RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
From: Paul Okami [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] If social pressures are so powerful, and only rare individuals can resist it, then people living in the same social group ought to be virtually 100% identical which they are not. If we are the saviors of these poor blighted souls, battered about by forces beyond their control and which they cannot resist, how the hell did we get so powerful as to resist the social pressures against which our students are utterly helpless? How are we different? Perhaps we read more and watch less TV? Marc writes: For me it's a question of what accounts for most of the variability in behavior: environment or personality. I'm not a social psychologist and so cannot speak authoritatively on this, but based on what I have read, environment accounts for far more of that variability than dispositions. And a Skinnerian would maintain that much of the variability in disposition can be explained by history. How did we wind up different? I don't know about you, but I can tell you *exactly* why I'm different from my peers: I had the chance to go away and study to be a religious priest. I was exposed to things that I never would have been exposed to, and who I am today is almost completely dependent on those experiences. Not one in a thousand people gets opportunities like that, but once those opportunities are there, things happen. I was lucky, as are a few others. Maybe they have a mentor. Maybe they're lucky as kids and get sucked into a few good books and learn the wonders of reading. Who knows? But my lack of knowledge of the exact causes of what makes someone different from the bulk of his or her peers is exactly the reason that I'm not willing to bet on it. I'm playing the odds, and the odds are that 80 of 100 of our students are going to be fundamentally similar to the other 79, and are largely a product of culture. Culture is immensely powerful. Paul again: I am also a determinist. Everything has a cause. But what are the causes? I am not angry at students. But they are responsible for their own development and education. If I am angry, it is at ideas which have the effect of robbing people of self-determination. And again, me: Maybe it's a semantic thing, but responsibility and self-determination are not phrases one often hears from a determinist. What self is doing the determining? And if there be such a thing as a (even relatively) autonomous self, what causes that self to determine behavior in the particular way the behavior manifests? That's why I choose (hee!) not to use the word responsible. Accountable, sure! They are accountable. But by imposing accountability on them, I change the environment, I change the culture (with a small 'c'), and thus feel I'm much more likely to make a change in behavior. And that's what I want to do. I want to shape their behavior. m --- ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
I recently went to an AGLS conference on Gen Ed and went to a presentation on the millennial kids. For a number of reasons, it was the best conference talk I've ever heard. I don't have any resources to recommend in particular, but I recommend that everyone get familiar with how these kids are, because they're different from us in some very fundamental ways. And soon we're going to have *their* kids in school :/ m -- There is no power for change greater than a community discovering what it cares about. -- Margaret Wheatley -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Beth Benoit Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 5:31 PM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much? Dave Myers recently recommended a very interesting book about this very subject, called Generation Me, by Jean Twenge. She sums it all up nicely and brings some scientific objectivity to it with studies looking at why today's young Americans are more confident, assertive, entitled - and more miserable than ever before. This came up on TIPS when we were discussing the new findings about these entitled but unhappy students. Of course, I immediately went to bn.com (sorry but I have had too many problems with Amazon) and bought it. It's been a fun, interesting read. I highly recommend it. Beth Benoit Granite State College Plymouth State University New Hampshire On Nov 20, 2007 5:08 PM, Robert Wildblood [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Placing blame is an interesting sport. Has anyone thought about the idea that we are dealing with the millennium generation with the helicopter parents who have never let their children do anything that they didn't sanction and who have told their children all of their lives that they are the best child in the world and that they deserve to be praised, rewarded, given a medal just because they participated in some activity? They also interfere in their children's education by telling their child's teacher that Bobby is special and you just have to learn how to stimulate him. -- or worse. I don't blame the students, I blame the parents who have interfered with the learning process by telling Bobby that he is the best and most important person in the world and that he doesn't have to try to do anything, people should just recognize his specialness. On 20 Nov 2007, at 11:21, Marc Carter wrote: Oh, my. Apparently I was wrong; some of us *are* blaming the students. Well, I'm not. Social pressures are powerful. They just are. It's a rare individual indeed who can consistently resist it, and I believe that the reason that students *can* resist it -- when they can -- because of people like us who encourage it. Blaming students for something over which they have little or no control doesn't change things. Working to change the situation can change things. But then, I'm a determinist. :) I'm much more rarely angry at students as a result. m Dr. Bob Wildblood Lecturer in Psychology Indiana University Kokomo 2300 S Washington St PO Box 9003 Kokomo, IN 46904-9003 765-455-9483 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies in the final sense a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. Dwight D. Eisenhower The time is always right to do what is right. Martin Luther King, Jr. Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. Benjamin Franklin, 1775 We are what we pretend to be, so we better be careful what we pretend to be. Kurt Vonnegut --- --- To make changes to your subscription contact: Bill Southerly ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Louis Schmier wrote, I think some of us are being too harsh. We aren't very understanding of our very young students. We're not walking in their shoes or remembering how we were like at those ages. I remember how I was at those ages. I'd been books for pleasure for many years. As for being too harsh, that assumes that I believe in free will and want blame students (or whoever) for not using their free will well. But as an orthodox probabilistic determinist (if there is such a thing) I don't blame anyone. There is a plethora of reasons as to why children don't learn to read for pleasure (or even watch the History other educational TV channels). We could make a long list. But the fact is that they don't read for pleasure and common words, famous events, etc. are often unknown to them. You can say it with contempt, anger, pity, concern, are any combination thereof. But it dopesn't change the fact that they're woefully unprepared in areas of general knowledge. Ed Edward I. Pollak, Ph.D. Department of Psychology West Chester University of Pennsylvania http://mywebpages.comcast.net/epollak/home.htm Husband, father, grandfather, biopsychologist, bluegrass fiddler and herpetoculturist.. in approximate order of importance. ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Admittedly I have been paying intermittent attention to this discussion. And I always have a reflexive?and negative?reaction to young people today are so different (by implication not as good) than we were) a complaint that to my knowledge can be found consistently in written history right back to the Greeks and Babylonians. I am wondering if we are comparing our students to the younger version of ourselves not to a younger version of the universe of people with whom we grew up. Sure I read a lot as a child and teen. And in that way I was very DIFFERENT than most of my peers. And I suspect that we all as kids were very different from our peers - thus we landed in careers as academics, researchers and scholars - while they went on to a vast universe of other work in which having a history as a good reader was not so crucial. Also, there were (and are) many ways in which I was and AM the same as my students. The us-versus-them thing, especially around issues of age, just fogs our ability to see how much similarity there is and have understanding or empathy for them (when appropriate). Where applicable, enjoy the holiday. Nancy Melucci Long Beach City College Long Beach CA -Original Message- From: Pollak, Edward [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) tips@acsun.frostburg.edu Sent: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 7:42 am Subject: RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much? ?Louis Schmier wrote, I think some of us are being too harsh.? We aren't very understanding of our very young students.? We're not walking in their shoes or remembering how we were like at those ages. I remember how I was at those ages. I'd been books for pleasure for many years. As for being too harsh, that assumes that I believe in free will and want blame students (or whoever) ?for not using their free will well. But as an orthodox probabilistic determinist (if there is such a thing) I don't blame anyone. There?is a plethora of reasons as to why children don't learn to read for pleasure (or even watch the History other educational TV channels). We could make a long list. But the fact is that they don't read for pleasure and common words, famous events, etc. are often unknown to them. You can say it with contempt, anger, pity, concern, are any combination thereof. But it dopesn't change the fact that they're woefully unprepared in areas of general knowledge. ? Ed ? Edward I. Pollak, Ph.D. Department of Psychology West Chester University of Pennsylvania http://mywebpages.comcast.net/epollak/home.htm Husband, father, grandfather, biopsychologist, bluegrass fiddler and herpetoculturist.. in approximate order of importance. --- To make changes to your subscription contact: Bill Southerly ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/19/arts/19nea.html?emex=1195707600en=19 c57bbd70b9bb6aei=5087%0A The article (Study Links Drop in Test Scores to a Decline in Time Spent Reading) in the New York Times (Monday) is interesting but I'm not sure how impressive the data are. Marie Marie Helweg-Larsen, Ph.D. Department Chair and Associate Professor of Psychology Kaufman 168, Dickinson College Carlisle, PA 17013 Office: (717) 245-1562, Fax: (717) 245-1971 http://alpha.dickinson.edu/departments/psych/helwegm -Original Message- From: Pollak, Edward [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 8:13 AM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: Re:[tips] Am I expecting too much? Suicide bomber is a pretty self-obvious term. But don't bet your life that they'd know what an IED is, Chris. I just had a student in my office asking for suggestions/source for a paper on psychological warfare (for a writing class). The conversation drifted to water boarding. She'd never heard of that. Besides, Kamikaze is more than ancient history. It's entered the English lexicon as general term. It's no more ancient history than is the word, vandal. Edward I. Pollak, Ph.D. Department of Psychology West Chester University of Pennsylvania West Chester, PA 19383 Office Hours: Mon. 12 - 2 p.m. 3 - 4 p.m. Tuesdays Thursdays 8 - 9:00 a.m. 12:30 - 2 p.m. by appointment. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/epollak/home.htm Husband, father, grandfather, biopsychologist, bluegrass fiddler and herpetoculturist.. in approximate order of importance. Subject: Re: Am I expecting too much? From: Christopher D. Green [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 11:24:44 -0500 X-Message-Number: 15 Pollak, Edward wrote: A few weeks ago I gave an exam in animal behavior and asked a question about Kamikaze sperm. One student asked what species a Kamikaze was. I then asked the next 4 students entering my office if they'd ever heard the word , kamikaze. The first three had never heard the word. I'm convinced that the problem is that most students no longer read for pleasure. Really? I bet if you ask them what a suicide bomber or an IED is, they'd have a pretty good idea (which is the rough equivalent in modern terms). Kamikazes are ancient history to today's student. *We* know what they were because they were a stock figure in many popular movies of our generations (asnd some of us may be old enough to remember them a mews items). But now they are as arcane as a hoplite phalanx or a Viking berserk. Chris --- ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Pollak, Edward wrote: Suicide bomber is a pretty self-obvious term. But don't bet your life that they'd know what an IED is, Chris. I just had a student in my office asking for suggestions/source for a paper on psychological warfare (for a writing class). The conversation drifted to water boarding. She'd never heard of that. Hmmm. That's too bad. (But perhaps it explains a lot about oh, never mind.) :-) Besides, Kamikaze is more than ancient history. It's entered the English lexicon as general term. It's no more ancient history than is the word, vandal. I am suggesting that it only seems that way to people of a certain age. Chris -- Christopher D. Green Department of Psychology York University Toronto, ON M3J 1P3 Canada 416-736-5115 ex. 66164 [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.yorku.ca/christo/ == ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Louis, I don't think any of us are blaming the students; I think we are venting a collective lament at the *fact* that students don't read, not that they're culpable. m -- There is no power for change greater than a community discovering what it cares about. -- Margaret Wheatley -Original Message- From: Louis Schmier [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 8:05 AM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much? I think some of us are being too harsh. We aren't very understanding of our very young students. We're not walking in their shoes or remembering how we were like at those ages. Make it a good day. --Louis-- Louis Schmier http://therandomthoughts.edublogs.org/ http://therandomthoughts.edublogs.org/ Department of History http://www.newforums.com/Auth_L_Schmier.asp http://www.newforums.com/Auth_L_Schmier.asp Valdosta State University Valdosta, Georgia 31698/\ /\ /\ /\ (229-333-5947) /^\\/ \/\ /\/\/\ \/\ / \ \__ \/ / \ /\/ \ \ /\ //\/\/ /\ \_ / /___\/\ \ \ \/ \ /\If you want to climb mountains \ /\ _/\don't practice on mole hills -/\ --- To make changes to your subscription contact: Bill Southerly ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Who says that students are not culpable? I for one respect students enough to hold them culpable. Simply because victimology is a national ideology does not make it an accurate characterization of empirical facts or existential realities. It's amazing that we are afraid even to imagine that people are responsible for their lives and their development. Paul Okami - Original Message - From: Marc Carter [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) tips@acsun.frostburg.edu Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 9:15 AM Subject: RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much? Louis, I don't think any of us are blaming the students; I think we are venting a collective lament at the *fact* that students don't read, not that they're culpable. m -- There is no power for change greater than a community discovering what it cares about. -- Margaret Wheatley -Original Message- From: Louis Schmier [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 8:05 AM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much? I think some of us are being too harsh. We aren't very understanding of our very young students. We're not walking in their shoes or remembering how we were like at those ages. Make it a good day. --Louis-- Louis Schmier http://therandomthoughts.edublogs.org/ http://therandomthoughts.edublogs.org/ Department of History http://www.newforums.com/Auth_L_Schmier.asp http://www.newforums.com/Auth_L_Schmier.asp Valdosta State University Valdosta, Georgia 31698/\ /\ /\ /\ (229-333-5947) /^\\/ \/\ /\/\/\ \/\ / \ \__ \/ / \ /\/ \ \ /\ //\/\/ /\ \_ / /___\/\ \ \ \/ \ /\If you want to climb mountains \ /\ _/\don't practice on mole hills -/\ --- To make changes to your subscription contact: Bill Southerly ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) --- __ NOD32 2665 (20071117) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Louis said: I think some of us are being too harsh. We aren't very understanding of our very young students. We're not walking in their shoes or remembering how we were like at those ages. And Louis hit a nerve, as usual; it's early in the morning: I was not a nerd in those days. That came later for me. I was a late bloomer--those frontal lobes resisted maturation for a long time. At 19 I decided California was the place for me and I hitch hiked from Chicago to California in November! Scares me to death to think back on it. But I still have memories of a family in Arkansas that wanted to take me home for Sunday dinner with the grandparents, horrible truck drivers who got fresh and I had jump out of the cab of a moving truck, and lots of interesting people with lots of stories. BUT I was also interested in what was going on around me. I walked blocks campaigning for McCarthy, I knew every statistic and battle in Viet Nam and wrote letters to anonymous soldiers (I failed in motivating our psych club to send home baked cookies to my son's unit in Marez--outside of Mosul), I liked Mark Twain, so at 18 I drove myself down to Hannibal, MO to see his birth place and all the 'touristy' stuff about him. I read every book he wrote or that was written about him and I still love to watch the Mark Twain comedy awards on PBS. Eventually I went to Angel's Camp and Twain Harte in California. I WAS different. So I DO have a hard time relating. I asked my 19-year old son about some of the things I expected my students to know and he didn't know much of it until I cued him. He vaguely knew something about Head Start as day care. I had to cue him with Prison in Iraq to get him to remember the Abu Gharib story. He does know about fly-fishing from seeing A River Runs Through It and his laptop home page is CNN; he mostly reads the headlines only--and he is like a lot of his friends who are not nerds. He is not a stellar student, last semester he was tickled to get all the (passing) letter grades on one report card: A, B, C, D. But he knows a lot about very many different things. So, I AM struggling to understand my students. In each section of 20 about 2 seem to know something about the world. The other 18 just seem so lost. I'm worried about how they are going to function in everyday life with such a poor understing of THEIR 'other' people! These students will have a hard time relating beyond their limited world. I'm thinking of somehow incorporating magazine/newspaper assignments into my classes from now on so at least they have to skim them to find information for assignments. Annette Annette Kujawski Taylor, Ph.D. Professor of Psychology University of San Diego 5998 Alcala Park San Diego, CA 92110 619-260-4006 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Original message Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 09:04:34 -0500 From: Louis Schmier [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much? To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) tips@acsun.frostburg.edu Make it a good day. --Louis-- Louis Schmier http://therandomthoughts.edublogs.org/ Department of History http://www.newforums.com/Auth_L_Schmier.asp Valdosta State University Valdosta, Georgia 31698/\ /\ /\ /\ (229-333-5947) /^\\/ \/\ /\/\/\ \/\ / \ \__ \/ / \ /\/ \ \ /\ //\/\/ /\ \_ / /___\/\ \ \ \/ \ /\If you want to climb mountains \ /\ _/ \don't practice on mole hills -/\ --- To make changes to your subscription contact: Bill Southerly ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
