Re: [Texascavers] guano question 2
A guanoclastic flow perhaps? Corky Gill Ediger wrote: One of the things I was trying to do was steer this discussion away from the undignified use of the way too generic and overly euphemistic, uninspired word "crap". Surely we are a more sophisticated and scientifically oriented society than one that's stuck on crap when there are dozens of more creative words to be used to discribe what is definitely an intregated act of physics affected by both biologic and geologic phenomena, not a simple "falling of crap'. Come on, you guys, we're looking for something with learned Greek or Roman origins. Dig deeply. Science is depending on you. --Ediger - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
Re: [Texascavers] guano question
Fecalanche: n. • A fall or slide of a large mass, as of feces or guano, down a slope. • A massive or overwhelming amount; a flood: received an avalanche of crap. v., -lanched, -lanch·ing, -lanch·es. v.intr. To fall or slide in a massive or overwhelming amount of poo. v.tr. To overwhelm; inundate in shit. [French; akin to Provençal lavanca, ravine, perhaps ultimately from Latin lābī, to slip.] sporslide - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
Re: RE: [Texascavers] guano question
I have manfully refrained (to date) from commenting. However, my inbox has overflowed as a result of a gigantic crapalanche from Texascavers. I just looked, and it is up over my ankles at the moment. DirtDoc -- Original message -- From: jran...@gmail.com So is this a new record for TexasCavers? A discussion that contains scatological humor, scientific study of guano fall rates, actual caving stories, new word creation and a reference to George Veni's testicles!
Re: RE: [Texascavers] guano question
I think there have been some nasty fungal infections related to wading through liquidy bat guano (or bat guanoy water, I don't know where one would draw the line on terminology). On Fri, Dec 5, 2008 at 11:14 AM, Geary Schindel < gschin...@edwardsaquifer.org> wrote: > > For example, we haven't discussed what would happen if guano caught on > fire while you were in the cave or the possibilities of a dust explosion. > There are a number of hazards associated with guano other than just plain > old histo. Being buried alive in guano or almost drown like Viv would be > pretty nasty way to go. Considering the hazards of caving in guano, has > anyone ever been diagnosed with a bat intestinal parasite. > > > > G > Ron Rutherford
RE: RE: [Texascavers] guano question
Joe, Been there and done that with David - at least almost all the way to Valles - I think we both paid our dues. As I've told David a couple of times, I think he has the worst case of sleep apnea of any LIVING human. I think someone should write up an abstract for the ICS on the need to create a new word and definition for the physical hazards from guano while caving. It has the makings of a great - if crappy talk. I nominate Devra as she coined the term Craptastrophic but then again, there is lots of room for second authors. Most cavers have a great sense of humor and would really enjoy it. Seems like there is still time. For example, we haven't discussed what would happen if guano caught on fire while you were in the cave or the possibilities of a dust explosion. There are a number of hazards associated with guano other than just plain old histo. Being buried alive in guano or almost drown like Viv would be pretty nasty way to go. Considering the hazards of caving in guano, has anyone ever been diagnosed with a bat intestinal parasite. G From: jran...@gmail.com [mailto:jran...@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 10:45 AM To: Texascavers Mailing List Subject: Re: RE: [Texascavers] guano question So is this a new record for TexasCavers? A discussion that contains scatological humor, scientific study of guano fall rates, actual caving stories, new word creation and a reference to George Veni's testicles! Geary and Locklear may need to be punished for this :-) Maybe a roadtrip from Houston to Xilitla together in David's Honda Fit... On Dec 5, 2008 9:46am, mark.al...@l-3com.com wrote: > > > Sounds like we have some good > candidates for the "Carbide Corner" in some upcoming TEXAS > CAVERs. > > > > Any takers want to submit a bio and apropos > column? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > (An always looking for material editor) > Mark > > > > > > > > > > From: vivb...@att.net > [mailto:vivb...