[WSG] Layout 39% not 39%

[Taco Fleur]

Title: Message



Does anyone know why 
on http://development.content3.com/test.htm 
the left column is not 39% in width?
 
The column has 

width: 
30%:
margin-left: 
9%:
 
Now if you look at 
the  tags above this column you'll see one with a width of 9% and one 
with a width of 39% and they seem to be the correct width.
 
Any 
ideas?
 
Taco 
Fleur
Tell me and I will forgetShow me and I will rememberTeach me and 
I will learn 
 

RE: [WSG] New Colour Schemer - draft - any suggestions?

[theGrafixGuy]

Looks good! 

Though for sake of presentation style, I'd have it layout the results in a
more formatted manner. The results page looks ad-hoc if you know what I
mean.

Also, if easily done, I'd like to see header examples as well as bold and
italic - but that is just me.

Brian

-Original Message-
From: Lindsay Evans [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 10:36 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [WSG] New Colour Schemer - draft - any suggestions?

Michael Kear wrote:
> For my own benefit, I have been developing a colour schemer tool, and
> I've put it on my web site for others to use, comment about, help me
> improve.

Snippety-snip

> http://afpwebworks.com/colourschemer/  is the address. (note the
> Australian COLOUR not the American COLOR)

Looks pretty good to me, Mike.

One thing I'd suggest: make the form method 'get' instead of 'post', that
way people can bookmark, email, etc. the colour scheme easily.

Oh, found a bug, too: if I enter a 3 digit hex code (eg. #333), then I get a
CF error, might be handy for us lazy CSS folk to put shorthand for colours
in :)

--
 Lindsay Evans.
 Developer,
 Red Square Productions.

 [p] 8596.4000
 [f] 8596.4001
 [w] www.redsquare.com.au

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RE: [WSG] New Colour Schemer - draft - any suggestions? (Leon's Away)

[Leon Wild]

Sorry, I'm away Thurs AM for study.

For urgent queries or intranet help please contact Marion on 02 9230
8542 or [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Many thanks,
Leon Wild.



>>> "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" 03/31/04 16:58 >>>

Not any more it doesn't.Result of cutting and pasting bits of
code
huh. 

Good thing I didn't try and pretend this was a mature
ready-for-prime-time
tool isn't it.


Cheers
Mike Kear

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Nick Cowie
Sent: Wednesday, 31 March 2004 4:46 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [WSG] New Colour Schemer - draft - any suggestions?

Michael

The right column, has a commnet "This is text in the colour #XX"
Unfortunately #XX is the first colour entered, while it does display
correctly as the second coloured entered.

Nick 


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RE: [WSG] New Colour Schemer - draft - any suggestions?

[Michael Kear]

Not any more it doesn't.Result of cutting and pasting bits of code
huh. 

Good thing I didn't try and pretend this was a mature ready-for-prime-time
tool isn't it.


Cheers
Mike Kear

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Nick Cowie
Sent: Wednesday, 31 March 2004 4:46 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [WSG] New Colour Schemer - draft - any suggestions?

Michael

The right column, has a commnet "This is text in the colour #XX"
Unfortunately #XX is the first colour entered, while it does display
correctly as the second coloured entered.

Nick 


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RE: [WSG] New Colour Schemer - draft - any suggestions?

[Michael Kear]

Thanks Lindsay.  Good suggestions. I've changed the method to get already.  

I haven't paid much attention to error trapping, and that's my bad.
Actually I never use the 3 digit abbreviation, so it never occurred to me
and it should have.  I'll do some thinking about error trapping in the next
day or so as I get more reaction to the tool.

Cheers
Mike Kear


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Subject: RE: [WSG] New Colour Schemer - draft - any suggestions?

Michael Kear wrote:
> For my own benefit, I have been developing a colour schemer tool, and
> I've put it on my web site for others to use, comment about, help me
> improve.

Snippety-snip

> http://afpwebworks.com/colourschemer/  is the address. (note the
> Australian COLOUR not the American COLOR)

Looks pretty good to me, Mike.

One thing I'd suggest: make the form method 'get' instead of 'post', that
way people can bookmark, email, etc. the colour scheme easily.

Oh, found a bug, too: if I enter a 3 digit hex code (eg. #333), then I get a
CF error, might be handy for us lazy CSS folk to put shorthand for colours
in :)

--
 Lindsay Evans.
 Developer,
 Red Square Productions.



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RE: [WSG] New Colour Schemer - draft - any suggestions?

[Nick Cowie]

Michael

The right column, has a commnet "This is text in the colour #XX"
Unfortunately #XX is the first colour entered, while it does display correctly as 
the second coloured entered.

Nick 
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RE: [WSG] New Colour Schemer - draft - any suggestions?

[Lindsay Evans]

Michael Kear wrote:
> For my own benefit, I have been developing a colour schemer tool, and
> I've put it on my web site for others to use, comment about, help me
> improve.

