[Texascavers] TCMA Auction at the Spring Convention

[Linda Palit]

First, Anybody hear of any good caves for purchase?  WE are looking, and we
need you to look also, and let us know if you see anything.  Make sure your
cave contacts know that when or IF they decide to sell, we'd like to know
and have a chance to preserve their cave.  But please, be sensitive to land
owner relations and don't scare the owners.

 

Now, the real purpose of this message.  TSA Spring Convention is just a
little over a month away, and it's going to be a great one.  And we will
have another TCMA Auction to raise money to purchase more caves.  The
Auction depends on you to make it great, so search for that perfect donation
that will make every Bidder up the price!  We have local contacts working
all over the state,  so pass me the information and we'll get back to you.  

 

Thanks, and hope you're caving this weekend!

Linda

[Texascavers] TCMA News

[Linda Palit]

Texas Cave Management Association has begun to send out a monthly email
newsletter which will include opportunities for volunteering, projects, cave
trips, and information about the organization.  This will be a brief update,
sent out once a month, (hopefully).  We will not share your mailing
information or stuff your mailbox.  If you want to subscribe to this list,
send an e-mail to tcma-list-subscr...@tcmacaves.org . If you want to help
put this letter out, contact me.

 

Thanks, 

Linda

 

[ot_caving] the border wall

[David]

Reliable sources have told me that Mexicans living in the nicer
neighborhoods of Monterrey, plan to build a giant long wall separating
the community from the poor neighborhoods.

Is that hypocritical or what?

I have heard that Mexicans don't like Central Americans living
in their country and wish that they would just keep on moving north
to the U.S.A.

Isn't that hypocritcal?  I mean how much difference is there really
between a poor Huastecan and a poor indian from Honduras?

They both wear sandals made out of used tires. Right??

I have always felt that we should encourage certain minority
communities in Mississippi that are living permanently on welfare to
migrate to Mexico or Central America.  Let's see how much
the Latinos would like all them living down there and collecting
Mexican Food Stamps and subsidized medical care and just
sitting on their front porch day after day watching the cars
go by??

David Locklear

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[Texascavers] Bourdain Goes Caving

[Gill Ediger]

At 03:10 PM 2/20/2008, Don Cooper wrote:

Anyone who eats bats shall illicit nothing but scorn from me.


They were dead. Why  not eat um?

[elicit, methinks]

--Ediger


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Re: [Texascavers] Anthony Bourdain Goes Caving on the Travel Channel

[Don Cooper]

Hmmm - hundreds in a box
That overkills just three by quite a margin!
-WaV

On Wed, Feb 20, 2008 at 4:03 PM, Fritz Holt 
wrote:

>  When it comes to primary sources of light for caving, do kitchen matches
> constitute "poorly equipped"? There are a lot of them in a box.
> Geezer spelunker
>
>  --
> *From:* Don Cooper [mailto:wavyca...@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 20, 2008 3:45 PM
> *To:* Philip L Moss
> *Cc:* Cavers, Texas
> *Subject:* Re: [Texascavers] Anthony Bourdain Goes Caving on the Travel
> Channel
>
> Actually -
> On my last caving trip I was not planning on doing any caving at all.  All
> my caving gear had been loaned out.
> I got talked into it and did so with a borrowed helmet and lousy light
> that failed - as luck had it - no backup, but of course I was not alone and
> another of my party did have a fine LED backup.
> This obviously is not how it should be done.
> I did make exceptions to the "golden rules" of caving and survived
> nonetheless.  I don't intend to make a habit of it.
> At least I DID have a good pair of boots (and borrowed elbow and knee
> pads.  Thanks to David C.!)
> I mean - if Bourdain knew what he was getting into - I figure he'd been
> better equipped or otherwise he'd simply turn down the opportunity.
> -WaV
>
> On Mon, Feb 18, 2008 at 3:26 PM, Philip L Moss 
> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > On Wed, 20 Feb 2008 12:18:28 -0800 (PST) John Brooks <
> > jpbrook...@sbcglobal.net> writes:
> >
> > Yeah..I bet none of us have been caving while "poorly equipped"...
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> >
> >
> > While many of us have undoubtedly caved while poorly equipped, I think
> > that there is an important distinction between what is done discreetly and
> > what is done in a public setting such as TV and newspapers.  In my
> > experience, people learn much more from what they see and do, than from what
> > they are told.
> >
> > If one leads a group of new people and tells them that each should have
> > three independent sources of light, but that because this cave is easy or
> > because of the large group, or we aren't going far in we have made an
> > exception and you can get by with a flashlight, then what they have learned
> > is that it is OK to cave with one flashlight.
> >
> > There are many good rules to safe caving that should be viewed as
> > inviolable to beginners but must have some flexibility to deal with risks as
> > evaluated by a highly experienced caver.
> >
> > Call it hypocritical if you must.  However, safety is enhanced by
> > discouraging new people from learning the hard way about risk analysis.
> >
> > Philip L. Moss
> > philipm...@juno.com
> >
>
>

