Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
On 22 Feb 2008, at 16:06, Richard Gaskin wrote: Lars Brehmer wrote: ...do the rev developers themselves plan to make that platform a standalone option? I guess that can't really be answered until everyone has seen the SDK,but isn't it theoretically possible? I am keeping my fingers crossed! Software is just lights dancing on a screen. Everything is possible. They key question is whether there is a compelling business case for investing the time. If I were RunRev, long before I jumped on the iPhone bandwaqon I'd make an engine that runs on the Windows-based handhelds. Simpler API, and a much larger installed base. While that may be true of the iPhone on it's own, the iPod has 80% of the mp3 player and with the addition of the iPod Touch this is bound to grow. Also since they is very little difference between the iPhone and the iPod Touch, I reckon the market will be humungus! All the Best Dave ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
In this case, I've been putting the ID column off to the right and tabbing it off the display. I have a lot of tables with far more columns than they show, for example, a 16 column table with 4 columns showing. This makes it easy, when the user clicks on one row, to show item detail, just replace tab with cr and you have all desired properties for display in a separate field. Although of course a better table object would be a huge help to folks like me, check out the functionality of these grids: http://extjs.com/deploy/dev/examples/grid/edit-grid.html http://extjs.com/deploy/dev/examples/grid/grouping.html On Feb 22, 2008, at 5:27 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote: Suppose you want to display records from a database in a multi- column list field. You'll want to keep track of the ID field, but that's just noise to the end-user so you don't want to display it. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
Josh Mellicker wrote: In this case, I've been putting the ID column off to the right and tabbing it off the display. I have a lot of tables with far more columns than they show, for example, a 16 column table with 4 columns showing. A good solution for fixed-width lists, but many of my apps need to also support horizontal scrolling, a la iTunes: http://www.fourthworld.net/list.jpg -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
On 23 Feb 2008, at 02:27, Richard Gaskin wrote: Suppose you want to display records from a database in a multi- column list field. You'll want to keep track of the ID field, but that's just noise to the end-user so you don't want to display it. Currently, you'd have to parse out that column and store it in a separate field. When the user clicks on a line in the list, you look up the corresponding line in the ID field to do whatever you need to do with that record. But then you want to sort the list. So you have to recombine the ID field with the rest of the list contents, do the sort, then parse them apart again for display. Ugh. Not to say this isn't a nice feature request, but removing or adding columns isn't exactly the rocket science you make it out to be. For example: on mouseUp put 1 into doNotWantColumn put 2 into sortByThisColumn put the data of field 1 into theData sort theData by item sortByThisColumn of each split theData by column delete variable theData[doNotWantColumn] combine theData by column put theData into field 1 end mouseUp Obviously not as simple as not showing a column in the field, and less memory efficient too, but on the plus side this is available now, and most likely faster then a modified field object (everything that has to do with fields is slow). -- official ChatRev page: http://chatrev.bjoernke.com Chat with other RunRev developers: go stack URL http://homepage.mac.com/bvg/chatrev1.3.rev; ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
Björnke von Gierke wrote: On 23 Feb 2008, at 02:27, Richard Gaskin wrote: Suppose you want to display records from a database in a multi- column list field. You'll want to keep track of the ID field, but that's just noise to the end-user so you don't want to display it. Currently, you'd have to parse out that column and store it in a separate field. When the user clicks on a line in the list, you look up the corresponding line in the ID field to do whatever you need to do with that record. But then you want to sort the list. So you have to recombine the ID field with the rest of the list contents, do the sort, then parse them apart again for display. Ugh. Not to say this isn't a nice feature request, but removing or adding columns isn't exactly the rocket science you make it out to be. Never said it was. Not sure what that's about, unless Ugh is some acronym for the European Space Agency. ;) I just said it was inconvenient, and not the sort of thing I want to spent time teaching, nor presumably how RunRev would like to see potential new corporate adoptees spend their time learning. For example: on mouseUp put 1 into doNotWantColumn put 2 into sortByThisColumn put the data of field 1 into theData sort theData by item sortByThisColumn of each split theData by column delete variable theData[doNotWantColumn] combine theData by column put theData into field 1 end mouseUp Obviously not as simple as not showing a column in the field, and less memory efficient too, but on the plus side this is available now, and most likely faster then a modified field object (everything that has to do with