Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Luca Martinelli]

Il giorno 22/ago/2013 19:28, "David Cuenca"  ha scritto:
> Since the BookManagerv2 extension (coming soon) will be storing all
metadata from any work (sourced or not) in the (new) "Book:" namespace,
IMHO the best would be to link those pages to the edition items as outlined
in the Books Task Force. [...]
> The only really needed namespaces would be Author and Book, that
information could be transcluded to other pages.

This is absolutely awesome and impressing. This simplifies things to the
very core, since we won't need to link any other namespace than Author and
Book. Great work.

I've been talking to Aubrey this afternoon about the possible inclusion of
Wikisource on Wikidata, this discussion comes absolutely in handy. :)

Please, let me know if I can be of any help for passing the data to WD.

L.
___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[David Cuenca]

@Luca: it would be great if you could take a look to this page:
http://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Wikisource

Since the BookManagerv2 extension (coming soon) will be storing all
metadata from any work (sourced or not) in the (new) "Book:" namespace,
IMHO the best would be to link those pages to the edition items as outlined
in the Books Task Force. For more info see:
http://www.mollywhite.net/blog/?p=87
http://blog.wikimedia.de/2013/08/22/wikidata-and-other-technical-bits-at-wikimania/
http://tools.wmflabs.org/bookmanagerv2/wiki/Book:The_Interpretation_of_Dreams
http://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Books_task_force

The only really needed namespaces would be Author and Book, that
information could be transcluded to other pages.

Cheers,
Micru

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 12:38 PM, Luca Martinelli
wrote:

>
> Il giorno 22/ago/2013 18:34, "Lydia Pintscher" <
> lydia.pintsc...@wikimedia.de> ha scritto:
>
> > We're currently trying to figure out how to best do this.
> >
>
> Great, thank you all. :)
>
> L.
>
> ___
> Wikidata-l mailing list
> Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
>
>


-- 
Etiamsi omnes, ego non
___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Luca Martinelli]

Il giorno 22/ago/2013 18:34, "Lydia Pintscher" 
ha scritto:
> We're currently trying to figure out how to best do this.
>

Great, thank you all. :)

L.
___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Denny Vrandečić]

I am not completely sure if there currently is such a thing. I guess we
need to implement that first.

One suggestion was that AbuseFilter could do this, but there was concern
raised that this may overload AbuseFilter, and a native implementation
would be better.

We will need to figure this out. Input is appreciated.

Cheers,
Denny



2013/8/22 Luca Martinelli 

> Il giorno 22/ago/2013 16:09, "Denny Vrandečić" <
> denny.vrande...@wikimedia.de> ha scritto:
>
> > I guess we should disallow sitelinks to the File: namespace, in order to
> avoid people trying to add metadata about the media files themselves?
>
> +1 to this and +1 to Marten's proposal.
>
> @Denny: is it possible to temporarily disallow sitelinks to certain
> namespaces for certain projects, in order to allow them when we've got a
> way to deal with them? This could be a trick to be used also with
> Wikisource's Index namespace, I think. (I was talking to an it.source admin
> several minutes ago, and he was asking me how we could speed things up for
> Wikisource too).
>
> Luca "Sannita" Martinelli
> https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utente:Sannita
>
> ___
> Wikidata-l mailing list
> Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
>
>


-- 
Project director Wikidata
Wikimedia Deutschland e.V. | Obentrautstr. 72 | 10963 Berlin
Tel. +49-30-219 158 26-0 | http://wikimedia.de

Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.V.
Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg unter
der Nummer 23855 B. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für
Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Lydia Pintscher]

On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 6:30 PM, Luca Martinelli
 wrote:
> @Denny: is it possible to temporarily disallow sitelinks to certain
> namespaces for certain projects, in order to allow them when we've got a way
> to deal with them? This could be a trick to be used also with Wikisource's
> Index namespace, I think. (I was talking to an it.source admin several
> minutes ago, and he was asking me how we could speed things up for
> Wikisource too).

We're currently trying to figure out how to best do this.