Re: [ot_caving] the economy

[Don Cooper]

Wierd as it sounds, Political factions in Mexico already have plans for
absorbing the state of Texas.
The possibility of a complete financial failure of the federal government is
just as real as what actually happened to the former USSR.
The fact that everything is running in a state of 'non-sustainability'
points to the reality of a future collapse.  As it exists - the collapse is
inevitable.
If sweeping (and terribly inconvenient) changes are not made - the question
is not "IF" but "WHEN"...
-WaV

On Wed, Feb 20, 2008 at 3:57 PM, David  wrote:

> I have been listening to a few economist throwing numbers
> the last few days.
>
> In my opinion, these guys seem to be using out of date
> theories on the economy.
>
> In my neck of the woods, I see everybody driving a $ 35,000 car, and
> living in a $ 180,000 house.   All their income goes to paying those
> and what little they have left over, goes to purchase goods made in
> China, and electronic gadgets made in Japan or Taiwan.
>
> Back when the economy was supposedly good ( late 1950's ??? ) people
> lived in simple houses near their jobs. They drove cars that were
> 10 years old, but were easy to repair.  They didn't work 60 hour
> weeks, and pay money in so many fees that we now consider normal,
> Cell phone tax fees, NSF charges, credit card interest, etc.
>
> I also feel that military spending is giving our economy a false sense
> of strength.  If you suddenly stopped military spending, our nation
> would collapse economically.  I am saying we are much
> like the old Soviet Union, in that economic sense.
>
> There is a lot of optimism out there.  Unfortunately, deep down inside
> I think I have a pessimistic feeling about the future of the ole U.S. of
> A.
>
> Eventually, some state is going to declare independece.   The world
> will immediately cheer them on.  And then other states will follow,
> Alaska, Hawaii, Oregon, Washington, Nevada, and even Texas.
>
> I think we need to run the U.S. Government like a business. Lets get
> rid of the dead wood.  Lets sell Mississippi and Louisiana to France.
> Lets forget about Puerto Rico and Guam and Somoa.  Lets sell
> southern Texas back to Mexico, or make it some kind of lawless buffer
> zone between the 2 countries.  And lets let the woman in prison
> make a little tax revenue on the side.
>
> David Locklear
>
> -
> Give this to a friend: ot-subscr...@texascavers.com
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: ot-unsubscr...@texascavers.com
> For additional commands, e-mail: ot-h...@texascavers.com
>
>

RE: [Texascavers] Anthony Bourdain Goes Caving on the Travel Channel

[Fritz Holt]

When it comes to primary sources of light for caving, do kitchen matches
constitute "poorly equipped"? There are a lot of them in a box.
Geezer spelunker

  _  

From: Don Cooper [mailto:wavyca...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 3:45 PM
To: Philip L Moss
Cc: Cavers, Texas
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Anthony Bourdain Goes Caving on the Travel
Channel


Actually -
On my last caving trip I was not planning on doing any caving at all.
All my caving gear had been loaned out.
I got talked into it and did so with a borrowed helmet and lousy light
that failed - as luck had it - no backup, but of course I was not alone
and another of my party did have a fine LED backup.
This obviously is not how it should be done.
I did make exceptions to the "golden rules" of caving and survived
nonetheless.  I don't intend to make a habit of it.
At least I DID have a good pair of boots (and borrowed elbow and knee
pads.  Thanks to David C.!)
I mean - if Bourdain knew what he was getting into - I figure he'd been
better equipped or otherwise he'd simply turn down the opportunity.
-WaV


On Mon, Feb 18, 2008 at 3:26 PM, Philip L Moss 
wrote:


 
 
On Wed, 20 Feb 2008 12:18:28 -0800 (PST) John Brooks
 writes:

Yeah..I bet none of us have been caving while "poorly
equipped"...

Sent from my iPhone

 

While many of us have undoubtedly caved while poorly equipped, I
think that there is an important distinction between what is done
discreetly and what is done in a public setting such as TV and
newspapers.  In my experience, people learn much more from what they see
and do, than from what they are told.
 
If one leads a group of new people and tells them that each
should have three independent sources of light, but that because this
cave is easy or because of the large group, or we aren't going far in we
have made an exception and you can get by with a flashlight, then what
they have learned is that it is OK to cave with one flashlight.
 
There are many good rules to safe caving that should be viewed
as inviolable to beginners but must have some flexibility to deal with
risks as evaluated by a highly experienced caver.
 
Call it hypocritical if you must.  However, safety is enhanced
by discouraging new people from learning the hard way about risk
analysis.

Philip L. Moss
philipm...@juno.com

[ot_caving] the economy

[David]

I have been listening to a few economist throwing numbers
the last few days.

In my opinion, these guys seem to be using out of date
theories on the economy.

In my neck of the woods, I see everybody driving a $ 35,000 car, and
living in a $ 180,000 house.   All their income goes to paying those
and what little they have left over, goes to purchase goods made in
China, and electronic gadgets made in Japan or Taiwan.

Back when the economy was supposedly good ( late 1950's ??? ) people
lived in simple houses near their jobs. They drove cars that were
10 years old, but were easy to repair.  They didn't work 60 hour
weeks, and pay money in so many fees that we now consider normal,
Cell phone tax fees, NSF charges, credit card interest, etc.

I also feel that military spending is giving our economy a false sense
of strength.  If you suddenly stopped military spending, our nation
would collapse economically.  I am saying we are much
like the old Soviet Union, in that economic sense.

There is a lot of optimism out there.  Unfortunately, deep down inside
I think I have a pessimistic feeling about the future of the ole U.S. of A.

Eventually, some state is going to declare independece.   The world
will immediately cheer them on.  And then other states will follow,
Alaska, Hawaii, Oregon, Washington, Nevada, and even Texas.

I think we need to run the U.S. Government like a business. Lets get
rid of the dead wood.  Lets sell Mississippi and Louisiana to France.
Lets forget about Puerto Rico and Guam and Somoa.  Lets sell
southern Texas back to Mexico, or make it some kind of lawless buffer
zone between the 2 countries.  And lets let the woman in prison
make a little tax revenue on the side.

David Locklear

-
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Re: [Texascavers] Anthony Bourdain Goes Caving on the Travel Channel

[Don Cooper]

Actually -
On my last caving trip I was not planning on doing any caving at all.  All
my caving gear had been loaned out.
I got talked into it and did so with a borrowed helmet and lousy light that
failed - as luck had it - no backup, but of course I was not alone and
another of my party did have a fine LED backup.
This obviously is not how it should be done.
I did make exceptions to the "golden rules" of caving and survived
nonetheless.  I don't intend to make a habit of it.
At least I DID have a good pair of boots (and borrowed elbow and knee pads.
Thanks to David C.!)
I mean - if Bourdain knew what he was getting into - I figure he'd been
better equipped or otherwise he'd simply turn down the opportunity.
-WaV

On Mon, Feb 18, 2008 at 3:26 PM, Philip L Moss  wrote:

