Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Christian Heinrich
Scott, On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 3:54 PM, Scott wrote: > You know, I've often wondered about these large companies - what would stop > them from presenting a page that said "Your access to our services has been > restricted because of laws in your jurisdiction. If you have any questions, > please c

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Scott
You know, I've often wondered about these large companies - what would stop them from presenting a page that said "Your access to our services has been restricted because of laws in your jurisdiction. If you have any questions, please call on to discuss the issue"? On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 at 14:48,

Re: [AusNOG] (Slightly OT) NBN FTTN - is this a record?

2018-08-15 Thread Justin Twiss
These guys must be 19 meters then :) Attainable Rate:138907 kbits/s 49867 kbits/s Slightly faster on the downstream but you've got 4Mbps on the upstream. On Thu, Aug 16, 2018 at 12:11 PM Michael J. Carmody wrote: > For Comparison ~200m of copper gets you: > > https://paste

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Paul Wilkins
Couple of points for discussion: 1 - The overseas jurisdiction is to be met by whether you conduct business within Australia. So that already covers the big corporates, social media etc. If you want to continue to conduct business in Australia, you're going to have to comply with Australian law or

Re: [AusNOG] (Slightly OT) NBN FTTN - is this a record?

2018-08-15 Thread Michael J. Carmody
For Comparison ~200m of copper gets you: https://pastebin.freepbx.org/view/01d00095 -M -Original Message- From: AusNOG [mailto:ausnog-boun...@lists.ausnog.net] On Behalf Of Rob Thomas Sent: Thursday, 16 August 2018 12:52 PM To: ausnog@lists.ausnog.net Subject: [AusNOG] (Slightly OT) NBN

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Paul Brooks
On 16/08/2018 11:09 AM, Paul Julian wrote: > > Hi Paul, > >   > > Where do you even start ? > > I would love to be able to comment on these things properly but how do you > structure > a response that isn’t just a whinge and saying that it’s not fair and blah > blah, it > would need to offer alte

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Paul Julian
Hi Robert and Paul, For the people that really want to make a difference there seems to be a good argument for joining a group or organisation that will represent them as a whole, I think this is good advice and I will be looking at the options for sure. Thanks for the information and for th

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Robert Hudson
Hi Paul, We have already published our stance on this previously in press releases and our regular newsletter, and will be sending a formal response to the govt's invitation to do so. That response is currently being formulated to ensure we cover all pertinent points, thus far (until we complete

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Paul Brooks
I'll support this - join a group that can represent your interests in a combined submissions that carries weight from the number of people/organisations/members behind it. It can be the ITPA, or Internet Australia (we have a dedicated ISP SIG for industry things, which did make an effective differ

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Paul Julian
Hi Robert, I think it’s a perfectly valid point, so just out of interest what is ITPA’s plan to respond to this current situation ? Regards Paul From: Robert Hudson Sent: Thursday, 16 August 2018 12:34 PM To: p...@buildingconnect.com.au Cc: Paul Wilkins ; ausnog@lists.ausnog.net Subject: R

[AusNOG] (Slightly OT) NBN FTTN - is this a record?

2018-08-15 Thread Rob Thomas
https://pastebin.freepbx.org/view/c383aa55 Attainable Rate:138550 kbits/s 54190 kbits/s I am probably 20 meters of cable, if that, from the node 8) --Rob ___ AusNOG mailing list AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net http://lists.ausnog.net/mailman/

[AusNOG] Rack Space B1 & P1

2018-08-15 Thread Stavros Patiniotis
Hello, I have a requirement for 1RU-4RU in both NextDC B1 and NextDC P1. Please advise hosting, remote hands, and cross connect fees. I’m looking for 36m term. Replies off list please. PS: I have ½ Rack in S1 if anyone’s interested 😉 Stavros Patiniotis Escapenet - Managing Directo

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Robert Hudson
On Thu, 16 Aug 2018 at 11:10, Paul Julian wrote: > Hi Paul, > > > > Where do you even start ? > > I would love to be able to comment on these things properly but how do you > structure a response that isn’t just a whinge and saying that it’s not fair > and blah blah, it would need to offer altern

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Paul Julian
I think a lot of us can relate to Ross and James on this one, myself included. But I am sure that's part of the plan for somebody. Paul -Original Message- From: AusNOG On Behalf Of James Gray Sent: Thursday, 16 August 2018 12:03 PM To: AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net Subject: Re: [AusNOG] Dutto

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread James Gray
> On 16 Aug 2018, at 11:37 am, Ross Wheeler wrote: > > In almost every case, regardless of how many industry players have made > well-reasoned representation against whatever "todays" issue is, there have > been few (if any) changes of any substance and eventually the futility of > making sub

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Bradley Silverman
@Paul, it does depend on circumstances, but this law doesn't. This is saying they will have full access. And the priest therapist is on topic, you are saying that refusing to hand over a password is to hold up law enforcement, then how does that same argument not hold up to priests and therapists?

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Paul Wilkins
Bradley, To be clear, lawyer, spouse confidentiality is qualified. It depends on circumstances. As to whether priests' and therapists' communications should enjoy qualified privilege, that's a whole other debate :) I "lost" the SSH key sounds like the dog ate my homework - tell it to the judge.

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread James Gray
> On 16 Aug 2018, at 11:09 am, Paul Julian wrote: > > Hi Paul, > > Where do you even start ? > I would love to be able to comment on these things properly but how do you > structure a response that isn’t just a whinge and saying that it’s not fair > and blah blah, it would need to offer alte

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Ross Wheeler
On Thu, 16 Aug 2018, Bradley Silverman wrote: It's incredibly short sighted to say, we should give the government full access to monitor anything and everything I do, which is what this is leading towards, because only bad people need privacy. One of the major objections (apart from the obv

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Paul Wilkins
Paul, The OP posted the bill: https://www.homeaffairs.gov.au/consultations/Documents/the-assistance-access-bill-2018.pdf It remains a bill until passes both houses of parliament, so this is a good starting place for discussion of the bill's purposes, and provisions, and their consequences. Rememb

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Bradley Silverman
@Paul I can tell a lawyer, priest, therapist or spouse my secrets and the judicial system can't force them to give up the information. Are you saying those laws need to be changed too? What if I had done nothing wrong, had a device that was using a SSH key to access and legitimately lost the priva

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Paul Julian
Hi Paul, Where do you even start ? I would love to be able to comment on these things properly but how do you structure a response that isn’t just a whinge and saying that it’s not fair and blah blah, it would need to offer alternatives or suggestions on how else this could be accomplished or

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Paul Wilkins
I believe the point of not surrendering a password or private key, is to frustrate due judicial process. It's no different to barricading the door if the police turn up with a search warrant - it's obstruction of justice, and the only reason people won't surrender keys is fear of the consequences o

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Christian Heinrich
https://www.crikey.com.au/2018/08/15/encryption-bill-password-jail/ is behind a paywall but it makes the point in their preview. -- Regards, Christian Heinrich http://cmlh.id.au/contact ___ AusNOG mailing list AusNOG@lists.ausnog.net http://lists.ausno

Re: [AusNOG] Dutton decryption bill

2018-08-15 Thread Paul Wilkins
*They're taking feedback/submissions/comments for 4 weeks only - is anyone planning to submit some comment?* It'd be sad if the government only saw response from a few corporates representing their vested interests. Representative democracy only works on a put up or shut up basis. Anyone with an i