Re: [WSG] page break up
Lachlan Hunt said: > Terrence Wood wrote: >> a comment in this format is not invalid HTML: >> >> > > If it's not followed by another '-->' later in the document with no > extra '--' in between, then yes it is an invalid comment declaration. > Where on earth did you get the idea that it is valid? where indeed ;-) ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
Re: [WSG] page break up
On Mon, 2005-11-28 at 00:25 -0400, Jay Gilmore wrote: > Lori, > > I am going to suggest that you download Firefox or Mozilla to develop > with. You will find that IE is too forgiving and allows errors to fall > through the cracks by trying to render the page vs. not parsing > invalid code. IE is forgiving! But it just murdered all my poor, innocent floats :( Alan Trick __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
Re: [WSG] page break up
Terrence Wood wrote: a comment in this format is not invalid HTML: If it's not followed by another '-->' later in the document with no extra '--' in between, then yes it is an invalid comment declaration. Where on earth did you get the idea that it is valid? The validator will certainly issue an error for that: Error unterminated comment: found end of entity inside comment Browser support is limited for HTML comment syntax? Which browser(s) would that be? IE/Win, for one, plus some (if not all) browsers in quirks mode. Also, at the time the spec was written, I seriously doubt NN4 and other browsers of that era supported them either.See the acid 2 test in IE, notice where it says ERROR on the page (near the bottom left corner). http://www.webstandards.org/act/acid2/test.html Also see the the different comment parsing modes in Mozilla (pick a DOCTYPE that triggers standards mode and compare with one that triggers quirks mode) http://www.mozilla.org/docs/web-developer/quirks/doctypes.html View the same tests in IE, and it will always show that comment parsing is in quirks mode -- Lachlan Hunt http://lachy.id.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
Re: [WSG] page break up
Lachlan Hunt said: > I did mention that whitespace could not follow the MDO. My apologies you did indeed say that. The fact remains, that while it may be malformed and bad pratice becuase it invites errors - comments can be terminated early or not at all, a comment in this format is not invalid HTML: > browser support is limited Browser support is limited for HTML comment syntax? Which browser(s) would that be? kind regards Terrence Wood. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
Re: [WSG] page break up
Terrence Wood wrote: Lachlan Hunt said: In SGML, the comment syntax is as follows: I believe your original comment was that it was invalid HTML. While similar, the SGML rule differs from HTML in it's treatment of whitespace, There is no formal difference between HTML4 and SGML comments, as HTML is an application of SGML which follows SGML rules. On the practical side of things, however, browsers will handle various forms of invalid comments in various ways, but that doesn't make them any less invalid, nor alter the formal HTML comment syntax. and the example you provided is, in fact, invalid HTML. Note that I broke the comment onto multiple lines in order to explain each component clearly, and I did mention that whitespace could not follow the MDO and that only whitespace could occur between comments. I thought it was clear that the notes in parenthesis were just that, and not actually part of the comment. The recommendation[1] That part of the rec should be treated as being informative, rather than normative. goes on to say authors should avoid multiple hyphens together in comments, however mulitple hyphens do not invalidate the document (otherwise, I presume, the recommendation would read MUST avoid multiple hyphens, and the validators would flag multiple occurances of them). It says *should* because it still uses SGML comment syntax, but authors should avoid using it because a) browser support is limited (and was much more limited at the time of writing) and b) most authors are unlikely to understand the SGML comment syntax, and it's advisable for authors to simply avoid strings of hyphens, rather than worry about all the technical details. If it said *must*, then that would not comply with SGML rules. eg. Run those through the validator to confirm that, if you like. [1] http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/intro/sgmltut.html#h-3.2.4 -- Lachlan Hunt http://lachy.id.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
Re: [WSG] page break up
Christian Montoya wrote: Lord Vader's Former Handle, Anakin link, visited, focus, hover, active Always in that order! Yeah -- that's it! -Jay Jay Gilmore Developer/Consultant Affordable Websites and Marketing Solutions for Real Small Business. SmashingRed Web & Marketing P) 902.529.0651 E) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [WSG] page break up
Lachlan Hunt said: > In SGML, the comment syntax is as follows: I believe your original comment was that it was invalid HTML. While similar, the SGML rule differs from HTML in it's treatment of whitespace, and the example you provided is, in fact, invalid HTML. The recommendation[1] goes on to say authors should avoid multiple hyphens together in comments, however mulitple hyphens do not invalidate the document (otherwise, I presume, the recommendation would read MUST avoid multiple hyphens, and the validators would flag multiple occurances of them). EXAMPLES: [1] http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/intro/sgmltut.html#h-3.2.4 kind regards Terrence Wood. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
Re: [WSG] page break up
Jay Gilmore wrote: 2. When styling your the pseudo classes, hover, active, visited. The way to ensure that the cascade works is through the "LoVe HAte" a:link, a:visited, a:hover (a:focus), a:active. I read somewhere that there was is a Star Wars reference that takes the focus into consideration. Lord Vader's Handle Formerly Anakin http://mezzoblue.com/css/cribsheet/#lovehate -- Lachlan Hunt http://lachy.id.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
RE: [WSG] page break up
> From: Terrence Wood > > Lachlan Hunt said: > > is an invalid HTML comment > how so? Perhaps not by strict definition, but the following reference explains where Lachlan is probably coming from. http://www.htmlhelp.com/reference/wilbur/misc/comment.html I like to stick with the method to avoid any potential problems. -- Peter Williams ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
Re: [WSG] page break up
