date:20200508


On 08May2020 20:32, Samuel Sieb  wrote:

On 5/8/20 4:32 PM, Cameron Simpson wrote:

On 08May2020 11:15, Robert Moskowitz  wrote:

I added inserting a Date: line and switched to using sed:

local]# cat mycron
#!/bin/sh

currentDate="$(date +'%a %b %d %T %Y')"


You don't need the double quotes. The shell parser recognises the 
assignment statement _before_ breaking things on whitespace.


That's not entirely true.  It will compress whitespace in the output 
if you don't use quotes.

$(date +'%a %b %d %T %Y')
$(date +'%a  %b  %d  %T  %Y')
will end up exactly the same without the double quotes around it.


It is entirely true. The collapsing happens when you _use_ the values:

   # all safe and reliable
   $ a=$( date +'%a %b %d %T %Y')
   $ b=$( date +'%a  %b  %d  %T  Y')
   $ c=$b

   # unquoted use
   $ echo $a
   Sat May 09 14:37:07 2020
   $ echo $b
   Sat May 09 14:37:15 2020
   $ echo $c
   Sat May 09 14:37:15 2020

   # quoted use
   $ echo "$a"
   Sat May 09 14:37:07 2020
   $ echo "$b"
   Sat  May  09  14:37:15  2020
   $ echo "$c"
   Sat  May  09  14:37:15  2020

The variable $b contains the multiple spaces you put in your date 
format. But they only survive is you quote the variable when you use it.


So the assignment statements do not need the quotes because of how the 
parsing is done.


Word separation happens in command _usage_ if you don't quote because 
the shell is in some ways a macro language. But $b contains the multiple 
spaces unharmed, you just have to not use it in a destructive way (== 
unquoted).


Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 
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Re: Need help with a weird kernel update panic.


On 5/8/20 8:59 PM, Sam Varshavchik wrote:
I have used ext4 for /boot for 20+ years on Fedora, and can't say that I 
ever had this happen. And I always reboot after installing updates.


I've never had this happen over all the very many computers I've worked 
with.



Long term the solution is to move boot to a non-journaled fs (ext
without a journal) or after each update umount/mount /boot(before
reboot)..


I would be very much surprised if a regular reboot does not unmount 
/boot, prior to rebooting. I would think that all mounted filesystems 
except / will get explicitly unmounted just before a halt or a reboot.


And / gets remounted read-only, so it's effectively the same.
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Re: Need help with a weird kernel update panic.

2020-05-08 Thread Ed Greshko

On 2020-05-09 11:59, Sam Varshavchik wrote:
> I would be very much surprised if a regular reboot does not unmount /boot, 
> prior to rebooting. I would think that all mounted filesystems except / will 
> get explicitly unmounted just before a halt or a reboot. 

You mean like this output from a reboot after a kernel update yesterday?

May 08 15:55:11 meimei.greshko.com systemd[1]: Unmounting /boot...
May 08 15:55:11 meimei.greshko.com systemd[1]: boot.mount: Succeeded.
May 08 15:55:11 meimei.greshko.com systemd[1]: Unmounted /boot.
May 08 15:55:11 meimei.greshko.com systemd[1]: systemd-reboot.service: 
Succeeded.
May 08 15:55:11 meimei.greshko.com systemd[1]: Finished Reboot.
May 08 15:55:11 meimei.greshko.com audit[1]: SERVICE_START pid=1 uid=0 
auid=4294967295 ses=4294967295 subj=system_u:system_r:init_t:s0 
msg='unit=systemd-reboot comm="systemd" exe="/usr/lib/systemd/systemd" 
hostname=? addr=? terminal=? res=success'
May 08 15:55:11 meimei.greshko.com audit[1]: SERVICE_STOP pid=1 uid=0 
auid=4294967295 ses=4294967295 subj=system_u:system_r:init_t:s0 
msg='unit=systemd-reboot comm="systemd" exe="/usr/lib/systemd/systemd" 
hostname=? addr=? terminal=? res=success'
May 08 15:55:11 meimei.greshko.com systemd[1]: Reached target Reboot.

-- 
The key to getting good answers is to ask good questions.
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Re: Need help with a weird kernel update panic.

2020-05-08 Thread Sam Varshavchik


Roger Heflin writes:


What you are saying does not exactly match what I have previously
seen, but there is a known feature with using a journaling filesystem
(ext4-journal, or xfs) for /boot, if only the journal is updated and
if it is not yet replayed  into the non-journal then grub will not be
able to find the new files/updated files (grub filesystem code is
simple and does not process the journal so if critical updates are
still in the journal then those updates(changed file, new files)
cannot be seen).  To get this one generally has to do the update and
almost immediately reboot (within a few minutes though in some cases,
note syncing the does not replay the journal).


I have used ext4 for /boot for 20+ years on Fedora, and can't say that I  
ever had this happen. And I always reboot after installing updates.



Long term the solution is to move boot to a non-journaled fs (ext
without a journal) or after each update umount/mount /boot(before
reboot)..


I would be very much surprised if a regular reboot does not unmount /boot,  
prior to rebooting. I would think that all mounted filesystems except / will  
get explicitly unmounted just before a halt or a reboot.





pgppXENZav7to.pgp
Description: PGP signature
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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab


On 5/8/20 4:32 PM, Cameron Simpson wrote:

On 08May2020 11:15, Robert Moskowitz  wrote:

I added inserting a Date: line and switched to using sed:

local]# cat mycron
#!/bin/sh

currentDate="$(date +'%a %b %d %T %Y')"


You don't need the double quotes. The shell parser recognises the 
assignment statement _before_ breaking things on whitespace.


That's not entirely true.  It will compress whitespace in the output if 
you don't use quotes.

$(date +'%a %b %d %T %Y')
$(date +'%a  %b  %d  %T  %Y')
will end up exactly the same without the double quotes around it.
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Re: Need help with a weird kernel update panic.

Did you do a lazy unmount?  Any other umount will fail if there are
open files, and lazy does not actually unmount it until whatever has
the files open closes them, which generally means it never gets
unmounted.


On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 5:53 PM John Mellor  wrote:
>
> I like the idea of just removing the journal tag, but I don't think that
> I can modify the /boot filesystem.  Doing a umount works, but tune2fs
> claims that an e2fsck is required.  Running e2fsck says that the
> filesystem is still mounted, even though it is not.  Doing a fuser
> /dev/sda1 shows a large number of /proc/fd entries using it, even though
> it successfully umounted.
>
> So, something is referencing the filesystem in a very bad way, and not
> as a mounted fs.
>
> So, I'm still stuck.  How do you successfully modify /boot to not be
> journalled?
>
>
> On 2020-05-08 3:25 p.m., Roger Heflin wrote:
> > You have to hit the timing right.  ie install the kernel package and
> > as quickly as possible reboot (automated, or very efficient).
> >
> > And if the update is more than just kernel, that may slowdown the
> > process enough that the immediate reboot won't be quick enough.
> >
> > I have seen it 3-5 times and that is over a huge number of machines,
> > in those the machines were booted and failed multiple times before
> > someone livecd booted it ran fsck'ed and/or mounted /boot, and it
> > found the files after that.
> >
> > On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 2:00 PM Mauricio Tavares  wrote:
> >> On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 12:12 PM Roger Heflin  wrote:
> >>> A sync will flush the writes to the journal were the data is safe.  It
> >>> will not force a replay of the journal.
> >>>
> >>> Nothing except removing the journal from the ext4 filesystem will fix it.
> >>>
> >>> This is not a fedora bug, this is a long standing
> >>> kernel/grub/filesystem interaction bug (all who use a journaled
> >>> filesystem have this bug).
> >>>
> >>> See tune2fs and something like -O ^has_journal will turn off the
> >>> journal.  It has to be done unmounted and verify that your fstab entry
> >>> will remounted it.
> >>>
> >>> Check /proc/mounts having data=XXX (probably ordered) says you have a
> >>> journal, after the umount+above tune2fs+remount the data=ordered will
> >>> be gone.
> >>>
> >>Interesting. I have a box which have been running for years with
> >>
> >> /dev/sdb1 /boot ext4
> >> rw,seclabel,noatime,barrier=1,stripe=32,data=ordered,discard 0 0
> >>
> >> and so far never borked on me.
> >>
> >>> On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 10:53 AM John Mellor  wrote:
>  Interesting!  This machine does reboot in about 5secs and the other
>  machines take longer, so it makes sense.  My /boot is mounted just like
>  /home and / as follows:
> 
>   /dev/sda1 on /boot type ext4 (rw,relatime,seclabel)
> 
>  I assume that a symple sync would flush the journal.  Its pretty easy to
>  do a sync;sync if updating using the CLI, but not possible when using
>  the GUI.  Is this a Fedora bug where the journal is not correctly
>  flushed on the reboot?  Should I modify that mount entry or do achattr
>  change to workaround the bug?
> 
> 
>  On 2020-05-08 11:11 a.m., Roger Heflin wrote:
> > What you are saying does not exactly match what I have previously
> > seen, but there is a known feature with using a journaling filesystem
> > (ext4-journal, or xfs) for /boot, if only the journal is updated and
> > if it is not yet replayed  into the non-journal then grub will not be
> > able to find the new files/updated files (grub filesystem code is
> > simple and does not process the journal so if critical updates are
> > still in the journal then those updates(changed file, new files)
> > cannot be seen).  To get this one generally has to do the update and
> > almost immediately reboot (within a few minutes though in some cases,
> > note syncing the does not replay the journal).   The fix is to boot up
> > with a kernel that it can still find and/or livecd and mount /boot so
> > that the journal gets replayed, or fsck boot so that the journal gets
> > replayed.
> >
> > Long term the solution is to move boot to a non-journaled fs (ext
> > without a journal) or after each update umount/mount /boot(before
> > reboot)..  If /boot is not separated then you cannot umount/mount it
> > to get the journal to replay.  There is a second method to force a
> > journal replay, but reports say that one often "hangs" when /boot is
> > not separate so is not a reliable solution.There were some
> > detailed posts on this several years ago with reliable commenters
> > confirming the behavior.  I have also personally seen the issue a
> > number of times and mount /boot and/or fscking corrects it (replays
> > journal).
> >
> > On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 8:52 AM John Mellor  
> > wrote:
> >> I have one completely stock workstation F32 machine

Re: Working! - Re: user crontab


On 08May2020 11:15, Robert Moskowitz  wrote:

I added inserting a Date: line and switched to using sed:

local]# cat mycron
#!/bin/sh

currentDate="$(date +'%a %b %d %T %Y')"


You don't need the double quotes. The shell parser recognises the 
assignment statement _before_ breaking things on whitespace.



echo "From cron@localhost  $currentDate" >> /var/spool/mail/$USER
currentDate="$(date +'%a,%e %b %Y %T %z (%Z)')"


Again, double quotes not needed.


sed "/^Status:/a Date: $currentDate" >> /var/spool/mail/$USER


You can just use echo; the Date: header does not need to be in a 
specific position.



echo "" >> /var/spool/mail/$USER


You do a lot of explicit >>mailfile. Try this:

   exec 3>>"/var/spool/mail/$USER"
   ... script ...

and just put ">&3" instead of ">>/var/spool/mail/$USER".

More readable, avoids typos, avoids gratiuitous extra opening of the 
mail file per command.


Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 
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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab


On 08May2020 06:59, Robert Moskowitz  wrote:



On 5/8/20 2:24 AM, Gordon Messmer wrote:

On 5/7/20 10:44 PM, Jon LaBadie wrote:

In my mail files each message is followed by a blank line
before the next "From_" line.  Is that a requirement of
mbox format?  If so, it may be necessary to add it to
the crontab output.



Yes, it's a requirement of the format.  That's why there's an "echo" 
after "cat".  :)


Oops.  That is right.  And I need to change this to do a sed to insert 
a Date: line in the right place...


"The right place"? You can do it with echo, just make it the first 
header.


Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 
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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab


On 08May2020 06:56, Robert Moskowitz  wrote:

On 5/8/20 2:08 AM, Cameron Simpson wrote:
You _do_ need to ensure the message at least ends with a newline, of 
the From_ won't be at the start of a line. So the previously posted 
script ensures that with the "echo" in "( cat; echo )". If you want to 
ensure a blank line you also need an additional "echo".


