RE: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out]
This way to make business that apple is using, will change. You will see. -Original Message- From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 11:30 PM To: viphone@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] The customer should be their focus, because that's their source of income. As a customer, I'd rather wait until the product is made right. I can wait for a few months to get a new iPhone. It'll come out when it works properly. There's no harm in using what is stable and usable for a while longer. I still think that I, as a business, would be better off by getting a reputation of producing quality, even though it may take a bit longer, rather than producing fast and shoddy. If they have to make something by their deadline, and that something is very buggy, then maybe they should move their deadline back next year, get it right, and then put it on the market so that it works fairly well the first time it is sold. I'll take quality over speed every single time. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Christopher J Chaltain chalt...@gmail.com To: viphone@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM Subject: Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have to worry about multiple things. KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for doing this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company that couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been OK with Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of the new iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors would have made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and people would have questioned what's going on at Apple. Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released. Would these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and using their old smart phones? Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue. People are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone 6's to come out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend? Postponing the availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the pocket book. Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone providers, accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have agreements with Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their commitments. If Apple was constantly missing their commitments then their partners would start to lose faith and confidence in Apple. Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features and put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very wealthy company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS without removing functionality from IOS. When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to keep them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too many bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum swing the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the market place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality the next time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the feature set a bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing and letting their customers know quality if priority #1. They still meet their dates though. You may not believe it, but Apple has some pretty smart people making decisions on whether to release a product on time or not with the given set of bugs. I can assure you that they've considered your three options, and there's a reason they stick to their committed schedule On 9/25/2014 6:01 PM, Charles Rivard wrote: As a customer, which would you prefer: 1. A product delivered on time, regardless of the quality. 2. A product delayed due to problems in the programming. 3. Number 2, with an explanation of why there is a delay. I, personally, would prefer option 3. If I had a business, I would give customers option 3. My reputation would be that I produce reliable, good quality software. Loyal customers would spread my reputation, bringing in more customers based on that reputation. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you
Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out]
Obviously customer satisfaction suffers when a program is released with a lot of bugs, but customer satisfaction also suffers when a program is promised on a certain date and then isn't released. Look at the criticism we saw on this list when KNFB Reader pushed out it's release by a few weeks? Apple also has a lot riding on their September releases. It's a big event with a lot of hype and press coverage. It also coincides with new iPhones, which generates new revenue for Apple. This revenue would be postponed if they had to push out the release of IOS 8, which is what's needed on the new iPhones. Imagine the criticism you'd hear lofted Apple's way if they postponed there big annual announcement? When a company releases a new update to a product, they have to weigh a lot of different factors, and ultimately a business decision is made based on all of the available facts. On 09/24/2014 11:41 PM, Neal Ewers wrote: This is not a complaint, just an observation. I know lots of companies that tie the release of their next version to a particular time of year, and if it's not ready, well it just may go out anyway. I'm guessing that there are a lot of mid level workers at apple who likely knew this was not ready for prime time but the choice may have been made for them by the higher ups. Those mid-level workers may be just as frustrated as we are. After all, many of them use iOS 8 also. I just hope the managers who set the time for this release didn't let so many bugs in the house that it will be a very long process to kill them all. Neal *From:*viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] *On Behalf Of *Ron Pelletier *Sent:* Wednesday, September 24, 2014 11:28 PM *To:* viphone@googlegroups.com *Subject:* RE: iOS 8.0.1 is out Neal, I think that Apple is trying so hard to satisfy the people who are impatient that they are cranking out the updates too fast and don't have time to properly check them. Having seen what has happened last year and this year also, I still think that they feel that timing to put out the new product is more important than coming out with the right thing from the get go. They set themselves a deadline and go crazy trying to stick to it and the result is what we get. I guess they have evaluated that their reputation can stand the problems and they seem to be right. No matter how many bugs there are, people seem to forgive Apple for putting out a product before it is ready. When people camp out on the sidewalk for two days to be the first to get the new product, I guess you don't have to worry about several dozen bugs. Ron Danvers *From:*viphone@googlegroups.com mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] *On Behalf Of *Neal Ewers *Sent:* Wednesday, September 24, 2014 2:28 PM *To:* viphone@googlegroups.com mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com *Subject:* RE: iOS 8.0.1 is out Hi, I applaud Apple's quick update release. What is bothersome is that they put out an update not knowing about the issue that caused them to pull it. I bring this up only to ask a question. For those who are on the beta team, do you get to see these updates first, or is the testing of these done in house. This also raises the question of updates released that may, in fact, break things that already work. I guess we will have to wait and see, but I am curious about who tests the updates they release. Neal *From:*viphone@googlegroups.com mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] *On Behalf Of *Alex Hall *Sent:* Wednesday, September 24, 2014 1:21 PM *To:* viphone@googlegroups.com mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com *Subject:* Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out FYI, Apple has just pulled the update. You can no longer get it; I imagine it will be re-released soon with a fix for the problems on the iPhone6. On Sep 24, 2014, at 2:14 PM, Trea Abma trea.a...