Re: [Talk-it] addr:place

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

sent from a phone

> Am 31.08.2015 um 09:38 schrieb Andrea Musuruane :
> 
> Secondo me no. Altrimenti dovremmo anche scrivere "Città di Torino", "Comune 
> di Settimo Torinese", ecc..


dipende dal nome ufficiale. Potrebbe avere senso mettere Città di Torino nel 
tag official_name
(non lo metterei in name perché non mi sembra usuale su una mappa).

ciao 
Martin  
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Re: [Talk-it] addr:place

[Andrea Musuruane]

On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 9:33 AM, demon.box  wrote:

> dvdzero wrote
> > Io "Località" lo metterei. Come per addr:street scriviamo "Via"
>
> Hai ragione!
>

Secondo me no. Altrimenti dovremmo anche scrivere "Città di Torino",
"Comune di Settimo Torinese", ecc..

Ciao,

Andrea
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Re: [Talk-it] addr:place

[dani rijeka]

Il 31/Ago/2015 09:39, "Andrea Musuruane"  ha scritto:
>
> On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 9:33 AM, demon.box  wrote:
>>
>> dvdzero wrote
>> > Io "Località" lo metterei. Come per addr:street scriviamo "Via"
>>
>> Hai ragione!
>
>
> Secondo me no. Altrimenti dovremmo anche scrivere "Città di Torino",
"Comune di Settimo Torinese", ecc..
>
> Ciao,
>
> Andrea
>
>
>
Quella è una divisione amministrativa, non è parte dell'indirizzo come lo
può essere "località" dove non ci sono nomi di vie (es: in luogo di "via Q,
29 - 32035 Santa Giustina (BL) " si ha "località Campel, 29 - 32035 Santa
Giustina (BL)")
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Re: [Talk-it] addr:place

[dvdzero]

Damjan Gerli wrote
 Il nome in addr:place dovrebbe essere quello usato nel corrispondente tag
 place:xyz=XY (es. place:village, hamlet, ecc.) che dovrebbe esistere.
 Quindi io metterei senza Località.

Io Località lo metterei. Come per addr:street scriviamo Via



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Re: [Talk-it] addr:place

[Damjan Gerl]

  ed eventualmente metto
  
  addr:place=Località XY
  
  oppure
  
  addr:place=XY soltanto?
 
 va usato il nome ufficiale (probabilmente metterei Località XY) come da 
 indirizzo postale
 
 
 ciao Martin 

Il nome in addr:place dovrebbe essere quello usato nel corrispondente tag 
place:xyz=XY (es. place:village, hamlet, ecc.) che dovrebbe esistere.
Quindi io metterei senza Località.

Ciao
Damjan

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Re: [Talk-it] addr:place

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

sent from a phone

 Am 25.08.2015 um 15:31 schrieb demon.box e.rossin...@alice.it:
 
 scusate se ho un ristorante che si trova in Località XY numero 10,
 
 utilizzo il tag addr:place?


si
(insieme agli altri tags addr, praticamente addr:place sostituisce addr:street 
in questi casi)



 
 ed eventualmente metto
 
 addr:place=Località XY
 
 oppure
 
 addr:place=XY soltanto?


va usato il nome ufficiale (probabilmente metterei Località XY) come da 
indirizzo postale


ciao Martin 

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Re: [Talk-GB] addr:place (was: UK Retail chains)

[Andy Street]

On Sun, 26 Oct 2014 07:28:42 +
SK53 sk53@gmail.com wrote:

 The tag addr:place has been used to locate one element inside another
 addressed element. See this example for shops within a Tesco Extra
 store http://overpass-turbo.eu/s/5CN.

Surely that could be inferred from the fact that the object is
spatially within the parent?

 This usage is useful but probably a little difficult to consume,
 particularly as there seem to be rather more usages of addr:place as a
 synonym of addr:city.

The way I've always undersood addr:place was not as a synonym
for addr:city but rather to specify the bit of the address between
the road (addr:street) and the post town (addr:city).

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Re: [Talk-GB] addr:place

[Will Phillips]

On 26/10/2014 10:36, Andy Street wrote:

On Sun, 26 Oct 2014 07:28:42 +
SK53 sk53@gmail.com wrote:


The tag addr:place has been used to locate one element inside another
addressed element. See this example for shops within a Tesco Extra
store http://overpass-turbo.eu/s/5CN.

Surely that could be inferred from the fact that the object is
spatially within the parent?


Sure it can, but I think there is something to be said for tagging 
things explicitly. I would only tag it in this way when it is part of 
the official address.



This usage is useful but probably a little difficult to consume,
particularly as there seem to be rather more usages of addr:place as a
synonym of addr:city.

The way I've always undersood addr:place was not as a synonym
for addr:city but rather to specify the bit of the address between
the road (addr:street) and the post town (addr:city).


My understanding has always been that addr:place is similar to 
addr:street, except when the unit in question isn't a street but some 
other grouping of addresses such as a business park, retail park or 
shopping centre, which serves a similar function to a street in the 
address.


For example:
Unit 5
XYZ Retail Park
Suburb
City

As far as I'm aware this has been what the wiki has said since the tag 
was first proposed and I remember mailing list discussions broadly 
agreeing. The wiki page - 
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:addr:place - does explicitly 
state it shouldn't be used instead of addr:suburb.


It's unfortunate when a tag is used by different people to mean 
substantially different things, because it makes the data less useful. I 
think there should be a wiki page dedicated to UK addresses, which would 
suggest best practices for tagging more complicated addresses. The only 
reason I haven't already created one is the lack of discussion and 
consensus over issues like parent/subsidiary streets, usage of 
addr:interpolation on buildings, and so on.



