Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote: > Nope. Default still goes to you instead of Vortex. I do not know what the > setting is. > > No big deal. It's the "reply to" function. I emailed him. T
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
John Milstone wrote: Testing... 1, 2, 3. Is this any better? > > (Sorry for the trouble!) > Nope. Default still goes to you instead of Vortex. I do not know what the setting is. No big deal. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
much better. Andre On 01/19/2012 05:25 PM, John Milstone wrote: Testing... 1, 2, 3. Is this any better? (Sorry for the trouble!) *From:* OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson *To:* vortex-l *Sent:* Thursday, January 19, 2012 4:03 PM *Subject:* Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean ... > ... I'm sending them to > "vortex-l@eskimo.com <mailto:vortex-l@eskimo.com>". Is that not correct? Hi John, The same thing is happening to me, as with Jed. When I hit the reply button, to reply to one of your vortex-l posts, I don't get the vortex-l address. I get your personal email address. There must be a setting somewhere that needs fixing at your end. Check your "reply to" setting. Anybody else got any suggestions? Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com <http://www.OrionWorks.com> www.zazzle.com/orionworks <http://www.zazzle.com/orionworks>
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
Testing... 1, 2, 3. Is this any better? (Sorry for the trouble!) From: OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson To: vortex-l Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2012 4:03 PM Subject: Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean ... > ... I'm sending them to > "vortex-l@eskimo.com". Is that not correct? Hi John, The same thing is happening to me, as with Jed. When I hit the reply button, to reply to one of your vortex-l posts, I don't get the vortex-l address. I get your personal email address. There must be a setting somewhere that needs fixing at your end. Check your "reply to" setting. Anybody else got any suggestions? Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
... > ... I'm sending them to > "vortex-l@eskimo.com". Is that not correct? Hi John, The same thing is happening to me, as with Jed. When I hit the reply button, to reply to one of your vortex-l posts, I don't get the vortex-l address. I get your personal email address. There must be a setting somewhere that needs fixing at your end. Check your "reply to" setting. Anybody else got any suggestions? Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
Jed, According to the Internet "Way-Back" machine (archive.org), Rossi's company has been using the same address since sometime prior to May 14, 2010. I thought Ampenergo was just set up last summer? Thanks for the advise on my email replies. I'm sending them to "vortex-l@eskimo.com". Is that not correct? John From: Jed Rothwell To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2012 3:42 PM Subject: Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean John Milstone wrote: I haven't seen or heard of any reports by credible witnesses to either of these. Are they buried somewhere in the LENR library? > Nope. They are unpublished. They will not give me permission to publish, unfortunately. In the case of Ampenergo, at least, I'm not overly impressed with a company that consists of nothing but a one-page, content-free web site . . . They have impressive people on tap, such as McKubre's friend. No money as far as I know, but I don't know much about them. and an rental office that just happens to be sharing the same rental office and same phone number as Rossi's company. > I believe it is the other way around. He is sharing their address. They were there first. Start-up companies are often no more than a mailing address. (By the way, you should change your e-mail specs so that responses go to Vortex.) - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
>From John Milstone > How fortunate that you [Jed] appear to be the only person who isn't > being bamboozled by Rossi. Just out of curiosity, have you had any correspondence with Mr. Rossi going back for for several years, as Mr. Rothwell presumably has had? What do you base your conclusion on? Your own personal correspondence with Rossi? Rossi's behavior reminds me of the psychological predilections of a well known UFO Investigator I have known for years. When it comes to UFO investigation facts, I have little reason to doubt most of what this investigator has to say - what his team has uncovered. (I suspect that in the near future we will be hearing published reports about the properties of certain metal samples that have been recovered from the Roswell crash site, the fruits of several archeological digs. It's my understanding that preliminary laboratory test performed on some of these samples have revealed very unusual properties. But more on that later.) OTOH, when it comes to personal interactions with various people I have learned to place a filter in front of our conversations. I still count him as an old friend of mine. It is best to learn how to work around each others "flaws", cuz we all have them. Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
