[xmail] Re: Reusing open connections
On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 08:43:18 +0200, =D7=A0=D7=95=D7=A8 =D7=93=D7=90=D7=95= =D7=93 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: All the big names support, including: Postfix, sendmail and Qmail. Xmail can and should included in that list of MTA's that support the =3D so-called pipelining. I thought you were talking about the esmtp extension called pipelining, but apparently you just meant specifying multiple RCPT's per DATA. Pipelining isn't very widely supported. Qmail supports it one way, not both. Sendmail doesn't support it at all. Yes, Postfix does support it. And I believe exchange supports it. --Iggy =20 Noor =20 =20 snip - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Reusing open connections
If I can just 'suggest' that a 'minimal' optimization of the final out queue stage could be ;-) ? A SINGLE mail is send to [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] then at smtp stage we obtain : a single smtp session to dom-A.com with one rcpt to (to u1) (normal here) a single smtp session to dom-B.com with TWO rcpt to (to u2 and u3) Actually xmail generate 3 smtp sessions ... one for each original rcpt to for the single original mail This will be very usefull for mail server hosting big (or smaller ?) mailing lists as in this case you have, statisticaly speaking, more chances to send the same mail to multiple rcpt on same final domains This is not a full out queue optimisation as stated in the 'must'/'may'/'should'/'could'/'or not' rfc esmtp features :-) just a 'minimal' ... for little companies ... with little links ... little servers ... few dollars ... or euros ... Any chance to see this in xmail ? Sure, an alternate solution could be to set xmail to send all mails to another local server that will make this type of optimization. But need another server, another mta to maintain, etc ... Francis - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Reusing open connections
On Tue, 14 Sep 2004, CLEMENT Francis wrote: If I can just 'suggest' that a 'minimal' optimization of the final out queue stage could be ;-) ? A SINGLE mail is send to [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] then at smtp stage we obtain : a single smtp session to dom-A.com with one rcpt to (to u1) (normal here) a single smtp session to dom-B.com with TWO rcpt to (to u2 and u3) Actually xmail generate 3 smtp sessions ... one for each original rcpt to for the single original mail This will be very usefull for mail server hosting big (or smaller ?) mailing lists as in this case you have, statisticaly speaking, more chances to send the same mail to multiple rcpt on same final domains This is not a full out queue optimisation as stated in the 'must'/'may'/'should'/'could'/'or not' rfc esmtp features :-) just a 'minimal' ... for little companies ... with little links ... little servers ... few dollars ... or euros ... Any chance to see this in xmail ? Sure. Post a patch :) - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Reusing open connections
David, I guess no one can force you to use the RFC. But it's written there, = nontheless. Anyway, if it's about being right or wrong, then pick either sides and = stick to it. I am merely saying that such a feature should be in XMAIL, = having so much other things to offer, and in heavy loaded situations, = this feature is absolutely vital and saves both bandwidth and CPU = cycles. Give it a thought... Noor -Original Message- From: Davide Libenzi [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, September 13, 2004 7:57 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Reusing open connections On Sun, 12 Sep 2004, [windows-1255] =3DF0=3DE5=3DF8 =3DE3=3DE0=3DE5=3DE3 = wrote: David, =3D20 But why fail the first time? Nonetheless, there's a clear ESMTP = protocol =3D =3D3D to address exactly this problem. You save bandwidth, save resources on = =3D =3D3D the SMTP server and G-d knows what else. =3D20 My C++ knowledge is pretty rusty or else I would have done this = myself. =3D =3D3D Haven't touched a C code for years now. How hard would it be to code = it =3D =3D3D anyway? It's part of the ESMTP standard, and XMAIL is supposedly a = ESMTP =3D =3D3D compliant server... If you point me to the exact RFC that states that MTAs *MUST* = implement=3D20 nagle-like algorithm for their queue, I might consider the = implementation. - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Reusing open connections