Snippety-snip

> http://afpwebworks.com/colourschemer/  is the address. (note the
> Australian COLOUR not the American COLOR)

Looks pretty good to me, Mike.

One thing I'd suggest: make the form method 'get' instead of 'post', that
way people can bookmark, email, etc. the colour scheme easily.

Oh, found a bug, too: if I enter a 3 digit hex code (eg. #333), then I get a
CF error, might be handy for us lazy CSS folk to put shorthand for colours
in :)

--
 Lindsay Evans.
 Developer,
 Red Square Productions.

 [p] 8596.4000
 [f] 8596.4001
 [w] www.redsquare.com.au

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[WSG] New Colour Schemer - draft - any suggestions?

[Michael Kear]

For my own benefit, I have been developing a colour schemer
tool, and I’ve put it on my web site for others to use, comment about,
help me improve. 

 

There are lots of colour development tools around, I know,
but I got into doing my own because all the tools I have known about use
_javascript_ and the scheme can’t be saved.   For example there’s a
great one at http://www.pixy.cz/apps/barvy/index-en.html
  but if you click anywhere on the page, or try to cut and paste the colour
numbers, it changes the scheme and you can’t get back again easily.   The
only way to record the scheme you work on so hard, is to get a pen and paper
and write down all the colour numbers.

 

So I started developing my own, so I can produce a chart for
each site I’m working on with the colours I’ve decided on for the
site listed out.   I’ve put it on my web site and I’d really
appreciate if you could go have a look, and let me know if there’s any
way I can make it more useful, any features I should add.   (One feature I’m
going to add is to have it email the resulting plan to you when you click a
button, so you have a chart to use as a reference).

 

 

http://afpwebworks.com/colourschemer/
 is the address. (note the Australian COLOUR not the American COLOR)

 

 

 

Cheers

Mike Kear

AFP Webworks

Windsor, NSW, Australia

http://afpwebworks.com

 

Re: [WSG] Show/hide layers without javascript (was: [WSG] How to do some things)

[scott parsons]

Well it depends upon the exact behaviour desired, and the browsers you 
want to support, but something like this can be done with the :focus, 
:target or  for win/ie the broken model of :active

I wouldn't necessarily suggest that any of these methods are perfect, 
and would reccommend javascript but hey there are possibilities there

s

P.H.Lauke wrote:

What you describe can only be achieved with javascript, if you want to
avoid server calls and do it all in a single document...the page needs to
keep track of which link has been pressed, for instance...something that
CSS is not meant for...
Patrick

Patrick H. Lauke
Webmaster
University of Salford 
www.salford.ac.uk
 

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[WSG] Progress on Brisbane WSG meeting - quality venue available

[Gary Menzel]

For those interested in the potential (embryonic) regular Brisbane WSG
meeting, there has been some more progress.

Please go to:

http://discuss.webstandardsgroup.org/archives/06.htm


Gary Menzel
Web Development Manager
IT Operations Brisbane -+- ABN AMRO Morgans Limited
Level 29, 123 Eagle Street BRISBANE QLD 4000
PH: 07 333 44 828  FX:  07 3834 0828


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RE: [WSG] Show/hide layers without javascript (was: [WSG] How to do some things)

[P.H.Lauke]

> And seeing most people use IE, you might as well use javascript.

Whether or not people use IE has nothing to do with whether or not they have 
javascript enabled or not. 
Available, yes...but not necessarily enabled.
 
Patrick

Patrick H. Lauke
Webmaster
University of Salford 
www.salford.ac.uk  
<>

RE: [WSG] Show/hide layers without javascript (was: [WSG] How to do some things)

[P.H.Lauke]

I beg to differ. If you re-read the thread starter, you'll see that the question was 
about "clicking a link, and making one thing visible, clicking another, and another 
one becomes visible". You can't toggle things on/off via clicks, and then let the user 
move out of the element to do something on the rest of the page. It's true you can use 
:hover/:focus, but that doesn't solve the original problem as far as I understood it.
 
P

-Original Message- 
From: Leo J. O'Campo [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wed 31/03/2004 02:18 
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Cc: 
Subject: Re: [WSG] Show/hide layers without javascript (was: [WSG] How to do 
some things)



Patrick

It can be done in CSS by toggling the display visibility with the
a:hover and positioning.

Leo

On Tuesday, March 30, 2004, at 04:41  PM, P.H.Lauke wrote:

> What you describe can only be achieved with javascript, if you want to
> avoid server calls and do it all in a single document...the page needs
> to
> keep track of which link has been pressed, for instance...something
> that
> CSS is not meant for...
>
> Patrick
> 
> Patrick H. Lauke
> Webmaster
> University of Salford
> www.salford.ac.uk
> 

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RE: [WSG] Show/hide layers without javascript (was: [WSG] How to do some things)

[Nick Cowie]

Leo wrote:
> It can be done in CSS by toggling the display visibility with the 
> a:hover and positioning.

