Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 3:08 PM, Nigel Verity wrote: > Hi Guys > > All the advice is very much appreciated, and the views expressed about the > merits of different audio formats and players are of great interest too. > > Like everyone else on this forum, I'm not happy about resorting to a > Microsoft audio format. However, when funds are tight, upgrading players > isn't an immediate option. My only format options at the moment are WMA and > MP3. Which format sounds best is, I believe, somewhat subjective. All I can > give is my own experience using the equipment I have available. > > The insertion of "-acodec wmav2" into the ffmpeg command line has done the > trick. Many thanks to those who suggested it. What player(s) do you have? You've still not said. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 1:55 PM, Dave Morley wrote: > Liam if you decide to upgrade go for a sansa fuze I can't rate it highly > enough. Ogg support, amazing soundand pic/film quality and upgradable > memory with hdsd micro cards. Thanks for the suggestion! The thing is, I bought the Archos just last year for 4 specific reasons: - Takes a standard 2.5" EIDE notebook hard disk (mine has a 100GB disk fitted); - Takes 4 standard AA batteries, so you can change them if you run out on the move; - Appears as a standard USB hard disk, so no sync software needed; - Supported by Rockbox for a better UI The only snags with it are that it cannot charge over USB (and uses a special, illegal USB A to A cable), and that the decoder chip is so basic that it doesn't support OGG, FLAC or other modern formats. I don't have any WMA or AAC tracks so I don't know if it works with them or not. I'm guessing not. The player cost me about £10 on eBay (mint, boxed, complete, manuals & all) and I installed a 100GB disk I had lying around anyway, so it was a really good deal! But if there was any other MP3 player around that met criteria #1-3 of my list there, I'd snap one up like a shot. I don't want video playback or anything like that, just a big capacity: the more the better. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
Hi Nigel, I used 320K mp3s and found little difference myself to WAV quality wise. Althought I dont doubt if you feed this into a decent Amplifier setup you will hear the difference, the output can also be affected by the quality of the soundcard. I used 320k MP3 on CD players them alongside Vinyl with decent quality Ortofon cartridges and there wasnt much difference to be heard. If you start dropping below 192k then you can start to hear the difference especially if you are passing through a mixer into a PC and re-encoding to stream to a shoutcast server. So I would say 320k mp3 would be great for a portable player and you shouldnt hear the quality difference at all. Mark On 14 April 2010 15:08, Nigel Verity wrote: > Hi Guys > > All the advice is very much appreciated, and the views expressed about the > merits of different audio formats and players are of great interest too. > > Like everyone else on this forum, I'm not happy about resorting to a > Microsoft audio format. However, when funds are tight, upgrading players > isn't an immediate option. My only format options at the moment are WMA and > MP3. Which format sounds best is, I believe, somewhat subjective. All I can > give is my own experience using the equipment I have available. > > The insertion of "-acodec wmav2" into the ffmpeg command line has done the > trick. Many thanks to those who suggested it. > > Regards > > Nige > > > > -- > ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ > > -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
On 14 April 2010 15:08, Nigel Verity wrote: > Hi Guys > > All the advice is very much appreciated, and the views expressed about the > merits of different audio formats and players are of great interest too. > > Like everyone else on this forum, I'm not happy about resorting to a > Microsoft audio format. However, when funds are tight, upgrading players > isn't an immediate option. My only format options at the moment are WMA and > MP3. Which format sounds best is, I believe, somewhat subjective. All I can > give is my own experience using the equipment I have available. > > The insertion of "-acodec wmav2" into the ffmpeg command line has done the > trick. Many thanks to those who suggested it. > > Regards > > Nige > > > If you're feeling adventurous, it's worth looking at Rockbox[1] if it's available for your players. I think it has better sound quality than the native software on iPods and it's non-destructive. It gives you ogg and FLAC support on many portable players. s/ -- Save BBC 6 Music http://www.love6music.com My CV: http://sites.google.com/site/simongreenwoodscv/ Linkedin: http://www.linkedin.com/in/simonfgreenwood Support for unemployed IT professionals: -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
Hi Guys All the advice is very much appreciated, and the views expressed about the merits of different audio formats and players are of great interest too. Like everyone else on this forum, I'm not happy about resorting to a Microsoft audio format. However, when funds are tight, upgrading players isn't an immediate option. My only format options at the moment are WMA and MP3. Which format sounds best is, I believe, somewhat subjective. All I can give is my own experience using the equipment I have available. The insertion of "-acodec wmav2" into the ffmpeg command line has done the trick. Many thanks to those who suggested it. Regards Nige -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
> > You can. I am using Gmail and just removed the crap and typed below your > reply. > > Cheers, > Al. > > Oh, I see. Thanks Alan. Tommy -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
On Wed, 2010-04-14 at 13:30 +0100, Liam Proven wrote: > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 1:23 PM, Tommy Pyatt > wrote: > > FLAC does little to resolve the OP's problem though, he already owns a > > player, which I assume supports only MP3 and WMA. > > I think you have perhaps not been paying sufficient attention. > > #1, please put replies /below/ the text you are quoting. > > #2, Rockbox is independent 3rd party FOSS firmware for a wide variety > of media players. The message to which you were replying was > suggesting that if Rockbox were available for the OP's unstated media > player(s), that it would play FLAC just fine. I run Rockbox on my own > Archos Multimedia Jukebox, although unfortunately, the primitive > hardware of this 6Y old device doesn't support anything much, not even > VBR MP3. :¬( > Liam if you decide to upgrade go for a sansa fuze I can't rate it highly enough. Ogg support, amazing soundand pic/film quality and upgradable memory with hdsd micro cards. -- Seek That Thy Might Know http://www.davmor2.co.uk signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
Hi Tommy, On 14 April 2010 13:52, Tommy Pyatt wrote: > Apologies, just trying to help. > > #1, I can't choose how the googlemail interface formats my reply. > You can. I am using Gmail and just removed the crap and typed below your reply. Cheers, Al. -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
Apologies, just trying to help. #1, I can't choose how the googlemail interface formats my reply. Tommy On 14 April 2010 13:30, Liam Proven wrote: > On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 1:23 PM, Tommy Pyatt > wrote: > > FLAC does little to resolve the OP's problem though, he already owns a > > player, which I assume supports only MP3 and WMA. > > I think you have perhaps not been paying sufficient attention. > > #1, please put replies /below/ the text you are quoting. > > #2, Rockbox is independent 3rd party FOSS firmware for a wide variety > of media players. The message to which you were replying was > suggesting that if Rockbox were available for the OP's unstated media > player(s), that it would play FLAC just fine. I run Rockbox on my own > Archos Multimedia Jukebox, although unfortunately, the primitive > hardware of this 6Y old device doesn't support anything much, not even > VBR MP3. :¬( > > > -- > Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven > Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com > Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 > AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven > MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 > > -- > ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ > -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 1:23 PM, Tommy Pyatt wrote: > FLAC does little to resolve the OP's problem though, he already owns a > player, which I assume supports only MP3 and WMA. I think you have perhaps not been paying sufficient attention. #1, please put replies /below/ the text you are quoting. #2, Rockbox is independent 3rd party FOSS firmware for a wide variety of media players. The message to which you were replying was suggesting that if Rockbox were available for the OP's unstated media player(s), that it would play FLAC just fine. I run Rockbox on my own Archos Multimedia Jukebox, although unfortunately, the primitive hardware of this 6Y old device doesn't support anything much, not even VBR MP3. :¬( -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
FLAC does little to resolve the OP's problem though, he already owns a player, which I assume supports only MP3 and WMA. Tommy On 14 April 2010 13:17, Alan Pope wrote: > On 14 April 2010 12:39, Nigel Verity wrote: > > I'm a bit of an audiophile, and have a large collection of music stored > in > > WAV format to preserve the sound quality. Clearly it's not possible to > copy > > many of these huge files to a portable player, so they need to be > > compressed. > > FLAC is your friend. > > a...@wopr:~/Music/Jesus Jones/Doubt$ ls -hl 3* > -rw-r--r-- 1 alan alan 23M 2010-04-04 20:33 3 - International Bright > Young Thing.flac > -rw-r--r-- 1 alan alan 33M 2010-04-04 20:33 3 - International Bright > Young Thing.wav > > Not a massive difference, 23M FLAC vs 33M WAV, but it helps, and is > lossless. I use Rockbox on my media player, which plays FLAC just > fine. > > Cheers, > Al. > > -- > ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ > -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
On 14 April 2010 12:39, Nigel Verity wrote: > I'm a bit of an audiophile, and have a large collection of music stored in > WAV format to preserve the sound quality. Clearly it's not possible to copy > many of these huge files to a portable player, so they need to be > compressed. FLAC is your friend. a...@wopr:~/Music/Jesus Jones/Doubt$ ls -hl 3* -rw-r--r-- 1 alan alan 23M 2010-04-04 20:33 3 - International Bright Young Thing.flac -rw-r--r-- 1 alan alan 33M 2010-04-04 20:33 3 - International Bright Young Thing.wav Not a massive difference, 23M FLAC vs 33M WAV, but it helps, and is lossless. I use Rockbox on my media player, which plays FLAC just fine. Cheers, Al. -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
On Wed, 2010-04-14 at 12:39 +0100, Nigel Verity wrote: > Hi Guys > > I'm a bit of an audiophile, and have a large collection of music > stored in WAV format to preserve the sound quality. Clearly it's not > possible to copy many of these huge files to a portable player, so > they need to be compressed. After much experimentation I've concluded > that OGG and WMA are both better formats for sound quality than MP3 at > a given bit rate. The trouble is that neither of my portable players > will play OGG, so it has to be WMA. > > Using the command "ffmpeg -i input.wav -ab 128k output.wma" I get a > WMA file which will sound great on Linux using players such as VLC, > Exaile and Rhythmbox. Unfortunately on both my portable players I get > "File Error". I've even tried playing files converted this way on XP > using WMP, and got similar results. > > Does anyone have any suggestions on an ffmpeg parameter that will > solve the problem, or know of an alternative Linux app that will > convert the files correctly? > > Thanks. > > Regards > > Nige What media players do you have. There are more and more on the market now that support ogg but you need to first install an official firmware update. Sansa, Cowan, Samsung and a lot of non-branded can do it. -- Seek That Thy Might Know http://www.davmor2.co.uk signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
Hi, Having to keep files in multiple formats for devices that didn't support free formats was a big pain for me. The only solution was to wait until the smallest excuse to get a portable audio player that supported FLAC and OGG. This has made my life much easier. I recommend an iAudio 7, not the best device but its a reasonable price, with large storage and long battery life. Regards, Ciarán -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
Personally, for portable players I'd recommend using MP3 at at least 192kbps, I have never been able to tell the difference between WMA and MP3 and they're both lossy formats. MP3 tends to be supported on more players than WMA does. You could always keep compressed and uncompressed copies, or you could use lossless FLAC to reduce the size of the WAV's. Tommy On 14 April 2010 13:00, Rob Beard wrote: > On 14/04/10 12:39, Nigel Verity wrote: > > Hi Guys > > > > I'm a bit of an audiophile, and have a large collection of music stored > > in WAV format to preserve the sound quality. Clearly it's not possible > > to copy many of these huge files to a portable player, so they need to > > be compressed. After much experimentation I've concluded that OGG and > > WMA are both better formats for sound quality than MP3 at a given bit > > rate. The trouble is that neither of my portable players will play OGG, > > so it has to be WMA. > > Actually when I was doing some broadcast training I was shown some > results of some tests of audio quality, WMA came out the worst. I > believe the best was ATRAC as used on Minidisc (or those Sony Network > Walkmans). > > When you were doing tests, what parameters did you use? > > Did you use a constant bit rate (say 192kbit/sec) or a variable bit rate > with joint stereo? > > Anyway, back to encoding in WMA... > > I did a quick Google search and found this... > > http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t52493.html > > It seems the command line is as follows: > > ffmpeg -i test.wav -acodec wmav2 -ab 128 test.wma > > Can't say if it works though, I tend to use MP3, OGG and FLAC myself. > > Rob > > > -- > ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ > -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
On 14 April 2010 12:39, Nigel Verity wrote: > Hi Guys > > I'm a bit of an audiophile, and have a large collection of music stored in > WAV format to preserve the sound quality. Clearly it's not possible to copy > many of these huge files to a portable player, so they need to be > compressed. After much experimentation I've concluded that OGG and WMA are > both better formats for sound quality than MP3 at a given bit rate. The > trouble is that neither of my portable players will play OGG, so it has to > be WMA. > > Using the command "ffmpeg -i input.wav -ab 128k output.wma" I get a WMA > file which will sound great on Linux using players such as VLC, Exaile and > Rhythmbox. Unfortunately on both my portable players I get "File Error". > I've even tried playing files converted this way on XP using WMP, and got > similar results. > > Does anyone have any suggestions on an ffmpeg parameter that will solve the > problem, or know of an alternative Linux app that will convert the files > correctly? > > If you feel you must use WMV, which is a proprietary Microsoft codec and is reverse engineered in ffmpeg, try ffmpeg -i input.wav -acodec wmav2 -ab 128k output.wma . It might have something to do with your player's firmware though - if they are certified for PlaysForSure then that conversion might not work anyway as I think that only accepts WMV3. >From what I remember, WMA sounds 'better' because it concentrates on different parts of the audio spectrum to MP3. It's a matter of taste, but it's going to restrict your choice of player, especially under Linux. s/ -- Save BBC 6 Music http://www.love6music.com My CV: http://sites.google.com/site/simongreenwoodscv/ Linkedin: http://www.linkedin.com/in/simonfgreenwood Support for unemployed IT professionals: -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 12:39 PM, Nigel Verity wrote: > Hi Guys > > I'm a bit of an audiophile, and have a large collection of music stored in > WAV format to preserve the sound quality. Clearly it's not possible to copy > many of these huge files to a portable player, so they need to be > compressed. After much experimentation I've concluded that OGG and WMA are > both better formats for sound quality than MP3 at a given bit rate. The > trouble is that neither of my portable players will play OGG, so it has to > be WMA. > > Using the command "ffmpeg -i input.wav -ab 128k output.wma" I get a WMA file > which will sound great on Linux using players such as VLC, Exaile and > Rhythmbox. Unfortunately on both my portable players I get "File Error". > I've even tried playing files converted this way on XP using WMP, and got > similar results. > > Does anyone have any suggestions on an ffmpeg parameter that will solve the > problem, or know of an alternative Linux app that will convert the files > correctly? WMA is a Microsoft proprietary format. I wouldn't expect much help with it here & personally I'd say don't use it. The non-compressed audio format of choice for audiophiles is FLAC, I believe. (Personally, I'm perfectly happy with high-bitrate MP3 but I'm no connoisseur.) If your players won't play it, you're probably better off either changing players or seeing if you can reFlash them with something like Rockbox. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
On 14/04/10 12:39, Nigel Verity wrote: > Hi Guys > > I'm a bit of an audiophile, and have a large collection of music stored > in WAV format to preserve the sound quality. Clearly it's not possible > to copy many of these huge files to a portable player, so they need to > be compressed. After much experimentation I've concluded that OGG and > WMA are both better formats for sound quality than MP3 at a given bit > rate. The trouble is that neither of my portable players will play OGG, > so it has to be WMA. Actually when I was doing some broadcast training I was shown some results of some tests of audio quality, WMA came out the worst. I believe the best was ATRAC as used on Minidisc (or those Sony Network Walkmans). When you were doing tests, what parameters did you use? Did you use a constant bit rate (say 192kbit/sec) or a variable bit rate with joint stereo? Anyway, back to encoding in WMA... I did a quick Google search and found this... http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t52493.html It seems the command line is as follows: ffmpeg -i test.wav -acodec wmav2 -ab 128 test.wma Can't say if it works though, I tend to use MP3, OGG and FLAC myself. Rob -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
[ubuntu-uk] Audio Conversion: WAV to WMA
Hi Guys I'm a bit of an audiophile, and have a large collection of music stored in WAV format to preserve the sound quality. Clearly it's not possible to copy many of these huge files to a portable player, so they need to be compressed. After much experimentation I've concluded that OGG and WMA are both better formats for sound quality than MP3 at a given bit rate. The trouble is that neither of my portable players will play OGG, so it has to be WMA. Using the command "ffmpeg -i input.wav -ab 128k output.wma" I get a WMA file which will sound great on Linux using players such as VLC, Exaile and Rhythmbox. Unfortunately on both my portable players I get "File Error". I've even tried playing files converted this way on XP using WMP, and got similar results. Does anyone have any suggestions on an ffmpeg parameter that will solve the problem, or know of an alternative Linux app that will convert the files correctly? Thanks. Regards Nige -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