Cheers
Lydia

-- 
Lydia Pintscher - http://about.me/lydia.pintscher
Community Communications for Technical Projects

Wikimedia Deutschland e.V.
Obentrautstr. 72
10963 Berlin
www.wikimedia.de

Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e. V.

Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg
unter der Nummer 23855 Nz. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das
Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/681/51985.

___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Luca Martinelli]

Il giorno 22/ago/2013 16:09, "Denny Vrandečić" 
ha scritto:
> I guess we should disallow sitelinks to the File: namespace, in order to
avoid people trying to add metadata about the media files themselves?

+1 to this and +1 to Marten's proposal.

@Denny: is it possible to temporarily disallow sitelinks to certain
namespaces for certain projects, in order to allow them when we've got a
way to deal with them? This could be a trick to be used also with
Wikisource's Index namespace, I think. (I was talking to an it.source admin
several minutes ago, and he was asking me how we could speed things up for
Wikisource too).

Luca "Sannita" Martinelli
https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utente:Sannita
___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Denny Vrandečić]

Hi Maarten,

thanks. That's the best proposal I have seen so far in how to proceed with
Phase 1 on Commons. I usually had pushed Commons support further to the
back, but with this I think we would indeed create some real value with a
small change. I will bounce Commons Phase 1 client support up on my list.

I guess we should disallow sitelinks to the File: namespace, in order to
avoid people trying to add metadata about the media files themselves?

Cheers,
Denny



2013/8/10 Maarten Dammers 

> Hi everyone,
>
> At Wikimania we had several discussions about the future of Wikidata and
> Commons. Some broader feedback would be nice.
> Now we have a property "Commons category" (https://www.wikidata.org/**
> wiki/Property:P373 ). This
> is a string and an intermediate solution.
> In the long run Commons should probably be a wikibase instance in it's own
> right (structured metadata stored at Commons) integrated with Wikidata.org,
> see 
> https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/**Wikidata:Wikimedia_Commonsfor
>  more info.
> In the meantime we should make Commons a wikidata client like Wikipedia
> and Wikivoyage. How would that work?
>
> We have an item 
> https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/**Q9920for 
> the city Haarlem. It links to the Wikipedia article "Haarlem" and the
> Wikivoyage article "Haarlem". It should link to the Commons gallery
> "Haarlem" 
> (https://commons.wikimedia.**org/wiki/Haarlem
> )
>
> We have an item 
> https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/**Q7427769for
>  the category Haarlem. It links to the Wikipedia category "Haarlem". It
> should link to the Commons category "Haarlem" (https://commons.wikimedia.*
> *org/wiki/Category:Haarlem
> ).
>
> The category item (Q7427769) links to article item (Q9920) using the
> property "main category topic" (https://www.wikidata.org/**
> wiki/Property:P301 ).
> We would need to make an inverse property of P301 to make the backlink.
>
> Some reasons why this is helpful:
> * Wikidata takes care of a lot of things like page moves, deletions, etc.
> Now with P373 (Commons category) it's all manual
> * Having Wikidata on Commons means that you can automatically get
> backlinks to Wikipedia, have intro's for category, etc etc
> * It's a step in the right direction. It makes it easier to do next steps
>
> Small change, lot's of benefits!
>
> Maarten
>
> __**_
> Wikidata-l mailing list
> Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/**mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
>



-- 
Project director Wikidata
Wikimedia Deutschland e.V. | Obentrautstr. 72 | 10963 Berlin
Tel. +49-30-219 158 26-0 | http://wikimedia.de

Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.V.
Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg unter
der Nummer 23855 B. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für
Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Paul A. Houle]

I’d like to see assertions of the sort

“Picture B represents topic X”

in commons.  One can easily infer this for some pictures by noticing that 
“Picture B is included in the encyclopedia entry for topic X”,  but often there 
are so many pictures of the topic that they aren’t all included in the topic 
page.

Often I see people use categories in Commons for this purpose,  and I think 
that this function be done in some way synchronized with Wikidata,  which would 
come with many benefits.

It would also be nice to some have some way to mark an image as

“A photograph of X”
“A piece of art created by X”
“A 3-d molecular rendering of X”

as well as that matter.  There will be a fringe of tasks that categories will 
be necessary for,  but it’s a good idea to make as many of them machine 
readable as we can.