@gmail.com mailto:trea.a...@gmail.com wrote: I updated and didn't have this problems. I called voicemail and was able to delete messages without the dial tone bug, so maybe this is solved. *From:*Rich Ring mailto:richr...@gmail.com *Sent:*Wednesday, September 24, 2014 8:00 PM *To:*viphone@googlegroups.com mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com *Cc:*Rich Ring mailto:richr...@gmail.com *Subject:*Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out However, I've heard that some users are losing cell service and that the update also breaks touch ID. I think I'll wait! You can have an off day, but you can't have a day off! ---The Art of Fielding Sent from my Mac Book Pro richr...@gmail.com mailto:richr...@gmail.com On Sep 24, 2014, at 12:52 PM, Gail the U. S. Male gailcrowe1...@gmail.com mailto:gailcrowe1...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, It sure is! I just saw the announcement in my iTunes. I'm downloading it now, as I write this. I was trying to send a message to the list, but you beat me to it. LOL! - Original Message - *From:*Cristóbal mailto:crismuno...@gmail.com *To:*viphone@googlegroups.com
Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out]
As a customer, which would you prefer: 1. A product delivered on time, regardless of the quality. 2. A product delayed due to problems in the programming. 3. Number 2, with an explanation of why there is a delay. I, personally, would prefer option 3. If I had a business, I would give customers option 3. My reputation would be that I produce reliable, good quality software. Loyal customers would spread my reputation, bringing in more customers based on that reputation. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Christopher Chaltain chalt...@gmail.com To: viphone@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 6:59 AM Subject: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] Obviously customer satisfaction suffers when a program is released with a lot of bugs, but customer satisfaction also suffers when a program is promised on a certain date and then isn't released. Look at the criticism we saw on this list when KNFB Reader pushed out it's release by a few weeks? Apple also has a lot riding on their September releases. It's a big event with a lot of hype and press coverage. It also coincides with new iPhones, which generates new revenue for Apple. This revenue would be postponed if they had to push out the release of IOS 8, which is what's needed on the new iPhones. Imagine the criticism you'd hear lofted Apple's way if they postponed there big annual announcement? When a company releases a new update to a product, they have to weigh a lot of different factors, and ultimately a business decision is made based on all of the available facts. On 09/24/2014 11:41 PM, Neal Ewers wrote: This is not a complaint, just an observation. I know lots of companies that tie the release of their next version to a particular time of year, and if it's not ready, well it just may go out anyway. I'm guessing that there are a lot of mid level workers at apple who likely knew this was not ready for prime time but the choice may have been made for them by the higher ups. Those mid-level workers may be just as frustrated as we are. After all, many of them use iOS 8 also. I just hope the managers who set the time for this release didn't let so many bugs in the house that it will be a very long process to kill them all. Neal *From:*viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] *On Behalf Of *Ron Pelletier *Sent:* Wednesday, September 24, 2014 11:28 PM *To:* viphone@googlegroups.com *Subject:* RE: iOS 8.0.1 is out Neal, I think that Apple is trying so hard to satisfy the people who are impatient that they are cranking out the updates too fast and don't have time to properly check them. Having seen what has happened last year and this year also, I still think that they feel that timing to put out the new product is more important than coming out with the right thing from the get go. They set themselves a deadline and go crazy trying to stick to it and the result is what we get. I guess they have evaluated that their reputation can stand the problems and they seem to be right. No matter how many bugs there are, people seem to forgive Apple for putting out a product before it is ready. When people camp out on the sidewalk for two days to be the first to get the new product, I guess you don't have to worry about several dozen bugs. Ron Danvers *From:*viphone@googlegroups.com mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] *On Behalf Of *Neal Ewers *Sent:* Wednesday, September 24, 2014 2:28 PM *To:* viphone@googlegroups.com mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com *Subject:* RE: iOS 8.0.1 is out Hi, I applaud Apple's quick update release. What is bothersome is that they put out an update not knowing about the issue that caused them to pull it. I bring this up only to ask a question. For those who are on the beta team, do you get to see these updates first, or is the testing of these done in house. This also raises the question of updates released that may, in fact, break things that already work. I guess we will have to wait and see, but I am curious about who tests the updates they release. Neal *From:*viphone@googlegroups.com mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] *On Behalf Of *Alex Hall *Sent:* Wednesday, September 24, 2014 1:21 PM *To:* viphone@googlegroups.com mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com *Subject:* Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out FYI, Apple has just pulled the update. You can no longer get it; I imagine it will be re-released soon with a fix for the problems on the iPhone6. On Sep 24, 2014, at 2:14 PM, Trea Abma trea.a...@gmail.com mailto:trea.a...@gmail.com wrote: I updated and didn't have this problems. I called voicemail and was able to delete messages without the dial tone bug, so maybe this is solved. *From:*Rich Ring mailto:richr...@gmail.com *Sent:*Wednesday, September 24, 2014 8:00 PM *To:*viphone@googlegroups.com mailto:viphone
Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out]
That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have to worry about multiple things. KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for doing this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company that couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been OK with Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of the new iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors would have made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and people would have questioned what's going on at Apple. Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released. Would these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and using their old smart phones? Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue. People are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone 6's to come out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend? Postponing the availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the pocket book. Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone providers, accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have agreements with Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their commitments. If Apple was constantly missing their commitments then their partners would start to lose faith and confidence in Apple. Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features and put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very wealthy company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS without removing functionality from IOS. When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to keep them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too many bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum swing the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the market place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality the next time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the feature set a bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing and letting their customers know quality if priority #1. They still meet their dates though. You may not believe it, but Apple has some pretty smart people making decisions on whether to release a product on time or not with the given set of bugs. I can assure you that they've considered your three options, and there's a reason they stick to their committed schedule On 9/25/2014 6:01 PM, Charles Rivard wrote: As a customer, which would you prefer: 1. A product delivered on time, regardless of the quality. 2. A product delayed due to problems in the programming. 3. Number 2, with an explanation of why there is a delay. I, personally, would prefer option 3. If I had a business, I would give customers option 3. My reputation would be that I produce reliable, good quality software. Loyal customers would spread my reputation, bringing in more customers based on that reputation. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Christopher Chaltain chalt...@gmail.com To: viphone@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 6:59 AM Subject: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] Obviously customer satisfaction suffers when a program is released with a lot of bugs, but customer satisfaction also suffers when a program is promised on a certain date and then isn't released. Look at the criticism we saw on this list when KNFB Reader pushed out it's release by a few weeks? Apple also has a lot riding on their September releases. It's a big event with a lot of hype and press coverage. It also coincides with new iPhones, which generates new revenue for Apple. This revenue would be postponed if they had to push out the release of IOS 8, which is what's needed on the new iPhones. Imagine the criticism you'd hear lofted Apple's way if they postponed there big annual announcement? When a company releases a new update to a product, they have to weigh a lot of different factors, and ultimately a business decision is made based on all of the available facts. On 09/24/2014 11:41 PM, Neal Ewers wrote: This is not a complaint, just an observation. I know lots of companies that tie the release of their next version to a particular time of year, and if it's not ready, well it just may go out anyway
Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out]
The customer should be their focus, because that's their source of income. As a customer, I'd rather wait until the product is made right. I can wait for a few months to get a new iPhone. It'll come out when it works properly. There's no harm in using what is stable and usable for a while longer. I still think that I, as a business, would be better off by getting a reputation of producing quality, even though it may take a bit longer, rather than producing fast and shoddy. If they have to make something by their deadline, and that something is very buggy, then maybe they should move their deadline back next year, get it right, and then put it on the market so that it works fairly well the first time it is sold. I'll take quality over speed every single time. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Christopher J Chaltain chalt...@gmail.com To: viphone@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM Subject: Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have to worry about multiple things. KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for doing this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company that couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been OK with Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of the new iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors would have made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and people would have questioned what's going on at Apple. Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released. Would these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and using their old smart phones? Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue. People are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone 6's to come out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend? Postponing the availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the pocket book. Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone providers, accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have agreements with Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their commitments. If Apple was constantly missing their commitments then their partners would start to lose faith and confidence in Apple. Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features and put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very wealthy company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS without removing functionality from IOS. When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to keep them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too many bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum swing the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the market place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality the next time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the feature set a bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing and letting their customers know quality if priority #1. They still meet their dates though. You may not believe it, but Apple has some pretty smart people making decisions on whether to release a product on time or not with the given set of bugs. I can assure you that they've considered your three options, and there's a reason they stick to their committed schedule On 9/25/2014 6:01 PM, Charles Rivard wrote: As a customer, which would you prefer: 1. A product delivered on time, regardless of the quality. 2. A product delayed due to problems in the programming. 3. Number 2, with an explanation of why there is a delay. I, personally, would prefer option 3. If I had a business, I would give customers option 3. My reputation would be that I produce reliable, good quality software. Loyal customers would spread my reputation, bringing in more customers based on that reputation. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Christopher Chaltain chalt...@gmail.com To: viphone@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 6:59 AM Subject: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] Obviously customer satisfaction suffers when a program is released
Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out]
Everyone have a choice. If you, as a customer, are not happy with what they, Apple, are offering, you, as a customer can always get to the Samsung/Google wagon. They, as Apple, didn't put a gun on your head and force you to get the newest and latest. They, might put the software on your phone, but you, as a customer can ignore it. On 26/09/2014, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: The customer should be their focus, because that's their source of income. As a customer, I'd rather wait until the product is made right. I can wait for a few months to get a new iPhone. It'll come out when it works properly. There's no harm in using what is stable and usable for a while longer. I still think that I, as a business, would be better off by getting a reputation of producing quality, even though it may take a bit longer, rather than producing fast and shoddy. If they have to make something by their deadline, and that something is very buggy, then maybe they should move their deadline back next year, get it right, and then put it on the market so that it works fairly well the first time it is sold. I'll take quality over speed every single time. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Christopher J Chaltain chalt...