Re: [videoblogging] Bored
This kind of a list invites that kind of behavior. You should see the discdog lists on Yahoo. They're brutal! It's the main reason that I created k9disc.com. It's a real community and we don't have any of this crap. The thing is that these distribution lists, pretending to be groups, are flashes in the pan - there's no permanence. So I can write something nasty and it's gone - poof - it's the definition of FLash in the pan. On a discussion forum that doesn't happen. Things are permanent. It's up there forever. The other reason that these lists are problematic, is that they are a pushed message - most of us get these in our inboxes and that means that we must address them. Forums are a pulled message, which means that we actively go in search of the information - we select it. I think that push v pull is just as important in defining the dialogue on these lists as the lack of permanence. I would really like to see this list be ported to a discussion forum, myself. There are some nice programs that allow for pulling posts from Yahoo lists and indexing them into a forum. I think that would be awesome! I started to do it with the discdog lists, but there's some powerful personalities in charge of them, and I did not want to let them set their sights on me for 'taking' their stuff, so it never went anywhere. We had a team of 5 cover 2000 posts each in about 1 week. All was ready to go, but I balked because I didn't want to make any waves. We could do something like this here, for sure, and I'd be happy to be a part of that. Cheers, Ron Watson http://k9disc.blip.tv http://k9disc.com http://pawsitivevybe.com/vlog http://pawsitivevybe.com On Nov 13, 2007, at 1:42 PM, Rupert Howe wrote: Yeah, Jay, discussions are one thing, but I'm bored of watching interesting discussions turn into personal slanging matches. It poisons threads and kills discussion. I know some of us seem to like it, and some of us just can't stop watching. There's a familiar discussion on Twitter - people asking themselves why they still subscribe to this list - it's like a car wreck. That saddens me. We all get heated about issues - fine - but if people have got something negative to say about another person, about their motivations or anything that's likely to lead to a personal slanging match, perhaps they could show us the courtesy of having their open and frank discussion on a blog and linking to it here. Maybe that will make this list more 'boring' - but personally, I'm much more bored of watching people going to the toilet on each other when I want to talk about videoblogging. Yours rather po-facedly, Rupert http://twittervlog.tv/ http://feeds.feedburner.com/twittervlog/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [videoblogging] Bored
On Wed, 14 Nov 2007 12:29 pm, Ron Watson wrote: The thing is that these distribution lists, pretending to be groups, are flashes in the pan - there's no permanence. So I can write something nasty and it's gone - poof - it's the definition of FLash in the pan. Well, I can find these discussions on web archives of the list. I can even find them searching Google. Putting the content on a board or list or widget-of-the-week doesn't change human behavior ... it just changes the delivery system. -- Brian Richardson - http://whatthecast.com - http://siliconchef.com - http://dragoncontv.com - http://www.3chip.com
Re: [videoblogging] Bored
While there is no doubt that you can find them on a search engine or through searching, you have to have the right term. I recently tried to find a resolution about 'dog aggression' in a Yahoo group that one of the discdog organizations uses for rules development. Searching for 'dog aggression' left off all the posts dealing with 'aggressive dogs', which would still happen on a forum, the only difference is that the topics are threaded and usually has an organizational structure, which means it's easier to find what you are looking for. Surfing 15000 posts is not very practical. It's painful, which is why not many people do it. People come in fresh and instead of searching the archives, or after their search terms failed, they then ask a question that was answered 3 months, or a year ago. Which often incites the same hostilities that ended the thread in the past. Picking scabs and all... On the side, when I search for things in Yahoo groups when my keywords don't work, I usually try to recall the date then start surfing from there. I think that Forums are far better situated to reflect permanence than these groups, but that's just my opinion. Also, I think that there are some very different human behaviors on display in these groups vs a forum. Cheers, Ron Watson http://k9disc.blip.tv http://k9disc.com http://pawsitivevybe.com/vlog http://pawsitivevybe.com On Nov 14, 2007, at 2:16 PM, Brian Richardson - WhatTheCast? wrote: On Wed, 14 Nov 2007 12:29 pm, Ron Watson wrote: The thing is that these distribution lists, pretending to be groups, are flashes in the pan - there's no permanence. So I can write something nasty and it's gone - poof - it's the definition of FLash in the pan. Well, I can find these discussions on web archives of the list. I can even find them searching Google. Putting the content on a board or list or widget-of-the-week doesn't change human behavior ... it just changes the delivery system. -- Brian Richardson - http://whatthecast.com - http://siliconchef.com - http://dragoncontv.com - http://www.3chip.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [videoblogging] Bored
Ron Watson wrote: People come in fresh and instead of searching the archives, or after their search terms failed, they then ask a question that was answered 3 months, or a year ago. I think that Forums are far better situated to reflect permanence than these groups, but that's just my opinion. Funny how this topic keeps coming back every few months. However, while bellyaching sounds much the same year to year, videoblogging is changing so quickly that revisiting perennial topics every three months often produces a new discussion worth having.
Re: [videoblogging] Bored
Great point, Charles! Personally I think there's something special that happens in heated arguments. Experts are worth nothing if they are never challenged. Cheers, Ron Watson http://k9disc.blip.tv http://k9disc.com http://pawsitivevybe.com/vlog http://pawsitivevybe.com On Nov 14, 2007, at 4:32 PM, Charles HOPE wrote: Ron Watson wrote: People come in fresh and instead of searching the archives, or after their search terms failed, they then ask a question that was answered 3 months, or a year ago. I think that Forums are far better situated to reflect permanence than these groups, but that's just my opinion. Funny how this topic keeps coming back every few months. However, while bellyaching sounds much the same year to year, videoblogging is changing so quickly that revisiting perennial topics every three months often produces a new discussion worth having. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [videoblogging] Bored
We all get heated about issues - fine - but if people have got something negative to say about another person, about their motivations or anything that's likely to lead to a personal slanging match, perhaps they could show us the courtesy of having their open and frank discussion on a blog and linking to it here. andrew did blog it here: http://dembot.com/post/19305296 i hear you though. Substance in discussions is necessary. We are trying to help each other do better than before. after one of the blow-ups last year, I made a list last year of what I thought the Videoblogging list was for: 1. help new people to start videoblogging 2. discuss new tech and its implications 3. discuss what we need...and build it! 4. let new companies know what is expected community behavior (after we agree what it is) 5. discuss creator's rights 6. gossip and fight we are certainly a chaotic crowd and gossip and fight is just a group dynamic. doesnt mean we got to encourage or stand for itbut here we are. Jay -- http://jaydedman.com 917 371 6790 Video: http://ryanishungry.com Twitter: http://twitter.com/jaydedman Photos: http://flickr.com/photos/jaydedman/ RSS: http://tinyurl.com/yqgdt9
