Re: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd

[Antony Awaida - CEO, Apporto]

Hey Mike:

Yes. Sorry if it came across that way. Point taken!

Cheers,
Antony

ᐧ

On Fri, Jan 19, 2024 at 9:51 AM Michael Jumper  wrote:

> Hello Antony,
>
> If you feel your changes would be beneficial, then please simply open
> them up so the community can start digging. There's no need for your
> team to sit on those changes until they grow to a theoretical point. The
> community is ready.
>
> You can, of course, continue to not do that. As someone who has
> personally volunteered many years to create and maintain Guacamole,
> that's a business decision that I strongly disagree with, but it is
> ultimately your decision.
>
> To that end, please do not use this list to advertise features of your
> own product, particularly features that are being intentionally withheld
> from the community on this list. Please instead use this list to help
> the community, such as by answering questions in a vendor-neutral fashion.
>
> - Mike
>
> On 1/19/24 09:18, Antony Awaida - CEO, Apporto wrote:
> > Hi Joachim:
> >
> > The problem is that we have forked from Guac 1.2 and have made very
> > extensive changes to customize the functionality for our
> > customers' needs (performance, security, replaced SFTP with a different
> > approach etc).  Merging with Guac again would be a major undertaking we
> > are unable to do at this time.
> >
> > As the team grows, we may reconsider our options.
> >
> > Hope this helps
> > Cheers,
> > Antony
> > ᐧ
> >
> > On Fri, Jan 19, 2024 at 12:50 AM Joachim Lindenberg
> >  wrote:
> >
> > Hi Antony,
> >
> > Can you please elaborate more on how you achieved that and what
> > blocks open sourcing that solution?
> >
> > I am convinced that a lot users would be interested as today users
> > can remote access company resources but not really participate in
> > video conferences via Guacamole.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Joachim
> >
> > __ __
> >
> > *Von:*Antony Awaida - CEO, Apporto  > >
> > *Gesendet:* Freitag, 19. Januar 2024 00:52
> > *An:* user@guacamole.apache.org 
> > *Betreff:* Re: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd
> >
> > __ __
> >
> > Hi Steven:
> >
> > __ __
> >
> > At Apporto we have extended Guacamole so it uses H264 all the way to
> > the browser. Our users can get up to 60 fps video.  Even with
> > very low specs on the rdp server. 
> >
> > __ __
> >
> > Our business model does not unfortunately, allow us to open source
> > this extension. 
> >
> > __ __
> >
> > However, if this is of interest, we can license it to you
> >
> > __ __
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Antony Awaida
> >
> > www.apporto.com 
> >
> > Das Bild wurde vom Absender entfernt.ᐧ
> >
> > __ __
> >
> > On Thu, Jan 18, 2024 at 11:20 AM Barnhart, Steven
> > mailto:barnhart@osu.edu>> wrote:
> >
> > Hi there,
> >
> > 
> >
> > We have some use cases where (unfortunatelty) users are
> > reviewing videos from a remote machine and using Guacamole to
> > connect. The viewing of videos is where the problem lies. A 720p
> > sample video viewed through Guacamole is very laggy and the
> > audio pops in/out. It is not reliable. During video playback,
> > all other mouse movements or commands are delayed on the server
> > as well. I see on the server side when viewing a video that a
> > guacd process spikes to 80-100%. We are also using Docker.
> >
> > 
> >
> >  1. I assume Guacamole encodes the rdp and sends it as video in
> > some way? Is there a way to use hardware accelertation such
> > as intel vaapi/quicksync for this process and could it maybe
> > help?
> >  2. Is it believed Docker vs native would have any real
> > difference in playing and streaming a video from an RDP
> > session?
> >
> > 
> >
> > Thank you.
> >
> > 
> >
> > *Steven T. Barnhart*
> >
> > Solutions Engineer
> > *The Ohio State University*
> > OTDI Research Technology and Infrastructure
> > (614) 688-1013 Office
> >
> > 
> >
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscr...@guacamole.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: user-h...@guacamole.apache.org
>
>

Re: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd

[Michael Jumper]

Hello Antony,

If you feel your changes would be beneficial, then please simply open 
them up so the community can start digging. There's no need for your 
team to sit on those changes until they grow to a theoretical point. The 
community is ready.


You can, of course, continue to not do that. As someone who has 
personally volunteered many years to create and maintain Guacamole, 
that's a business decision that I strongly disagree with, but it is 
ultimately your decision.


To that end, please do not use this list to advertise features of your 
own product, particularly features that are being intentionally withheld 
from the community on this list. Please instead use this list to help 
the community, such as by answering questions in a vendor-neutral fashion.