Working on it.  Plus I have to sed in a Date: line.


Note that the From_ line uses a UNIX ctime format date, while all the 
dates in the message headers use the RFC5322 date format, described 
here:


   https://tools.ietf.org/rfcmarkup/5322#page-14


Or Robert could install an MDA and make it the MDA's problem :-)


What fun would that be?

Plus I have always thought of this as a deficiency in cron on a 
workstation.  Cron should work (report in this case) properly without 
needing something else (MTA) installed.  Maybe the developers will pick 
this up and do it right...


Except that sending an email to the user is close to an _ideal_ way to 
send a chunk of output from an unattended task. A proper UNIX system has 
an email system supplied IMO. Why not use it?


By what mechanism would you prefer it report? syslog (gah!)?

Writing to a log file is easily done just by prefixing the shell line 
with a redirection to a file, eg change:


   * * * * * shell command ...

to:

   * * * * * exec >>$HOME/var/log/cron/"`date`.log" 2>&1; shell command ...

What other sophistication do you seek?

Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 
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Re: Need help with a weird kernel update panic.

2020-05-08 Thread John Mellor

I like the idea of just removing the journal tag, but I don't think that 
I can modify the /boot filesystem.  Doing a umount works, but tune2fs 
claims that an e2fsck is required.  Running e2fsck says that the 
filesystem is still mounted, even though it is not.  Doing a fuser 
/dev/sda1 shows a large number of /proc/fd entries using it, even though 
it successfully umounted.


So, something is referencing the filesystem in a very bad way, and not 
as a mounted fs.


So, I'm still stuck.  How do you successfully modify /boot to not be 
journalled?



On 2020-05-08 3:25 p.m., Roger Heflin wrote:

You have to hit the timing right.  ie install the kernel package and
as quickly as possible reboot (automated, or very efficient).

And if the update is more than just kernel, that may slowdown the
process enough that the immediate reboot won't be quick enough.

I have seen it 3-5 times and that is over a huge number of machines,
in those the machines were booted and failed multiple times before
someone livecd booted it ran fsck'ed and/or mounted /boot, and it
found the files after that.

On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 2:00 PM Mauricio Tavares  wrote:

On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 12:12 PM Roger Heflin  wrote:

A sync will flush the writes to the journal were the data is safe.  It
will not force a replay of the journal.

Nothing except removing the journal from the ext4 filesystem will fix it.

This is not a fedora bug, this is a long standing
kernel/grub/filesystem interaction bug (all who use a journaled
filesystem have this bug).

See tune2fs and something like -O ^has_journal will turn off the
journal.  It has to be done unmounted and verify that your fstab entry
will remounted it.

Check /proc/mounts having data=XXX (probably ordered) says you have a
journal, after the umount+above tune2fs+remount the data=ordered will
be gone.


   Interesting. I have a box which have been running for years with

/dev/sdb1 /boot ext4
rw,seclabel,noatime,barrier=1,stripe=32,data=ordered,discard 0 0

and so far never borked on me.


On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 10:53 AM John Mellor  wrote:

Interesting!  This machine does reboot in about 5secs and the other
machines take longer, so it makes sense.  My /boot is mounted just like
/home and / as follows:

 /dev/sda1 on /boot type ext4 (rw,relatime,seclabel)

I assume that a symple sync would flush the journal.  Its pretty easy to
do a sync;sync if updating using the CLI, but not possible when using
the GUI.  Is this a Fedora bug where the journal is not correctly
flushed on the reboot?  Should I modify that mount entry or do achattr
change to workaround the bug?


On 2020-05-08 11:11 a.m., Roger Heflin wrote:

What you are saying does not exactly match what I have previously
seen, but there is a known feature with using a journaling filesystem
(ext4-journal, or xfs) for /boot, if only the journal is updated and
if it is not yet replayed  into the non-journal then grub will not be
able to find the new files/updated files (grub filesystem code is
simple and does not process the journal so if critical updates are
still in the journal then those updates(changed file, new files)
cannot be seen).  To get this one generally has to do the update and
almost immediately reboot (within a few minutes though in some cases,
note syncing the does not replay the journal).   The fix is to boot up
with a kernel that it can still find and/or livecd and mount /boot so
that the journal gets replayed, or fsck boot so that the journal gets
replayed.

Long term the solution is to move boot to a non-journaled fs (ext
without a journal) or after each update umount/mount /boot(before
reboot)..  If /boot is not separated then you cannot umount/mount it
to get the journal to replay.  There is a second method to force a
journal replay, but reports say that one often "hangs" when /boot is
not separate so is not a reliable solution.There were some
detailed posts on this several years ago with reliable commenters
confirming the behavior.  I have also personally seen the issue a
number of times and mount /boot and/or fscking corrects it (replays
journal).

On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 8:52 AM John Mellor  wrote:

I have one completely stock workstation F32 machine where kernel updates
almost always cause a multiple-reboot panic problem.  This problem also
occurred on F31, but not on releases before that. I'm stumped and need
some help in figuring it out.

The symptoms vary in the number of reboots and the type of tertiary
error, but are otherwise pretty similar.  It does not matter whether I
use the Gnome update app or the CLI dnf method. After a number of
reboots, the upgrade succeeds and Fedora behaves nortmally again.  I
think that this only happens whenever the kernel is upgraded.

What I observe is that the machine is rebooted and on reboot, grub (I
think) gets a halt for a 32-bit relocation error.  This sequence may
happen twice.  Its an i7 with plenty of memory and an SSD boot disk, so
the 32-bit thing is confusing.  To

Power Mgmt problem

2020-05-08 Thread Christopher Marlow

I am having a problem with Fedora 32.. When my screen blanks off.
When I come back to the computer the screen will flash on for a sec and
then go black again. But the power light is still green...

And the only way I can get a picture back is to turn the monitor off
and hold a key down on the keyboard and turn the monitor back on at the
same time

its getting worse and worse


I had the same problem in 31 right there at the end
 right before I upgraded to 32) -- 



Thanks,
Chris
ch...@cwm030.com

Fedora 32 Workstation
With XFCE as my preferred desktop ( installed on top of gnome 3) 
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Re: How do you Dual boot with Intel RST - Optane ?

2020-05-08 Thread Gordon Messmer


On 5/7/20 7:49 AM, sean darcy wrote:

1. Is there a way to get the FC31 drive to boot with RST ?



No.  RST is unsafe by design, and the kernel developers won't support it.

 * No NVMe device power management
 * No NVMe reset support
 * No NVMe quirks based on PCI ID
 * No SR-IOV VFs
 * Reduced performance through a shared, legacy interrupt

https://lore.kernel.org/linux-pci/20190620061038.ga20...@lst.de/T/


2. Any way to have the Windows drive boot with AHCI ? 



https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=boot+windows+raid+ahci+mode

First result is:

https://support.thinkcritical.com/kb/articles/switch-windows-10-from-raid-ide-to-ahci

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Re: How do you Dual boot with Intel RST - Optane ?


On 5/7/20 7:49 AM, sean darcy wrote:

My new laptop has Windows 10 installed with the Intel
rapid Storage Technology  (optane) system chip. Windows is on an nvme 
drive.


FC31 is on a SATA ssd.


I thought RST was where it used a small SSD as caching for a regular 
spinning hard drive.  The few times I've had to deal with that, I just 
broke the RAID and let Windows use the hard drive directly.


BIOS allows me to choose AHCI or RST. I must use AHCI to boot the FC31 
drive, and RST to boot the Windows drive. Neither will boot with the 
other.  Sigh.


1. Is there a way to get the FC31 drive to boot with RST ?


I thought there was some sort of support for that, but it's hard to find.


2.  Any way to have the Windows drive boot with AHCI ?


Check if there's an option in the BIOS to disable the RAID.
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Re: VDQ Thumb drive software

On 5/8/20 6:45 AM, Beartooth wrote:

On Thu, 07 May 2020 13:44:11 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

On 5/7/20 1:41 PM, Beartooth wrote:

I'm pretty sure the Fedora machine I want to use to put something
onto a thumb drive doesn't have the thumb drive software installed to
do so. But I've searched dnfdragora up one side and down the other
without finding it. What is it called? Pretty please?

We'll need more info than that. What do you want to put on the drive?
I assume it's not the file manager that you're looking for. :-)

Two things, either of which can go onto an optical medium or a
second thumb drive instead.

If I can find them, I'd like to save my tweaks: size and
positions of panels, choice and positions of launchers, tabs of the
terminal with their fonts and color schemes, tabs & bookmarks of all the
browsers (all the ones in the regular repos, plus Opera and Vivaldi), the
biggest mouse cursor there is, all that kind of stuff. (I always display
'hidden' files, but there's some of that I never have found, running
Fedora since its creation.)

I'm not clearly understanding this. You might want to start again with
more details on what exactly you are trying to find. This last
paragraph sounds like you just need to copy the files from your hard
drive to the usb stick which would only involve the file manager.

And a netinstall .iso with Mate, for one more try at a re-
install. :-}

The recommended method is installing the "mediawriter" package and using
that:

https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/fedora/f32/install-guide/install/Preparing_for_Installation/#sect-preparing-boot-media
For other methods:
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/quick-docs/creating-and-using-a-live-installation-image/index.html#proc_creating-and-using-live-usb
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Re: More 686 woe


On 5/8/20 1:43 PM, Beartooth wrote:


I've just tried to upgrade another (and much more important)
machine -- and hit the mate-panel 686 snag again:

Error: Transaction test error:
   file /usr/share/mate-panel/applets/org.mate.panel.ClockApplet.mate-
panel-applet conflicts between attempted installs of mate-
panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.i686 and mate-panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.x86_64
   file /usr/share/mate-panel/applets/org.mate.panel.FishApplet.mate-panel-
applet conflicts between attempted installs of mate-
panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.i686 and mate-panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.x86_64
   file /usr/share/mate-panel/applets/
org.mate.panel.NotificationAreaApplet.mate-panel-applet conflicts between
attempted installs of mate-panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.i686 and mate-
panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.x86_64
   file /usr/share/mate-panel/applets/org.mate.panel.Wncklet.mate-panel-
applet conflicts between attempted installs of mate-
panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.i686 and mate-panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.x86_64

This is AFTER running with ' --skip-broken --allowerasing'


You will need to remove the .i686 one.  I don't understand how you would 
have them both installed at the same time in the first place.

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Re: Browser list?

2020-05-08 Thread Patrick O'Callaghan

On Fri, 2020-05-08 at 18:41 +, Beartooth wrote:
>   I like trying out browsers, but I remember dependency hell too 
> strongly to risk it again. 
> 
>   I have installed Opera (which I've run and liked since before 
> Fedora) and Vivaldi which I liked the sound of; and both of them (once 
> you find the rpm versions) have repos that Fedora/dnf can use. 
> 
>   I also thought, only just now, to try searching 'browser' in 
> dnfdragora, and did find a couple, which I installed and will play with. 
> 
>   Anybody know any others? 

Brave (https://brave.com/). They have a Fedora RPM repo.

poc
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More 686 woe


I've just tried to upgrade another (and much more important) 
machine -- and hit the mate-panel 686 snag again:

Error: Transaction test error:
  file /usr/share/mate-panel/applets/org.mate.panel.ClockApplet.mate-
panel-applet conflicts between attempted installs of mate-
panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.i686 and mate-panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.x86_64
  file /usr/share/mate-panel/applets/org.mate.panel.FishApplet.mate-panel-
applet conflicts between attempted installs of mate-
panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.i686 and mate-panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.x86_64
  file /usr/share/mate-panel/applets/
org.mate.panel.NotificationAreaApplet.mate-panel-applet conflicts between 
attempted installs of mate-panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.i686 and mate-
panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.x86_64
  file /usr/share/mate-panel/applets/org.mate.panel.Wncklet.mate-panel-
applet conflicts between attempted installs of mate-
panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.i686 and mate-panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.x86_64

This is AFTER running with ' --skip-broken --allowerasing'
-- 
Beartooth Staffwright, Not Quite Clueless Power User
Remember I know little (precious little!) of where up is.
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Re: LibreOffice print dialog too tall for my screen




On 5/8/20 4:26 PM, Samuel Sieb wrote:

On 5/8/20 12:05 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:

On 05/08/2020 12:05 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:


I learned to call that the system key.  But ok.  And by itself in 
Xfce, it does not enable dragging of a dialog box.


