I also have some old hardware around that could have problems with booting
from something other then the CD sets. But seriously...
I should have thrown in away a decade ago. Also I can by more powerful used
hardware that those (with DVD support) for a dozen of Euros.
Therefore I think that such
On 29/10/13 at 22:42 +0100, Emilio Pozuelo Monfort wrote:
On 24/10/13 18:31, Lucas Nussbaum wrote:
What's the the status of XFCE regarding accessibility?
That was a big strengh of GNOME for a long time, though I've heard
rumors (sorry not to be more specific) that gnome-shell has some
Op 30-10-13 23:09, Steve McIntyre schreef:
Having said that, I do think that providing a limited number of CD
install images is useful for those cases of retrocomputing where
installing off DVD is difficult. Other than that...
So... In that situation, would you care about having more than
On 31/10/13 09:30, Wouter Verhelst wrote:
Op 30-10-13 23:09, Steve McIntyre schreef:
So... In that situation, would you care about having more than just a
netinst available for initial booting? Beyond that, people can get on
the network to a mirror, or to other machines hosting the DVD images.
Hi,
On Fri, 25 Oct 2013 13:31:23 +0100 Steve McIntyre wrote:
We've had this discussion multiple times over the years. I've been
told multiple times that we still have a non-negligible set of users
owning/running hardware that can't do DVDs. I'm not 100% convinced
myself of how large or
Wouter wrote:
The last time I used the full stack of CDs where there was no decent
alternative option was when I was helping a customer prepare a set of
installation instructions for a code escrow situation.
Since one of the requirements there was the ability to produce a 100%
bit-for-bit equal
Zack wrote:
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 11:57:29PM +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
I would not be opposed to changing the default for xfce for now, and
reverting it if gnome's improvements make it a better choice.
OK. I suggest that we *try* that for now.
If we try, what will be the criteria for
On Wed, Oct 30, 2013 at 10:09:30PM +, Steve McIntyre wrote:
Wouter wrote:
The last time I used the full stack of CDs where there was no decent
alternative option was when I was helping a customer prepare a set of
installation instructions for a code escrow situation.
Since one of the
Olav Vitters olav at vitters.nl writes:
Most of systemd is not in pid1. This was explained by a blog references
But (by the time of the jessie freeze, at least) it will need systemd to
be pid1 to work. Same thing, really, just picking words.
bye,
//mirabilos
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to
On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 08:37:02AM +, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
Olav Vitters olav at vitters.nl writes:
Most of systemd is not in pid1. This was explained by a blog references
But (by the time of the jessie freeze, at least) it will need systemd to
be pid1 to work. Same thing, really,
On 24/10/13 18:31, Lucas Nussbaum wrote:
What's the the status of XFCE regarding accessibility?
That was a big strengh of GNOME for a long time, though I've heard
rumors (sorry not to be more specific) that gnome-shell has some
unsolved issues in that regard, which is a problem since GNOME
Olaf Titz o...@bigred.inka.de writes:
Aeh, are you sure? I think you missed my point. I'm not involved with
any init system, nor a Debian developer, yet by developing some random
app and having it depend on a specific init system, I could (according
to you) make that init system unsuitable for
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 11:57:29PM +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
I would not be opposed to changing the default for xfce for now, and
reverting it if gnome's improvements make it a better choice.
OK. I suggest that we *try* that for now.
If we try, what will be the criteria for assessing
Luca Capello luca at pca.it writes:
My X60 (from late 2006) can not either, but IMHO the reason behind it
that the SD reader it is not connected through the USB bus:
=
$ lspci | grep SD
15:00.2 SD Host controller: Ricoh Co Ltd R5C822 SD/SDIO/MMC/MS/MSPro Host
Adapter (rev 18)
Right, but
you need something with big buttons
that is finger-friendly,
I'm surprised how much accuracy a capacitive multitouch mobile has when
in touchscreen terms it is actually extremely poor (3-4mm) exacerbated
by them not responding to nails (conductive), a trade-off for size and
multitouch. Many
Op 25-10-13 14:45, Adam Sampson schreef:
Steve McIntyre st...@einval.com writes:
We *could* just drop all the CD sets and be done with it, just keeping
the netinst CD and the DVDs. Is that what people really want?
As a longtime Debian user, that would suit me fine -- I've not done a
OK. I suggest that we *try* that for now.
If we try, what will be the criteria for assessing whether the
experiment has been successful (and hence worth keeping for Jessie) or a
failure (and hence reverting it)?
I think it should be considered that there has been much improvement
upto
Aeh, are you sure? I think you missed my point. I'm not involved with
any init system, nor a Debian developer, yet by developing some random
app and having it depend on a specific init system, I could (according
to you) make that init system unsuitable for Debian?
You would surely make _your
Op 25-10-13 12:10, Thomas Goirand schreef:
On 10/25/2013 07:52 AM, Paul Wise wrote:
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 7:47 AM, Christoph Anton Mitterer wrote:
Debian is the Universal OS, isn't it?
Part of being a 'Universal OS' is being useful to as many people as
possible, including people who don't
Op 25-10-13 15:43, Olav Vitters schreef:
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 01:41:23PM +0100, Neil Williams wrote:
There is no good reason other than that's the way GNOME has been
written. So change the code and get GNOME to behave properly.
Because you raise this again:
- No maintenance on ConsoleKit
Op 25-10-13 19:32, Sune Vuorela schreef:
Why not consolidate on shared code rather than having several bits
providing the similar functionality for fairly simple tasks ?
That's a (very!) fair argument, but there's nothing in that argument
which means it absolutely totally *has* to be part of a
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 07:41:47PM +0100, Wouter Verhelst wrote:
That's a (very!) fair argument, but there's nothing in that argument
which means it absolutely totally *has* to be part of a pid1
Most of systemd is not in pid1. This was explained by a blog references
on debian-devel a while ago.
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 07:29:02PM +0100, Wouter Verhelst wrote:
Op 25-10-13 15:43, Olav Vitters schreef:
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 01:41:23PM +0100, Neil Williams wrote:
There is no good reason other than that's the way GNOME has been
written. So change the code and get GNOME to behave
On Sat, 2013-10-26 at 22:14 +0200, Marco d'Itri wrote:
On Oct 26, Svante Signell svante.sign...@gmail.com wrote:
This really pinpoints the whole problem: What happened to the Unix
philosophy, with freedom of choice?
We killed it for good in 2008:
On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 02:12:11AM +0300, Jukka Ruohonen wrote:
Indeed. And given the train wreck of contemporary Gnome, I fully welcome the
discussion on alternative default desktops. Some people are keen to rule out
the stakeholder issues, but a fact on the so-called agenda remains.
I
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 02:23:42PM -0700, Steve Langasek wrote:
Thanks, I hadn't seen that team mentioned before anywhere. It looks
like the right place for this work to happen. Unfortunately it seems
rather dormant, as the packages they do have in place date back to
Ubuntu 12.04 (i.e.,
]] Steve Langasek
In the short term, this could be a committment from the systemd
maintainers to hold the package at version 204 until the dust settles
around cgroup manager interfaces[1].
With some time limit (3 months? 6 months?) I think I'd be ok with this.
--
Tollef Fog Heen
UNIX is
On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 2:15 AM, Joey Hess wrote:
I do wish that some of the .. energy .. seen in these threads could be
used for something more interesting. For example, find a way to detect
touch screen systems, on which xfce is *not* pleasant, and don't install
a desktop task there, but a
On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 3:19 AM, Joey Hess wrote:
I also wonder why unity is not being packaged in Debian..
Based on the logs for #609278 it appears there is a lot of interest
and some people working on packaging it but it sounds like it is hard
to build and requires patches in external
On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 12:19:53AM +0100, Kevin Chadwick wrote:
I have Gnucash installed and it depends on udisks, trust me I have
absolutely no need for udisks or polkit, so don't be so sure (I am not
saying that I am sure that he is not).
gnucash → libgnome2-0 → gvfs → gvfs-daemons → libgdu0
On 26/10/13 12:02, Jonathan Dowland wrote:
On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 12:19:53AM +0100, Kevin Chadwick wrote:
I have Gnucash installed and it depends on udisks, trust me I have
absolutely no need for udisks or polkit, so don't be so sure (I am not
saying that I am sure that he is not).
gnucash
[Please don't top post on this mailing list!]
On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 06:45:02PM +0200, Zlatan Todoric wrote:
And just bashing GNOME DE for systemd and GNOME Classic
is not good enough point because probably the largest user base
of Debian user use GNOME.
That is because it is installed by
On Fri, 25 Oct 2013 14:58:34 -0700
Nikolaus Rath nikol...@rath.org wrote:
Neil Williams codeh...@debian.org writes:
If someone comes up with good reasons to consider systemd on it's
own merit, I'm willing to consider it. With the current approach of
a fait-accompli systemd is part of the
Le samedi 26 octobre 2013 à 13:03 +0200, Emilio Pozuelo Monfort a
écrit :
On 26/10/13 12:02, Jonathan Dowland wrote:
On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 12:19:53AM +0100, Kevin Chadwick wrote:
I have Gnucash installed and it depends on udisks, trust me I have
absolutely no need for udisks or polkit, so
On 26 Oct 2013, at 13:00, Neil Williams codeh...@debian.org wrote:
Desktop
components cannot dictate how the rest of the system operates.
The gnome folks are free to do what they please. They don't answer to us and
your repeated assertions that they're crossing a line just shine a light
Quoting Emilio Pozuelo Monfort (2013-10-26 13:03:13)
On 26/10/13 12:02, Jonathan Dowland wrote:
On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 12:19:53AM +0100, Kevin Chadwick wrote:
I have Gnucash installed and it depends on udisks, trust me I have
absolutely no need for udisks or polkit, so don't be so sure (I am
On 26/10/13 16:38, Jonas Smedegaard wrote:
Quoting Emilio Pozuelo Monfort (2013-10-26 13:03:13)
On 26/10/13 12:02, Jonathan Dowland wrote:
On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 12:19:53AM +0100, Kevin Chadwick wrote:
I have Gnucash installed and it depends on udisks, trust me I have
absolutely no need for
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 11:44:48PM +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
Andy Cater wrote:
I think it would be a good idea to have the netinst have an
additional option to select desktop easily including the option for
command line only, no graphical desktop as default.
We already have that option
On 26 Oct 2013, at 16:08, Andrew M.A. Cater amaca...@galactic.demon.co.uk
wrote:
That wouldbe my preference - a tasksel change for no desktop KDE GNOME
LXDE XFCE etc. for the netinst - default being no desktop - ideal for a
minimum
install.
I don't understand how that would work: I
Of course, the gnome default makes adding gnome to the plot not
currently useful. One nice side benefit of at least temporarily
switching the default desktop to xfce would be that if a lot of people
wanted gnome, rather than just picking it as the default, we'd see that
reflected in the
On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 04:41:00PM +0100, Jonathan Dowland wrote:
On 26 Oct 2013, at 16:08, Andrew M.A. Cater
amaca...@galactic.demon.co.uk wrote:
That wouldbe my preference - a tasksel change for no desktop KDE GNOME
LXDE XFCE etc. for the netinst - default being no desktop -
On Sat, 2013-10-26 at 00:00 +0100, Kevin Chadwick wrote:
Pros:
* CD#1 will work again without size worries
* Smaller, simpler desktop
* Works well/better on all supported kernels (?)
* Does not depend on replacing init
* Users can pick and choose components and drop
On Oct 26, Svante Signell svante.sign...@gmail.com wrote:
This really pinpoints the whole problem: What happened to the Unix
philosophy, with freedom of choice?
We killed it for good in 2008:
http://www.redhat.com/archives/rhl-devel-list/2008-January/msg00861.html
--
ciao,
Marco
Hi there!
On Sat, 26 Oct 2013 08:08:53 -0700, Andrew M.A. Cater wrote:
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 11:44:48PM +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
Yes, it can. It should contain enough of the packages needed to be
able to support all 4 of the recognised DEs. However, at current rates
it won't take long
On Oct 26, Luca Capello l...@pca.it wrote:
A small note: does anyone consider that there are still people on
not-so-fast Internet connections?
Yes: unless they need to install multiple computers (unusual, I think)
and do not know how to share the downloaded packages among them, then
Neil Williams codeh...@debian.org writes:
Please reconsider this. If I wrote a little GUI calculator and made it
depend on e.g. upstart, would that also make upstart unsuitable as a
default init system because of the resulting insane top-down
dependency?
Yes.
Aeh, are you sure? I think you
On 2013-10-24 22:24:05, James McCoy wrote:
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 12:57:37AM +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
James wrote:
On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 11:40 AM, Steve McIntyre st...@einval.com wrote:
This falsely implies that sticking with Gnome requires replacing the
init system. The only
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 06:48:03AM +0800, Paul Wise wrote:
I agree with the people who suggest getting rid of the concept of a
'default' desktop but I don't know how practical it is since not all
users will be capable of choosing a desktop. So we need to develop
some guidance for them. In the
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 08:39:58AM +0100, Marcin Kulisz wrote:
Why should I have installed packages I'm not using and I don't want to
use? I know it's rhetorical question but not all systems are having
enough disk space besides I don't like have packages I'm not using on
my systems. So it's
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 01:47:00AM +0200, Christoph Anton Mitterer wrote:
On Fri, 2013-10-25 at 10:40 +1100, Ben Finney wrote:
Why force
*every* user of the installer to make that choice, when many of them
find the very question to be a needless imposition which makes the
installer
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 08:39:58AM +0100, Marcin Kulisz wrote:
This falsely implies that sticking with Gnome requires replacing the
init system. The only requirement is that systemd is installed, not
that it is used as the init system.
That may be the case today, but I personally
Steve McIntyre steve at einval.com writes:
Pros:
* CD#1 will work again without size worries
* Smaller, simpler desktop
* Works well/better on all supported kernels (?)
* Does not depend on replacing init
Cons:
* please fill in here
IMHO you forgot the crucial part here - why
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 09:00 +0100, Lars Wirzenius wrote:
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 01:47:00AM +0200, Christoph Anton Mitterer wrote:
On Fri, 2013-10-25 at 10:40 +1100, Ben Finney wrote:
Why force
*every* user of the installer to make that choice, when many of them
find the very
* Lars Wirzenius l...@liw.fi [2013-10-25 10:01]:
(...)
I know how to make the choice. I don't fucking want to. Unless I'm
needing to do a customised install for particular needs, I want Debian
to provide me with defaults that just work. I don't care if the
default choices are the ones I
On 10/25/2013 07:52 AM, Paul Wise wrote:
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 7:47 AM, Christoph Anton Mitterer wrote:
Debian is the Universal OS, isn't it?
Part of being a 'Universal OS' is being useful to as many people as
possible, including people who don't know what a desktop is and
people who
On Fri, 25 Oct 2013 09:21:15 + (UTC)
Ole Laursen o...@hardworking.dk wrote:
Steve McIntyre steve at einval.com writes:
Pros:
* CD#1 will work again without size worries
* Smaller, simpler desktop
* Works well/better on all supported kernels (?)
* Does not depend on replacing
Lars Wirzenius l...@liw.fi writes:
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 01:47:00AM +0200, Christoph Anton Mitterer wrote:
On Fri, 2013-10-25 at 10:40 +1100, Ben Finney wrote:
Why force
*every* user of the installer to make that choice, when many of them
find the very question to be a needless
Le jeudi 24 octobre 2013 à 18:50 +0200, Lucas Nussbaum a écrit :
An even stronger reason to move away from Gnome if the classic mode
disappears.
