Re: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[John Currie]

On 16/01/2004, at 10:06 AM, L Pohl wrote:


A telling quote from Justine Milne, BigPond managing director:

"iPods don't (work with BigPond Music) - that's Apple's device and  it's an
Apple ambush, I guess the question is would you be prepared to bet  against
Microsoft? I wouldn't," Mr Milne said.



Ambush ??? And this jerk is the MD of bigPond. Shudder.



I've even seen one journalist refer to Apple's "Proprietary file 
format". Proprietary?? AAC is part of the MPEG4 standard. With which 
particular non-proprietary standard does WMP comply?


What's wrong with just using MP3? WMP recognises it, and it actually 
works on MP3 players! All of them! And we wouldn't be stuffing 
around  with all this platform rubbish.


Who would have thought that the old platform wars would be 
resurrected  in the online music scene. Music files have 
historically been among the  most platform-agnostic around, and here 
we have all sorts of companies  (it's not just Telstra) doing their 
utmost to make sure their fare will  not work on the iPod.






Being a tin ear i don't understand all this, however,.

Does this mean that HP have bought themselves a Lemon  ipod   not an 
Apple iPod ?


It would not seem to be in Telestra's commercial interest to  act 
this way.  As we still own 51% perhaps it's a matter which should be 
drawn to the  Ministers attention ?


Now I'll go back to listening to Peter Dawson on my  78 gramophone.
John

Re: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[Craig Ringer]

I'd pay extra for non-encrypted MP3 over WMA or apple-AAC, just for the 
convenience of not having to battle stupid player programs and silly 
restrictions. I'd pay quite a bit extra to get copies in FLAC format 
sometimes, too. Wow - they could have _margins_. Alas, again the music 
industry prevents this.


Speaking of which

http://theregister.co.uk/content/6/34896.html

Craig Ringer

Re: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[Mark Secker]

this  quote comes to mind... from a certain Rolling Stone reporter we 
all know and love and/or hate:


The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long 
plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die 
like dogs. There's also a negative side.

Hunter S. Thompson
--
~
Mark Secker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
ph#6488 1855 (ECEL)
ECEL Computer Support Officer, University of Western Australia.
CRICOS Provider No. 00126G
~

"present day
 present time  "

Re: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[Craig Ringer]

Peter Hinchliffe wrote:
I've even seen one journalist refer to Apple's "Proprietary file  
format". Proprietary?? AAC is part of the MPEG4 standard. With which  
particular non-proprietary standard does WMP comply?


AFAIK, while the AAC encoding is standard the DRM wrapper and encryption 
used by Apple for iTunes are not. As such, it is a proprietary format.


What's wrong with just using MP3? WMP recognises it, and it actually  
works on MP3 players! All of them! And we wouldn't be stuffing around  
with all this platform rubbish.


The music companies are afraid of non-DRM formats and won't allow music 
stores to distribute their property in such formats. This problem will 
persist until we can finially persuade them that DRM DOES NOT WORK so 
MP3/Ogg/Flac are just as good. After all, the DRM schemes all get 
cracked - and if you use a standard format in the first place, you don't 
have to pay royalties on your DRM system.


I'd pay extra for non-encrypted MP3 over WMA or apple-AAC, just for the 
convenience of not having to battle stupid player programs and silly 
restrictions. I'd pay quite a bit extra to get copies in FLAC format 
sometimes, too. Wow - they could have _margins_. Alas, again the music 
industry prevents this.


Oh, and I could finially buy music that I could keep on both my desktop 
and my laptop, have restoreable after backups, and expect not to 
mysteriously not work after OS changes. Not having to reboot into 
windows to play it would be nice, too.


Craig Ringer

Re: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[Craig Ringer]

Peter Hinchliffe wrote:
Please, please Apple, get ITMS working in Oz before we are engulfed in 
this Windows-only rubbish.


Hmm. ITMS is still locked down AC3 that needs a custom player to use. It 
just happens to be an Apple custom player.