- Mike

On 1/19/24 09:18, Antony Awaida - CEO, Apporto wrote:

Hi Joachim:

The problem is that we have forked from Guac 1.2 and have made very 
extensive changes to customize the functionality for our 
customers' needs (performance, security, replaced SFTP with a different 
approach etc).  Merging with Guac again would be a major undertaking we 
are unable to do at this time.


As the team grows, we may reconsider our options.

Hope this helps
Cheers,
Antony
ᐧ

On Fri, Jan 19, 2024 at 12:50 AM Joachim Lindenberg 
 wrote:


Hi Antony,

Can you please elaborate more on how you achieved that and what
blocks open sourcing that solution?

I am convinced that a lot users would be interested as today users
can remote access company resources but not really participate in
video conferences via Guacamole.

Thanks,

Joachim

__ __

*Von:*Antony Awaida - CEO, Apporto mailto:ant...@apporto.com>>
*Gesendet:* Freitag, 19. Januar 2024 00:52
*An:* user@guacamole.apache.org 
*Betreff:* Re: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd

__ __

Hi Steven:

__ __

At Apporto we have extended Guacamole so it uses H264 all the way to
the browser. Our users can get up to 60 fps video.  Even with
very low specs on the rdp server. 

__ __

Our business model does not unfortunately, allow us to open source
this extension. 

__ __

However, if this is of interest, we can license it to you

__ __

Regards,

Antony Awaida

www.apporto.com 

Das Bild wurde vom Absender entfernt.ᐧ

__ __

On Thu, Jan 18, 2024 at 11:20 AM Barnhart, Steven
mailto:barnhart@osu.edu>> wrote:

Hi there,



We have some use cases where (unfortunatelty) users are
reviewing videos from a remote machine and using Guacamole to
connect. The viewing of videos is where the problem lies. A 720p
sample video viewed through Guacamole is very laggy and the
audio pops in/out. It is not reliable. During video playback,
all other mouse movements or commands are delayed on the server
as well. I see on the server side when viewing a video that a
guacd process spikes to 80-100%. We are also using Docker.



 1. I assume Guacamole encodes the rdp and sends it as video in
some way? Is there a way to use hardware accelertation such
as intel vaapi/quicksync for this process and could it maybe
help?
 2. Is it believed Docker vs native would have any real
difference in playing and streaming a video from an RDP
session?



Thank you.



*Steven T. Barnhart*

Solutions Engineer
*The Ohio State University*
OTDI Research Technology and Infrastructure
(614) 688-1013 Office





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To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscr...@guacamole.apache.org
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Re: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd

[Antony Awaida - CEO, Apporto]

Hi Joachim:

The problem is that we have forked from Guac 1.2 and have made very
extensive changes to customize the functionality for our customers' needs
(performance, security, replaced SFTP with a different approach etc).
Merging with Guac again would be a major undertaking we are unable to do at
this time.

As the team grows, we may reconsider our options.

Hope this helps
Cheers,
Antony
ᐧ

On Fri, Jan 19, 2024 at 12:50 AM Joachim Lindenberg
 wrote:

> Hi Antony,
>
> Can you please elaborate more on how you achieved that and what blocks
> open sourcing that solution?
>
> I am convinced that a lot users would be interested as today users can
> remote access company resources but not really participate in video
> conferences via Guacamole.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Joachim
>
>
>
> *Von:* Antony Awaida - CEO, Apporto 
> *Gesendet:* Freitag, 19. Januar 2024 00:52
> *An:* user@guacamole.apache.org
> *Betreff:* Re: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd
>
>
>
> Hi Steven:
>
>
>
> At Apporto we have extended Guacamole so it uses H264 all the way to the
> browser. Our users can get up to 60 fps video.  Even with very low
> specs on the rdp server.
>
>
>
> Our business model does not unfortunately, allow us to open source this
> extension.
>
>
>
> However, if this is of interest, we can license it to you
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Antony Awaida
>
> www.apporto.com
>
> [image: Das Bild wurde vom Absender entfernt.]ᐧ
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 18, 2024 at 11:20 AM Barnhart, Steven 
> wrote:
>
> Hi there,
>
>
>
> We have some use cases where (unfortunatelty) users are reviewing videos
> from a remote machine and using Guacamole to connect. The viewing of videos
> is where the problem lies. A 720p sample video viewed through Guacamole is
> very laggy and the audio pops in/out. It is not reliable. During video
> playback, all other mouse movements or commands are delayed on the server
> as well. I see on the server side when viewing a video that a guacd process
> spikes to 80-100%. We are also using Docker.
>
>
>
>1. I assume Guacamole encodes the rdp and sends it as video in some
>way? Is there a way to use hardware accelertation such as intel
>vaapi/quicksync for this process and could it maybe help?
>2. Is it believed Docker vs native would have any real difference in
>playing and streaming a video from an RDP session?
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
>
>
> *Steven T. Barnhart*
>
> Solutions Engineer
> *The Ohio State University*
> OTDI Research Technology and Infrastructure
> (614) 688-1013 Office
>
>
>
>

