Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Alex Brollo]

2010/8/17 Magnus Manske 

>
>
> Now reloads transcluded pages from the correct language automatically,
> no textlang parameter neccessary!
>
> Magnus
>


Great! :-)
Alex
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Magnus Manske]

On Tue, Aug 17, 2010 at 2:52 PM, Alex Brollo  wrote:
> 2010/8/17 Alex Brollo 
>
> Marcus, a challenge for you...
>
> http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=it&file=Hymnus_in_Romam.djvu&startpage=9
>
> This is a text from it.source using {{Iwpage}} ThomasV's trick, linking many
> pages into la.source . It would be great to see the content coming from
> Iwpage interwiki transclusion!

Now reloads transcluded pages from the correct language automatically,
no textlang parameter neccessary!

Magnus

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Magnus Manske]

On Tue, Aug 17, 2010 at 3:34 PM, Magnus Manske
 wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 17, 2010 at 2:52 PM, Alex Brollo  wrote:
>> 2010/8/17 Alex Brollo 
>>
>> Marcus, a challenge for you...
>>
>> http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=it&file=Hymnus_in_Romam.djvu&startpage=9
>>
>> This is a text from it.source using {{Iwpage}} ThomasV's trick, linking many
>> pages into la.source . It would be great to see the content coming from
>> Iwpage interwiki transclusion!
>
> I'm not sure how to detect interwiki transclusion universally (in all
> languages) with a single system, so I fall back to "manual":
> http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=it&file=Hymnus_in_Romam.djvu&startpage=9&textlang=la

ARGH! Only /some/ of the pages are transcluded!

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Magnus Manske]

On Tue, Aug 17, 2010 at 2:52 PM, Alex Brollo  wrote:
> 2010/8/17 Alex Brollo 
>
> Marcus, a challenge for you...
>
> http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=it&file=Hymnus_in_Romam.djvu&startpage=9
>
> This is a text from it.source using {{Iwpage}} ThomasV's trick, linking many
> pages into la.source . It would be great to see the content coming from
> Iwpage interwiki transclusion!

I'm not sure how to detect interwiki transclusion universally (in all
languages) with a single system, so I fall back to "manual":
http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=it&file=Hymnus_in_Romam.djvu&startpage=9&textlang=la

Cheers,
Magnus

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Alex Brollo]

2010/8/17 Alex Brollo 

Marcus, a challenge for you...

http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=it&file=Hymnus_in_Romam.djvu&startpage=9

This is a text from it.source using {{Iwpage}} ThomasV's trick, linking many
pages into la.source . It would be great to see the content coming from
Iwpage interwiki transclusion!

Alex
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Alex Brollo]

2010/8/17 Billinghurst 

> Hi Magnus,
>
> The tool has choked on something for
>
> http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=en&file=Mrs_Caudle%2527s_curtain_lectures.djvu&startpage=1
> might it be the apostrophe in the url?  This url just shows the one page,
> and no
> subsequent pages, and that is for whichever starting page one feeds into
> the url.
>
> Regards Andrew
>

I'd got a similar problem,  solved simply *avoiding urlencode* and using the
plain output of {{PAGENAMEE}} or similar variables.

http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=en&file=Mrs_Caudle's_curtain_lectures.djvu&startpage=1runs.

Alex
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Billinghurst]

Hi Magnus,

The tool has choked on something for
 
http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=en&file=Mrs_Caudle%2527s_curtain_lectures.djvu&startpage=1
might it be the apostrophe in the url?  This url just shows the one page, and 
no 
subsequent pages, and that is for whichever starting page one feeds into the 
url.