At 8:04 AM -0600 11/20/07, Louis Schmier wrote: I think some of us are being too harsh. We aren't very understanding of our very young students. We're not walking in their shoes or remembering how we were like at those ages. Or maybe we are. -- The best argument against Intelligent Design is that fact that people believe in it. * PAUL K. BRANDON[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Psychology Dept Minnesota State University * * 23 Armstrong Hall, Mankato, MN 56001 ph 507-389-6217 * * http://krypton.mnsu.edu/~pkbrando/* ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Louis said: I think some of us are being too harsh. We aren't very understanding of our very young students. We're not walking in their shoes or remembering how we were like at those ages. At my students' ages I had my own apartment in the East Village, was about to be married. For fun I read T. S. Eliot, Marx Engels, Hermann Hesse, Karen Horney/Erich Fromm, Raymond Chandler Hammett, Robert Musil, Dostoyevsky, Thomas Mann (on occasion only), Herman Melville, Norman Mailer, Phillip Roth, Saul Bellow, James Baldwin, Kerouac, and Marvel Comics (especially the Silver Surfer). I knew the works of Bach, Debussy, Charlie Parker, and Charles Mingus. I watched the films of Truffaut Goddard, Fellini, Kurosawa, Mizoguchi, Demy, Renoir and others. I went to museums. I played music. I also used drugs, got drunk, dropped out of college because it was irrelevant, had sex as often as I possibly could, and went with my wife to live in a commune. I misbehaved. I danced naked in Central Park. I opposed everything around me that I perceived as ugly. By age 21, I was a father, was working various radical groups to try to change the world. I was not alone in *any* of this, including dancing naked in Central Park. Louis, I do remember how I was like at their age. Paul Okami ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Oh, my. Apparently I was wrong; some of us *are* blaming the students. Well, I'm not. Social pressures are powerful. They just are. It's a rare individual indeed who can consistently resist it, and I believe that the reason that students *can* resist it -- when they can -- because of people like us who encourage it. Blaming students for something over which they have little or no control doesn't change things. Working to change the situation can change things. But then, I'm a determinist. :) I'm much more rarely angry at students as a result. m -- There is no power for change greater than a community discovering what it cares about. -- Margaret Wheatley -Original Message- From: Paul Okami [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 10:10 AM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much? Who says that students are not culpable? I for one respect students enough to hold them culpable. Simply because victimology is a national ideology does not make it an accurate characterization of empirical facts or existential realities. It's amazing that we are afraid even to imagine that people are responsible for their lives and their development. Paul Okami - Original Message - From: Marc Carter [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) tips@acsun.frostburg.edu Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 9:15 AM Subject: RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much? Louis, I don't think any of us are blaming the students; I think we are venting a collective lament at the *fact* that students don't read, not that they're culpable. m -- There is no power for change greater than a community discovering what it cares about. -- Margaret Wheatley -Original Message- From: Louis Schmier [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 8:05 AM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much? I think some of us are being too harsh. We aren't very understanding of our very young students. We're not walking in their shoes or remembering how we were like at those ages. Make it a good day. --Louis-- Louis Schmier http://therandomthoughts.edublogs.org/ http://therandomthoughts.edublogs.org/ Department of History http://www.newforums.com/Auth_L_Schmier.asp http://www.newforums.com/Auth_L_Schmier.asp Valdosta State University Valdosta, Georgia 31698/\ /\ /\ /\ (229-333-5947) /^\\/ \/\ /\/\/\ \/\ / \ \__ \/ / \ /\/ \ \ /\ //\/\/ /\ \_ / /___\/\ \ \ \/ \ /\If you want to climb mountains \ /\ _/\don't practice on mole hills -/\ --- To make changes to your subscription contact: Bill Southerly ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) --- __ NOD32 2665 (20071117) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com --- ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
I have an explanation for the lack of knowledge about the more modern terms that I don't think many will agree with me on (and I often have doubts about myself). I think students don't watch as much television as we often assume (or maybe than we did as students). Maybe this isn't true everywhere but today it seems TVs are more likely to be used as monitors for game systems or DVD players than as broadcast tools that might be used to inform people of current events. I seriously believe that I might watch more cable TV than most of my students. When I hear them talking about things, it seldom involves TV shows (unless they are on DVD box sets). Just the other day, some students were giving a presentation on non-verbal communication. They showed the video of the Cingular commercial http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GQBABkFI34 where the family yells nice things at each other (I raised you to speak to me like that and you never hated me and you never will) with the sound down and asked them what was going on. Then they played it with the sound up and showed them the inconsistency between the two. I could tell from the reaction that most students in the class had never seen it. It was hard to avoid in my house when it was playing regularly and it was just another small piece of evidence (I don't give much credence to self-report) that many of my students don't watch much TV. I remember watching late night television back in college which, at least during the monologues, would reference the news of the day. You don't have to read books or even newspapers to have heard the basic current events terminology of the day. All you need to do is watch a TV news broadcast, however briefly, to see most of these terms used repeatedly. I don't think today's students aren't reading for pleasure enough to learn these new terms -- they're just not watching enough TV. Rick Dr. Rick Froman, Chair Division of Humanities and Social Sciences Professor of Psychology John Brown University 2000 W. University Siloam Springs, AR 72761 [EMAIL PROTECTED] (479) 524-7295 http://www.jbu.edu/academics/hss/faculty/rfroman.asp Pete, it's a fool that looks for logic in the chambers of the human heart. - Ulysses Everett McGill -Original Message- From: Pollak, Edward [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 7:13 AM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: Re:[tips] Am I expecting too much? Suicide bomber is a pretty self-obvious term. But don't bet your life that they'd know what an IED is, Chris. I just had a student in my office asking for suggestions/source for a paper on psychological warfare (for a writing class). The conversation drifted to water boarding. She'd never heard of that. Besides, Kamikaze is more than ancient history. It's entered the English lexicon as general term. It's no more ancient history than is the word, vandal. Edward I. Pollak, Ph.D. Department of Psychology West Chester University of Pennsylvania West Chester, PA 19383 Office Hours: Mon. 12 - 2 p.m. 3 - 4 p.m. Tuesdays Thursdays 8 - 9:00 a.m. 12:30 - 2 p.m. by appointment. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/epollak/home.htm Husband, father, grandfather, biopsychologist, bluegrass fiddler and herpetoculturist.. in approximate order of importance. Subject: Re: Am I expecting too much? From: Christopher D. Green [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 11:24:44 -0500 X-Message-Number: 15 Pollak, Edward wrote: A few weeks ago I gave an exam in animal behavior and asked a question about Kamikaze sperm. One student asked what species a Kamikaze was. I then asked the next 4 students entering my office if they'd ever heard the word , kamikaze. The first three had never heard the word. I'm convinced that the problem is that most students no longer read for pleasure. Really? I bet if you ask them what a suicide bomber or an IED is, they'd have a pretty good idea (which is the rough equivalent in modern terms). Kamikazes are ancient history to today's student. *We* know what they were because they were a stock figure in many popular movies of our generations (asnd some of us may be old enough to remember them a mews items). But now they are as arcane as a hoplite phalanx or a Viking berserk. Chris --- ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Placing blame is an interesting sport. Has anyone thought about the idea that we are dealing with the millennium generation with the helicopter parents who have never let their children do anything that they didn't sanction and who have told their children all of their lives that they are the best child in the world and that they deserve to be praised, rewarded, given a medal just because they participated in some activity? They also interfere in their children's education by telling their child's teacher that Bobby is special and you just have to learn how to stimulate him. -- or worse. I don't blame the students, I blame the parents who have interfered with the learning process by telling Bobby that he is the best and most important person in the world and that he doesn't have to try to do anything, people should just recognize his specialness. On 20 Nov 2007, at 11:21, Marc Carter wrote: Oh, my. Apparently I was wrong; some of us *are* blaming the students. Well, I'm not. Social pressures are powerful. They just are. It's a rare individual indeed who can consistently resist it, and I believe that the reason that students *can* resist it -- when they can -- because of people like us who encourage it. Blaming students for something over which they have little or no control doesn't change things. Working to change the situation can change things. But then, I'm a determinist. :) I'm much more rarely angry at students as a result. m Dr. Bob Wildblood Lecturer in Psychology Indiana University Kokomo 2300 S Washington St PO Box 9003 Kokomo, IN 46904-9003 765-455-9483 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies in the final sense a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. Dwight D. Eisenhower The time is always right to do what is right. Martin Luther King, Jr. Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. Benjamin Franklin, 1775 We are what we pretend to be, so we better be careful what we pretend to be. Kurt Vonnegut ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
It's funny that Rick mentioned that. Just for fun I asked my class today how many watched The Daily Show with John Stuart, The Bill Maher Show, and/or the Colbert Report. There was a high correlation between watching those shows and the ones who also have intelligent comments and input in class. At least, they are informed. By the way, several also watched Kieth Olberman as well. On 20 Nov 2007, at 12:16, Rick Froman wrote: I remember watching late night television back in college which, at least during the monologues, would reference the news of the day. You don't have to read books or even newspapers to have heard the basic current events terminology of the day. All you need to do is watch a TV news broadcast, however briefly, to see most of these terms used repeatedly. I don't think today's students aren't reading for pleasure enough to learn these new terms -- they're just not watching enough TV. Rick Dr. Bob Wildblood 711 Rivereview Dr. Kokomo, IN 46901-7025 765-776-1727 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies in the final sense a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. - Dwight D. Eisenhower The time is always right to do what is right. Martin Luther King, Jr. Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. Benjamin Franklin, 1775 We are what we pretend to be, so we better be careful what we pretend to be. Kurt Vonnegut ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
I'm seeing a lot of this myself and it has changed the way I see this cohort of students. On Nov 20, 2007, at 5:08 PM, Robert Wildblood wrote: Placing blame is an interesting sport. Has anyone thought about the idea that we are dealing with the millennium generation with the helicopter parents who have never let their children do anything that they didn't sanction and who have told their children all of their lives that they are the best child in the world and that they deserve to be praised, rewarded, given a medal just because they participated in some activity? They also interfere in their children's education by telling their child's teacher that Bobby is special and you just have to learn how to stimulate him. -- or worse. I don't blame the students, I blame the parents who have interfered with the learning process by telling Bobby that he is the best and most important person in the world and that he doesn't have to try to do anything, people should just recognize his specialness. On 20 Nov 2007, at 11:21, Marc Carter wrote: Oh, my. Apparently I was wrong; some of us *are* blaming the students. Well, I'm not. Social pressures are powerful. They just are. It's a rare individual indeed who can consistently resist it, and I believe that the reason that students *can* resist it -- when they can -- because of people like us who encourage it. Blaming students for something over which they have little or no control doesn't change things. Working to change the situation can change things. But then, I'm a determinist. :) I'm much more rarely angry at students as a result. m Dr. Bob Wildblood Lecturer in Psychology Indiana University Kokomo 2300 S Washington St PO Box 9003 Kokomo, IN 46904-9003 765-455-9483 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies in the final sense a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. Dwight D. Eisenhower The time is always right to do what is right. Martin Luther King, Jr. Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. Benjamin Franklin, 1775 We are what we pretend to be, so we better be careful what we pretend to be. Kurt Vonnegut --- Steven M. Specht, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Psychology Utica College Utica, NY 13502 (315) 792-3171 Mice may be called large or small, and so may elephants, and it is quite understandable when someone says it was a large mouse that ran up the trunk of a small elephant (S. S. Stevens, 1958) ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Dave Myers recently recommended a very interesting book about this very subject, called *Generation Me*, by Jean Twenge. She sums it all up nicely and brings some scientific objectivity to it with studies looking at why today's young Americans are more confident, assertive, entitled - and more miserable than ever before. This came up on TIPS when we were discussing the new findings about these entitled but unhappy students. Of course, I immediately went to bn.com (sorry but I have had too many problems with Amazon) and bought it. It's been a fun, interesting read. I highly recommend it. Beth Benoit Granite State College Plymouth State University New Hampshire On Nov 20, 2007 5:08 PM, Robert Wildblood [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Placing blame is an interesting sport. Has anyone thought about the idea that we are dealing with the millennium generation with the helicopter parents who have never let their children do anything that they didn't sanction and who have told their children all of their lives that they are the best child in the world and that they deserve to be praised, rewarded, given a medal just because they participated in some activity? They also interfere in their children's education by telling their child's teacher that Bobby is special and you just have to learn how to stimulate him. -- or worse. I don't blame the students, I blame the parents who have interfered with the learning process by telling Bobby that he is the best and most important person in the world and that he doesn't have to try to do anything, people should just recognize his specialness. On 20 Nov 2007, at 11:21, Marc Carter wrote: Oh, my. Apparently I was wrong; some of us *are* blaming the students. Well, I'm not. Social pressures are powerful. They just are. It's a rare individual indeed who can consistently resist it, and I believe that the reason that students *can* resist it -- when they can -- because of people like us who encourage it. Blaming students for something over which they have little or no control doesn't change things. Working to change the situation can change things. But then, I'm a determinist. :) I'm much more rarely angry at students as a result. m Dr. Bob Wildblood Lecturer in Psychology Indiana University Kokomo 2300 S Washington St PO Box 9003 Kokomo, IN 46904-9003 765-455-9483 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies in the final sense a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. Dwight D. Eisenhower The time is always right to do what is right. Martin Luther King, Jr. Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. Benjamin Franklin, 1775 We are what we pretend to be, so we better be careful what we pretend to be. Kurt Vonnegut --- ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
