Re: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away
...I was up in Tobermory :-) with no internet so happily couldn't respond to Mike P's deeply insightful reply (lol). The funniest was the insights and understandings part, especially considering Mike P here: Ah, irony! I love it when it comes so think one can cut it with a knife. Quoting from the article: Research results not consistent with your world view? Then you're likely to believe science can't supply all the answers I suppose that Mike believes that the statement is obviously true--after all, it was in a popular article and he considers the article's conclusions so strong that they are worth quoting! ...Now there's an insightful soccer-science at its best. All in all, pretty funny. --Mike --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=3604 or send a blank email to leave-3604-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away | Ben Goldacre | Comment is free | The Guardian
I wonder if scientists are people too. I hope the implication of the author of the article isn't that science can address all issues, which it clearly can't...especially the social sciences which just aren't on par with the physical sciences. --Mike On Mon, Jul 12, 2010 at 11:39 PM, Christopher D. Green chri...@yorku.ca wrote: Here is a description of an interesting study that might be of use in a critical thinking course (or cognition, or social psych, or methods). Apparently when you confront people with evidence that runs contrary to their pre-existing beliefs, they not only argue that science cannot address the question, they also often generalize that opinion of science to a wide range of other topics as well. http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/jul/03/confirmation-bias-scientific-evidence Chrsi -- Christopher D. Green Department of Psychology York University Toronto, ON M3J 1P3 Canada 416-736-2100 ex. 66164 chri...@yorku.ca http://www.yorku.ca/christo/ == --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: tipsl...@gmail.com. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13541.42a7e8017ab9578358f118300f4720fbn=Tl=tipso=3543 (It may be necessary to cut and paste the above URL if the line is broken) or send a blank email to leave-3543-13541.42a7e8017ab9578358f118300f472...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=3548 or send a blank email to leave-3548-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away | Ben Goldacre | Comment is free | The Guardian
Yes, and we see similar responses around us all the time...even here on TIPS. But what is up with the picture of Frankenstein?! Perhaps this is Ben G's idea of science? Perhaps Scott L. might find that of interest re: characterizations of science...and psych? Findings from Psych, relevant to our everyday experiences, are even more likely to be challenging and thus lead to rejection of Psych as science? GPeterson Gary's iPad On Jul 13, 2010, at 12:38 AM, Christopher D. Green chri...@yorku.ca wrote: Here is a description of an interesting study that might be of use in a critical thinking course (or cognition, or social psych, or methods). Apparently when you confront people with evidence that runs contrary to their pre-existing beliefs, they not only argue that science cannot address the question, they also often generalize that opinion of science to a wide range of other topics as well. http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/jul/03/confirmation-bias-scientific-evidence Chrsi -- Christopher D. Green Department of Psychology York University Toronto, ON M3J 1P3 Canada 416-736-2100 ex. 66164 chri...@yorku.ca http://www.yorku.ca/christo/ == --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: peter...@svsu.edu. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13445.e3edca0f6e68bfb76eaf26a8eb6dd94bn=Tl=tipso=3543 (It may be necessary to cut and paste the above URL if the line is broken) or send a blank email to leave-3543-13445.e3edca0f6e68bfb76eaf26a8eb6dd...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=3551 or send a blank email to leave-3551-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away | Ben Goldacre | Comment is free | The Guardian
Gary, Ben Goldacre's regular Guardian column is called Bad Science, and is usually concerned with pseudoscience that is in the public eye (homeopathy, chiropractic, psychic phenomena, creationism, internet addiction, etc.). That is why he uses Frankenstein as his icon. Goldacre' column is consistently one of the best public science news column in the English-speaking world. Chris -- Christopher D. Green Department of Psychology York University Toronto, ON M3J 1P3 Canada 416-736-2100 ex. 66164 chri...@yorku.ca http://www.yorku.ca/christo/ == peter...@svsu.edu wrote: Yes, and we see similar responses around us all the time...even here on TIPS. But what is up with the picture of Frankenstein?! Perhaps this is Ben G's idea of science? Perhaps Scott L. might find that of interest re: characterizations of science...and psych? Findings from Psych, relevant to our everyday experiences, are even more likely to be challenging and thus lead to rejection of Psych as science? GPeterson Gary's iPad On Jul 13, 2010, at 12:38 AM, Christopher D. Green chri...