Re: [ubuntu-studio-devel] Anoying/confusing things in our DE

[Shubham Mishra]

On 11/16/2013 11:10 PM, Len Ovens wrote:

As prep for getting the best experience for 14.04 I would like to know
what people find anoying about our default desktop. What are the first
things you change. Not everything you or I find anoying should be
changed as we are trying not to confuse people new to UbuntuStudio as well.

  -I like focus follows mouse. I have used things this way since I began
using X with fvwm in the 90s. Probably won't get changed due to all the
windows raised people around.


I've never done this, but I can see how this can be useful now that I 
think about it.



  - click and double click on the window title bar defaults to full
screen or other action. The most common reason I click on the title bar
is to move the window. I would prefer double click to do nothing. (the
first thing to wear out of a mouse seems to be the left button resulting
in unintended double clicks)


I find this useful, and I think this is a very common feature, so people 
might feel confused.



  - scroll wheel on mouse changes workspace. This is really confusing
for those who have yet to get btheir minds wrapped around more than one
workspace. This mildly anoying for the rest of us (well me anyway) as it
means that as soon as the mouse wanders off of the window I am using the
scroll wheel for scrolling with, I get a blank screen or some other app
and have to go and find what I was working on again. I think this should
default to off.


I found this really annoying as well. I've turned this off.


  - The bottom pannel
a) the bottom (at least for me) is a bad place for this. Left side.
Monitors are no longer 3x4, using a side for this instead of bottom
makes more sense.
b) auto hide results in the application sharing the space the pannel
takes as well as the whole bottom making it appear that the application
being used no longer responding even though the mouse is not over the
mouse itself. This may be fixable by making the pannel less than 100%
c) I find the icon size too big. this is subjective :)
d) Do we need this pannel at all?
e) I think we could pick better apps to populate it.

 I find this bottom panel useful. I have keyboard shortcuts for things 
like the browser, terminal, file manager and alt-F2 for app finder etc, 
but I do use the panel for quickly going to the settings manager, I use 
the directory menu a lot (and for me it is more useful in the bottom 
panel than the top, only because of the size of the icon), and also the 
show desktop icon (which I can only use because of its bigger size). I 
haven't use USC icon at all for a very long time (partly because I 
hardly ever use USC). I don't use trash icon as well.


Yes initially it was slightly confusing because despite clicking on what 
appeared to be the application currently open, the panel did not 
disappear. I eventually figured out that I was in fact not clicking on 
the app but the panel. Once you know this, its a non-issue. I guess this 
could be solved by not keeping it completely transparent like you said.




  - clock format, and maybe app. We switched to Orage because the clock
applet doesn't open a calendar when clicked. However, Orage is more
difficult to set default time/date format. We should watch what Xubuntu
does here it sounds like they are annoyed too :)
ss


I actually don't remember if I had to change the clock settings to do 
it, but orage displays time on the panel the way I want it (hh:mm:ss 
AM/PM) at the moment. I setting the format shouldn't be too difficult as 
the settings dialog has an index displaying which code to use to get what.



Please comment on any of these and feel free to add your pet peaves
too... even if they seem opposite to mine. I do know how to set my
desktop the way I want it, but would prefer that the average and new
person gets the best workflow without having to learn to set things up.
SO please think in these terms. We really do want productivity first,
and nice looks right after that.



I use desktop icons a lot because that is a very convenient place for me 
to put up custom launchers for apps and launchers for any scripts. I 
don't have any normal app launchers on my desktop, I use the menu for that.


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Re: [ubuntu-studio-devel] Ubuntu Studio 13.10 - Default wallpaper proposition RC1

[Shubham Mishra]

On 09/19/2013 01:16 AM, Kaj Ailomaa wrote:

I really don't see anything political about this WP.

IMO Ralf has a very subjective interpretation of it.

UI freeze is tomorrow. This will be our new default WP for 13.10.
The upload has already been requested.



I don't see anything wrong with it either. Looks great to me.

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Re: ubuntustudio-installer icon

[Shubham Mishra]

On 07/27/2013 08:46 AM, Len Ovens wrote:

Mish or anyone else:

I need an icon for our installer. This will be used in the menu for any of
our extra software installer items as well as for our ubuntustudio meta
installer. (both use the same software now)

I am going to do the initial release using our logo or one of the generic
installer icons.

Most of the generic installer icons are just a think down arrow. (see the
icons for Ubuntu Software Center or Synaptic to see what I mean) I was
thinking that putting such an arrow on top of our logo might work. Or if
the space inside the arrow had the logo colours inverse. The arrow could
be bigger too or something completely new.

My hope is that this would be a persons first install if they are
installing some of our metas in another flavour as it takes all the
guesswork out of which metas are up to date and it makes sense to install.



I'm sorry but I'm moving this tuesday. Lot's of preparations going on 
right now, and I don't know how long it'll take for me to get an 
internet connection over there.


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Re: new default theme

[Shubham Mishra]

On 07/22/2013 10:30 PM, lukefro...@hushmail.com wrote:

The authors of that theme are asking users to puchase it instead
of downloading it free from github. That's usually enough to keep
something out of my machines.