- Original Message - From: Marc Carter [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) tips@acsun.frostburg.edu Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 11:21 AM Subject: RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much? Oh, my. Apparently I was wrong; some of us *are* blaming the students. Well, I'm not. Social pressures are powerful. They just are. It's a rare individual indeed who can consistently resist it, and I believe that the reason that students *can* resist it -- when they can -- because of people like us who encourage it. If social pressures are so powerful, and only rare individuals can resist it, then people living in the same social group ought to be virtually 100% identical which they are not. If we are the saviors of these poor blighted souls, battered about by forces beyond their control and which they cannot resist, how the hell did we get so powerful as to resist the social pressures against which our students are utterly helpless? How are we different? Perhaps we read more and watch less TV? But then, I'm a determinist. :) I'm much more rarely angry at students as a result. I am also a determinist. Everything has a cause. But what are the causes? I am not angry at students. But they are responsible for their own development and education. If I am angry, it is at ideas which have the effect of robbing people of self-determination. Paul Okami ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Maybe this is a good time to haul out that yearly posting from Beloit College about this year's freshman class. I find that I need to update my examples, as these kids don't really recall the Challenger explosion (so much for that example for discussions of groupthink), Jonestown (have to use videos to discuss cult behavior because they never heard of it), and on and on. Here's the current list (which was also posted at the beginning of this term). It's fun and quite surprising: http://www.beloit.edu/~pubaff/mindset/2011.php Beth Benoit Granite State College Plymouth State University New Hampshire ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Great list and thanks Beth. However, students do remember the Columbia shuttle disaster which, sadly, had very similar dynamics among the managers and engineers. The exploitation of Enron employees by the inside traders (Smartest Guys in the Room) is also a fairly recent example of group think. Google group think and Columbia Shuttle as well as group think and Enron. Joan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Maybe this is a good time to haul out that yearly posting from Beloit College about this year's freshman class. I find that I need to update my examples, as these kids don't really recall the Challenger explosion (so much for that example for discussions of groupthink), Jonestown (have to use videos to discuss cult behavior because they never heard of it), and on and on. Here's the current list (which was also posted at the beginning of this term). It's fun and quite surprising: http://www.beloit.edu/~pubaff/mindset/2011.php Beth Benoit Granite State College Plymouth State University New Hampshire --- ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Most of my students when we covered social psych in intro yesterday (all but two students, different ones for each question) had ever heard of Abu-Gharib OR the Heaven's Gate cult and mass suicide. No one had heard of Jonestown (we watched the discovering psych video) or knew what happened in Waco, Tx. It is getting harder to find relevant examples to use in class. They do remember 9-11 but few had a flashbulb memory. Sigh Thanks for the updated list. I'll send it on to my students :) Annette Annette Kujawski Taylor, Ph.D. Professor of Psychology University of San Diego 5998 Alcala Park San Diego, CA 92110 619-260-4006 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Original message Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 18:56:41 -0500 From: beth benoit [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much? To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) tips@acsun.frostburg.edu Link: File-List Maybe this is a good time to haul out that yearly posting from Beloit College about this year's freshman class. I find that I need to update my examples, as these kids don't really recall the Challenger explosion (so much for that example for discussions of groupthink), Jonestown (have to use videos to discuss cult behavior because they never heard of it), and on and on. Here's the current list (which was also posted at the beginning of this term). It's fun and quite surprising: http://www.beloit.edu/~pubaff/mindset/2011.php Beth Benoit Granite State College Plymouth State University New Hampshire --- To make changes to your subscription contact: Bill Southerly ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Well, I just discovered--I have amnesia of that week in ICU--that the day after I was admitted to ICU I dictated an e-mail to my son for my classes. All the students in the four classes, 196 students, were first semester students. I told them to run the classes themselves, to finish the project that was being presented at the time I had my cerebral hemorrahage and what to do to prepare for the second. I guess I thought I'd be back in class in a few days. Well, both the students and my colleagues tell me that they ran all the classes like troopers: they wrote their own Words for the Day on the whiteboard, they wrote the one-word how do you feel today word on the whiteboard, took role, and presented. Some even videotaped the presentations. I haven't seen any yet. They all submitted the issue papers for the second project. At that point, my classes were taken over by my colleagues as I went on medical leave. Make it a good day. --Louis-- Louis Schmier http://therandomthoughts.edublogs.org/ Department of History http://www.newforums.com/Auth_L_Schmier.asp Valdosta State University Valdosta, Georgia 31698/\ /\ /\ /\ (229-333-5947) /^\\/ \/\ /\/\/\ \/\ / \ \__ \/ / \ /\/ \ \ /\ //\/\/ /\ \_ / /___\/\ \ \ \/ \ /\If you want to climb mountains \ /\ _/\don't practice on mole hills -/ \ ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Hi A number of years ago a colleague and I looked at item attributes as predictors of word naming difficulty on the Boston Naming Test. We did a similar thing with the Peabody Picture Vocabulary Test (never published). Quite good prediction with such attributes as frequency, familiarity, age of acquisition, ... (all quite highly correlated). It would be interesting to see if ratings of familiarity and age of acquisition of words has changed across time, perhaps focusing on the university-age or high school population. Another interesting approach would be to examine more specifically when and how people of different ages learn such terms as fly fishing. Is it perhaps the case that some of the activities we engaged in when younger are less common or universal (camp? scouts or guides?) and that is when we learned these somewhat specialized term? I do not think that it can be the lack of availability of information, given specialty tv channels, google, and the you-tube example Tim just posted. It must be something driving access or exposure to the information (assuming of course there is anything to explain). That is, a within-culture factor analogous perhaps to the mundane (although not-so for immigrants, of course) example of terms from different cultures. Just to give a further example, several of our students were impressed when I could define malinger (they were practising with GRE flash cards). Or does that just seem easy to me because I've read about and actually done some research on MMPI validity scales? Take care Jim James M. Clark Professor of Psychology 204-786-9757 204-774-4134 Fax [EMAIL PROTECTED] Shearon, Tim [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19-Nov-07 1:33:38 AM Jim- You asked- (I have no idea how many of these there are or how far this goes, but YouTube. . . ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2SgcCw6I8Mfeature=related So lack of video instruction can't be it- Have fun. Tim ___ Timothy O. Shearon, PhD Professor and Chair Department of Psychology The College of Idaho Caldwell, ID 83605 email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] teaching: intro to neuropsychology; psychopharmacology; general; history and systems -Original Message- From: Jim Matiya [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sun 11/18/2007 6:43 PM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much? Hi Annette, Do they have fly-fishing on MtV? or My Space? I discovered several years ago, that my urban-suburban students never heard of fly-fishing. I started to include and explanation of it in my lectures...a sign of the times... Jim --- ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
For me at least, computers now make it MUCH more likely that I'll look up a word in the dictionary. Dictionary.com contains definitions of the word (including a sound bite for pronunciation) from multiple dictionaries as well as the word translated to other languages. You can also easily see entries nearby for other words. E.g., http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/malinger Another handy source is urbandictionary.com and of course the various urban legends websites. I just this morning saw a video on how fly fishing works (that was pretty cool and informative). Certainly we have WAY MORE information at our finger tips than we had even 10 years ago. Isn't the point that kids (and adults) in their free time do what they are most interested in doing? Marie Marie Helweg-Larsen, Ph.D. Department Chair and Associate Professor of Psychology Kaufman 168, Dickinson College Carlisle, PA 17013 Office: (717) 245-1562, Fax: (717) 245-1971 http://alpha.dickinson.edu/departments/psych/helwegm http://alpha.dickinson.edu/departments/psych/helwegm From: Pollak, Edward [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 10:20 AM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: [tips] Am I expecting too much? A few weeks ago I gave an exam in animal behavior and asked a question about Kamikaze sperm. One student asked what species a Kamikaze was. I then asked the next 4 students entering my office if they'd ever heard the word , kamikaze. The first three had never heard the word. I'm convinced that the problem is that most students no longer read for pleasure. This has been problematic for years but is getting worse. Try asking your student if, as children, they ever read books (not magazines) just for fun. It's no wonder their general knowledge is so pathetic. And there's a BIG difference between looking up the definitive of a specific word on line and learning words incidentally while reading a book. Even looking words up in a dictionary is better because you naturally do a little browsing of other words when you look it up. That's not as easy/common when looking up a definition on line. The Kindly Old Curmudgeon Edward I. Pollak, Ph.D. Department of Psychology West Chester University of Pennsylvania Office Hours: Mondays noon-2 and 3-4 p.m.; Tuesdays Thursdays 8-9:00 a.m. 12:30-1:30 p.m. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/epollak/home.htm Husband, father, grandfather, biopsychologist, bluegrass fiddler and herpetoculturist.. in approximate order of importance. --- To make changes to your subscription contact: Bill Southerly ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Pollak, Edward wrote: A few weeks ago I gave an exam in animal behavior and asked a question about Kamikaze sperm. One student asked what species a Kamikaze was. I then asked the next 4 students entering my office if they'd ever heard the word , kamikaze. The first three had never heard the word. I'm convinced that the problem is that most students no longer read for pleasure. Really? I bet if you ask them what a suicide bomber or an IED is, they'd have a pretty good idea (which is the rough equivalent in modern terms). Kamikazes are ancient history to today's student. *We* know what they were because they were a stock figure in many popular movies of our generations (asnd some of us may be old enough to remember them a mews items). But now they are as arcane as a hoplite phalanx or a Viking berserk. Chris -- Christopher D. Green Department of Psychology York University Toronto, ON M3J 1P3 Canada [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.yorku.ca/christo/ phone: 416-736-2100 ext. 66164 fax: 416-736-5814 ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
I have a colleague who claimed that you only needed the answer to one question to predict college success: How often do you read for pleasure? Ken Pollak, Edward wrote: A few weeks ago I gave an exam in animal behavior and asked a question about Kamikaze sperm. One student asked what species a Kamikaze was. I then asked the next 4 students entering my office if they'd ever heard the word , kamikaze. The first three had never heard the word. I'm convinced that the problem is that most students no longer read for pleasure. This has been problematic for years but is getting worse. Try asking your student if, as children, they ever read books (not magazines) just for fun. It's no wonder their general knowledge is so pathetic. And there's a BIG difference between looking up the definitive of a specific word on line and learning words incidentally while reading a book. Even looking words up in a dictionary is better because you naturally do a little browsing of other words when you look it up. That's not as easy/common when looking up a definition on line. The Kindly Old Curmudgeon / /Edward I. Pollak, Ph.D./ /Department of Psychology/ /West Chester University of Pennsylvania/ Office Hours: Mondays noon-2 and 3-4 p.m.; Tuesdays Thursdays 8-9:00 a.m. 12:30-1:30 p.m. /http://mywebpages.comcast.net/epollak/home.htm/ // /Husband, father, grandfather, biopsychologist, bluegrass fiddler and herpetoculturist.. in approximate order of importance./ --- Kenneth M. Steele, Ph.D. [EMAIL PROTECTED] Professor Department of Psychology http://www.psych.appstate.edu Appalachian State University Boone, NC 28608 USA --- ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Your colleague's post raises an interesting question for -- Original message -- From: Ken Steele [EMAIL PROTECTED] I have a colleague who claimed that you only needed the answer to one question to predict college success: How often do you read for pleasure? Ken Pollak, Edward wrote: A few weeks ago I gave an exam in animal behavior and asked a question about Kamikaze sperm. One student asked what species a Kamikaze was. I then asked the next 4 students entering my office if they'd ever heard the word , kamikaze. The first three had never heard the word. I'm convinced that the problem is that most students no longer read for pleasure. This has been problematic for years but is getting worse. Try asking your student if, as children, they ever read books (not magazines) just for fun. It's no wonder their general knowledge is so pathetic. And there's a BIG difference between looking up the definitive of a specific word on line and learning words incidentally while reading a book. Even looking words up in a dictionary is better because you naturally do a little browsing of other words when you look it up. That's not as easy/common when looking up a definition on line. The Kindly Old Curmudgeon / /Edward I. Pollak, Ph.D./ /Department of Psychology/ /West Chester University of Pennsylvania/ Office Hours: Mondays noon-2 and 3-4 p.m.; Tuesdays Thursdays 8-9:00 a.m. 12:30-1:30 p.m. /http://mywebpages.comcast.net/epollak/home.htm/ // /Husband, father, grandfather, biopsychologist, bluegrass fiddler and herpetoculturist.. in approximate order of importance./ --- Kenneth M. Steele, Ph.D. [EMAIL PROTECTED] Professor Department of Psychology http://www.psych.appstate.edu Appalachian State University Boone, NC 28608 USA --- --- ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Annette- Count your blessings. In our community more than 50% of the people speak a language other than English at home. On a recent exam I had a question that read in part, Susan was reaching under a fence for a squash when she hit her head on a post. One of the students didn't know what squash meant, but what was worse was that she also didn't know what post meant either! I'm real glad that I'm only two years away from retirement. -Don. Don Allen Dept. of Psychology Langara College 100 W. 49th Ave. Vancouver, B.C. Canada V5Y 2Z6 Phone: 604-323-5871 - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sunday, November 18, 2007 2:12 pm Subject: [tips] Am I expecting too much? To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) tips@acsun.frostburg.edu Perhaps times are changing and my students know different vocabulary than mine, but I have had some laughers on the last two tests, except it has me concerned that I may be getting so old that I am losing touch; or the students are truly ill-prepared for life in general. I would except students to be knowledgeable about life in general just from reading. Maybe these students, whose *average* GPA in high school (these are incoming freshmen in intro psych and I have all of their admissions data) EXCEEDED 3.8 because of honors and AP classes are getting short-changed? I used a standard item on the learning test and asked for the schedule of reinforcement for various behaviors. I used fly fishing as one item. I got the most outrageous answers: the fish will learn to fly to get fed; you can catch more flying fish; fish will go faster if they fly than if they swim, etc. And then there were at least a dozen students who gave simply incorrect answers without embarassing themselves (probably didn't understand schedules of rf anyway) and another dozen who flat out came up and asked me what 'fly fishing' is. Ok, I let that slide. So now we have another exam, now over the developmental chapter: M A N Y students came up to ask me the meaning of the words innate and longevity and many more missed an item on Head Start. We talked about Head Start in class, but I didn't go into explaining what it is all about. I guess I'm teaching kids whose families would never have qualified and they never heard of it because the exam item required them to go a bit beyond what we talked about and very many of my students couldn't because they had no context for what they had memorized by rote. One of the foils on the multiple choice item referred to middle- class and was clearly incorrect because middle-class children wouldn't qualify for Head Start. Many selected that foil as correct, and wrote in the margin their explanation (I allow this on items the student wants to challenge) and I got all kinds of answers about middle this and middle that. Wow, what's up with all this? I'm feeling either very very old or exceptionally well educated in a broad way. Annette Annette Kujawski Taylor, Ph.D. Professor of Psychology University of San Diego 5998 Alcala Park San Diego, CA 92110 619-260-4006 [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
