Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
Gnash doesn't work well for anything, and in fact gets in the way of fallback HTML5 players (making some streaming sites look like they don't work when they do). I have no idea if Wine works with Skype, but it's probably not a high priority what with a GNU binary being available. Sure, you could give your friend Trisquel with Skype added on, but what would be the point in that? They're going to get no support for that from this community, and they might decide that Trisquel (or worse, Linux or GNU/Linux) is stupid. If they're unwilling to stop using proprietary software, you might as well give them an imperfect system whose community is going to help them. Take it one step at a time. If they already know about free software and understand that proprietary software is bad, that's a different story, but most people who are used to Windows don't even know about this issue, much less understand it.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
Ekiga isn't good. I recommend Jitsi, Linphone or WebRTC. All this is cross-platform. You can install in the most operating systems. For GNU/Linux the best for small resources or old computer is Empathy and Linphone. Jitsi is a memory and CPU hungry. Probably WebRTC in Abrowser too.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
Sorry. I meant running free software that hadn't been ported to linux yet (or ported but left unchanged otherwise.) I guess Minitube won't work?
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
I'm trying to mean I might add a DE every so often to the VM ( see one of my previous posts ) so that whenever my friend hears linux my friend will not think about a panel at the bottom, a trisquel button and a system tray.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
I mean free software that hadn't been changed ( i.e. to change the OS of a web browser so I could run windows executables ( free software of course ) ).
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
I'm sorry, it's just that most windows runtimes can be supplied in linux/trisquel. java = openjdk flash = gnash ( maybe not though) html5 = well, html5 .net = mono shockwave = probaly not.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
Minitube is in the repositories. Just mind the privacy implications.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
And also send the template at https://trisquel.info/en/wiki/recommending-trisquel to my friends email?
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
So I should first tell my friend to use Free Software Applications, wait about 3-5 weeks, grab the ISO and make a VM, wait a week, give my friend a LiveUSB and tell my friend to use the LiveUSB a couple times, wait 4 weeks, and finally install?
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
I am not trying to move my friend to Trisquel 6.0 for the freedoms (well atleast not just because of the freedoms) but for the fact it might be better for my friend. My friend /*isn't that smart on computers*/ and finds Windows too complex. My friend is looking for a laptop more simple; it's that my friend doesn't know /*almost every*/ laptop runs Windows 8. And that's the problem.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
If they don't use Flash and can live without Flash and Skype in particular (be sure to explain what exactly Flash is and what it's used for), then Trisquel might be just fine for them. My mom is OK with Trisquel, for example. If they're not OK with losing Flash and Skype (or there's some other proprietary program they're not OK with losing), I suggest suggesting either Ubuntu GNOME (if simplicity is what they're really looking for) or Xubuntu (if they really mean something like Windows XP).
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
And I could install the default settings a desktop environment anyway.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
And a VM/wine works right most of the time anyway. Then again, every package is a vulnerability.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
Couldn't you just use a) Wine to run Skype (or run it in a (legit) VM) and b) use Gnash?
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
Even if I am late...here are my 2 cents... For me all boils down to this: Trisquel Debian Ubuntu Windows / MacOS with mostly open source Windows / MacOS with no open source used Explanation: - Trisquel stands for pretty much every free GNU Linux out there - Debian stands for all those GNU Linux variants which most aim to be free but still include non-free firmware files, support installing non-free software - Ubuntu stands for all those GNU Linux variants which fully provide / support non-free firmware and apps - Windows / MacOS with open sources stands for propritary operating systems with mostly open-source / free software installed like GIMP, Firefox, Audacity and so on - Windows / MacOS with no open sources stands for propritary operating systems with only propritary software installed. Getting everyone to use an OS like Trisquel might be the final goal but right now with the tremendeous amount of non-free things around like SmartTVs, Android boxes, tablets and smartphones I do not see this happening. Its more like most people will turn away from a general purpose PC towards specific devices. In the end even an Ubuntu user (like I am most of my time) is more free than a Windows / MacOS user ;)
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
Personally I just ask people about their use cases first. There's an awful lot of people, like the friend who I recently influenced into using Trisquel, for whom the many things free software _can_ do are more than they need. Of course I always discuss the freedoms. But, people do tend to use things for their own sweet reasons regardless of what you say. So you have to keep chipping away at the education thing until they've fully grasped the implications of the freedoms and the nature of the injustice software hoarders perpetrate. They still might not commit even though they'll happily use a GFSD distro after all that.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
I had been using GNU/Linux for 2 years before I discovered Trisquel. I eased into it after I became less reliant on propietary software. By the time I discovered Trisquel the transition wasn't a big deal since I knew the alternatives to flash and various codecs.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
Tell him about freedom. Let him choose. http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
Users must understand it (they must be told so) and keep it in mind for the free software movement to be a success. That's only half of the truth. Maybe the free software movement has to understand a few things as well. Many members of it spend their time searching for solutions for their own needs and are happy if they can free their computing because they can afford to abandon functionality xy and yz; this gives them the feeling of being pure and better than others, now matter how little influence their own actions have on the general problem. The general problem is not the missing freedom of me as an individual; it is the missing freedom of our digital society. But people don't get that. They think they can achieve something by repeating over and over again how people should stop putting convenience above freedom, and they push people so hard and point with fingers on them so almost everyone gets scared off. Really, I heard so many members here in this forum who never did anything but blaming free software projects because of one single problem, some tiny flaws in them, praising their own morality because they never would use such unholy crap. It's a false morality. Maybe I'll write an essay about it. Yes, we'll have to teach people that freedom matters. But we can't achieve anything by running around and telling people not to use a mobile phone and abandon this and abandon that. There is a reason why the movement is extremly small, though the hugest spying scandal in modern history was revealed. We can't just blame the stupid people who value convenience above all and keep on using our yeeloong.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
Users must understand it (they must be told so) and keep it in mind for the free software movement to be a success. That's only half of the truth. Maybe the free software movement has to understand a few things as well. Many members of it spend their time searching for solutions for their own needs and are happy if they can free their computing because they can afford to abandon functionality xy and yz; this gives them the feeling of being pure and better than others, now matter how little influence their own actions have on the general problem. The general problem is not the missing freedom of me as an individual; it is the missing freedom of our digital society. But people don't get that. They think they can achieve something by repeating over and over again how people should stop putting convenience above freedom, and they push people so hard and point with fingers on them so almost everyone gets scared off. Really, I heard so many members here in this forum who never did anything but blaming free software projects because of one single problem, some tiny flaws in them, praising their own morality because they never would use such unholy crap. It's a false morality. Maybe I'll write an essay about it. Yes, we'll have to teach people that freedom matters. But we can't achieve anything by running around and telling people not to use a mobile phone and abandon this and abandon that. There is a reason why the movement is extremly small, though the hugest spying scandal in modern history was revealed. We can't just blame the stupid people who value convenience above all and keep on using our yeeloong.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
We have some canned promotional statements in the Documentation. Can we better gear these statements to new users? https://trisquel.info/en/wiki/recommending-trisquel Telstar wrote that the specific freedoms may be too abstract for new users. Magic says that freedom matters. Can we convey both the philosophy (freedom) and why it matters (practical) in the promotional statements? Others said that going fully free is hard to do without understanding why. And new users who care may not understand or accept the perspective overnight. Should the promotional material address this?
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
I wouldn't. Turning someone off to GNU/Linux (which is used to describe several operating systems that are rather different) would be a huge loss. I think someone who is used to Windows needs to be introduced to something like Ubuntu GNOME before trying Trisquel, and they need to learn about the issues of things like Flash and proprietary drivers/firmware. Without knowing about this stuff, someone who tries Trisquel will just think that it's no good as an operating system and go straight back to Windows. But before you can go to an entirely different operating system, you need to get a feel of it. Tell your friend about LibreOffice, the GIMP, and other free software which is (and this is important) relevant to them. Some other time, you can show them GNOME, Unity, KDE, and/or Cinnamon and tell them of the imperfect from the freedom dimension, but easy to use operating system appropriate: Ubuntu GNOME, Ubuntu, Kubuntu, or Mint. Once they are comfortable with whatever OS you showed them, and if they've heard about the freedom problems in it, Windows, OS X, etc, *then* you can tell them about Trisquel, that it's basically the same as the system they're using but without proprietary software. Don't push them too hard, however; if they feel that they need Flash, Skype, or some other proprietary program, be compassionate about their situation. it's better to have an Ubuntu user who understands and appreciates the free software movement, but feels they are not ready to abandon certain proprietary programs, than to have an Ubuntu user who is convinced that free software advocates are assholes or a Trisquel user who is unhappy with the free software-only experience.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
I think onpon4 sums it up pretty well. Free software in general, such as GIMP, is a step in the right direction. A GNU/Linux distribution such as Ubuntu or Fedora is an even bigger step in the right direction-- even if both have proprietary software and firmware. I wouldn't recommend Trisquel to someone who isn't interested in or doesn't understand free software, quite personally. Especially if they are accustomed to a proprietary operating system where everything just works out of the box. I don't think your friend will appreciate having to use a special USB wifi card, or degraded 3d performance, or not being able to use programs such as Steam, After Effects, what have you. I think most people (and your friend) will just come to the conclusion that their old proprietary operating system is better because it just works, despite the upsides of free software. They won't have to go through a bunch of trouble (such as buying new hardware) to make their once working computer function properly again (if the hardware is incompatable with free software, of course, which in my case is rather frequent). I had a lot of trouble making the decision to choose free software. It took me a while to choose because I saw practical (at the time) gains when using some proprietary software and firmware. I didn't want my hardware not to work, either. I didn't want to replace something that once worked. But, I eventually got fed up with proprietary software all together for security, privacy, ethical and liberty reasons. Not to mention the costs of some proprietary software. If you give your friend some time, they may choose the path of free software, like myself. But, I believe only if they understand the reasons for choosing it and are willing to go through some extra difficulty for good.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Getting someone to switch to Trisquel
Good thoughts fellows. I'd like to contribute something. I'm already sorry for a lenghty answer, but I hope it give some insight. a Previous thread here shows that many of us have switched to free software step-by-step, many small steps after another, so I'd suggest using that strategy. Show them small things that are relevant /to them/. Be cautious, because those things and tasks are likely to be completely different than what's nice and neat for you.. so take a note on what tasks and how they perform, look for alternatives and play around with those programs yourself, so you can support their experience. Please keep in mind that many users don't mind about the four freedoms. I found out that the best way for those who value practicality, is to show them the aspects of free software in practice. The ethical issue is harder. There's no pushing it. Just let the question why would anyone make this software and give it out for no money? arise, and then address that with your reasoning the way they might understand. One day my father asked about copying Vinyls and C-tapes to a computer, if that's possible. I teach my father to use audacity. Not all the bells and whistles of it, but a very basic set of tools and concepts he already understands from the analog world. He already knows the equalizer, amplifier, selection removal, zooming and exporting to file. He knows the practical, or sound difference between lossy and lossless audio files. Sure you could do all these things with proprietary software, but these programs tend to bug, nag and wear off. You often are required to tell the dev you're using it, paying for it, and throwing it away when it wears off. What's neat in this software for him is the fact he's completely libre and allowed to use old version of this sound thing on his old laptop. It doesn't nag, brag or bug him about anything irrelevant. It just does what he tells it to do.