@att.net] > Sent: Fri 12/5/2008 9:32 AM > To: > Texascavers Mailing List > Subject: Re: [Texascavers] guano > question > > > > > > > > David wrote: > >I am just curious which cave > passages have you experienced your > worst encounter with bat guano. > > The > Vampire guano in Japones Cave in Mexico was pretty bad. Really deep red and > sticky-slimy gooey. And the vampires were in a complete frenzy filling the > passage and stirring up the choking smell. But we only had to walk ankle deep in > it. It didn't even top my boots and wet my socks. > > Then I thought I had > experienced the worst the time I plunged one leg into a 2' diameter pothole full > of semi-liquid quano in Borneo. Those potholes were everywhere so we really had > to watch it. But even then, only one leg was completely saturated with the > stuff, and I was able to wash off in the river that night. > > But the true > pinnacle of guano came the time George Veni took us to Sorcerer's cave here in > Texas. It was the Boil-Boil-Guano-and-Trouble passage. This is a full on lake of > pudding-consistency guano with a frosting of insect casings and dead bats. It's > actually a series of these lakes. Apparently some of the original explorers wore > hip waders (a rally good idea), but George swore he could cross the lakes > without getting his balls wet, and it wouldn't be that bad. But then, no > one had been there is some time, and the guano dam on the far side had grown. It > was at least waist deep for everyone, that is if you could maintain your perch > on invisible ledges deep in the pools. Once on the far side, it was decided to > take out the guano dam (something like a rimstone dam, but all pure guano)to > lower the lakes to their previous levels. I thought the amonia and methane would > kill us all for a minute there, but eventually the air did clear somewhat, and > we all made it to our objectives. > > At the bottom of the cave is a really > nice stream passage, so we could get nice and clean down there. But the trouble > was you have to exit the cave through the guano lakes. On my way out of the > cave, I was the lucky one who actually did fall full on into the over-my-head > shit. I managed to barely keep my lips above guano, but my hair was saturated. > It was freezing cold outside and we were in a 100% dry camp, so when I stumbled > out of the cave in the wee hours, I just washed my hands and face as best I > could with a nalgene of water and crawled in my sleeping bag. > > I was > pleased to learn that the climb I did the next day did not require traversing > the dreaded > cesspool. > > Poo-falls? > Shitslide? > guanoflow? > > > - > Visit > our website: http://texascavers.com > To > unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com > For additional > commands, e-mail: > texascavers-h...@texascavers.com > > > > > >
Re: RE: [Texascavers] guano question
So is this a new record for TexasCavers? A discussion that contains scatological humor, scientific study of guano fall rates, actual caving stories, new word creation and a reference to George Veni's testicles! Geary and Locklear may need to be punished for this :-) Maybe a roadtrip from Houston to Xilitla together in David's Honda Fit... On Dec 5, 2008 9:46am, mark.al...@l-3com.com wrote: Sounds like we have some good candidates for the "Carbide Corner" in some upcoming TEXAS CAVERs. Any takers want to submit a bio and apropos column? Thanks, (An always looking for material editor) Mark From: vivb...@att.net [mailto:vivb...@att.net] Sent: Fri 12/5/2008 9:32 AM To: Texascavers Mailing List Subject: Re: [Texascavers] guano question David wrote: >I am just curious which cave passages have you experienced your worst encounter with bat guano. The Vampire guano in Japones Cave in Mexico was pretty bad. Really deep red and sticky-slimy gooey. And the vampires were in a complete frenzy filling the passage and stirring up the choking smell. But we only had to walk ankle deep in it. It didn't even top my boots and wet my socks. Then I thought I had experienced the worst the time I plunged one leg into a 2' diameter pothole full of semi-liquid quano in Borneo. Those potholes were everywhere so we really had to watch it. But even then, only one leg was completely saturated with the stuff, and I was able to wash off in the river that night. But the true pinnacle of guano came the time George Veni took us to Sorcerer's cave here in Texas. It was the Boil-Boil-Guano-and-Trouble passage. This is a full on lake of pudding-consistency guano with a frosting of insect casings and dead bats. It's actually a series of these lakes. Apparently some of the original explorers wore hip waders (a rally good idea), but George swore he could cross the lakes without getting his balls wet, and it wouldn't be that bad. But then, no one had been there is some time, and the guano dam on the far side had grown. It was at least waist deep for everyone, that is if you could maintain your perch on invisible ledges deep in the pools. Once on the far side, it was decided to take out the guano dam (something like a rimstone dam, but all pure guano)to lower the lakes to their previous levels. I thought