Regards Andrew


On 16 Aug 2010 at 13:22, Magnus Manske wrote:

> On Mon, Aug 16, 2010 at 1:02 PM, Alex Brollo  wrote:
> > Thanks!
> >
> > I just tried to build a template like this:
> >
> > [[File:Library-logo-blue-outline.png|30px|link=http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html
> > ?lang=it&file={{urlencode:{{PAGENAME]], to be used into Index: pages.
> >
> > But urlencode converts spaces into +, where your script doesn't like the
> > output of urlencode... it only likes names where spaces are replaced by
> > underscores.
> >
> > How can I obtain this transformation by a parser function/by a template? Or:
> > can you modify the scripts, so that url encoded titles are accepted too?
> >
> > I apologyze, if my question is banal.
> 
> Not at all, though
> http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=it&file=De%27+matematici+italiani+anteriori+all%27invenzione+della+stampa.djvu
> seems to work fine. You can also try {{PAGENAMEE}} (note the two E).
> 
> Note that sometimes, the Index: name is not the same at the actual
> .djvu file, so you should allow attribute {{{1}}} to be the filename
> (PAGENAME by default), and maybe the start page as {{{2}}}, default
> "1". That would also allow for the template to be used anywhere, not
> just on the index page.
> 
> Cheers,
> Magnus
> 
> 
> 



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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Magnus Manske]

On Mon, Aug 16, 2010 at 5:35 PM, Alex Brollo  wrote:
>
>
> 2010/8/16 Magnus Manske 
>>
>>
>> Not at all, though
>>
>> http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=it&file=De%27+matematici+italiani+anteriori+all%27invenzione+della+stampa.djvu
>> seems to work fine. You can also try {{PAGENAMEE}} (note the two E).
>
> My question was definitely banal. With  {{PAGENAMEE}} the template
> http://it.wikisource.org/wiki/Template:BackToScroll runs perfectly: see
> http://it.wikisource.org/wiki/Indice:Rime_%28Vittorelli%29.djvu .
> Thanks Magnus (even if some of our it.source users poined my mistake, I
> appreciated a lot your attention and suggestions!)

Nice! Thanks!

Magnus

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Alex Brollo]

2010/8/16 Magnus Manske 

>
>
> Not at all, though
>
> http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=it&file=De%27+matematici+italiani+anteriori+all%27invenzione+della+stampa.djvu
> seems to work fine. You can also try {{PAGENAMEE}} (note the two E).
>

My question was definitely banal. With  {{PAGENAMEE}} the template
http://it.wikisource.org/wiki/Template:BackToScroll runs perfectly: see
http://it.wikisource.org/wiki/Indice:Rime_%28Vittorelli%29.djvu .
Thanks Magnus (even if some of our it.source users poined my mistake, I
appreciated a lot your attention and suggestions!)

Alex
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Magnus Manske]

On Mon, Aug 16, 2010 at 1:02 PM, Alex Brollo  wrote:
> Thanks!
>
> I just tried to build a template like this:
>
> [[File:Library-logo-blue-outline.png|30px|link=http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html
> ?lang=it&file={{urlencode:{{PAGENAME]], to be used into Index: pages.
>
> But urlencode converts spaces into +, where your script doesn't like the
> output of urlencode... it only likes names where spaces are replaced by
> underscores.
>
> How can I obtain this transformation by a parser function/by a template? Or:
> can you modify the scripts, so that url encoded titles are accepted too?
>
> I apologyze, if my question is banal.

Not at all, though
http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=it&file=De%27+matematici+italiani+anteriori+all%27invenzione+della+stampa.djvu
seems to work fine. You can also try {{PAGENAMEE}} (note the two E).

Note that sometimes, the Index: name is not the same at the actual
.djvu file, so you should allow attribute {{{1}}} to be the filename
(PAGENAME by default), and maybe the start page as {{{2}}}, default
"1". That would also allow for the template to be used anywhere, not
just on the index page.

Cheers,
Magnus

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Alex Brollo]

Thanks!

I just tried to build a template like this:

[[File:Library-logo-blue-outline.png|30px|link=
http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html
?lang=it&file={{urlencode:{{PAGENAME]], to be used into Index: pages.

But urlencode converts spaces into +, where your script doesn't like the
output of urlencode... it only likes names where spaces are replaced by
underscores.

How can I obtain this transformation by a parser function/by a template? Or:
can you modify the scripts, so that url encoded titles are accepted too?

I apologyze, if my question is banal.

Alex
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Magnus Manske]

Last one for today : Automatic retrieval of max page number and
"number length" (e.g. "001" instead of just "1"). Manual parameters
will override (and save a query).

Cheers,
Magnus

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Magnus Manske]

On Sun, Aug 15, 2010 at 6:46 PM, ThomasV  wrote:
> Magnus Manske a écrit :
>> On Sat, Aug 14, 2010 at 8:49 PM, Thomas Voegtlin  wrote:
>>
> Also, in on_body_scroll, you could avoid the for loop : divide
>
 $('#body').position()['scrollTop'] by the height of an image

 'fraid not - sometimes the rendered text runs longer than the image,
 so the "row" can be higher than the image. Example:
 http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html
 (scroll down and you'll see it)


>>> hmm, you are right ; I had a "pure scan" version in mind.
>>>
>>> But it would be nice to have a version that does not load
>>> the text, just in order to see if the WMF servers are fast
>>> enough to provide the same fluidity as in the Google Books
>>> interface.
>>>
>>
>> I don't think the text retrieval is the slow step here...
>>
>
> No, but the for loop in the scroll handler makes it a bit slow.
>
> Another problem occurs when you are viewing page p, and when
> p-1 is not loaded yet : if you scroll up, at the moment where p-1 is
> loaded, the size of its container div increases, and the text you
> are viewing (page p) is pushed towards the bottom. On the
> Dictionary of National Biography this offset can be quite big,
> so you lose track of the text you are viewing.
>
> I don't really know how to solve this ; but it seems to me that
> using divs with variable size is part of the problem here too.

I tried to solve that by fixing the div height to the same as the
image div and using overflow-y to have per-page "sub-scroll". However,
it does not seem to work with divs "display:table-cell", and altering
that breaks the entire layout. I suppose I could go back to good 'ol
table, but that would be a shame...

>> I've switched to specifying width rounded to 100s; however, the API
>> still gives me one-off images (599 instead of 600 px). I could hack
>> the API thumbnail URL, though. Better yet, I can probably skip that
>> step entirely after the first one...
>>
> I can see that too (599 instead of 600); but that's not a
> problem, because the filename does not change, it is "600px-"
>
>> Why load a giant text and then hack around on broken HTML, when I can
>> just query each page individually? It's not really slow, at least not
>> in Google Chrome.
>>
>>
> oh, that was in order to display the text without headers, footers
> and page breaks ; but I guess it's ok to show headers, because
> they are in the scans too. (here I'm not talking about the headers
> that you hide with your button ; I mean the other elements
> that are in this field : running title, references, etc.)

Yes, I know what you mean, but they're not really in that way...

Anyway, I've added a permalink.

Also, I've fiddled with the scrolling for loop; it should be much quicker now.

Cheers,
Magnus

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[ThomasV]

Magnus Manske a écrit :
> On Sat, Aug 14, 2010 at 8:49 PM, Thomas Voegtlin  wrote:
>   
 Also, in on_body_scroll, you could avoid the for loop : divide
 
>>> $('#body').position()['scrollTop'] by the height of an image
>>>
>>> 'fraid not - sometimes the rendered text runs longer than the image,
>>> so the "row" can be higher than the image. Example:
>>> http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html
>>> (scroll down and you'll see it)
>>>
>>>   
>> hmm, you are right ; I had a "pure scan" version in mind.
>>
>> But it would be nice to have a version that does not load
>> the text, just in order to see if the WMF servers are fast
>> enough to provide the same fluidity as in the Google Books
>> interface.
>> 
>
> I don't think the text retrieval is the slow step here...
>   

No, but the for loop in the scroll handler makes it a bit slow.

Another problem occurs when you are viewing page p, and when
p-1 is not loaded yet : if you scroll up, at the moment where p-1 is
loaded, the size of its container div increases, and the text you
are viewing (page p) is pushed towards the bottom. On the
Dictionary of National Biography this offset can be quite big,
so you lose track of the text you are viewing.

I don't really know how to solve this ; but it seems to me that
using divs with variable size is part of the problem here too.


> I've switched to specifying width rounded to 100s; however, the API
> still gives me one-off images (599 instead of 600 px). I could hack
> the API thumbnail URL, though. Better yet, I can probably skip that
> step entirely after the first one...
>   
I can see that too (599 instead of 600); but that's not a
problem, because the filename does not change, it is "600px-"

> Why load a giant text and then hack around on broken HTML, when I can
> just query each page individually? It's not really slow, at least not
> in Google Chrome.
>
>   
oh, that was in order to display the text without headers, footers
and page breaks ; but I guess it's ok to show headers, because
they are in the scans too. (here I'm not talking about the headers
that you hide with your button ; I mean the other elements
that are in this field : running title, references, etc.)

Thomas


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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Magnus Manske]

On Sun, Aug 15, 2010 at 4:20 PM, Klaus Graf  wrote:
> 2010/8/15 Magnus Manske :
>
>> And for Klaus, I added de.wikisource:
>> http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=de&numlen=3&file=Reymont_-_Der_Vampir.djvu&startpage=5&pages=318
>
> Thank you!

And now with "search in this book" function (abusing page search
through toolserver), with in-text highlighting, page markers, etc. !
:-)

Cheers,
Magnus

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Klaus Graf]

2010/8/15 Magnus Manske :

> And for Klaus, I added de.wikisource:
> http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=de&numlen=3&file=Reymont_-_Der_Vampir.djvu&startpage=5&pages=318

Thank you!

Klaus Graf

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Magnus Manske]

On Sat, Aug 14, 2010 at 8:49 PM, Thomas Voegtlin  wrote:
>> > Also, in on_body_scroll, you could avoid the for loop : divide
>> $('#body').position()['scrollTop'] by the height of an image
>>
>> 'fraid not - sometimes the rendered text runs longer than the image,
>> so the "row" can be higher than the image. Example:
>> http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html
>> (scroll down and you'll see it)
>>
>
> hmm, you are right ; I had a "pure scan" version in mind.
>
> But it would be nice to have a version that does not load
> the text, just in order to see if the WMF servers are fast
> enough to provide the same fluidity as in the Google Books
> interface.

I don't think the text retrieval is the slow step here...

> For the size quantization, I think it is better to request
> a desired width than a desired height ; the API does not
> exactly give you the height you request. In addition, if
> you quantize the width you will be likely to request thumbs
> that are already created by ProofreadPage.

I've switched to specifying width rounded to 100s; however, the API
still gives me one-off images (599 instead of 600 px). I could hack
the API thumbnail URL, though. Better yet, I can probably skip that
step entirely after the first one...

> Also, for the text, I just had a crazy idea : instead of
> requesting the text of each page, you can do a single
> request for the whole book, using &action=parse (pass the
>  command to it, as in this script : 
> http://wikisource.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Dictionary.js ).
>
> Then we can split the returned string with a regexp that detects
> the page breaks (they are in a special span element), and place
> it in the corresponding divs ; things will break whenever a html
> formatting element ends on a different page than where it
> begins, but we could write a function that balances the
> missing elements.

Why load a giant text and then hack around on broken HTML, when I can
just query each page individually? It's not really slow, at least not
in Google Chrome.


Meanwhile, I added a feature to hide "header elements" like the
proofread line, which kind of disrupts the reading flow. There's a
checkbox to toggle header display.

And for Klaus, I added de.wikisource:
http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?lang=de&numlen=3&file=Reymont_-_Der_Vampir.djvu&startpage=5&pages=318

Cheers,
Magnus

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Thomas Voegtlin]

> > Also, in on_body_scroll, you could avoid the for loop : divide
> $('#body').position()['scrollTop'] by the height of an image
> 
> 'fraid not - sometimes the rendered text runs longer than the image,
> so the "row" can be higher than the image. Example:
> http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html
> (scroll down and you'll see it)
> 

hmm, you are right ; I had a "pure scan" version in mind.

But it would be nice to have a version that does not load 
the text, just in order to see if the WMF servers are fast 
enough to provide the same fluidity as in the Google Books 
interface.

For the size quantization, I think it is better to request 
a desired width than a desired height ; the API does not 
exactly give you the height you request. In addition, if 
you quantize the width you will be likely to request thumbs 
that are already created by ProofreadPage.

Also, for the text, I just had a crazy idea : instead of 
requesting the text of each page, you can do a single 
request for the whole book, using &action=parse (pass the 
 command to it, as in this script : 
http://wikisource.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Dictionary.js ). 

Then we can split the returned string with a regexp that detects 
the page breaks (they are in a special span element), and place 
it in the corresponding divs ; things will break whenever a html 
formatting element ends on a different page than where it 
begins, but we could write a function that balances the 
missing elements.

Thomas

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Magnus Manske]

On Sat, Aug 14, 2010 at 8:00 PM,   wrote:
> nice demo ; it would be nice to make it more efficient.
>
> I see that you are generating images with a size that is adapted to the 
> user's screen. If you do this, hundreds of thumbnails of all possible sizes 
> will be generated at commons for each page. To avoid this, you should 
> quantize the size : use a width that is a multiple of 100 pixels, as 
> ProofreadPage does (Tim asked me to do this). In addition, if you use this 
> restricted set of widths, then thumbnails will be more likely to already 
> exist and will load faster.
>
> To gain some speed, you could also preload pages p+1 and p-1, as google books 
> does.

Both good ideas, I'll do that.

> Also, in on_body_scroll, you could avoid the for loop : divide 
> $('#body').position()['scrollTop'] by the height of an image

'fraid not - sometimes the rendered text runs longer than the image,
so the "row" can be higher than the image. Example:
http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html
(scroll down and you'll see it)

Cheers,
Magnus

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Magnus Manske]

On Sat, Aug 14, 2010 at 7:26 PM, Klaus Graf  wrote:
> 2010/8/14 Magnus Manske :
>> Hi all,
>>
>> after some discussion on wikitech-l, I made a Google Books-like
>> display demo for wikisource content.
>
> Please do not confuse en Wikisource with Wikisource.

Is that your way of saying "please enable other languages"?

> BTW: I don't
> understand the sense of this viewer.

To browse books more fluently.

Cheers,
Magnus

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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[thomasV1]

nice demo ; it would be nice to make it more efficient.

I see that you are generating images with a size that is adapted to the user's 
screen. If you do this, hundreds of thumbnails of all possible sizes will be 
generated at commons for each page. To avoid this, you should quantize the size 
: use a width that is a multiple of 100 pixels, as ProofreadPage does (Tim 
asked me to do this). In addition, if you use this restricted set of widths, 
then thumbnails will be more likely to already exist and will load faster.

To gain some speed, you could also preload pages p+1 and p-1, as google books 
does.

Also, in on_body_scroll, you could avoid the for loop : divide 
$('#body').position()['scrollTop'] by the height of an image

Thomas 




 Original-Nachricht 
> Datum: Sat, 14 Aug 2010 19:15:47 +0100
> Von: Magnus Manske 
> An: wikisource-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Betreff: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

> Hi all,
> 
> after some discussion on wikitech-l, I made a Google Books-like
> display demo for wikisource content. It should work on any multipage
> djvu or PDF. To link to it, you'll need:
> * The file name for the original (needs to be on commons)
> * The total number of pages (couldn't find a way to get that
> automatically anywhere...)
> * The page to start on
> 
> Thus armed, you can construct a URL like this:
> http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?file=Transactions_of_the_Geological_Society,_1st_series,_vol._1.djvu&pages=478&startpage=82
> 
> The default parameter-less URL will fall back on the DNB vol. 11:
> http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html
> 
> Note that this is HTML/CSS/JS only; no toolserver backend
> script/database is involved.
> 
> Awaiting onslaught of critique,
> Magnus
> 
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Re: [Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Klaus Graf]

2010/8/14 Magnus Manske :
> Hi all,
>
> after some discussion on wikitech-l, I made a Google Books-like
> display demo for wikisource content.

Please do not confuse en Wikisource with Wikisource. BTW: I don't
understand the sense of this viewer.

Klaus Graf

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[Wikisource-l] Back to the Scroll

[Magnus Manske]

Hi all,

after some discussion on wikitech-l, I made a Google Books-like
display demo for wikisource content. It should work on any multipage
djvu or PDF. To link to it, you'll need:
* The file name for the original (needs to be on commons)
* The total number of pages (couldn't find a way to get that
automatically anywhere...)
* The page to start on

Thus armed, you can construct a URL like this:
http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html?file=Transactions_of_the_Geological_Society,_1st_series,_vol._1.djvu&pages=478&startpage=82

The default parameter-less URL will fall back on the DNB vol. 11:
http://toolserver.org/~magnus/book2scroll/index.html

Note that this is HTML/CSS/JS only; no toolserver backend
script/database is involved.

Awaiting onslaught of critique,
Magnus

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