>
>
> On Wed, 20 Feb 2008 12:18:28 -0800 (PST) John Brooks <
> jpbrook...@sbcglobal.net> writes:
>
> Yeah..I bet none of us have been caving while "poorly equipped"...
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> While many of us have undoubtedly caved while poorly equipped, I think
> that there is an important distinction between what is done discreetly and
> what is done in a public setting such as TV and newspapers.  In my
> experience, people learn much more from what they see and do, than from what
> they are told.
>
> If one leads a group of new people and tells them that each should have
> three independent sources of light, but that because this cave is easy or
> because of the large group, or we aren't going far in we have made an
> exception and you can get by with a flashlight, then what they have learned
> is that it is OK to cave with one flashlight.
>
> There are many good rules to safe caving that should be viewed as
> inviolable to beginners but must have some flexibility to deal with risks as
> evaluated by a highly experienced caver.
>
> Call it hypocritical if you must.  However, safety is enhanced by
> discouraging new people from learning the hard way about risk analysis.
>
> Philip L. Moss
> philipm...@juno.com
>

Re: [Texascavers] Anthony Bourdain Goes Caving on the Travel Channel

[Philip L Moss]

On Wed, 20 Feb 2008 12:18:28 -0800 (PST) John Brooks
 writes:
Yeah..I bet none of us have been caving while "poorly equipped"...

Sent from my iPhone

 
While many of us have undoubtedly caved while poorly equipped, I think
that there is an important distinction between what is done discreetly
and what is done in a public setting such as TV and newspapers.  In my
experience, people learn much more from what they see and do, than from
what they are told.

If one leads a group of new people and tells them that each should have
three independent sources of light, but that because this cave is easy or
because of the large group, or we aren't going far in we have made an
exception and you can get by with a flashlight, then what they have
learned is that it is OK to cave with one flashlight.

There are many good rules to safe caving that should be viewed as
inviolable to beginners but must have some flexibility to deal with risks
as evaluated by a highly experienced caver.

Call it hypocritical if you must.  However, safety is enhanced by
discouraging new people from learning the hard way about risk analysis.

Philip L. Moss
philipm...@juno.com

[Texascavers] Check your GPS at the Chinese border

[Diana Tomchick]

For awhile now it's been my goal to eventually visit the famed karst  
areas of China. This last weekend, while attending the President's  
Day Expedition at Mammoth Cave, I picked up a copy of "Tianxing  
2001-2003," the latest report from the Hong Megui Cave Exploration  
Society (edited by Erin Lynch and Duncan Collis, $16 from  
Speleobooks, see http://www.hongmeigui.net/). This impressive 35 page  
full color publication has only whetted my appetite for visiting (and  
surveying caves) in China.


Now some distressing news about China has appeared in this week's  
issue of Nature magazine; I pasted the text of this article below.


I guess if you're planning to go, be careful what means you use to  
record cave locations.


Diana

--

Check Your GPS at the Border

Foreign researchers fall foul of monitoring restrictions in China.

by David Cyranoski

Foreign researchers working in China are falling foul of laws  
restricting environmental monitoring and use of Global Positioning  
System (GPS) equipment. Geologists, botanists, environmental  
scientists and meteorologists have been affected. Even those who  
believed that they were within the law and were collaborating with  
Chinese researchers have lost data, been detained and had equipment  
confiscated.


According to the State Bureau of Surveying and Mapping, in 2006 there  
were 759 cases of illegal geographical surveys and mapping, many of  
which involved foreigners. And there have been 20 cases of illegal  
meteorological surveys by foreigners since 2000. Last year, two new  
stricter laws governing data collection were introduced to “protect  
national security”: these were Measures for the Administration of  
Foreign-related Meteorological Sounding and Information, introduced  
in January; and Measures Governing the Surveying and Mapping in China  
by Foreign Organizations or Individuals, in March. The new laws  
require projects to be approved by the China Meteorological  
Administration or the State Bureau of Surveying and Mapping, in  
addition to the current approval processes, and stipulate that any  
data are gathered and interpreted jointly with Chinese counterparts.


Some experts believe that the stricter meteorological laws were  
introduced in reaction to a presentation of environmental data at a  
conference in Hong Kong in May 2006 that, according to the official  
Chinese press, “amplified China's environmental problems to draw more  
attention to their research, heedless to the fact that data collected  
in polluted areas doesn't represent the norm in China”. The research  
had been carried out in collaboration with Chinese scientists, but  
Chinese officials say that the research was published “unilaterally”,  
in violation of a previously agreed arrangement.


