[wdvltalk] Re: Is Netscape 4.x dead?
Oops, I meant to say ASP.NET 2.0 on any commercial hosts. Plenty of them around with 1.0 and/or 1.1 installed on production machines. Been a long day, sigh. Cheryl D. Wise Certified Professional Web Developer MS-MVP-FrontPage www.wiserways.com mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 713.353.0139 Office -Original Message- From: Cheryl D Wisementioned are BETA software. You won't find ASP.NET on any commercial host yet since there isn't even a "go live" license for it yet, just beta builds. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: "set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword" in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: Is Netscape 4.x dead?
They are available for testing only right now. Note all of those products you mentioned are BETA software. You won't find ASP.NET on any commercial host yet since there isn't even a "go live" license for it yet, just beta builds. There are lots of improvements in Whitbey/Visual Web Developer over the first release of Visual Studio.NET for the web developer. Seems someone at Microsoft has woken to and realized that web development IS DIFFERENT than Windows development and that web developers don't work the same was as windows programmers. BTW, even if you don't have an MSDN subscription you can get a copy of the Whitbey beta by ordering the CD http://lab.msdn.microsoft.com/vs2005/ The new membership and login classes are really nice. Too bad you can't use them on a production site yet. Cheryl D. Wise Certified Professional Web Developer MS-MVP-FrontPage www.wiserways.com mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 713.353.0139 Office -Original Message- From: Scott Glasgow Yes, and there are some very interesting, ==FREE== development tools available to work with asp.net 2.0 and other MS technologies. See http://lab.msdn.microsoft.com/express/ for availability of SQL Server 2005 Express, Visual Basic 2005 Express, Visual Web Developer Express, etc. The later provides a remarkably capable, streamlined way to create and maintain fully-featured data-driven asp.net 2.0 sites full of bells and whistles. The only drawback I can see is the (relative) paucity of providers currently supporting this level of asp.net. I would imagine that, in time, that will change. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: "set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword" in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: Eliminate Page Address when Printing
Thanks Stephen That worked beautifully. I was looking under option rather than page setup earlier. Ken The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: "set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword" in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: Eliminate Page Address when Printing
Ken, AFAIK, that's a client side setting dependant on the browser. This poses no problem though, since you'll be printing invoices from a limited number of locations, all under your clients direct control (presumably). So... just get in and fidget around with your browsers print settings (in IE and FireFox, it's "Page Setup..." under "File") and do the same for your clients machines :) - Stephen On Mon, 19 Jul 2004 11:50:02 -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hey Gang > > Been an awful long time since I have posted here. I hope everyone is doing > well and being prosperous. I am currently working on a site that will have > an admin section so that invoices can be printed at a retail location. My > problem is that the actual URL is being printed in the bottom left corner > of the page and I would rather that people not know this address. Does > anyone know of a way to prevent the printing of this information? I can > probably do it with a PDF but I would rather not go that route. Javascript > or CSS or anything would be prefferable. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: "set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword" in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Eliminate Page Address when Printing
Hey Gang Been an awful long time since I have posted here. I hope everyone is doing well and being prosperous. I am currently working on a site that will have an admin section so that invoices can be printed at a retail location. My problem is that the actual URL is being printed in the bottom left corner of the page and I would rather that people not know this address. Does anyone know of a way to prevent the printing of this information? I can probably do it with a PDF but I would rather not go that route. Javascript or CSS or anything would be prefferable. TIA Ken The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: "set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword" in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: Is Netscape 4.x dead?
Yes, and there are some very interesting, ==FREE== development tools available to work with asp.net 2.0 and other MS technologies. See http://lab.msdn.microsoft.com/express/ for availability of SQL Server 2005 Express, Visual Basic 2005 Express, Visual Web Developer Express, etc. The later provides a remarkably capable, streamlined way to create and maintain fully-featured data-driven asp.net 2.0 sites full of bells and whistles. The only drawback I can see is the (relative) paucity of providers currently supporting this level of asp.net. I would imagine that, in time, that will change. Cheers, Scott - Original Message - From: "Cheryl D Wise" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Monday, July 19, 2004 11:41 AM Subject: [wdvltalk] Re: Is Netscape 4.x dead? > Only one quibble with Andrew's comments. > > ASP.NET is a web standard and available for platforms other than MS. > Microsoft teamed with Berkley to create a FreeBSD/Mac version available for > free download > (http://msdn.microsoft.com/netframework/downloads/updates/default.aspx > scroll down and you'll find the 3 share source items available for > FreeBSD/Mac) and there is a Linux Open Source version 1.0 available right > now at www.go-mono.org > > > Cheryl D. Wise > Certified Professional Web Developer > MS-MVP-FrontPage > www.wiserways.com > mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 713.353.0139 Office > > -Original Message- > From: Trusz, Andrew > > Look at the proprietary implementation of xml, the invention of asp, the MS > dependence of .Net, and then speculate on the chances that IE Longhorn will > be standards compliant. MS isn't going to seriously adopt standards unless > and until there is a critical mass of standards compliant browser usage such > that IE users start to realize that while they are getting the same > information as other people it looks boring and plain by comparison. > > > . The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM . > To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: "set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword" in the body of the email. > To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: > http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub > > http://www.wdvl.com ___ > > You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% > > To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: > Jupitermedia Corp. > Attn: Discussion List Management > 475 Park Avenue South > New York, NY 10016 > > Please include the email address which you have been contacted with. > The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: "set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword" in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: Is Netscape 4.x dead?
Only one quibble with Andrew's comments. ASP.NET is a web standard and available for platforms other than MS. Microsoft teamed with Berkley to create a FreeBSD/Mac version available for free download (http://msdn.microsoft.com/netframework/downloads/updates/default.aspx scroll down and you'll find the 3 share source items available for FreeBSD/Mac) and there is a Linux Open Source version 1.0 available right now at www.go-mono.org Cheryl D. Wise Certified Professional Web Developer MS-MVP-FrontPage www.wiserways.com mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 713.353.0139 Office -Original Message- From: Trusz, Andrew Look at the proprietary implementation of xml, the invention of asp, the MS dependence of .Net, and then speculate on the chances that IE Longhorn will be standards compliant. MS isn't going to seriously adopt standards unless and until there is a critical mass of standards compliant browser usage such that IE users start to realize that while they are getting the same information as other people it looks boring and plain by comparison. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: "set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword" in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: Is Netscape 4.x dead?
Joe new computer user can have a Mac but I find mine sadly limiting. Personally I prefer the box model used by IE in "quirks" mode over the W3C standard. I'm sorry but it the W3C method makes it too danged difficult to keep calculate out box models. Doable but a PIA if you are trying to get multiple items floated in the correct order. IMHO padding and borders should be subtracted from the box size not added to it. Adding the margins, yes but anything inside the container be it content, padding or border width should not. After all you buy a picture frame (box), mat (padding) for your picture (content). I've seen pictures framed with a mat as large as the image and the same picture framed with a mat twice the size of the image (looks rather silly sometimes but its 'art'). I know the web is different from print but its like the model used in Flash where lines and fills start out separate and have to be grouped while every other graphics program under the sun (okay possible exaggeration since I haven't used every editor but all the majors PhotoShop, Fireworks, Illustrator, PSP, etc. work the same way) when you create circle, square, whatever, the fill and the line are one unit for manipulation until you ungroup them. But I digress, it was only about a month ago that Microsoft announced that they would be working on IE again. IE 6 in standards mode isn't that much different from Mozilla, etc. IE 5x is losing market share pretty rapidly (thank god). Microsoft has been making a push for more standards support in its products. I'm running the Whitbey beta, asp.net 2.0 and it does output decent XHTML. Not perfect but no tool writes perfect html/xhtml. As far as whatever browser will be in Longhorn I haven't the faintest clue. The few demos I've seen didn't include the browser just the new interface and file system. IE has support for pngs just not full alpha transparency support just the gif like index transparency and has for a long time. Cheryl D. Wise Certified Professional Web Developer MS-MVP-FrontPage www.wiserways.com mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 713.353.0139 Office -Original Message- From: Ross Clutterbuck. I doubt this will ever happen, although it's probably for reasons of mad conspiracy on my part!! However awful it may be for us professionals to code for, or more accurately how easy it is to code for but it's insanely inaccurate forgivings make it difficult to code cross-platform *correctly*, it's still, IMO, the easiest browser for Joe Soap public to use, requires no pratting about installing (it's available straight out of the box to the majority of computer owners in the world - boy I wish new computer users would by a Mac once in a while!) and while it holds the biggest market share, it can serve to allow Microsoft to dictate the direction if Web development and sway the standards should they so choose. How long can W3C hold out saying "but Mr. Gates, the browser that has 90,000% market share does things wrong"? I can honestly see the day coming when IE7 still refuses to implement standards correctly or completely and W3C buckle under the pressure and re-write things to accomodate Microsoft's steadfast reluctance to do things correctly. Either that or be made to look foolish and a waste of time. What about PNG? Surely to god IE can use PNG transparency natively by now? Of course it can't (note: anybody know if IE7 can do it?) because if it could there would be no reason to use the GIF format any more (OK, I still find even PNG-8 to be a little weighty compared to GIF but with broadband connections becoming more commonplace throughout the world it's not going to be an issue for much longer). And with no reason to use GIF, it's possible that the *creation* of such images will no longer be supported by the graphics packages out there. In short: Compuserve don't get their royalties no more, and that's an awful lot of money. Can anybody see a little backhander from Compuserve to Microsoft here? If the most proliferent browser still makes the use of GIF-killer more hassle than it's worth then there's every reason to keep GIF alive. And before Microsoft lawyers start banging my door down after illegally reading this e-mail, I would like to point out that these are my own thoughts and opinions - I make no claims of their accuracy (although how much does Free Speech cost these days?), but if you get riled about it maybe I touched a nerve there, eh? Just realised the time - I think I better get back to work! MOU who's off to take his paranoia medication now :D The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: "set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword" in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://w
[wdvltalk] Re: onMouseOver for table rows? Cells?
Thanks, Stephen, Scott et all.
Been away for about a week. Appreciate the help.
All the best,
Mike
Michael M Milligan
-Original Message-
From: Stephen Caudill [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, July 09, 2004 9:55 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [wdvltalk] Re: onMouseOver for table rows? Cells?
The text below should read:
"Anything will set off an onMouseOver event when an event listener is
attached to it."
e.g.:
or the preferred method for attaching events in modern, DOM compliant
browsers given the following HTML:
where the following is located in an included .js file:
function doSomethingAnnoying(){
//my annoying onload code
}
document.getElementById('myObjID').attachEvent("onload",
doSomethingAnnoying);
this helps achieve separation of structure and behavior (the behavior
bit being the javascript) and get's you one step closer to coding
eutopia :)
- Stephen
On Fri, 9 Jul 2004 12:45:26 -0400, Stephen Caudill <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> Everything set's off an onMouseOver event with a listener attached.
. The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM .
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[wdvltalk] Re: Is Netscape 4.x dead?
-Original Message- From: Ross Clutterbuck [Re: Is Netscape 4.x dead? I don't worry about older browsers per se, but like Rudy it's the @import trick I use to keep the design work hidden from horrors like Netscape 4.7 (and I'm most pleased of myself I've not used a single CSS hack in about a year now). I've never understood the mentality to do browser sniffs or deliver different content to different browsers - if you do your job properly you shouldn't need to, even with the plethora of bugs, quirks and inconsistencies we see in all the browsers out there (although I'd love to see IE dead or Microsoft get their asses in gear, read the specs and stop acting like children - although we would need to see the end of the Compuserve "PNG will kill GIF - please keep it alive for us" backhander conspiracy to do it properly). + rudy and Russ have the right of it -- avoid the hacks and the sniffs. Older browsers, as Cheryl says, can get the content right even if it isn't fully tricked out. Non-compliant browsers of all sorts should degrade with reasonable grace. Microsoft has its browser functioning perfectly for the MS Wide Web. IE6 with its compounding bug and bug workarounds fits perfectly with all the other bug ridden MS applications. Cross-platform reliability doesn't seem to be much of a goal for MS. Cherry picking standards to form a proprietary implementation seems more in keeping with passed performance. Look at the proprietary implementation of xml, the invention of asp, the MS dependence of .Net, and then speculate on the chances that IE Longhorn will be standards compliant. MS isn't going to seriously adopt standards unless and until there is a critical mass of standards compliant browser usage such that IE users start to realize that while they are getting the same information as other people it looks boring and plain by comparison. drew The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: "set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword" in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
[wdvltalk] Re: Is Netscape 4.x dead?