Except is does not work in that browser.  (you know the one I mean Internet Exploder )

There are a number of tricks you can do with hover and CSS for people using CSS2 
compliant browsers have a look at the suckerfish dropdowns on a list apart for a 
starting point and go from there, it is only limited by your imagination, hard work 
and how many people using the wrong browser ;-).

Seriously there is a lot you can do, but it will not work in IE without javascript.  
And seeing most people use IE, you might as well use javascript.

Nick
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Re: [WSG] Show/hide layers without javascript (was: [WSG] How to do some things)

[Leo J. O'Campo]

Patrick

It can be done in CSS by toggling the display visibility with the 
a:hover and positioning.

Leo

On Tuesday, March 30, 2004, at 04:41  PM, P.H.Lauke wrote:

What you describe can only be achieved with javascript, if you want to
avoid server calls and do it all in a single document...the page needs 
to
keep track of which link has been pressed, for instance...something 
that
CSS is not meant for...

Patrick

Patrick H. Lauke
Webmaster
University of Salford
www.salford.ac.uk

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Re: [WSG] How to do some things

[Justin French]

On Wednesday, March 31, 2004, at 06:21  AM, Vaska.WSG wrote:

I'm trying to find a method for showing/hiding layers using CSS which 
doesn't use javascript if it's possible (?).  Ideally, a layer (let's 
call it A) would automatically show when a page loads, then when a 
link is clicked it would disappear and B would replace it.  Then, 
another link would show A again and hide B, etc.
I don't think it can be done sorry.  Remember, CSS is about 
presentation, not interaction.  The only property you really have in 
CSS to play with is :hover, which allows some interaction with an 
element in it's hovered state. [1]

This has allowed many CSS-only drop-down menus to crop up [2], but 
since IE only supports :hover on 's, DOM javascripting [3] is 
required to make IE work as expected.  In otherwords, you certainly 
can't escape JS on IE -- an exception may be all that IE7 huff that's 
going on at the moment.

I'd suggest checking out the scripting and work down with Suckerfish 
drop-downs [3], but since you were looking for "clicking" interaction, 
not "hovering", my guess is this won't be sufficient.

1. http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/css/edge/popups/demo.html
2. http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/css/edge/menus/demo.html
3. http://alistapart.com/articles/dropdowns/
---
Justin French
http://indent.com.au
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RE: [WSG] best method for columns inside a column

[Miles Tillinger]

> On Monday, March 29, 2004, at 11:57  PM, Miles Tillinger wrote:
> 

> 
> As far as the IE hacks go, ...go to the web site of Dean 
> Edwards and I 
> think your find the best solution. http://dean.edwards.name/IE7/intro/
> His script [ie7-xml.css] changes IE to a standards browser.
> Copy it from the "src" link in the breadcrump tail. -chuck

Ah yes, I'd forgotten about that little bit of wizardry!  Have ppl used the IE7 script 
successfully?

> 
> 
> 
> 
> >
> > Is what I am trying to do not suited to CSS positioning?  
> Or is there 
> > a better way to do it?
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > MT
> > *
> > The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
> > See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> > for some hints on posting to the list & getting help
> > *
> >
> >
> 
> *
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> 
> 
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RE: [WSG] best method for columns inside a column

[Miles Tillinger]

> 
> Sorry no answer to the problem... But your services div has a margin
> left of 197 and your splitter one has a margin left of 200. 
> The splitter
> seems to be pushing out as well in ie5.0, im not sure why that is.
> Probably the width of the feature or services div becomes 
> smaller in ie5
> and so its out of whack. 

That was the smoking ears problem I had, trying to make small changes to pixel values 
to get it to line up in different browsers.  I will take a look at the IE5 issue.

> 
> Also with regards to your box model hacks, if you haven't 
> used a left or
> right padding/margin, ie5 and 6 should read the width as the same non?
> So no need to use the hack? Or does ie5 put some stupid 2 
> pixel space in
> for some reason?

I think the hacks were in there from the layout-o-matic template.  I'm yet to try 
removing them.

> 
> How come you decided to use float and abosolute positioning? I would
> have thought to only use one or the other, not together. It is sitting
> within the main div already so would float: right take care of the
> positioning using a specific margin and width? Or does it break the
> layout?

When I first tried that method it worked ok but removing the float right broke the 
layout.  However it changed a fair bit after that so working backwards a bit may help 
solve the problem.

> 
> Site looks awesome btw, shadows are nicely done imo.

Thanks for the suggestions, I'll try them out :)

MT.