fields is slow). I think it would actually be the same or slower since it touches the field data twice and requires split and combine, which are computationally intensive on large data sets. But moreover, your handler does something so very different from the example I gave above that I'm not sure how it's relevant here. While three of us have explained the value of preserving data and just hiding it from display, if I read your handler correctly it completely deletes the column altogether. If the data in this hidden columns were IDs, such as in the example I gave, preserving them would be critical to using the visible data in the field. For performance and convenience, compare your handler to what I and the others here are proposing with zero-width columns: on mouseUp sort lines of field 1 by item 2 of each end mouseUp With this proposed method we touch the field data no more than yours, but most importantly we're preserving all of the data. -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
Getting to this thread a bit late... A Windows mobile version of Rev would be great (hey I think I even voted for one in BugZilla about three years ago) but if I could only have one mobile Rev platform then it would be for the iPhone/iPod Touch. These are the first handheld devices that I've seen that, IMHO, have real potential in the education sector. PDAs, whether Windows powered or not, have never taken off among students but these just might! I couldn't agree more Terry. The phone manufacturers cannot understand the lure of the iPhone and don't get the importance of the user experience where features are very similar. The same with handhelds - the iPhone/iPod touch make using this sort of device so much easier and more pleasant, that I reckon such things are finally going to become mainstream. It's a tough call. The iPhone has captured some healthy mindshare, but like the Mac GUI it won't be long before its gestures (and more) are simply industry standard. And for the other capabilities, competing vendors don't have far to go. I got a Palm Centro for my gal, and it's quite a powerful little device. And I have to say I prefer the tactile response of a fixed keypad over the where-did-I-just-press? virtual keypad of the iPhone. And ideal device may be more like the Sidekick: usable physical keypad with large screen display. Add gestures and it's an iPhone-killer. Richard, a lot of the people who say they don't like the iPhone keyboard are won over as soon as they actually use one. Have you played with one? I have used handhelds with keyboards and I find the iPod touch/iPhone keyboard to be enormously easier to use and more accurate. Even typing passwords is easy as the feedback for which button you are pressing is immediate and obvious. As regards a Rev port, while I would love to se it happen, and hope that the iPhone's version of OS X is similar enough to the full thing to make such a port relatively easy, I agree that RunRev should concentrate on the desktop version for now. Meanwhile I am hoping to learn enough from RevOnRockets to be able to make some simple web apps. I have already tailored some Rev-created updated web pages to suit but I would love to be able to make these pages more interactive. Cheers, Sarah ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
Sarah Reichelt wrote: Richard, a lot of the people who say they don't like the iPhone keyboard are won over as soon as they actually use one. In my case it was the other way around. After all, it's rare that Apple does something as completely baseless as the hockey-puck mouse, so I was predisposed to thinking the virtual keyboard would be easy to use. That is, until I used it. Not having any tactile feedback on such tiny target areas makes it very hard to get used to, and I hear this complaint from about half the iPhone owners I know, including some with rather tiny hands, so we can rule out hand-size being the determiner for this. I'm not claiming my tiny sample of anecdotal input says much one way or another. Simply to answer your question, I find tactile feedback very useful, and miss it in the iPod. -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
You complain that my handler deletes the data, so it seems I wasn't clear enough. Obviously there's a custom property, called data. This is what you use to show later parts of, or sorted stuff of, in the field. That is why I said less memory efficient, because there's an additional property containing all the data. Sure, dividing the presentation from the actual data is much more work then having both in one, but it also gives you more control. Again I'm not against having all the data in a field, and I never claimed my way of doubling everything in a cprop is simpler. But no matter if runrev agrees that your proposal is a nice thing to have or not, it isn't available now. Also: You need to add a set the itemDelimiter to tab line for my example code to actually work. have FUN (extra caps for extra fun) Björnke On 23 Feb 2008, at 23:53, Richard Gaskin wrote: Never said it was. Not sure what that's about, unless Ugh is some acronym for the European Space Agency. ;) I just said it was inconvenient, and not the sort of thing I want to spent time teaching, nor presumably how RunRev would like to see potential new corporate adoptees spend their time learning. For example: on mouseUp put 1 into doNotWantColumn put 2 into sortByThisColumn put the data of field 1 into theData sort theData by item sortByThisColumn