Re: [9fans] (no subject)

> My gripe here is that it is hard to track what has been ported and > what hasn't and repetition isn't helpful. grep something /n/sources/lsr ?

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

>> My gripe here is that it is hard to track what has been ported and >> what hasn't and repetition isn't helpful. > > grep something /n/sources/lsr ? I wasn't aware of an "lsr", but I don't think that's it, really. One needs more than a file name in many instances. If I had infinite free resou

[9fans] build system: [was: (no subject)]

> Of course, one would then be tempted (as I have been) to look more > seriously at porting the NetBSD package system to Plan 9. That's not > out of the question, in fact it's probably not too difficult, but the > residual pain of autoconf for each individual package has already > frightened peop

[9fans] acme to open a 'strange' directory

Hello, it happened I have some subdirectories named similarly to rotxy3_[1-5Co6-10Ni] i.e. having [ ] brackets as a part of the name. rc works so, that when it encounters such a directory, it is able to switch to it, since the rule is that if the pattern doesn't match anything, it is taken lite

Re: [9fans] build system: [was: (no subject)]

> I've also started on updating an old per-application portage ebuild based on > Anant's work back in 2007. If that is of any interest maybe I could get you > to either collaborate or just do a little testing. p9p is ment to work as a unit. i think it would be better if you didn't. - erik

[9fans] ndb and shortening names

Hello, I wanted to shorten writing some often used addresses like penelopa.karlov.mff.cuni.cz e.g. in a scp command. I want to only have to write penelopa. So I added sys = penelopa dom=penelopa.karlov.mff.cuni.cz to /lib/ndb/local But that doesn't help. What's missing? Thanks Ruda

Re: [9fans] ndb and shortening names

> sys = penelopa >dom=penelopa.karlov.mff.cuni.cz > > to /lib/ndb/local > > But that doesn't help. What's missing? an ip address. also the spaces around the '=' mean that ndb will fail to see sys/penelopa as a key/value pair. since there is no ip address, dns is used. and you have to u

Re: [9fans] acme to open a 'strange' directory

Acme's New command does not parse the file name. Try New rotxy3_[1-5Co6-10Ni] with button 2. -rob

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

We have fgb's contrib, and before that just the INDEX files in / contrib on sources. Neither is a perfect solution, but I don't think the problem here would be addressed by the Labs providing some new resource. Between the above and the wiki, there's plenty of opportunity for folks to make p

Re: [9fans] ndb and shortening names

On 7 March 2010 17:44, erik quanstrom wrote: >> sys = penelopa >>        dom=penelopa.karlov.mff.cuni.cz >> >> to /lib/ndb/local >> >> But that doesn't help. What's missing? > > an ip address.  also the spaces around the '=' > mean that ndb will fail to see sys/penelopa > as a key/value pair. > >

Re: [9fans] problem with installing plan9

On 2 March 2010 22:19, erik quanstrom wrote: >> Any suggestion now? > Now it seems that as long as I don't try to back up fossil with venti (i.e. I choose just fossil and not fossil+venti in the installation process), I can use the 9atom CD. Any attempt to use venti too resulted in a failure soon

Re: [9fans] build system: [was: (no subject)]

> Take a look at Boost's port of Perforce Software's build tool Jam > . What little I have used it > in the past it came across as a much more elegant tool-chain. Now what I > would LOVE to see is a port of Joel de Gusman's Spirit++. Well I can drea

Re: [9fans] acme to open a 'strange' directory

On 7 March 2010 17:43, Rob Pike wrote: > Acme's New command does not parse the file name.  Try New > rotxy3_[1-5Co6-10Ni] with button 2. > > -rob Ok. This works. Nonetheless, it's a question what is better. With your way you have to write 'New' somewhere (either in front of the directory, or in t

Re: [9fans] ndb and shortening names

> Btw. I saw the spaces in 'The Organization of Networks in Plan9' by > Presotto & Winterbottom, part 4.1. on page 8, see 'sys = helix'. So > there it is probably wrong... it does look to be a typo. patch submitted. - erik

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

On Sat, Mar 6, 2010 at 9:05 PM, Anthony Sorace wrote: > We have fgb's contrib, and before that just the INDEX files in /contrib on > sources. we've got fgb's wonderful program and I think we're crazy if we don't build on that. Or we're CADT. ron

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

> we've got fgb's wonderful program and I think we're crazy if we don't > build on that. > > Or we're CADT. haven't you heard? we're not allowed to do anything for ourselves anymore. the mythical (and god like) Library Writers do this for us. our job is to glue things together and port: http:

Re: [9fans] ndb and shortening names

>> Btw. I saw the spaces in 'The Organization of Networks in Plan9' by >> Presotto & Winterbottom, part 4.1. on page 8, see 'sys = helix'. So >> there it is probably wrong... > > it does look to be a typo. patch submitted. No, it's a later change. I remember Presotto commenting on the need to a

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

> We have fgb's contrib, and before that just the INDEX files in / > contrib on sources. Neither is a perfect solution, but I don't think > the problem here would be addressed by the Labs providing some new > resource. Between the above and the wiki, there's plenty of > opportunity for folks

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

> Fgb's contrib sounds very good, I have not had occasion to try it but > I presume it retains the scattered nature of the contrib directory. [...] > I'm looking at the problem from the single perspective of how it's > done in NetBSD. really? you haven't even tried it and your trying to fit it in

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

> really? you haven't even tried it and your trying > to fit it into a whatever-netbsd-does shoebox? Well, I do have some idea on how fgb's contrib is meant to work and, yes, I do look at it from a biased perspective :-) Surely you don't think that is implicitly flawed logic? After all, how fami

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

> we've got fgb's wonderful program and I think we're crazy if we don't > build on that. A deserved compliment, certainly. Now to figure how to provide the grouping I believe is required in addition to the means for replication. And, if I'm not being stupid, some facility to make sure that the f

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

> if you're installing > all unix->plan 9 ports, perhaps you would be happer > running unix in the first place. That's flawed logic: I may need dot, while you need curses. It's nice if both have been "blessed". ++L

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

On Sun, Mar 7, 2010 at 1:09 PM, wrote: >> we've got fgb's wonderful program and I think we're crazy if we don't >> build on that. > > A deserved compliment, certainly.  Now to figure how to provide the > grouping I believe is required in addition to the means for > replication.  And, if I'm not b

Re: [9fans] ndb and shortening names

I wanted to shorten writing some often used addresses like penelopa.karlov.mff.cuni.cz e.g. in a scp command. I want to only have to write penelopa. If you don't want to wire down ip addresses in ndb: penelopa = penelopa.karlov.mff.cuni.cz and use $penelopa in your commands.

Re: [9fans] acme to open a 'strange' directory

Related question is: I really need names with something like brackets. But all types have already some meaning, (), [], {}, <>. What do you use in such a case? Use unicode. There are lots of alternative bracketing symbols available.

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

On Sun, Mar 7, 2010 at 2:42 PM, wrote: >> We have fgb's contrib, and before that just the INDEX files in / >> contrib on sources. Neither is a perfect solution, but I don't think >> the problem here would be addressed by the Labs providing some new >> resource. Between the above and the wiki, the

[9fans] Contrib indexes

grep something /n/sources/lsr ? You can also grab /n/sources/contrib/lyndon/contribindex which generates a pretty-printed listing of people's contrib/*/INDEX files.

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

> Wouldn't grouping be a matter of placing a "category" file in the > package? I'm reading "grouping" as the kind of divisions you get in > Ports, i.e. net, editor, util, language, etc. Thing is, the "port" hierarchy (hereto I used "NetBSD package system" for the same concept) provides both the hi

Re: [9fans] acme to open a 'strange' directory

On Sun, Mar 7, 2010 at 9:24 AM, Rudolf Sykora wrote: > On 7 March 2010 17:43, Rob Pike wrote: >> Acme's New command does not parse the file name.  Try New >> rotxy3_[1-5Co6-10Ni] with button 2. >> >> -rob > > Ok. This works. Nonetheless, it's a question what is better. With your > way you have to

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

> That's flawed logic: I may need dot, while you need curses. It's nice > if both have been "blessed". bless a curse! jehova! -- cinap

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

> while at it, run contrib/gui. when a package is duplicated, it should > be clear from the package list on the left. Suppression of duplication is incidental. What I believe is missing from sources is a simple mechanism to see if something I'm already somewhat familiar with has been ported succe

Re: [9fans] Contrib indexes

> You can also grab /n/sources/contrib/lyndon/contribindex which generates a > pretty-printed listing of people's contrib/*/INDEX files. Just goes to show why I'm asking for some consolidation :-) ++L

Re: [9fans] Contrib indexes

> Just goes to show why I'm asking for some consolidation :-) Mines better!!! :-)

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

code-code is better than talk-talk :-) (absolutely no offense intended, I just enjoyed the phrase!) i.e. I think a proof of concept will get your further than discussion. It seems to me you could even make a copy of the sources tree, set up your idea, and put it out there for people to try. I onl

Re: [9fans] ndb and shortening names

On 7 March 2010 19:58, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote: >> I wanted to shorten writing some often used addresses like >> penelopa.karlov.mff.cuni.cz >> e.g. in a scp command. I want to only have to write penelopa. > > If you don't want to wire down ip addresses in ndb: > > penelopa = penelopa.karlov.mff.cu