But the laws are not well known in China or abroad. Jefferson Fox of  
the East–West Center at the University of Hawaii, and his  
collaborator Jianchu Xu, of the Kunming Institute of Botany in Yunnan  
province, were stunned when in February 2007, local security officers  
dismantled their field stations in southwestern Yunnan province. The  
scientists were comparing field data with Landsat satellite data, in  
a project to assess the impact of rubber-tree monocultures on  
hydrology and land cover.


Some equipment was returned a week later, but many of the cables had  
been cut and underground soil-moisture sensors were lost, resulting  
in damage worth more than US$20,000 and curtailing the study halfway  
through. “We were just starting to get very good data,” says Fox. “It  
was just a bad experience.”


Ramón Arrowsmith, a geologist at Arizona State University in Tempe,  
was similarly disturbed when local officials came to his team's hotel  
by the Altyn Tagh fault, near the border between the Tibet and  
Xinjiang autonomous regions in western China in March 2007. With  
Chinese counterparts, Arrowsmith was studying the record of deformity  
— ridges and humps — along the fault line to understand the history  
of the Indo–Asian plate collision. The officials objected to his use  
of GPS equipment, the kind, Arrowsmith says, that can be purchased  
cheaply at a camping-equipment store.


Arrowsmith tried unsuccessfully to convince the officials that he was  
only measuring specific geological features relative to each other,  
not absolute topography. “It was scientifically very interesting, but  
from a general perspective, this was a really boring project,” he  
says. Despite having received permission to do research through his  
visa application and from the local nature reserve, Arrowsmith and  
his team were detained in their hotel for 10 days before being  
allowed to leave China. “They were not abusive, but it was  
stressful,” he says. “We're not used to being questioned.”


The Chinese official media has reported copious other transgressors  
over the past year, including several Japanese groups. The  
meteorological administr

Re: [Texascavers] Anthony Bourdain Goes Caving on the Travel Channel

[John Brooks]

Yeah..I bet none of us have been caving while "poorly equipped"...

Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 20, 2008, at 2:10 PM, "Don Cooper"  wrote:

Yeah -
I think I saw that episode.  The guy certainly has a lot of charisma - I cannot 
help but to like him - but as "an outdoorsman" I think he's a little bit on the 
wimpy side.  I found it hard to believe he'd go 'caving' so poorly equipped.
(On top of that he smokes cigarettes.  Da fool!)
Another "eat anything go everywhere" character I've seen on the Travel Channel 
is Andrew Zimmer - that guy I have to dislike!  Anyone who eats bats shall 
illicit nothing but scorn from me.  
-WaV

On Feb 19, 2008 7:34 AM,  wrote:
 
Anyone catch the irreverent travel host and world renowned foodie on the Travel 
Channel last night?
 
He went caving in Jamaica and, from all appearances, had a miserable time.
 
Part of the problem may be that his intrepid guides had him wearing tennis 
shoes into a muddy cave, no gloves or knee pads, trekking thru jungle with 200% 
humidity,
and he seemed particularly concerned about "anal invading parasites".
 
Can't blame him on the latter point!
 
He will eat the most gosh awful food (watch the Namibia episode to watch him 
partake of a certain delicacy from the back end of a warthog to see what I 
mean),
but I wouldn't count on him making any Grotto meetings.
 
If you missed it, they're running it again on Feb. 23rd at 1 PM.
 
Set them DVR's!
 
 
Later,
 
Mark
 
 
 

Re: [Texascavers] Anthony Bourdain Goes Caving on the Travel Channel

[Don Cooper]

Yeah -
I think I saw that episode.  The guy certainly has a lot of charisma - I
cannot help but to like him - but as "an outdoorsman" I think he's a little
bit on the wimpy side.  I found it hard to believe he'd go 'caving' so
poorly equipped.
(On top of that he smokes cigarettes.  Da fool!)
Another "eat anything go everywhere" character I've seen on the Travel
Channel is Andrew Zimmer - that guy I have to dislike!  Anyone who eats bats
shall illicit nothing but scorn from me.
-WaV

On Feb 19, 2008 7:34 AM,  wrote:

>
> Anyone catch the irreverent travel host and world renowned foodie on the
> Travel Channel last night?
>
> He went caving in Jamaica and, from all appearances, had a miserable time.
>
> Part of the problem may be that his intrepid guides had him wearing tennis
> shoes into a muddy cave, no gloves or knee pads, trekking thru jungle with
> 200% humidity,
> and he seemed particularly concerned about "anal invading parasites".
>
> Can't blame him on the latter point!
>
> He will eat the most gosh awful food (watch the Namibia episode to watch
> him partake of a certain delicacy from the back end of a warthog to see what
> I mean),
> but I wouldn't count on him making any Grotto meetings.
>
> If you missed it, they're running it again on Feb. 23rd at 1 PM.
>
> Set them DVR's!
>
>
> Later,
>
> Mark
>
>
>
>

Re: [ot_caving] laptop news - Dell and Linux

[Don Cooper]

I like using Linux because its not microsoft.
I know that's like saying I'm a Democrat because I despise George, and
perhaps I am a little bit brash like that...  But *I am am a staunch
"anti-consumerist"* and the trend to update machine hungry O/S with
increasingly powerful machines irks me.  I feel the trend is reflected in
everything from the size of new homes to god-awful SUVs that everyone
appears to think they're entitled to.   I hate it.
OK - now I've spoken from MY soapbox.
Unfortunately - for everything which open-sourced Linux has hoped to be -
I've never found it to be faster than the seasonal version of Windows.
(Well, Redhat version 7 might appear to be faster than XP...)
XP, being more stable than other versions of the Windows O/S I've used - is
what I'm running on my heavy old patched-up antiquated Compaq Armada.  I'd
be using Linux on it, except that I was never able to get all the right
drivers to work in order to make that a useful alternative.
(Linux on Laptops has, for years, been a challenge to configure).
I do not intend to use Vista - not if I can help it.
I hope that hardware in the future will not change so much that XP will fail
to be compatible,
If so - I will be using Linux - or maybe I'll "Go Mac"!
-WaV


On Feb 20, 2008 12:58 PM, Charles Goldsmith  wrote:

> David, I've been a linux/unix users for almost 10 years now, my
> primary workstation here at work is currently an ubuntu box.  I've
> used redhat, freebsd, ubuntu/kubuntu and suse here at work, along of
> course with windows 2k/xp and I'm happy with ubuntu right now.
>
> Any of the BSD flavors would be my preference, but they make better
> servers than workstations.  With ubuntu, I get Macromedia Flash,
> windows video/audio codecs and better sound support than I do with
> BSD, which is the main reason I switched to Ubuntu.
>
> Because of my corporate network, with everyone using Microsoft Office
> products, I also have an XP box, but it runs in a VMWare session
> (virtualized windows), mainly for my Outlook and Lotus Notes, plus the
> odd webpage that requires IE and won't run on Firebird.
>
> You mentioned browsing with Linux, and true, you are much, much safer
> browsing websites with a non-windows box, whether it be Linux or Mac.
> My mac at home and my linux box here at work don't have anti-virus,
> anti-spyware or any of the other anti-ware products on them, I don't
> have to worry about it.
>
> I can do just about anything on my linux/mac boxes that can be done on
> a windows box, and where I can't, there is a virtualized instance of
> XP that I can easily backup/restore (since its just another directory
> on my workstation).  The biggest thing for the office that linux/mac
> is missing out on is Microsoft Office.  I know there are alternatives,
> openoffice, staroffice, google apps, but none of them can touch the
> usability of M$ Office.  I've tried them all and it just doesn't work
> out as well.  Mac has an older office, but with 2007 Office, there
> isn't a Mac alternative yet.
>
> Ok, I'll get off my box now :)
>
> Charles
>
> On 2/20/08, David  wrote:
> > According to the web-site below, you will be able to order a
> > laptop with Linux instead of Vista in the very near future.
> >
> > http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS2937357707.html
> >
> > In my opinion, this is good news. Vista runs poorly on
> > your average laptop. The graphic improvements are not
> > really noticeable on a small laptop screen.  For example,
> > the Sidebar gadgets, take up space on a laptop screen.
> >
> > The main problem with Linux is that people just haven't
> > realized its potential yet.  It will be difficult to find
> > compatible peripherals ( printers, etc ) for the non-geek.
> >
> > But Linux is great for doing what the average person does
> > on a computer ( i.e. type letters, play games, listen to
> > MP3's, send e-mail) and in my opinion it is far
> > better for surfing the web.
> >
> > I think if you compared the latest release of Ubuntu
> > ( the Linux version that Dell is using ) to an older version
> > of Windows such as Windows 95, it would be clear
> > that Linux has a lot of potential.
> >
> > Had Bill Gates not been so greedy and supported
> > the free Linux community, we would probably have a really
> > good operating system now, instead of having to wait
> > another 10 years ( or having to fork out the money for a MAC ).
> >
> > David Locklear
> >
> > -
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Re: [ot_caving] Ladybugs

