Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

2018-01-19 Thread Richard Turner 
That is not my experience at all.
But, if you do not care about document layout, then KNFB is faster.
With the Short Text mode, once it starts reading the page, point the camera to 
a blank spot on your desk, because the entire point of the short text mode is 
to read on the fly, so any movement that focuses on other text, or changes the 
focus on the same text, will be treated as a new scan. It isn't really designed 
for whole page scanning, that is what the document channel is for.
But, if it doesn't work for you, sticking with KNFB makes perfect sense.
Scott White, at NFB, tells me that format retention should be in an update this 
year for KNFB.
Something I've asked for since it was released.
Here's hoping it finally happens.
Richard



(Sent from the iPod Touch 6)

On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:24 PM, kelby carlson 
mailto:kelbycarl...@gmail.com>> wrote:

So, I'm now working in a court and have to deal with lots of paper documents. 
So I am using OCR much more. This has given me the chance to really compare 
KNFB Reader (which I honestly hadn't used much even though I bought it) and 
Seeing AI.

My conclusion: KNFB still beats Seeing AI for scanning print documents by a 
country mile.

Take what is called a "face sheet" for a docket, which contains all the basic 
information about a case. When trying to do the document channel with Seeing 
AI, it would continually tellm me that one or more edges was not visible no 
matter how much I adjusted the phone. When I raised the phone really high and 
got a "hold steady" it would take a picture but not recognize a bit of text.

With KNFB: I center the camera, lift it up, take a couple field of views to 
orient, take a picture and it reads the sheet almost immediately, with very few 
flaws at all.

In each case I'm using the same camera and positioning it in the same way. I 
can only conclude, then, that it is a difference in the apps.

Seeing AI's short text feature in this case actually worked better than the 
document channel, for some reason, but typically still gives garbled text ap 
some points and will also stop if you move the camera even a milimeter.

So, I think with a few exceptions I'll be sticking with KNFB Reader.




Sent from my iPhone

--
The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:  
mk...@ucla.edu.  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can 
reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=FsImJusuIxNPuxcuzAfHqMnttymG1HeiWAc2hKKrEZY%3D&reserved=0
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"VIPhone" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to 
viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to 
viphone@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at 
https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fgroup%2Fviphone&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=oowIdv0hfUDrFGv2rcQhp2c8Ey2Q49ABnu1aF%2BoUTAs%3D&reserved=0.
For more options, visit 
https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fd%2Foptout&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=7Wrif9kosFpnFfQmbDFY46%2BZQm5DQsAF%2FuPRbfd1iXg%3D&reserved=0.

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:  
mk...@ucla.edu.  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/viphone@googlegroups.com/
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"VIPhone" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to viphone@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/viphone.
For more options, vi

Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

2018-01-19 Thread K. Scott Carlson 
Do you know to what degree things like coloring, greyscale, boxes and
odd fonts can affect Seeing AI's processing of documents? I suspect
with the docket sheets I just described, Seeing AI might be having
problems for that reason. like you, i've had pretty good luck with
Seeing AI when scanning normal documents, but not so much stuff like
this.

On 1/19/18, Richard Turner  wrote:
> That is not my experience at all.
> But, if you do not care about document layout, then KNFB is faster.
> With the Short Text mode, once it starts reading the page, point the camera
> to a blank spot on your desk, because the entire point of the short text
> mode is to read on the fly, so any movement that focuses on other text, or
> changes the focus on the same text, will be treated as a new scan. It isn't
> really designed for whole page scanning, that is what the document channel
> is for.
> But, if it doesn't work for you, sticking with KNFB makes perfect sense.
> Scott White, at NFB, tells me that format retention should be in an update
> this year for KNFB.
> Something I've asked for since it was released.
> Here's hoping it finally happens.
> Richard
>
>
>
> (Sent from the iPod Touch 6)
>
> On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:24 PM, kelby carlson
> mailto:kelbycarl...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> So, I'm now working in a court and have to deal with lots of paper
> documents. So I am using OCR much more. This has given me the chance to
> really compare KNFB Reader (which I honestly hadn't used much even though I
> bought it) and Seeing AI.
>
> My conclusion: KNFB still beats Seeing AI for scanning print documents by a
> country mile.
>
> Take what is called a "face sheet" for a docket, which contains all the
> basic information about a case. When trying to do the document channel with
> Seeing AI, it would continually tellm me that one or more edges was not
> visible no matter how much I adjusted the phone. When I raised the phone
> really high and got a "hold steady" it would take a picture but not
> recognize a bit of text.
>
> With KNFB: I center the camera, lift it up, take a couple field of views to
> orient, take a picture and it reads the sheet almost immediately, with very
> few flaws at all.
>
> In each case I'm using the same camera and positioning it in the same way. I
> can only conclude, then, that it is a difference in the apps.
>
> Seeing AI's short text feature in this case actually worked better than the
> document channel, for some reason, but typically still gives garbled text ap
> some points and will also stop if you move the camera even a milimeter.
>
> So, I think with a few exceptions I'll be sticking with KNFB Reader.
>
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> --
> The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone
> list.
>
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>
> Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:
> mk...@ucla.edu.  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you
> can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=FsImJusuIxNPuxcuzAfHqMnttymG1HeiWAc2hKKrEZY%3D&reserved=0
> ---
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "VIPhone" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to
> viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to
> viphone@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at
> https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fgroup%2Fviphone&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=oowIdv0hfUDrFGv2rcQhp2c8Ey2Q49ABnu1aF%2BoUTAs%3D&reserved=0.
> For more options, visit
> https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fd%2Foptout&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=7Wrif9kosFpnFfQmbDFY46%2BZQm5DQsAF%2FuPRbfd1iXg%3D&reserved=0.
>
> --
> The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone
> list.
>
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>
> Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:
> mk...@ucla.edu.  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - yo

RE: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

2018-01-19 Thread Cristóbal 
Can’t remember the last time I used KNFBReader on my phone. Immediacy of 
scanning results is what makes me partial to SeeingAI hands down at this point. 
Even if scanning results were marginally better in KNFBReader, the fact that 
you can get feedback almost instantaneously in SeeingAI 

Would for me anyway outweigh the difference in OCR results. That and the added 
channels too. KNFBReader’s got some major catching up to do.

 

 

From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
Richard Turner
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2018 12:58 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

 

That is not my experience at all. 