Re: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd

[Robert Dinse]

 I am using an i7-9700k clocked 4.8Ghz all cores, 32G of RAM, Ubuntu
24.04 with Ubuntu studio installed, a 6.7 Kernel, Intel UHD630 graphics, using 
the kernel X-server.  So not a particularly strong setup from a graphics point

of view.

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 Eskimo North Linux Friendly Internet Access, Shell Accounts, and Hosting.
   Knowledgeable human assistance, not telephone trees or script readers.
 See our web site: http://www.eskimo.com/ (206) 812-0051 or (800) 246-6874.

On Thu, 18 Jan 2024, Barnhart, Steven wrote:


Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2024 23:49:27 +
From: "Barnhart, Steven" 
Reply-To: user@guacamole.apache.org
To: "user@guacamole.apache.org" 
Subject: Re: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd

What are the stats of the video playing host?

–Steve

From: Robert Dinse 
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2024 6:48:08 PM
To: user@guacamole.apache.org 
Subject: Re: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd


 For what it's worth I don't have any issues with 1920x1080 videos.

-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-
 Eskimo North Linux Friendly Internet Access, Shell Accounts, and Hosting.
   Knowledgeable human assistance, not telephone trees or script readers.
 See our web site: 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.eskimo.com/__;!!KGKeukY!1JVzNbp4nCN9I_kR6CcUKAL7v0l12erMYofl58p2dKtuNK7CaXnELSIzmXQsp068r30_UPS1kZPeCzc71T594j-K_g$
  (206) 812-0051 or (800) 246-6874.

On Thu, 18 Jan 2024, Barnhart, Steven wrote:


Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2024 19:20:09 +
From: "Barnhart, Steven" 
Reply-To: user@guacamole.apache.org
To: "user@guacamole.apache.org" 
Subject: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd

Hi there,

We have some use cases where (unfortunatelty) users are reviewing videos from a 
remote machine and using Guacamole to connect. The viewing of videos is where 
the problem lies. A 720p sample video viewed through Guacamole is very laggy 
and the audio pops in/out. It is not reliable. During video playback, all other 
mouse movements or commands are delayed on the server as well. I see on the 
server side when viewing a video that a guacd process spikes to 80-100%. We are 
also using Docker.


 1.  I assume Guacamole encodes the rdp and sends it as video in some way? Is 
there a way to use hardware accelertation such as intel vaapi/quicksync for 
this process and could it maybe help?
 2.  Is it believed Docker vs native would have any real difference in playing 
and streaming a video from an RDP session?

Thank you.

Steven T. Barnhart
Solutions Engineer
The Ohio State University
OTDI Research Technology and Infrastructure
(614) 688-1013 Office




-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscr...@guacamole.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: user-h...@guacamole.apache.org



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Re: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd

[Antony Awaida - CEO, Apporto]

Hi Steven:

At Apporto we have extended Guacamole so it uses H264 all the way to the
browser. Our users can get up to 60 fps video.  Even with very low
specs on the rdp server.

Our business model does not unfortunately, allow us to open source this
extension.

However, if this is of interest, we can license it to you

Regards,
Antony Awaida
www.apporto.com
ᐧ

On Thu, Jan 18, 2024 at 11:20 AM Barnhart, Steven 
wrote:

> Hi there,
>
>
>
> We have some use cases where (unfortunatelty) users are reviewing videos
> from a remote machine and using Guacamole to connect. The viewing of videos
> is where the problem lies. A 720p sample video viewed through Guacamole is
> very laggy and the audio pops in/out. It is not reliable. During video
> playback, all other mouse movements or commands are delayed on the server
> as well. I see on the server side when viewing a video that a guacd process
> spikes to 80-100%. We are also using Docker.
>
>
>
>1. I assume Guacamole encodes the rdp and sends it as video in some
>way? Is there a way to use hardware accelertation such as intel
>vaapi/quicksync for this process and could it maybe help?
>2. Is it believed Docker vs native would have any real difference in
>playing and streaming a video from an RDP session?
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
>
>
> *Steven T. Barnhart*
>
> Solutions Engineer
> *The Ohio State University*
> OTDI Research Technology and Infrastructure
> (614) 688-1013 Office
>
>
>

Re: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd

[Barnhart, Steven]

What are the stats of the video playing host?