From: Gerard Meijssen 
Sent: Tuesday, August 13, 2013 5:08 AM
To: Discussion list for the Wikidata project. 
Subject: Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

Hoi, 

As far as I am concerned, the categories used for images are not really helpful 
, While there are many images about Kiribati, you find only a few in the 
category by that name. The rest can be found in subcategories.

In the proposal for Commons there is a provision for tags. These tags can be 
populated to some extend by the categories they are in. 

The reason to have categories is because they are intended to help find images. 
Without them and without tags we would not have Commons as a functioning 
entity. However, the way they work with all these subcategories and stuff 
prevent many people including myself to use Commons as the source of images 
when I need them.

So yes, having categories are good in a half arsed way but we should get rid of 
them as we can have something better.

One other big advantage of tags is that they are typically single concepts that 
have typically have translations either in the labels in Wikidata or in 
Wiktionary. This allows us to make Commons a truly multi-lingual resource.
Thanks,
 GerardM



On 10 August 2013 06:19, Maarten Dammers  wrote:

  Hi everyone,

  At Wikimania we had several discussions about the future of Wikidata and 
Commons. Some broader feedback would be nice.
  Now we have a property "Commons category" 
(https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P373). This is a string and an 
intermediate solution.
  In the long run Commons should probably be a wikibase instance in it's own 
right (structured metadata stored at Commons) integrated with Wikidata.org, see 
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Wikimedia_Commons for more info.
  In the meantime we should make Commons a wikidata client like Wikipedia and 
Wikivoyage. How would that work?

  We have an item https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q9920 for the city Haarlem. It 
links to the Wikipedia article "Haarlem" and the Wikivoyage article "Haarlem". 
It should link to the Commons gallery "Haarlem" 
(https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Haarlem)

  We have an item https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q7427769 for the category 
Haarlem. It links to the Wikipedia category "Haarlem". It should link to the 
Commons category "Haarlem" 
(https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Haarlem).

  The category item (Q7427769) links to article item (Q9920) using the property 
"main category topic" (https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P301).
  We would need to make an inverse property of P301 to make the backlink.

  Some reasons why this is helpful:
  * Wikidata takes care of a lot of things like page moves, deletions, etc. Now 
with P373 (Commons category) it's all manual
  * Having Wikidata on Commons means that you can automatically get backlinks 
to Wikipedia, have intro's for category, etc etc
  * It's a step in the right direction. It makes it easier to do next steps

  Small change, lot's of benefits!

  Maarten

  ___
  Wikidata-l mailing list
  Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
  https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l





___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Federico Leva (Nemo)]

Gerard Meijssen, 13/08/2013 15:58:

Hoi,
If anything Wikidata has replaced the interwiki links for both Wikipedia
and Wikivoyage. Wikidata DOES allow links to images on Commons and
Commons categories already. In Commons it is known where images are used.

There is no way in which it is wise to abandon all that.

Once Wikidata replaced the interwiki links, many things had to be
re-arranged to accomodate the changed situation.


Like?


When Wikidata is to be
used in an optimal way it makes sense to have a plan on what
functionality can be created with the new technology. With Wikidata it
is for instance possible to have multilingual tags.

This is not to say that what has been done is wrong or what has been
done was not worthwhile, it is to say let us move in a direction that
will provide a much improved functionality.


Well said, but I have no idea how it relates to this discussion.

Nemo

___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Gerard Meijssen]

Hoi,
If anything Wikidata has replaced the interwiki links for both Wikipedia
and Wikivoyage. Wikidata DOES allow links to images on Commons and Commons
categories already. In Commons it is known where images are used.

There is no way in which it is wise to abandon all that.

Once Wikidata replaced the interwiki links, many things had to be
re-arranged to accomodate the changed situation. When Wikidata is to be
used in an optimal way it makes sense to have a plan on what functionality
can be created with the new technology. With Wikidata it is for instance
possible to have multilingual tags.