This reflects an obvious reality that for some reason people are turning summersaults attempting to deny: College students of today are approximately at the base knowledge level of junior high-high school students of just a few decades ago. It's happening as fast as global warming. Paul Okami - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) tips@acsun.frostburg.edu Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 5:11 PM Subject: [tips] Am I expecting too much? Perhaps times are changing and my students know different vocabulary than mine, but I have had some laughers on the last two tests, except it has me concerned that I may be getting so old that I am losing touch; or the students are truly ill-prepared for life in general. I would except students to be knowledgeable about life in general just from reading. Maybe these students, whose *average* GPA in high school (these are incoming freshmen in intro psych and I have all of their admissions data) EXCEEDED 3.8 because of honors and AP classes are getting short-changed? I used a standard item on the learning test and asked for the schedule of reinforcement for various behaviors. I used fly fishing as one item. I got the most outrageous answers: the fish will learn to fly to get fed; you can catch more flying fish; fish will go faster if they fly than if they swim, etc. And then there were at least a dozen students who gave simply incorrect answers without embarassing themselves (probably didn't understand schedules of rf anyway) and another dozen who flat out came up and asked me what 'fly fishing' is. Ok, I let that slide. So now we have another exam, now over the developmental chapter: M A N Y students came up to ask me the meaning of the words innate and longevity and many more missed an item on Head Start. We talked about Head Start in class, but I didn't go into explaining what it is all about. I guess I'm teaching kids whose families would never have qualified and they never heard of it because the exam item required them to go a bit beyond what we talked about and very many of my students couldn't because they had no context for what they had memorized by rote. One of the foils on the multiple choice item referred to middle-class and was clearly incorrect because middle-class children wouldn't qualify for Head Start. Many selected that foil as correct, and wrote in the margin their explanation (I allow this on items the student wants to challenge) and I got all kinds of answers about middle this and middle that. Wow, what's up with all this? I'm feeling either very very old or exceptionally well educated in a broad way. Annette Annette Kujawski Taylor, Ph.D. Professor of Psychology University of San Diego 5998 Alcala Park San Diego, CA 92110 619-260-4006 [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- __ NOD32 2665 (20071117) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Annette-- I never make assumptions about cultural knowledge. There is simply too much out there to know, and I can't see any reason why a person can say that it's important to know what fly fishing is, but not important to know what, say, the different types of manga are (which many of your students are likely to know more about than you). I think it's reasonable not to know what Head Start is, especially if you're 18 and no one in your family or neighborhood would qualify for it. I would also say that not knowing what fly fishing is is legitimate ... I had to look it up to be sure I knew, myself. I'm ichthyophobic, it doesn't come up much for me. Vocabulary is different. I would always explain cultural references (had to tell one kid what the society page in a newspaper was, which also seems legit to me), but told students that if they didn't understand a word in the textbook, it was up to them to look it up. I'm not a dictionary. Any words on an exam that were related to the material (as longevity and innate would be in a dev. class) they needed to know going in. Anything that wasn't related to the material, I would explain on the day of an exam. Robin Robin Abrahams www.boston.com/missconduct Notices at the bottom of this e-mail do not reflect the opinions of the sender. I do not yahoo that I am aware of. ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Count your blessings. In our community more than 50% of the people speak a language other than English at home. On a recent exam I had a question that read in part, Susan was reaching under a fence for a squash when she hit her head on a post. One of the students didn't know what squash meant, but what was worse was that she also didn't know what post meant either! I'm real glad that I'm only two years away from retirement. -Don. Don Allen Dept. of Psychology Langara College 100 W. 49th Ave. Vancouver, B.C. Canada V5Y 2Z6 Phone: 604-323-5871 Will knowing these help him get a better paying job? Just because one lacks linguistic intelligence is no implication that one may not excel in other forms of intelligence.I know a mechanic who never graduated from High School who can diagnose an automobile by the sound of the engine. Michael Sylvester,PhD Daytona Beach,Florida ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Hi Annette, Do they have fly-fishing on MtV? or My Space? I discovered several years ago, that my urban-suburban students never heard of fly-fishing. I started to include and explanation of it in my lectures...a sign of the times... Jim Jim Matiya Moraine Valley Community College [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003 Moffett Memorial Teaching Excellence Award of the Society for the Teaching of Psychology (Division Two of the American Psychological Association)New webpage: http://online.morainevalley.edu/WebSupported/JimMatiya/ Using David Myers' texts for AP Psychology? Go to http://bcs.worthpublishers.com/cppsych/ High School Psychology and Advanced Psychology Graphic Organizers, Pacing Guides, and Daily Lesson Plans archived at www.Teaching-Point.net - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) tips@acsun.frostburg.edu Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 5:11 PM Subject: [tips] Am I expecting too much?Perhaps times are changing and my students know different vocabulary than mine, but I have had some laughers on the last two tests, except it has me concerned that I may be getting so old that I am losing touch; or the students are truly ill-prepared for life in general. I would except students to be knowledgeable about life in general just from reading. Maybe these students, whose *average* GPA in high school (these are incoming freshmen in intro psych and I have all of their admissions data) EXCEEDED 3.8 because of honors and AP classes are getting short-changed? I used a standard item on the learning test and asked for the schedule of reinforcement for various behaviors. I used fly fishing as one item. I got the most outrageous answers: the fish will learn to fly to get fed; you can catch more flying fish; fish will go faster if they fly than if they swim, etc. And then there were at least a dozen students who gave simply incorrect answers without embarassing themselves (probably didn't understand schedules of rf anyway) and another dozen who flat out came up and asked me what 'fly fishing' is. Ok, I let that slide. So now we have another exam, now over the developmental chapter: M A N Y students came up to ask me the meaning of the words innate and longevity and many more missed an item on Head Start. We talked about Head Start in class, but I didn't go into explaining what it is all about. I guess I'm teaching kids whose families would never have qualified and they never heard of it because the exam item required them to go a bit beyond what we talked about and very many of my students couldn't because they had no context for what they had memorized by rote. One of the foils on the multiple choice item referred to middle-class and was clearly incorrect because middle-class children wouldn't qualify for Head Start. Many selected that foil as correct, and wrote in the margin their explanation (I allow this on items the student wants to challenge) and I got all kinds of answers about middle this and middle that. Wow, what's up with all this? I'm feeling either very very old or exceptionally well educated in a broad way. AnnetteAnnette Kujawski Taylor, Ph.D. Professor of Psychology University of San Diego 5998 Alcala Park San Diego, CA 92110 619-260-4006 [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- __ NOD32 2665 (20071117) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com --- ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
What about Abu-Gharib; must not be on myspace either. I tried using that as a more recent example of events that might, at least in part, be predicted by the Stanford Prison Study (I know there are controversies about the original study AND about the connection between the two but I just wanted it to be more relevant). Blank stares. Sigh. Annette Annette Kujawski Taylor, Ph.D. Professor of Psychology University of San Diego 5998 Alcala Park San Diego, CA 92110 619-260-4006 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Original message Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 19:43:20 -0600 From: Jim Matiya [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much? To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) tips@acsun.frostburg.edu Hi Annette, Do they have fly-fishing on MtV? or My Space? I discovered several years ago, that my urban-suburban students never heard of fly-fishing. I started to include and explanation of it in my lectures...a sign of the times... Jim Jim Matiya Moraine Valley Community College [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2003 Moffett Memorial Teaching Excellence Award of the Society for the Teaching of Psychology (Division Two of the American Psychological Association) New webpage: http://online.morainevalley.edu/WebSupported/JimMatiya/ Using David Myers' texts for AP Psychology? Go to http://bcs.worthpublishers.com/cppsych/ High School Psychology and Advanced Psychology Graphic Organizers, Pacing Guides, and Daily Lesson Plans archived at www.Teaching-Point.net - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) tips@acsun.frostburg.edu Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 5:11 PM Subject: [tips] Am I expecting too much? Perhaps times are changing and my students know different vocabulary than mine, but I have had some laughers on the last two tests, except it has me concerned that I may be getting so old that I am losing touch; or the students are truly ill-prepared for life in general. I would except students to be knowledgeable about life in general just from reading. Maybe these students, whose *average* GPA in high school (these are incoming freshmen in intro psych and I have all of their admissions data) EXCEEDED 3.8 because of honors and AP classes are getting short-changed? I used a standard item on the learning test and asked for the schedule of reinforcement for various behaviors. I used fly fishing as one item. I got the most outrageous answers: the fish will learn to fly to get fed; you can catch more flying fish; fish will go faster if they fly than if they swim, etc. And then there were at least a dozen