Re: [Vo]:excess power as either anomolous heating or cooling
It seems like a sensible test if nuclear reactions/transformation are suppose to be occurring. Harry On Sun, Jan 27, 2013 at 5:47 PM, Daniel Rocha wrote: > What do you think of my suggestion on their forums? > > http://www.quantumheat.org/index.php/forum/welcome-mat/87-neutrino-detection-as-definitive-proof-and-hi > > > > > 2013/1/27 Harry Veeder >> >> Oh sorry, it is here: >> http://www.quantumheat.org/index.php/follow/follow-2/204-much-lower-levels >> >> It is mentioned in a few places in the discussion. In one instance, if >> I recall correctly, someone calls it >> "negative power". >> >> harry >> >> >> >> On Sun, Jan 27, 2013 at 5:38 PM, Daniel Rocha >> wrote: >> > >> > What is the link, please? >> > >> > 2013/1/27 Harry Veeder >> >> >> >> , the data now >> >> suggest the possibility of some slight anomalous cooling effect. >> > >> > -- >> > Daniel Rocha - RJ >> > danieldi...@gmail.com >> > > > > -- > Daniel Rocha - RJ > danieldi...@gmail.com
Re: [Vo]:excess power as either anomolous heating or cooling
Harry Veeder wrote: > However, the data now > suggest the possibility of some slight anomalous cooling effect. I > don't know if this cooling is real or the result some minor > calibration error . . . No instruments are perfect. You never get exactly zero. There is always a bias, positive or negative. A small bias is meaningless. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:excess power as either anomolous heating or cooling
On Sun, Jan 27, 2013 at 7:53 PM, wrote: > Cooling is not against the second law. > > There exist "endothermic" chemical reactions how makes cooling. > > There also are endothermic nuclear reactions. > To quote Mizuno's book, "Nuclear Transmutation": it is not necessarily the case that heat production means a reaction, and no heat means no reaction. There may be endothermic reactions that absorb heat instead of producing it. This is an important clue to understanding the reaction mechanism. In many experiments until now [1997], samples that did not produce heat were put aside and not analyzed. I believe important data may well have been overlooked when these samples were ignored. (p. 94.) Eric
Re: [Vo]:excess power as either anomolous heating or cooling
Cooling is not against the second law. There exist "endothermic" chemical reactions how makes cooling. There also are endothermic nuclear reactions. This includes 7Li+n→ 4He+3T +n -2.466 MeV, observe the negative sign (-). And fission of light elements and fusion of heavy elements. On Sun, 27 Jan 2013 22:03:28 -0500, ChemE Stewart wrote: "Cooling and going against the second law of thermodynamics" Cooling only goes against the second law if the particle(s) never give the entropy back to their surroundings, which is not known Stewart darkmattersalot,com On Sun, Jan 27, 2013 at 9:53 PM, Daniel Rocha wrote: Maybe the wire is getting old after so much testing. To be sure, another one should be made. 2013/1/28 Jouni Valkonen Is this then yet another failure for cold fusion, or is it still too early to tell? -- Daniel Rocha - RJ danieldi...@gmail.com [3] Links: -- [1] mailto:danieldi...@gmail.com [2] mailto:jounivalko...@gmail.com [3] mailto:danieldi...@gmail.com
Re: [Vo]:excess power as either anomolous heating or cooling
"Cooling and going against the second law of thermodynamics" Cooling only goes against the second law if the particle(s) never give the entropy back to their surroundings, which is not known Stewart darkmattersalot,com On Sun, Jan 27, 2013 at 9:53 PM, Daniel Rocha wrote: > Maybe the wire is getting old after so much testing. To be sure, another > one should be made. > > > 2013/1/28 Jouni Valkonen > >> >> Is this then yet another failure for cold fusion, or is it still too >> early to tell? >> > > -- > Daniel Rocha - RJ > danieldi...@gmail.com >
Re: [Vo]:excess power as either anomolous heating or cooling
Maybe the wire is getting old after so much testing. To be sure, another one should be made. 2013/1/28 Jouni Valkonen > > Is this then yet another failure for cold fusion, or is it still too early > to tell? > -- Daniel Rocha - RJ danieldi...@gmail.com
Re: [Vo]:excess power as either anomolous heating or cooling
I would say with 99.98 % confidence that anomalous cooling hints to the calibration error of instruments. There should not be any doubts for that. Cooling and going against the second law of thermodynamics, however is not that particularly surprising. Entropy decreased at large scale when the universe was just three seconds old. The primordial nucleosynthesis compressed huge amount of energy into protons and alpha particles. This caused entropy to decrease in isolated system. Also in supernovae explosions, entropy decreases when energy is trapped into atoms heavier than Ni-62. Hydrino formation goes also against the second law of thermodynamics and it causes thus the cooling of isolated system, because hydrinos are stable. However as I know that Mills' theory is wrong at fundamental level, this does not do as an explanation. However, hydrinos are interesting thought experiments, because it is trivial to envision logical conditions where the classical second law of thermodynamics will fail in isolated system. Is this then yet another failure for cold fusion, or is it still too early to tell? —Jouni On Jan 28, 2013, at 12:35 AM, Harry Veeder wrote: > The MFMP results are not looking very good at the moment as excess > heat appears to be marginal or non-existent. However, the data now > suggest the possibility of some slight anomalous cooling effect. I > don't know if this cooling is real or the result some minor > calibration error, but it raises the question of how we estimate > excess power. > > Although we tend to associate excess power with anomalous heating, it > seems to me that a system can exhibit excess power (or over unity) > through either persistent anomalous cooling or persistent anomalous > heating . But what if the system oscillates between periods of > anomalous cooling and anomalous heating? Simply taking a time average > would make the excess power appear to be much less or even > non-existent. > > harry >
Re: [Vo]:excess power as either anomolous heating or cooling
What do you think of my suggestion on their forums? http://www.quantumheat.org/index.php/forum/welcome-mat/87-neutrino-detection-as-definitive-proof-and-hi 2013/1/27 Harry Veeder > Oh sorry, it is here: > http://www.quantumheat.org/index.php/follow/follow-2/204-much-lower-levels > > It is mentioned in a few places in the discussion. In one instance, if > I recall correctly, someone calls it > "negative power". > > harry > > > > On Sun, Jan 27, 2013 at 5:38 PM, Daniel Rocha > wrote: > > > > What is the link, please? > > > > 2013/1/27 Harry Veeder > >> > >> , the data now > >> suggest the possibility of some slight anomalous cooling effect. > > > > -- > > Daniel Rocha - RJ > > danieldi...@gmail.com > > -- Daniel Rocha - RJ danieldi...@gmail.com
Re: [Vo]:excess power as either anomolous heating or cooling
Oh sorry, it is here: http://www.quantumheat.org/index.php/follow/follow-2/204-much-lower-levels It is mentioned in a few places in the discussion. In one instance, if I recall correctly, someone calls it "negative power". harry On Sun, Jan 27, 2013 at 5:38 PM, Daniel Rocha wrote: > > What is the link, please? > > 2013/1/27 Harry Veeder >> >> , the data now >> suggest the possibility of some slight anomalous cooling effect. > > -- > Daniel Rocha - RJ > danieldi...@gmail.com
Re: [Vo]:excess power as either anomolous heating or cooling
What is the link, please? 2013/1/27 Harry Veeder > , the data now > suggest the possibility of some slight anomalous cooling effect. -- Daniel Rocha - RJ danieldi...@gmail.com
[Vo]:excess power as either anomolous heating or cooling
The MFMP results are not looking very good at the moment as excess heat appears to be marginal or non-existent. However, the data now suggest the possibility of some slight anomalous cooling effect. I don't know if this cooling is real or the result some minor calibration error, but it raises the question of how we estimate excess power. Although we tend to associate excess power with anomalous heating, it seems to me that a system can exhibit excess power (or over unity) through either persistent anomalous cooling or persistent anomalous heating . But what if the system oscillates between periods of anomalous cooling and anomalous heating? Simply taking a time average would make the excess power appear to be much less or even non-existent. harry