This is not to say that what has been done is wrong or what has been done
was not worthwhile, it is to say let us move in a direction that will
provide a much improved functionality.
Thanks,
  GerardM


On 13 August 2013 14:50, Federico Leva (Nemo)  wrote:

> Jane Darnell, 13/08/2013 13:19:
>
>  Now that I think about it, if you want to create a relationship where
>> Wiki Commons is a client of WikiData, then I think this should be done
>> for galleries only, not categories. Galleries can be easily split
>> and/or merged, reside in more than one category, and offer a "best"
>> selection of images of the subject, as well as offering a link to more
>> images on Commons by clicking through to categories
>>
>
> Wikidata is not a tool to force what you/we think the Right Thing.
> Interproject links between categories are in the (tens of) millions, hence
> we need better ways to manage them, not lectures to Wikimedia projects on
> why it's wrong to do all this. Thank you for the patience.
>
> Nemo
>
>
> __**_
> Wikidata-l mailing list
> Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/**mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
>
___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Federico Leva (Nemo)]

Jane Darnell, 13/08/2013 13:19:

Now that I think about it, if you want to create a relationship where
Wiki Commons is a client of WikiData, then I think this should be done
for galleries only, not categories. Galleries can be easily split
and/or merged, reside in more than one category, and offer a "best"
selection of images of the subject, as well as offering a link to more
images on Commons by clicking through to categories


Wikidata is not a tool to force what you/we think the Right Thing. 
Interproject links between categories are in the (tens of) millions, 
hence we need better ways to manage them, not lectures to Wikimedia 
projects on why it's wrong to do all this. Thank you for the patience.


Nemo

___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Jane Darnell]

Maarten, thanks for that clarification! Gerard, I totally agree with
you. Personally I was hoping for a way to use WikiData to find Commons
images that was *not* through the gallery/category structures as we
know them, for all the reasons Gerard has mentioned (in this and
previous mails).

Now that I think about it, if you want to create a relationship where
Wiki Commons is a client of WikiData, then I think this should be done
for galleries only, not categories. Galleries can be easily split
and/or merged, reside in more than one category, and offer a "best"
selection of images of the subject, as well as offering a link to more
images on Commons by clicking through to categories.

Jane

2013/8/13, Gerard Meijssen :
> Hoi,
>
> As far as I am concerned, the categories used for images are not really
> helpful , While there are many images about Kiribati, you find only a few
> in the category by that name. The rest can be found in subcategories.
>
> In the proposal for Commons there is a provision for tags. These tags can
> be populated to some extend by the categories they are in.
>
> The reason to have categories is because they are intended to help find
> images. Without them and without tags we would not have Commons as a
> functioning entity. However, the way they work with all these subcategories
> and stuff prevent many people including myself to use Commons as the source
> of images when I need them.
>
> So yes, having categories are good in a half arsed way but we should get
> rid of them as we can have something better.
>
> One other big advantage of tags is that they are typically single concepts
> that have typically have translations either in the labels in Wikidata or
> in Wiktionary. This allows us to make Commons a truly multi-lingual
> resource.
> Thanks,
>  GerardM
>
>
> On 10 August 2013 06:19, Maarten Dammers  wrote:
>
>> Hi everyone,
>>
>> At Wikimania we had several discussions about the future of Wikidata and
>> Commons. Some broader feedback would be nice.
>> Now we have a property "Commons category" (https://www.wikidata.org/**
>> wiki/Property:P373 ). This
>> is a string and an intermediate solution.
>> In the long run Commons should probably be a wikibase instance in it's
>> own
>> right (structured metadata stored at Commons) integrated with
>> Wikidata.org,
>> see
>> https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/**Wikidata:Wikimedia_Commonsfor
>> more info.
>> In the meantime we should make Commons a wikidata client like Wikipedia
>> and Wikivoyage. How would that work?
>>
>> We have an item
>> https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/**Q9920for
>> the city Haarlem. It links to the Wikipedia article "Haarlem" and the
>> Wikivoyage article "Haarlem". It should link to the Commons gallery
>> "Haarlem"
>> (https://commons.wikimedia.**org/wiki/Haarlem
>> )
>>
>> We have an item
>> https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/**Q7427769for
>> the category Haarlem. It links to the Wikipedia category "Haarlem". It
>> should link to the Commons category "Haarlem"
>> (https://commons.wikimedia.*
>> *org/wiki/Category:Haarlem
>> ).
>>
>> The category item (Q7427769) links to article item (Q9920) using the
>> property "main category topic" (https://www.wikidata.org/**
>> wiki/Property:P301 ).
>> We would need to make an inverse property of P301 to make the backlink.
>>
>> Some reasons why this is helpful:
>> * Wikidata takes care of a lot of things like page moves, deletions, etc.
>> Now with P373 (Commons category) it's all manual
>> * Having Wikidata on Commons means that you can automatically get
>> backlinks to Wikipedia, have intro's for category, etc etc
>> * It's a step in the right direction. It makes it easier to do next steps
>>
>> Small change, lot's of benefits!
>>
>> Maarten
>>
>> __**_
>> Wikidata-l mailing list
>> Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/**mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
>>
>