> 
> 
> Tim Hill
> Computer Associates
> Graphic Artist
> tel: +612 9937 0792
> fax: +612 9937 0546
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>  
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Miles Tillinger
> Sent: Tuesday, 30 March 2004 3:57 PM
> To: Web Standards Group (E-mail)
> Subject: [WSG] best method for columns inside a column
> 
> Finally a chance for my first attempt at a 100% CSS 
> positioning site and
> besides using the deprecated align parameter for an input:image, the
> site validates ok!
> 
> http://streetdaddy.gotdns.com/astute/index.html
> http://streetdaddy.gotdns.com/astute/main.css
> http://streetdaddy.gotdns.com/astute/astute.css
> 
> (sorry if the dyndns is borked, try 150.101.34.189 
> temporarily if it is)
> 
> Its a simple header > two-columns > footer layout based on a
> layout-o-matic template.  I then use absolute positioning to float the
> #feature div to the right of the #services div, however the 
> correct top
> & left values seem to differ between IE and Mozilla/Opera.
> 
> I've managed to get it basically perfect in IE6, but there is 
> small 2-3
> pixel discrepancy in Mozilla and Opera (haven't had a chance 
> to check on
> Safari yet *shudder*) down the left side of the right column.  I'm
> guessing that its to do with how I've made the columns inside a column
> layout, but I can't work out a better way to do it.
> 
> Is what I am trying to do not suited to CSS positioning?  Or 
> is there a
> better way to do it?
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> MT
> *
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> http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
> for some hints on posting to the list & getting help
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> 
> 
> *
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> 
> 
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RE: [WSG] best method for columns inside a column

[Miles Tillinger]

> On Tuesday, March 30, 2004, at 03:57  PM, Miles Tillinger wrote:
> 
> > I've managed to get it basically perfect in IE6, but there is small 
> > 2-3 pixel discrepancy in Mozilla and Opera (haven't had a chance to 
> > check on Safari yet *shudder*) down the left side of the 
> right column. 
> >  I'm guessing that its to do with how I've made the columns 
> inside a 
> > column layout, but I can't work out a better way to do it.
> 
> You're worried about 2-3 pixels?  I wouldn't be, unless it 
> looks awful, 
> just aim for "close and visually balanced" rather than "pixel 
> perfect".

I agree and I'm happy with where it's at now.  It definitely doesn't look awful, in 
fact a few ppl that've seen the site didn't notice it, although they aren't hunting 
for it like we would!

> 
> Furthermore, I'd suggest that Safari, Mozilla, Opera et al are 
> "correct" and IE is "2-3 pixels out", not the other way around :)

Yeah it's certainly IE that is being silly as I've measured the pixels.

> 
> FWIW, it renders the same in Safari and Opera 7.5Beta on Mac OS X.

Thanks for the OSX check, that makes me feel better!
> 
> 
> > Is what I am trying to do not suited to CSS positioning?  
> Or is there 
> > a better way to do it?
> 
> Seems perfect to me -- you should be able to almost achieve 
> everything 
> (and then some) with CSS layout that you used to with tables, 
> with the 
> exception of tabular data, which should remain in tables.

MT.

> 
> ---
> Justin French
> http://indent.com.au
> 
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> 
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[WSG] Re: CSS not rendering in Mozilla

[Universal Head]

Thanks for the help on this. It's working ow, though I'm very confused as to why to tell you the truth. I asked my host about the MIME type and he said it was set to text/css (his server software is Webstar btw). Yet it still wouldn't work. It was only after he flushed the server cache that it suddenly started working.

Strange, but the problem appears to be fixed. Thanks again for the help!
Peter


On 30/03/2004, at 10:28 AM, David McDonald wrote:

Peter,

I have had a similar problem with the BHP Billiton site recently. It
looks like the server does not have the mime type for CSS set
correctly.

In Mozilla, if you select Tools, Web Development, then Javascript
Console, you should see an error message reading:

Error: The stylesheet http://www.cinema4duser.com/css/main.css was
not loaded because its MIME type, "text/html", is not "text/css".

This is a problem on the server end, where they either don't have the
experience or the knowledge to set up mime types properly. I woulod
hazard a guess and say that the CSS mime type is set to
"text/x-pointplus.

More info at:

http://devedge.netscape.com/viewsource/2002/incorrect-mime-types/

Universal Head 
Design That Works.

7/43 Bridge Rd Stanmore
NSW 2048 Australia
T	(+612) 9517 1466
F	(+612) 9565 4747
E	[EMAIL PROTECTED]
W	www.universalhead.com

Re: [WSG] :hover and accessibility [Virus checkedAU]

[Mark . Lynch]

This email is to be read subject to the disclaimer below.

Hi Rob,

One of the things I tend to use wherever I use a :hover is a similar :focus
(Not supported in IE) - this gives a similar effect when you are tabbing
over elements -
For an example see http://markl.f2o.org/ and keep hitting tab until you end
up at the either of the nav menus (left and right).

Unfortunately I'm not sure how this works in screenreaders but will help
make your menu's more accessible to keyboard navigation.

