Re: Vintage Mac Sound.

[Clark Martin]

>Where this becomes relevant to the list is that I'm planning on digging out
>my old PowerBook 100 and using it to generate the necessary tones and
>control the robot. I plan on hooking a cable to the audio-out jack and
>wiring this to the robot. The only problem is that the robot's control
>circuits have pretty tight tolerances on what tone quality is acceptable, so
>my question is: Just how clean a tone can the PB 100 or average Vintage
>Mac's sound system produce? For example, if I programmed the '100 to produce
>a 1500Hz tone, how likely is the result to be 1500Hz as opposed to something
>200Hz or so "around" it?

It may depend on how you generate the sound.  There is a primitive tone
generator in the hardware that may not produce sound good enough for what
you want.  But if you use the waveform synthesizer, especially at the
highest rate (22KHz for a PB100 I'd guess) you can generate a fairly high
quality sinewave depending on what the frequency is.  1KHz should be quit
good.

--
Clark Martin
Redwood City, CA, USA
Macintosh / Internet Consulting
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

"I'm a designated driver on the Information Super Highway"



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AVOID MemoryToGo

[the pickle]

They spammed me, therefore MemoryToGo.com is evil.  I strongly suggest you
all take your business elsewhere if you were considering dealing with them.

Not only did they spam me, but they did it in HTML format ...argh...

"**SPECIAL** COMPUTER MEMORY PRICES" was the subject.  If anyone else got
this to an addy that's subscribed to these lists, let me know and I'll get
a big fxckin complaint together and have them anally raped by the RBL for
scraping the lists, among other things...

Anyone who wants proof can contact me offlist.  Any legal types for
MemoryToGo can piss off and bite me.

p
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Re: A Question

[Amber Rhea]

on 8/6/01 4:16 PM, (Vintage Macs) at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> OK, I have a question. I saw this and while I recognize most of these OSes
> I see some I am unfamiliar with and my reference books do not mention them
> at all.
> 
> 
> "I came into the Apple fold running System 7. I upgraded every time
> one was offered, 7.1,7.2,7.3,7.5,7.55,7.6, 8, 8.1, 8.6. Pardon if I
> missed any. I remember 7.3 being the worst."
> 
> I don't recognize 7.2 and 7.3

I remember there being a 7.3 but I would guess that by 7.2 they mean 7.5.2,
which was a nightmare...

-- 
Amber Rhea   [EMAIL PROTECTED]

"I spent eleven long years in a hot house zone
 I spent twentynine more trying to get home
 Well I never got home, but I did what I did
 And I got myself this house and you can't come in"
  - Shawn Colvin


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Re: OT: Small monitor gloat. ;)

[the pickle]

At 10:54 + on 06/08/01, Dana Collins wrote:

>>> Mine too, works beautifully at 640X480. Freaks
>>> out at 512X384 &
>>> won't centre right at 832X624. Design flaw?
>>
>> Yup, same monitor. Its the Apple Multiple Scan 14
>> Display model M4222. Anyone have one of these working
>> right at?
>
>I recently sold one in a package deal w/a 6100av; prior to that, I had run
>it on my 7100av and (for a while) on my Quadra 605. On the 7100, I always
>ran it at the 832x624 resolution - it worked fine, looked fine (not the best

...yet another reason never to trust AppleSpec for ANY information to be
accurate.

p
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Re: A Question

[the pickle]

At 03:16 -0600 on 06/08/01, Steve Conrad wrote:

>OK, I have a question. I saw this and while I recognize most of these OSes
>I see some I am unfamiliar with and my reference books do not mention them
>at all.
>
>
>"I came into the Apple fold running System 7. I upgraded every time
>one was offered, 7.1,7.2,7.3,7.5,7.55,7.6, 8, 8.1, 8.6. Pardon if I
>missed any. I remember 7.3 being the worst."
>
>I don't recognize 7.2 and 7.3

Methinks they forgot the .1 in there.  7.1.2 and 7.1.3 were both sort-of
OSes.  7.1.2 only shipped on the first Power Macs before 7.5 came out.
7.1.3 was really 7.1 with Update 3.

p
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Re: DTMF Re: Drain Crawler

[Bob C.]

Yes, my SE using HyperCard actually dials quite reliably that way, just by
holding my phone's mouthpiece up to the speaker on the front of the Mac.
Doesn't work as well on my Plus, since the speaker is deeper, and on the
side.  :-(

Those "pocket phone dialers" were really useful!   When many pay phones
still had rotary dials, it was the only way to access Touch Tone features of
banks and information sources when you were on the road.

Incidentally, these tone dialers were listed in the Radio Shack 2000
catalog, but not the 2001 version, and yet they're still mentioned in the
on-line catalog; I don't know if they can be special-ordered.

Bob

- Original Message -
From: "Gregg Eshelman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Vintage Macs" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, August 06, 2001 1:10 PM
Subject: DTMF Re: Drain Crawler


> So you could hold a rotary phone up to your Mac
> and dial numbers with HyperCard? ;-)
>
> A little unit that was popular in the 1980's was
> a small box about 1/2 the thickenss of a pager with
> a speaker on the back and a keypad on the front.

[snip!]



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Re: A Question

[Steve Conrad]

Possibly but then one would wonder why 7.0.1, 7.1.1, 7.5.1, 7.5.2 and 7.6.1
were left out.

>> OK, I have a question. I saw this and while I recognize most of these OSes
>> I see some I am unfamiliar with and my reference books do not mention them
>> at all.
>>
>>
>> "I came into the Apple fold running System 7. I upgraded every time
>> one was offered, 7.1,7.2,7.3,7.5,7.55,7.6, 8, 8.1, 8.6. Pardon if I
>> missed any. I remember 7.3 being the worst."
>>
>> I don't recognize 7.2 and 7.3
>>
>> Thanks!
>> Steve
>Neither do I; perhaps the writer was referring to 7.1.2 and 7.5.3?
>
>Best regards,
>Dana

Steve Conrad
1818 Franklin
Lexington, MO 64067
660-259-7176 http://sasha91.0pi.com


   It is no secret (nor should it come as any surprise) that humankind's
most noble impulses often surface during the most trying of times, that
human spirit rises to the challenge when faced with adversity, that human
strength is born from human failings...Is it any wonder, then, that the
SDF-1 crew became a tighter family after the fortress had been exiled than
it had before?

 From the log of Captain (later Admiral) Henry Gloval



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VRAM

[Steve Moody]

   I have a 256K VRAM that is for an LCIII.  I don't know if it is 
good or not.  If anyone is interested in it, I'll plug it in and see 
if it works.   Pay shipping and it's yours.
-- 
---

   My email address is changed to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - please change 
your address book.

http://homepage.mac.com/stmoody/
http://www.macunlimited.com/news/articles/TechTVverifies.html

   When was the last time you remember the "Virus Of The Week" 
attacking a Macintosh?

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Re: OT: Small monitor gloat. ;)

[Gregg Eshelman]

--- Luc Verhelst <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I checked, and it is the same monitor. The
> monitors&sound control panel (OS8.1) on my 6100 only
> has one possibility : 832x624, 75Hz.
> I'm not using any special control panels or
> software, just the generic system ones.
> 
> It probably works because the computer thinks it's a
> standard VGA monitor at 832x624.

Weird. I could try swapping the multiscan to the AV
port and the old NEC MultiSynch Plus (so old not
even Griffin or NEC knows anything about it, even
has its own cooling fan) to the built in video to
see if that makes any difference. I could also plug
the multiscan into the E-Machines DoubleColor SX
or the Apple 4*8 card in the Power IIci.

I probably need to open it up, center the external
controls then see if it has controls specific to
the 832x624 mode for centering inside. Time to
dig through that Service Source CD-ROM. ;-)

=
"The earth swarms with inhabitants. Why then should nature,
which is fruitful to an excess here, be so very barren in
the rest of the planets?" Bernard de Fontenelle, 1686
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
My ICQ# 16024947

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DTMF Re: Drain Crawler

[Gregg Eshelman]

--- "Bob C." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Even the oldest version of HyperCard could produce
> valid DTMF tones.:-)

So you could hold a rotary phone up to your Mac
and dial numbers with HyperCard? ;-)

A little unit that was popular in the 1980's was
a small box about 1/2 the thickenss of a pager with
a speaker on the back and a keypad on the front.
They could store several phone numbers for autodialing
with DTMF on any phone. More expensive ones had
an LCD display and stored around 100 numbers.
They also worked for when you needed to use voice
mail or to remote control an answering machine over
a rotary or pulse tone only phone. Stripped down
versions often came with answering machines for
remote control, those were popular with hackers since
with a little work they could do the same things
as the more expensive DTMF dialers. :)

Just one of the neat gadgets killed off by the
digital PDAs and organizers.

=
"The earth swarms with inhabitants. Why then should nature,
which is fruitful to an excess here, be so very barren in
the rest of the planets?" Bernard de Fontenelle, 1686
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
My ICQ# 16024947

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Re: OT: Small monitor gloat. ;)

[Gregg Eshelman]

--- Dana Collins <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Speakers worked but of
> course were cheezy (not
> talking KRK or JBL here!).
> Best regards,
> Dana

They sound better than the mono built in speaker of
most Macs. :) 'Course most of the all in one
Performas had decent stereo speakers built in.

=
"The earth swarms with inhabitants. Why then should nature,
which is fruitful to an excess here, be so very barren in
the rest of the planets?" Bernard de Fontenelle, 1686
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
My ICQ# 16024947

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Searching the old TIL articles.

[Gregg Eshelman]

Articles prior to November 1997 can be searched
without signing in by going here.

http://karchive.info.apple.com/

I also sent them a feedback about how I dislike
their new setup, especially the signing in bit. :P

=
"The earth swarms with inhabitants. Why then should nature,
which is fruitful to an excess here, be so very barren in
the rest of the planets?" Bernard de Fontenelle, 1686
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
My ICQ# 16024947

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Re: OT: Small monitor gloat. ;)

[Dana Collins]

> From: Gregg Eshelman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Reply-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> (Vintage Macs)
> Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 21:50:55 -0700 (PDT)
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> (Vintage Macs)
> Subject: Re: OT: Small monitor gloat. ;)
> 
> --- Andrew Michael MacTao <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> 
>> Mine too, works beautifully at 640X480. Freaks
>> out at 512X384 &
>> won't centre right at 832X624. Design flaw?
> 
> Yup, same monitor. Its the Apple Multiple Scan 14
> Display model M4222. Anyone have one of these working
> right at?

I recently sold one in a package deal w/a 6100av; prior to that, I had run
it on my 7100av and (for a while) on my Quadra 605. On the 7100, I always
ran it at the 832x624 resolution - it worked fine, looked fine (not the best
but hey it wasn't a Trinitron!) never gave me troubles - the only drawback
was that "stretching" the screen display to occupy all of the visible screen
was not possible on the horizontal (vertical was more than sufficient). Even
at maximum width, there was still about 3/8" deflection on either side of
the screen to tolerate. Speakers worked but of course were cheezy (not
talking KRK or JBL here!).
Best regards,
Dana


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Re: Drain Crawler

[Bob C.]

Even the oldest version of HyperCard could produce valid DTMF tones.:-)

Bob

- Original Message - 
From: "Gregg Eshelman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Vintage Macs" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, August 06, 2001 11:15 AM
Subject: Re: Drain Crawler

> If it responds to DTMF tones there might be a DTMF
> tone generator program for Mac. There are several PC
> ones.