@gmail.com To: viphone@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM Subject: Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have to worry about multiple things. KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for doing this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company that couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been OK with Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of the new iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors would have made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and people would have questioned what's going on at Apple. Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released. Would these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and using their old smart phones? Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue. People are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone 6's to come out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend? Postponing the availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the pocket book. Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone providers, accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have agreements with Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their commitments. If Apple was constantly missing their commitments then their partners would start to lose faith and confidence in Apple. Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features and put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very wealthy company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS without removing functionality from IOS. When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to keep them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too many bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum swing the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the market place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality the next time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the feature set a bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing and letting their customers know quality if priority #1. They still meet their dates though. You may not believe it, but Apple has some pretty smart people making decisions on whether to release a product on time or not with the given set of bugs. I can assure you that they've considered your three options, and there's a reason they stick to their committed schedule On 9/25/2014 6:01 PM, Charles Rivard wrote: As a customer, which would you prefer: 1. A product delivered on time, regardless of the quality. 2. A product delayed due to problems in the programming. 3. Number 2, with an explanation of why there is a delay. I, personally, would prefer option 3. If I had a business, I would give customers option 3. My reputation would be that I produce reliable, good quality software. Loyal customers would spread
RE: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out]
Good God, let it go folks. We're already on to version 8.0.2 -Original Message- From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Joanne Chua Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM To: viphone@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] Everyone have a choice. If you, as a customer, are not happy with what they, Apple, are offering, you, as a customer can always get to the Samsung/Google wagon. They, as Apple, didn't put a gun on your head and force you to get the newest and latest. They, might put the software on your phone, but you, as a customer can ignore it. On 26/09/2014, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: The customer should be their focus, because that's their source of income. As a customer, I'd rather wait until the product is made right. I can wait for a few months to get a new iPhone. It'll come out when it works properly. There's no harm in using what is stable and usable for a while longer. I still think that I, as a business, would be better off by getting a reputation of producing quality, even though it may take a bit longer, rather than producing fast and shoddy. If they have to make something by their deadline, and that something is very buggy, then maybe they should move their deadline back next year, get it right, and then put it on the market so that it works fairly well the first time it is sold. I'll take quality over speed every single time. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Christopher J Chaltain chalt...@gmail.com To: viphone@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM Subject: Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have to worry about multiple things. KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for doing this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company that couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been OK with Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of the new iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors would have made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and people would have questioned what's going on at Apple. Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released. Would these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and using their old smart phones? Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue. People are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone 6's to come out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend? Postponing the availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the pocket book. Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone providers, accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have agreements with Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their commitments. If Apple was constantly missing their commitments then their partners would start to lose faith and confidence in Apple. Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features and put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very wealthy company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS without removing functionality from IOS. When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to keep them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too many bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum swing the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the market place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality the next time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the feature set a bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing and letting their customers know quality if priority #1. They still meet their dates though. You may not believe it, but Apple has some pretty smart people making decisions on whether to release a product on time or not with the given set of bugs. I can assure you that they've considered your three options, and there's a reason they stick to their committed schedule On 9/25/2014 6:01 PM, Charles Rivard wrote: As a customer, which would you prefer: 1. A product
RE: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out]