[9fans] ports duplication

I really think this idea that duplication of things in contrib is bad, is bad (or just a red herring). For ports of big applications (python, say), the amount of work involved is going to self-limit the number of ports right up front. And the ones that do make it will self-select based on the qual

Re: [9fans] Contrib indexes

Lyndon said: You can also grab /n/sources/contrib/lyndon/contribindex which generates a pretty-printed listing of people's contrib/*/INDEX files. There's been several of these. Note that I run one to update the contrib index on the wiki more or less daily. That version includes both thing

[9fans] ndb and ipv6=

While we're talking about ndb ... what's the status of the ipv6= tag? Last week I was setting up IPv6 on a network and was adding ipv6=2001:... entries in ndb as per the manpages. I lost the better part of a day trying to figure out why the records weren't being propagated to the DNS slaves

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

> Thing is, the "port" hierarchy (hereto I used "NetBSD package system" > for the same concept) provides both the hierarchical structure I > believe is needed to minimise duplication and a description file to > search for concepts rather than file names. So, yes, I agree with a > portion of your s

Re: [9fans] ports duplication

Augment the contrib tools (or a fork or facsimile thereof) to including user-defined rankings and reviews. Forks and duplication sometimes make sense, sometimes they don't -- but the better versions will percolate to the top. Its a community driven thing, we need the right tools to enable that.

Re: [9fans] ndb and ipv6=

It's still undecided how to best cope with a mixed v4 and v6 world. I don't expect the ipv6 attribute to go away.

Re: [9fans] ndb and ipv6=

> It's still undecided how to best cope with a mixed v4 and v6 > world. I don't expect the ipv6 attribute to go away. I like the new (to me, anyway) ip= behaviour. parseip() and isv4() provide everything that's needed at the C level to distinguish the two. ndb/dns already does this right thing

[9fans] Plan 9 as local DHCP/DNS server

I'm trying to get a Plan 9 system set up to serve as a DHCP/DNS server on my local LAN. The clients are mostly Windows systems, with some Macs, etc, thrown in. Here are the relevant bits from /lib/ndb/local: ipnet=internal ip=10.0.0.0 ipmask 255.255.0.0 ipsubmask=255.255.255.0 dns=ns2.te

Re: [9fans] Plan 9 as local DHCP/DNS server

> Now, it hands out DHCP addresses to my Windows clients, and, I can ping > ns2.test.local by name, but, cannot ping the short name, ns2. > This is because the client doesn't receive a "Connection-specific DNS suffix" > from dhcpd. (You can see this in from "ipconfig /all"). > I thought that is

Re: [9fans] ndb and ipv6=

> Back to my original question: what currently uses the ipv6= tag? We > need to update the man pages at least. ndb/dnsquery. ndb/dnsdebug. it's inconsistent. - erik

[9fans] (no subject)

[9fans] 9fans@9fans.net

Re: [9fans] ndb and shortening names

> It finally works without any IP mentioned. Only the surrounding spaces > were the problem, otherwise my entry works as it was written in the > beginning... For the record, you may find CNAMEs workable too. Although CNAMES are restrictive, they are propagated to other OS platforms which is not t

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

> I only strongly suggest that you put the contrib gui at the heart of > what the user sees. Agreed wholeheartedly. Thing is, It's autoconf that needs careful redesign: even though contrib/replica is not as comprehensive as a revision control even when backed by venti, it is unmatched for Plan 9

Re: [9fans] ports duplication

> As for the smaller things, I would prefer to see ten different bits of > code that achieve the same end vs. just one. Diversity is good, and a > broader selection of code gives a bigger field to mine for ideas and > concepts. I really don't think that's going to be the problem here, we do not ha

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

> if you want to make an überpackage, just make your > überpackage depend on everything else. Is this what I wanted to know all along? ++L

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

On Sun, Mar 7, 2010 at 8:22 PM, wrote: > Agreed wholeheartedly.  Thing is, It's autoconf that needs careful > redesign: I don't see any need for autoconf. As one wise person put it to me, "things like configure and autoconf just mean you don't know how to write portable code". I still like to

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

>> Agreed wholeheartedly.  Thing is, It's autoconf that needs careful >> redesign: > > I don't see any need for autoconf. As one wise person put it to me, > "things like configure and autoconf just mean you don't know how to > write portable code". > Again, agreed, but reality out there suggests

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

>> I still like to point people at plan 9 ports as an example of a >> complex system that gets by without this *conf* nonsense. > > It falls over just enough to be attacked.  Otherwise, p9p source would > have been ported back to Plan 9 in its entirety.  It's a shame, > really, and with some work i

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

> There is already a tool to port plan9port code back to Plan 9. > See cp(1). Touche'. ++L