You might need to check the Xfce forum at 
http://forum.xfce.org/index.php for help.


That wasn't a problem.  I mentioned that the LOGO key works in Gnome 
and possibly some other desktops and he said that it doesn't work in 
xfce because that still uses the older method of using ALT.


Xfce has Windows Manager -> Keyboard that I have used to add things.  It 
calls the LOGO key the Super key.


For example I have mapped Super+l (lower case L) to screen lock. But I 
don't know how to add operations that are not in there (like 
Alt+LeftButton).


Well I did finish revising one IETF draft this week and another one 
almost done for submission, so despite all this fun I am having with 
Fedora 32, I am getting some paid work done!


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Re: VDQ Thumb drive software

2020-05-08 Thread Fred Smith

On Fri, May 08, 2020 at 04:23:43PM -0400, Jonathan Billings wrote:
> On Fri, May 08, 2020 at 08:16:48PM -, Beartooth wrote:
> > On Thu, 07 May 2020 16:46:49 -0400, Jonathan Billings wrote:
> > 
> > > On May 7, 2020, at 16:42, Beartooth  wrote:
> > >>I'm pretty sure the Fedora machine I want to use to put something
> > >> onto a thumb drive doesn't have the thumb drive software installed to
> > >> do so. But I've searched dnfdragora up one side and down the other
> > >> without finding it. What is it called? Pretty please?
> > > 
> > > It’d be part of the kernel if it’s a USB Mass Storage device. You
> > > shouldn’t need to install anything.
> > > 
> > > Does `gnome-disks` see the device?
> > 
> > I keep forgetting to mention that I run Mate. I get 
> > 
> > $ rpm -q gnome-disks
> > package gnome-disks is not installed
> 
> Then 'dnf install gnome-disk-utility' to get it installed.
> 

Mate also has a disks utility, named--odly enugh--"disks"

On Ubuntu it is under the Control Center, possibly the same on Fedora

-- 
 Fred Smith -- fre...@fcshome.stoneham.ma.us -
The Lord is like a strong tower. 
 Those who do what is right can run to him for safety.
--- Proverbs 18:10 (niv) -
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Re: LibreOffice print dialog too tall for my screen


On 5/8/20 12:05 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:

On 05/08/2020 12:05 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:


I learned to call that the system key.  But ok.  And by itself in 
Xfce, it does not enable dragging of a dialog box.


You might need to check the Xfce forum at 
http://forum.xfce.org/index.php for help.


That wasn't a problem.  I mentioned that the LOGO key works in Gnome and 
possibly some other desktops and he said that it doesn't work in xfce 
because that still uses the older method of using ALT.

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Re: VDQ Thumb drive software

2020-05-08 Thread Jonathan Billings

On Fri, May 08, 2020 at 08:16:48PM -, Beartooth wrote:
> On Thu, 07 May 2020 16:46:49 -0400, Jonathan Billings wrote:
> 
> > On May 7, 2020, at 16:42, Beartooth  wrote:
> >>I'm pretty sure the Fedora machine I want to use to put something
> >> onto a thumb drive doesn't have the thumb drive software installed to
> >> do so. But I've searched dnfdragora up one side and down the other
> >> without finding it. What is it called? Pretty please?
> > 
> > It’d be part of the kernel if it’s a USB Mass Storage device. You
> > shouldn’t need to install anything.
> > 
> > Does `gnome-disks` see the device?
> 
>   I keep forgetting to mention that I run Mate. I get 
> 
>   $ rpm -q gnome-disks
>   package gnome-disks is not installed

Then 'dnf install gnome-disk-utility' to get it installed.

-- 
Jonathan Billings 
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Re: VDQ Thumb drive software

On Thu, 07 May 2020 16:46:49 -0400, Jonathan Billings wrote:

> On May 7, 2020, at 16:42, Beartooth  wrote:
>>I'm pretty sure the Fedora machine I want to use to put something
>> onto a thumb drive doesn't have the thumb drive software installed to
>> do so. But I've searched dnfdragora up one side and down the other
>> without finding it. What is it called? Pretty please?
> 
> It’d be part of the kernel if it’s a USB Mass Storage device. You
> shouldn’t need to install anything.
> 
> Does `gnome-disks` see the device?

I keep forgetting to mention that I run Mate. I get 

$ rpm -q gnome-disks
package gnome-disks is not installed
-- 
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Remember I know little (precious little!) of where up is.
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Re: Need help with a weird kernel update panic.

You have to hit the timing right.  ie install the kernel package and
as quickly as possible reboot (automated, or very efficient).

And if the update is more than just kernel, that may slowdown the
process enough that the immediate reboot won't be quick enough.

I have seen it 3-5 times and that is over a huge number of machines,
in those the machines were booted and failed multiple times before
someone livecd booted it ran fsck'ed and/or mounted /boot, and it
found the files after that.

On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 2:00 PM Mauricio Tavares  wrote:
>
> On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 12:12 PM Roger Heflin  wrote:
> >
> > A sync will flush the writes to the journal were the data is safe.  It
> > will not force a replay of the journal.
> >
> > Nothing except removing the journal from the ext4 filesystem will fix it.
> >
> > This is not a fedora bug, this is a long standing
> > kernel/grub/filesystem interaction bug (all who use a journaled
> > filesystem have this bug).
> >
> > See tune2fs and something like -O ^has_journal will turn off the
> > journal.  It has to be done unmounted and verify that your fstab entry
> > will remounted it.
> >
> > Check /proc/mounts having data=XXX (probably ordered) says you have a
> > journal, after the umount+above tune2fs+remount the data=ordered will
> > be gone.
> >
>   Interesting. I have a box which have been running for years with
>
> /dev/sdb1 /boot ext4
> rw,seclabel,noatime,barrier=1,stripe=32,data=ordered,discard 0 0
>
> and so far never borked on me.
>
> > On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 10:53 AM John Mellor  wrote:
> > >
> > > Interesting!  This machine does reboot in about 5secs and the other
> > > machines take longer, so it makes sense.  My /boot is mounted just like
> > > /home and / as follows:
> > >
> > > /dev/sda1 on /boot type ext4 (rw,relatime,seclabel)
> > >
> > > I assume that a symple sync would flush the journal.  Its pretty easy to
> > > do a sync;sync if updating using the CLI, but not possible when using
> > > the GUI.  Is this a Fedora bug where the journal is not correctly
> > > flushed on the reboot?  Should I modify that mount entry or do achattr
> > > change to workaround the bug?
> > >
> > >
> > > On 2020-05-08 11:11 a.m., Roger Heflin wrote:
> > > > What you are saying does not exactly match what I have previously
> > > > seen, but there is a known feature with using a journaling filesystem
> > > > (ext4-journal, or xfs) for /boot, if only the journal is updated and
> > > > if it is not yet replayed  into the non-journal then grub will not be
> > > > able to find the new files/updated files (grub filesystem code is
> > > > simple and does not process the journal so if critical updates are
> > > > still in the journal then those updates(changed file, new files)
> > > > cannot be seen).  To get this one generally has to do the update and
> > > > almost immediately reboot (within a few minutes though in some cases,
> > > > note syncing the does not replay the journal).   The fix is to boot up
> > > > with a kernel that it can still find and/or livecd and mount /boot so
> > > > that the journal gets replayed, or fsck boot so that the journal gets
> > > > replayed.
> > > >
> > > > Long term the solution is to move boot to a non-journaled fs (ext
> > > > without a journal) or after each update umount/mount /boot(before
> > > > reboot)..  If /boot is not separated then you cannot umount/mount it
> > > > to get the journal to replay.  There is a second method to force a
> > > > journal replay, but reports say that one often "hangs" when /boot is
> > > > not separate so is not a reliable solution.There were some
> > > > detailed posts on this several years ago with reliable commenters
> > > > confirming the behavior.  I have also personally seen the issue a
> > > > number of times and mount /boot and/or fscking corrects it (replays
> > > > journal).
> > > >
> > > > On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 8:52 AM John Mellor  
> > > > wrote:
> > > >> I have one completely stock workstation F32 machine where kernel 
> > > >> updates
> > > >> almost always cause a multiple-reboot panic problem.  This problem also
> > > >> occurred on F31, but not on releases before that. I'm stumped and need
> > > >> some help in figuring it out.
> > > >>
> > > >> The symptoms vary in the number of reboots and the type of tertiary
> > > >> error, but are otherwise pretty similar.  It does not matter whether I
> > > >> use the Gnome update app or the CLI dnf method. After a number of
> > > >> reboots, the upgrade succeeds and Fedora behaves nortmally again.  I
> > > >> think that this only happens whenever the kernel is upgraded.
> > > >>
> > > >> What I observe is that the machine is rebooted and on reboot, grub (I
> > > >> think) gets a halt for a 32-bit relocation error.  This sequence may
> > > >> happen twice.  Its an i7 with plenty of memory and an SSD boot disk, so
> > > >> the 32-bit thing is confusing.  To get around this error, I powercycle
> > > >> the box and get into the next stage o

Re: How do you Dual boot with Intel RST - Optane ?

2020-05-08 Thread sean darcy


On 5/7/20 10:49 AM, sean darcy wrote:

My new laptop has Windows 10 installed with the Intel
rapid Storage Technology  (optane) system chip. Windows is on an nvme 
drive.


FC31 is on a SATA ssd.

BIOS allows me to choose AHCI or RST. I must use AHCI to boot the FC31 
drive, and RST to boot the Windows drive. Neither will boot with the 
other.  Sigh.


1. Is there a way to get the FC31 drive to boot with RST ?

2.  Any way to have the Windows drive boot with AHCI ?

sean


Ping
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Re: LibreOffice print dialog too tall for my screen

2020-05-08 Thread Joe Zeff


On 05/08/2020 01:11 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:


I am on the Xfce mailing list...

In fact it was going back to my history there that I found how I did 
this LAST time I had a too tall dialog box.


OK.  I've found over the past few years that most people asking for help 
with Xfce don't know about the forum, and it's a good place to get help.

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Re: LibreOffice print dialog too tall for my screen




On 5/8/20 3:05 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:

On 05/08/2020 12:05 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:


I learned to call that the system key.  But ok.  And by itself in 
Xfce, it does not enable dragging of a dialog box.


You might need to check the Xfce forum at 
http://forum.xfce.org/index.php for help.


I am on the Xfce mailing list...

In fact it was going back to my history there that I found how I did 
this LAST time I had a too tall dialog box.


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Re: LibreOffice print dialog too tall for my screen

2020-05-08 Thread Joe Zeff


On 05/08/2020 12:05 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:


I learned to call that the system key.  But ok.  And by itself in Xfce, 
it does not enable dragging of a dialog box.


You might need to check the Xfce forum at 
http://forum.xfce.org/index.php for help.

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Re: Need help with a weird kernel update panic.

2020-05-08 Thread Mauricio Tavares

On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 12:12 PM Roger Heflin  wrote:
>
> A sync will flush the writes to the journal were the data is safe.  It
> will not force a replay of the journal.
>
> Nothing except removing the journal from the ext4 filesystem will fix it.
>
> This is not a fedora bug, this is a long standing
> kernel/grub/filesystem interaction bug (all who use a journaled
> filesystem have this bug).
>
> See tune2fs and something like -O ^has_journal will turn off the
> journal.  It has to be done unmounted and verify that your fstab entry
> will remounted it.
>
> Check /proc/mounts having data=XXX (probably ordered) says you have a
> journal, after the umount+above tune2fs+remount the data=ordered will
> be gone.
>
  Interesting. I have a box which have been running for years with

/dev/sdb1 /boot ext4
rw,seclabel,noatime,barrier=1,stripe=32,data=ordered,discard 0 0

and so far never borked on me.