@yorku.ca mailto:chri...@yorku.ca wrote: Here is a description of an interesting study that might be of use in a critical thinking course (or cognition, or social psych, or methods). Apparently when you confront people with evidence that runs contrary to their pre-existing beliefs, they not only argue that science cannot address the question, they also often generalize that opinion of science to a wide range of other topics as well. http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/jul/03/confirmation-bias-scientific-evidence Chrsi -- Christopher D. Green Department of Psychology York University Toronto, ON M3J 1P3 Canada 416-736-2100 ex. 66164 chri...@yorku.ca mailto:chri...@yorku.ca http://www.yorku.ca/christo/ == --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: peter...@svsu.edu mailto:peter...@svsu.edu. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13445.e3edca0f6e68bfb76eaf26a8eb6dd94bn=Tl=tipso=3543 http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13445.e3edca0f6e68bfb76eaf26a8eb6dd94bn=Tl=tipso=3543 (It may be necessary to cut and paste the above URL if the line is broken) or send a blank email to leave-3543-13445.e3edca0f6e68bfb76eaf26a8eb6dd...@fsulist.frostburg.edu mailto:leave-3543-13445.e3edca0f6e68bfb76eaf26a8eb6dd...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: chri...@yorku.ca mailto:chri...@yorku.ca. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13132.a868d710aa4ef67a68807ce4fe8bd0dan=Tl=tipso=3551 http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13132.a868d710aa4ef67a68807ce4fe8bd0dan=Tl=tipso=3551 (It may be necessary to cut and paste the above URL if the line is broken) or send a blank email to leave-3551-13132.a868d710aa4ef67a68807ce4fe8bd...@fsulist.frostburg.edu mailto:leave-3551-13132.a868d710aa4ef67a68807ce4fe8bd...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=3555 or send a blank email to leave-3555-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away | Ben Goldacre | Comment is free | The Guardian
And of course the picture is not of Victor Frankenstein, but of the monster that he created (an icon for Bad Science?). Paul Brandon Emeritus Professor of Psychology Minnesota State University, Mankato paul.bran...@mnsu.edu On Jul 13, 2010, at 7:59 AM, peter...@svsu.edu peter...@svsu.edu wrote: Yes, and we see similar responses around us all the time...even here on TIPS. But what is up with the picture of Frankenstein?! Perhaps this is Ben G's idea of science? Perhaps Scott L. might find that of interest re: characterizations of science...and psych? Findings from Psych, relevant to our everyday experiences, are even more likely to be challenging and thus lead to rejection of Psych as science? --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=3556 or send a blank email to leave-3556-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away | Ben Goldacre | Comment is free | The Guardian
Yes, I am familiar with Ben G's writing. Yes, it is indeed Frankenstein's monster. I wonder if it is still typically seen however as a representation of the horrors of science gone wild. Gary GPeterson Gary's iPad On Jul 13, 2010, at 10:03 AM, Christopher D. Green chri...@yorku.ca wrote: Gary, Ben Goldacre's regular Guardian column is called Bad Science, and is usually concerned with pseudoscience that is in the public eye (homeopathy, chiropractic, psychic phenomena, creationism, internet addiction, etc.). That is why he uses Frankenstein as his icon. Goldacre' column is consistently one of the best public science news column in the English-speaking world. Chris -- Christopher D. Green Department of Psychology York University Toronto, ON M3J 1P3 Canada �� 416-736-2100 ex. 66164 chri...@yorku.ca http://www.yorku.ca/christo/ == peter...@svsu.edu wrote: �� Yes, and we see similar responses around us all the time...even here on TIPS. ��But what is up with the picture of Frankenstein?! Perhaps this is Ben G's idea of science? ��Perhaps�� Scott L. might find that of interest re: characterizations of science...and psych? ��Findings from Psych, ��relevant to our everyday experiences, are even more likely to be challenging and thus lead to rejection of Psych as science? �� �� GPeterson Gary's iPad On Jul 13, 2010, at 12:38 AM, Christopher D. Green chri...@yorku.ca wrote: �� Here is a description of an interesting study that might be of use in a critical thinking course (or cognition, or social psych, or methods). Apparently when you confront people with evidence that runs contrary to their pre-existing beliefs, they not only argue that science cannot address the question, they also often generalize that opinion of science to a wide range of other topics as well. http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/jul/03/confirmation-bias-scientific-evidence Chrsi -- Christopher D. Green Department of Psychology York University Toronto, ON M3J 1P3 Canada �� 416-736-2100 ex. 66164 chri...@yorku.ca http://www.yorku.ca/christo/ == --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: peter...@svsu.edu. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13445.e3edca0f6e68bfb76eaf26a8eb6dd94bn=Tl=tipso=3543 (It may be necessary to cut and paste the above URL if the line is broken) or send a blank email to leave-3543-13445.e3edca0f6e68bfb76eaf26a8eb6dd...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: chri...@yorku.ca. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13132.a868d710aa4ef67a68807ce4fe8bd0dan=Tl=tipso=3551 (It may be necessary to cut and paste the above URL if the line is broken) or send a blank email to leave-3551-13132.a868d710aa4ef67a68807ce4fe8bd...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: peter...@svsu.edu. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13445.e3edca0f6e68bfb76eaf26a8eb6dd94bn=Tl=tipso=3555 (It may be necessary to cut and paste the above URL if the line is broken) or send a blank email to leave-3555-13445.e3edca0f6e68bfb76eaf26a8eb6dd...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=3557 or send a blank email to leave-3557-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
RE: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away | Ben Goldacre | Comment is free | The Guardian
But in what sense was Frankenstein's creation (monster seems a non-PC insult to a creature that had to deal as best he could with some faulty biology and terrible self-esteem problems, not to mention an absence of love from his significant others) a result of bad science? If actually possible, such a thing (the re-animation of dead tissue) would be top-notch breakthrough science even today. His problem was not one of methodology but of morality. Just because you can do something doesn't mean you should. What you can do is the realm of science; what you should do, not so much. Rick Dr. Rick Froman, Chair Division of Humanities and Social Sciences Professor of Psychology Box 3055 John Brown University 2000 W. University Siloam Springs, AR 72761 rfro...@jbu.edu (479)524-7295 http://tinyurl.com/DrFroman -Original Message- From: Paul Brandon [mailto:paul.bran...@mnsu.edu] Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 9:40 AM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: Re: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away | Ben Goldacre | Comment is free | The Guardian And of course the picture is not of Victor Frankenstein, but of the monster that he created (an icon for Bad Science?). Paul Brandon Emeritus Professor of Psychology Minnesota State University, Mankato paul.bran...@mnsu.edu On Jul 13, 2010, at 7:59 AM, peter...@svsu.edu peter...@svsu.edu wrote: Yes, and we see similar responses around us all the time...even here on TIPS. But what is up with the picture of Frankenstein?! Perhaps this is Ben G's idea of science? Perhaps Scott L. might find that of interest re: characterizations of science...and psych? Findings from Psych, relevant to our everyday experiences, are even more likely to be challenging and thus lead to rejection of Psych as science? --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: rfro...@jbu.edu. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13039.37a56d458b5e856d05bcfb3322db5f8an=Tl=tipso=3556 or send a blank email to leave-3556-13039.37a56d458b5e856d05bcfb3322db5...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=3559 or send a blank email to leave-3559-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away | Ben Goldacre | Comment is free | The Guardian
I wouldn't interpret the author's icon as an example of bad science, he's just on the lookout for bad science. Anyway, if you use the iGoogle page you can get a newsfeed gadget of the Ben Goldacre column. RS On Tue, Jul 13, 2010 at 9:59 AM, Rick Froman rfro...@jbu.edu wrote: But in what sense was Frankenstein's creation (monster seems a non-PC insult to a creature that had to deal as best he could with some faulty biology and terrible self-esteem problems, not to mention an absence of love from his significant others) a result of bad science? If actually possible, such a thing (the re-animation of dead tissue) would be top-notch breakthrough science even today. His problem was not one of methodology but of morality. Just because you can do something doesn't mean you should. What you can do is the realm of science; what you should do, not so much. Rick Dr. Rick Froman, Chair Division of Humanities and Social Sciences Professor of Psychology Box 3055 John Brown University 2000 W. University Siloam Springs, AR 72761 rfro...@jbu.edu (479)524-7295 http://tinyurl.com/DrFroman -Original Message- From: Paul Brandon [mailto:paul.bran...@mnsu.edu] Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 9:40 AM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: Re: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away | Ben Goldacre | Comment is free | The Guardian And of course the picture is not of Victor Frankenstein, but of the monster that he created (an icon for Bad Science?). Paul Brandon Emeritus Professor of Psychology Minnesota State University, Mankato paul.bran...@mnsu.edu On Jul 13, 2010, at 7:59 AM, peter...@svsu.edu peter...@svsu.edu wrote: Yes, and we see similar responses around us all the time...even here on TIPS. But what is up with the picture of Frankenstein?! Perhaps this is Ben G's idea of science? Perhaps Scott L. might find that of interest re: characterizations of science...and psych? Findings from Psych, relevant to our everyday experiences, are even more likely to be challenging and thus lead to rejection of Psych as science? --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: rfro...@jbu.edu. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13039.37a56d458b5e856d05bcfb3322db5f8an=Tl=tipso=3556 or send a blank email to leave-3556-13039.37a56d458b5e856d05bcfb3322db5...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: stevens.r...@gmail.com. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13526.d532f8e870faf8a0d8f6433b7952f38dn=Tl=tipso=3559 or send a blank email to leave-3559-13526.d532f8e870faf8a0d8f6433b7952f...@fsulist.frostburg.edu -- Rick Stevens Psychology Department University of Louisiana at Monroe stevens.r...@gmail.com SL - Evert Snook --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=3560 or send a blank email to leave-3560-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away
Massimo Pigliucci's book Nonsense on Stilts, part of my summer reading, does a nice job of exploring these ideas and misconceptions. Gary GPeterson Gary's iPad On Jul 13, 2010, at 12:01 PM, Marc Carter marc.car...@bakeru.edu wrote: -Original Message- From: Mike Palij [mailto:m...@nyu.edu] On Tue, 13 Jul 2010 01:07:19 -0700, Michael Smith wrote: [snippage snipped] especially the social sciences which just aren't on par with the physical sciences. This is a curious statement because it assumes that there is a common metric that one can use to compare the achievements in different domains of the sciences. I wonder which metric(s) Prof. Smith is using as the basis for this? Can he enlighten us? I share your curiosity. I often get into this discussion with people in the hard sciences. When I ask them to tell me what differentiates a hard from soft science, they can't do it. When I ask them why biology is considered a hard science, especially given parts of biology that are in no way I can determine different from psychological science, they can't tell me. So I would really like to know. Science is method, not content, and doesn't have anything to do with the difference in variability or reliability of the result. It's a method for finding things out (or more accurately, it's a method for telling you when you're wrong). Physics uses it, biology uses it, psychology uses, and so on. I don't get the distinction between hard and soft science -- it literally makes no sense to me. We differ in technique, in subject of investigation, in accuracy in prediction (for many things -- things which I as a behaviorist would say are due to the scientists' ignorance and not anything intrinsic to the subject). But none of those have to do with the method. m The information contained in this e-mail and any attachments thereto (e-mail) is sent by Baker University (BU) and is intended to be confidential and for the use of only the individual or entity named above. The information may be protected by federal and state privacy and disclosures acts or other legal rules. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified that retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error please immediately notify Baker University by email reply and immediately and permanently delete this e-mail message and any attachments thereto. Thank you. --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: peter...@svsu.edu. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13445.e3edca0f6e68bfb76eaf26a8eb6dd94bn=Tl=tipso=3561 or send a blank email to leave-3561-13445.e3edca0f6e68bfb76eaf26a8eb6dd...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=3562 or send a blank email to leave-3562-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
RE: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away | Ben Goldacre | Comment is free | The Guardian