of each split theData by column delete variable theData[doNotWantColumn] combine theData by column put theData into field 1 end mouseUp Obviously not as simple as not showing a column in the field, and less memory efficient too, but on the plus side this is available now, and most likely faster then a modified field object (everything that has to do with fields is slow). But moreover, your handler does something so very different from the example I gave above that I'm not sure how it's relevant here. While three of us have explained the value of preserving data and just hiding it from display, if I read your handler correctly it completely deletes the column altogether. For performance and convenience, compare your handler to what I and the others here are proposing with zero-width columns: on mouseUp sort lines of field 1 by item 2 of each end mouseUp -- official ChatRev page: http://chatrev.bjoernke.com Chat with other RunRev developers: go stack URL http://homepage.mac.com/bvg/chatrev1.3.rev; ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
Just stick some bubble-wrap over the screen! Cheers, Luis. Richard Gaskin wrote: Sarah Reichelt wrote: Richard, a lot of the people who say they don't like the iPhone keyboard are won over as soon as they actually use one. In my case it was the other way around. After all, it's rare that Apple does something as completely baseless as the hockey-puck mouse, so I was predisposed to thinking the virtual keyboard would be easy to use. That is, until I used it. Not having any tactile feedback on such tiny target areas makes it very hard to get used to, and I hear this complaint from about half the iPhone owners I know, including some with rather tiny hands, so we can rule out hand-size being the determiner for this. I'm not claiming my tiny sample of anecdotal input says much one way or another. Simply to answer your question, I find tactile feedback very useful, and miss it in the iPod. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
Björnke von Gierke wrote: You complain that my handler deletes the data, so it seems I wasn't clear enough. Obviously there's a custom property, called data. This is what you use to show later parts of, or sorted stuff of, in the field. That is why I said less memory efficient, because there's an additional property containing all the data. Sure, dividing the presentation from the actual data is much more work then having both in one, but it also gives you more control. True, but if the object the data is stored in is part of the UI doesn't it obviate many of the benefits of such separation? And if the data is already stored in a database or other file then that's just an extra copy. But storage aside, if we delete the ID field from the record before we display it how do we know which record the user clicks on? So in addition to adding the line of code about the itemdel, we need to add another which stores the sorted list back into the property before stripping out stuff for display, so we can later look it up in response to clicks. Doable, yes, but requires a bit of forethought, strategy, and time. Again I'm not against having all the data in a field, and I never claimed my way of doubling everything in a cprop is simpler. But no matter if runrev agrees that your proposal is a nice thing to have or not, it isn't available now. As one who generally shares your interest here in focusing on immediate solutions, I appreciate your help with the scripting. But stepping back to the original context of this thread, this was a conversation about relative ROI of proposed features, and this admittedly tiny feature of zero-width columns was presented in conjunction with independent column alignment. The column alignment is absolutely critical for broad adoption in business environments. And fortunately the good folks at RunRev have previously acknowledged the importance of independent column alignment. Extra bonus points that when they find themselves diving deep into the field object to make that happen, they'll be in a position to add zero-width columns for very little additional effort. Like Linux support, this zero-width-column thang is a feature that, if well-timed, has an unusually high ROI because it has such an uncommonly low cost. And to bring all this back to the iPhone, if the API presents a very low cost to port then of course it should be pursued at whatever point in the priority list where its ROI ranking would put it. But the iPhone is not a Mac, and I suspect there will be many differences in how apps must be built for each. -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
I couldn't agree more! Personally I doubt I will ever learn to use/ code Apple's Xcode or the coming iPhone SDK, but I am sure some of you real cracks out there could develop a rev stack that can convert what is necessary to run a standalone on those devices. Or do the rev developers themselves plan to make that platform a standalone option? I guess that can't really be answered until everyone has seen the SDK,but isn't it theoretically possible? I am keeping my fingers crossed! Lars ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
Lars, standalones would need an ARM targeted engine and that does not exist (I think). Best options for us is Web apps on iPhone. iPhone javascript support has some nice features so you can build nice webapps for it. andre PS: who has not an iPhone and thus can't test anything. On 2/22/08, Lars Brehmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I couldn't agree more! Personally I doubt I will ever learn to use/ code Apple's Xcode or the coming iPhone SDK, but I am sure some of you real cracks out there could develop a rev stack that can convert what is necessary to run a standalone on those devices. Or do the rev developers themselves plan to make that platform a standalone option? I guess that can't really be answered until everyone has seen the SDK,but isn't it theoretically possible? I am keeping my fingers crossed! Lars ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution -- http://www.andregarzia.com All We Do Is Code. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
Lars Brehmer wrote: ...do the rev developers themselves plan to make that platform a standalone option? I guess that can't really be answered until everyone has seen the SDK,but isn't it theoretically possible? I am keeping my fingers crossed! Software is just lights dancing on a screen. Everything is possible. They key question is whether there is a compelling business case for investing the time. If I were RunRev, long before I jumped on the iPhone bandwaqon I'd make an engine that runs on the Windows-based handhelds. Simpler API, and a much larger installed base. -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
On Feb 22, 2008, at 11:06 AM, Andre Garzia wrote: PS: who has not an iPhone and thus can't test anything. Perhaps you could try iPhoney http://www.marketcircle.com/iphoney/. My brother Greg says it works OK and he used it a little while developing the iPhone interface to ScreenSteps Live. Though he says the best solution was when he hooked up his local development server to be accessible over wifi. Then he could just test using a real iPhone in his office without having to deploy to the public server first. Regards, -- Trevor DeVore Blue Mango Learning Systems www.bluemangolearning.com-www.screensteps.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
On Feb 22, 2008, at 5:06 PM, Andre Garzia wrote: iPhone javascript support has some nice features so you can build nice webapps for it. andre PS: who has not an iPhone and thus can't test anything. http://www.marketcircle.com/iphoney/ Not really an iPhone but seems to provide a 'frame' for your canvas with lights dancing across the screen ;-) For appearance only, in a way. Looking for a way to see how your web creations will look on iPhone? Look no further. iPhoney gives you a pixel-accurate web browsing environment—powered by Safari—that you can use when developing web sites for iPhone. It's the perfect 320 by 480-pixel canvas for your iPhone development. And it's free. sims ClipaSearch Pro http://www.ClipaTools.com Across Platforms - Code and Culture http://www.ezpzapps.com/blog/ ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
If I were RunRev, long before I jumped on the iPhone bandwaqon I'd make an engine that runs on the Windows-based handhelds. Simpler API, and a much larger installed base. A Windows mobile version of Rev would be great (hey I think I even voted for one in BugZilla about three years ago) but if I could only have one mobile Rev platform then it would be for the iPhone/iPod Touch. These are the first handheld devices that I've seen that, IMHO, have real potential in the education sector. PDAs, whether Windows powered or not, have never taken off among students but these just might! Terry... -- Dr Terry Judd Lecturer in Educational Technology (Design) Biomedical Multimedia Unit Faculty of Medicine, Dentistry Health Sciences The University of Melbourne Parkville VIC 3052 AUSTRALIA 61-3 8344 0187 ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
Hello Sorry Richard, but I disagree. I recently read (maybe from this same mailing list) that the iPhone has more penetration than Linux within internet-connected devices. If I remember correctly, measurement was taken from Google visitors. If this is correct, the iPhone would be an important platform for RunRev. Regards, Andres Martinez www.baKno.com On Feb 22, 2008, at 5:26 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote: Terry Judd wrote: If I were RunRev, long before I jumped on the iPhone bandwaqon I'd make an engine that runs on the Windows-based handhelds. Simpler API, and a much larger installed base. A Windows mobile version of Rev would be great (hey I think I even voted for one in BugZilla about three years ago) but if I could only have one mobile Rev platform then it would be for the iPhone/iPod Touch. These are the first handheld devices that I've seen that, IMHO, have real potential in the education sector. PDAs, whether Windows powered or not, have never taken off among students but these just might! It's a tough call. The iPhone has captured some healthy mindshare, but like the Mac GUI it won't be long before its gestures (and more) are simply industry standard. And for the other capabilities, competing vendors don't have far to go. I got a Palm Centro for my gal, and it's quite a powerful little device. And I have to say I prefer the tactile response of a fixed keypad over the where-did-I-just-press? virtual keypad of the iPhone. And ideal device may be more like the Sidekick: usable physical keypad with large screen display. Add gestures and it's an iPhone-killer. It'll be interesting to see whether Apple opens up the iPhone architecture faster than competing vendors add gestures. But while that race is on, it would take RunRev some time to deliver an engine for either device. With both the iPhone and competing alternatives in such a state of flux, the whole thing is quite a moving target, and in the meantime I really, really, really need independent column alignment and zero-width columns in Rev fields, as do a few thousand others. So it may be best for Rev to keep focusing on honing the engine for the business tasks currently asked of it, while the Handheld Platform Wars play themselves out for at least another year. -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