the amonia and methane would kill us all for a minute there, but eventually the air did clear somewhat, and we all made it to our objectives. At the bottom of the cave is a really nice stream passage, so we could get nice and clean down there. But the trouble was you have to exit the cave through the guano lakes. On my way out of the cave, I was the lucky one who actually did fall full on into the over-my-head shit. I managed to barely keep my lips above guano, but my hair was saturated. It was freezing cold outside and we were in a 100% dry camp, so when I stumbled out of the cave in the wee hours, I just washed my hands and face as best I could with a nalgene of water and crawled in my sleeping bag. I was pleased to learn that the climb I did the next day did not require traversing the dreaded cesspool. Poo-falls? Shitslide? guanoflow? - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
RE: [Texascavers] guano question
Sounds like we have some good candidates for the "Carbide Corner" in some upcoming TEXAS CAVERs. Any takers want to submit a bio and apropos column? Thanks, (An always looking for material editor) Mark From: vivb...@att.net [mailto:vivb...@att.net] Sent: Fri 12/5/2008 9:32 AM To: Texascavers Mailing List Subject: Re: [Texascavers] guano question David wrote: >I am just curious which cave passages have you experienced your worst encounter with bat guano. The Vampire guano in Japones Cave in Mexico was pretty bad. Really deep red and sticky-slimy gooey. And the vampires were in a complete frenzy filling the passage and stirring up the choking smell. But we only had to walk ankle deep in it. It didn't even top my boots and wet my socks. Then I thought I had experienced the worst the time I plunged one leg into a 2' diameter pothole full of semi-liquid quano in Borneo. Those potholes were everywhere so we really had to watch it. But even then, only one leg was completely saturated with the stuff, and I was able to wash off in the river that night. But the true pinnacle of guano came the time George Veni took us to Sorcerer's cave here in Texas. It was the Boil-Boil-Guano-and-Trouble passage. This is a full on lake of pudding-consistency guano with a frosting of insect casings and dead bats. It's actually a series of these lakes. Apparently some of the original explorers wore hip waders (a rally good idea), but George swore he could cross the lakes without getting his balls wet, and it wouldn't be that bad. But then, no one had been there is some time, and the guano dam on the far side had grown. It was at least waist deep for everyone, that is if you could maintain your perch on invisible ledges deep in the pools. Once on the far side, it was decided to take out the guano dam (something like a rimstone dam, but all pure guano)to lower the lakes to their previous levels. I thought the amonia and methane would kill us all for a minute there, but eventually the air did clear somewhat, and we all made it to our objectives. At the bottom of the cave is a really nice stream passage, so we could get nice and clean down there. But the trouble was you have to exit the cave through the guano lakes. On my way out of the cave, I was the lucky one who actually did fall full on into the over-my-head shit. I managed to barely keep my lips above guano, but my hair was saturated. It was freezing cold outside and we were in a 100% dry camp, so when I stumbled out of the cave in the wee hours, I just washed my hands and face as best I could with a nalgene of water and crawled in my sleeping bag. I was pleased to learn that the climb I did the next day did not require traversing the dreaded cesspool. Poo-falls? Shitslide? guanoflow? - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
Re: [Texascavers] guano question
David wrote: >I am just curious which cave passages have you experienced your worst encounter with bat guano. The Vampire guano in Japones Cave in Mexico was pretty bad. Really deep red and sticky-slimy gooey. And the vampires were in a complete frenzy filling the passage and stirring up the choking smell. But we only had to walk ankle deep in it. It didn't even top my boots and wet my socks. Then I thought I had experienced the worst the time I plunged one leg into a 2' diameter pothole full of semi-liquid quano in Borneo. Those potholes were everywhere so we really had to watch it. But even then, only one leg was completely saturated with the stuff, and I was able to wash off in the river that night. But the true pinnacle of guano came the time George Veni took us to Sorcerer's cave here in Texas. It was the Boil-Boil-Guano-and-Trouble passage. This is a full on lake of pudding-consistency guano with a frosting of insect casings and dead bats. It's actually a series of these lakes. Apparently some of the original explorers wore hip waders (a rally good idea), but George swore he could cross the lakes without getting his balls wet, and it wouldn't be that bad. But then, no one had been there is some time, and the guano dam on the far side had grown. It was at least waist deep for everyone, that is if you could maintain your perch on invisible ledges deep in the pools. Once on the far side, it was decided to take out the guano dam (something like a rimstone dam, but all pure guano)to lower the lakes to their previous levels. I thought the amonia and methane would kill us all for a minute there, but eventually the air did clear somewhat, and we all made it to our objectives. At the bottom of the cave is a really nice stream passage, so we could get nice and clean down there. But the trouble was you have to exit the cave through the guano lakes. On my way out of the cave, I was the lucky one who actually did fall full on into the over-my-head shit. I managed to barely keep my lips above guano, but my hair was saturated. It was freezing cold outside and we were in a 100% dry camp, so when I stumbled out of the cave in the wee hours, I just washed my hands and face as best I could with a nalgene of water and crawled in my sleeping bag. I was pleased to learn that the climb I did the next day did not require traversing the dreaded cesspool. Poo-falls? Shitslide? guanoflow? - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
Re: [Texascavers] guano question
I may have been in deeper or worse guano before.but the grossest for me was in Stowers Cave in Texas. I went a little way past the bat room at the back into a crawland the floor was about 16 inches of bat guano with the gelatinous quality of jello.the smell was horrid...and I was gagging from the ammonia...and I tried to minimize my point of contact with the floor as much as possible...but every time I put a hand or foot down...it sank through the bat guano-jello and make a quishing sound.after about 30 feetI was rewarded with the coolest white calcite that was forming on top of the guano jello into a small stalactite and several layers of splash ringsi got the picture..by very carefully balancing my camera box and camera.as I was afraid that my camera box would sink into the guano-jello if I set it down..fortunately my squish holes remained and I was able to retreat following my steps...I was recovering from a respiratory infection at the timeand being around that guano didn't help.come to think about itneither did the millions of gnats all through the cavebut it was odd...there were not any gnats in the bat room On 12/4/08 9:40 PM, "David" wrote: > I am just curious which cave passages have you experienced your > worst encounter with bat guano. > > For me, it was the last pit in Emerald Sink, but I heard someone tell > me that there is a pit off the main route of the cave which is the worst > they have ever seen. > > Another time near Ocampo in the Sierra Madres, we were in an open > air pit and on some ledges was what appeared to be vampire guano, > but we didn't have to get near it. > > I guess being in Bracken or Frio at the peak of the guano freshness > would be another place. > > I have also been in water that had a high concentration of bat poop. > The wet entrance of Carrizal can be like that. > > I don't think I have ever been waste deep in a slurry of bat guano, > but nearly was on a trip to a pit ( Sotano Molino ? ) just outside of > Gomez Farias. But I seem to recall reading about someone who has. > > David Locklear > > - > Visit our website: http://texascavers.com > To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com > For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com > - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
Re: [Texascavers] guano question
Surveying up through the center of Punkin. Every move threatened us with death by drowning in guano. Sent from my iPhone On Dec 4, 2008, at 9:40 PM, David wrote: I am just curious which cave passages have you experienced your worst encounter with bat guano. For me, it was the last pit in Emerald Sink, but I heard someone tell me that there is a pit off the main route of the cave which is the worst they have ever seen. Another time near Ocampo in the Sierra Madres, we were in an open air pit and on some ledges was what appeared to be vampire guano, but we didn't have to get near it. I guess being in Bracken or Frio at the peak of the guano freshness would be another place. I have also been in water that had a high concentration of bat poop. The wet entrance of Carrizal can be like that. I don't think I have ever been waste deep in a slurry of bat guano, but nearly was on a trip to a pit ( Sotano Molino ? ) just outside of Gomez Farias. But I seem to recall reading about someone who has. David Locklear - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