But, if you do not care about document layout, then KNFB is faster.

With the Short Text mode, once it starts reading the page, point the camera to 
a blank spot on your desk, because the entire point of the short text mode is 
to read on the fly, so any movement that focuses on other text, or changes the 
focus on the same text, will be treated as a new scan. It isn't really designed 
for whole page scanning, that is what the document channel is for.

But, if it doesn't work for you, sticking with KNFB makes perfect sense.

Scott White, at NFB, tells me that format retention should be in an update this 
year for KNFB.

Something I've asked for since it was released.

Here's hoping it finally happens.

Richard

 





(Sent from the iPod Touch 6)


On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:24 PM, kelby carlson mailto:kelbycarl...@gmail.com> > wrote:

So, I'm now working in a court and have to deal with lots of paper documents. 
So I am using OCR much more. This has given me the chance to really compare 
KNFB Reader (which I honestly hadn't used much even though I bought it) and 
Seeing AI.

My conclusion: KNFB still beats Seeing AI for scanning print documents by a 
country mile.

Take what is called a "face sheet" for a docket, which contains all the basic 
information about a case. When trying to do the document channel with Seeing 
AI, it would continually tellm me that one or more edges was not visible no 
matter how much I adjusted the phone. When I raised the phone really high and 
got a "hold steady" it would take a picture but not recognize a bit of text.

With KNFB: I center the camera, lift it up, take a couple field of views to 
orient, take a picture and it reads the sheet almost immediately, with very few 
flaws at all.

In each case I'm using the same camera and positioning it in the same way. I 
can only conclude, then, that it is a difference in the apps.

Seeing AI's short text feature in this case actually worked better than the 
document channel, for some reason, but typically still gives garbled text ap 
some points and will also stop if you move the camera even a milimeter.

So, I think with a few exceptions I'll be sticking with KNFB Reader.




Sent from my iPhone

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:  
mk...@ucla.edu <mailto:mk...@ucla.edu> .  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com <mailto:caraqu...@caraquinn.com> 

The archives for this list can be searched at:
https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2F
 
<https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=FsImJusuIxNPuxcuzAfHqMnttymG1HeiWAc2hKKrEZY%3D&reserved=0>
 
&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=FsImJusuIxNPuxcuzAfHqMnttymG1HeiWAc2hKKrEZY%3D&reserved=0
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"VIPhone" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com 
<mailto:viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com> .
To post to this group, send email to viphone@googlegroups.com 
<mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com> .
Visit this group at 
https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fgroup%2Fviphone
 
<https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fgroup%2Fviphone&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=oowIdv0hfUDrFGv2rcQhp2c8Ey2Q49ABn

Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

2018-01-19 Thread Richard Turner 
I do not know if that has an impact on Seeing AI.  It might since it is 
attempting to retain the format.
I’d suggest writing seein...@microsoft.com<mailto:seein...@microsoft.com> and 
asking them that very question.
This is just the kind of thing that they could then add to its capability 
perhaps.

Later,
Richard



(Sent from the iPod Touch 6)

On Jan 19, 2018, at 1:19 PM, Cristóbal 
mailto:crismuno...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Can’t remember the last time I used KNFBReader on my phone. Immediacy of 
scanning results is what makes me partial to SeeingAI hands down at this point. 
Even if scanning results were marginally better in KNFBReader, the fact that 
you can get feedback almost instantaneously in SeeingAI
Would for me anyway outweigh the difference in OCR results. That and the added 
channels too. KNFBReader’s got some major catching up to do.


From: viphone@googlegroups.com<mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com> 
[mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Richard Turner
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2018 12:58 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com<mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

That is not my experience at all.
But, if you do not care about document layout, then KNFB is faster.
With the Short Text mode, once it starts reading the page, point the camera to 
a blank spot on your desk, because the entire point of the short text mode is 
to read on the fly, so any movement that focuses on other text, or changes the 
focus on the same text, will be treated as a new scan. It isn't really designed 
for whole page scanning, that is what the document channel is for.
But, if it doesn't work for you, sticking with KNFB makes perfect sense.
Scott White, at NFB, tells me that format retention should be in an update this 
year for KNFB.
Something I've asked for since it was released.
Here's hoping it finally happens.
Richard



(Sent from the iPod Touch 6)

On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:24 PM, kelby carlson 
mailto:kelbycarl...@gmail.com>> wrote:
So, I'm now working in a court and have to deal with lots of paper documents. 
So I am using OCR much more. This has given me the chance to really compare 
KNFB Reader (which I honestly hadn't used much even though I bought it) and 
Seeing AI.

My conclusion: KNFB still beats Seeing AI for scanning print documents by a 
country mile.

Take what is called a "face sheet" for a docket, which contains all the basic 
information about a case. When trying to do the document channel with Seeing 
AI, it would continually tellm me that one or more edges was not visible no 
matter how much I adjusted the phone. When I raised the phone really high and 
got a "hold steady" it would take a picture but not recognize a bit of text.

With KNFB: I center the camera, lift it up, take a couple field of views to 
orient, take a picture and it reads the sheet almost immediately, with very few 
flaws at all.

In each case I'm using the same camera and positioning it in the same way. I 
can only conclude, then, that it is a difference in the apps.

Seeing AI's short text feature in this case actually worked better than the 
document channel, for some reason, but typically still gives garbled text ap 
some points and will also stop if you move the camera even a milimeter.

So, I think with a few exceptions I'll be sticking with KNFB Reader.




Sent from my iPhone

--
The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:  
mk...@ucla.edu<mailto:mk...@ucla.edu>.  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can 
reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com<mailto:caraqu...@caraquinn.com>

The archives for this list can be searched at:
https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=FsImJusuIxNPuxcuzAfHqMnttymG1HeiWAc2hKKrEZY%3D&reserved=0
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"VIPhone" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to 
viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com<mailto:viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>.
To post to this group, send email to 
viphone@googlegroups.com<mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com>.
Visit this group at 
https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fgroup%2Fviphone&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=oowIdv0hfUDrFGv

Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

2018-01-19 Thread kelby carlson 
Is it necessary to hold the phone still while the image is processing?