Cheers,
Mark



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Re: [WSG] Show/hide layers without javascript (was: [WSG] How to do some things)

[Bill McAvinney]

What you describe can only be achieved with javascript Š
However, you can "show/hide" text (and in some browsers images) using
hover as shown here:
http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/css/edge/popups/demo.html
and here:
http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/css/edge/popups/demo2.html
This isn't what you asked for, but it might be helpful depending on
what you're really trying to achieve.
Bill McAvinney
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[WSG] [OT] World Wide Web Conference

[aaron . webb]

Title: [OT] World Wide Web Conference





Can anyone give me feedback on the World Wide Web Conference (www.www2004.org).  I was thinking about going but would like to know if anyone has ever been to it.  It was kind of hard to tell from the website everything that is going on and what it is like.  You can direct your comments to the discussion list (http://discuss.webstandardsgroup.org/archives/07.htm).

Thanks,
Aaron

[WSG] :hover and accessibility

[Robert Moser]

How do screen readers handle the :hover pseudoclass?

The main reason I'm wondering is in regards to CSS flyout menus. 
Typically these involve changing a display: none; on the normal element 
to a display: block; on the :hover pseudoclass of that element.

FIR was deprecated due to poor behavior of display: none; with screen 
readers, so I'm wondering how this technique fares with them.

Is the worst case scenario handled appropriately by making the top-level 
of the menu link to a sectional page with the submenu expanded, such 
that everything is still accessible, just with an additional click?
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[WSG] Show/hide layers without javascript (was: [WSG] How to do some things)

[P.H.Lauke]

What you describe can only be achieved with javascript, if you want to
avoid server calls and do it all in a single document...the page needs to
keep track of which link has been pressed, for instance...something that
CSS is not meant for...
 
Patrick

Patrick H. Lauke
Webmaster
University of Salford 
www.salford.ac.uk
<>

Re: [WSG] What do you think?

[Luc]

Good evening russ,
  
It was foretold that on 30-3-2004 @ 23:43:07 GMT+1000 (which was
15:43:07 where I live) russ weakley would write:
  


rw> So, it should not be TOO hard to convert your nav system into a list. All
rw> you have to do is overcome the default behaviour of the list first. This is
rw> achieved by a few rules like:
rw> Once you take out these browser default behaviours you can rework your own
rw> rules and you are away.
  
And there is always this that will get you the needed info:

http://css.maxdesign.com.au/listutorial/index.htm

(russ, note my reply template ;-) )
 
-- 
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 Luc
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[WSG] How to do some things

[Vaska . WSG]

Hi WSG...

I've searched through my email archives and I can't dig up a good 
discussion on this, although I know that it must exist someplace in 
here.

I'm trying to find a method for showing/hiding layers using CSS which 
doesn't use javascript if it's possible (?).  Ideally, a layer (let's 
call it A) would automatically show when a page loads, then when a link 
is clicked it would disappear and B would replace it.  Then, another 
link would show A again and hide B, etc.

I know of a Microsoft-only method for doing this, but not something 
that will work on all modern browsers.

Any links or tutorials regarding this would be muchos gracias.

Thanks...v

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Re: [WSG] IE doesn't like my positioning

[Barbara Dozetos]

Thanks!  Believe me, I know there's lots more to be dealt with.  I 
inherited this site when I took the job and found that there had been no 
single person in charge of the site.  We're definitely starting from 
scratch with a redesign, but we have to keep putting bandaids on the 
existing site until that's ready to go.

Again, thanks a million for finding my problem.  I would NEVER have 
found that.

Barb

Robert Moser wrote:

This specific problem is caused by the  tag at the end of your 
div with an id of div3.  Since you don't close that tag and IE is 
operating in quirks mode, it happily applies it to the rest of the page.

Plenty of other problems to fix after that.  It may actually be easier 
to start this site over from scratch rather than try to fix all the 
problems.  But if you want to fix it in place I'd recommend as a first 
step looking at the validator 
(http://validator.w3.org/check?verbose=1&uri=http%3A//www.pcc.com/clients/uc/welcometest.html). 

Good luck,
Robert
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1 Main St., Ste 7   802-846-5532
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Re: [WSG] IE doesn't like my positioning

[Barbara Dozetos]

No, you're just seeing the result of a server-side include there.  IE 
doesn't have a problem with that, or none of our Web site would ever 
work. :)

Is there something about right margins, maybe?  The div that creates the 
far left column with the logos in it works fine with left, right and top 
properties.  I've tried replacing the 'width' property in the two divs 
that aren't working with a right property, but that isn't working, either.

Barb

Jeremy Flint wrote:

I am going to guess it has something to do with the fact that you 
start your HTML document twice.

-
Jeremy Flint
www.jeremyflint.com


--
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Re: [WSG] Thank you for the great tutorial was... Some suggestions needed

[Sarah Sammis]

> Sorry Gray did I forget it?  Here it is...
>
> http://css.maxdesign.com.au/floatutorial/tutorial0801.htm
>
>

I'm in the process of completely redoing my site. Step 1 is just to get
all the pieces looking similar. Step 2 will be to completely revamp it
with CSS and this tutorial will come in handy then.