> On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 10:53 AM John Mellor  wrote:
> >
> > Interesting!  This machine does reboot in about 5secs and the other
> > machines take longer, so it makes sense.  My /boot is mounted just like
> > /home and / as follows:
> >
> > /dev/sda1 on /boot type ext4 (rw,relatime,seclabel)
> >
> > I assume that a symple sync would flush the journal.  Its pretty easy to
> > do a sync;sync if updating using the CLI, but not possible when using
> > the GUI.  Is this a Fedora bug where the journal is not correctly
> > flushed on the reboot?  Should I modify that mount entry or do achattr
> > change to workaround the bug?
> >
> >
> > On 2020-05-08 11:11 a.m., Roger Heflin wrote:
> > > What you are saying does not exactly match what I have previously
> > > seen, but there is a known feature with using a journaling filesystem
> > > (ext4-journal, or xfs) for /boot, if only the journal is updated and
> > > if it is not yet replayed  into the non-journal then grub will not be
> > > able to find the new files/updated files (grub filesystem code is
> > > simple and does not process the journal so if critical updates are
> > > still in the journal then those updates(changed file, new files)
> > > cannot be seen).  To get this one generally has to do the update and
> > > almost immediately reboot (within a few minutes though in some cases,
> > > note syncing the does not replay the journal).   The fix is to boot up
> > > with a kernel that it can still find and/or livecd and mount /boot so
> > > that the journal gets replayed, or fsck boot so that the journal gets
> > > replayed.
> > >
> > > Long term the solution is to move boot to a non-journaled fs (ext
> > > without a journal) or after each update umount/mount /boot(before
> > > reboot)..  If /boot is not separated then you cannot umount/mount it
> > > to get the journal to replay.  There is a second method to force a
> > > journal replay, but reports say that one often "hangs" when /boot is
> > > not separate so is not a reliable solution.There were some
> > > detailed posts on this several years ago with reliable commenters
> > > confirming the behavior.  I have also personally seen the issue a
> > > number of times and mount /boot and/or fscking corrects it (replays
> > > journal).
> > >
> > > On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 8:52 AM John Mellor  wrote:
> > >> I have one completely stock workstation F32 machine where kernel updates
> > >> almost always cause a multiple-reboot panic problem.  This problem also
> > >> occurred on F31, but not on releases before that. I'm stumped and need
> > >> some help in figuring it out.
> > >>
> > >> The symptoms vary in the number of reboots and the type of tertiary
> > >> error, but are otherwise pretty similar.  It does not matter whether I
> > >> use the Gnome update app or the CLI dnf method. After a number of
> > >> reboots, the upgrade succeeds and Fedora behaves nortmally again.  I
> > >> think that this only happens whenever the kernel is upgraded.
> > >>
> > >> What I observe is that the machine is rebooted and on reboot, grub (I
> > >> think) gets a halt for a 32-bit relocation error.  This sequence may
> > >> happen twice.  Its an i7 with plenty of memory and an SSD boot disk, so
> > >> the 32-bit thing is confusing.  To get around this error, I powercycle
> > >> the box and get into the next stage of the problem.  One the 2nd or 3rd
> > >> reboot, I usually see a halt with an access outside of the kernel space,
> > >> although with the update this morning, I had a kernel panic instead.
> > >> Cold-booting again, and the update is installed, and the last reboot and
> > >> I'm up on the new updates.
> > >>
> > >> After that, the machine behaves normally until the next kernel updates.
> > >> I assume that there is some incorrectly-asynchronous operation in grub
> > >> related to the update entry, but I can find no grub logs to dig into
> > >> this problem.  I have several other machines that do not see this
> > >> problem.  I dug around in the fedora bugs, but not knowing what to look
> > >> for, I'm basically blind.  Its a

Browser list?


I like trying out browsers, but I remember dependency hell too 
strongly to risk it again. 

I have installed Opera (which I've run and liked since before 
Fedora) and Vivaldi which I liked the sound of; and both of them (once 
you find the rpm versions) have repos that Fedora/dnf can use. 

I also thought, only just now, to try searching 'browser' in 
dnfdragora, and did find a couple, which I installed and will play with. 

Anybody know any others? 
-- 
Beartooth Staffwright, Not Quite Clueless Power User
Remember I know little (precious little!) of where up is.
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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab


On 5/8/20 11:08 AM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:

On 5/8/20 1:58 PM, Mike Wright wrote:

There's a tiny MDA called femtomail that delivers into a Maildir.


Well first I need mbox, not maildir format.


mutt can read Maildir as well.  Maildir is a much better mail storage 
method than mbox.


Provide it a USERNAME and MAILBOX_PATH and do a make and it will 
produce a binary (back in 2016 it was 38724 bytes) usable for the 
specified user.


It does not seem to be in the F32 repos, so I would have to make it.


It's only a couple of files, trivial to build.
It's not something that could be packaged because you have to adjust a 
couple of settings like the username before compiling.


And yes, I understand that learning to make your own simple MDA can be 
fun as well.

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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab




On 5/8/20 2:01 PM, Samuel Sieb wrote:

On 5/8/20 10:58 AM, Mike Wright wrote:

On 5/8/20 9:55 AM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:



On 5/8/20 12:39 PM, Tim via users wrote:

On Fri, 2020-05-08 at 06:56 -0400, Robert Moskowitz wrote:

Plus I have always thought of this as a deficiency in cron on a
workstation.  Cron should work (report in this case) properly
without needing something else (MTA) installed.

Does it though?  There's always /var/log/cron.  Or that other journal
log thing that is too convoluted for me to want to use.
It depends on what you are doing in your cron scripts.  It can be 
argued that mine really don't need to go to emails, but I decided to 
do it...


There's a tiny MDA called femtomail that delivers into a Maildir.


I linked to that project much earlier in this thread.


Yes, and I do remember that...

but I would have to get the source and the rest of that.  What I am 
doing is more interesting; for now.


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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab




On 5/8/20 1:58 PM, Mike Wright wrote:

On 5/8/20 9:55 AM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:



On 5/8/20 12:39 PM, Tim via users wrote:

On Fri, 2020-05-08 at 06:56 -0400, Robert Moskowitz wrote:

Plus I have always thought of this as a deficiency in cron on a
workstation.  Cron should work (report in this case) properly
without needing something else (MTA) installed.

Does it though?  There's always /var/log/cron.  Or that other journal
log thing that is too convoluted for me to want to use.
It depends on what you are doing in your cron scripts.  It can be 
argued that mine really don't need to go to emails, but I decided to 
do it...


There's a tiny MDA called femtomail that delivers into a Maildir.


Well first I need mbox, not maildir format.



Provide it a USERNAME and MAILBOX_PATH and do a make and it will 
produce a binary (back in 2016 it was 38724 bytes) usable for the 
specified user.


It does not seem to be in the F32 repos, so I would have to make it.

sendmail is 4.5M, dovecot is almost 10M, postfix is almost 5M. 
Comparatively femtomail is miniscule.  Now I realize that comparing 
femtomail to those is like comparing a checker player to a chess 
master but it does look like it might fit the bill.


Something to think about.

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Re: LibreOffice print dialog too tall for my screen




On 5/8/20 1:57 PM, Samuel Sieb wrote:

On 5/8/20 10:38 AM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:



On 5/8/20 1:33 PM, Samuel Sieb wrote:

On 5/8/20 6:32 AM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
The workaround for me is the  and then move the 
dialog with the mouse.


For Gnome and possibly other desktops, it's the LOGO key and drag.


What is the LOGO key?


The one on the left between the CTRL and ALT that usually has a 
Windows logo on it.  It's the modifier key that Gnome uses for most of 
its shortcuts.


I learned to call that the system key.  But ok.  And by itself in Xfce, 
it does not enable dragging of a dialog box.

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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab


On 5/8/20 10:58 AM, Mike Wright wrote:

On 5/8/20 9:55 AM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:



On 5/8/20 12:39 PM, Tim via users wrote:

On Fri, 2020-05-08 at 06:56 -0400, Robert Moskowitz wrote:

Plus I have always thought of this as a deficiency in cron on a
workstation.  Cron should work (report in this case) properly
without needing something else (MTA) installed.

Does it though?  There's always /var/log/cron.  Or that other journal
log thing that is too convoluted for me to want to use.
It depends on what you are doing in your cron scripts.  It can be 
argued that mine really don't need to go to emails, but I decided to 
do it...


There's a tiny MDA called femtomail that delivers into a Maildir.


I linked to that project much earlier in this thread.
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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab

2020-05-08 Thread Mike Wright


On 5/8/20 9:55 AM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:



On 5/8/20 12:39 PM, Tim via users wrote:

On Fri, 2020-05-08 at 06:56 -0400, Robert Moskowitz wrote:

Plus I have always thought of this as a deficiency in cron on a
workstation.  Cron should work (report in this case) properly
without needing something else (MTA) installed.

Does it though?  There's always /var/log/cron.  Or that other journal
log thing that is too convoluted for me to want to use.
It depends on what you are doing in your cron scripts.  It can be argued 
that mine really don't need to go to emails, but I decided to do it...


There's a tiny MDA called femtomail that delivers into a Maildir.

Provide it a USERNAME and MAILBOX_PATH and do a make and it will produce 
a binary (back in 2016 it was 38724 bytes) usable for the specified user.


sendmail is 4.5M, dovecot is almost 10M, postfix is almost 5M. 
Comparatively femtomail is miniscule.  Now I realize that comparing 
femtomail to those is like comparing a checker player to a chess master 
but it does look like it might fit the bill.

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Re: LibreOffice print dialog too tall for my screen


On 5/8/20 10:38 AM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:



On 5/8/20 1:33 PM, Samuel Sieb wrote:

On 5/8/20 6:32 AM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
The workaround for me is the  and then move the 
dialog with the mouse.


For Gnome and possibly other desktops, it's the LOGO key and drag.


What is the LOGO key?


The one on the left between the CTRL and ALT that usually has a Windows 
logo on it.  It's the modifier key that Gnome uses for most of its 
shortcuts.

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Re: LibreOffice print dialog too tall for my screen




On 5/8/20 1:33 PM, Samuel Sieb wrote:

On 5/8/20 6:32 AM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
The workaround for me is the  and then move the 
dialog with the mouse.


For Gnome and possibly other desktops, it's the LOGO key and drag.


What is the LOGO key?

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Re: LibreOffice print dialog too tall for my screen


On 5/8/20 6:32 AM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
The workaround for me is the  and then move the dialog 
with the mouse.


For Gnome and possibly other desktops, it's the LOGO key and drag.
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Re: reading bluray data disk

2020-05-08 Thread Thomas Schmitt

Hi,

Tim wrote:
>  Take it to a garage and give it an indirect blast of air

Well, as long as the miracle cure lasts, i will try not to stirr up
anything in the BD drive.

But i applied to the worn-off DVD drive a few blows from a borrowed
can of keyboard duster (half a pound of butane, ewww). Regrettably the
drive's reliability with DVD+RW and CD-RW did not improve. But it still
can burn CD-R and read CD or DVD. Bought for EUR 12.99 in 2015.
Two cans of spray duster would cost more than that.


Have a nice day :)

Thomas
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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab




On 5/8/20 12:39 PM, Tim via users wrote:

On Fri, 2020-05-08 at 06:56 -0400, Robert Moskowitz wrote:

Plus I have always thought of this as a deficiency in cron on a
workstation.  Cron should work (report in this case) properly
without needing something else (MTA) installed.

Does it though?  There's always /var/log/cron.  Or that other journal
log thing that is too convoluted for me to want to use.
  
It depends on what you are doing in your cron scripts.  It can be argued 
that mine really don't need to go to emails, but I decided to do it...