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 19, 2018, at 4:26 PM, Richard Turner  
> wrote:
> 
> I do not know if that has an impact on Seeing AI.  It might since it is 
> attempting to retain the format.
> I’d suggest writing seein...@microsoft.com and asking them that very question.
> This is just the kind of thing that they could then add to its capability 
> perhaps.
> 
> Later,
> Richard
> 
> 
> 
> (Sent from the iPod Touch 6)
> 
> On Jan 19, 2018, at 1:19 PM, Cristóbal  wrote:
> 
>> Can’t remember the last time I used KNFBReader on my phone. Immediacy of 
>> scanning results is what makes me partial to SeeingAI hands down at this 
>> point. Even if scanning results were marginally better in KNFBReader, the 
>> fact that you can get feedback almost instantaneously in SeeingAI
>> Would for me anyway outweigh the difference in OCR results. That and the 
>> added channels too. KNFBReader’s got some major catching up to do.
>>  
>>  
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf 
>> Of Richard Turner
>> Sent: Friday, January 19, 2018 12:58 PM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI
>>  
>> That is not my experience at all.
>> But, if you do not care about document layout, then KNFB is faster.
>> With the Short Text mode, once it starts reading the page, point the camera 
>> to a blank spot on your desk, because the entire point of the short text 
>> mode is to read on the fly, so any movement that focuses on other text, or 
>> changes the focus on the same text, will be treated as a new scan. It isn't 
>> really designed for whole page scanning, that is what the document channel 
>> is for.
>> But, if it doesn't work for you, sticking with KNFB makes perfect sense.
>> Scott White, at NFB, tells me that format retention should be in an update 
>> this year for KNFB.
>> Something I've asked for since it was released.
>> Here's hoping it finally happens.
>> Richard
>>  
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> (Sent from the iPod Touch 6)
>> 
>> On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:24 PM, kelby carlson  wrote:
>> 
>> So, I'm now working in a court and have to deal with lots of paper 
>> documents. So I am using OCR much more. This has given me the chance to 
>> really compare KNFB Reader (which I honestly hadn't used much even though I 
>> bought it) and Seeing AI.
>> 
>> My conclusion: KNFB still beats Seeing AI for scanning print documents by a 
>> country mile.
>> 
>> Take what is called a "face sheet" for a docket, which contains all the 
>> basic information about a case. When trying to do the document channel with 
>> Seeing AI, it would continually tellm me that one or more edges was not 
>> visible no matter how much I adjusted the phone. When I raised the phone 
>> really high and got a "hold steady" it would take a picture but not 
>> recognize a bit of text.
>> 
>> With KNFB: I center the camera, lift it up, take a couple field of views to 
>> orient, take a picture and it reads the sheet almost immediately, with very 
>> few flaws at all.
>> 
>> In each case I'm using the same camera and positioning it in the same way. I 
>> can only conclude, then, that it is a difference in the apps.
>> 
>> Seeing AI's short text feature in this case actually worked better than the 
>> document channel, for some reason, but typically still gives garbled text ap 
>> some points and will also stop if you move the camera even a milimeter.
>> 
>> So, I think with a few exceptions I'll be sticking with KNFB Reader.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:  
>> mk...@ucla.edu.  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
>> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823

Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

2018-01-19 Thread Richard Turner 
No, once the picture is taken, you can set the phone down.
Richard



(Sent from the iPod Touch 6)

On Jan 19, 2018, at 4:24 PM, kelby carlson 
mailto:kelbycarl...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Is it necessary to hold the phone still while the image is processing?

Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 19, 2018, at 4:26 PM, Richard Turner 
mailto:richardturne...@outlook.com>> wrote:

I do not know if that has an impact on Seeing AI.  It might since it is 
attempting to retain the format.
I’d suggest writing seein...@microsoft.com<mailto:seein...@microsoft.com> and 
asking them that very question.
This is just the kind of thing that they could then add to its capability 
perhaps.

Later,
Richard



(Sent from the iPod Touch 6)

On Jan 19, 2018, at 1:19 PM, Cristóbal 
mailto:crismuno...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Can’t remember the last time I used KNFBReader on my phone. Immediacy of 
scanning results is what makes me partial to SeeingAI hands down at this point. 
Even if scanning results were marginally better in KNFBReader, the fact that 
you can get feedback almost instantaneously in SeeingAI
Would for me anyway outweigh the difference in OCR results. That and the added 
channels too. KNFBReader’s got some major catching up to do.


From: viphone@googlegroups.com<mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com> 
[mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Richard Turner
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2018 12:58 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com<mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

That is not my experience at all.
But, if you do not care about document layout, then KNFB is faster.
With the Short Text mode, once it starts reading the page, point the camera to 
a blank spot on your desk, because the entire point of the short text mode is 
to read on the fly, so any movement that focuses on other text, or changes the 
focus on the same text, will be treated as a new scan. It isn't really designed 
for whole page scanning, that is what the document channel is for.
But, if it doesn't work for you, sticking with KNFB makes perfect sense.
Scott White, at NFB, tells me that format retention should be in an update this 
year for KNFB.
Something I've asked for since it was released.
Here's hoping it finally happens.
Richard



(Sent from the iPod Touch 6)

On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:24 PM, kelby carlson 
mailto:kelbycarl...@gmail.com>> wrote:
So, I'm now working in a court and have to deal with lots of paper documents. 
So I am using OCR much more. This has given me the chance to really compare 
KNFB Reader (which I honestly hadn't used much even though I bought it) and 
Seeing AI.

My conclusion: KNFB still beats Seeing AI for scanning print documents by a 
country mile.

Take what is called a "face sheet" for a docket, which contains all the basic 
information about a case. When trying to do the document channel with Seeing 
AI, it would continually tellm me that one or more edges was not visible no 
matter how much I adjusted the phone. When I raised the phone really high and 
got a "hold steady" it would take a picture but not recognize a bit of text.

With KNFB: I center the camera, lift it up, take a couple field of views to 
orient, take a picture and it reads the sheet almost immediately, with very few 
flaws at all.

In each case I'm using the same camera and positioning it in the same way. I 
can only conclude, then, that it is a difference in the apps.

Seeing AI's short text feature in this case actually worked better than the 
document channel, for some reason, but typically still gives garbled text ap 
some points and will also stop if you move the camera even a milimeter.

So, I think with a few exceptions I'll be sticking with KNFB Reader.