Michael, what does just aren't on par with the physical sciences mean? I hope this isn't a reference to the hardsciences (physical sciences) and the soft sciences (social sciences); sigh. Joann Jelly From: Michael Smith [mailto:tipsl...@gmail.com] Sent: Tue 7/13/2010 1:07 AM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: Re: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away | Ben Goldacre | Comment is free | The Guardian I wonder if scientists are people too. I hope the implication of the author of the article isn't that science can address all issues, which it clearly can't...especially the social sciences which just aren't on par with the physical sciences. --Mike On Mon, Jul 12, 2010 at 11:39 PM, Christopher D. Green chri...@yorku.ca wrote: Here is a description of an interesting study that might be of use in a critical thinking course (or cognition, or social psych, or methods). Apparently when you confront people with evidence that runs contrary to their pre-existing beliefs, they not only argue that science cannot address the question, they also often generalize that opinion of science to a wide range of other topics as well. http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/jul/03/confirmation-bias-scientific-evidence Chrsi -- Christopher D. Green Department of Psychology York University Toronto, ON M3J 1P3 Canada 416-736-2100 ex. 66164 chri...@yorku.ca http://www.yorku.ca/christo/ == --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: tipsl...@gmail.com. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13541.42a7e8017ab9578358f118300f4720fbn=Tl=tipso=3543 (It may be necessary to cut and paste the above URL if the line is broken) or send a blank email to leave-3543-13541.42a7e8017ab9578358f118300f472...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: jje...@barstow.edu. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13010.76185584223b2f7b9f3a91a2f9913135n=Tl=tipso=3548 or send a blank email to leave-3548-13010.76185584223b2f7b9f3a91a2f9913...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=3563 or send a blank email to leave-3563-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away | Ben Goldacre | Comment is free | The Guardian
It means that social scientists have more time for golf. Paul Brandon Emeritus Professor of Psychology Minnesota State University, Mankato paul.bran...@mnsu.edu On Jul 13, 2010, at 12:23 PM, Joann Jelly wrote: Michael, what does just aren't on par with the physical sciences mean? I hope this isn't a reference to the hardsciences (physical sciences) and the soft sciences (social sciences); sigh. --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=3565 or send a blank email to leave-3565-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away
Wow, that is seriously well-written. I opened it on Google Books and it sucked me in immediately and for 45 minutes before coming up air to get back to work. Paul Paul Bernhardt Dept of Psychology Frostburg State University pcbernhardt _at_ frostburg _dot_ edu On Jul 13, 2010, at 12:07 PM, peter...@svsu.edu wrote: Massimo Pigliucci's book Nonsense on Stilts, part of my summer reading, does a nice job of exploring these ideas and misconceptions. Gary GPeterson Gary's iPad On Jul 13, 2010, at 12:01 PM, Marc Carter marc.car...@bakeru.edu wrote: -Original Message- From: Mike Palij [mailto:m...@nyu.edu] On Tue, 13 Jul 2010 01:07:19 -0700, Michael Smith wrote: [snippage snipped] especially the social sciences which just aren't on par with the physical sciences. This is a curious statement because it assumes that there is a common metric that one can use to compare the achievements in different domains of the sciences. I wonder which metric(s) Prof. Smith is using as the basis for this? Can he enlighten us? I share your curiosity. I often get into this discussion with people in the hard sciences. When I ask them to tell me what differentiates a hard from soft science, they can't do it. When I ask them why biology is considered a hard science, especially given parts of biology that are in no way I can determine different from psychological science, they can't tell me. So I would really like to know. Science is method, not content, and doesn't have anything to do with the difference in variability or reliability of the result. It's a method for finding things out (or more accurately, it's a method for telling you when you're wrong). Physics uses it, biology uses it, psychology uses, and so on. I don't get the distinction between hard and soft science -- it literally makes no sense to me. We differ in technique, in subject of investigation, in accuracy in prediction (for many things -- things which I as a behaviorist would say are due to the scientists' ignorance and not anything intrinsic to the subject). But none of those have to do with the method. m The information contained in this e-mail and any attachments thereto (e-mail) is sent by Baker University (BU) and is intended to be confidential and for the use of only the individual or entity named above. The information may be protected by federal and state privacy and disclosures acts or other legal rules. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified that retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error please immediately notify Baker University by email reply and immediately and permanently delete this e-mail message and any attachments thereto. Thank you. --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: peter...@svsu.edu. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13445.e3edca0f6e68bfb76eaf26a8eb6dd94bn=Tl=tipso=3561 or send a blank email to leave-3561-13445.e3edca0f6e68bfb76eaf26a8eb6dd...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: pcbernha...@frostburg.edu. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13441.4e79e96ebb5671bdb50111f18f263003n=Tl=tipso=3562 or send a blank email to leave-3562-13441.4e79e96ebb5671bdb50111f18f263...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=3566 or send a blank email to leave-3566-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