John Milstone wrote: I haven't seen or heard of any reports by credible witnesses to either of > these. Are they buried somewhere in the LENR library? > Nope. They are unpublished. They will not give me permission to publish, unfortunately. > In the case of Ampenergo, at least, I'm not overly impressed with a > company that consists of nothing but a one-page, content-free web site . . . They have impressive people on tap, such as McKubre's friend. No money as far as I know, but I don't know much about them. and an rental office that just happens to be sharing the same rental office > and same phone number as Rossi's company. > I believe it is the other way around. He is sharing their address. They were there first. Start-up companies are often no more than a mailing address. (By the way, you should change your e-mail specs so that responses go to Vortex.) - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
On 12-01-19 03:08 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote: Stephen A. Lawrence wrote: Personally I stopped believing anything Rossi said after the "wet steam/dry steam" business blew up early last year. That is unfair to Rossi. No, it's not. He did not select the meter which is controversial. If you really understood why the steam could not have been dry, you'd also understand why it's not unfair to Rossi to blame him for claiming it was dry. (And you'd also understand why your repeated appeals to authority on the subject are so unconvincing.) We've been over this, Jed, and the most solid conclusion I'd draw is that I would not hire you for a position which required a clear understanding of physical chemistry. He is using industry standard techniques to ensure dry steam. Every expert he has consulted with assures him the steam is dry. I doubt that, unless "every" is a very small number and "expert" is defined very vaguely. Every expert I have consulted with says the same thing. Your unnamed experts who used unspecified methods to measure unknown quantities from which they used unstated reasoning in order to demonstrate that the wet steam was really dry carry no weight.
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
I haven't seen or heard of any reports by credible witnesses to either of these. Are they buried somewhere in the LENR library? In the case of Ampenergo, at least, I'm not overly impressed with a company that consists of nothing but a one-page, content-free web site and an rental office that just happens to be sharing the same rental office and same phone number as Rossi's company. - Original Message - From: Jed Rothwell To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Cc: Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2012 3:08 PM Subject: Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean It makes no difference which is more common. We can be sure that Rossi's claims are real because they have been independently tested by Ampenergo and others, and independently replicated by Defkalion. We do not have depend on his judgement or his honesty. If we did have to depend on those things, I would not believe a word of it. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
Jed Rothwell said: >It is also because he thrives on controversy. He loves confusing and >outwitting people, Jed Rothwell also said: >He never fools me. He does not seem to be trying to fool me. How fortunate that you appear to be the only person who isn't being bamboozled by Rossi.
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 12:08 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote: > Stephen A. Lawrence wrote: > > Personally I stopped believing anything Rossi said after the "wet >> steam/dry steam" business blew up early last year. >> > > That is unfair to Rossi. He did not select the meter which is > controversial. He is using industry standard techniques to ensure dry > steam. Every expert he has consulted with assures him the steam is dry. > Every expert I have consulted with says the same thing. > How strange. Everyone of Krivit's experts, and he named them by name, said the opposite. > You should blame him for things that are his fault. The "wet steam/dry > steam" controversy has nothing to do with him. As far as I can tell, it is > a figment of the skeptics' imaginations. If you read all the detailed arguments that appeared here, you'd know it was not figment. > It makes no difference which is more common. We can be sure that Rossi's > claims are real because they have been independently tested by Ampenergo Ampenergo has said nothing and published nothing and shown nothing. > and others, and independently replicated by Defkalion. > Defkalion seems to have lied grossly about having submitted anything to the Greek authorities for certification. All they have shown are a few photos of lab gear of indeterminate nature. They have never given a public demo. Nobody who's seen a private one has ever written about it. There is nothing from Rossi but questionable tests in which he was always personally deeply involved. There are no tests at all from Defkalion. None of Defkalion and Rossi's claims are credible. Yes, I'm repeating myself. In response to Jed's constant symphony of misinformation.