Sent from my iPhone

--
The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:  
mk...@ucla.edu<mailto:mk...@ucla.edu>.  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can 
reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com<mailto:caraqu...@caraquinn.com>

The archives for this list can be searched at:
https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=FsImJusuIxNPuxcuzAfHqMnttymG1HeiWAc2hKKrEZY%3D&reserved=0
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"VIPhone" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to 
viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com<mailto:viphone+unsubscr...@g

RE: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

2018-01-19 Thread Sieghard Weitzel 
Would be nice if KNFB would also include an instant mode where it reads what 
the camera sees without having to interact with the phone.
I also find that in many situations the short text channel in the Seeing AI app 
does all the OCR I need.

From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
Richard Turner
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2018 12:58 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

That is not my experience at all.
But, if you do not care about document layout, then KNFB is faster.
With the Short Text mode, once it starts reading the page, point the camera to 
a blank spot on your desk, because the entire point of the short text mode is 
to read on the fly, so any movement that focuses on other text, or changes the 
focus on the same text, will be treated as a new scan. It isn't really designed 
for whole page scanning, that is what the document channel is for.
But, if it doesn't work for you, sticking with KNFB makes perfect sense.
Scott White, at NFB, tells me that format retention should be in an update this 
year for KNFB.
Something I've asked for since it was released.
Here's hoping it finally happens.
Richard



(Sent from the iPod Touch 6)

On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:24 PM, kelby carlson 
mailto:kelbycarl...@gmail.com>> wrote:
So, I'm now working in a court and have to deal with lots of paper documents. 
So I am using OCR much more. This has given me the chance to really compare 
KNFB Reader (which I honestly hadn't used much even though I bought it) and 
Seeing AI.

My conclusion: KNFB still beats Seeing AI for scanning print documents by a 
country mile.

Take what is called a "face sheet" for a docket, which contains all the basic 
information about a case. When trying to do the document channel with Seeing 
AI, it would continually tellm me that one or more edges was not visible no 
matter how much I adjusted the phone. When I raised the phone really high and 
got a "hold steady" it would take a picture but not recognize a bit of text.

With KNFB: I center the camera, lift it up, take a couple field of views to 
orient, take a picture and it reads the sheet almost immediately, with very few 
flaws at all.

In each case I'm using the same camera and positioning it in the same way. I 
can only conclude, then, that it is a difference in the apps.

Seeing AI's short text feature in this case actually worked better than the 
document channel, for some reason, but typically still gives garbled text ap 
some points and will also stop if you move the camera even a milimeter.

So, I think with a few exceptions I'll be sticking with KNFB Reader.




Sent from my iPhone

--
The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:  
mk...@ucla.edu<mailto:mk...@ucla.edu>.  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can 
reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com<mailto:caraqu...@caraquinn.com>

The archives for this list can be searched at:
https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=FsImJusuIxNPuxcuzAfHqMnttymG1HeiWAc2hKKrEZY%3D&reserved=0
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"VIPhone" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to 
viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com<mailto:viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>.
To post to this group, send email to 
viphone@googlegroups.com<mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com>.
Visit this group at 
https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fgroup%2Fviphone&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=oowIdv0hfUDrFGv2rcQhp2c8Ey2Q49ABnu1aF%2BoUTAs%3D&reserved=0.
For more options, visit 
https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fd%2Foptout&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=7Wrif9kosFpnFfQmbDFY46%2BZQm5DQsAF%2FuPRbfd1iXg%3D&reserved=0.
--
The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark

RE: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

2018-01-19 Thread ajvece 
That Seeing AI app really amazes me!

 

 

From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
Sieghard Weitzel
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2018 8:23 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

 

Would be nice if KNFB would also include an instant mode where it reads what 
the camera sees without having to interact with the phone.

I also find that in many situations the short text channel in the Seeing AI app 
does all the OCR I need.

 

From: viphone@googlegroups.com <mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com>  
[mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Richard Turner
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2018 12:58 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com <mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com> 
Subject: Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

 

That is not my experience at all. 

But, if you do not care about document layout, then KNFB is faster.

With the Short Text mode, once it starts reading the page, point the camera to 
a blank spot on your desk, because the entire point of the short text mode is 
to read on the fly, so any movement that focuses on other text, or changes the 
focus on the same text, will be treated as a new scan. It isn't really designed 
for whole page scanning, that is what the document channel is for.

But, if it doesn't work for you, sticking with KNFB makes perfect sense.

Scott White, at NFB, tells me that format retention should be in an update this 
year for KNFB.

Something I've asked for since it was released.

Here's hoping it finally happens.

Richard

 

 

(Sent from the iPod Touch 6)


On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:24 PM, kelby carlson mailto:kelbycarl...@gmail.com> > wrote:

So, I'm now working in a court and have to deal with lots of paper documents. 
So I am using OCR much more. This has given me the chance to really compare 
KNFB Reader (which I honestly hadn't used much even though I bought it) and 
Seeing AI.

My conclusion: KNFB still beats Seeing AI for scanning print documents by a 
country mile.

Take what is called a "face sheet" for a docket, which contains all the basic 
information about a case. When trying to do the document channel with Seeing 
AI, it would continually tellm me that one or more edges was not visible no 
matter how much I adjusted the phone. When I raised the phone really high and 
got a "hold steady" it would take a picture but not recognize a bit of text.

With KNFB: I center the camera, lift it up, take a couple field of views to 
orient, take a picture and it reads the sheet almost immediately, with very few 
flaws at all.

In each case I'm using the same camera and positioning it in the same way. I 
can only conclude, then, that it is a difference in the apps.

Seeing AI's short text feature in this case actually worked better than the 
document channel, for some reason, but typically still gives garbled text ap 
some points and will also stop if you move the camera even a milimeter.

So, I think with a few exceptions I'll be sticking with KNFB Reader.




Sent from my iPhone

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:  
mk...@ucla.edu <mailto:mk...@ucla.edu> .  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you 
can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com <mailto:caraqu...@caraquinn.com> 

The archives for this list can be searched at:
https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2F
 
<https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=FsImJusuIxNPuxcuzAfHqMnttymG1HeiWAc2hKKrEZY%3D&reserved=0>
 
&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=FsImJusuIxNPuxcuzAfHqMnttymG1HeiWAc2hKKrEZY%3D&reserved=0
--- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"VIPhone" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com 
<mailto:viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com> .
To post to this group, send email to viphone@googlegroups.com 
<mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com> .
Visit this group at 
https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fgroup%2Fviphone
 
<https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fgroup%2Fviphone&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d

Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

2018-01-20 Thread englishrider91 
I've not had much luck with Seeing AI's document channel, either. Strange. I'm 
getting a bit better at getting the hold steady announcement a little faster--I 
guess all that practice with KNFB was helpful--but once the pic is processed by 
Seeing AI, 99% of the time, I get a message about there being no text. It's 
super frustrating. And since I'm pretty sure Seeing AI's default is to control 
the flash automatically, and since I do get results on the same text using the 
short text channel, I have no idea why this is happening.