–Steve

From: Robert Dinse 
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2024 6:48:08 PM
To: user@guacamole.apache.org 
Subject: Re: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd


  For what it's worth I don't have any issues with 1920x1080 videos.

-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-
  Eskimo North Linux Friendly Internet Access, Shell Accounts, and Hosting.
Knowledgeable human assistance, not telephone trees or script readers.
  See our web site: 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.eskimo.com/__;!!KGKeukY!1JVzNbp4nCN9I_kR6CcUKAL7v0l12erMYofl58p2dKtuNK7CaXnELSIzmXQsp068r30_UPS1kZPeCzc71T594j-K_g$
  (206) 812-0051 or (800) 246-6874.

On Thu, 18 Jan 2024, Barnhart, Steven wrote:

> Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2024 19:20:09 +
> From: "Barnhart, Steven" 
> Reply-To: user@guacamole.apache.org
> To: "user@guacamole.apache.org" 
> Subject: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd
>
> Hi there,
>
> We have some use cases where (unfortunatelty) users are reviewing videos from 
> a remote machine and using Guacamole to connect. The viewing of videos is 
> where the problem lies. A 720p sample video viewed through Guacamole is very 
> laggy and the audio pops in/out. It is not reliable. During video playback, 
> all other mouse movements or commands are delayed on the server as well. I 
> see on the server side when viewing a video that a guacd process spikes to 
> 80-100%. We are also using Docker.
>
>
>  1.  I assume Guacamole encodes the rdp and sends it as video in some way? Is 
> there a way to use hardware accelertation such as intel vaapi/quicksync for 
> this process and could it maybe help?
>  2.  Is it believed Docker vs native would have any real difference in 
> playing and streaming a video from an RDP session?
>
> Thank you.
>
> Steven T. Barnhart
> Solutions Engineer
> The Ohio State University
> OTDI Research Technology and Infrastructure
> (614) 688-1013 Office
>
>

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Re: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd

[Robert Dinse]

 For what it's worth I don't have any issues with 1920x1080 videos.

-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-
 Eskimo North Linux Friendly Internet Access, Shell Accounts, and Hosting.
   Knowledgeable human assistance, not telephone trees or script readers.
 See our web site: http://www.eskimo.com/ (206) 812-0051 or (800) 246-6874.

On Thu, 18 Jan 2024, Barnhart, Steven wrote:


Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2024 19:20:09 +
From: "Barnhart, Steven" 
Reply-To: user@guacamole.apache.org
To: "user@guacamole.apache.org" 
Subject: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd

Hi there,

We have some use cases where (unfortunatelty) users are reviewing videos from a 
remote machine and using Guacamole to connect. The viewing of videos is where 
the problem lies. A 720p sample video viewed through Guacamole is very laggy 
and the audio pops in/out. It is not reliable. During video playback, all other 
mouse movements or commands are delayed on the server as well. I see on the 
server side when viewing a video that a guacd process spikes to 80-100%. We are 
also using Docker.


 1.  I assume Guacamole encodes the rdp and sends it as video in some way? Is 
there a way to use hardware accelertation such as intel vaapi/quicksync for 
this process and could it maybe help?
 2.  Is it believed Docker vs native would have any real difference in playing 
and streaming a video from an RDP session?

Thank you.

Steven T. Barnhart
Solutions Engineer
The Ohio State University
OTDI Research Technology and Infrastructure
(614) 688-1013 Office




-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscr...@guacamole.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: user-h...@guacamole.apache.org

RE: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd

[Mark Li]

I don’t run Guacamole anymore, but I would suggest running the client and 
server on separate instances or containers,   giving the instances/containers 
enough cpu that you don’t see spikes above 40%, and watching the memory usage 
and/or make sure memory isn’t maxing out. Watching the network usage and 
possibly using multiple nics if network bandwidth is an issue.

You need to discover the bottleneck and resolve that.  If on AWS use detailed 
monitoring, etc.

From: Sean Hulbert 
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2024 2:49 PM
To: user@guacamole.apache.org
Subject: Re: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd


Increase your CPUs to 2x6 (12Core) then increase RAM to at least 24G, then make 
sure your networking is at least 1G, this will help some.

I would also use Window 2019 or Ubuntu with xRDP

Hope this helps.