On Mon, 13 Sep 2004, [windows-1255] =F0=E5=F8 =E3=E0=E5=E3 wrote: David, =20 I guess no one can force you to use the RFC. But it's written there, =3D nontheless. Please, enlighten me and show me the RFC that states that MTAs MUST (in=20 the RFC mean) implement queue optimizations. I'm really willing to be=20 educated here. - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Reusing open connections
In continuation of the discussion that is going on here, I would like to point out that one of the reason of I implementing Que Scheduling is to be able to use a single SMTP channel for all the mails that are meant for the same SMTP server. I think I am not alone who would love to have this feature. -VK Davide Libenzi wrote: On Sat, 11 Sep 2004, [windows-1255] =F0=E5=F8 =E3=E0=E5=E3 wrote: Hello, =20 I read XMAIL's documentation and didn't find a way to make it reuse open = =3D connections (send multiple messages destinated to the same SMTP server = =3D using one open connection.) Is there a way to do this in the next XMAIL = =3D - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Reusing open connections
MUST? No no one said that, David. No one can force you. You can either implement it or not. What's the catch here? Why not to do = it? Noor -Original Message- From: Davide Libenzi [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, September 13, 2004 8:08 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Reusing open connections On Mon, 13 Sep 2004, [windows-1255] =3DF0=3DE5=3DF8 =3DE3=3DE0=3DE5=3DE3 = wrote: David, =3D20 I guess no one can force you to use the RFC. But it's written there, = =3D3D nontheless. Please, enlighten me and show me the RFC that states that MTAs MUST = (in=3D20 the RFC mean) implement queue optimizations. I'm really willing to = be=3D20 educated here. - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Reusing open connections
wrote / skrev: MUST? No no one said that, David. No one can force you. You can either implement it or not. What's the catch here? Why not to do = it? Noor [...] On Mon, 13 Sep 2004, [windows-1255] =3DF0=3DE5=3DF8 =3DE3=3DE0=3DE5=3DE3 = wrote: David, =3D20 I guess no one can force you to use the RFC. But it's written there, = The way you phrased it implied to me as well that you meant this was a MUST in the RFC and not an optional part. To me using the RFC would mean comply to it not implement every possible optional feature in it. - Veronica Loell - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Reusing open connections
Veronica, I see... Well, maybe my English is rusty too ;) I certainly didn't mean that David must implement it. My apologies are = in due then... Although it's a cheerful thought being able to command your provider for = additional functionalities and features :) Noor -Original Message- From: Veronica Loell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, September 13, 2004 8:39 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Reusing open connections =F0=E5=F8 =E3=E0=E5=E3 wrote / skrev: MUST? No no one said that, David. No one can force you. =20 You can either implement it or not. What's the catch here? Why not to = do =3D it? =20 Noor [...] On Mon, 13 Sep 2004, [windows-1255] =3D3DF0=3D3DE5=3D3DF8 = =3D3DE3=3D3DE0=3D3DE5=3D3DE3 =3D wrote: =20 =20 David, =3D3D20 I guess no one can force you to use the RFC. But it's written there, = =3D =20 The way you phrased it implied to me as well that you meant this was a MUST in the RFC and not an optional part. To me using the RFC would mean comply to it not implement every possible optional feature in it. - Veronica Loell - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Reusing open connections
On Mon, 13 Sep 2004, [windows-1255] =F0=E5=F8 =E3=E0=E5=E3 wrote: MUST? No no one said that, David. No one can force you. =20 You can either implement it or not. What's the catch here? Why not to do it? Ok, you said: 1) there's a clear ESMTP protocol to address exactly this problem 2) It's part of the ESMTP standard, and XMAIL is supposedly a ESMTP=20 compliant server... 3) I guess no one can force you to use the RFC. But it's written there,=20 nontheless. Can you show me an RFC where it is told that what you are requesting has=20 to be implemented? Both MUST and SHOULD are fine for me ... PS: The MUST I used is a typical RFC term to distinguish among features= =20 that *has* to be implemented to be compliant (MUST), and features that are= =20 strongly suggested (SHOULD) or simply suggested (MAY). But I guess you=20 never read one, did you? :=3D) - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Reusing open connections