Actually, everyone does not have a choice. Some people work for companies who only use Apple. So if the phone doesn't work, then you may be out of luck. You are right, of course, when you say that people may not have to update. However, some companies update all people at the same time. If the device belongs to the company and they decide to update, you don't have a choice. The good thing is that I doubt many companies have updated many people this early in the release cycle. Neal -Original Message- From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Joanne Chua Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 10:56 PM To: viphone@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] Everyone have a choice. If you, as a customer, are not happy with what they, Apple, are offering, you, as a customer can always get to the Samsung/Google wagon. They, as Apple, didn't put a gun on your head and force you to get the newest and latest. They, might put the software on your phone, but you, as a customer can ignore it. On 26/09/2014, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: The customer should be their focus, because that's their source of income. As a customer, I'd rather wait until the product is made right. I can wait for a few months to get a new iPhone. It'll come out when it works properly. There's no harm in using what is stable and usable for a while longer. I still think that I, as a business, would be better off by getting a reputation of producing quality, even though it may take a bit longer, rather than producing fast and shoddy. If they have to make something by their deadline, and that something is very buggy, then maybe they should move their deadline back next year, get it right, and then put it on the market so that it works fairly well the first time it is sold. I'll take quality over speed every single time. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Christopher J Chaltain chalt...@gmail.com To: viphone@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM Subject: Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have to worry about multiple things. KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for doing this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company that couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been OK with Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of the new iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors would have made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and people would have questioned what's going on at Apple. Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released. Would these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and using their old smart phones? Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue. People are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone 6's to come out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend? Postponing the availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the pocket book. Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone providers, accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have agreements with Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their commitments. If Apple was constantly missing their commitments then their partners would start to lose faith and confidence in Apple. Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features and put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very wealthy company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS without removing functionality from IOS. When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to keep them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too many bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum swing the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the market place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality the next time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the feature set a bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing and letting their customers know quality if priority #1
Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out]
And there's no option not to update if you're getting a new device. You need IOS 8 if you're getting an iPhone 6. On 9/25/2014 11:02 PM, Neal Ewers wrote: Actually, everyone does not have a choice. Some people work for companies who only use Apple. So if the phone doesn't work, then you may be out of luck. You are right, of course, when you say that people may not have to update. However, some companies update all people at the same time. If the device belongs to the company and they decide to update, you don't have a choice. The good thing is that I doubt many companies have updated many people this early in the release cycle. Neal -Original Message- From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Joanne Chua Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 10:56 PM To: viphone@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] Everyone have a choice. If you, as a customer, are not happy with what they, Apple, are offering, you, as a customer can always get to the Samsung/Google wagon. They, as Apple, didn't put a gun on your head and force you to get the newest and latest. They, might put the software on your phone, but you, as a customer can ignore it. On 26/09/2014, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: The customer should be their focus, because that's their source of income. As a customer, I'd rather wait until the product is made right. I can wait for a few months to get a new iPhone. It'll come out when it works properly. There's no harm in using what is stable and usable for a while longer. I still think that I, as a business, would be better off by getting a reputation of producing quality, even though it may take a bit longer, rather than producing fast and shoddy. If they have to make something by their deadline, and that something is very buggy, then maybe they should move their deadline back next year, get it right, and then put it on the market so that it works fairly well the first time it is sold. I'll take quality over speed every single time. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Christopher J Chaltain chalt...@gmail.com To: viphone@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM Subject: Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have to worry about multiple things. KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for doing this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company that couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been OK with Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of the new iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors would have made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and people would have questioned what's going on at Apple. Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released. Would these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and using their old smart phones? Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue. People are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone 6's to come out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend? Postponing the availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the pocket book. Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone providers, accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have agreements with Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their commitments. If Apple was constantly missing their commitments then their partners would start to lose faith and confidence in Apple. Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features and put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very wealthy company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS without removing functionality from IOS. When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to keep them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too many bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum swing the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the market place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality the next time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the feature set a bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing
Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out]
Does it hurt to discuss issues and voice our opinions? If you don't like it, all you have to do is to hit the delete key on the subject line being used, and your problem will be solved. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Cristóbal crismuno...@gmail.com To: viphone@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 11:00 PM Subject: RE: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] Good God, let it go folks. We're already on to version 8.0.2 -Original Message- From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Joanne Chua Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM To: viphone@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] Everyone have a choice. If you, as a customer, are not happy with what they, Apple, are offering, you, as a customer can always get to the Samsung/Google wagon. They, as Apple, didn't put a gun on your head and force you to get the newest and latest. They, might put the software on your phone, but you, as a customer can ignore it. On 26/09/2014, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: The customer should be their focus, because that's their source of income. As a customer, I'd rather wait until the product is made right. I can wait for a few months to get a new iPhone. It'll come out when it works properly. There's no harm in using what is stable and usable for a while longer. I still think that I, as a business, would be better off by getting a reputation of producing quality, even though it may take a bit longer, rather than producing fast and shoddy. If they have to make something by their deadline, and that something is very buggy, then maybe they should move their deadline back next year, get it right, and then put it on the market so that it works fairly well the first time it is sold. I'll take quality over speed every single time. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Christopher J Chaltain chalt...@gmail.com To: viphone@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM Subject: Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have to worry about multiple things. KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for doing this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company that couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been OK with Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of the new iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors would have made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and people would have questioned what's going on at Apple. Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released. Would these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and using their old smart phones? Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue. People are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone 6's to come out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend? Postponing the availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the pocket book. Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone providers, accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have agreements with Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their commitments. If Apple was constantly missing their commitments then their partners would start to lose faith and confidence in Apple. Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features and put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very wealthy company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS without removing functionality from IOS. When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to keep them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too many bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum swing the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the market place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality the next time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the feature set a bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing and letting their customers know quality if priority #1. They still meet their dates
Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out]
If the phone was given to you as an employee of a business, and they decide to upgrade, your phone will be upgraded. Also, most companies, if they are smart, won't immediately jump to the latest and greatest. The system must be working before businesses go to it. Also, and this is a personal opinion, I would not jump to a Samsung phone based on one mistake by Apple, because, based on previous experience, they have corrected the problems in their operating systems. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Joanne Chua shuang.an...@gmail.com To: viphone@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 10:56 PM Subject: Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] Everyone have a choice. If you, as a customer, are not happy with what they, Apple, are offering, you, as a customer can always get to the Samsung/Google wagon. They, as Apple, didn't put a gun on your head and force you to get the newest and latest. They, might put the software on your phone, but you, as a customer can ignore it. On 26/09/2014, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: The customer should be their focus, because that's their source of income. As a customer, I'd rather wait until the product is made right. I can wait for a few months to get a new iPhone. It'll come out when it works properly. There's no harm in using what is stable and usable for a while longer. I still think that I, as a business, would be better off by getting a reputation of producing quality, even though it may take a bit longer, rather than producing fast and shoddy. If they have to make something by their deadline, and that something is very buggy, then maybe they should move their deadline back next year, get it right, and then put it on the market so that it works fairly well the first time it is sold. I'll take quality over speed every single time. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Christopher J Chaltain chalt...@gmail.com To: viphone@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM Subject: Re: Release schedules [was Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out] That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have to worry about multiple things. KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for doing this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company that couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been OK with Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of the new iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors would have made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and people would have questioned what's going on at Apple. Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released. Would these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and using their old smart phones? Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue. People are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone 6's to come out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend? Postponing the availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the pocket book. Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone providers, accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have agreements with Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their commitments. If Apple was constantly missing their commitments then their partners would start to lose faith and confidence in Apple. Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features and put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very wealthy company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS without removing functionality from IOS. When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to keep them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too many bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum swing the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the market place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality the next time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the feature set a bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing and letting their customers know quality if priority #1. They still meet their dates though. You may