I don't worry about older browsers per se, but like Rudy it's the @import trick I use to keep the design work hidden from horrors like Netscape 4.7 (and I'm most pleased of myself I've not used a single CSS hack in about a year now). I've never understood the mentality to do browser sniffs or deliver different content to different browsers - if you do your job properly you shouldn't need to, even with the plethora of bugs, quirks and inconsistencies we see in all the browsers out there (although I'd love to see IE dead or Microsoft get their asses in gear, read the specs and stop acting like children - although we would need to see the end of the Compuserve "PNG will kill GIF - please keep it alive for us" backhander conspiracy to do it properly). As to Netscape 4.7 being dead? We're never going to be that fortunate and forget about the lil sucker completely, but there's plenty you can do CSS trickery-wise to stop it from fouling up our work. David: > When IE does eventually get officially abandoned by Microsoft... I doubt this will ever happen, although it's probably for reasons of mad conspiracy on my part!! However awful it may be for us professionals to code for, or more accurately how easy it is to code for but it's insanely inaccurate forgivings make it difficult to code cross-platform *correctly*, it's still, IMO, the easiest browser for Joe Soap public to use, requires no pratting about installing (it's available straight out of the box to the majority of computer owners in the world - boy I wish new computer users would by a Mac once in a while!) and while it holds the biggest market share, it can serve to allow Microsoft to dictate the direction if Web development and sway the standards should they so choose. How long can W3C hold out saying "but Mr. Gates, the browser that has 90,000% market share does things wrong"? I can honestly see the day coming when IE7 still refuses to implement standards correctly or completely and W3C buckle under the pressure and re-write things to accomodate Microsoft's steadfast reluctance to do things correctly. Either that or be made to look foolish and a waste of time. What about PNG? Surely to god IE can use PNG transparency natively by now? Of course it can't (note: anybody know if IE7 can do it?) because if it could there would be no reason to use the GIF format any more (OK, I still find even PNG-8 to be a little weighty compared to GIF but with broadband connections becoming more commonplace throughout the world it's not going to be an issue for much longer). And with no reason to use GIF, it's possible that the *creation* of such images will no longer be supported by the graphics packages out there. In short: Compuserve don't get their royalties no more, and that's an awful lot of money. Can anybody see a little backhander from Compuserve to Microsoft here? If the most proliferent browser still makes the use of GIF-killer more hassle than it's worth then there's every reason to keep GIF alive. And before Microsoft lawyers start banging my door down after illegally reading this e-mail, I would like to point out that these are my own thoughts and opinions - I make no claims of their accuracy (although how much does Free Speech cost these days?), but if you get riled about it maybe I touched a nerve there, eh? Just realised the time - I think I better get back to work! MOU who's off to take his paranoia medication now :D The WDVL Discussion List from WDVL.COM To Join wdvltalk, Send An Email To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Send Your Posts To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To set a personal password send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the words: "set WDVLTALK pw=yourpassword" in the body of the email. To change subscription settings to the wdvltalk digest version: http://wdvl.internet.com/WDVL/Forum/#sub http://www.wdvl.com ___ You are currently subscribed to wdvltalk as: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe via postal mail, please contact us at: Jupitermedia Corp. Attn: Discussion List Management 475 Park Avenue South New York, NY 10016 Please include the email address which you have been contacted with.