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Re: [Talk-GB] addr:place

[Andy Street]

On Sun, 26 Oct 2014 13:11:39 +
Will Phillips wp4...@gmail.com wrote:

 My understanding has always been that addr:place is similar to 
 addr:street, except when the unit in question isn't a street but some 
 other grouping of addresses such as a business park, retail park or 
 shopping centre, which serves a similar function to a street in the 
 address.

So far I've been tagging addresses like this:

addr:housename = Enterprise House
addr:site  = The Business Park
addr:street= High Street
addr:place = Locality
addr:city  = Posttown
addr:postcode  = AB12 3CD
addr:country   = GB

 As far as I'm aware this has been what the wiki has said since the
 tag was first proposed and I remember mailing list discussions
 broadly agreeing. The wiki page - 
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:addr:place - does explicitly 
 state it shouldn't be used instead of addr:suburb.

It certainly appears that I have been tagging wrongly given the wiki
page you cite. Frankly I find the whole address tagging schema rather
confusing as many of the tags are either too specific (housenumber
needn't be a house nor city a city) or too vague (place). There is
also an issue when reading the data of which way to order the various
tags, especially when people mix in district, province, state,
etc. 

 It's unfortunate when a tag is used by different people to mean 
 substantially different things, because it makes the data less
 useful. I think there should be a wiki page dedicated to UK
 addresses, which would suggest best practices for tagging more
 complicated addresses. The only reason I haven't already created one
 is the lack of discussion and consensus over issues like
 parent/subsidiary streets, usage of addr:interpolation on buildings,
 and so on.

I've largely given up on adding addresses in OSM but if I were to
resume then I'd certainly find it helpful if we had a wiki page with
clear and concise examples of how to map GB addresses.

-- 
Regards,

Andy Street

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Re: [Talk-GB] addr:place

[Chris Hill]

On 26/10/14 19:02, Andy Street wrote:

On Sun, 26 Oct 2014 13:11:39 +
Will Phillips wp4...@gmail.com wrote:


My understanding has always been that addr:place is similar to
addr:street, except when the unit in question isn't a street but some
other grouping of addresses such as a business park, retail park or
shopping centre, which serves a similar function to a street in the
address.

So far I've been tagging addresses like this:

addr:housename = Enterprise House
addr:site  = The Business Park
addr:street= High Street
addr:place = Locality
addr:city  = Posttown
addr:postcode  = AB12 3CD
addr:country   = GB

The last thing I would include in OSM addressing is the confusing and 
wholly unjustifiable post town as defined by Royal Mail. I live in a 
village in its own civil parish and completely separate from a nearby 
village that Royal Fail insist is my postal town. This postal town is a 
village; it has nothing at all to do with my village except that my post 
is delivered from a small office there. When I quote my postcode, 
companies who use Royal Fail's PAF conclude that I live in the next door 
village rather than the one I actually live in. When a delivery is sent 
here, the CARP or sat-nav -generated route sends the driver to my door 
in a village that is not always on the delivery note (because that 
wrongly has the postal town on it), causing problems including abandoned 
deliveries.


We in OSM can do SO much better and we must not use the imaginary, 
spurious and wholly wrong concept of Royal Fail's postal town. Postal 
towns are not real and have no place in OSM.


One good thing is that Royal Fail has finally removed Humberside from 
the PAF. In fact they had North  South Humberside in the PAF when only 
Humberside ever existed. Humberside was abolished in 1996, so Royal Fail 
are really good at keeping up.


We can do SO much better.

--
Cheers, Chris
user: chillly


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Re: [Talk-GB] addr:place

[Brad Rogers]

On Sun, 26 Oct 2014 19:27:11 +
Chris Hill o...@raggedred.net wrote:

Hello Chris,

Like you, I live in a different parish than the one RM route my post
through.

spurious and wholly wrong concept of Royal Fail's postal town. Postal 

I agree it's a shame that so many people attribute so much value to
RM's postal address.  After all it was, and remains, designed for
*their* purposes only.  That is, the purpose of routing mail
deliveries.  Nothing more.

-- 
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 / )   The blindingly obvious is
/ _)radnever immediately apparent
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Re: [Talk-GB] addr:place

[phil]

On Sun Oct 26 2014 19:34:14 GMT+ (GMT), Brad Rogers wrote:
 On Sun, 26 Oct 2014 19:27:11 +
 Chris Hill o...@raggedred.net wrote:
 
 Hello Chris,
 
 Like you, I live in a different parish than the one RM route my post
 through.
 
 spurious and wholly wrong concept of Royal Fail's postal town. Postal 
 
 I agree it's a shame that so many people attribute so much value to
 RM's postal address.  After all it was, and remains, designed for
 *their* purposes only.  That is, the purpose of routing mail
 deliveries.  Nothing more.

Absolutely,  would be so good to put the postcode genie back in the bottle.

Postal addresses are the reason Donington Park is referred to as  The 
Derbyshire Circuit by geographicakk ignorant motor racing commentators, its in 
Leicestershire.

Ramblers are assigned to wrong county as a result of postcodes,  it took some 
work to convince London office staff that that Castle Donnngton, Kegworth, 
Measham, Moira are in Leicestershire. 

Its a shame grid references are not taught in schools, they are as simple to 
use and remember. They give geographic  meaning, I can see instantly that SK53 
lives in an area 100km east and 10km north of me. 

Phil (trigpoint)

 

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