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain 
confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of 
the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure 
is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic 
Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please 
contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication. Content within 
this email communication is not legally binding as a contract and no promises 
are guaranteed unless in a formal contract outside this email communication.

igitur qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum!!!

Epitoma Rei Militaris
On 1/18/2024 11:28 AM, Nick Couchman wrote:
On Thu, Jan 18, 2024 at 2:20 PM Barnhart, Steven 
mailto:barnhart@osu.edu>> wrote:
Hi there,

We have some use cases where (unfortunatelty) users are reviewing videos from a 
remote machine and using Guacamole to connect. The viewing of videos is where 
the problem lies. A 720p sample video viewed through Guacamole is very laggy 
and the audio pops in/out. It is not reliable. During video playback, all other 
mouse movements or commands are delayed on the server as well. I see on the 
server side when viewing a video that a guacd process spikes to 80-100%. We are 
also using Docker.


  1.  I assume Guacamole encodes the rdp and sends it as video in some way? Is 
there a way to use hardware accelertation such as intel vaapi/quicksync for 
this process and could it maybe help?

Not as video, as images. The Guacamole software/protocol does some calculations 
to try to choose the best image format possible, but video/visual data is 
transferred as images.

I do not know of any hardware acceleration that is currently supported. The one 
thing that might help is support for GFX over RDP, which is in the master 
branch and should be released in the 1.6.0 release, whenever that happens 
(later this year).


  1.
  2.  Is it believed Docker vs native would have any real difference in playing 
and streaming a video from an RDP session?


I doubt this would make a difference.

-Nick

Re: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd

[Sean Hulbert]

Increase your CPUs to 2x6 (12Core) then increase RAM to at least 24G, 
then make sure your networking is at least 1G, this will help some.


I would also use Window 2019 or Ubuntu with xRDP

Hope this helps.


CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication with its contents may contain 
confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the 
use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use 
or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including 
the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended 
recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the 
communication. Content within this email communication is not legally 
binding as a contract and no promises are guaranteed unless in a formal 
contract outside this email communication.


igitur qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum!!!

Epitoma Rei Militaris

On 1/18/2024 11:28 AM, Nick Couchman wrote:
On Thu, Jan 18, 2024 at 2:20 PM Barnhart, Steven 
 wrote:


Hi there,

We have some use cases where (unfortunatelty) users are reviewing
videos from a remote machine and using Guacamole to connect. The
viewing of videos is where the problem lies. A 720p sample video
viewed through Guacamole is very laggy and the audio pops in/out.
It is not reliable. During video playback, all other mouse
movements or commands are delayed on the server as well. I see on
the server side when viewing a video that a guacd process spikes
to 80-100%. We are also using Docker.

 1. I assume Guacamole encodes the rdp and sends it as video in
some way? Is there a way to use hardware accelertation such as
intel vaapi/quicksync for this process and could it maybe help?


Not as video, as images. The Guacamole software/protocol does some 
calculations to try to choose the best image format possible, but 
video/visual data is transferred as images.


I do not know of any hardware acceleration that is currently 
supported. The one thing that might help is support for GFX over RDP, 
which is in the master branch and should be released in the 1.6.0 
release, whenever that happens (later this year).


1.


 2. Is it believed Docker vs native would have any real difference
in playing and streaming a video from an RDP session?


I doubt this would make a difference.

-Nick

Re: Options for hardware acceleration/vaapi for guacd

[Nick Couchman]

On Thu, Jan 18, 2024 at 2:20 PM Barnhart, Steven 
wrote:

> Hi there,
>
>
>
> We have some use cases where (unfortunatelty) users are reviewing videos
> from a remote machine and using Guacamole to connect. The viewing of videos
> is where the problem lies. A 720p sample video viewed through Guacamole is
> very laggy and the audio pops in/out. It is not reliable. During video
> playback, all other mouse movements or commands are delayed on the server
> as well. I see on the server side when viewing a video that a guacd process
> spikes to 80-100%. We are also using Docker.
>
>
>
>1. I assume Guacamole encodes the rdp and sends it as video in some
>way? Is there a way to use hardware accelertation such as intel
>vaapi/quicksync for this process and could it maybe help?
>
>
Not as video, as images. The Guacamole software/protocol does some
calculations to try to choose the best image format possible, but
video/visual data is transferred as images.

I do not know of any hardware acceleration that is currently supported. The
one thing that might help is support for GFX over RDP, which is in the
master branch and should be released in the 1.6.0 release, whenever that
happens (later this year).


>
>1.
>2. Is it believed Docker vs native would have any real difference in
>playing and streaming a video from an RDP session?
>
>
>

I doubt this would make a difference.

-Nick

>