___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Gerard Meijssen]

Hoi,

As far as I am concerned, the categories used for images are not really
helpful , While there are many images about Kiribati, you find only a few
in the category by that name. The rest can be found in subcategories.

In the proposal for Commons there is a provision for tags. These tags can
be populated to some extend by the categories they are in.

The reason to have categories is because they are intended to help find
images. Without them and without tags we would not have Commons as a
functioning entity. However, the way they work with all these subcategories
and stuff prevent many people including myself to use Commons as the source
of images when I need them.

So yes, having categories are good in a half arsed way but we should get
rid of them as we can have something better.

One other big advantage of tags is that they are typically single concepts
that have typically have translations either in the labels in Wikidata or
in Wiktionary. This allows us to make Commons a truly multi-lingual
resource.
Thanks,
 GerardM


On 10 August 2013 06:19, Maarten Dammers  wrote:

> Hi everyone,
>
> At Wikimania we had several discussions about the future of Wikidata and
> Commons. Some broader feedback would be nice.
> Now we have a property "Commons category" (https://www.wikidata.org/**
> wiki/Property:P373 ). This
> is a string and an intermediate solution.
> In the long run Commons should probably be a wikibase instance in it's own
> right (structured metadata stored at Commons) integrated with Wikidata.org,
> see 
> https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/**Wikidata:Wikimedia_Commonsfor
>  more info.
> In the meantime we should make Commons a wikidata client like Wikipedia
> and Wikivoyage. How would that work?
>
> We have an item 
> https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/**Q9920for 
> the city Haarlem. It links to the Wikipedia article "Haarlem" and the
> Wikivoyage article "Haarlem". It should link to the Commons gallery
> "Haarlem" 
> (https://commons.wikimedia.**org/wiki/Haarlem
> )
>
> We have an item 
> https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/**Q7427769for
>  the category Haarlem. It links to the Wikipedia category "Haarlem". It
> should link to the Commons category "Haarlem" (https://commons.wikimedia.*
> *org/wiki/Category:Haarlem
> ).
>
> The category item (Q7427769) links to article item (Q9920) using the
> property "main category topic" (https://www.wikidata.org/**
> wiki/Property:P301 ).
> We would need to make an inverse property of P301 to make the backlink.
>
> Some reasons why this is helpful:
> * Wikidata takes care of a lot of things like page moves, deletions, etc.
> Now with P373 (Commons category) it's all manual
> * Having Wikidata on Commons means that you can automatically get
> backlinks to Wikipedia, have intro's for category, etc etc
> * It's a step in the right direction. It makes it easier to do next steps
>
> Small change, lot's of benefits!
>
> Maarten
>
> __**_
> Wikidata-l mailing list
> Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/**mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
>
___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Maarten Dammers]

Hi Jane,

You completely missed my point. This is about galleries and categories, 
not about creator, institution, etc etc. That's all next phase. Please 
reread my original post.


Maarten

Op 12-8-2013 20:32, Jane Darnell schreef:

geocoordinates can be linked to places; creator templates, book
templates, and artwork templates can all be linked to people.

The problem is if you store the data on WikiData, but do not allow the
content to show up on WikiCommons (due to copyright problems), then
where does data-curation take place?

