data conversion automated as possible, and matching of assets very reliable, so that the conflation (tool yet to be determined) can then be done with a high degree of confidence and as easily as possible. The conflation itself, using the output of the script, will be started by TfL personnel, with training from Richard/myself about both process and norms and quality expectations of the community. TfL only have a certain amount of time resource for this, so it is hoped the OSM community will also contribute time as we refine and document the process. As noted above, the converted data will be published along the script itself. Every asset also has two images (already publicly available) which will be useful for verification. Richard and I hope this news will be well-received within the OSM community - this is a great opportunity to enhance OSM data in London. For instance, cycle parking coverage and detail can be considerably enhanced as a result of this data. If you have feedback for TfL on the CID outside of this conflation task then they can be contacted via c...@tfl.gov.uk. Martin, ** CycleStreets - For Cyclists, By Cyclists Developer, CycleStreets ** https://www.cyclestreets.net/ ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] TfL Cycling Infrastructure Database - conflation
Martin Lucas-Smith - CycleStreets wrote: > Richard will be doing the bulk of the scripting work, and is working > on converting each of the sections of data. This will naturally be > published on Github openly, as will the outputted data. This is > reasonably complex work given the number of attributes and the > data extent. We are keen to ensure the OSM community is > able to scrutinise the conversion easily and have input. Richard > will post to this list about the work, as it proceeds. A quick update on this one: Hoo boy, there's a lot of data! The good news is that it's consistently high quality, and lots of it isn't in OSM already. Our cycle parking and speed bump coverage, for example, will be massively enhanced by this. In a few of the datasets, particularly (traffic-free) cycleways, we already have most of the information but the TfL data has identified missing items - for example, a decent shared-use path (almost a mile long) beside Snakey Lane in Feltham, shared-use paths beside the A1 in Mill Hill, and so on. The line geometries (cycleways and footways) will require a fair degree of manual work to get into OSM, obviously to ensure connectivity but also for sanity checking. The point data (cycle parking, traffic calming) etc. varies, and I've been classifying the output as "easy new data" or "needs further review" accordingly. I'll push some code and output to Github in the next few days so people can have a play. The general approach is that the TfL data is compared against an OSM PostGIS database, which means we have the full power of PostGIS's spatial analysis to help match features. Don't underestimate how complex the matching is: I've been working for 8+ days on it (lockdown's not such a bad thing...) and it's not finished yet. Currently I'm outputting GeoJSON for easy visualisation, but depending on the conflation tools eventually used, there'll almost certainly be .osm files too. There is an elephant in the room, and that's the (on-road, painted) cycle lane data. Once again, this is really high quality data. It's all new tags on existing ways (because we have all the roads mapped), but because it'll mean splitting the ways to get the extents right, it'll be a challenge for conflation. I'm currently thinking through the best approach for this, but again, I think it'll ultimately involve classifying the data into levels of confidence: "this is already in OSM", "this can be added easily", "this will need further review", etc. etc. As Martin set out, TfL have dedicated some time to training up their staff and working on the data. That'll work well for cycle parking etc., but the in-depth work on cycle lane attributes is almost certainly going to be best done by experienced OSM mappers. Once I've got the first set of output up on Github it would be great to take a steer from interested people as to what they'd find most helpful. cheers Richard -- Sent from: http://gis.19327.n8.nabble.com/Great-Britain-f5372682.html ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] TfL Cycling Infrastructure Database - conflation
Sounds great. I have used Ilya's OSM Conflate tool for point data in the past. That might be a good option and could be adapted to show the TfL photos. Probably best to split by region to keep the task manageable. BTW. the lockdown means more people are looking at ways to give back. There was an article about crowdsourcing to digitise handwritten rain / weather reports. A big success. I wonder if we can find a good OSM project to promote. Would need to be simple and hard to make a mistake. Need not be TfL data related. Best regards Rob -- Sent from: http://gis.19327.n8.nabble.com/Great-Britain-f5372682.html ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb