Re: [Tutor] Set Reply-To field to Tutor@python.org
FWIW, I'd like to reverse my answer, and now I agree with Oscar's 29 Jan suggestion to make Reply-to-tutor-list the default. Lately, several times a tutor had to forward to the list an email meant for the list but sent to him only, by mistake. On the other hand, the wrote-to-1-person-but-mistakenly-sent-to-list scenario that I had in mind is rarer, therefore Oscar's suggestion is better than my previous reply. Trung On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 6:33 AM, Nick W pacificmorrow...@gmail.com wrote: My personal opinion (with whatever limited weight that has on this list since I've only answered a few questions - and probably half of them I've accidentally only sent to the op)/how I read it is that RFC 2822 actually allows lists to set reply-to header; by my view the list software is forwarding to everyone else and therefor counts as the most recent sender/author. I admit that that is a somewhat different conclusion to others that I've read as to the meaning of 2822, but that seems logical to me and also my personal preference is for having the reply-to header be set to the list address. Nick On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 7:44 AM, Albert-Jan Roskam fo...@yahoo.comwrote: To summarize existing opinions on this matter: http://marc.merlins.org/netrants/listreplyto.html You might want to familiarize yourself with existing literature on the matter before starting a new flame war. Hmmm... False alarm? Page blocked The page you've been trying to access was blocked. Reason: Access Denied! The requested URL is a Spyware site. Transaction ID is 5107F01CFF920603D57F. ___ Tutor maillist - Tutor@python.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor ___ Tutor maillist - Tutor@python.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor ___ Tutor maillist - Tutor@python.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor
Re: [Tutor] Set Reply-To field to Tutor@python.org
On 29 January 2013 03:35, DoanVietTrungAtGmail doanviettr...@gmail.com wrote: As a student user of this list, I prefer leaving the Reply-To field unchanged. I like the fact that this means a deliberate decision is required to send public emails. If you don't mind my asking, do you send many off-list messages as replies to on-list ones? I see the mailing list as being fundamentally a public message forum and only very occasionally send an off-list message. Usually the reason that I do this is because someone else has sent me a message off-list and even though I'm fairly sure they meant it to be on-list I don't want to assume that they did by replying back to the list. Often this means that the archives are incomplete, so that there is a thread but the part of the thread where the OP says Thanks, this is the solution that worked or Sorry, that's not what I meant. My actual problem is... is missing. Not having this information on the list is unhelpful. It is unhelpful for people reading the archives in the future, for people who keep replying to a thread that is essentially solved, and for people who offer suggestions and don't get feedback on whether their suggestions were useful. Of course if the message is deliberately sent off-list then that is fine but I find that I send/receive many more accidentally off-list messages than deliberate ones. It's hard to predict how often the alternative, accidentally sending a private message to the list, would occur. Although judging from other lists where reply-to-list is the default I would say not very often. I don't find that replying to the list is a deliberate decision to engage in public conversation since the fact that I read and respond to the list at all is because I have already made that decision. For me at least, it is replying off-list that requires explicit consideration. Oscar ___ Tutor maillist - Tutor@python.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor
Re: [Tutor] Set Reply-To field to Tutor@python.org
On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 9:12 PM, Oscar Benjamin oscar.j.benja...@gmail.comwrote: If you don't mind my asking, do you send many off-list messages as replies to on-list ones? Oscar For this list, I have sent 1 public reply and 2 private replies (to thank individual tutors). Both numbers are too small to have any significance. Reading the Chip Rosenthal article that Steven referred to, I thought that in the case of this Tutor list, his arguments are neither here nor there. It probably comes down to personal preference, and that's why I stated mine. The reason for my personal preference is that for other lists, I am frequently annoyed by private-reply emails landing in my inbox, and sometimes I absent-mindedly do the same thing, thus annoying others. For most lists, group-reply ought to be deliberate. For a few lists it doesn't matter either way. What if, as Oscar seems to say, this Tutor list is in a category where private-reply ought to be deliberate? Most people would only form 1 habit for all lists, rather than 1 for each of the several lists they participate in. If so, I think the habit of deliberate public-reply would serve us better in terms of etiquette. Trung ___ Tutor maillist - Tutor@python.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor
Re: [Tutor] Set Reply-To field to Tutor@python.org
El 29/01/2013, a las 04:14 a.m., Oscar Benjamin oscar.j.benja...@gmail.com escribió: I see the mailing list as being fundamentally a public message forum and only very occasionally send an off-list message. Often this means that the archives are incomplete, so that there is a thread but the part of the thread where the OP says Thanks, this is the solution that worked or Sorry, that's not what I meant. My actual problem is... is missing. Not having this information on the list is unhelpful. It is unhelpful for people reading the archives in the future, for people who keep replying to a thread that is essentially solved, and for people who offer suggestions and don't get feedback on whether their suggestions were useful. For me at least, it is replying off-list that requires explicit consideration. The fact of giving and receiving help by a public mean, and having this help available to others as well, complete in the archives, it's for me enough reason to give +1 to set reply-to field to tutor address. If I am reading something which comes from a mailing list then I think the most proper way to reply would be to send an answer to all the people which originally received the same message. That way, I can avoid duplicate answers, even better this conduct can lead to additional complementary answers because someone can construct on previous partial solutions/suggestions. But this needs all answers are available to everyone. This is my opinion. I hope my writing is understandable. -- Jonatan G ___ Tutor maillist - Tutor@python.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor
Re: [Tutor] Set Reply-To field to Tutor@python.org
Oscar Benjamin oscar.j.benja...@gmail.com writes: I have both sent and received messages on this list that went off-list by mistake. It's an easy mistake to make that you use reply instead of reply-all and then the message goes just to one person instead of the whole list. This problem is not unique to the python-tutor. I see it happening often on other mailing lists (often it's noticeable by the fact that someone forwards an off-list message back to the list which can sometimes break the threading of email software). One particular list that I receive has recently made an administrative change so that, from now on, all emails have the Reply-To header set to the list address. This means that the default behaviour when replying to a message is that the reply goes to the list. I think that this is the right thing to do by default since replying off-list is much less common and more likely to be something that you are consciously aware of when you do it. The change seems to have gone down well on the other list so I wondered: could it be done for this list as well? To summarize existing opinions on this matter: http://marc.merlins.org/netrants/listreplyto.html You might want to familiarize yourself with existing literature on the matter before starting a new flame war. -- regards, kushal ___ Tutor maillist - Tutor@python.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor
Re: [Tutor] Set Reply-To field to Tutor@python.org
To summarize existing opinions on this matter: http://marc.merlins.org/netrants/listreplyto.html You might want to familiarize yourself with existing literature on the matter before starting a new flame war. Hmmm... False alarm? Page blocked The page you've been trying to access was blocked. Reason: Access Denied! The requested URL is a Spyware site. Transaction ID is 5107F01CFF920603D57F. ___ Tutor maillist - Tutor@python.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor
Re: [Tutor] Set Reply-To field to Tutor@python.org
My personal opinion (with whatever limited weight that has on this list since I've only answered a few questions - and probably half of them I've accidentally only sent to the op)/how I read it is that RFC 2822 actually allows lists to set reply-to header; by my view the list software is forwarding to everyone else and therefor counts as the most recent sender/author. I admit that that is a somewhat different conclusion to others that I've read as to the meaning of 2822, but that seems logical to me and also my personal preference is for having the reply-to header be set to the list address. Nick On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 7:44 AM, Albert-Jan Roskam fo...@yahoo.com wrote: To summarize existing opinions on this matter: http://marc.merlins.org/netrants/listreplyto.html You might want to familiarize yourself with existing literature on the matter before starting a new flame war. Hmmm... False alarm? Page blocked The page you've been trying to access was blocked. Reason: Access Denied! The requested URL is a Spyware site. Transaction ID is 5107F01CFF920603D57F. ___ Tutor maillist - Tutor@python.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor ___ Tutor maillist - Tutor@python.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor
Re: [Tutor] Set Reply-To field to Tutor@python.org
On 29/01/13 09:04, Oscar Benjamin wrote: One particular list that I receive has recently made an administrative change so that, from now on, all emails have the Reply-To header set to the list address. This means that the default behaviour when replying to a message is that the reply goes to the list. I think that this is the right thing to do by default since replying off-list is much less common and more likely to be something that you are consciously aware of when you do it. The change seems to have gone down well on the other list so I wondered: could it be done for this list as well? http://www.unicom.com/pw/reply-to-harmful.html http://woozle.org/~neale/papers/reply-to-still-harmful.html versus http://www.betacantrips.com/bits/reply_to_munging_considered_harmful_considered_infuriating/ http://www.metasystema.net/essays/reply-to.mhtml -- Steven ___ Tutor maillist - Tutor@python.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor
Re: [Tutor] Set Reply-To field to Tutor@python.org
As a student user of this list, I prefer leaving the Reply-To field unchanged. I like the fact that this means a deliberate decision is required to send public emails. Trung On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 12:17 PM, Steven D'Aprano st...@pearwood.infowrote: On 29/01/13 09:04, Oscar Benjamin wrote: One particular list that I receive has recently made an administrative change so that, from now on, all emails have the Reply-To header set to the list address. This means that the default behaviour when replying to a message is that the reply goes to the list. I think that this is the right thing to do by default since replying off-list is much less common and more likely to be something that you are consciously aware of when you do it. The change seems to have gone down well on the other list so I wondered: could it be done for this list as well? http://www.unicom.com/pw/**reply-to-harmful.htmlhttp://www.unicom.com/pw/reply-to-harmful.html http://woozle.org/~neale/**papers/reply-to-still-harmful.**htmlhttp://woozle.org/~neale/papers/reply-to-still-harmful.html versus http://www.betacantrips.com/**bits/reply_to_munging_** considered_harmful_considered_**infuriating/http://www.betacantrips.com/bits/reply_to_munging_considered_harmful_considered_infuriating/ http://www.metasystema.net/**essays/reply-to.mhtmlhttp://www.metasystema.net/essays/reply-to.mhtml -- Steven __**_ Tutor maillist - Tutor@python.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: http://mail.python.org/**mailman/listinfo/tutorhttp://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor ___ Tutor maillist - Tutor@python.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor