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Re: A Question

[Dana Collins]

> From: Steve Conrad <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Reply-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> (Vintage Macs)
> Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 03:16:56 -0600
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> (Vintage Macs)
> Subject: A Question
> 
> OK, I have a question. I saw this and while I recognize most of these OSes
> I see some I am unfamiliar with and my reference books do not mention them
> at all.
> 
> 
> "I came into the Apple fold running System 7. I upgraded every time
> one was offered, 7.1,7.2,7.3,7.5,7.55,7.6, 8, 8.1, 8.6. Pardon if I
> missed any. I remember 7.3 being the worst."
> 
> I don't recognize 7.2 and 7.3
> 
> Thanks!
> Steve
Neither do I; perhaps the writer was referring to 7.1.2 and 7.5.3?

Best regards,
Dana


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Re: Drain Crawler

[Gregg Eshelman]

--- tesla <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Adam:
> 
> I have to wonder if perhaps you could generate those
> tones with your trusty
> touchtone phone?

If it responds to DTMF tones there might be a DTMF
tone generator program for Mac. There are several PC
ones.

=
"The earth swarms with inhabitants. Why then should nature,
which is fruitful to an excess here, be so very barren in
the rest of the planets?" Bernard de Fontenelle, 1686
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
My ICQ# 16024947

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Re: OT: Small monitor gloat. ;)

[Gregg Eshelman]

--- Alex Allee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> on 8/5/01 11:55 PM, Gregg Eshelman at
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> 
> >>> Yup, same monitor. Its the Apple Multiple Scan
> 14
> >>
> >> According to both AppleSpec and the Apple Online
> >> Museum, that monitor's max
> >> resolution is 800x600.
> > 
> > Huh. Then why am I offered only 512x384, which it
> > can't synch to, 640x480, which works, and 832x624,
> > whiich it can synch to but is shifted down and to
> > the right?
> 
> Maybe the OS can't identify the monitor correctly,
> and is covering itself.
> (Like if you plug in a VGA monitor, it spews tons of
> resolutions at you)
> Are those three resolutions under Recommended or
> All? See if you can switch
> to All, 800x600 might be listed there.
> Then again, AppleSpec (how long till they ditch
> that?) lists two 800x600
> modes, both as SVGA. The only Macintosh mode is
> 640x480...

I installed the AppleVision software, which installed
Control Strip and modules for the displays. That gives
me only 640x480 and 832x624. Monitors & Sound also
shows 512x384 and only recommended, won't show All.

=
"The earth swarms with inhabitants. Why then should nature,
which is fruitful to an excess here, be so very barren in
the rest of the planets?" Bernard de Fontenelle, 1686
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
My ICQ# 16024947

__
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Drain Crawler

[tesla]

Adam:

I have to wonder if perhaps you could generate those tones with your trusty
touchtone phone?

Regards,

Gene


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Re: OT: Small monitor gloat. ;)

[Luc Verhelst]

I wrote :
> > Date: Sun, 05 Aug 2001 22:17:41 -0700
> > From: Alex Allee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > on 8/5/01 9:50 PM, Gregg Eshelman at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > > Yup, same monitor. Its the Apple Multiple Scan 14
> > > Display model M4222. Anyone have one of these working
> > > right at 832x624?
> > 
> > According to both AppleSpec and the Apple Online Museum, that 
> > monitor's max
> > resolution is 800x600.
> 
> I think I bought one at a junk market for 10 USD. I'm using it on
> my 6100 with an adapter with dip switches (DB-15 to HDI-45), and 
> it is definitely doing more than 640x480 (and doing it perfectly). 
> I'll check it tonight after work and post the exact resolution.
> No 'on the fly' switching resolutions, though, because of the 
> adapter. 

I checked, and it is the same monitor. The monitors&sound control panel (OS8.1) on my 
6100 only has one possibility : 832x624, 75Hz.
I'm not using any special control panels or software, just the generic system ones.

It probably works because the computer thinks it's a standard VGA monitor at 832x624.