[Don Cooper]

Well there you go!
Thanks for the link Quinta -  I was worried that perhaps it was due to a
favorable habitat due to 'wood rot' or something like that...
-WaV

On Feb 20, 2008 11:34 AM, CaverArch  wrote:

>  Quinta,
>
> Thanks for the great link that 'explains it all.'
>
> Roger
>
> --
> Supercharge your AIM. Get the AIM 
> toolbarfor
>  your browser.
>

Re: [ot_caving] laptop news - Dell and Linux

[Charles Goldsmith]

David, I've been a linux/unix users for almost 10 years now, my
primary workstation here at work is currently an ubuntu box.  I've
used redhat, freebsd, ubuntu/kubuntu and suse here at work, along of
course with windows 2k/xp and I'm happy with ubuntu right now.

Any of the BSD flavors would be my preference, but they make better
servers than workstations.  With ubuntu, I get Macromedia Flash,
windows video/audio codecs and better sound support than I do with
BSD, which is the main reason I switched to Ubuntu.

Because of my corporate network, with everyone using Microsoft Office
products, I also have an XP box, but it runs in a VMWare session
(virtualized windows), mainly for my Outlook and Lotus Notes, plus the
odd webpage that requires IE and won't run on Firebird.

You mentioned browsing with Linux, and true, you are much, much safer
browsing websites with a non-windows box, whether it be Linux or Mac.
My mac at home and my linux box here at work don't have anti-virus,
anti-spyware or any of the other anti-ware products on them, I don't
have to worry about it.

I can do just about anything on my linux/mac boxes that can be done on
a windows box, and where I can't, there is a virtualized instance of
XP that I can easily backup/restore (since its just another directory
on my workstation).  The biggest thing for the office that linux/mac
is missing out on is Microsoft Office.  I know there are alternatives,
openoffice, staroffice, google apps, but none of them can touch the
usability of M$ Office.  I've tried them all and it just doesn't work
out as well.  Mac has an older office, but with 2007 Office, there
isn't a Mac alternative yet.

Ok, I'll get off my box now :)

Charles

On 2/20/08, David  wrote:
> According to the web-site below, you will be able to order a
> laptop with Linux instead of Vista in the very near future.
>
> http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS2937357707.html
>
> In my opinion, this is good news. Vista runs poorly on
> your average laptop. The graphic improvements are not
> really noticeable on a small laptop screen.  For example,
> the Sidebar gadgets, take up space on a laptop screen.
>
> The main problem with Linux is that people just haven't
> realized its potential yet.  It will be difficult to find
> compatible peripherals ( printers, etc ) for the non-geek.
>
> But Linux is great for doing what the average person does
> on a computer ( i.e. type letters, play games, listen to
> MP3's, send e-mail) and in my opinion it is far
> better for surfing the web.
>
> I think if you compared the latest release of Ubuntu
> ( the Linux version that Dell is using ) to an older version
> of Windows such as Windows 95, it would be clear
> that Linux has a lot of potential.
>
> Had Bill Gates not been so greedy and supported
> the free Linux community, we would probably have a really
> good operating system now, instead of having to wait
> another 10 years ( or having to fork out the money for a MAC ).
>
> David Locklear
>
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> Give this to a friend: ot-subscr...@texascavers.com
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[ot_caving] laptop news - Dell and Linux

[David]

According to the web-site below, you will be able to order a
laptop with Linux instead of Vista in the very near future.

http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS2937357707.html

In my opinion, this is good news. Vista runs poorly on
your average laptop. The graphic improvements are not
really noticeable on a small laptop screen.  For example,
the Sidebar gadgets, take up space on a laptop screen.