David, But why fail the first time? Nonetheless, there's a clear ESMTP protocol = to address exactly this problem. You save bandwidth, save resources on = the SMTP server and G-d knows what else. My C++ knowledge is pretty rusty or else I would have done this myself. = Haven't touched a C code for years now. How hard would it be to code it = anyway? It's part of the ESMTP standard, and XMAIL is supposedly a ESMTP = compliant server... Noor -Original Message- From: Davide Libenzi [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 12, 2004 7:59 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Reusing open connections On Sat, 11 Sep 2004, [windows-1255] =3DF0=3DE5=3DF8 =3DE3=3DE0=3DE5=3DE3 = wrote: Hello, =3D20 I read XMAIL's documentation and didn't find a way to make it reuse = open =3D =3D3D connections (send multiple messages destinated to the same SMTP server = =3D =3D3D using one open connection.) Is there a way to do this in the next = XMAIL =3D =3D3D release? =3D20 Maybe incorporate it with a delayed delivery mechanism so XMAIL's = queue =3D =3D3D would be filled first, before deciding how many connections to open. = =3D3D This is an extremely valuable feature that would prove useful in = today's =3D =3D3D environment where ISP's and system administrators lock up their SMTP = =3D3D server tightly and allow very limited number of cosequtivie = connections =3D =3D3D to be made to the server -- afterwards the server drops connections = =3D3D coming from the same IP. =3D20 Any idea if one can do this in the next release? I don't think that something like this is ever gonna hit mainline = XMail.=3D20 If the remote MTA throttle connections, the failing ones will be retried = a=3D =3D20 few minutes later and succeed. - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Reusing open connections
On Sun, 12 Sep 2004 22:07:25 +0200, =D7=A0=D7=95=D7=A8 =D7=93=D7=90=D7=95= =D7=93 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: David, =20 But why fail the first time? Nonetheless, there's a clear ESMTP protocol = =3D to address exactly this problem. You save bandwidth, save resources on = =3D the SMTP server and G-d knows what else. =20 My C++ knowledge is pretty rusty or else I would have done this myself. = =3D Haven't touched a C code for years now. How hard would it be to code it = =3D anyway? It's part of the ESMTP standard, and XMAIL is supposedly a ESMTP = =3D compliant server... It's an ESMTP extension called piplining. I don't know of many of the most popular mta's that support it, so it's probably not that much of a win to implement it. --iggy =20 Noor =20 =20 snip - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Reusing open connections
All the big names support, including: Postfix, sendmail and Qmail. Xmail can and should included in that list of MTA's that support the = so-called pipelining. Noor -Original Message- From: Brian Jackson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, September 13, 2004 6:15 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Reusing open connections On Sun, 12 Sep 2004 22:07:25 +0200, =3DD7=3DA0=3DD7=3D95=3DD7=3DA8 = =3DD7=3D93=3DD7=3D90=3DD7=3D95=3D =3DD7=3D93 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: David, =3D20 But why fail the first time? Nonetheless, there's a clear ESMTP = protocol =3D =3D3D to address exactly this problem. You save bandwidth, save resources on = =3D =3D3D the SMTP server and G-d knows what else. =3D20 My C++ knowledge is pretty rusty or else I would have done this = myself. =3D =3D3D Haven't touched a C code for years now. How hard would it be to code = it =3D =3D3D anyway? It's part of the ESMTP standard, and XMAIL is supposedly a = ESMTP =3D =3D3D compliant server... It's an ESMTP extension called piplining. I don't know of many of the most popular mta's that support it, so it's probably not that much of a win to implement it. --iggy =3D20 Noor =3D20 =3D20 snip - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Reusing open connections
On Sun, 12 Sep 2004, [windows-1255] =F0=E5=F8 =E3=E0=E5=E3 wrote: David, =20 But why fail the first time? Nonetheless, there's a clear ESMTP protocol = =3D to address exactly this problem. You save bandwidth, save resources on = =3D the SMTP server and G-d knows what else. =20 My C++ knowledge is pretty rusty or else I would have done this myself. = =3D Haven't touched a C code for years now. How hard would it be to code it = =3D anyway? It's part of the ESMTP standard, and XMAIL is supposedly a ESMTP = =3D compliant server... If you point me to the exact RFC that states that MTAs *MUST* implement=20 nagle-like algorithm for their queue, I might consider the implementation. - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