Thanks.
Sarah
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Re: [WSG] IE doesn't like my positioning

[Robert Moser]

Barbara Dozetos wrote:

Hello all --

This is probably a really simple thing, but I'm growing incapacitated by 
my frustration.  Working on the layout with dummy text and it looks 
great in Firefox, but IE says ut-uh.  Can someone take a look and tell 
me what stupid mistake I've made?
http://www.pcc.com/clients/uc/welcometest.html

thanks,

Barb

This specific problem is caused by the  tag at the end of your div 
with an id of div3.  Since you don't close that tag and IE is operating 
in quirks mode, it happily applies it to the rest of the page.

Plenty of other problems to fix after that.  It may actually be easier 
to start this site over from scratch rather than try to fix all the 
problems.  But if you want to fix it in place I'd recommend as a first 
step looking at the validator 
(http://validator.w3.org/check?verbose=1&uri=http%3A//www.pcc.com/clients/uc/welcometest.html).

Good luck,
Robert
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[WSG] CSS issue in Opera (Win)

[theGrafixGuy]

Title: CSS issue in Opera (Win)






Hi all,

I am building Zen Cart, and thanks for the suggestion!!!

I have noticed a problem though – in the footer every cart I have seen using a footer with a border, the right border disappears on the footer and footer top.

Here are 7 example sites and you will see what I mean – the CSS will be the same for all with some changes for style, but here is the base code.

/* footer

--*/

TABLE.footer {

  background: #ff;

  text-align: center;

  font-size: 10px;

  border-right: 1px solid #9a9a9a;

  border-left: 1px solid #9a9a9a;

  border-bottom: 1px solid #9a9a9a;

}

TR.footertop {

  background: #abbbd3;

  background-image: url(../images/tile_back.jpg);

  font-size: 11px;

}

TD.footertop, TD.footerbottom {

  padding: 5px;

}

Any ideas what is wrong???

Re: [WSG] IE doesn't like my positioning

[Jeremy Flint]

I am going to guess it has something to do with the fact that you start 
your HTML document twice.

-
Jeremy Flint
www.jeremyflint.com


Barbara Dozetos wrote:
Hello all --

This is probably a really simple thing, but I'm growing incapacitated by 
my frustration.  Working on the layout with dummy text and it looks 
great in Firefox, but IE says ut-uh.  Can someone take a look and tell 
me what stupid mistake I've made?
http://www.pcc.com/clients/uc/welcometest.html

thanks,

Barb

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[WSG] IE doesn't like my positioning

[Barbara Dozetos]

Hello all --

This is probably a really simple thing, but I'm growing incapacitated by 
my frustration.  Working on the layout with dummy text and it looks 
great in Firefox, but IE says ut-uh.  Can someone take a look and tell 
me what stupid mistake I've made?
http://www.pcc.com/clients/uc/welcometest.html

thanks,

Barb

--
Barbara Dozetos [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Physician's Computer CompanyMarketing Team
1 Main St., Ste 7   802-846-5532
Winooski, VT 05404
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RE: [WSG] Some links...

[Peters Micheal A Contr GSI/SCBN]

Nice Templates, but my German is a little shaky at best

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of russ weakley
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2004 4:30 PM
To: Web Standards Group
Subject: [WSG] Some links...

New css layout resources: http://intensivstation.ch/css/template.php

Russ

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Re: [WSG] a QUICK HELPER - BRAIN IS DEAD AFTER 14 HOURS

[Tim Lucas]

Answered off list.
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[WSG] a QUICK HELPER - BRAIN IS DEAD AFTER 14 HOURS

[theGrafixGuy]

I have a php define that I want to add in include as well - How???

 blah blah');?>

I want to put in 


I do this  blah blah');?>

And it breaks 

What Am I missing here???

Brian

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Re: [WSG] What do you think?

[Andy Clarke]

Chris

Comrade, there are many fantastic resources that deal with converting lists into 'tabbed' navigation.

Places to start might be;

http://css.maxdesign.com.au/listamatic/index.htm
http://www.alistapart.com/articles/slidingdoors2/
http://labs.silverorange.com/archives/2003/september/simplecsstabs
Oooops! I didn't separate my links with more than whitespace :(

Malarkey
www.malarkey.co.uk
www.karova.com
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Re: [WSG] What do you think?

[russ weakley]

Keeping in mind that everyone has their own opinion on semantically correct
markup, I'll give you my opinion.

If they are reduced to their most basic level, navigation links are simply a
list of links to other parts of the site.

If we assume that some devices will see them without any css or other visual
styling, then it is important that they have some meaning and structure. So,
a list can (arguably) be seen as the most semantically correct option.

The funny thing about css is that all elements are just blocks to be styled
as you need - , , , , ... Doesn¹t matter. You can
still apply borders padding, margin, colour and background colour...