The main problem with Linux is that people just haven't
realized its potential yet.  It will be difficult to find
compatible peripherals ( printers, etc ) for the non-geek.

But Linux is great for doing what the average person does
on a computer ( i.e. type letters, play games, listen to
MP3's, send e-mail) and in my opinion it is far
better for surfing the web.

I think if you compared the latest release of Ubuntu
( the Linux version that Dell is using ) to an older version
of Windows such as Windows 95, it would be clear
that Linux has a lot of potential.

Had Bill Gates not been so greedy and supported
the free Linux community, we would probably have a really
good operating system now, instead of having to wait
another 10 years ( or having to fork out the money for a MAC ).

David Locklear

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Re: [ot_caving] Ladybugs

[CaverArch]

Quinta,

Thanks for the great link that 'explains it all.'

Roger 

Re: [ot_caving] Ladybugs

[quinta]

http://bexar-tx.tamu.edu/IPM/Landscape/F2/Ladybug_Invasion.htm

Here is a link to the info on Lady Bugs and good photos also.
Quinta

Re: [ot_caving] Ladybugs

[CaverArch]

That's a relevant question for me, at least.  Candice and I own a small cabin 
on an oxbow lake in the Trinity River bottoms of northern Liberty County (about 
60 miles NNE of Houston).  We've been having a similar, and unprecedented, 
infestation of ladybugs for the last two months or so.  Each time we open the 
cabin for the weekend, every window sill is covered with sadly expired 
ex-ladybugs.  

We haven't seen this phenomenon in the seven years that we've owned the cabin, 
and we are equally uncertain as to where they are coming from.  Did they enter 
the house seeking refuge from the cold, and can't find their way back out 
again?  Or were they born somewhere in the house and then unable to escape?  
The former seems more likely.  Whatever the reason, I wish it would stop 
because there are usually only a few living ladybugs that can be "saved" when 
we get there.  And I don't see how I could effectively bug-proof the cabin 
further.  Its screens already effectively keep out mosquitoes and other typical 
flying insects.  The cabin is old and up on stilts, so it's not likely that I 
could seal all the places where they could squeeze (as opposed to fly) in.

Maybe this is just a particularly abundant season for ladybugs, making their 
invasions much more visible?

Roger Moore

In a message dated 02/19/08 22:43:01 Central Standard Time, wavyca...@gmail.com 
writes:
I hope there are enough "cavers" who read this section, that it might encompass 
someone who knows these things
But I am wondering what "media" or "environment" it is that suits Ladybugs.   
My new domain (rented duplex next door to Cammy and Vico Jones) has a minor 
infestation of ladybugs - at least in the bathroom.   I cannot tell where they 
are coming from - I think from around the edges of the bathroom window (ie. 
from somewhere in the innards of the structure) - this morning while taking a 
nice long hot bath I counted seven of them - all around the window, apparently 
trying to escape.
I understand they are beneficial insects.  (I try not to harm any of them or 
the little jumping spiders that hang around.)
They are somewhat interesting.  I had not realized before that their spots are 
not uniformly issued - some have none.  (I'm assuming they are all from the 
same "family" and not multiple species or varieties.)
-WaV

Re: [Texascavers] apes in underwater caves

[Ted Samsel]

C'mon. I'm sure some cavers a familiar with *The Ballad of Eskimo Nell*..

T.

-Original Message-
>From: Mixon Bill 
>Sent: Feb 20, 2008 12:11 AM
>To: Cavers Texas 
>Subject: [Texascavers] apes in underwater caves
>
>Hey, people, as was pointed out, that was just (alleged) poetry.  
>Modern poetry is not _supposed_ to make sense, especially any coming  
>out of colleges. It's not supposed to rhyme or scan, either. Any  
>contemporary poetry you're likely to come across makes "There once was  
>a man from Nantucket/..." seem like a classic of English literature.-- 
>Mixon
>--
>You may "reply" to the address this message
>came from, but for long-term use, save:
>Personal: bmi...@alumni.uchicago.edu
>AMCS: edi...@amcs-pubs.org or sa...@amcs-pubs.org
>
>
>
>-
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http://home.infionline.net/~tbsamsel/

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