RE: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away
I just did the same thing, and ordered it. Right now Amazon's got it for $13.60... m -- Marc Carter, PhD Associate Professor and Chair Department of Psychology College of Arts Sciences Baker University -- -Original Message- From: Paul Bernhardt [mailto:pcbernha...@frostburg.edu] Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 1:27 PM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: Re: [tips] When the scientific evidence is unwelcome, people try to reason it away Wow, that is seriously well-written. I opened it on Google Books and it sucked me in immediately and for 45 minutes before coming up air to get back to work. Paul Paul Bernhardt Dept of Psychology Frostburg State University pcbernhardt _at_ frostburg _dot_ edu On Jul 13, 2010, at 12:07 PM, peter...@svsu.edu wrote: Massimo Pigliucci's book Nonsense on Stilts, part of my summer reading, does a nice job of exploring these ideas and misconceptions. Gary GPeterson Gary's iPad On Jul 13, 2010, at 12:01 PM, Marc Carter marc.car...@bakeru.edu wrote: -Original Message- From: Mike Palij [mailto:m...@nyu.edu] On Tue, 13 Jul 2010 01:07:19 -0700, Michael Smith wrote: [snippage snipped] especially the social sciences which just aren't on par with the physical sciences. This is a curious statement because it assumes that there is a common metric that one can use to compare the achievements in different domains of the sciences. I wonder which metric(s) Prof. Smith is using as the basis for this? Can he enlighten us? I share your curiosity. I often get into this discussion with people in the hard sciences. When I ask them to tell me what differentiates a hard from soft science, they can't do it. When I ask them why biology is considered a hard science, especially given parts of biology that are in no way I can determine different from psychological science, they can't tell me. So I would really like to know. Science is method, not content, and doesn't have anything to do with the difference in variability or reliability of the result. It's a method for finding things out (or more accurately, it's a method for telling you when you're wrong). Physics uses it, biology uses it, psychology uses, and so on. I don't get the distinction between hard and soft science -- it literally makes no sense to me. We differ in technique, in subject of investigation, in accuracy in prediction (for many things -- things which I as a behaviorist would say are due to the scientists' ignorance and not anything intrinsic to the subject). But none of those have to do with the method. m The information contained in this e-mail and any attachments thereto (e-mail) is sent by Baker University (BU) and is intended to be confidential and for the use of only the individual or entity named above. The information may be protected by federal and state privacy and disclosures acts or other legal rules. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified that retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error please immediately notify Baker University by email reply and immediately and permanently delete this e-mail message and any attachments thereto. Thank you. --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: peter...@svsu.edu. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13445.e3edca0f6e68bfb76eaf26a8eb6dd 94bn=Tl=tipso=3561 or send a blank email to leave-3561-13445.e3edca0f6e68bfb76eaf26a8eb6dd...@fsulist.frostburg.e du --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: pcbernha...@frostburg.edu. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13441.4e79e96ebb5671bdb50111f18f2630 03n=Tl=tipso=3562 or send a blank email to leave-3562-13441.4e79e96ebb5671bdb50111f18f263...@fsulist.frostburg.ed u --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: marc.car...@bakeru.edu. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13029.76c7c563b32ad9d8d09c72 a2d17c90e1n=Tl=tipso=3566 or send a blank email to leave-3566-13029.76c7c563b32ad9d8d09c72a2d17c9...@fsulist.fros tburg.edu The information contained in this e-mail and any attachments thereto (e-mail) is sent by Baker University (BU) and is intended to be confidential and for the use of only the individual or entity named above. The information may be protected by federal and state privacy and disclosures acts or other legal rules. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified that retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error please immediately notify Baker University by email reply and immediately and permanently delete this e-mail message and any attachments thereto. Thank you. --- You are