So, it should not be TOO hard to convert your nav system into a list. All
you have to do is overcome the default behaviour of the list first. This is
achieved by a few rules like:

ul { margin: 0; padding: 0; list-style-type: none;}
li { display: inline}

Be warned, my brain is gone tonight so this code could be a little off  :)

Once you take out these browser default behaviours you can rework your own
rules and you are away.

Russ



> Aw russ...
> I see your point!
> 
> One thing - which I have NEVER understood is...
> Why you people all use Lists?
> I mean I just dont understand why lists are used for menus...
> It sounds like a stupid question - beause a menu is a list...
> 
> But just wondering, why you use them, instead of simply lining up the
> content??
> 
> I dont know how well i can convert the code to work with a list...
> I will try, otherwise I can just use a   to spread it...
> Chris Stratford
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Http://www.neester.com
> 
> 
> russ weakley wrote:
>> Chris,
>> 
>> The tabs looks really nice but Tonico does have a point. If you strip out
>> all css styles, the links will appear in one line with very little between
>> them - making them hard to distinguish on older browsers, browsers that have
>> css switched off or text-based browsers..
>> 
>> Could you convert that system into a list and tweak the styles slightly?
>> Then you'd have (arguably) a much more semantically correct base to work
>> from.
>> 
>> Russ
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> It has been said that adjacend links should be separated with more then
>>> whitespace.
>>> 
>>> WCAG 10.5
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Don't know if this is relevant for your audience.
>>> 
>>> Tonico
>>>   
>> 
>> *
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>> See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
>> for some hints on posting to the list & getting help
>> *
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
> * The discussion list for
> http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See
> http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to
> the list  getting help *


Thanks
Russ

---
Russ Weakley
Max Design
Phone: (02) 9410 2521
Mobile: 0403 433 980
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.maxdesign.com.au
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Re: [WSG] What do you think?

[Tonico Strasser]

Chris Stratford wrote:

I dont know what you mean by that?
Sorry, I'll try to be more verbose the next time. I see Russ has already 
explained it very well.

Tonico

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Re: [WSG] What do you think?

[Chris Stratford]

Aw russ...
I see your point!

One thing - which I have NEVER understood is...
Why you people all use Lists?
I mean I just dont understand why lists are used for menus...
It sounds like a stupid question - beause a menu is a list...

But just wondering, why you use them, instead of simply lining up the
content??

I dont know how well i can convert the code to work with a list...
I will try, otherwise I can just use a   to spread it...
Chris Stratford
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Http://www.neester.com


russ weakley wrote:

  Chris,

The tabs looks really nice but Tonico does have a point. If you strip out
all css styles, the links will appear in one line with very little between
them - making them hard to distinguish on older browsers, browsers that have
css switched off or text-based browsers..

Could you convert that system into a list and tweak the styles slightly?
Then you'd have (arguably) a much more semantically correct base to work
from.

Russ


  
  
It has been said that adjacend links should be separated with more then
whitespace.

WCAG 10.5
 

Don't know if this is relevant for your audience.

Tonico

  
  
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Re: [WSG] What do you think?

[Chris Stratford]

I dont know what you mean by that?

but yeah.
the tabs are seperated only with a margin...
but i tested it out on IECapture and ICapture and it looks great on
them all so far!
Chris Stratford
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Http://www.neester.com


Tonico Strasser wrote:
Chris
Stratford wrote:
  
  
  Hey everyone,


I have just completed my own Tab layout style in CSS...

Sorry I didnt really develop it for show - I didnt even plan it...

Like most of my work, it just sort of happened...



www.neester.com/tdir

CSS:

www.neester.com/tdir/water.css


dont mind the content.

what do you all think?


I had to use a sort of hack to get around some parts.

And PHP is needed to know which is the active tab etc...


let me know what you think!

  
  
It has been said that adjacend links should be separated with more then
whitespace.
  
  
WCAG 10.5
  
  
  
  
Don't know if this is relevant for your audience.
  
  
Tonico
  
  
  
  



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Re: [WSG] What do you think?

[russ weakley]

Chris,

The tabs looks really nice but Tonico does have a point. If you strip out
all css styles, the links will appear in one line with very little between
them - making them hard to distinguish on older browsers, browsers that have
css switched off or text-based browsers..

Could you convert that system into a list and tweak the styles slightly?
Then you'd have (arguably) a much more semantically correct base to work
from.

Russ


> It has been said that adjacend links should be separated with more then
> whitespace.
> 
> WCAG 10.5
>  
> 
> Don't know if this is relevant for your audience.
> 
> Tonico

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Re: [WSG] What do you think?

[Tonico Strasser]

Chris Stratford wrote:

Hey everyone,

I have just completed my own Tab layout style in CSS...
Sorry I didnt really develop it for show - I didnt even plan it...
Like most of my work, it just sort of happened...
www.neester.com/tdir
CSS:
www.neester.com/tdir/water.css
dont mind the content.
what do you all think?
I had to use a sort of hack to get around some parts.
And PHP is needed to know which is the active tab etc...
let me know what you think!
It has been said that adjacend links should be separated with more then 
whitespace.