After I sent that email it occurred to me though that probably most,
if not all the people on Commons who understand this stuff are already
Wikidatans anyway. So maybe it's a moot point.

2013/8/12, Cristian Consonni :

2013/8/11 Jane Darnell :

Hmm, I am not quite sure how to see this. Places and people yes: It
would be nice to have the geo coordinates on Wikidata and for the
artist and writers

I am not sure I get what geocoordinates means for people.


  I also agree for the book and the artwork templates.
But how could you possibly move all of the Commons copyright logic? As
far as I know, it's really quite a small group of people who even
understand how all that stuff works on Commons and can untangle those
template categories and delete/keep workflows... if you open Wikidata
to keeping the data on copyrighted materials, like books and artworks,
is that metadata OK to move and manage there?

I think this was not the sense of Maarten's proposal.

Cristian

___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l


___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l



___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Jane Darnell]

geocoordinates can be linked to places; creator templates, book
templates, and artwork templates can all be linked to people.

The problem is if you store the data on WikiData, but do not allow the
content to show up on WikiCommons (due to copyright problems), then
where does data-curation take place?

After I sent that email it occurred to me though that probably most,
if not all the people on Commons who understand this stuff are already
Wikidatans anyway. So maybe it's a moot point.

2013/8/12, Cristian Consonni :
> 2013/8/11 Jane Darnell :
>> Hmm, I am not quite sure how to see this. Places and people yes: It
>> would be nice to have the geo coordinates on Wikidata and for the
>> artist and writers
>
> I am not sure I get what geocoordinates means for people.
>
>>  I also agree for the book and the artwork templates.
>> But how could you possibly move all of the Commons copyright logic? As
>> far as I know, it's really quite a small group of people who even
>> understand how all that stuff works on Commons and can untangle those
>> template categories and delete/keep workflows... if you open Wikidata
>> to keeping the data on copyrighted materials, like books and artworks,
>> is that metadata OK to move and manage there?
>
> I think this was not the sense of Maarten's proposal.
>
> Cristian
>
> ___
> Wikidata-l mailing list
> Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
>

___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Cristian Consonni]

2013/8/11 Jane Darnell :
> Hmm, I am not quite sure how to see this. Places and people yes: It
> would be nice to have the geo coordinates on Wikidata and for the
> artist and writers

I am not sure I get what geocoordinates means for people.

>  I also agree for the book and the artwork templates.
> But how could you possibly move all of the Commons copyright logic? As
> far as I know, it's really quite a small group of people who even
> understand how all that stuff works on Commons and can untangle those
> template categories and delete/keep workflows... if you open Wikidata
> to keeping the data on copyrighted materials, like books and artworks,
> is that metadata OK to move and manage there?

I think this was not the sense of Maarten's proposal.

Cristian

___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Jane Darnell]

Well I am a bit behind on my email, but I thought the idea was that
empty templates like the Commons creator template could be plopped
onto a Commons category or gallery page and these would get
auto-filled on click/open by "sucking" their data from Wikidata.

2013/8/11, Gerard Meijssen :
> Hoi,
> There is a lot of data that already fits perfectly well in Wikidata.
>
> There is one thing that should become absolutely clear. Wikidata is a
> project in its own right and  Wikipedia is only linked through its
> interwiki links. The relevance is that there will be an increasing number
> of Wikidata items with no link at all to Wikipedia.
>
> Thanks,
>  Gerard
>
>
> On 11 August 2013 09:36, Jane Darnell  wrote:
>
>> Hmm, I am not quite sure how to see this. Places and people yes: It
>> would be nice to have the geo coordinates on Wikidata and for the
>> artist and writers it would be nice to have the creator templates on
>> Wikidata as well. I also agree for the book and the artwork templates.
>> But how could you possibly move all of the Commons copyright logic? As
>> far as I know, it's really quite a small group of people who even
>> understand how all that stuff works on Commons and can untangle those
>> template categories and delete/keep workflows... if you open Wikidata
>> to keeping the data on copyrighted materials, like books and artworks,
>> is that metadata OK to move and manage there?
>>
>> 2013/8/10, Cristian Consonni :
>> > 2013/8/10 Maarten Dammers :
>> >> Small change, lot's of benefits!
>> >
>> > Strong +1
>> >
>> > C
>> >
>> > ___
>> > Wikidata-l mailing list
>> > Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
>> >
>>
>> ___
>> Wikidata-l mailing list
>> Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
>>
>

___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Gerard Meijssen]

Hoi,
There is a lot of data that already fits perfectly well in Wikidata.

