Re: cards in a stack
Hi Paul, I'm just trying to decide whether to do "any" conversions at all. Actually I have one particular stack that I will probably push to the front of the line, since I use it almost every day to do structural calculations; and would like to expand its capabilities under the new California Building Code. Since we have a lot of engineers who use PCs, a cross platform application would be nice. And it would be fun to do. Right now, I just need the time to devote to doing them; aside from paying the bills. (smile) Joe Wilkins On Jan 2, 2008, at 8:00 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Joe, I was not saying a port from HC to Rev is easy. A year ago we completed porting a business system consisting of 22 databases, hundreds of reports, and dozens of auxiliary programs - it took over five years! But, you can get a quick idea of how your stacks will perform by opening them in Rev and turning off the error reporting. For instance, you can test the speed of the Find command. What type of stacks are you converting? Paul Looney ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: cards in a stack
Joe, I was not saying a port from HC to Rev is easy. A year ago we completed porting a business system consisting of 22 databases, hundreds of reports, and dozens of auxiliary programs - it took over five years! But, you can get a quick idea of how your stacks will perform by opening them in Rev and turning off the error reporting. For instance, you can test the speed of the Find command. What type of stacks are you converting? Paul Looney ** See AOL's top rated recipes (http://food.aol.com/top-rated-recipes?NCID=aoltop000304) ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: cards in a stack
Paul, I wish it were that simple; and I had thought it would be at the outset, but there are an awful lot of fixes that need to be done before things work even close to the way the do in HC. Some do convert as easily as you said, but others don't even come close. Just keep plugging away. Thanks, Joe Wilkins On Jan 2, 2008, at 3:45 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Joe, In my experience, finding in Rev. is really quite fast - plenty fast for 2400 records - of course HC's fast find really spoils you. You can convert your most challenging stack to Rev. - by just opening it in Rev. and saving it. Rev's built-in HC to Rev. converter is fantastic! Give it a try. Paul Looney ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: cards in a stack
Joe, In my experience, finding in Rev. is really quite fast - plenty fast for 2400 records - of course HC's fast find really spoils you. You can convert your most challenging stack to Rev. - by just opening it in Rev. and saving it. Rev's built-in HC to Rev. converter is fantastic! Give it a try. Paul Looney ** See AOL's top rated recipes (http://food.aol.com/top-rated-recipes?NCID=aoltop000304) ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: cards in a stack
I believe the performance hit is because Rev loads everything into ram. HyperCard didn't. In HyperCard you had to periodically compact the stack because of the fragmentation caused by the swapping to and from disk. Rev never needs to compact because a Save saves the entire stack again. Bill Vlahos Sent from my iPhone On Jan 2, 2008, at 12:40 PM, Joe Lewis Wilkins <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Thanks, Paul. I didn't realize that there was a performance hit using Rev. How about searching in Rev? HC's searching was amazingly fast, even in the days of SE30s, although I do recall implementing an indexing protocol to make sure account cards were found as fast as I wanted them to be found. Joe Wilkins On Jan 2, 2008, at 12:23 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Joe, We have had Rev stacks with well over 10,000 cards. They open, close, and save much more slowly than the same data in a HyperCard stack with the same cards. They also require much more memory than the equivalent HC stacks. The speed and memory usage problems seem to be exponential (the more cards, the greater the problem). Based on my experience, you should be able to manage stacks with less than 2500 cards in Rev - but don't expect HC performance. Paul Looney ** See AOL's top rated recipes (http://food.aol.com/top-rated-recipes?NCID=aoltop000304) ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: cards in a stack
Thanks, Paul. I didn't realize that there was a performance hit using Rev. How about searching in Rev? HC's searching was amazingly fast, even in the days of SE30s, although I do recall implementing an indexing protocol to make sure account cards were found as fast as I wanted them to be found. Joe Wilkins On Jan 2, 2008, at 12:23 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Joe, We have had Rev stacks with well over 10,000 cards. They open, close, and save much more slowly than the same data in a HyperCard stack with the same cards. They also require much more memory than the equivalent HC stacks. The speed and memory usage problems seem to be exponential (the more cards, the greater the problem). Based on my experience, you should be able to manage stacks with less than 2500 cards in Rev - but don't expect HC performance. Paul Looney ** See AOL's top rated recipes (http://food.aol.com/top-rated-recipes?NCID=aoltop000304) ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: cards in a stack
Joe, We have had Rev stacks with well over 10,000 cards. They open, close, and save much more slowly than the same data in a HyperCard stack with the same cards. They also require much more memory than the equivalent HC stacks. The speed and memory usage problems seem to be exponential (the more cards, the greater the problem). Based on my experience, you should be able to manage stacks with less than 2500 cards in Rev - but don't expect HC performance. Paul Looney ** See AOL's top rated recipes (http://food.aol.com/top-rated-recipes?NCID=aoltop000304) ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: cards in a stack
Militón, My largest HC stack was 2,400 cards, so I imagine with Rev you could have many more than that based on memory availability these days. You should get a more absolute answer from some one else on the list. Joe Wilkins On Jan 2, 2008, at 10:35 AM, Meliton Cardona wrote: How many cards can a stack have? Melitón Cardona ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: cards in a stack
Meliton Cardona wrote: How many cards can a stack have? I believe the only logical restriction is with IDs, so given that the engine doles out a new ID for every object, even cards, regardless of type, the total number of objects in a stack is 4,294,967,295. However, for most practical uses you'll find that performance begins to bog down at about 5,000 cards, and finds, sorts, and saves are prohibitively slow at 50,000 cards for most uses. And then there's memory: unlike systems that page parts of the file from disk (DBs, FMP, HC, etc.), Rev loads an entire stack file into RAM. This makes for good performance and more flexibility with when things are saved, making even traditional document behaviors a snap. But it does mean that it can use more memory if you're loading large stack files. But there are so many ways to work with data in Rev, to help find the one most suited for your project can you tell us a bit about how many cards you anticipate needing and what you want to store on those cards? -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