Thanks,
Ari

> On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:57 PM, Richard Turner  
> wrote:
> 
> That is not my experience at all.
> But, if you do not care about document layout, then KNFB is faster.
> With the Short Text mode, once it starts reading the page, point the camera 
> to a blank spot on your desk, because the entire point of the short text mode 
> is to read on the fly, so any movement that focuses on other text, or changes 
> the focus on the same text, will be treated as a new scan. It isn't really 
> designed for whole page scanning, that is what the document channel is for.
> But, if it doesn't work for you, sticking with KNFB makes perfect sense.
> Scott White, at NFB, tells me that format retention should be in an update 
> this year for KNFB.
> Something I've asked for since it was released.
> Here's hoping it finally happens.
> Richard
> 
> 
> 
> (Sent from the iPod Touch 6)
> 
> On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:24 PM, kelby carlson  wrote:
> 
>> So, I'm now working in a court and have to deal with lots of paper 
>> documents. So I am using OCR much more. This has given me the chance to 
>> really compare KNFB Reader (which I honestly hadn't used much even though I 
>> bought it) and Seeing AI.
>> 
>> My conclusion: KNFB still beats Seeing AI for scanning print documents by a 
>> country mile.
>> 
>> Take what is called a "face sheet" for a docket, which contains all the 
>> basic information about a case. When trying to do the document channel with 
>> Seeing AI, it would continually tellm me that one or more edges was not 
>> visible no matter how much I adjusted the phone. When I raised the phone 
>> really high and got a "hold steady" it would take a picture but not 
>> recognize a bit of text.
>> 
>> With KNFB: I center the camera, lift it up, take a couple field of views to 
>> orient, take a picture and it reads the sheet almost immediately, with very 
>> few flaws at all.
>> 
>> In each case I'm using the same camera and positioning it in the same way. I 
>> can only conclude, then, that it is a difference in the apps.
>> 
>> Seeing AI's short text feature in this case actually worked better than the 
>> document channel, for some reason, but typically still gives garbled text ap 
>> some points and will also stop if you move the camera even a milimeter.
>> 
>> So, I think with a few exceptions I'll be sticking with KNFB Reader.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:  
>> mk...@ucla.edu.  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
>> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=FsImJusuIxNPuxcuzAfHqMnttymG1HeiWAc2hKKrEZY%3D&reserved=0
>> --- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "VIPhone" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> To post to this group, send email to viphone@googlegroups.com.
>> Visit this group at 
>> https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fgroup%2Fviphone&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=oowIdv0hfUDrFGv2rcQhp2c8Ey2Q49ABnu1aF%2BoUTAs%3D&reserved=0.
>> For more options, visit 
>> https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fd%2Foptout&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=7Wrif9kosFpnFfQmbDFY46%2BZQm5DQsAF%2FuPRbfd1iXg%3D&reserved=0.
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list.
>  
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly ra

Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

2018-01-20 Thread Nancy Badger 
The only reason I use kNFB FB reader now is  is when I want to have more than 
one page in a single document. I don’t think seeing AI does that yet.

Nancy Badger, Ph.D
Executive Director of Counseling
Old Dominion University
Sent from my iPhone with dictation software. Please excuse spelling errors.

> On Jan 20, 2018, at 2:21 PM, englishride...@gmail.com wrote:
> 
> I've not had much luck with Seeing AI's document channel, either. Strange. 
> I'm getting a bit better at getting the hold steady announcement a little 
> faster--I guess all that practice with KNFB was helpful--but once the pic is 
> processed by Seeing AI, 99% of the time, I get a message about there being no 
> text. It's super frustrating. And since I'm pretty sure Seeing AI's default 
> is to control the flash automatically, and since I do get results on the same 
> text using the short text channel, I have no idea why this is happening.
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> Ari
> 
>> On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:57 PM, Richard Turner  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> That is not my experience at all. 
>> But, if you do not care about document layout, then KNFB is faster.
>> With the Short Text mode, once it starts reading the page, point the camera 
>> to a blank spot on your desk, because the entire point of the short text 
>> mode is to read on the fly, so any movement that focuses on other text, or 
>> changes the focus on the same text, will be treated as a new scan. It isn't 
>> really designed for whole page scanning, that is what the document channel 
>> is for.
>> But, if it doesn't work for you, sticking with KNFB makes perfect sense.
>> Scott White, at NFB, tells me that format retention should be in an update 
>> this year for KNFB.
>> Something I've asked for since it was released.
>> Here's hoping it finally happens.
>> Richard
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> (Sent from the iPod Touch 6)
>> 
>> On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:24 PM, kelby carlson  wrote:
>> 
>>> So, I'm now working in a court and have to deal with lots of paper 
>>> documents. So I am using OCR much more. This has given me the chance to 
>>> really compare KNFB Reader (which I honestly hadn't used much even though I 
>>> bought it) and Seeing AI.
>>> 
>>> My conclusion: KNFB still beats Seeing AI for scanning print documents by a 
>>> country mile.
>>> 
>>> Take what is called a "face sheet" for a docket, which contains all the 
>>> basic information about a case. When trying to do the document channel with 
>>> Seeing AI, it would continually tellm me that one or more edges was not 
>>> visible no matter how much I adjusted the phone. When I raised the phone 
>>> really high and got a "hold steady" it would take a picture but not 
>>> recognize a bit of text.
>>> 
>>> With KNFB: I center the camera, lift it up, take a couple field of views to 
>>> orient, take a picture and it reads the sheet almost immediately, with very 
>>> few flaws at all.
>>> 
>>> In each case I'm using the same camera and positioning it in the same way. 
>>> I can only conclude, then, that it is a difference in the apps.
>>> 
>>> Seeing AI's short text feature in this case actually worked better than the 
>>> document channel, for some reason, but typically still gives garbled text 
>>> ap some points and will also stop if you move the camera even a milimeter.
>>> 
>>> So, I think with a few exceptions I'll be sticking with KNFB Reader.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list.
>>> 
>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners 
>>> or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>> 
>>> Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:  
>>> mk...@ucla.edu.  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
>>> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>>> 
>>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>>> https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=FsImJusuIxNPuxcuzAfHqMnttymG1HeiWAc2hKKrEZY%3D&reserved=0
>>> --- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>> "VIPhone" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>>> email to viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To post to this group, send email to viphone@googlegroups.com.
>>> Visit this group at 
>>> https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fgroup%2Fviphone&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=oowIdv0hfUDrFGv2rcQhp2c8Ey2Q49ABnu1aF%2BoUTAs%3D&reserved=0.
>>> For more options, visit 
>>> https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google

Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

2018-01-20 Thread kelby carlson 
That is the precise experience I have. I today used it on some other documents 
besides the court ones I described, with the same result; KNFB Reader gave much 
better quality and was much easier to get the document in view of the camera.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 20, 2018, at 4:09 PM, Nancy Badger  wrote:
> 
> The only reason I use kNFB FB reader now is  is when I want to have more than 
> one page in a single document. I don’t think seeing AI does that yet.
> 
> Nancy Badger, Ph.D
> Executive Director of Counseling
> Old Dominion University
> Sent from my iPhone with dictation software. Please excuse spelling errors.
> 
>> On Jan 20, 2018, at 2:21 PM, englishride...@gmail.com wrote:
>> 
>> I've not had much luck with Seeing AI's document channel, either. Strange. 
>> I'm getting a bit better at getting the hold steady announcement a little 
>> faster--I guess all that practice with KNFB was helpful--but once the pic is 
>> processed by Seeing AI, 99% of the time, I get a message about there being 
>> no text. It's super frustrating. And since I'm pretty sure Seeing AI's 
>> default is to control the flash automatically, and since I do get results on 
>> the same text using the short text channel, I have no idea why this is 
>> happening.
>> 
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> Ari
>> 
>>> On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:57 PM, Richard Turner  
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> That is not my experience at all.
>>> But, if you do not care about document layout, then KNFB is faster.
>>> With the Short Text mode, once it starts reading the page, point the camera 
>>> to a blank spot on your desk, because the entire point of the short text 
>>> mode is to read on the fly, so any movement that focuses on other text, or 
>>> changes the focus on the same text, will be treated as a new scan. It isn't 
>>> really designed for whole page scanning, that is what the document channel 
>>> is for.
>>> But, if it doesn't work for you, sticking with KNFB makes perfect sense.
>>> Scott White, at NFB, tells me that format retention should be in an update 
>>> this year for KNFB.
>>> Something I've asked for since it was released.
>>> Here's hoping it finally happens.
>>> Richard
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> (Sent from the iPod Touch 6)
>>> 
>>> On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:24 PM, kelby carlson  wrote:
>>> 
 So, I'm now working in a court and have to deal with lots of paper 
 documents. So I am using OCR much more. This has given me the chance to 
 really compare KNFB Reader (which I honestly hadn't used much even though 
 I bought it) and Seeing AI.
 
 My conclusion: KNFB still beats Seeing AI for scanning print documents by 
 a country mile.
 
 Take what is called a "face sheet" for a docket, which contains all the 
 basic information about a case. When trying to do the document channel 
 with Seeing AI, it would continually tellm me that one or more edges was 
 not visible no matter how much I adjusted the phone. When I raised the 
 phone really high and got a "hold steady" it would take a picture but not 
 recognize a bit of text.
 
 With KNFB: I center the camera, lift it up, take a couple field of views 
 to orient, take a picture and it reads the sheet almost immediately, with 
 very few flaws at all.
 
 In each case I'm using the same camera and positioning it in the same way. 
 I can only conclude, then, that it is a difference in the apps.
 
 Seeing AI's short text feature in this case actually worked better than 
 the document channel, for some reason, but typically still gives garbled 
 text ap some points and will also stop if you move the camera even a 
 milimeter.
 
 So, I think with a few exceptions I'll be sticking with KNFB Reader.
 
 
 
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 -- 
 The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone 
 list.
 
 If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or 
 if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the 
 owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
 
 Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:  
 mk...@ucla.edu.  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
 caraqu...@caraquinn.com
 
 The archives for this list can be searched at:
 https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cb3aecfc5aaba4fbe477808d55f7aaba9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636519902823758093&sdata=FsImJusuIxNPuxcuzAfHqMnttymG1HeiWAc2hKKrEZY%3D&reserved=0
 --- 
 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
 "VIPhone" group.
 To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
 email to viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
 To post to this group, send email to viphone@google

RE: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

2018-01-20 Thread Richard Turner 
Below is a scan of the back cover of a paperback first done with Seeing AI.  
Following that, is the same back cover done with KNFB Reader.  Sitting at my 
desk using my iPhone SE.

Back cover with Seeing AI:

and Heroism!

ARE YOU READY?

iant earthquakes and tsunamis devastate western Oregon every 300 to 600 years. 
The last one hit in 1700, so we're due anytime. This informative, entertaining
book tells the stories of Oregon's past floods, fires, and eruptions. Then it 
investigates the cycles behind our natural disasters and takes a look at
what may happen when the next "Big One" strikes.

Also by WILLIAM L. SULLIVAN

Oregon Inrs& I rails - Cabm Fever - l_ustenmg for Covote

The 100 lltkes" sent•sfor Oregon • A Peeper J Vilå

History - [rplonng Oregon' Wild Areas - 17K Case of[msfem's Vtoltn

Navillus Press

1958 Onvx Street

Eugene, OR 97403 aww.oregonhiking.com

ISBN 0-9815701-0-0 S18.95


Now the same back cover done with KNFB Reader:

FfJt ^ ^^^ and Heroism • , • ^ ? ARE YOU READY? Giant edrthquakcs iin -1 
tsunamis (.lcviist^tc western Oregon every 300 to 600 years. The last one hit 
in 1700, so we're due anytime. Tliis infonritttivc, enterLuning Ixiok tells the 
stories of Oregon's past floods, fires, anJ eruptions. Then it iiivcsti^tcs the 
cycles behind our natural dis^stei-s tUtd ttikes a look At what nuy happen 
wlicn tltc next "Big One'' strikes. I hkiH^ Or^^n's. ii^t^ty l' ^! ^nn^0fv^m^ 
ilti Arc^ " Tfy C ^ tfr:n (n t h') n Also by WILLIAM L. SULLIVAN Vh' "1W Hike^' 
f;i4i l ~l ^ •fw.- A" Onyn • A Pci' vr l ,;J 1W Onv Stnvt I'u^w, OR 97403 - . , 
-. y rf -M^ - - S1S05 •-• •^ 80S