Lord Vader's Former Handle, Anakin link, visited, focus, hover, active Always in that order! -- -- Christian Montoya christianmontoya.com ... rdpdesign.com ... cssliquid.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
Re: [WSG] page break up
Terrence Wood wrote: Lachlan Hunt said: is an invalid HTML comment how so? In SGML, the comment syntax is as follows: (Markup declaration close (MDC)) Only white space (or nothing) may occur between comments (except that no whitespace may occur immediately after the MDO). So, breaking up the above comment into components, we see: (start of comment 2, missing end "--") (Missing MDC) If it were XHTML, it would be well-formedness error. However, since it was occuring in CSS, it wasn't really an (X)HTML comment, it was just using the syntax and I felt it worthwhile to mention so that the same mistake isn't made within HTML. -- Lachlan Hunt http://lachy.id.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
Re: [WSG] page break up
Lori, I am going to suggest that you download Firefox or Mozilla to develop with. You will find that IE is too forgiving and allows errors to fall through the cracks by trying to render the page vs. not parsing invalid code.It is better to learn to make it right and then tweak it for IE. I have a couple of things below: Your CSS doesn't actually validate. Please check it and correct all errors. When styling your the pseudo classes, hover, active, visited. The way to ensure that the cascade works is through the "LoVe HAte" a:link, a:visited, a:hover (a:focus), a:active. I read somewhere that there was is a Star Wars reference that takes the focus into consideration. Try not to use absolute measurements other than pixels as they are rendered and or represented differently on different browsers and platforms. Using cm and inches is fine for printing stylesheets but can cause layout problems on screen. All the best, Jay Jay Gilmore Developer/Consultant Affordable Websites and Marketing Solutions for Real Small Business. SmashingRed Web & Marketing P) 902.529.0651 E) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Lori Cole wrote: Hi-I am new to CSS and strict. The URL I am having trouble with is http://members.cox.net/loricole.newhome.html. The style sheet is at http://members.cox.net.loricole/newtext.css. As you use the navigations tabs and go back to the home page, the blue background breaks up the white index card. Refreshing the screen stops it unless you tab through and cursor back again. I have IE v6. Also, I was intending for the hover of the tabs to be yellow but that does not happen. Thank you for any help. Lori
Re: [WSG] page break up
Lachlan Hunt said: > is an invalid HTML comment how so? > Please make sure you type the URIs correctly in the future and use '.' > and '/' appropriately. minor typos are easy to ignore, and really don't warrant being commented on kind regards Terrence WOod. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
Re: [WSG] page break up
Jay Gilmore Developer/Consultant Affordable Websites and Marketing Solutions for Real Small Business. SmashingRed Web & Marketing P) 902.529.0651 E) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Lori Cole wrote: Thanks Scott, The correct order of those elements is doing the trick. Yellow appears. I did change the CSS comments to be the CSS format but that has altered some other page's format like the form entry windows and text alignment in the client page. The blue line still appears on the home page. Lori -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Scott Swabey - Lafinboy Productions Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2005 9:20 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: RE: [WSG] page break up Hi Lori Your issue with the tabs can be quickly fixed by switching the order in your css of the #menu a:visited and #menu a:hover, so the hover is 'above' the visited declaration. The page break up looks like a guillotine bug. Need to dig more to find the cause for that! Regards Scott Swabey Lafinboy Productions www.lafinboy.com Lori Cole wrote: Subject: [WSG] page break up Also, I was intending for the hover of the tabs to be yellow but that does not happen. Thank you for any help. Lori ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
RE: [WSG] page break up
Thanks Scott, The correct order of those elements is doing the trick. Yellow appears. I did change the CSS comments to be the CSS format but that has altered some other page's format like the form entry windows and text alignment in the client page. The blue line still appears on the home page. Lori -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Scott Swabey - Lafinboy Productions Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2005 9:20 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: RE: [WSG] page break up Hi Lori Your issue with the tabs can be quickly fixed by switching the order in your css of the #menu a:visited and #menu a:hover, so the hover is 'above' the visited declaration. The page break up looks like a guillotine bug. Need to dig more to find the cause for that! Regards Scott Swabey Lafinboy Productions www.lafinboy.com Lori Cole wrote: Subject: [WSG] page break up Also, I was intending for the hover of the tabs to be yellow but that does not happen. Thank you for any help. Lori ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
RE: [WSG] page break up
Hi Lori Your issue with the tabs can be quickly fixed by switching the order in your css of the #menu a:visited and #menu a:hover, so the hover is 'above' the visited declaration. The page break up looks like a guillotine bug. Need to dig more to find the cause for that! Regards Scott Swabey Lafinboy Productions www.lafinboy.com Lori Cole wrote: Subject: [WSG] page break up Also, I was intending for the hover of the tabs to be yellow but that does not happen. Thank you for any help. Lori ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
Re: [WSG] page break up
Lori Cole wrote: Hi-I am new to CSS and strict. The URL I am having trouble with is http://members.cox.net/loricole.newhome.html. The style sheet is at http://members.cox.net.loricole/newtext.css. Please make sure you type the URIs correctly in the future and use '.' and '/' appropriately. http://members.cox.net/loricole/newtext.css http://members.cox.net/loricole/newhome.html The first problem I noticed in the CSS is that you have attempted to use comments like , , etc. These are HTML comments, not CSS comments. (Also note that the first is an invalid HTML comment, but that's really irrelevant in this case). You need to use CSS comments in CSS and HTML comments in HTML. CSS comments are: /* comment */ Fixing these issues may solve some of your problems. -- Lachlan Hunt http://lachy.id.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