There is one thing that should become absolutely clear. Wikidata is a
project in its own right and  Wikipedia is only linked through its
interwiki links. The relevance is that there will be an increasing number
of Wikidata items with no link at all to Wikipedia.

Thanks,
 Gerard


On 11 August 2013 09:36, Jane Darnell  wrote:

> Hmm, I am not quite sure how to see this. Places and people yes: It
> would be nice to have the geo coordinates on Wikidata and for the
> artist and writers it would be nice to have the creator templates on
> Wikidata as well. I also agree for the book and the artwork templates.
> But how could you possibly move all of the Commons copyright logic? As
> far as I know, it's really quite a small group of people who even
> understand how all that stuff works on Commons and can untangle those
> template categories and delete/keep workflows... if you open Wikidata
> to keeping the data on copyrighted materials, like books and artworks,
> is that metadata OK to move and manage there?
>
> 2013/8/10, Cristian Consonni :
> > 2013/8/10 Maarten Dammers :
> >> Small change, lot's of benefits!
> >
> > Strong +1
> >
> > C
> >
> > ___
> > Wikidata-l mailing list
> > Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
> >
>
> ___
> Wikidata-l mailing list
> Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
>
___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Jane Darnell]

Hmm, I am not quite sure how to see this. Places and people yes: It
would be nice to have the geo coordinates on Wikidata and for the
artist and writers it would be nice to have the creator templates on
Wikidata as well. I also agree for the book and the artwork templates.
But how could you possibly move all of the Commons copyright logic? As
far as I know, it's really quite a small group of people who even
understand how all that stuff works on Commons and can untangle those
template categories and delete/keep workflows... if you open Wikidata
to keeping the data on copyrighted materials, like books and artworks,
is that metadata OK to move and manage there?

2013/8/10, Cristian Consonni :
> 2013/8/10 Maarten Dammers :
>> Small change, lot's of benefits!
>
> Strong +1
>
> C
>
> ___
> Wikidata-l mailing list
> Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
>

___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

Re: [Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Cristian Consonni]

2013/8/10 Maarten Dammers :
> Small change, lot's of benefits!

Strong +1

C

___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l

[Wikidata-l] Make Commons a wikidata client

[Maarten Dammers]

Hi everyone,

At Wikimania we had several discussions about the future of Wikidata and 
Commons. Some broader feedback would be nice.
Now we have a property "Commons category" 
(https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P373). This is a string and an 
intermediate solution.
In the long run Commons should probably be a wikibase instance in it's 
own right (structured metadata stored at Commons) integrated with 
Wikidata.org, see 
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Wikimedia_Commons for more info.
In the meantime we should make Commons a wikidata client like Wikipedia 
and Wikivoyage. How would that work?


We have an item https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q9920 for the city 
Haarlem. It links to the Wikipedia article "Haarlem" and the Wikivoyage 
article "Haarlem". It should link to the Commons gallery "Haarlem" 
(https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Haarlem)


We have an item https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q7427769 for the category 
Haarlem. It links to the Wikipedia category "Haarlem". It should link to 
the Commons category "Haarlem" 
(https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Haarlem).


The category item (Q7427769) links to article item (Q9920) using the 
property "main category topic" 
(https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P301).

We would need to make an inverse property of P301 to make the backlink.

Some reasons why this is helpful:
* Wikidata takes care of a lot of things like page moves, deletions, 
etc. Now with P373 (Commons category) it's all manual
* Having Wikidata on Commons means that you can automatically get 
backlinks to Wikipedia, have intro's for category, etc etc

* It's a step in the right direction. It makes it easier to do next steps

Small change, lot's of benefits!

Maarten

___
Wikidata-l mailing list
Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l