Richard



From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
kelby carlson
Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2018 2:59 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

That is the precise experience I have. I today used it on some other documents 
besides the court ones I described, with the same result; KNFB Reader gave much 
better quality and was much easier to get the document in view of the camera.
Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 20, 2018, at 4:09 PM, Nancy Badger 
mailto:nancybad...@icloud.com>> wrote:
The only reason I use kNFB FB reader now is  is when I want to have more than 
one page in a single document. I don’t think seeing AI does that yet.
Nancy Badger, Ph.D
Executive Director of Counseling
Old Dominion University
Sent from my iPhone with dictation software. Please excuse spelling errors.

On Jan 20, 2018, at 2:21 PM, 
englishride...@gmail.com<mailto:englishride...@gmail.com> wrote:
I've not had much luck with Seeing AI's document channel, either. Strange. I'm 
getting a bit better at getting the hold steady announcement a little faster--I 
guess all that practice with KNFB was helpful--but once the pic is processed by 
Seeing AI, 99% of the time, I get a message about there being no text. It's 
super frustrating. And since I'm pretty sure Seeing AI's default is to control 
the flash automatically, and since I do get results on the same text using the 
short text channel, I have no idea why this is happening.


Thanks,
Ari

On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:57 PM, Richard Turner 
mailto:richardturne...@outlook.com>> wrote:
That is not my experience at all.
But, if you do not care about document layout, then KNFB is faster.
With the Short Text mode, once it starts reading the page, point the camera to 
a blank spot on your desk, because the entire point of the short text mode is 
to read on the fly, so any movement that focuses on other text, or changes the 
focus on the same text, will be treated as a new scan. It isn't really designed 
for whole page scanning, that is what the document channel is for.
But, if it doesn't work for you, sticking with KNFB makes perfect sense.
Scott White, at NFB, tells me that format retention should be in an update this 
year for KNFB.
Something I've asked for since it was released.
Here's hoping it finally happens.
Richard



(Sent from the iPod Touch 6)

On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:24 PM, kelby carlson 
mailto:kelbycarl...@gmail.com>> wrote:
So, I'm now working in a court and have to deal with lots of paper documents. 
So I am using OCR much more. This has given me the chance to really compare 
KNFB Reader (which I honestly hadn't used much even though I bought it) and 
Seeing AI.

My conclusion: KNFB still beats Seeing AI for scanning print documents by a 
country mile.

Take what is called a "face sheet" for a docket, which contains all the basic 
information about a case. When trying to do the document channel with Seeing 
AI, it would continually tellm me that one or more edges was not visible no 
matter how much I adjusted the phone. When I raised the phone really high and 
got a "hold steady" it would take a picture b

Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

2018-01-20 Thread kelby carlson 
Well, for certain documents where accurate results are absolutely essential 
(tax forms, for example) I'm not sure either will work completely.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 20, 2018, at 6:28 PM, Richard Turner  
> wrote:
> 
> Below is a scan of the back cover of a paperback first done with Seeing AI.  
> Following that, is the same back cover done with KNFB Reader.  Sitting at my 
> desk using my iPhone SE.
>  
> Back cover with Seeing AI:
>  
> and Heroism!
>  
> ARE YOU READY?
>  
> iant earthquakes and tsunamis devastate western Oregon every 300 to 600 
> years. The last one hit in 1700, so we're due anytime. This informative, 
> entertaining
> book tells the stories of Oregon's past floods, fires, and eruptions. Then it 
> investigates the cycles behind our natural disasters and takes a look at
> what may happen when the next "Big One" strikes.
>  
> Also by WILLIAM L. SULLIVAN
>  
> Oregon Inrs& I rails - Cabm Fever - l_ustenmg for Covote
>  
> The 100 lltkes" sent•sfor Oregon • A Peeper J Vilå
>  
> History - [rplonng Oregon' Wild Areas - 17K Case of[msfem's Vtoltn
>  
> Navillus Press
>  
> 1958 Onvx Street
>  
> Eugene, OR 97403 aww.oregonhiking.com
>  
> ISBN 0-9815701-0-0 S18.95
>  
>  
> Now the same back cover done with KNFB Reader:
>  
> FfJt ^ ^^^ and Heroism • , • ^ ? ARE YOU READY? Giant edrthquakcs iin -1 
> tsunamis (.lcviist^tc western Oregon every 300 to 600 years. The last one hit 
> in 1700, so we're due anytime. Tliis infonritttivc, enterLuning Ixiok tells 
> the stories of Oregon's past floods, fires, anJ eruptions. Then it 
> iiivcsti^tcs the cycles behind our natural dis^stei-s tUtd ttikes a look At 
> what nuy happen wlicn tltc next "Big One'' strikes. I hkiH^ Or^^n's. ii^t^ty 
> l' ^! ^nn^0fv^m^ ilti Arc^ " Tfy C ^ tfr:n (n t h') n Also by WILLIAM L. 
> SULLIVAN Vh' "1W Hike^' f;i4i l ~l ^ •fw.- A" Onyn • A Pci' vr l ,;J 1W Onv 
> Stnvt I'u^w, OR 97403 - . , -. y rf -M^ - - S1S05 •-• •^ 80S
>  
> Richard
>  
>  
>  
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
> kelby carlson
> Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2018 2:59 PM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI
>  
> That is the precise experience I have. I today used it on some other 
> documents besides the court ones I described, with the same result; KNFB 
> Reader gave much better quality and was much easier to get the document in 
> view of the camera.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Jan 20, 2018, at 4:09 PM, Nancy Badger  wrote:
> 
> The only reason I use kNFB FB reader now is  is when I want to have more than 
> one page in a single document. I don’t think seeing AI does that yet.
> 
> Nancy Badger, Ph.D
> Executive Director of Counseling
> Old Dominion University
> Sent from my iPhone with dictation software. Please excuse spelling errors.
> 
> On Jan 20, 2018, at 2:21 PM, englishride...@gmail.com wrote:
> 
> I've not had much luck with Seeing AI's document channel, either. Strange. 
> I'm getting a bit better at getting the hold steady announcement a little 
> faster--I guess all that practice with KNFB was helpful--but once the pic is 
> processed by Seeing AI, 99% of the time, I get a message about there being no 
> text. It's super frustrating. And since I'm pretty sure Seeing AI's default 
> is to control the flash automatically, and since I do get results on the same 
> text using the short text channel, I have no idea why this is happening.
>  
>  
> Thanks,
> Ari
> 
> On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:57 PM, Richard Turner  
> wrote:
> 
> That is not my experience at all.
> But, if you do not care about document layout, then KNFB is faster.
> With the Short Text mode, once it starts reading the page, point the camera 
> to a blank spot on your desk, because the entire point of the short text mode 
> is to read on the fly, so any movement that focuses on other text, or changes 
> the focus on the same text, will be treated as a new scan. It isn't really 
> designed for whole page scanning, that is what the document channel is for.
> But, if it doesn't work for you, sticking with KNFB makes perfect sense.
> Scott White, at NFB, tells me that format retention should be in an update 
> this year for KNFB.
> Something I've asked for since it was released.
> Here's hoping it finally happens.
> Richard
>  
> 
> 
> 
> (Sent from the iPod Touch 6)
> 
> On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:24 PM, kelby carlson  wrote:
> 
> So, I'm now working in a court and have to de

Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

2018-01-20 Thread Richard Turner 

No scanning software should be trusted with things like tax forms. Not 
Openbook, Kurzweil or anything on a phone. Accuracy is simply too important.
Just My Opinion,
Richard



(Sent from the iPod Touch 6)

On Jan 20, 2018, at 5:52 PM, kelby carlson 
mailto:kelbycarl...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Well, for certain documents where accurate results are absolutely essential 
(tax forms, for example) I'm not sure either will work completely.

Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 20, 2018, at 6:28 PM, Richard Turner 
mailto:richardturne...@outlook.com>> wrote:

Below is a scan of the back cover of a paperback first done with Seeing AI.  
Following that, is the same back cover done with KNFB Reader.  Sitting at my 
desk using my iPhone SE.

Back cover with Seeing AI:

and Heroism!

ARE YOU READY?

iant earthquakes and tsunamis devastate western Oregon every 300 to 600 years. 
The last one hit in 1700, so we're due anytime. This informative, entertaining
book tells the stories of Oregon's past floods, fires, and eruptions. Then it 
investigates the cycles behind our natural disasters and takes a look at
what may happen when the next "Big One" strikes.

Also by WILLIAM L. SULLIVAN

Oregon Inrs& I rails - Cabm Fever - l_ustenmg for Covote

The 100 lltkes" sent•sfor Oregon • A Peeper J Vilå

History - [rplonng Oregon' Wild Areas - 17K Case of[msfem's Vtoltn

Navillus Press

1958 Onvx Street

Eugene, OR 97403 
aww.oregonhiking.com<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Faww.oregonhiking.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cfacf99d04bb54466df5508d560719bb6%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636520963417096863&sdata=Yjwm7%2FPS8SPfbTwe8MhgE77HwugaBqt1vQ7hjhmR2qQ%3D&reserved=0>

ISBN 0-9815701-0-0 S18.95


Now the same back cover done with KNFB Reader:

FfJt ^ ^^^ and Heroism • , • ^ ? ARE YOU READY? Giant edrthquakcs iin -1 
tsunamis (.lcviist^tc western Oregon every 300 to 600 years. The last one hit 
in 1700, so we're due anytime. Tliis infonritttivc, enterLuning Ixiok tells the 
stories of Oregon's past floods, fires, anJ eruptions. Then it iiivcsti^tcs the 
cycles behind our natural dis^stei-s tUtd ttikes a look At what nuy happen 
wlicn tltc next "Big One'' strikes. I hkiH^ Or^^n's. ii^t^ty l' ^! ^nn^0fv^m^ 
ilti Arc^ " Tfy C ^ tfr:n (n t h') n Also by WILLIAM L. SULLIVAN Vh' "1W Hike^' 
f;i4i l ~l ^ •fw.- A" Onyn • A Pci' vr l ,;J 1W Onv Stnvt I'u^w, OR 97403 - . , 
-. y rf -M^ - - S1S05 •-• •^ 80S

Richard



From: viphone@googlegroups.com<mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com> 
[mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of kelby carlson
Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2018 2:59 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com<mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: KNFB Reader v. Seeing AI

That is the precise experience I have. I today used it on some other documents 
besides the court ones I described, with the same result; KNFB Reader gave much 
better quality and was much easier to get the document in view of the camera.
Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 20, 2018, at 4:09 PM, Nancy Badger 
mailto:nancybad...@icloud.com>> wrote:
The only reason I use kNFB FB reader now is  is when I want to have more than 
one page in a single document. I don’t think seeing AI does that yet.
Nancy Badger, Ph.D
Executive Director of Counseling
Old Dominion University
Sent from my iPhone with dictation software. Please excuse spelling errors.

On Jan 20, 2018, at 2:21 PM, 
englishride...@gmail.com<mailto:englishride...@gmail.com> wrote:
I've not had much luck with Seeing AI's document channel, either. Strange. I'm 
getting a bit better at getting the hold steady announcement a little faster--I 
guess all that practice with KNFB was helpful--but once the pic is processed by 
Seeing AI, 99% of the time, I get a message about there being no text. It's 
super frustrating. And since I'm pretty sure Seeing AI's default is to control 
the flash automatically, and since I do get results on the same text using the 
short text channel, I have no idea why this is happening.


Thanks,
Ari

On Jan 19, 2018, at 12:57 PM, Richard Turner 
mailto:richardturne...@outlook.com>> wrote:
That is not my experience at all.
But, if you do not care about document layout, then KNFB is faster.
With the Short Text mode, once it starts reading the page, point the camera to 
a blank spot on your desk, because the entire point of the short text mode is 
to read on the fly, so any movement that focuses on other text, or changes the 
focus on the same text, will be treated as a new scan. It isn't really designed 
for whole page scanning, that is what the document channel is for.
But, if it doesn't work for you, sticking with KNFB makes perfect sense.
Scott White, at NFB, tells me that format retention should be in an update this 
year for KNFB.
Something I'v