The erroneous claim that there is no WMA player for the Mac is bad 
enough,


It's possible that it doesn't support all of the DRM (content lock-down) 
features of the Windows variant, which uses Windows Rights Management OS 
services. Then again, as MS wants WMA9 DRM to be the industry 
"standard," one would think they'd want to include support in all their 
media products. Maybe Telstra just don't have a clue - it's not as if 
that'd be a first.


but then they (Telstra) have managed to make sure that the key 
links in the Flash-based database menu don't work on the Mac, so whether 
or not they believe there is a Mac-compatible media player ceases to be 
an issue. The site is simply unusable on a Mac (I've tried Safari, 
Mozilla, OmniWeb and Internet Explorer).


Download Windows Media Player 9, then spoof your browser ID string and 
see what happens. I know you can do it with Mozilla using a user_pref() 
setting or a toolbar plugin, and no doubt the others make it possible 
somehow.


Craig Ringer

Re: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[Peter Hinchliffe]

On 16/01/2004, at 10:06 AM, L Pohl wrote:


A telling quote from Justine Milne, BigPond managing director:

"iPods don't (work with BigPond Music) - that's Apple's device and  
it's an
Apple ambush, I guess the question is would you be prepared to bet  
against

Microsoft? I wouldn't," Mr Milne said.




Ambush ??? And this jerk is the MD of bigPond. Shudder.




I've even seen one journalist refer to Apple's "Proprietary file  
format". Proprietary?? AAC is part of the MPEG4 standard. With which  
particular non-proprietary standard does WMP comply?


What's wrong with just using MP3? WMP recognises it, and it actually  
works on MP3 players! All of them! And we wouldn't be stuffing around  
with all this platform rubbish.


Who would have thought that the old platform wars would be resurrected  
in the online music scene. Music files have historically been among the  
most platform-agnostic around, and here we have all sorts of companies  
(it's not just Telstra) doing their utmost to make sure their fare will  
not work on the iPod.



--
Peter Hinchliffe
Apwin Computer ServicesFileMaker Pro Solutions Developer
Perth,  
Western Australia   Phone (618) 9332 6482Fax (618) 9332 0913

   Mac because I prefer it -- Windows because I have to.

Re: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[Rod Lavington]

On 16/1/04 10:06 AM, "L Pohl" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> On 16/1/04 9:44 AM, "Peter Hinchliffe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Well I have, and all I can say is Good Lord!
>> 
>> Please, please Apple, get ITMS working in Oz before we are engulfed in
>> this Windows-only rubbish.
>> 
>> The erroneous claim that there is no WMA player for the Mac is bad
>> enough, but then they (Telstra) have managed to make sure that the key
>> links in the Flash-based database menu don't work on the Mac, so
>> whether or not they believe there is a Mac-compatible media player
>> ceases to be an issue. The site is simply unusable on a Mac (I've tried
>> Safari, Mozilla, OmniWeb and Internet Explorer).
>> 
> 
> A telling quote from Justine Milne, BigPond managing director:
> 
> "iPods don't (work with BigPond Music) - that's Apple's device and it's an
> Apple ambush, I guess the question is would you be prepared to bet against
> Microsoft? I wouldn't," Mr Milne said.
> 
> 
> 
> Ambush ??? And this jerk is the MD of bigPond. Shudder.
> 

Obviously market share for mp3/wma players means absolutely nothing to this
moron!

Then again, it *is* from Telstra If it is anything like their broadband,
they will suck you in with great offers to start with, then change the
rules!  Anyway, nobody still has managed to get the Beatles online yet :-)

Seeya

Rod!

drones and clones Re: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[Mark Secker]

A telling quote from Justine Milne, BigPond managing director:

"iPods don't (work with BigPond Music) - that's Apple's device and it's an
Apple ambush, I guess the question is would you be prepared to bet against
Microsoft? I wouldn't," Mr Milne said.


"You have been assimilated in to the borgatus collective"









Ambush ??? And this jerk is the MD of bigPond. Shudder.


yeh  trust me I have a work colleague  just like this  who, if he 
comes across a mac he tells the user "It's an Apple, they suck " (or 
words to that effect)  then rings me and bitches about how "All 
apples are cr#p and  are useless" - seriously he rang me up to ask 
how to get in to a B&W G3 ... he'd taken all the torques head screws 
out and had the side plate plastic covers off and he blowing off down 
the phone about how F*#ked macs are because you can't even open their 
cases and we have a manager who still pushes the "more expensive, 
incompatible & no software" line


I suspect that it is plain old fear and/or laziness  of taking the 
small amount of time to learn a enough about something other than 
Intel and Microsoft.



--
~
Mark Secker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
ph#6488 1855 (ECEL)
ECEL Computer Support Officer, University of Western Australia.
CRICOS Provider No. 00126G
~

"present day
 present time  "

Re: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[Bart Raffaele]

Hey all

I just viewed the bigpondmusic man oh! man! what a lot of crap I'll give
Bigpond 3 months and they'll shut it down and that's been generous.
We should have a friendly pool on how long before they'll shut it down:)

As Apple said we where 10 years in front of our competitors in 1984 so as
well in this case.

Come on http://www.apple.com.au/itunes/musicstore/ (not a real web site)

Oh yeh! I'm with bigpond not my choice .

Bart

Re: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[L Pohl]

On 16/1/04 9:44 AM, "Peter Hinchliffe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Well I have, and all I can say is Good Lord!
> 
> Please, please Apple, get ITMS working in Oz before we are engulfed in
> this Windows-only rubbish.
> 
> The erroneous claim that there is no WMA player for the Mac is bad
> enough, but then they (Telstra) have managed to make sure that the key
> links in the Flash-based database menu don't work on the Mac, so
> whether or not they believe there is a Mac-compatible media player
> ceases to be an issue. The site is simply unusable on a Mac (I've tried
> Safari, Mozilla, OmniWeb and Internet Explorer).
> 

A telling quote from Justine Milne, BigPond managing director:

"iPods don't (work with BigPond Music) - that's Apple's device and it's an
Apple ambush, I guess the question is would you be prepared to bet against
Microsoft? I wouldn't," Mr Milne said.



Ambush ??? And this jerk is the MD of bigPond. Shudder.

propagating industry clones Re: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[Mark Secker]

 "In order to download and purchase music from BigPond Music you must have
 a compatible Windows Media Player.

 At present there is no compatible Windows Media Player for Mac OS and as
 such you will be unable to play any downloaded music. You will be able to
 browse the BigPond Music Catalogue."


WMP 

 well browsing seems to come up with a dogs breakfast of 
industry standardized cloned "artists" so lets do a bit of searching


OK lets search... 20 minutes latter results in a few crossover 
artists that would be covered by pretty much buying a couple of JJJ 
hottest 100 albums


 very token effort on the alternative/underground side of things
--
~
Mark Secker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
ph#6488 1855 (ECEL)
ECEL Computer Support Officer, University of Western Australia.
CRICOS Provider No. 00126G
~

"present day
 present time  "

Re: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[Peter Hinchliffe]

On 16/01/2004, at 8:42 AM, Bart Raffaele wrote:


Hi all

Bigpond have just launched there version of Apple's Music Store,
http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp
Hopefully Apple's Music Store is just around the corner.
Hmm competion that's what i like to see  , sooner or later it's all 
going to

be like the mobile phone industries

I haven't look at it yet but will be .

Bart



Well I have, and all I can say is Good Lord!

Please, please Apple, get ITMS working in Oz before we are engulfed in 
this Windows-only rubbish.


The erroneous claim that there is no WMA player for the Mac is bad 
enough, but then they (Telstra) have managed to make sure that the key 
links in the Flash-based database menu don't work on the Mac, so 
whether or not they believe there is a Mac-compatible media player 
ceases to be an issue. The site is simply unusable on a Mac (I've tried 
Safari, Mozilla, OmniWeb and Internet Explorer).



--
Peter Hinchliffe
Apwin Computer ServicesFileMaker Pro Solutions Developer
Perth,  
Western Australia   Phone (618) 9332 6482Fax (618) 9332 0913

   Mac because I prefer it -- Windows because I have to.

RE: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[Kay, Richard]

Interestingly, the Online Flash Tutorial for the site depicts a geek holding an 
iBook! ;-)

-Original Message-
From: Steve Woods [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, 16 January 2004 8:50 AM
To: WAMUG Mailing List
Subject: Re: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp




Well they lost me from the start:

"In order to download and purchase music from BigPond Music you must have
a compatible Windows Media Player.