students who gave simply incorrect answers without embarassing themselves (probably didn't understand schedules of rf anyway) and another dozen who flat out came up and asked me what 'fly fishing' is. Ok, I let that slide. So now we have another exam, now over the developmental chapter: M A N Y students came up to ask me the meaning of the words innate and longevity and many more missed an item on Head Start. We talked about Head Start in class, but I didn't go into explaining what it is all about. I guess I'm teaching kids whose families would never have qualified and they never heard of it because the exam item required them to go a bit beyond what we talked about and very many of my students couldn't because they had no context for what they had memorized by rote. One of the foils on the multiple choice item referred to middle-class and was clearly incorrect because middle-class children wouldn't qualify for Head Start. Many selected that foil as correct, and wrote in the margin their explanation (I allow this on items the student wants to challenge) and I got all kinds of answers about middle this and middle that. Wow, what's up with all this? I'm feeling either very very old or exceptionally well educated in a broad way. Annette Annette Kujawski Taylor, Ph.D. Professor of Psychology University of San Diego 5998 Alcala Park San Diego, CA 92110 619-260-4006 [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- __ NOD32 2665 (20071117) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com --- --- To make changes to your subscription contact: Bill Southerly ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Are these students who would have attended college 25 years ago? At 4:11 PM -0600 11/18/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Perhaps times are changing and my students know different vocabulary than mine, but I have had some laughers on the last two tests, except it has me concerned that I may be getting so old that I am losing touch; or the students are truly ill-prepared for life in general. I would except students to be knowledgeable about life in general just from reading. Maybe these students, whose *average* GPA in high school (these are incoming freshmen in intro psych and I have all of their admissions data) EXCEEDED 3.8 because of honors and AP classes are getting short-changed? I used a standard item on the learning test and asked for the schedule of reinforcement for various behaviors. I used fly fishing as one item. I got the most outrageous answers: the fish will learn to fly to get fed; you can catch more flying fish; fish will go faster if they fly than if they swim, etc. And then there were at least a dozen students who gave simply incorrect answers without embarassing themselves (probably didn't understand schedules of rf anyway) and another dozen who flat out came up and asked me what 'fly fishing' is. Ok, I let that slide. So now we have another exam, now over the developmental chapter: M A N Y students came up to ask me the meaning of the words innate and longevity and many more missed an item on Head Start. We talked about Head Start in class, but I didn't go into explaining what it is all about. I guess I'm teaching kids whose families would never have qualified and they never heard of it because the exam item required them to go a bit beyond what we talked about and very many of my students couldn't because they had no context for what they had memorized by rote. One of the foils on the multiple choice item referred to middle-class and was clearly incorrect because middle-class children wouldn't qualify for Head Start. Many selected that foil as correct, and wrote in the margin their explanation (I allow this on items the student wants to challenge) and I got all kinds of answers about middle this and middle that. Wow, what's up with all this? I'm feeling either very very old or exceptionally well educated in a broad way. -- The best argument against intelligent design is that people believe in it. * PAUL K. BRANDON [EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Psychology Department507-389-6217 * * 23 Armstrong Hall Minnesota State University, Mankato * *http://krypton.mnsu.edu/~pkbrando/ * ---
Re: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
At 4:37 PM -0600 11/18/07, Michael Sylvester wrote: Maybe. Let us not forget the epistemological approach of Piaget-assimilation and accomodation.If the mountain will not come to us,we must go to the mountain.Btw,everyclimber may require different tools In other words, it's not only the students who don't make sense. -- The best argument against intelligent design is that people believe in it. * PAUL K. BRANDON [EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Psychology Department507-389-6217 * * 23 Armstrong Hall Minnesota State University, Mankato * *http://krypton.mnsu.edu/~pkbrando/ * ---
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
I don't think you are expecting too much but I'm feeling pretty frustrated right now. I have had to be away from my classes for three weeks due to a family emergency (my daughter had to have heart surgery and needed someone with her in Houston). At first I had someone cover for me, but that only worked for about a week. I've been posting study guides and other material on Blackboard and I just assigned them an open-book test. One of the chapters covered on the test was one I expected them to read on their own. They had a study guide that I developed for them, they had the textbook, they had the CD that came with the book, and I told them they could use any other source they wanted except each other. I just got an angry e-mail from one student about how she thought it was unfair that I was testing them on material not covered in class. I guess things weren't working as well as I thought. On the other hand, I also expected...I don't know what I expected. Too much I guess. Carol Carol L. DeVolder, Ph.D. Professor of Psychology Chair, Department of Psychology St. Ambrose University 518 West Locust Street Davenport, Iowa 52803 Phone: 563-333-6482 e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] web: http://web.sau.edu/psychology/psychfaculty/cdevolder.htm The contents of this message are confidential and may not be shared with anyone without permission of the sender. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sun 11/18/2007 4:11 PM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: [tips] Am I expecting too much? Perhaps times are changing and my students know different vocabulary than mine, but I have had some laughers on the last two tests, except it has me concerned that I may be getting so old that I am losing touch; or the students are truly ill-prepared for life in general. I would except students to be knowledgeable about life in general just from reading. Maybe these students, whose *average* GPA in high school (these are incoming freshmen in intro psych and I have all of their admissions data) EXCEEDED 3.8 because of honors and AP classes are getting short-changed? I used a standard item on the learning test and asked for the schedule of reinforcement for various behaviors. I used fly fishing as one item. I got the most outrageous answers: the fish will learn to fly to get fed; you can catch more flying fish; fish will go faster if they fly than if they swim, etc. And then there were at least a dozen students who gave simply incorrect answers without embarassing themselves (probably didn't understand schedules of rf anyway) and another dozen who flat out came up and asked me what 'fly fishing' is. Ok, I let that slide. So now we have another exam, now over the developmental chapter: M A N Y students came up to ask me the meaning of the words innate and longevity and many more missed an item on Head Start. We talked about Head Start in class, but I didn't go into explaining what it is all about. I guess I'm teaching kids whose families would never have qualified and they never heard of it because the exam item required them to go a bit beyond what we talked about and very many of my students couldn't because they had no context for what they had memorized by rote. One of the foils on the multiple choice item referred to middle-class and was clearly incorrect because middle-class children wouldn't qualify for Head Start. Many selected that foil as correct, and wrote in the margin their explanation (I allow this on items the student wants to challenge) and I got all kinds of answers about middle this and middle that. Wow, what's up with all this? I'm feeling either very very old or exceptionally well educated in a broad way. Annette Annette Kujawski Taylor, Ph.D. Professor of Psychology University of San Diego 5998 Alcala Park San Diego, CA 92110 619-260-4006 [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- ---winmail.dat
RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much?
Jim- You asked- (I have no idea how many of these there are or how far this goes, but YouTube. . . ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2SgcCw6I8Mfeature=related So lack of video instruction can't be it- Have fun. Tim ___ Timothy O. Shearon, PhD Professor and Chair Department of Psychology The College of Idaho Caldwell, ID 83605 email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] teaching: intro to neuropsychology; psychopharmacology; general; history and systems -Original Message- From: Jim Matiya [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sun 11/18/2007 6:43 PM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: RE: [tips] Am I expecting too much? Hi Annette, Do they have fly-fishing on MtV? or My Space? I discovered several years ago, that my urban-suburban students never heard of fly-fishing. I started to include and explanation of it in my lectures...a sign of the times... Jim ---winmail.dat