WCAG 10.5
  
Don't know if this is relevant for your audience.

Tonico



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[WSG] What do you think?

[Chris Stratford]

Hey everyone,

I have just completed my own Tab layout style in CSS...
Sorry I didnt really develop it for show - I didnt even plan it...
Like most of my work, it just sort of happened...


www.neester.com/tdir
CSS:
www.neester.com/tdir/water.css

dont mind the content.
what do you all think?

I had to use a sort of hack to get around some parts.
And PHP is needed to know which is the active tab etc...

let me know what you think!

cheers!
-- 
Chris Stratford
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Http://www.neester.com


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Re: [WSG] CSS & the Linux documentation project

[Cameron Adams]

Well ... you know, the webmonkey.com domain name will
be up for grabs soon ... but it's all a bit hush-hush,
so shhh ...

;o]

--
Cameron Adams

W: www.themaninblue.com


--- russ weakley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Well, we have seen some amazing stuff come out of
> TheManinBlue - auto
> accessible forms, css scrabble...
> 
> Is this a hint about an upcoming project? Something
> like a
> Blind-monkey-auto-layout-tool ?
> 
> :)
> Russ


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Re: [WSG] best method for columns inside a column

[Chuck]

On Monday, March 29, 2004, at 11:57  PM, Miles Tillinger wrote:

Finally a chance for my first attempt at a 100% CSS positioning site 
and besides using the deprecated align parameter for an input:image, 
the site validates ok!

http://streetdaddy.gotdns.com/astute/index.html
http://streetdaddy.gotdns.com/astute/main.css
http://streetdaddy.gotdns.com/astute/astute.css
(sorry if the dyndns is borked, try 150.101.34.189 temporarily if it 
is)

Its a simple header > two-columns > footer layout based on a 
layout-o-matic template.  I then use absolute positioning to float the 
#feature div to the right of the #services div, however the correct 
top & left values seem to differ between IE and Mozilla/Opera.

I've managed to get it basically perfect in IE6, but there is small 
2-3 pixel discrepancy in Mozilla and Opera (haven't had a chance to 
check on Safari yet *shudder*) down the left side of the right column. 
 I'm guessing that its to do with how I've made the columns inside a 
column layout, but I can't work out a better way to do it.
Good looking page!
Mac side looks good; Safari, IE5.0, & Mozzilla (ex: Opera 6.0 -no 
@import, so no text)
As far as the IE hacks go, ...go to the web site of Dean Edwards and I 
think your find the best solution. http://dean.edwards.name/IE7/intro/
His script [ie7-xml.css] changes IE to a standards browser.
Copy it from the "src" link in the breadcrump tail. -chuck




Is what I am trying to do not suited to CSS positioning?  Or is there 
a better way to do it?

Cheers,

MT
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[WSG] Desktop Article

[Bradley Wright]

Did anyone happen to see the Web Standards article in the latest Desktop
magazine? (I have a subscription so I got it earlier than the
newsagents)

For those of you not familiar with the magazine, it's a primarily
graphic/flash design oriented magazine that's generally very high on
gloss. It was nice to see an article on web standards but to be honest I
wasn't expecting much.

It's not too bad actually. It refers to Zeldman and WASP, so it at least
has its sources right. It (in my opinion) paints a fairly measured view
on web standards in general, trotting out the by now familiar lines of
"bandwidth savings" and "future compatibility". Basically I'm not
unhappy with it: it's certainly better than I'd expect Desktop to be on
a fairly technical subject.

Just thought I'd bring it to your attention.

Here's the general link of the magazine for those who are interested:
http://www.niche.com.au/dt/general.html

There's unfortunately no article text online yet.

Cheers,

Brad

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Re: [WSG] Some suggestions needed

[Leo J. O'Campo]

Sorry Gray did I forget it?  Here it is...

http://css.maxdesign.com.au/floatutorial/tutorial0801.htm

On Tuesday, March 30, 2004, at 12:11  AM, Gary Greer wrote:

Hi Leo.

What was the URL for the tutorial?

gary

Leo J. O'Campo wrote:
So Gary...  What is complicating it?  Just remember to put a clear: 
both; in the footer rule
Just check out this excellent tutorial on how to create footer for a 
2 column layout.  It step by step by the numbers, easy.
Leo
On Monday, March 29, 2004, at 02:25  AM, Gary Greer wrote:
Looking at http://www.muprivate.edu.au/index_frameset.asp I'm 
fighting to replicate the same layout as was used with tables. All 
is going fine, until I got to the footer, when it's just too complex 
for me to figure out.

Could I ask if the group could look at the above URL and see what 
could be done with the footer? It's the bit that starts "University 
web search"

Thanks greatly!

Gary

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