At present there is no compatible Windows Media Player for Mac OS and as
such you will be unable to play any downloaded music. You will be able to
browse the BigPond Music Catalogue."

Re: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[Daniel Kerr]

 
>> "In order to download and purchase music from BigPond Music you must have
>> a compatible Windows Media Player.
>> 
>> At present there is no compatible Windows Media Player for Mac OS and as
>> such you will be unable to play any downloaded music. You will be able to
>> browse the BigPond Music Catalogue."
>> 
OK,..in answer to my own post,..the word there must be "compatible". Because
even if you look at it in Safari or Explorer the "Buy" button is crossed
out. So you can't do anything but listen. Why they didn't just use a .mp3
format which I would have thought would be *more* compatible then Windows
Media format. *shrug* I don't know.

I must say though,..the originality of that site is fantastic! I don¹t think
I've seen the layout anywhere before,oh hold on,can someone say
iTunes Music Store?? :p (Sarcasm intended)

It makes you wonder if site layout is copyrighted really doesn't it? I mean
surely they have it it so similar to the Apple iTunes store that Apple could
get "picky" over it?
(Not being a lawyer I could be wrong here) ;o)

Oh well,..lets really hope the iTMS.au is really close,..it's so much
better,..and we can actually use it.

Enjoy!!

Kind Regards
Daniel Kerr
---
Daniel Kerr
MacWizardry

Phone: 0414 795 960
Email: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Web:   


**For everything Macintosh**

Re: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[Daniel Kerr]

On 16/1/04 8:49 AM, "Steve Woods" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>> Hi all
>> 
>> Bigpond have just launched there version of Apple's Music Store,
>> http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp
>> Hopefully Apple's Music Store is just around the corner.
>> Hmm competion that's what i like to see  , sooner or later it's all going
>> to
>> be like the mobile phone industries
>> 
>> I haven't look at it yet but will be .
>> 
>> Bart
> 
> Well they lost me from the start:
> 
> "In order to download and purchase music from BigPond Music you must have
> a compatible Windows Media Player.
> 
> At present there is no compatible Windows Media Player for Mac OS and as
> such you will be unable to play any downloaded music. You will be able to
> browse the BigPond Music Catalogue."
> 
> Bring on iTMS.au :)
> 
> Steve.


Um,...there is Windows Media Player for Mac. They even recently just
released Version 9 for Macintosh. (Only for OSX).

You can grab it from here.
<http://www.microsoft.com/mac/otherproducts/otherproducts.aspx?pid=windowsme
dia>

Unless I'm missing something of course. But this player will play any of the
.wma formats that PC's use.

Still I do hope the Apple ITMS in Australia gets here soon. (Hey it would be
nice to see iPhoto Book ordering while we're at it too!)

Hope that helps!

Kind Regards
Daniel Kerr
---
Daniel Kerr
MacWizardry

Phone: 0414 795 960
Email: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Web:   <http://www.macwizardry.com.au>


**For everything Macintosh**

Re: http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[Steve Woods]

> Hi all
>
> Bigpond have just launched there version of Apple's Music Store,
> http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp
> Hopefully Apple's Music Store is just around the corner.
> Hmm competion that's what i like to see  , sooner or later it's all going
> to
> be like the mobile phone industries
>
> I haven't look at it yet but will be .
>
> Bart

Well they lost me from the start:

"In order to download and purchase music from BigPond Music you must have
a compatible Windows Media Player.

At present there is no compatible Windows Media Player for Mac OS and as
such you will be unable to play any downloaded music. You will be able to
browse the BigPond Music Catalogue."

Bring on iTMS.au :)

Steve.

http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp

[Bart Raffaele]

Hi all

Bigpond have just launched there version of Apple's Music Store,
http://bigpondmusic.com/home.asp
Hopefully Apple's Music Store is just around the corner.
Hmm competion that's what i like to see  , sooner or later it's all going to
be like the mobile phone industries

I haven't look at it yet but will be .

Bart