On Feb 22, 2008, at 2:26 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote: So it may be best for Rev to keep focusing on honing the engine for the business tasks currently asked of it, while the Handheld Platform Wars play themselves out for at least another year. Not to get in the way of other important features that Rev is lacking, I find spending some time on this technology to be quite worthy of Rev's time. The clean flat screen would be a benefit for the apps I am creating. It allows the entire screen to be made into any button configuration I want. I don't even care about iPhone compatibility. I just need iTouch compatibility. I have a whole slew of apps that would fit that hardware architecture just fine. With sockets, you have a networked, portable, affordable, mini apple computer for all kinds of embedded application uses. Mark Talluto -- CANELA Software http://www.canelasoftware.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
Terry Judd wrote: If I were RunRev, long before I jumped on the iPhone bandwaqon I'd make an engine that runs on the Windows-based handhelds. Simpler API, and a much larger installed base. A Windows mobile version of Rev would be great (hey I think I even voted for one in BugZilla about three years ago) but if I could only have one mobile Rev platform then it would be for the iPhone/iPod Touch. These are the first handheld devices that I've seen that, IMHO, have real potential in the education sector. PDAs, whether Windows powered or not, have never taken off among students but these just might! It's a tough call. The iPhone has captured some healthy mindshare, but like the Mac GUI it won't be long before its gestures (and more) are simply industry standard. And for the other capabilities, competing vendors don't have far to go. I got a Palm Centro for my gal, and it's quite a powerful little device. And I have to say I prefer the tactile response of a fixed keypad over the where-did-I-just-press? virtual keypad of the iPhone. And ideal device may be more like the Sidekick: usable physical keypad with large screen display. Add gestures and it's an iPhone-killer. It'll be interesting to see whether Apple opens up the iPhone architecture faster than competing vendors add gestures. But while that race is on, it would take RunRev some time to deliver an engine for either device. With both the iPhone and competing alternatives in such a state of flux, the whole thing is quite a moving target, and in the meantime I really, really, really need independent column alignment and zero-width columns in Rev fields, as do a few thousand others. So it may be best for Rev to keep focusing on honing the engine for the business tasks currently asked of it, while the Handheld Platform Wars play themselves out for at least another year. -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
Andres Martinez wrote: Sorry Richard, but I disagree. I recently read (maybe from this same mailing list) that the iPhone has more penetration than Linux within internet-connected devices. If I remember correctly, measurement was taken from Google visitors. If this is correct, the iPhone would be an important platform for RunRev. I think we're in agreement that the iPhone is an interesting platform, and of course there's no disputing hard data like the Linux market share stat you noted. But the question here isn't a technical one, it's a business one, and like all such questions it focuses on ROI: Before Rev was Rev it was MetaCard, and it was born on UNIX, with Windows and then Mac added later. So a *NIX-compatible engine has always been around since the beginning. The efforts with v2.9 to bring it up to date for the current Linux window managers are relatively trivial; the core of the engine has always run on *NIX. Very little cost involved in Linux support at this time. Moreover, I hadn't referred to Linux at all. With mobile devices, the most useful comparison is to Windows Mobile. While the comparison with Linux is interesting, it doesn't affect a business decision between iPhone and Windows Mobile. The unknown here is the cost of porting the engine to whatever variant of OS X us running the iPhone, relative to the level of effort that would be needed to port it to Windows Mobile. If the cost is favorable relative to market share, it's worth doing. And maybe both are worth doing; I have neither the data on Rev's development costs nor the Windows Mobile market to make that decision for them, nor would they care if I did since I don't work there. :) But I do know this: Rev is already on the desktop, and to fully exploit the opportunities already before us we really need independent column alignment and zero-width columns in fields. A lot of money is left on the table until those two features are in place. So once we get those I'll happily explore other more exotic opportunities. But in the meantime there's plenty to keep RunRev, and us, profitably busy while the mobile market sorts itself out. -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