If this is the solution to the problem, you could fool your computer into thinking 
this by building a DB15 to DB15 adapter, with the sense pins at the male end wired for 
the appropriate VGA monitor.
I've checked the pin codes at , but the 
only mono-sync monitor at 832x624 is a 16" one. It has pins 10 and 4 interconnected, 
and pin 7 free. 
This will prevent you to switch to other resolutions, however.
This way, you should be able to use the monitor at 832x624 on any vintage mac. (See, 
we're on topic.)

Luc
-- 



_
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Vintage Mac Sound.

[Adam]

Hi all,

THE STORY:

I recently got my hands on a decommisioned "drain crawler" which is a type
of human controlled, robotic "sled" originally designed to travel up and
down the stormwater/sewerage drainage system in search of cracks and
what-not. Thinking this would be a cool thing to mess around with, I picked
it up even though it lacks its controller unit. This isn't to much of a
problem as it receives it's control instructions through a set of audio
tones sent over a cable link, with each tone manipulating  a certain
function. In a week or so I'll be getting the chart that says what tones
operate what so that's no problem.

THE POINT:

Where this becomes relevant to the list is that I'm planning on digging out
my old PowerBook 100 and using it to generate the necessary tones and
control the robot. I plan on hooking a cable to the audio-out jack and
wiring this to the robot. The only problem is that the robot's control
circuits have pretty tight tolerances on what tone quality is acceptable, so
my question is: Just how clean a tone can the PB 100 or average Vintage
Mac's sound system produce? For example, if I programmed the '100 to produce
a 1500Hz tone, how likely is the result to be 1500Hz as opposed to something
200Hz or so "around" it?


Sorry for this rambling post, especially as it likely makes no sense but
these 5am starts at work are getting to me.

Cheers,
Adam.


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Re: OT: Small monitor gloat. ;)

[Luc Verhelst]

> Date: Sun, 05 Aug 2001 22:17:41 -0700
> From: Alex Allee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> on 8/5/01 9:50 PM, Gregg Eshelman at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> 
> >> Mine too, works beautifully at 640X480. Freaks
> >> out at 512X384 &
> >> won't centre right at 832X624. Design flaw?
> > 
> > Yup, same monitor. Its the Apple Multiple Scan 14
> > Display model M4222. Anyone have one of these working
> > right at 832x624?
> 
> According to both AppleSpec and the Apple Online Museum, that 
> monitor's max
> resolution is 800x600.

I think I bought one at a junk market for 10 USD. I'm using it on my 6100 with an 
adapter with dip switches (DB-15 to HDI-45), and it is definitely doing more than 
640x480 (and doing it perfectly). I'll check it tonight after work and post the exact 
resolution.
No 'on the fly' switching resolutions, though, because of the adapter.

Luc
-- 
Police arrested two kids yesterday, one was drinking battery acid, 
the other was eating fireworks. They charged one and let the other 
one off. T.Cooper


_
Je eigen e-mail, fax en voice mail: alles in een!
Nu bij Clickx! op http://www.clickx.be/mstation. 


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A Question

[Steve Conrad]

OK, I have a question. I saw this and while I recognize most of these OSes
I see some I am unfamiliar with and my reference books do not mention them
at all.


"I came into the Apple fold running System 7. I upgraded every time
one was offered, 7.1,7.2,7.3,7.5,7.55,7.6, 8, 8.1, 8.6. Pardon if I
missed any. I remember 7.3 being the worst."

I don't recognize 7.2 and 7.3

Thanks!
Steve

Steve Conrad
1818 Franklin
Lexington, MO 64067
660-259-7176 http://sasha91.0pi.com


   It is no secret (nor should it come as any surprise) that humankind's
most noble impulses often surface during the most trying of times, that
human spirit rises to the challenge when faced with adversity, that human
strength is born from human failings...Is it any wonder, then, that the
SDF-1 crew became a tighter family after the fortress had been exiled than
it had before?

 From the log of Captain (later Admiral) Henry Gloval



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