Not really. To quote from the DA page


"""
By purchasing the theme from here, you show that you appreciate the work 
and time we spent into making the theme. However the theme is free and 
always will be. You can download the theme for free from GitHub.

"""

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Re: Application Icons vs. icon themes

[Shubham Mishra]

On 07/11/2013 05:17 AM, Len Ovens wrote:

Mish I think I have caused some confusion with Icon themes.

Here is something I explained on IRC, but realize it should be here so you
  see it for sure:

< OvenWerks> zequence: there are some problems I think with what you were
discussing with Mish.
< OvenWerks> You may recall, we wanted to use standard categories and
names for things.
< OvenWerks> so ihave styled all the icon names after the standard icon
names for other standard menus.
< OvenWerks> What this means, is that some of the icons I use (or will
use when they are done) in the menu package will
not show up in our menu because they are "themed over"
or overriden by themes farther up the theme inheritance
chain.
< OvenWerks> That is why we are using the icon-theme to make sure our
icons show up in our iso.
< OvenWerks> zequence: there are two paths we can go with this:
< OvenWerks> 1) use icon themes as Mish suggested, one dark and one light
that inherit other dark and light themes. Mish seems to
have found nice ones.
< OvenWerks> 2) Rename our icons non-standard so they show up no matter
what icon theme is used.
< OvenWerks> I am sure Mish's confusion is my fault and I appologize.
< OvenWerks> I should probably drop this in the mailing list :)

I am not sure this clears everything up, but as you can see there is a
problem that needs resolution one way or the other.




So from what I understand, the problem is this: Currently the UBS 
specific menu icons are in the hicolor folder. But because the names 
used are standard ones, they might get overridden by themes from 
~/.themes, which also have those categories. They might not have icons 
for all the menus though so some will change and some will be taken from 
hicolor, which might not look good because of inconsistency. For this I 
think non-standard names could be used, since these menus are specific 
to Ubuntu Studio only.


As for light and dark themes, I suggested that simply because it's kinda 
hard to make icons that look good in both. Right now I'm making some 
icons following Kaj's suggestion of using different colours for the 
different workflow menus. I'm not sure if it'll work out; if it does 
then we can scrap the light/dark idea, and if not then we'll see.


And no that was my fault. I couldn't realise that it was the 
"ubuntustudio-menu" package (that puts them in hicolor) that was being 
talked about. I had something else in my mind entirely, hence the confusion.


For anyone who's interested, this folder has previews of anything that 
I'm currently working on. (NOTE: There is no versioning for this folder. 
It's simple cloud storage and will most likely be deleted after all 
icons have been made and moved to my branch)


https://www.wuala.com/Mishrito/Icons/?key=CRBaTkk2DEln

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Re: New icons Screen shot

[Shubham Mishra]

Here are two screenshots with the new icons used with a flat monochrome
icon theme called "Any Colour You Like", which I've used before and
really liked on a dark GTK theme called "Buonanotte", and also on a
light theme called "Clearlooks" for reference.

http://ubuntuone.com/6oveB0gFlYplBter2aJ8Qm
http://ubuntuone.com/6oveB0gFlYplBter2aJ8Qm

(NOTE: The menu panel icon is broken, I couldn't figure out how to fix it)

Looks nice to me, since everything has that monochrome look (most of the
common apps are covered as well). I don't have confusion regarding the
UBS specific menus because of the separators, but then other DEs might
display it differently. Opinions?



Goofed up there with the duplicate links. This is one for the dark theme

http://ubuntuone.com/4ec2wQ5tlaXZCXWFe7u7cH

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Re: New icons Screen shot

[Shubham Mishra]

On 07/06/2013 10:57 PM, lukefro...@hushmail.com wrote:

If a really large number of icons use monochrome themes, distinguishing
them could get difficult in small sizes. For the Studio menu section icons
this is a plus, as it can distinguish them from all the other icons in the menu.
For every icon in all the menus might be another matter, however. When some is
good, more is not always better.

On 07/06/2013 at 12:41 PM, "Len Ovens"  wrote:



BTW if there is a better icon theme to inherit than elementary-
xfce-dark,
then that might be another thing we should run past the leads. The
icons
that lubuntu uses for example are already pretty monochrome. Some
apps
(most) are always going to have colour though, but having
monochrome
submenu icons might help make them stand out... I'm not sure, art
and
visual things are not my strong point.

--
Len Ovens
www.OvenWerks.net


Here are two screenshots with the new icons used with a flat monochrome 
icon theme called "Any Colour You Like", which I've used before and 
really liked on a dark GTK theme called "Buonanotte", and also on a 
light theme called "Clearlooks" for reference.


http://ubuntuone.com/6oveB0gFlYplBter2aJ8Qm
http://ubuntuone.com/6oveB0gFlYplBter2aJ8Qm

(NOTE: The menu panel icon is broken, I couldn't figure out how to fix it)

Looks nice to me, since everything has that monochrome look (most of the 
common apps are covered as well). I don't have confusion regarding the 
UBS specific menus because of the separators, but then other DEs might 
display it differently. Opinions?



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Re: New icons Screen shot

[Shubham Mishra]

On 07/05/2013 06:42 AM, Len Ovens wrote:

First off, if you want to play with them, they are available for saucy at:
https://launchpad.net/~len-ovenwerks/+archive/ppa

But the screen shot is at:

http://www.ovenwerks.net/UStudiodocs/menu.html

Hit the reload if it is not the first thing on top.

These are just proposed at this time, so comments would be great.




I installed the theme using the ppa. Looks decent enough on both dark 
and light backgrounds. But the synth icon definitely needs to be remade 
separately in 16x16. So does the photography icon, as it looks just like 
circles, not a camera shutter. I'll start working on them.
Also should I export them in higher resolutions and place them in 
folders with that name? Because when required, the desktop might 
upsample from the 48x48 images, which would look bad.


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Re: ubuntustudio-icon-theme

[Shubham Mishra]

On 07/04/2013 04:14 AM, Len Ovens wrote:


On Sat, June 29, 2013 9:25 pm, Shubham Mishra wrote:


That's good then. The link to mine is this in case you're wondering.
(https://code.launchpad.net/~mishrashubham2007/+junk/UbuntuStudio)


Wow! now we know why Len normally doesn't do icons... Those are great. Let
me know when you are ready to release. I will branch and put a snapshot up
on my PPA (or you can do so on your own) and install it on a machine so I
can get a screen shot for our art lead to look at.



So you know, I have already sent a link to that to madeinkobaia on IRC 
so you can coordinate with him. From my side they are already ready. 
Might have to make a separate 16x16 version of the synth icon to make it 
more recognizable but other than that it's good to go IMHO.


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Re: ubuntustudio-icon-theme

[Shubham Mishra]

On 06/30/2013 05:50 AM, Len Ovens wrote:


On Sat, June 29, 2013 5:50 am, Shubham Mishra wrote:


installed bazaar and made a branch like you told me to. So far I seem to
have understood most of it. I guess I'll learn more when I eventually
make a mistake, so brace yourselves :D.


Thats the nice thing about a branch and lots of commits, I can look at it
before I do a merge, or even branch off of your branch build a package to
try. In any case it is pretty hard to truly hurt something. No worries.


That's good then. The link to mine is this in case you're wondering.
(https://code.launchpad.net/~mishrashubham2007/+junk/UbuntuStudio)



I have one more question. The directory contains only 48x48 PNGs of the
icons. Does that mean the other resolutions are created during build
time from these ones?


No, 48x48 is the bare minimum, the panel or file manager creates whatever
size it needs on the fly if it can't find the right size pre-made. I was
unable to get the 22x22 size to look any better than the panel menu was...
sometimes worse. So we should have 22x as well. The 22x can even be
different if it makes it easier to recognize.



For most icons downsampling the 48x48 to 22x22 should give decent 
recognizable icons. It's 16x16 that causes problems and usually need to 
be made separately, pixel by pixel. So I'll see which icons look ok in 
22x22 and modify the ones which don't.


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Re: ubuntustudio-icon-theme

[Shubham Mishra]

On 06/29/2013 02:57 AM, Len Ovens wrote:

Sorry, I guess I was using ideas that expected you to already know what I
was saying... I am not a good teacher.

I will try hard to explain below in answer to points. (scroll down for
more info)

On Fri, June 28, 2013 5:36 am, Shubham Mishra wrote:

On 06/22/2013 11:31 AM, Len Ovens wrote:

Hello Mish,
I am not sure how you would like to work on the icon theme. It might
be
easiest to keep your own branch updated and we can merge it with main
any time you feel a releasable step has been made. We can also release
snapshots in your own ppa or the US ppa so that you or the rest of us
can test it before release.

I have found the easiest way to test things like this is to just install
the file on my own machine and see how it works.

Let me know if you need any help at all.



Hi Len

  Sorry for the late reply. I've been sick the entire last week so I
could only check my mail now. I am not sure I get what you're trying to
say. When you say 'snapshot', do you mean a package which after
installing would replace the old icons with the ones in the package?


No need to worry about snapshot. What it means is like an in-between quick
test release.


Also when you say icon-theme,  do you mean the icons for the menu or a
general icon theme for everything?


Either/and/or  I want you to feel free to do as much or little as you feel
like/have time for. I have forked the menu icons we use so that even if
the ubuntustudio icon theme is not used our menu items will still have
some sort of icon. So if you change those icons in the ubuntustudio icon
theme they will override the ones I have made, but if the user decides to
use some other icon theme, our menus will still work... sort of a backup.
Obviously having our menu icons look unified with each other as well as
the desktop theme (and nicer than mine) are priorities. Our icon theme
bypasses xubuntu's.. I am not sure that is a great idea as we are using
the same desktop theme and so their icon theme might match the desktop
rather well and be a good starting point. If you have ubuntustudio loaded
you should be able to install the xubuntu-icon-theme package and select it
to see what it looks like. If you don't like it, you are welcome to come
up with your own too.


Also is there a page on the wiki or somewhere where we can look at what
we already have and what needs to be worked on or improved upon? Because
I'm somewhat confused as to what I need to work on now.

Sorry for all the questions


Good questions :)
We are using only two of your icons right now for video and mixers. They
both have a similar style Mine have a similar style too... similar to
my 7 year old's drawings :P

Basically anything that can look more polished than what I have done. The
Audio production and submenus, publishing (that one just looks like a
document right now), Photography, Graphic design. Those are the main ones
I would like to see redone. In the style of what you have done so far. You
can of coarse do some of the other menu icons as well, media playback for
example or even play with the ubuntustudio icon... so long as the logo
still looks like our logo :)

If you have a launchpad account, you should be able to install bzr and do a:
bzr branch lp:~ubuntustudio-dev/ubuntustudio-icon-theme/UbuntuStudio
in a directory set aside for this like ~/software/icons for example. This
will put a copy of the the ubunto studio icon theme in that directory.
Make a change, update the debian/changelog file and then do a:
bzr commit -m "added silly icon to bug Len"
(well I hope your comment makes more sense, I normally use the same text I
added to the changelog)

When you have done some changes and would like us to look at them or add
them to the main package. You should be able to go to your lauchpad home
page and make sure you have your ssh keys set up right for that machine.
Then you can go to your "Code" page. (see the word Code at the top of the
page right under your name. Not too far down you will see a bzr push
command for your page. So you want to be in your terminal in the directory
where you can see the debian and usr directories,
(~/software/icons/ubuntustudio/ in the example I showed above) and do that
bzr push command but with a "branch name" of ubuntustudio-icon-theme. This
will upload your work to your code page. You can then post the url of your
code page in the mailing list of the irc channel and one of us can look at
it and merge it into the the main branch. Probably still not really clear
:)  but there are some help icons along the way on your home pages in
launchpad too.

Ignore any of this stuff you already know... ask about anything not clear.
This is a long term project so there is no rush or pressure.





Thanks for answering the questions. You answered them pretty well. I 
installed bazaar and made a branch like you told me to. So far I seem to 
have un

Re: Youtube channel created for Ubuntu Studio - contributors needed to submit tutorials

[Shubham Mishra]

On 06/05/2013 06:06 AM, Kaj Ailomaa wrote:

We now have a youtube channel for Ubuntu Studio
https://www.youtube.com/user/ubuntustudiotube.
It's linked to the Ubuntu Studio G+ page, so all page managers should
also be able to manage the youtube channel.

I'll announce it later on social sites, and mail lists.

The primary reason for the channel is to host tutorials. So far we have
no written down guidelines for how to do this. I'll prepare some later.
But, for now, something like this should do:

Category tree for tutorials:

  * main workflow (i.e., audio, video, graphics, etc)
   * sub workflow (i.e., recording, mixing, mastering, editing, etc)

So, we could name one video something like: "audio - recording - setting
up ardour for recording"
or: "video - modelling - how to create a soccer ball".

The videos don't need to be long. And we don't need to cover everything
imaginable. Just some basic stuff to begin with. So, short and to the
point is much appreciated.

The videos should have:
  * recorded desktop - both audio and video from the actual workflow
  * english subs - describing what is going on

Spoken english is voluntary.

Not sure what we should do about background music, and such, but for
now, I think we don't need to use it at all.
Would be nice to have a pool of music that is suitable for using in the
background (preferably something somewhat soft, that works for all age
groups and style preferences), and that we can use on multiple videos.
We should ask for submissions for this separately.
Tutorials for audio related workflows probably don't require background
music anyway.

Are there any requirements for what we can have in the OS if we are 
doing a video? For example I am still using the LTS 12.04. So my menus 
might look a bit different from what we currently have. That might 
confuse people


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Re: New Art Lead, and announcing Release Manager

[Shubham Mishra]

Wow that's great news. I've seen his works before and his design skills 
are awesome. Congratulations


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Re: Choosing Art for Ubuntu Studio

[Shubham Mishra]

On 03/13/2013 11:10 PM, Kaj Ailomaa wrote:

= Creating Art for Ubuntu Studio =

Lately, we haven't been very active on creating art for Ubuntu Studio. 
Not sure exactly how this has been managed back in the day when Ubuntu 
Studio had its own gtk2 theme and so forth.
There are three ways I see how we can go about it in the future, and 
this depends on what we want to achieve with the artwork.


Out of these three suggestions, I'd personally like to go with having 
a art team work for us, but in order to make that happen, we need to 
find some artists who are willing to work with us on this.


== 1. Art Team Develops the Artwork ==

With this solution, we have artists developing the artwork during the 
development cycle, or over several cycles.  Using this method, it 
would be logical to strive for a unified theme, where all of the 
components - XFCE theme, icon theme, wallpaper, and the look on our 
website and social sites are all coherent, at least to some degree. It 
would mean there is some kind of a schedule, with planned goals. It 
would also mean that we need to get artists to join our team.


== 2. Submissions selected by Ubuntu Studio devs ==

We set dates, call for submissions, and then the team decides what 
goes onto the ISO. It would be hard to have a unified theme experience 
this way, but the team is still able to select items that they think 
go well together, and what works with Ubuntu Studio, generally.


== 3. Community decides ==

We set dates, call for submissions, and have polls. The Ubuntu Studio 
team could either let the users decide completely, or at a minimum 
decide what submissions will be up for a vote.



= Choosing wallpaper for this cycle =

As for the current problem on selecting the wallpaper - we haven't 
really discussed how to go about it. And we need to do that pretty 
fast. User interface freeze is March 21st 
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RaringRingtail/ReleaseSchedule.


The situation right now is that we have one of my wallpapers as 
default on the ISO (just got it in yesterday) 
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/Artwork/RockTheme, but it's not a 
final decision in any way.


We have gotten a few suggestions so far. It's not much, but enough to 
put together some kind of vote. So, should we let our users decide (if 
we do that, I'd rather we do it on social channels and mail lists 
alike, and use some kind of poll service), or do we let the devs 
decide (which would be faster)?


I would like to include the best of what has been suggested so far in 
any case, no matter which one is chosen as default.




So what exactly is needed here? A unified Ubuntu Studio GTK, window 
manager and icon theme? If so it would be nearly impossible to make it 
all by the UI freeze (which is just a week away) wouldn't it? 
Considering the time required to arrange for an artist team, then laying 
out the plans and coordinating everything, testing for bugs...



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Wallpaper Design

[Shubham Mishra]

  
  
Guess I was a bit late on the scene. I had some fun creating a
wallpaper, inspired by Chinese patterns. Attached is a PNG (I don't
know how but the image ended up four pixels short of the required
width, but I hope that's ok :P), the final SVG, and also the SVG of
the artboard (named WIP, although it's mess with everything lying
around). 

All suggestions are welcome. :D
I personally like the way it is asymmetic, but that can be changed.

Everything used in the wallpaper is made by me (in Inkscape and
Krita; also my own paper texture) except the ubuntu studio logo
which I took from the official site.

Note : I haven't licensed anything yet, since I don't know what you
guys use, and also partly because changes could be made.



  I've linked 3 files to this
email:
  
Wallpaper
main.svg(6.7 MB)Ubuntu

  Onehttp://ubuntuone.com/4FizbqngIY96ITwASefpym
Wallpaper
WIP.svg(12.4 MB)Ubuntu

  Onehttp://ubuntuone.com/0jhcCLs9q4aSVkDf1RXVeY
Final.png(4.1
MB)Ubuntu
  Onehttp://ubuntuone.com/6rQ7kMR8qxsDA17z1t3qhh
  
  Mozilla Thunderbird
makes it easy to share large files over email.


  



bin1xVBSMZUfT.bin
Description: Binary data


bin0NHd7GjnId.bin
Description: Binary data


bintq7NkvHfPB.bin
Description: Binary data
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Re: Graphics apps, kde stuff

[Shubham Mishra]

Actually there is an extension for inkscape for CMYK support, but that's 
besides the point. Inkscape is a vector program and is different from 
Krita which works with raster graphics (which is what one would use to 
create so called "Digital Art").


On 02/25/2013 02:53 PM, ttoine wrote:

Krita handle CMYK, and the is missing in Inkscape !


Antoine THOMAS
Tél: 0663137906


2013/2/25 Ho Wan Chan mailto:smartbo...@gmail.com>>

Len, even the almighty Calligra doesn't kill me to package
GIMP+GPS won't be a big problem to me. I want to practice my
packaging skills:-P

smartboyhw

On 2013-2-25 ??8:10, "Len Ovens" mailto:l...@ovenwerks.net>> wrote:

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Re: SVG

[Shubham Mishra]

On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 3:11 PM,  Ralf Mardorf  wrote


>Let's say I've got two identically circles and I want to edit stroke and
>fill of both circles. Is it possible to link both circles, so that
>editing one fill, will edit the fill of the other circle in the same
>way? I also guess that if this should be possible, it would reduce data,
>not only work.

In Inkscape you can select both the circles with shift+click (you need
to have the select tool enabled for this). And then after selecting
ctrl+G will group the objects. Then both will have the same fill and
stroke and other properties. They will even move together. It wouldn't
reduce file size though.


>The Inkscape version of Ubuntu Studio Precise supports different sorts
>of SVG files and PDF. What is the most "common" SVG format? For sharing
>the files with other software, would there be any benefit when using PDF
>instead?

Plain SVG should be fine. Don't try svgz or other formats. PDF makes
the file uneditable. It is only for viewing purposes.



>What kind of CC license or other license is needed, that Linux distros
>can use artwork?

At least for Ubuntu Studio it is "Creative Commons Legal Code
Attribution-ShareAlike 2.5"

On 7/29/12, Ralf Mardorf  wrote:
> Hi :)
>
> today I started testing making scalable icons. For the iPad 2 I
> installed the gratis app neu.Draw.
> It does work, when I e.g. draw a circle with outline (stroke) and a
> gradient fill using neu.Draw, safe it as a SVG and then open it with
> Inkscape on my Linux PC to continue the work.
>
> Scaling the circle as it is, does work and it's possible to edit the
> existing stroke and fill, there's no need to make a new fill.
>
> Let's say I've got two identically circles and I want to edit stroke and
> fill of both circles. Is it possible to link both circles, so that
> editing one fill, will edit the fill of the other circle in the same
> way? I also guess that if this should be possible, it would reduce data,
> not only work.
>
> If it shouldn't be possible, I would draw all outlines in the same color
> and do no fills during work, but do different outline colors and fills
> at the end of the work.
>
> Until now I didn't test what happens if I safe a SVG with Inkscape and
> after that continue work with neu.Draw.
>
> neu.Draw formats are
> JPG Image
> PNG Image
> PDF (Vector) File
> SVG File
>
> The Inkscape version of Ubuntu Studio Precise supports different sorts
> of SVG files and PDF. What is the most "common" SVG format? For sharing
> the files with other software, would there be any benefit when using PDF
> instead?
>
> What kind of CC license or other license is needed, that Linux distros
> can use artwork?
>
> Regards,
> Ralf
>
>
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Re: ubuntustudio icons

[Shubham Mishra]

On Wed, Jul 25, 2012 at 11:29 PM, Ralf Mardorf

>To enlarge something small is different to shrink something large ;).
>"We" already draw comics on A3 while they are printed on A5 ;). That
>becomes seldom an issue, anyway, even this could become an issue.

Downsampling an image also introduces artifacts, mostly those related
to aliasing (although this depends on the algorithm used) like Emmet
said. Rendering a bitmap from a vector at the desired resolution
bypasses this problem (although this too has its limitations like
Emmet mentioned).

On 7/25/12, Ralf Mardorf  wrote:
> On Thu, 2012-07-26 at 02:45 +0900, Emmet Hikory wrote:
>> To see the effect of this yourself, take a look through the icons
>> already
>> installed on your computer: try scaling them to various sizes (including
>> upscaling to e.g. 800x800 or so).  I suspect you'll find that vector
>> files
>> (from SVG) survive better than bitmaps.
>
>
> To enlarge something small is different to shrink something large ;).
> "We" already draw comics on A3 while they are printed on A5 ;). That
> becomes seldom an issue, anyway, even this could become an issue.
>
> I guess I understand what you're trying to explain, but your example
> isn't valid ;).
>
> However, thank you for the information (I'm serious, since I guess I
> understand what you mean),
> Ralf
>
>
>
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Re: Graphics apps

[Shubham Mishra]

On Wed, Jul 25, 2012 at 6:25 PM, Scott Lavender wrote,

>one thing i wouldn't want to do is make a install image that was 4GB for 
>everyone to >download. therefore, i am concerned about incurring tonnes of new 
>libraries for a >particular application. also, i would be cautious about 
>trying to include applications for >_every_ possible creative use for content 
>creation.

I completely understand your situation (although Krita isn't just yet
another graphics app).  Would it be possible to implement what Len
said about not actually including the application in shipped list, but
having links to recommended programs that the user can view and
download if he wants to?

On 7/25/12, Scott Lavender  wrote:
> On Sun, Jul 22, 2012 at 4:17 PM, Len Ovens  wrote:
>
>>
>> On Sun, July 22, 2012 10:37 am, Shubham Mishra wrote:
>>
>> > On Sun, July 22, 2012 7:59 PM, Len Ovens wrote
>> >> I want to add a menu item that opens
>> >>software-center with libreoffice, abiword and gnumeric so that if the
>> >> user
>> >>wants it they don't have to search.
>> >
>> > Hmm.. Right. And then that could be done for the other sections as
>> > well, like the list of recommended apps that you were talking about
>> > (which can also include Krita under graphics, thereby removing the
>> > need to include KDE libs beforehand).
>>
>> That is the idea. I have just looked through our meta files.. and they
>> are
>> all full of depends rather than recommends  :P  Like why should our whole
>> audio install depend on "meterbridge"? I would include krita for sure in
>> that item because there has already been at least one user ask for it.
>>
>> This does mean a bit more testing... I will have to try installing some
>> of
>> these extra packages to make sure they run nice with whatever else we
>> have. We will also have to make sure they show up in the right submenu.
>>
>> The vision of our leader is to include enough to get any job done without
>> including every known software in the repo. We also want the user to be
>> able at system install to just install the workflow/area they are
>> interested in. For that possibility the meta that goes with area should
>> be
>> listed so that someone who wants to add a meta later can do so easily.
>>
>> It is hard thinking of all the possibilities to try to cover.
>>
>> --
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>> www.OvenWerks.net
>>
>>
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>
> one thing i wouldn't want to do is make a install image that was 4GB for
> everyone to download. therefore, i am concerned about incurring tonnes of
> new libraries for a particular application. also, i would be cautious about
> trying to include applications for _every_ possible creative use for
> content creation.
>
> if gimp paint studio is in process into the repos, i would be happy to wait
> a cycle to include it rather than make a reactionary decision and include
> krita with the additional dependencies.
>
> likewise, i hope our work flows are well though out and provide enough
> competent functionality for the majority of users. i feel it would
> be disastrous if we felt compelled to include every possible application
> solution to a need, not only for those maintaining ubuntu studio but also
> (and especially) for the users as i believe it would confuse many of them.
>
>
> as to the OP: alchemy is an amazing application and i have watched numerous
> videos for it, including a renowned contemporary graphics designer who made
> something rather incredible withing ten minutes using alchemy.
> unfortunately, alchemy appeared to have zero development for years and it
> is not in the repos. this doesn't mean we can't work up a "supported" work
> flow for it, which would need to include instructions or a link for
> installation.
>
> i already mentioned that i would rather wait a reasonable period for gimp
> paint studio rather than rashly include krita.
>
> however, i do very much appreciate the input and i think ubuntu studio
> benefits when we get user feedback like this.
>
>
> oh, and len, i agree with not making ubuntustudio-audio depend on
> meterbridge. that does seem a little silly.
>
> scottl
>


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Re: ubuntustudio icons

[Shubham Mishra]

On Tue, Jul 24, 2012 at 9:51 PM, Len Ovens wrote
>Can I do this from the command line? How?

I haven't used Inkscape's command line interface. You can find the
parameters however over here.
http://inkscape.org/doc/inkscape-man.html

Exporting though can be easily done using the GUI with File>Export Bitmap

On 7/24/12, Shubham Mishra  wrote:
> On Tue, Jul 24, 2012 at 10:16 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote
>
>>Is it easier to do a proper drawing, scan and import it to Inksacpe and
>>then to use it as a template or can Inksacpe be used without such a help
>>easily? I once saw live art made with Inkscape or something similar, I
>>don't think it would be that easy for me to "morph some lines and
>>fields". Ok, I should test myself ;).
>
> It all depends on what you are comfortable with. Many people begin
> their work directly in Inkscape, while others scan hand drawn pictures
> and then go about vectorizing them. Try Inkscape, you'll be surprised
> to see how easy it is.
>
> On 7/24/12, Ralf Mardorf  wrote:
>> On Tue, 2012-07-24 at 09:26 -0700, Len Ovens wrote:
>>> On Tue, July 24, 2012 8:24 am, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
>>>
>>> > colors even 24x24 (here 28x28) should be ok. But the colors seem to be
>>> > important, since the original colors for 24x24 are bad. What color
>>> > will
>>> > the background for the menu become in the future?
>>>
>>> One way to get around the BG colour issue is to use a semi-sized BG. The
>>> reason for clear BG is that the DE uses it to indicate selection. I have
>>> put a circle under some of mine (sunburst seems to look best).
>>
>> Yes, thank you.
>>
>> Before I finally need to leave home, a last question:
>>
>> Is it easier to do a proper drawing, scan and import it to Inksacpe and
>> then to use it as a template or can Inksacpe be used without such a help
>> easily? I once saw live art made with Inkscape or something similar, I
>> don't think it would be that easy for me to "morph some lines and
>> fields". Ok, I should test myself ;).
>>
>> Cu,
>> Ralf
>>
>>
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Re: ubuntustudio icons

[Shubham Mishra]

On Tue, Jul 24, 2012 at 10:16 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote

>Is it easier to do a proper drawing, scan and import it to Inksacpe and
>then to use it as a template or can Inksacpe be used without such a help
>easily? I once saw live art made with Inkscape or something similar, I
>don't think it would be that easy for me to "morph some lines and
>fields". Ok, I should test myself ;).

It all depends on what you are comfortable with. Many people begin
their work directly in Inkscape, while others scan hand drawn pictures
and then go about vectorizing them. Try Inkscape, you'll be surprised
to see how easy it is.

On 7/24/12, Ralf Mardorf  wrote:
> On Tue, 2012-07-24 at 09:26 -0700, Len Ovens wrote:
>> On Tue, July 24, 2012 8:24 am, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
>>
>> > colors even 24x24 (here 28x28) should be ok. But the colors seem to be
>> > important, since the original colors for 24x24 are bad. What color will
>> > the background for the menu become in the future?
>>
>> One way to get around the BG colour issue is to use a semi-sized BG. The
>> reason for clear BG is that the DE uses it to indicate selection. I have
>> put a circle under some of mine (sunburst seems to look best).
>
> Yes, thank you.
>
> Before I finally need to leave home, a last question:
>
> Is it easier to do a proper drawing, scan and import it to Inksacpe and
> then to use it as a template or can Inksacpe be used without such a help
> easily? I once saw live art made with Inkscape or something similar, I
> don't think it would be that easy for me to "morph some lines and
> fields". Ok, I should test myself ;).
>
> Cu,
> Ralf
>
>
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Re: ubuntustudio icons

[Shubham Mishra]

On Tuesday, Jul 24, 2012 at 8:54 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote

>I guess working with Inkscape will allow to add colors on different
>layers, so that the colors could be changed easily?

Yes adding colours is no big issue, although adding them on a separate
layer is a bad idea.The fill colour of a shape is a property of the
shape itself. Are you online right now on IRC?

On 7/24/12, Ralf Mardorf  wrote:
> On Mon, 2012-07-23 at 10:04 -0700, Len Ovens wrote:
>> In general, each icon should have an svg (128x128 is probably an easy
>> size to work at for creation... or does svg have a size?) a 24x24 png
>> and a 48x48 png.
>
> Hi all,
>
> before I try to make a good svg, here's a sketch/scribble to test if all
> sizes will be good.
>
> I made some typos,
> icon_sketch_001-128 is 128x128
> icon_sketch_001-48  is  48x48
> icon_sketch_001-28  is  24x24
> icon_sketch_001-28color is  28x28 :(, however I guess regarding to the
> colors even 24x24 (here 28x28) should be ok. But the colors seem to be
> important, since the original colors for 24x24 are bad. What color will
> the background for the menu become in the future?
>
> I guess working with Inkscape will allow to add colors on different
> layers, so that the colors could be changed easily?
>
> Regards,
> Ralf
>
>


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Re: ubuntustudio icons

[Shubham Mishra]

on Tueday, July 24, 2012 at 4:18 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote

>I feared that.

Fear? Vectorizing a line drawing is not at all difficult actually.
Vectors curves are very easy to manipulate so you can do all of it
using a mouse; no need of a graphics tablet.

>And a SVG is really needed for the icons?
Yes. The reason icons are made in vectors, is because of its
scalability. You can export and SVG as a bitmap in any resolution that
you want.

On 7/24/12, Ralf Mardorf  wrote:
> On Tue, 24 Jul 2012 11:09:06 +0200, Shubham Mishra
>  wrote:
>
>> On Tuesday, July 24, 2012 at 1:25 AM, Ralf Mardorf wrote
>>
>>> If I would draw on paper and import it by Inkscape, would it become a
>>> usable SVG file? I'm asking, because I need to visit a friend to scan a
>>> picture. I'm able to draw, but I don't have the needed computer
>>> equipment to do it and I anyway like drawings on paper.
>>
>> No, simply importing the image into inkscape wouldn't make it and SVG.
>> But you can always import, create a new layer over it, and trace your
>> drawing in inkscape using the pen or pencil tools. Only then does it
>> become a vector image.
>
> I feared that. And a SVG is really needed for the icons?
> - Ralf
>
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Re: ubuntustudio icons

[Shubham Mishra]

On Tuesday, July 24, 2012 at 1:25 AM, Ralf Mardorf wrote

>If I would draw on paper and import it by Inkscape, would it become a
>usable SVG file? I'm asking, because I need to visit a friend to scan a
>picture. I'm able to draw, but I don't have the needed computer
>equipment to do it and I anyway like drawings on paper.

No, simply importing the image into inkscape wouldn't make it and SVG.
But you can always import, create a new layer over it, and trace your
drawing in inkscape using the pen or pencil tools. Only then does it
become a vector image.

On 7/24/12, Len Ovens  wrote:
>
> On Mon, July 23, 2012 12:55 pm, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
>> On Mon, 2012-07-23 at 09:19 -0700, Len Ovens wrote:
>>>  - The icon we use for audio production comes from Aeolus and
>>>should be replaced.
>>
>> I wonder if instead of the notes (US Precise here has got notes) a tape
>> recorder could do the icon job?
>> As an example, I guess it's not a free pic:
>> http://png-1.findicons.com/files//icons/607/evil_dead_movie/128/taperecorder.png
>> and than "Ctrl" + "-" as often as possible, it seems to be borderline.
>>
>> If I would draw on paper and import it by Inkscape, would it become a
>> usable SVG file? I'm asking, because I need to visit a friend to scan a
>> picture. I'm able to draw, but I don't have the needed computer
>> equipment to do it and I anyway like drawings on paper.
>>
>> I'll test what happens to the taperecorder.png from the Internet after
>> importing ;), but perhaps somebody already has experiences and knows
>> what to take care about.
>>
>> I dunno if I'll draw an icon or not, I just was thinking about a tape
>> recorder as a nice icon.
>
> Just remember in the menu it is only 24x24. Other than that I like the
> idea.
>
>
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> www.OvenWerks.net
>
>
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Re: Graphics apps

[Shubham Mishra]

On Sat, July 21, 2012 10:28 am, óÅÒÇÅÊ äÁ×ÙÄÏ× wrote:
> Krita got really weird recently.

Could you please elaborate?

On Sun, July 22, 2012 7:59 PM, Len Ovens wrote
> I want to add a menu item that opens
>software-center with libreoffice, abiword and gnumeric so that if the user
>wants it they don't have to search.

Hmm.. Right. And then that could be done for the other sections as
well, like the list of recommended apps that you were talking about
(which can also include Krita under graphics, thereby removing the
need to include KDE libs beforehand).

On 7/22/12, Len Ovens  wrote:
>
> On Sun, July 22, 2012 6:52 am, óÅÒÇÅÊ äÁ×ÙÄÏ× wrote:
>>> If it makes it to Debian we just request sync pretty much... However
>>> that
>>> is not a decision I can make. I would guess 13.04 for an eta as people
>>> seem to have more time in the winter months.
>>>
>>
>> AFAIK Debian is frozen and does not accept new uploads to testing which
>> Ubuntu auto-syncs. So uploading it upstream is not an option at the
>> moment.
>
> Right, ok, I don't know how we would get it into ubuntu repos (micahg
> might know). There are some ways of installing things that are not on the
> live session at the end of install... and I am working on an install after
> the fact setup too. For example, our office section comes empty except
> gedit and the pdf reader. I want to add a menu item that opens
> software-center with libreoffice, abiword and gnumeric so that if the user
> wants it they don't have to search. Just opening software center and
> searching for "office" makes things a pain to find. If I include the
> packages we ship, they can be removed as well. According to the man page I
> can add an apt-url as well. I can't really test it on this system though
> because your repo is already listed. So gimp-paint-studio already shows if
> I list it.
>
> There are some other apps we would like to be able to add like linux
> sampler for example that will never be on the ubuntu repos because of
> licensing issues. (free but not GPL)
>
> A general question for everyone: Is there anything in ubuntu policy that
> prevents us from adding extra PPAs to apt at install time?
>
> --
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> www.OvenWerks.net
>
>
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