On 23/2/08 9:26 AM, Richard Gaskin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So it may be best for Rev to keep focusing on honing the engine for the business tasks currently asked of it, while the Handheld Platform Wars play themselves out for at least another year. I agree that we need to play the waiting game for a while but hopefully not for too long. Handhelds have been around for a while without ever really taking off - but I reckon that's about to change. While I don't expect to see an iPhone (or whatever) version of Rev anytime soon, I'd hope that someone in the Rev engine room will at least take the time to investigate Apple's SDK when it comes out. Yes the so-called web apps that we can already develop for the iPhone are promising but if you look through the hundreds that have already been published you'd struggle to find more than a couple that were truly useful (a bit like Apple's dashboard and Yahoo's widgets) - but real mini-desktop apps... Terry... -- Dr Terry Judd Lecturer in Educational Technology (Design) Biomedical Multimedia Unit Faculty of Medicine, Dentistry Health Sciences The University of Melbourne Parkville VIC 3052 AUSTRALIA 61-3 8344 0187 ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
On 23/2/08 10:20 AM, Richard Gaskin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But I do know this: Rev is already on the desktop, and to fully exploit the opportunities already before us we really need independent column alignment and zero-width columns in fields. A lot of money is left on the table until those two features are in place. Agreed - I also want these feature now, Rev for iPhone can wait until next week ;) Terry... ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
silly question, but what does one do with a zero-width column ? On 23/2/08 10:20 AM, Richard Gaskin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But I do know this: Rev is already on the desktop, and to fully exploit the opportunities already before us we really need independent column alignment and zero-width columns in fields. A lot of money is left on the table until those two features are in place. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
Hide data in-line in a column in a field row. Associating hidden data with a line can be very useful. Currently we have to hide any such data at the end of a row, out of view. sqb silly question, but what does one do with a zero-width column ? On 23/2/08 10:20 AM, Richard Gaskin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But I do know this: Rev is already on the desktop, and to fully exploit the opportunities already before us we really need independent column alignment and zero-width columns in fields. A lot of money is left on the table until those two features are in place. -- stephen barncard s a n f r a n c i s c o - - - - - - - - - - - - ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
I don't know about other programmers, but I would be able to display just the columns I wanted for the user without having to parse a table of data. For example: All data is in one table of 15 columns. Field price would use column 1,2,4,10 which could be [database id][inventory item num][description][price] the user only needs to see [description][price] so all columns would be 0 width except those 2 If the user clicks, now you want to display the related data such as [package size][in stock][shipping wt] All this info has already been retrieved and Rev can use chunking to get it. I am sure there are other uses. Jim Ault Las Vegas On 2/22/08 5:04 PM, Martin Blackman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: silly question, but what does one do with a zero-width column ? On 23/2/08 10:20 AM, Richard Gaskin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But I do know this: Rev is already on the desktop, and to fully exploit the opportunities already before us we really need independent column alignment and zero-width columns in fields. A lot of money is left on the table until those two features are in place. ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: RunRev for iPhone and iPod Touch
Martin Blackman wrote: silly question, but what does one do with a zero-width column ? Not silly at all. I got the idea from Ken Ray, and have been a strong advocate of it since. But when I first heard about it, I had the same question. :) Suppose you want to display records from a database in a multi-column list field. You'll want to keep track of the ID field, but that's just noise to the end-user so you don't want to display it. Currently, you'd have to parse out that column and store it in a separate field. When the user clicks on a line in the list, you look up the corresponding line in the ID field to do whatever you need to do with that record. But then you want to sort the list. So you have to recombine the ID field with the rest of the list contents, do the sort, then parse them apart again for display. Ugh. Not the sort of thing I want to spend time in a seminar at a corporation when I'm trying to teach them how to use Rev. With a zero-width column, you can effectively hide any data you want, yet still keep it bound to the rest of the display. Simple, convenient, easy to learn. -- Richard Gaskin Managing Editor, revJournal ___ Rev tips, tutorials and more: http://www.revJournal.com ___ use-revolution mailing list use-revolution@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