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
Stephen A. Lawrence wrote: Personally I stopped believing anything Rossi said after the "wet steam/dry steam" business blew up early last year. That is unfair to Rossi. He did not select the meter which is controversial. He is using industry standard techniques to ensure dry steam. Every expert he has consulted with assures him the steam is dry. Every expert I have consulted with says the same thing. You should blame him for things that are his fault. The "wet steam/dry steam" controversy has nothing to do with him. As far as I can tell, it is a figment of the skeptics' imaginations. There are no doubt zillions of cases of hotshot researchers who lied about their results but none the less went on to produce real breakthroughs, as Jed seems to be fond of asserting, but I'm afraid the opposite is quite a bit more common. (Google "korea clone" for a perhaps more typical example.) It makes no difference which is more common. We can be sure that Rossi's claims are real because they have been independently tested by Ampenergo and others, and independently replicated by Defkalion. We do not have depend on his judgement or his honesty. If we did have to depend on those things, I would not believe a word of it. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
I thought that the container was loaded onto a truck and driven away from the site shortly after the demonstration - Did I just imagine reading that? Fran -Original Message- From: Stephen A. Lawrence [mailto:sa...@pobox.com] Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2012 2:27 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean On 12-01-19 02:09 PM, Wolf Fischer wrote: > Some of us tried to find where he said that the thing was shipped. The > only thing that we found was his answer on the question "Is it gone?" > --> "Yes". The question leaves a little room for interpretation in my > opinion, but really - it's only very little room... Hmmm -- I was just taking Jed's statement at face value; I confess I didn't go swimming in the strange river of Rossi's statements to try to confirm it. Certainly there have been recent quotes from Rossi in which he strenuously denied claims that the customer had RETURNED it. I suppose, though, if he never shipped it, then he's being totally truthful in asserting that it wasn't returned ... right? Personally I stopped believing anything Rossi said after the "wet steam/dry steam" business blew up early last year. There are no doubt zillions of cases of hotshot researchers who lied about their results but none the less went on to produce real breakthroughs, as Jed seems to be fond of asserting, but I'm afraid the opposite is quite a bit more common. (Google "korea clone" for a perhaps more typical example.) > Wolf > >> >> >> On 12-01-19 10:11 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: >>> This discussion about Rossi's 1 MW reactor is silly. The reactor has >>> not shipped anywhere. He said it has not shipped, and it is obvious >>> from the photos it has not. >>> >>> Previously he said he did ship it. Now he says he did not. He is >>> contradicting himself. He often does that. I would not call it a "lie" >> >> He said it shipped. That's a binary statement, either true or >> false. If false, I, personally, would call it a "lie". >> >> In fact, for the most part, when a vendor says they shipped something >> and they really didn't, most folks would call that a "lie". >> >> Photos indicate Rossi didn't ship it. That makes his statement >> false, thus, as I said, making it what most folks would call a >> "lie". (That's what a lie IS, for goodness' sake! It didn't ship, >> he knew perfectly well it didn't ship, and he said it did ship. Right?) >> >> Now Rossi says it didn't ship, which most people would characterize >> as an "admission", though he didn't couch it quite that way. (But of >> course he didn't say "I admit it didn't ship" -- if you're covering >> up an earlier lie, it's always better to make it sound like the >> current story was true all along, and anything else is just mistakes, >> misunderstandings, or stuff to be ignored and/or dismissed.) >> >> Just what would he have to do, Jed, for you to say he "lied" ? >> >> >>> in the usual sense because he makes no effort to cover up or explain >>> the contradiction. He says "X" on Monday and "not X" on Tuesday as >>> if it makes no difference. >> >> Yup, he's what most folks would call a pathological liar. >> >> Yet you seem to be saying that because he lies habitually, nearly >> constantly, we should conclude that he really doesn't lie at all. >> >> I don't quite follow that. >> >> >>> As if he never expected to be believed in the first instance, and he >>> did not mean it. >> >> This is a totally bizarre characterization of his behavior, IMHO. >> >> >>> Truth is malleable in his imagination. >> >> Maybe; I don't have a direct line into his imagination. >> >> From where I'm sitting he just looks like a pathological liar. >> >> > >
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 11:50 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: > > > I do not see any of that. I have been dealing with him for years, and I > have seen him act this way countless times. He never fools me. > This seems like a good place to ask what those dealings were and exactly what it is Rossi delivered to you which makes you believe that he did not, as I suspect, wildly fool you many times over. Other than words, of course -- we know he delivered a lot of those. Far as I know, since this adventure began more than a year ago, Rossi has not been proven to have delivered anything tangible to anyone, anywhere, ever. Ditto Defkalion. > He does not seem to be trying to fool me. > That remains to be determined, IMHO.
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
Stephen A. Lawrence wrote: Previously he said he did ship it. Now he says he did not. He is >> contradicting himself. He often does that. I would not call it a "lie" >> > > He said it shipped. That's a binary statement, either true or false. If > false, I, personally, would call it a "lie". > In that case I suggest you learn something about psychology. I would define a lie as something intended to deceive other people for some purpose. I don't see how Rossi can accomplish any purpose in this instance. Lying is quite different from something like confabulation, defined as: "To fill in gaps in one's memory with fabrications that one believes to be facts." (I am not saying that is what he is doing. There are many similar behaviors.) You seem to have a two-dimensional view of human behavior. Small children, confused elderly people, and others like them often say things which are not true, but are not lies either. Don't be so judgmental. > Photos indicate Rossi didn't ship it. That makes his statement false . . . Yes, of course. But it does not prove he was lying in the conventional sense. As I said, when someone tells you 3 or 4 outrageously conflicting things in a short time, that's not lying. That would be mental illness. Perhaps Rossi's behavior does not go that far, but it is abnormal. Nothing to laugh at, or get upset about. Just what would he have to do, Jed, for you to say he "lied" ? He would have to benefit in some way. He would have to have some plausible motivation to lie. He would have to cover up the previous statement -- or at least, try to cover it up. He would have to exhibit consternation, anger, fake anger, or some other indication that he is a aware of the truth. I do not see any of that. I have been dealing with him for years, and I have seen him act this way countless times. He never fools me. He does not seem to be trying to fool me. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
On 12-01-19 02:09 PM, Wolf Fischer wrote: Some of us tried to find where he said that the thing was shipped. The only thing that we found was his answer on the question "Is it gone?" --> "Yes". The question leaves a little room for interpretation in my opinion, but really - it's only very little room... Hmmm -- I was just taking Jed's statement at face value; I confess I didn't go swimming in the strange river of Rossi's statements to try to confirm it. Certainly there have been recent quotes from Rossi in which he strenuously denied claims that the customer had RETURNED it. I suppose, though, if he never shipped it, then he's being totally truthful in asserting that it wasn't returned ... right? Personally I stopped believing anything Rossi said after the "wet steam/dry steam" business blew up early last year. There are no doubt zillions of cases of hotshot researchers who lied about their results but none the less went on to produce real breakthroughs, as Jed seems to be fond of asserting, but I'm afraid the opposite is quite a bit more common. (Google "korea clone" for a perhaps more typical example.) Wolf On 12-01-19 10:11 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: This discussion about Rossi's 1 MW reactor is silly. The reactor has not shipped anywhere. He said it has not shipped, and it is obvious from the photos it has not. Previously he said he did ship it. Now he says he did not. He is contradicting himself. He often does that. I would not call it a "lie" He said it shipped. That's a binary statement, either true or false. If false, I, personally, would call it a "lie". In fact, for the most part, when a vendor says they shipped something and they really didn't, most folks would call that a "lie". Photos indicate Rossi didn't ship it. That makes his statement false, thus, as I said, making it what most folks would call a "lie". (That's what a lie IS, for goodness' sake! It didn't ship, he knew perfectly well it didn't ship, and he said it did ship. Right?) Now Rossi says it didn't ship, which most people would characterize as an "admission", though he didn't couch it quite that way. (But of course he didn't say "I admit it didn't ship" -- if you're covering up an earlier lie, it's always better to make it sound like the current story was true all along, and anything else is just mistakes, misunderstandings, or stuff to be ignored and/or dismissed.) Just what would he have to do, Jed, for you to say he "lied" ? in the usual sense because he makes no effort to cover up or explain the contradiction. He says "X" on Monday and "not X" on Tuesday as if it makes no difference. Yup, he's what most folks would call a pathological liar. Yet you seem to be saying that because he lies habitually, nearly constantly, we should conclude that he really doesn't lie at all. I don't quite follow that. As if he never expected to be believed in the first instance, and he did not mean it. This is a totally bizarre characterization of his behavior, IMHO. Truth is malleable in his imagination. Maybe; I don't have a direct line into his imagination. From where I'm sitting he just looks like a pathological liar.
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
Some of us tried to find where he said that the thing was shipped. The only thing that we found was his answer on the question "Is it gone?" --> "Yes". The question leaves a little room for interpretation in my opinion, but really - it's only very little room... Wolf On 12-01-19 10:11 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: This discussion about Rossi's 1 MW reactor is silly. The reactor has not shipped anywhere. He said it has not shipped, and it is obvious from the photos it has not. Previously he said he did ship it. Now he says he did not. He is contradicting himself. He often does that. I would not call it a "lie" He said it shipped. That's a binary statement, either true or false. If false, I, personally, would call it a "lie". In fact, for the most part, when a vendor says they shipped something and they really didn't, most folks would call that a "lie". Photos indicate Rossi didn't ship it. That makes his statement false, thus, as I said, making it what most folks would call a "lie". (That's what a lie IS, for goodness' sake! It didn't ship, he knew perfectly well it didn't ship, and he said it did ship. Right?) Now Rossi says it didn't ship, which most people would characterize as an "admission", though he didn't couch it quite that way. (But of course he didn't say "I admit it didn't ship" -- if you're covering up an earlier lie, it's always better to make it sound like the current story was true all along, and anything else is just mistakes, misunderstandings, or stuff to be ignored and/or dismissed.) Just what would he have to do, Jed, for you to say he "lied" ? in the usual sense because he makes no effort to cover up or explain the contradiction. He says "X" on Monday and "not X" on Tuesday as if it makes no difference. Yup, he's what most folks would call a pathological liar. Yet you seem to be saying that because he lies habitually, nearly constantly, we should conclude that he really doesn't lie at all. I don't quite follow that. As if he never expected to be believed in the first instance, and he did not mean it. This is a totally bizarre characterization of his behavior, IMHO. Truth is malleable in his imagination. Maybe; I don't have a direct line into his imagination. From where I'm sitting he just looks like a pathological liar.
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
On 12-01-19 10:11 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: This discussion about Rossi's 1 MW reactor is silly. The reactor has not shipped anywhere. He said it has not shipped, and it is obvious from the photos it has not. Previously he said he did ship it. Now he says he did not. He is contradicting himself. He often does that. I would not call it a "lie" He said it shipped. That's a binary statement, either true or false. If false, I, personally, would call it a "lie". In fact, for the most part, when a vendor says they shipped something and they really didn't, most folks would call that a "lie". Photos indicate Rossi didn't ship it. That makes his statement false, thus, as I said, making it what most folks would call a "lie". (That's what a lie IS, for goodness' sake! It didn't ship, he knew perfectly well it didn't ship, and he said it did ship. Right?) Now Rossi says it didn't ship, which most people would characterize as an "admission", though he didn't couch it quite that way. (But of course he didn't say "I admit it didn't ship" -- if you're covering up an earlier lie, it's always better to make it sound like the current story was true all along, and anything else is just mistakes, misunderstandings, or stuff to be ignored and/or dismissed.) Just what would he have to do, Jed, for you to say he "lied" ? in the usual sense because he makes no effort to cover up or explain the contradiction. He says "X" on Monday and "not X" on Tuesday as if it makes no difference. Yup, he's what most folks would call a pathological liar. Yet you seem to be saying that because he lies habitually, nearly constantly, we should conclude that he really doesn't lie at all. I don't quite follow that. As if he never expected to be believed in the first instance, and he did not mean it. This is a totally bizarre characterization of his behavior, IMHO. Truth is malleable in his imagination. Maybe; I don't have a direct line into his imagination. From where I'm sitting he just looks like a pathological liar.
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 8:13 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: > > There is no doubt he is accomplished engineer. He has invented many > important products. > Just out curiosity, which are those? May we have a list? Does that include waste to fuel conversion? How about heat to electricity conversion? Those didn't seem to work out very well.
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
Rossi's best contribution so far has been the tabloid like attention he has brought to the field and I credit him with that. He has yet to reduce the CO2 emissions of the planet and primarily increased it with his hot air... I am sure you won't mind having your next surgery done by a mail order doctor. On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 11:14 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: > Terry Blanton wrote: > > >> > If that is all I had to do to become a licensed engineer or other >> > professional, then I would also be a doctor and a professional athlete >> since >> > I read sports illustrated and medical journals. >> >> Little more is required to earn a Nobel Peace Prize. >> > > Or a Nobel in physics. Credentials have nothing to do with it. > > - Jed > >
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
Chemical Engineer wrote: > I agree with most of what you say. Please remember Rossi also claimed he > received a Chemical Engineering degree from a mail-order university > That is incorrect. He has an engineering degree from a legit university, and a fake PhD from a mail order university. There is no doubt he is accomplished engineer. He has invented many important products. I have loads of proof of that from other people who have worked with him. There is no doubt in my mind he is a genius, and he has made gigantic contributions to cold fusion. Credentials are unimportant. The fact that he has a mail order degree is of no importance at all. You should ignore that kind of thing. > So I am not sure he really is an engineer. > I am sure he is. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
Terry Blanton wrote: > > If that is all I had to do to become a licensed engineer or other > > professional, then I would also be a doctor and a professional athlete > since > > I read sports illustrated and medical journals. > > Little more is required to earn a Nobel Peace Prize. > Or a Nobel in physics. Credentials have nothing to do with it. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
Gotta like this guy. Go Terry Go. AG On 20/01/2012 2:25 AM, Terry Blanton wrote: On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 10:37 AM, Chemical Engineer wrote: If that is all I had to do to become a licensed engineer or other professional, then I would also be a doctor and a professional athlete since I read sports illustrated and medical journals. Little more is required to earn a Nobel Peace Prize. T
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 10:37 AM, Chemical Engineer wrote: > If that is all I had to do to become a licensed engineer or other > professional, then I would also be a doctor and a professional athlete since > I read sports illustrated and medical journals. Little more is required to earn a Nobel Peace Prize. T
Re: [Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
Jed, I agree with most of what you say. Please remember Rossi also claimed he received a Chemical Engineering degree from a mail-order university shutdown later for fraud that required students to "read magazines" to get your degree. So I am not sure he really is an engineer. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kensington_University If that is all I had to do to become a licensed engineer or other professional, then I would also be a doctor and a professional athlete since I read sports illustrated and medical journals. On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 10:11 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: > This discussion about Rossi's 1 MW reactor is silly. The reactor has not > shipped anywhere. He said it has not shipped, and it is obvious from the > photos it has not. > > Previously he said he did ship it. Now he says he did not. He is > contradicting himself. He often does that. I would not call it a "lie" in > the usual sense because he makes no effort to cover up or explain the > contradiction. He says "X" on Monday and "not X" on Tuesday as if it makes > no difference. As if he never expected to be believed in the first > instance, and he did not mean it. Truth is malleable in his imagination. He > sees what is in his own mind more clearly than reality. Many people are > like that, especially creative people such as artists and writers. It is a > little unusual to meet an engineer like this, but there have been some. > Tesla was a famous example. > > If Rossi's claims rested upon his personal credibility you would be crazy > to believe any of them. Fortunately, other people have tested his machines > and observed the factory heater; he has been independently replicated by > Defkalion; and despite the problems with the tests he has done they are > irrefutable. > > I have been dealing with Rossi for a couple of years now. One thing I know > about him for sure: he often says things he does not mean. I would not say > "you can't trust him." It goes deeper than. I would say you cannot be sure > he is talking about reality rather than what he sees in his own > imagination, or what he wishes were true. He is describing an idealized > form of reality that he alone sees. He is also trying to manipulate people > or fool them by saying outrageous things he does not really mean. He prides > himself on his ability to manipulate people, including me, but actually he > is inept at that. He upsets people instead of outwitting them. Again, that > includes me personally. > > As I have said before, I have never seen him lie or exaggerate about > technical aspects of his device. Engineers are often like that. They are > sometimes honest about engineering and blatant liars when it comes to > paying their share of the bill at the restaurant, or having an affair with > your wife. Perhaps he has lied about technical subjects but I have not > caught him. However, when it comes to his business affairs, or arrangements > that he and I were trying to make together, or what I have said and done, > he has often lied. Sometimes so extravagantly and so obviously that I do > not think he ever intended to fool anyone. > > People are complicated. Rossi is particularly complicated and > contradictory. I would not want to do business with him, as I have often > said. > > - Jed > >
[Vo]:Rossi often says things he does not mean
This discussion about Rossi's 1 MW reactor is silly. The reactor has not shipped anywhere. He said it has not shipped, and it is obvious from the photos it has not. Previously he said he did ship it. Now he says he did not. He is contradicting himself. He often does that. I would not call it a "lie" in the usual sense because he makes no effort to cover up or explain the contradiction. He says "X" on Monday and "not X" on Tuesday as if it makes no difference. As if he never expected to be believed in the first instance, and he did not mean it. Truth is malleable in his imagination. He sees what is in his own mind more clearly than reality. Many people are like that, especially creative people such as artists and writers. It is a little unusual to meet an engineer like this, but there have been some. Tesla was a famous example. If Rossi's claims rested upon his personal credibility you would be crazy to believe any of them. Fortunately, other people have tested his machines and observed the factory heater; he has been independently replicated by Defkalion; and despite the problems with the tests he has done they are irrefutable. I have been dealing with Rossi for a couple of years now. One thing I know about him for sure: he often says things he does not mean. I would not say "you can't trust him." It goes deeper than. I would say you cannot be sure he is talking about reality rather than what he sees in his own imagination, or what he wishes were true. He is describing an idealized form of reality that he alone sees. He is also trying to manipulate people or fool them by saying outrageous things he does not really mean. He prides himself on his ability to manipulate people, including me, but actually he is inept at that. He upsets people instead of outwitting them. Again, that includes me personally. As I have said before, I have never seen him lie or exaggerate about technical aspects of his device. Engineers are often like that. They are sometimes honest about engineering and blatant liars when it comes to paying their share of the bill at the restaurant, or having an affair with your wife. Perhaps he has lied about technical subjects but I have not caught him. However, when it comes to his business affairs, or arrangements that he and I were trying to make together, or what I have said and done, he has often lied. Sometimes so extravagantly and so obviously that I do not think he ever intended to fool anyone. People are complicated. Rossi is particularly complicated and contradictory. I would not want to do business with him, as I have often said. - Jed