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Re: VDQ Thumb drive software

2020-05-08 Thread Patrick O'Callaghan

On Fri, 2020-05-08 at 13:45 +, Beartooth wrote:
> On Thu, 07 May 2020 13:44:11 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
> 
> > On 5/7/20 1:41 PM, Beartooth wrote:
> > >   I'm pretty sure the Fedora machine I want to use to put something
> > > onto a thumb drive doesn't have the thumb drive software installed to
> > > do so. But I've searched dnfdragora up one side and down the other
> > > without finding it. What is it called? Pretty please?
> > 
> > We'll need more info than that.  What do you want to put on the drive?
> > I assume it's not the file manager that you're looking for. :-)
> 
>   Two things, either of which can go onto an optical medium or a 
> second thumb drive instead.
> 
>   If I can find them, I'd like to save my tweaks: size and 
> positions of panels, choice and positions of launchers, tabs of the 
> terminal with their fonts and color schemes, tabs & bookmarks of all the 
> browsers (all the ones in the regular repos, plus Opera and Vivaldi), the 
> biggest mouse cursor there is, all that kind of stuff. (I always display 
> 'hidden' files, but there's some of that I never have found, running 
> Fedora since its creation.)

All that stuff is in your home directory, under either .config or
.local. Assuming you're either preserving /home when reinstalling, or
backing it up and restoring it, that shouldn't be a problem.

poc
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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab

On Fri, 2020-05-08 at 06:56 -0400, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
> Plus I have always thought of this as a deficiency in cron on a 
> workstation.  Cron should work (report in this case) properly
> without needing something else (MTA) installed.

Does it though?  There's always /var/log/cron.  Or that other journal
log thing that is too convoluted for me to want to use.
 
-- 
 
uname -rsvp
Linux 3.10.0-1127.el7.x86_64 #1 SMP Tue Mar 31 23:36:51 UTC 2020 x86_64
 
Boilerplate:  All unexpected mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted.
I will only get to see the messages that are posted to the mailing list.
 
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Re: reading bluray data disk

On Fri, 2020-05-08 at 17:53 +0200, Thomas Schmitt wrote:
> My best guess is that some lint had settled on the blue beam lense.
> (My best hope is that the lint isn't still roaming in the drive.)

Brute force and ignorance approach:  Take it to a garage and give it an
indirect blast of air (from a distance, not full blast, not directly at
anything sensitive, just expel anything loose within the cabinet).

:-)

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Re: Logwatch cron job

On Fri, 2020-05-08 at 08:23 -0400, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
> This is a little more challenging when you don't have a mailer.

If you don't want to run a mail server, you could do a different
approach:  Have a watchdog program monitor a /var/log/your-log-file and
act upon it.
 
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Re: Need help with a weird kernel update panic.

A sync will flush the writes to the journal were the data is safe.  It
will not force a replay of the journal.

Nothing except removing the journal from the ext4 filesystem will fix it.

This is not a fedora bug, this is a long standing
kernel/grub/filesystem interaction bug (all who use a journaled
filesystem have this bug).

See tune2fs and something like -O ^has_journal will turn off the
journal.  It has to be done unmounted and verify that your fstab entry
will remounted it.

Check /proc/mounts having data=XXX (probably ordered) says you have a
journal, after the umount+above tune2fs+remount the data=ordered will
be gone.

On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 10:53 AM John Mellor  wrote:
>
> Interesting!  This machine does reboot in about 5secs and the other
> machines take longer, so it makes sense.  My /boot is mounted just like
> /home and / as follows:
>
> /dev/sda1 on /boot type ext4 (rw,relatime,seclabel)
>
> I assume that a symple sync would flush the journal.  Its pretty easy to
> do a sync;sync if updating using the CLI, but not possible when using
> the GUI.  Is this a Fedora bug where the journal is not correctly
> flushed on the reboot?  Should I modify that mount entry or do achattr
> change to workaround the bug?
>
>
> On 2020-05-08 11:11 a.m., Roger Heflin wrote:
> > What you are saying does not exactly match what I have previously
> > seen, but there is a known feature with using a journaling filesystem
> > (ext4-journal, or xfs) for /boot, if only the journal is updated and
> > if it is not yet replayed  into the non-journal then grub will not be
> > able to find the new files/updated files (grub filesystem code is
> > simple and does not process the journal so if critical updates are
> > still in the journal then those updates(changed file, new files)
> > cannot be seen).  To get this one generally has to do the update and
> > almost immediately reboot (within a few minutes though in some cases,
> > note syncing the does not replay the journal).   The fix is to boot up
> > with a kernel that it can still find and/or livecd and mount /boot so
> > that the journal gets replayed, or fsck boot so that the journal gets
> > replayed.
> >
> > Long term the solution is to move boot to a non-journaled fs (ext
> > without a journal) or after each update umount/mount /boot(before
> > reboot)..  If /boot is not separated then you cannot umount/mount it
> > to get the journal to replay.  There is a second method to force a
> > journal replay, but reports say that one often "hangs" when /boot is
> > not separate so is not a reliable solution.There were some
> > detailed posts on this several years ago with reliable commenters
> > confirming the behavior.  I have also personally seen the issue a
> > number of times and mount /boot and/or fscking corrects it (replays
> > journal).
> >
> > On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 8:52 AM John Mellor  wrote:
> >> I have one completely stock workstation F32 machine where kernel updates
> >> almost always cause a multiple-reboot panic problem.  This problem also
> >> occurred on F31, but not on releases before that. I'm stumped and need
> >> some help in figuring it out.
> >>
> >> The symptoms vary in the number of reboots and the type of tertiary
> >> error, but are otherwise pretty similar.  It does not matter whether I
> >> use the Gnome update app or the CLI dnf method. After a number of
> >> reboots, the upgrade succeeds and Fedora behaves nortmally again.  I
> >> think that this only happens whenever the kernel is upgraded.
> >>
> >> What I observe is that the machine is rebooted and on reboot, grub (I
> >> think) gets a halt for a 32-bit relocation error.  This sequence may
> >> happen twice.  Its an i7 with plenty of memory and an SSD boot disk, so
> >> the 32-bit thing is confusing.  To get around this error, I powercycle
> >> the box and get into the next stage of the problem.  One the 2nd or 3rd
> >> reboot, I usually see a halt with an access outside of the kernel space,
> >> although with the update this morning, I had a kernel panic instead.
> >> Cold-booting again, and the update is installed, and the last reboot and
> >> I'm up on the new updates.
> >>
> >> After that, the machine behaves normally until the next kernel updates.
> >> I assume that there is some incorrectly-asynchronous operation in grub
> >> related to the update entry, but I can find no grub logs to dig into
> >> this problem.  I have several other machines that do not see this
> >> problem.  I dug around in the fedora bugs, but not knowing what to look
> >> for, I'm basically blind.  Its a pretty serious bug, especially if the
> >> machine is remote.  Does anyone have a way out of this?
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> John Mellor
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Re: reading bluray data disk

2020-05-08 Thread Thomas Schmitt

Hi,

Steve Berg wrote:
> Get this with either one of my data BD-R's or a commercial bluray movie
> disk, Blade Runner in this case:
> libburn : SORRY : Asynchronous SCSI error on waiting after START UNIT (+
> LOAD): [2 06 00] Drive not ready. No reference position found.

The drive does not like the media at all. Since it happens with burnt
and commercial BDs, i would blame the drive, not the media.

(The error code [2 06 00] was issued by the drive. libburn translated it
 according SCSI specs to: "Drive not ready. No reference position found".)

> I'm going on the assumption that the laser
> for bluray has failed while the DVD/CD laser is still functioning.
> Gonna buy a new drive to test that theory,

Good plan.

Just as anecdote:
I bought an LG BH16NS40 in 2013, which seemingly lost its Blu-ray vision
in 2015. In 2019 one of my DVD burners died and i reactivated the BH16NS40
which i knew would still do DVD and CD.
Oh wonder, it turned out that the drive again recognizes, burns, and reads
BD-R and BD-RE. Two moves and 4 years on the shelf salvaged it.
My best guess is that some lint had settled on the blue beam lense.
(My best hope is that the lint isn't still roaming in the drive.)

> only $55 from amazon.

We should be glad that it's not much less.
DVD burners have become so cheap that half of them are dead on arrival.

Have a nice day :)

Thomas
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Re: Need help with a weird kernel update panic.

2020-05-08 Thread John Mellor

Interesting!  This machine does reboot in about 5secs and the other 
machines take longer, so it makes sense.  My /boot is mounted just like 
/home and / as follows:


   /dev/sda1 on /boot type ext4 (rw,relatime,seclabel)

I assume that a symple sync would flush the journal.  Its pretty easy to 
do a sync;sync if updating using the CLI, but not possible when using 
the GUI.  Is this a Fedora bug where the journal is not correctly 
flushed on the reboot?  Should I modify that mount entry or do achattr 
change to workaround the bug?



On 2020-05-08 11:11 a.m., Roger Heflin wrote:

What you are saying does not exactly match what I have previously
seen, but there is a known feature with using a journaling filesystem
(ext4-journal, or xfs) for /boot, if only the journal is updated and
if it is not yet replayed  into the non-journal then grub will not be
able to find the new files/updated files (grub filesystem code is
simple and does not process the journal so if critical updates are
still in the journal then those updates(changed file, new files)
cannot be seen).  To get this one generally has to do the update and
almost immediately reboot (within a few minutes though in some cases,
note syncing the does not replay the journal).   The fix is to boot up
with a kernel that it can still find and/or livecd and mount /boot so
that the journal gets replayed, or fsck boot so that the journal gets
replayed.

Long term the solution is to move boot to a non-journaled fs (ext
without a journal) or after each update umount/mount /boot(before
reboot)..  If /boot is not separated then you cannot umount/mount it
to get the journal to replay.  There is a second method to force a
journal replay, but reports say that one often "hangs" when /boot is
not separate so is not a reliable solution.There were some
detailed posts on this several years ago with reliable commenters
confirming the behavior.  I have also personally seen the issue a
number of times and mount /boot and/or fscking corrects it (replays
journal).

On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 8:52 AM John Mellor  wrote:

I have one completely stock workstation F32 machine where kernel updates
almost always cause a multiple-reboot panic problem.  This problem also
occurred on F31, but not on releases before that. I'm stumped and need
some help in figuring it out.

The symptoms vary in the number of reboots and the type of tertiary
error, but are otherwise pretty similar.  It does not matter whether I
use the Gnome update app or the CLI dnf method. After a number of
reboots, the upgrade succeeds and Fedora behaves nortmally again.  I
think that this only happens whenever the kernel is upgraded.

What I observe is that the machine is rebooted and on reboot, grub (I
think) gets a halt for a 32-bit relocation error.  This sequence may
happen twice.  Its an i7 with plenty of memory and an SSD boot disk, so
the 32-bit thing is confusing.  To get around this error, I powercycle
the box and get into the next stage of the problem.  One the 2nd or 3rd
reboot, I usually see a halt with an access outside of the kernel space,
although with the update this morning, I had a kernel panic instead.
Cold-booting again, and the update is installed, and the last reboot and
I'm up on the new updates.

After that, the machine behaves normally until the next kernel updates.
I assume that there is some incorrectly-asynchronous operation in grub
related to the update entry, but I can find no grub logs to dig into
this problem.  I have several other machines that do not see this
problem.  I dug around in the fedora bugs, but not knowing what to look
for, I'm basically blind.  Its a pretty serious bug, especially if the
machine is remote.  Does anyone have a way out of this?

--

John Mellor
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Re: Logwatch cron job

2020-05-08 Thread Francis . Montagnac


On Fri, 08 May 2020 10:26:05 -0400 Robert Moskowitz wrote:
> On 5/8/20 10:18 AM, francis.montag...@inria.fr wrote:

>> By using 'systemctl restart' you invoked the later that do not use
>> /etc/logwatch/conf/logwatch.conf ...

> Ooops.

> So to get things back to how they were:
> systemctl stop logwatch

This is probably not necessary since this "service" is of type oneshot
and has thus surely already finished.

> And then wait until cron.daily

Yes.

Another weakness of cron compared to systemd.timer :-):

  you cannot test your change immediately except if you change
  temporarily the start time of the cron job.

> or do something to kick it off on the next cron hourly...?

No need thus.

