Re: [TROM1] interesting fun piece on EXTERIOR
* The following message is relayed to you by trom@lists.newciv.org Hi Pete,from Aarre Nov. 1/'11 Perhaps this is rhetorical. I'm not sure. I have L.Ron Hubbard's 'The Factors' in front of me, so let's look at it. 1. Before the beginning was a Cause and the entire purpose of the cause was the creation of effect. 2. In the beginning and forever is the decision and the decision is TO BE. 3. The first action of beingness is to assume a viewpoint. 4. The second action of beingness is to extend from the viewpoint, points to view, which are dimension points. etc. Keypoint is the last half of Factor # 3. Sequence. The beingness apparently came before the viewpoint, and THEN needed to assume a viewpoint. At least LRH said that the beingness came before the viewpoint, insinuating some sort of difference. Before beingness was cause, so I took 'cause', which is the earliest in the chain of events, to be the thetan (spirit). Perhaps this isn't vital anyhow. Thanks much, Aarre On Sun, Oct 30, 2011 at 1:53 AM, Pete McLaughlin < pete_mclaughlin_93...@yahoo.com> wrote: > * > The following message is relayed to you by trom@lists.newciv.org > > > Hi Aarre > My personal observations are that the Thetan is the viewpoint and can > "locate" anywhere at will. He can perceive with the bodies senses whether > he is in the body or not but i find that i have a hard time perceiving the > bodies sensations when i move my viewpoint out of the body and likewise i > have a hard time not using the bodies senses when i am located in the body. > > At the moment i am most comfortable with the notion that everything > started as the one being which we could label as > God. God postulated other beings to exist at which point they parted off > from him. While these other beings were separate from God by the postulate > that they were not part of God this was a lie. They are in fact still part > of God. > More postulates made more beings and more postulates made matter, energy > and space. > > All of which is still God If all the postulates of separateness were > eliminated there would only be God. > > If this view is correct then all considerations that the physical universe > is in a different location from the thetan is incorrect. All are just God > and we thetans are just choosing to perceive or not perceive the physical > universe, other beings with or without bodies and God himself as a matter > of personal choices. > > Sincerely > > Pete > > -------------- > *From:* Aarre Peltomaa > *To:* Slim . > *Cc:* The Resolution of Mind list > *Sent:* Saturday, October 29, 2011 7:17 PM > *Subject:* Re: [TROM1] interesting fun piece on EXTERIOR > > * > The following message is relayed to you by trom@lists.newciv.org > > > Hi Randy, Oct. 29/'11Aarre > > It's a battle to catch up with the emails. Sorry for the tardiness. The > thetan can never be in the physical universe, but only his creations can. > His creations include the mind, body, brain, physical matter, etc.It > seems to me that the thetan creates his mind out of postulates, and > everything else out of postulates. It would seem that, because the > physical universe is 'generated with TIPM' out of a thetan's opposing > postulates within the thetan's mind, voila! The physical universe is > within the thetan's mind as a construct, and nowhere else. The mind is > senior to the physical universe in other words. The thetan is a static who > isn't located anywhere. It seems the thetan mocks up being overwhelmed > because of his reactions to his postulates. No? He creates the > 'Frankenstein's monster', and then decides to be freaked out when he sees > it. No? It seems he must know and be known, even to himself (flow 0). > If by corrolary, the mind is senior to the physical universe, then it would > seem that the mind, like the thetan that created it wouldn't be located > anywhere. Energies 'from' the mind are obviously located in the physical > universe, but that doesn't mean that the mind itself is. Perhaps there are > two basic categories of mind, the postulates which aren't in the physical > universe, and the 'energies, pictures, masses, noise, etc.', which is > located in the physical universe. > > Food for thought. > > p.s. - the thetan's viewpoint goes exterior to the body, never the thetan > 'himself'. The thetan can never 'go' anywhere, and never has. Your > viewpoint travels around, not you ! You create a vie
Re: [TROM1] interesting fun piece on EXTERIOR
* The following message is relayed to you by trom@lists.newciv.org p.s. - the thetan's viewpoint goes exterior to the body, never the thetan 'himself'. The thetan can never 'go' anywhere, and never has. Your viewpoint travels around, not you ! You create a viewpoint to go traveling around and having adventures. You are entertained by it. I'd love comment on this. Yes, all true and also your response to my "interesting fun piece on EXTERIOR". To my understanding, I would also say that a viewpoint (and the associated point to view from) is a consideration and therefore is exterior to the body and is also on the level of pure thought. There is the point to view from, that a viewpoint (the Thetan) takes as the basis for the viewpoint but this does not mean that there is any mass or location to the viewpoint. It is pure thought. It is the idea that one has come to if one were to view from a specific location and time. One is not taking the body's eyeballs and perceptics to all of these different points to view from. They are thoughts/considerations that the Thetan is having. Another definition of Theta is viewpoint. In Level 3, one can take old scenes and take new viewpoints from those old scenes even now. Dennis mentions getting the idea of getting on a bus from an old scene and seeing where it takes one. I did that and found that I could explore more of that old scene. I did it on foot, on a magic carpet (exterior from a body), on a bus and on a trolley. The trolleys were very enjoyable inasmuch as I could more fully experience them since they were only a small and vague part of my earlier life. Trolleys were soon replaced by streetcars in this life time's early years. The San Francisco cable cars are very similar to trolleys in my early childhood. I was putting up more of the old scene and being aware of other locations and events during the time of that old scene, more than I did even being at and in that time. Talk about time travel! Talk about being able 'to Know'! One of those 'Holy Shit' moments. It was very enjoyable as well as very interesting. Needless to say it was very expanding. I had a lot of curiosity about those trolleys from long ago and with TROM, I was able to satisfy that curiosity by more fully experiencing those trolleys. At first it frightened and bewildered me but I did it a second and third time and then it just flowed evenly and smoothly as I simply took the trip. Went where I wanted and saw what I pleased. ___ Trom mailing list Trom@lists.newciv.org http://lists.newciv.org/mailman/listinfo/trom
Re: [TROM1] interesting fun piece on EXTERIOR
* The following message is relayed to you by trom@lists.newciv.org Hi Aarre My personal observations are that the Thetan is the viewpoint and can "locate" anywhere at will. He can perceive with the bodies senses whether he is in the body or not but i find that i have a hard time perceiving the bodies sensations when i move my viewpoint out of the body and likewise i have a hard time not using the bodies senses when i am located in the body. At the moment i am most comfortable with the notion that everything started as the one being which we could label as God. God postulated other beings to exist at which point they parted off from him. While these other beings were separate from God by the postulate that they were not part of God this was a lie. They are in fact still part of God. More postulates made more beings and more postulates made matter, energy and space. All of which is still God If all the postulates of separateness were eliminated there would only be God. If this view is correct then all considerations that the physical universe is in a different location from the thetan is incorrect. All are just God and we thetans are just choosing to perceive or not perceive the physical universe, other beings with or without bodies and God himself as a matter of personal choices. Sincerely Pete > >From: Aarre Peltomaa >To: Slim . >Cc: The Resolution of Mind list >Sent: Saturday, October 29, 2011 7:17 PM >Subject: Re: [TROM1] interesting fun piece on EXTERIOR > >* >The following message is relayed to you by trom@lists.newciv.org > > > >Hi Randy, Oct. 29/'11 Aarre > >It's a battle to catch up with the emails. Sorry for the tardiness. The >thetan can never be in the physical universe, but only his creations can. His >creations include the mind, body, brain, physical matter, etc. It seems to >me that the thetan creates his mind out of postulates, and everything else out >of postulates. It would seem that, because the physical universe is >'generated with TIPM' out of a thetan's opposing postulates within the >thetan's mind, voila! The physical universe is within the thetan's mind as a >construct, and nowhere else. The mind is senior to the physical universe in >other words. The thetan is a static who isn't located anywhere. It seems the >thetan mocks up being overwhelmed because of his reactions to his postulates. >No? He creates the 'Frankenstein's monster', and then decides to be freaked >out when he sees it. No? It seems he must know and be known, even to >himself (flow 0). If by corrolary, the mind is senior to the physical universe, then it would seem that the mind, like the thetan that created it wouldn't be located anywhere. Energies 'from' the mind are obviously located in the physical universe, but that doesn't mean that the mind itself is. Perhaps there are two basic categories of mind, the postulates which aren't in the physical universe, and the 'energies, pictures, masses, noise, etc.', which is located in the physical universe. > >Food for thought. > >p.s. - the thetan's viewpoint goes exterior to the body, never the thetan >'himself'. The thetan can never 'go' anywhere, and never has. Your >viewpoint travels around, not you ! You create a viewpoint to go travelling >around and having adventures. You are entertained by it. > >I'd love comment on this. > >Your friend, >Aarre Peltomaa >peltomaa.aa...@gmail.com >(647) 202-7267 > > >On Sat, Oct 15, 2011 at 12:49 AM, Slim . wrote: > >Perfect agreement is just a complimentary postulate >> >>If a thetan can not be overwhelmed unless he's in the mest universe and >>yet the thetan is not in the mest universe. How is the thetan >>overwhelmed ever ? >> >> >> >>If the mind has no location , where is it? >> >>If there is a present time universe there must be a past time universe.. >> >>Where is it? >> >> >> >>Sent from my Windows Phone From: Aarre Peltomaa >>Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 7:07 PM >>To: The Resolution of Mind list >>Subject: Re: [TROM1] interesting fun piece on EXTERIOR >> >>* >>The following message is relayed to you by trom@lists.newciv.org >> >> > >___ >Trom mailing list >Trom@lists.newciv.org >http://lists.newciv.org/mailman/listinfo/trom > > >___ Trom mailing list Trom@lists.newciv.org http://lists.newciv.org/mailman/listinfo/trom
Re: [TROM1] interesting fun piece on EXTERIOR
* The following message is relayed to you by trom@lists.newciv.org Hi Randy, Oct. 29/'11Aarre It's a battle to catch up with the emails. Sorry for the tardiness. The thetan can never be in the physical universe, but only his creations can. His creations include the mind, body, brain, physical matter, etc.It seems to me that the thetan creates his mind out of postulates, and everything else out of postulates. It would seem that, because the physical universe is 'generated with TIPM' out of a thetan's opposing postulates within the thetan's mind, voila! The physical universe is within the thetan's mind as a construct, and nowhere else. The mind is senior to the physical universe in other words. The thetan is a static who isn't located anywhere. It seems the thetan mocks up being overwhelmed because of his reactions to his postulates. No? He creates the 'Frankenstein's monster', and then decides to be freaked out when he sees it. No? It seems he must know and be known, even to himself (flow 0). If by corrolary, the mind is senior to the physical universe, then it would seem that the mind, like the thetan that created it wouldn't be located anywhere. Energies 'from' the mind are obviously located in the physical universe, but that doesn't mean that the mind itself is. Perhaps there are two basic categories of mind, the postulates which aren't in the physical universe, and the 'energies, pictures, masses, noise, etc.', which is located in the physical universe. Food for thought. p.s. - the thetan's viewpoint goes exterior to the body, never the thetan 'himself'. The thetan can never 'go' anywhere, and never has. Your viewpoint travels around, not you ! You create a viewpoint to go travelling around and having adventures. You are entertained by it. I'd love comment on this. Your friend, Aarre Peltomaa peltomaa.aa...@gmail.com (647) 202-7267 On Sat, Oct 15, 2011 at 12:49 AM, Slim . wrote: > Perfect agreement is just a complimentary postulate > > If a thetan can not be overwhelmed unless he's in the mest universe and > yet the thetan is not in the mest universe. How is the thetan > overwhelmed ever ? > > > > If the mind has no location , where is it? > > If there is a present time universe there must be a past time universe.. > > Where is it? > > > > Sent from my Windows Phone From: Aarre Peltomaa > Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 7:07 PM > To: The Resolution of Mind list > Subject: Re: [TROM1] interesting fun piece on EXTERIOR > * > The following message is relayed to you by trom@lists.newciv.org > > ___ Trom mailing list Trom@lists.newciv.org http://lists.newciv.org/mailman/listinfo/trom
Re: [TROM1] interesting fun piece on EXTERIOR
* The following message is relayed to you by trom@lists.newciv.org Very interesting, Paul ! Oct. 14/'11Aarre May I also venture to say that the thetan isn't in the physical universe. He doesn't have a location, as he is not composed of matter, energy, space, and time. He creates those things. He is a static. He puts a viewpoint, mind, body, etc. into the physical universe, but none of those things are 'him'. It's approximately analogous to looking via a camera that is located in another room (your viewpoint) to view things, but 'you' aren't there in the other room. You put up viewpoints whereever you please, maybe more than one at a time. I love the beautiful simplicity of this concept. Thanks, Aarre Peltomaa peltomaa.aa...@gmail.com (647) 202-2767 On Tue, Sep 20, 2011 at 2:06 AM, Paul Tipon wrote: > * > The following message is relayed to you by trom@lists.newciv.org > > I too wanted to clarify the difference of using MEST eyes vs. Theta > perception and knowingness. > > Let’s first look at the MEST looking. MEST is emanating waves and > reflecting particles and waves. These actions are picked up by the > eye mechanism and create a signal that is transmitted to the brain. > MEST seeing also has a perception of time which is motion. Even in > still objects there is a moment to moment picture with which is > classified as, time is changing. > > Theta looking in the case of TimeBreaking, is Theta looking at > facsimiles. Facsimiles can have motion or no motion. They certainly > are not emanating particles or waves and are not seen by or through > one’s eyes. They may or may not have motion. Whether they have > motion in them or not there is no time passing that they reflect in > their motion other than, it took time for a facsimile action to > occur. If there is a time element taken from the motion, it will > have to be in the context of, what was the time for or of a sequence > then. Because the Thetan has manufactured these facsimiles when they > occurred and is manufacturing them now, there may be a lot of missing > elements but the Thetan only has to put them there for them to be > there. They are not there on their own. Another is they will not be > solid or what one can call real. They have no reality other than to > the Thetan for they are not MEST and do not fall under the definition > of reality. There is where the Thetan can have his reality really > mixed up. > > The definition of reality here is that which is agreed upon in the > MEST Universe by two or more Thetans. Interesting huh. So if there > is not a perfect agreement then MEST is not as solid as one may have > thought, huh. Do you see how it is possible for one to start to go > off the rails? At least it can be said that there is not perfect > reality because no two MEST viewpoints can occupy the same spot. So > you say Theta viewpoints can! Well that’s true but you still may not > have perfect agreement. For now you are having Theta viewpoints and > obviously not MEST eyeball viewpoints. Is MEST going even further > from solid into liquid? Careful you don’t get to the vapor stage. > Things are not as solid as one thought they were and the agreement, > the reality is starting to get a little thin and narrow too, huh! > > Theta can also look at MEST and in doing so, (not using eyeballs) > would it not be the same as looking at facsimiles? > > So one needs to know this. This gives understanding to what is > happening in TimeBreaking. Which truly is the more ‘real’, the more > ‘solid’. Careful now, that you don’t have an emergency and have to > call someone into the room to get reality back. Just joking. I must > say that all depends on how you yourself want to judge what is real > for you. > > So there you have it briefly. There are two types of looking. Both > done differently. Now the question becomes, who or what is doing > both of those lookings? I leave that for you do discover and know. > I simply went briefly into the Tech of looking. There are several > distinct ways of doing that. This should give you fluidity over both > lookings and the right to choose which is more solid and real. But > realize that one does not always have to outrank the other. Yes, the > ranking can be switched back and forth too. That is entirely up to > you. This kinda puts reality in several possible places. > > You might say you now have a new freedom. Use it wisely, use it for > fun. Also see that a reality of others cannot be enforced or > changed. Don’t bother trying to do so, they have to do it. I > believe you will also find this as the four items in Dennis’ Ethics > section towards the end. Now you know why it is there. It’s > actually there to help you, not police you. You will never succeed > though try you may to accomplish any of the four. > > Oh, last but not least …. Can you now answer whether you are > exterio