-- 
francis
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Re: reading bluray data disk

2020-05-08 Thread Steve Berg


On 5/8/20 10:11 AM, Thomas Schmitt wrote:

Hi,

Steve Berg wrote:

I've got some data saved to blu-ray BD-R disks that won't read.
[...] I'm positive it's a BluRay drive [...]
Anyone have any idea what could cause this?

You should try to find out whether it is a problem of medium and drive
or of the potentially present filesystem.

Inspect medium and drive by xorriso and show the reported lines

   xorriso -outdev /dev/sr0 -list_profiles out -toc


Get this with either one of my data BD-R's or a commercial bluray movie 
disk, Blade Runner in this case:


xorriso 1.5.2 : RockRidge filesystem manipulator, libburnia project.

libburn : SORRY : Asynchronous SCSI error on waiting after START UNIT (+ 
LOAD): [2 06 00] Drive not ready. No reference position found.

xorriso : FAILURE : Cannot acquire drive '/dev/sr0'
xorriso : aborting : -abort_on 'FAILURE' encountered 'FAILURE'

With a DVD, (Where the Buffalo Roam), I get the expected output.

Using file or ls on /dev/sr0 I get nothing with either type of bluray 
but the normal results with a DVD. I'm going on the assumption that the 
laser for bluray has failed while the DVD/CD laser is still 
functioning.  Gonna buy a new drive to test that theory, only $55 from 
amazon.


--
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//-Home = sb...@mississippi.com-//
//- Sinners can repent, but stupid is forever. -//

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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab




On 5/8/20 10:03 AM, Jon LaBadie wrote:

On Thu, May 07, 2020 at 11:24:41PM -0700, Gordon Messmer wrote:

On 5/7/20 10:44 PM, Jon LaBadie wrote:

In my mail files each message is followed by a blank line
before the next "From_" line.  Is that a requirement of
mbox format?  If so, it may be necessary to add it to
the crontab output.


Yes, it's a requirement of the format.  That's why there's an "echo" after
"cat".  :)

except cat is not guarenteed to EOF after a newline.


New script.

I added inserting a Date: line and switched to using sed:

local]# cat mycron
#!/bin/sh

currentDate="$(date +'%a %b %d %T %Y')"
echo "From cron@localhost  $currentDate" >> /var/spool/mail/$USER
currentDate="$(date +'%a,%e %b %Y %T %z (%Z)')"
sed "/^Status:/a Date: $currentDate" >> /var/spool/mail/$USER
echo "" >> /var/spool/mail/$USER

==

Took a bit to get the date function outputing the right formats.

I still suspect I am missing an important mail header.  Mutt takes a 
long time to start up compared to a CentOS system that DOES have postfix 
and cron is sending the mail to local store.


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Re: reading bluray data disk

2020-05-08 Thread Thomas Schmitt

Hi,

Steve Berg wrote:
> I've got some data saved to blu-ray BD-R disks that won't read.
> [...] I'm positive it's a BluRay drive [...]
> Anyone have any idea what could cause this?

You should try to find out whether it is a problem of medium and drive
or of the potentially present filesystem.

Inspect medium and drive by xorriso and show the reported lines

  xorriso -outdev /dev/sr0 -list_profiles out -toc

If more than one drive is attached, the address might be /dev/sr1 or
a higher number.

Info about the possibly readable filesystem might be shown by

  file -s /dev/sr0

or

  lsblk -o NAME,SIZE,FSTYPE,LABEL /dev/sr0


Have a nice day :)

Thomas
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Re: Need help with a weird kernel update panic.

What you are saying does not exactly match what I have previously
seen, but there is a known feature with using a journaling filesystem
(ext4-journal, or xfs) for /boot, if only the journal is updated and
if it is not yet replayed  into the non-journal then grub will not be
able to find the new files/updated files (grub filesystem code is
simple and does not process the journal so if critical updates are
still in the journal then those updates(changed file, new files)
cannot be seen).  To get this one generally has to do the update and
almost immediately reboot (within a few minutes though in some cases,
note syncing the does not replay the journal).   The fix is to boot up
with a kernel that it can still find and/or livecd and mount /boot so
that the journal gets replayed, or fsck boot so that the journal gets
replayed.

Long term the solution is to move boot to a non-journaled fs (ext
without a journal) or after each update umount/mount /boot(before
reboot)..  If /boot is not separated then you cannot umount/mount it
to get the journal to replay.  There is a second method to force a
journal replay, but reports say that one often "hangs" when /boot is
not separate so is not a reliable solution.There were some
detailed posts on this several years ago with reliable commenters
confirming the behavior.  I have also personally seen the issue a
number of times and mount /boot and/or fscking corrects it (replays
journal).

On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 8:52 AM John Mellor  wrote:
>
> I have one completely stock workstation F32 machine where kernel updates
> almost always cause a multiple-reboot panic problem.  This problem also
> occurred on F31, but not on releases before that. I'm stumped and need
> some help in figuring it out.
>
> The symptoms vary in the number of reboots and the type of tertiary
> error, but are otherwise pretty similar.  It does not matter whether I
> use the Gnome update app or the CLI dnf method. After a number of
> reboots, the upgrade succeeds and Fedora behaves nortmally again.  I
> think that this only happens whenever the kernel is upgraded.
>
> What I observe is that the machine is rebooted and on reboot, grub (I
> think) gets a halt for a 32-bit relocation error.  This sequence may
> happen twice.  Its an i7 with plenty of memory and an SSD boot disk, so
> the 32-bit thing is confusing.  To get around this error, I powercycle
> the box and get into the next stage of the problem.  One the 2nd or 3rd
> reboot, I usually see a halt with an access outside of the kernel space,
> although with the update this morning, I had a kernel panic instead.
> Cold-booting again, and the update is installed, and the last reboot and
> I'm up on the new updates.
>
> After that, the machine behaves normally until the next kernel updates.
> I assume that there is some incorrectly-asynchronous operation in grub
> related to the update entry, but I can find no grub logs to dig into
> this problem.  I have several other machines that do not see this
> problem.  I dug around in the fedora bugs, but not knowing what to look
> for, I'm basically blind.  Its a pretty serious bug, especially if the
> machine is remote.  Does anyone have a way out of this?
>
> --
>
> John Mellor
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Re: Working now - Re: Pigdin account config files


ARGH

I blame my dyslexia.  :)'

really!  I am Mr. Malaprop; my wife has had to put up with it for 40+ 
years...


On 5/8/20 10:49 AM, John Pilkington wrote:

On 07/05/2020 22:34, Robert Moskowitz wrote:

Perhaps I did not fully shut it down when I installed the purple rpms.

Anyway working.  thanks for the help, and I updated my notes for next 
year!




Just a comment, intended to be helpful:

All your posts in this thread have been about 'pigdin'.  I think 
pretty much all the replies have been about 'pidgin'.  They are not 
the same - and it might be worth looking over those notes :-)


Cheers,

John P
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Re: Working now - Re: Pigdin account config files

2020-05-08 Thread John Pilkington


On 07/05/2020 22:34, Robert Moskowitz wrote:

Perhaps I did not fully shut it down when I installed the purple rpms.

Anyway working.  thanks for the help, and I updated my notes for next year!



Just a comment, intended to be helpful:

All your posts in this thread have been about 'pigdin'.  I think pretty 
much all the replies have been about 'pidgin'.  They are not the same - 
and it might be worth looking over those notes :-)


Cheers,

John P
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Re: reading bluray data disk

2020-05-08 Thread Steve Berg


On 5/8/20 9:21 AM, Tom Horsley wrote:

On Fri, 8 May 2020 09:10:22 -0500
Steve Berg wrote:


Anyone have
any idea what could cause this?

Linux shouldn't need any extra software to read a BD-R data
disk, so the drive dying or the disk dying over time are
the most likely issues.


I've tried 5 or 6 different discs and none of them read but DVD's read 
just fine.  Hoping it's the laser for the bluray part of the drive 
itself since I can get a new one for fairly cheap off amazon or newegg.


--
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//-Home = sb...@mississippi.com-//
//- Sinners can repent, but stupid is forever. -//

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Re: Logwatch cron job




On 5/8/20 10:18 AM, francis.montag...@inria.fr wrote:

Hi.

On Fri, 08 May 2020 09:51:13 -0400 Robert Moskowitz wrote:

May  8 03:27:17 lx140e run-parts[66530]: (/etc/cron.daily) finished 0logwatch
So it looks like I need to modify /etc/logwatch/conf/logwatch.conf with
mailer = "/usr/local/mycron"
And see what happens next.

# cat /etc/logwatch/conf/logwatch.conf
# Local configuration options go here (defaults are in
/usr/share/logwatch/default.conf/logwatch.conf)
mailer = "/usr/local/mycron"
What happens after I made this change and then "systemctl restart logwatch"
was for logwatch to send its output to /var/log/messages
So what am I missing?

The logwatch RPM allows 2 ways to launch logwatch:

   - with cron /etc/cron.daily/0logwatch
   - with a systemd timer  /usr/lib/systemd/system/logwatch.{service,timer}

By using 'systemctl restart' you invoked the later that do not use
/etc/logwatch/conf/logwatch.conf but instead:

   # This first EnvironmentFile has the Logwatch default variables
   EnvironmentFile=-/usr/share/logwatch/default.conf/systemd.conf
   # This second EnvironmentFile is meant for system-specific
   # customization of variables, including overriding the defaults
   EnvironmentFile=-/etc/logwatch/conf/systemd.conf


Ooops.

So to get things back to how they were:

systemctl stop logwatch

And then wait until cron.daily

or do something to kick it off on the next cron hourly...

?
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Re: reading bluray data disk

2020-05-08 Thread Tom Horsley

On Fri, 8 May 2020 09:10:22 -0500
Steve Berg wrote:

> Anyone have 
> any idea what could cause this?

Linux shouldn't need any extra software to read a BD-R data
disk, so the drive dying or the disk dying over time are
the most likely issues.
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Re: Logwatch cron job

2020-05-08 Thread Francis . Montagnac


Hi.

On Fri, 08 May 2020 09:51:13 -0400 Robert Moskowitz wrote:
>> May  8 03:27:17 lx140e run-parts[66530]: (/etc/cron.daily) finished 0logwatch

>> So it looks like I need to modify /etc/logwatch/conf/logwatch.conf with
>> mailer = "/usr/local/mycron"

>> And see what happens next.

> # cat /etc/logwatch/conf/logwatch.conf
> # Local configuration options go here (defaults are in 
> /usr/share/logwatch/default.conf/logwatch.conf)
> mailer = "/usr/local/mycron"

> What happens after I made this change and then "systemctl restart logwatch"

> was for logwatch to send its output to /var/log/messages

> So what am I missing?

The logwatch RPM allows 2 ways to launch logwatch:

  - with cron /etc/cron.daily/0logwatch
  - with a systemd timer  /usr/lib/systemd/system/logwatch.{service,timer}

By using 'systemctl restart' you invoked the later that do not use
/etc/logwatch/conf/logwatch.conf but instead:

  # This first EnvironmentFile has the Logwatch default variables
  EnvironmentFile=-/usr/share/logwatch/default.conf/systemd.conf
  # This second EnvironmentFile is meant for system-specific
  # customization of variables, including overriding the defaults
  EnvironmentFile=-/etc/logwatch/conf/systemd.conf

-- 
francis
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Re: reading bluray data disk

2020-05-08 Thread Richard Shaw

On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 9:11 AM Steve Berg  wrote:

> I've got some data saved to blu-ray BD-R disks that won't read. Loading
> a video DVD works, the system mounts it and I can see the files.  But
> when I pop in one of these BD-R disks nothing, the system doesn't see
> the media at all.  I'm positive it's a BluRay drive, pretty sure it's
> the same drive I used to burn these disks a couple years ago.
>
> I did recently reinstall this system with F32 so I might be missing
> software needed to read, but haven't figured out what that might be
> yet.  These disks are just data, no encryption of any sort.  Anyone have
> any idea what could cause this?
>

Do you know how the data was written? What format?

Just random ideas I can think of...

Is libbluray installed?
UDF tools?

Thanks,
Richard
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reading bluray data disk

2020-05-08 Thread Steve Berg

I've got some data saved to blu-ray BD-R disks that won't read. Loading 
a video DVD works, the system mounts it and I can see the files.  But 
when I pop in one of these BD-R disks nothing, the system doesn't see 
the media at all.  I'm positive it's a BluRay drive, pretty sure it's 
the same drive I used to burn these disks a couple years ago.


I did recently reinstall this system with F32 so I might be missing 
software needed to read, but haven't figured out what that might be 
yet.  These disks are just data, no encryption of any sort.  Anyone have 
any idea what could cause this?



--
//-Fixer of that which is broke-//
//-Home = sb...@mississippi.com-//
//- Sinners can repent, but stupid is forever. -//

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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab

2020-05-08 Thread Jon LaBadie

On Thu, May 07, 2020 at 11:24:41PM -0700, Gordon Messmer wrote:
> On 5/7/20 10:44 PM, Jon LaBadie wrote:
> > In my mail files each message is followed by a blank line
> > before the next "From_" line.  Is that a requirement of
> > mbox format?  If so, it may be necessary to add it to
> > the crontab output.
> 
> 
> Yes, it's a requirement of the format.  That's why there's an "echo" after
> "cat".  :)

except cat is not guarenteed to EOF after a newline.

-- 
Jon H. LaBadie  jo...@jgcomp.com
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Re: Logwatch cron job




On 5/8/20 8:23 AM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
This is a little more challenging when you don't have a mailer.  I see 
it ran:


May  8 03:01:02 lx140e anacron[66134]: Anacron started on 2020-05-08
May  8 03:01:02 lx140e anacron[66134]: Will run job `cron.daily' in 26 
min.

May  8 03:01:02 lx140e anacron[66134]: Jobs will be executed sequentially
May  8 03:01:02 lx140e run-parts[66123]: (/etc/cron.hourly) finished 
0anacron

May  8 03:27:02 lx140e anacron[66134]: Job `cron.daily' started
May  8 03:27:02 lx140e run-parts[66530]: (/etc/cron.daily) starting 
0logwatch
May  8 03:27:17 lx140e run-parts[66530]: (/etc/cron.daily) finished 
0logwatch
May  8 03:27:17 lx140e anacron[66134]: Job `cron.daily' terminated 
(produced output)

May  8 03:27:17 lx140e anacron[66134]: Normal exit (1 job run)

but no /var/spool/mail/root

So a little digging and I find in 
/usr/share/logwatch/default.conf/logwatch.conf


# By default we assume that all Unix systems have sendmail or a 
sendmail-like MTA.

# The mailer code prints a header with To: From: and Subject:.
# At this point you can change the mailer to anything that can handle 
this output

# stream.
# TODO test variables in the mailer string to see if the 
To/From/Subject can be set
# From here with out breaking anything. This would allow 
mail/mailx/nail etc. -mgt

mailer = "/usr/sbin/sendmail -t"

So it looks like I need to modify /etc/logwatch/conf/logwatch.conf with

mailer = "/usr/local/mycron"

And see what happens next.


# cat /etc/logwatch/conf/logwatch.conf
# Local configuration options go here (defaults are in 
/usr/share/logwatch/default.conf/logwatch.conf)

mailer = "/usr/local/mycron"

# cat /usr/local/mycron
#!/bin/sh

currentDate="$(date +'%a %b %d %T %Y')"
echo "From cron@localhost  $currentDate" >> /var/spool/mail/$USER
(cat; echo) >> /var/spool/mail/$USER


What happens after I made this change and then "systemctl restart logwatch"

was for logwatch to send its output to /var/log/messages

So what am I missing?

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Need help with a weird kernel update panic.

2020-05-08 Thread John Mellor

I have one completely stock workstation F32 machine where kernel updates 
almost always cause a multiple-reboot panic problem.  This problem also 
occurred on F31, but not on releases before that. I'm stumped and need 
some help in figuring it out.


The symptoms vary in the number of reboots and the type of tertiary 
error, but are otherwise pretty similar.  It does not matter whether I 
use the Gnome update app or the CLI dnf method. After a number of 
reboots, the upgrade succeeds and Fedora behaves nortmally again.  I 
think that this only happens whenever the kernel is upgraded.


What I observe is that the machine is rebooted and on reboot, grub (I 
think) gets a halt for a 32-bit relocation error.  This sequence may 
happen twice.  Its an i7 with plenty of memory and an SSD boot disk, so 
the 32-bit thing is confusing.  To get around this error, I powercycle 
the box and get into the next stage of the problem.  One the 2nd or 3rd 
reboot, I usually see a halt with an access outside of the kernel space, 
although with the update this morning, I had a kernel panic instead.  
Cold-booting again, and the update is installed, and the last reboot and 
I'm up on the new updates.


After that, the machine behaves normally until the next kernel updates.  
I assume that there is some incorrectly-asynchronous operation in grub 
related to the update entry, but I can find no grub logs to dig into 
this problem.  I have several other machines that do not see this 
problem.  I dug around in the fedora bugs, but not knowing what to look 
for, I'm basically blind.  Its a pretty serious bug, especially if the 
machine is remote.  Does anyone have a way out of this?


--

John Mellor
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Re: VDQ Thumb drive software

On Thu, 07 May 2020 13:44:11 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> On 5/7/20 1:41 PM, Beartooth wrote:
>>  I'm pretty sure the Fedora machine I want to use to put something
>> onto a thumb drive doesn't have the thumb drive software installed to
>> do so. But I've searched dnfdragora up one side and down the other
>> without finding it. What is it called? Pretty please?
> 
> We'll need more info than that.  What do you want to put on the drive?
> I assume it's not the file manager that you're looking for. :-)

Two things, either of which can go onto an optical medium or a 
second thumb drive instead.

If I can find them, I'd like to save my tweaks: size and 
positions of panels, choice and positions of launchers, tabs of the 
terminal with their fonts and color schemes, tabs & bookmarks of all the 
browsers (all the ones in the regular repos, plus Opera and Vivaldi), the 
biggest mouse cursor there is, all that kind of stuff. (I always display 
'hidden' files, but there's some of that I never have found, running 
Fedora since its creation.)

And a netinstall .iso with Mate, for one more try at a re-
install. :-}

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Re: LibreOffice print dialog too tall for my screen


Thanks for the pointer.

The workaround for me is the  and then move the dialog 
with the mouse.


On 5/8/20 8:58 AM, Ted Roche wrote:

Robert:

It appears to be this bug: 
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=128495


There are patches in the pipeline for LibreOffice 6.4.x or 6.5.x and 
some suggested workarounds, depending on your configuration.


On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 9:57 PM Robert Moskowitz > wrote:


Found that if I hold down alt key and left mouse button I can use
mouse
ball to move the dialog up so I can get to the OK.

But this is not a solution to a dialog too big for its britches.

On 5/6/20 9:53 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
> F30 with Xfce
>
> Screen size 1280 x 768
>
> The dialog goes from just below the top panel to below the
bottom of
> the screen so the print button is lost.
>
> I cannot resize this dialog.  It is locked.  I cannot get it to
move
> up the screen (releases ago I had a similar problem and there
was some
> magic key combination to make this possible?)
>
> There are only 2 tabs on the top of the dialog for General and
> LibreOffice Writer.  Back in F30 there were 4 tabs and the
dialog box
> was much shorter.
>
> I cannot find any way to configure this dialog nor move it around.
>
> And I need to print something...
>
> Help?
>
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--
Ted Roche
Ted Roche & Associates, LLC
http://www.tedroche.com

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Re: LibreOffice print dialog too tall for my screen

2020-05-08 Thread Ted Roche

Robert:

It appears to be this bug:
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=128495

There are patches in the pipeline for LibreOffice 6.4.x or 6.5.x and some
suggested workarounds, depending on your configuration.

On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 9:57 PM Robert Moskowitz  wrote:

> Found that if I hold down alt key and left mouse button I can use mouse
> ball to move the dialog up so I can get to the OK.
>
> But this is not a solution to a dialog too big for its britches.
>
> On 5/6/20 9:53 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
> > F30 with Xfce
> >
> > Screen size 1280 x 768
> >
> > The dialog goes from just below the top panel to below the bottom of
> > the screen so the print button is lost.
> >
> > I cannot resize this dialog.  It is locked.  I cannot get it to move
> > up the screen (releases ago I had a similar problem and there was some
> > magic key combination to make this possible?)
> >
> > There are only 2 tabs on the top of the dialog for General and
> > LibreOffice Writer.  Back in F30 there were 4 tabs and the dialog box
> > was much shorter.
> >
> > I cannot find any way to configure this dialog nor move it around.
> >
> > And I need to print something...
> >
> > Help?
> >
> > ___
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> > https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
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-- 
Ted Roche
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http://www.tedroche.com
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Logwatch cron job

This is a little more challenging when you don't have a mailer.  I see 
it ran:


May  8 03:01:02 lx140e anacron[66134]: Anacron started on 2020-05-08
May  8 03:01:02 lx140e anacron[66134]: Will run job `cron.daily' in 26 min.
May  8 03:01:02 lx140e anacron[66134]: Jobs will be executed sequentially
May  8 03:01:02 lx140e run-parts[66123]: (/etc/cron.hourly) finished 
0anacron

May  8 03:27:02 lx140e anacron[66134]: Job `cron.daily' started
May  8 03:27:02 lx140e run-parts[66530]: (/etc/cron.daily) starting 
0logwatch
May  8 03:27:17 lx140e run-parts[66530]: (/etc/cron.daily) finished 
0logwatch
May  8 03:27:17 lx140e anacron[66134]: Job `cron.daily' terminated 
(produced output)

May  8 03:27:17 lx140e anacron[66134]: Normal exit (1 job run)

but no /var/spool/mail/root

So a little digging and I find in 
/usr/share/logwatch/default.conf/logwatch.conf


# By default we assume that all Unix systems have sendmail or a 
sendmail-like MTA.

# The mailer code prints a header with To: From: and Subject:.
# At this point you can change the mailer to anything that can handle 
this output

# stream.
# TODO test variables in the mailer string to see if the To/From/Subject 
can be set
# From here with out breaking anything. This would allow mail/mailx/nail 
etc. -mgt

mailer = "/usr/sbin/sendmail -t"

So it looks like I need to modify /etc/logwatch/conf/logwatch.conf with

mailer = "/usr/local/mycron"

And see what happens next.



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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab




On 5/8/20 6:04 AM, Tim via users wrote:

On Fri, 2020-05-08 at 01:44 -0400, Jon LaBadie wrote:

In my mail files each message is followed by a blank line
before the next "From_" line.  Is that a requirement of
mbox format?  If so, it may be necessary to add it to
the crontab output.

It's how mbox works, each email is concatenated into one huge file, and
that's the separator (a blank line, then a "from" line at the beginning
of the next message).  i.e. It's an mbox thing, not a general email
thing.

Of course, it's entirely possible for someone to write an email,
starting off a new paragraph with the word from, and that'll confuse
the heck of dumbly written email software.  Typically, they'll split
the email there, you'll only see what appeared before it, and the rest
of the mail will be completely lost.


Well I kind of just did exactly that by pasteing in an email that was in 
the mbox!


Of course, I am sending email with rich html, so it is not received as 
just a plain text file to mess up anyone using an mbox reader.


Got to love this stuff.  Otherwise you would go crazier!




I say dumb, because it's well known that people might write an email
that way, they should't have to word their emails some other way, and
email software should be able to handle it, one way or another.  The
usual way is that some mail handler will add a character into the text,
somewhere, to make it different (e.g. shove a > in front, or add
another character after the word from).  That could be your own email
program, munging the message as it sends it (another dumb thing), or it
could be an email server munging messages as it passes through them
knowing that *it* is going to store its messages in a mbox file (just
acceptable), or some email server munging messages passing through it
in case some other mail server can't handle it (another dumb thing).

Another way of handling it is for your mail server to not use a from
line, and be able to ignore the word "from" appearing in a message.
Whether that be using some other non-standard message separation method
of their own, or an addition (such as adding details to the "from line"
about the length of the message, so the server doesn't break apart
messages when the word "from" appears before the end of the message),
or a different mail storage technique.  e.g. Maildir stores each email
as a separate file, so doesn't need to use that technique.
  

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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab

2020-05-08 Thread Francis . Montagnac


Hi.

On Fri, 08 May 2020 06:56:58 -0400 Robert Moskowitz wrote:
> On 5/8/20 2:08 AM, Cameron Simpson wrote:

>> You _do_ need to ensure the message at least ends with a newline, of 
>> the From_ won't be at the start of a line. So the previously posted 
>> script ensures that with the "echo" in "( cat; echo )". If you want to 
>> ensure a blank line you also need an additional "echo".

> Working on it. Plus I have to sed in a Date: line.

>> Or Robert could install an MDA and make it the MDA's problem :-)

> What fun would that be?

IMO none :-(

> Plus I have always thought of this as a deficiency in cron on a 
> workstation. Cron should work (report in this case) properly without 
> needing something else (MTA) installed.

There is an alternative to cron: systemd.timer

See my previous post:

  
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org/message/4WZ2QUP7XYV7AJDKL4QBMV7KBD4ALCMI/

In your case you will have to use the service manager of your account
instead of the system one.

In short, use "systemctl --user" "journalctl --user".

Assuming you write a rsync-ietf.service file, you can then use:

  ## Status of this rsync:
  systemctl --user status rsync-ietf.service
  
  ## Logs since midnight:
  journalctl --user --since 00:00 -u rsync-ietf.service

I can give more help if you want to use that.

-- 
francis
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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab




On 5/8/20 2:24 AM, Gordon Messmer wrote:

On 5/7/20 10:44 PM, Jon LaBadie wrote:

In my mail files each message is followed by a blank line
before the next "From_" line.  Is that a requirement of
mbox format?  If so, it may be necessary to add it to
the crontab output.



Yes, it's a requirement of the format.  That's why there's an "echo" 
after "cat".  :)


Oops.  That is right.  And I need to change this to do a sed to insert a 
Date: line in the right place...


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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab

On 5/8/20 2:08 AM, Cameron Simpson wrote:

On 08May2020 01:44, Jon LaBadie  wrote:

On Fri, May 08, 2020 at 09:57:33AM +1000, Cameron Simpson wrote:

On 07May2020 15:01, Robert Moskowitz  wrote:
> /ustr/sbin/mycron:
> #!/bin/sh
>
> currentDate="$(date +'%a %b %d %T %Y')"
> echo "From cron@localhost  "$currentDate >> /var/spool/mail/$USER

Put $currentDate inside the quotes. With echo it is less of an 
issue, but
for many other commands you should exert more control over strings.  
So as a

matter of practice:

   echo "From cron@localhost $currentDate"

If nothing else it prevents filename expansion happening to the 
value of
$currentDate. (Not that that will happen with the date format 
chosen, but

again, as a general practice in scripting.)

In my mail files each message is followed by a blank line
before the next "From_" line.  Is that a requirement of
mbox format?  If so, it may be necessary to add it to
the crontab output.

Kinda. Depends on the thing parsing the mbox file. To avoid misparsing 
message body lines which themselves commance with "From " some things 
only consider a From_ line after a blank line. Others rely on ">" 
stuffing. It is all a mess.

You _do_ need to ensure the message at least ends with a newline, of 
the From_ won't be at the start of a line. So the previously posted 
script ensures that with the "echo" in "( cat; echo )". If you want to 
ensure a blank line you also need an additional "echo".

Working on it.  Plus I have to sed in a Date: line.

Or Robert could install an MDA and make it the MDA's problem :-)

What fun would that be?

Plus I have always thought of this as a deficiency in cron on a 
workstation.  Cron should work (report in this case) properly without 
needing something else (MTA) installed.  Maybe the developers will pick 
this up and do it right...

Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 
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Re: user crontab




On 5/8/20 1:16 AM, Tim via users wrote:

On Thu, 2020-05-07 at 09:09 -0500, Roger Heflin wrote:

In general if you set up the cronjobs to redirect stdout and stderr
to a file then typically there is nothing to email.

Just thinking out loud:  If your scripts generate their own logs, you
see the results of your scripts.  But if cron generates its logs, you
see the results of cron executing your scripts.  Might there be a
difference beyond the obvious of knowing it was run by cron?
  

I kind of have it working.

There is a bit of valuable info in the headers from cron.

I have to modify my script to add a Date: line, but:



From cron@localhost  Fri May 08 04:01:10 2020
From: "(Cron Daemon)" 
To: rgm
Subject: Cron  rsync -tvz 
rsync.tools.ietf.org::tools.id/*.txt /home

/common/ietf/drafts
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Auto-Submitted: auto-generated
Precedence: bulk
X-Cron-Env: 
X-Cron-Env: 
X-Cron-Env: 
X-Cron-Env: 
X-Cron-Env: 
X-Cron-Env: 
X-Cron-Env: 
X-Cron-Env: 
X-Cron-Env: 
X-Cron-Env: 
X-Cron-Env: 
X-Cron-Env: 
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1212
Lines: 32

1id-abstracts.txt
skipping non-regular file "code.txt"
1id-index.txt
all_id.txt
all_id2.txt
draft-bdc-something-something-certificate-04.txt
draft-chen-top-level-interface-protocol-01.txt
draft-iesg-nomcom-eligibility-2020-03.txt
draft-ietf-cbor-date-tag-00.txt
draft-ietf-ccamp-layer0-types-04.txt
draft-ietf-i2nsf-nsf-facing-interface-dm-09.txt
draft-ietf-i2nsf-nsf-monitoring-data-model-03.txt
draft-ietf-idr-bgp-bfd-strict-mode-03.txt
draft-ietf-lisp-predictive-rlocs-06.txt
draft-ietf-lsvr-l3dl-04.txt
draft-ietf-mpls-lsp-ping-ospfv3-codepoint-02.txt
draft-ietf-opsawg-sdi-09.txt
draft-ietf-roll-aodv-rpl-08.txt
draft-ietf-spring-segment-routing-policy-07.txt
draft-ietf-tsvwg-datagram-plpmtud-20.txt
draft-irtf-icnrg-icn-lte-4g-06.txt
draft-jeong-ipwave-context-aware-navigator-01.txt
draft-jeong-ipwave-iot-dns-autoconf-08.txt
draft-jeong-ipwave-security-privacy-01.txt
draft-jeong-ipwave-vehicular-mobility-management-03.txt
draft-jeong-ipwave-vehicular-neighbor-discovery-09.txt
draft-yang-i2nsf-security-policy-translation-06.txt
draft-zheng-ccamp-client-pm-yang-01.txt
replaced_id.txt

sent 36,590 bytes  received 5,737,944 bytes  427,743.26 bytes/sec
total size is 6,540,286,093  speedup is 1,132.61

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Re: LibreOffice print dialog too tall for my screen

2020-05-08 Thread George N. White III

On Wed, 6 May 2020 at 22:54, Robert Moskowitz  wrote:

> F30 with Xfce
>
> Screen size 1280 x 768
>
> The dialog goes from just below the top panel to below the bottom of the
> screen so the print button is lost.
>
> I cannot resize this dialog.  It is locked.  I cannot get it to move up
> the screen (releases ago I had a similar problem and there was some
> magic key combination to make this possible?)
>
> There are only 2 tabs on the top of the dialog for General and
> LibreOffice Writer.  Back in F30 there were 4 tabs and the dialog box
> was much shorter.
>
> I cannot find any way to configure this dialog nor move it around.
>
> And I need to print something...
>
> Help?
>

I've had this problem with some X11 apps ported from SGI and designed for
larger
screens, both on laptops of the day and using a projector.   Years ago the
fix was
to configure X with a virtual desktop larger than the physical screen.
 These days
it is called a panning viewport:

$ xrandr --output VGA1 --rate 60 --mode 800x600 --fb 1280x1024 \\

--panning 1280x1024

workable for people who were familiar enough  with the app to know were to
look, but
a PITA for student workshops with a room full of laptop 1024x768 screens.
 I think
it was necessary to use 8-bit color to avoid running out of memory for the
virtual
desktop.

-- 
George N. White III
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Re: /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifcfg-* not read after upgrade to F32

On Fri, 2020-05-08 at 00:23 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
> It's a standard, but I don't think NetworkManager will switch to it 
> automatically.  However, there is an option in the network settings
> to pick "link-local" which is that.

As far as I recall, if you boot up an unconfigured / default
configuration Fedora installation, and it tries to connect to a DHCP
server but can't (such as the server was down), it will eventually use
link-local addresses.  I seem to remember that zeroconf (which uses
those addresses), is part of a default installation.

And, as I seem to recall that if you booted up Fedora preconfigured to
use DHCP network settings, but it couldn't find a DHCP server, it just
didn't get an IP assigned to it.

I can't test either of these at the moment.

-- 

uname -rsvp
Linux 3.10.0-1127.el7.x86_64 #1 SMP Tue Mar 31 23:36:51 UTC 2020 x86_64

Boilerplate:  All unexpected mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted.
I will only get to see the messages that are posted to the mailing list.

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Re: Working! - Re: user crontab

On Fri, 2020-05-08 at 01:44 -0400, Jon LaBadie wrote:
> In my mail files each message is followed by a blank line
> before the next "From_" line.  Is that a requirement of
> mbox format?  If so, it may be necessary to add it to
> the crontab output.

It's how mbox works, each email is concatenated into one huge file, and
that's the separator (a blank line, then a "from" line at the beginning
of the next message).  i.e. It's an mbox thing, not a general email
thing.

Of course, it's entirely possible for someone to write an email,
starting off a new paragraph with the word from, and that'll confuse
the heck of dumbly written email software.  Typically, they'll split
the email there, you'll only see what appeared before it, and the rest
of the mail will be completely lost.

I say dumb, because it's well known that people might write an email
that way, they should't have to word their emails some other way, and
email software should be able to handle it, one way or another.  The
usual way is that some mail handler will add a character into the text,
somewhere, to make it different (e.g. shove a > in front, or add
another character after the word from).  That could be your own email
program, munging the message as it sends it (another dumb thing), or it
could be an email server munging messages as it passes through them
knowing that *it* is going to store its messages in a mbox file (just
acceptable), or some email server munging messages passing through it
in case some other mail server can't handle it (another dumb thing).

Another way of handling it is for your mail server to not use a from
line, and be able to ignore the word "from" appearing in a message. 
Whether that be using some other non-standard message separation method
of their own, or an addition (such as adding details to the "from line"
about the length of the message, so the server doesn't break apart
messages when the word "from" appears before the end of the message),
or a different mail storage technique.  e.g. Maildir stores each email
as a separate file, so doesn't need to use that technique.

-- 

uname -rsvp
Linux 3.10.0-1127.el7.x86_64 #1 SMP Tue Mar 31 23:36:51 UTC 2020 x86_64

Boilerplate:  All unexpected mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted.
I will only get to see the messages that are posted to the mailing list.

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Re: Killing existing connections with firewall-cmd (F31)

2020-05-08 Thread Thorsten Schubert

On Thu, May 7, 2020 at 12:12 AM Sam Varshavchik  wrote:
> Is there a way with firewall-cmd to /really/ block an IP address, new or
> established connections, or is manually adding an iptables rule my only
> option?

You can bypass connection tracking for dropping existing connections
by adding a rule in the *raw* or *mangle* table when using the
iptables backend. The fastest way I know of, is to add a direct rule:

If 1.2.3.4 is the offending IP, something like:

firewall-cmd --permanent --direct --add-rule ipv4 raw PREROUTING 0
-s 1.2.3.4 -j DROP
firewall-cmd --reload

should work fine. After that

iptables -n -t raw -L

should list the IP with the DROP target, REJECT doesn't work here.

A more efficient way would be to use ipsets:

firewall-cmd --permanent --zone=drop --add-source=ipset:blacklist
firewall-cmd --permanent --ipset=blacklist --add-entry=1.2.3.4
firewall-cmd --permanent --ipset=blacklist --add-entry=4.3.2.1

This should terminate any existing connection and prevent new ones.
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Re: /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifcfg-* not read after upgrade to F32