That's a set of gnome-shell extensions that reproduce the look feel of
GNOME 2 and GNOME 3 classic/fallback mode, not a separate window
Le vendredi 25 octobre 2013 à 00:57 +0100, Steve McIntyre a écrit :
That may be the case today, but I personally think it's abundantly
clear from the current path of Gnome development that sooner or later
it's going to have a hard dependency on using systemd.
How is that a problem?
I mean,
On Fri, 2013-10-25 at 12:33 +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote:
The old “classic/fallback” mode has not disappeared, it has been renamed
to GNOME Flashback.
But it became less and less usable... even in 3.4 now... many minor bugs
that have accumulated and which you Debian maintainers probably cannot
Le jeudi 24 octobre 2013 à 16:40 +0100, Steve McIntyre a écrit :
This goes back to during the wheezy release cycle. There was a little
discussion around a change in tasksel [1], but rather too late in the
day for the change to make sense. Now we have rather more time, I
feel. Let's change the
Hi,
Ansgar Burchardt ans...@debian.org writes:
How about renaming CD1 to GNOME CD1 and make the minimal installers
prompt which desktop to install? That is no longer having a default
desktop.
The downside would be that one download link would no longer be
enough.
By now I no longer think
On Fri, 2013-10-25 at 12:34 +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote:
I mean, apart from the pain of seeing a bunch of people who do not
understand what systemd is rant about it?
Taking out the people just rant and/or don't understand it club simply
doesn't help...
Debian should continue to offer free
On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 6:52 PM, Andrei POPESCU andreimpope...@gmail.comwrote:
Would LXDE still fit on the same CD? I'm guessing yes, but I'd rather
have it explicit.
Why are we still talking about CDs? Didn't everybody move to DVDs a century
ago? People who want to install Debian on old
Le vendredi 25 octobre 2013 à 12:43 +0200, Christoph Anton Mitterer a
écrit :
Debian should continue to offer free choice of the init system
Why? “Multiple init systems” is not a feature that any of our users
should care of. It is not a functional goal.
And in reality it seems to be far less
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 12:43:04PM +0200, Pau Garcia i Quiles wrote:
Would LXDE still fit on the same CD? I'm guessing yes, but I'd rather
have it explicit.
Why are we still talking about CDs? Didn't everybody move to DVDs a century
ago?
And then they moved away from DVDs too.
I guess we
Steve McIntyre steve at einval.com writes:
* Does not depend on replacing init
Wasn’t there some mention of xfce needing gnome-settings-daemon as well,
which would kinda defeat the point?
I’d be for IceWM as default setup, as opposed to a full Desktop Environment,
and then people can either
Josselin Mouette joss at debian.org writes:
Debian should continue to offer free choice of the init system
Why? “Multiple init systems” is not a feature that any of our users
should care of. It is not a functional goal.
Of course!
• Developers are users, too.
• The upstart crowd has got
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 01:41 +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
Wolodja wrote:
On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 16:40 +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
This goes back to during the wheezy release cycle. There was a little
discussion around a change in tasksel [1], but rather too late in the
day for the
On Fri, 2013-10-25 at 12:48 +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote:
Why? “Multiple init systems” is not a feature that any of our users
should care of. It is not a functional goal.
Well I guess users *do* care... just look at the posts from the last few
days.
We had users who said stick with sysvinit,
Hi,
* Does not depend on replacing init
Wasn’t there some mention of xfce needing gnome-settings-daemon as well,
which would kinda defeat the point?
Not as far as I can tell:
nik@keks:~ $ apt-rdepends xfce4 | grep gnome
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 12:50 PM, Andrey Rahmatullin w...@wrar.name wrote:
Why are we still talking about CDs? Didn't everybody move to DVDs a
century
ago?
And then they moved away from DVDs too.
I guess we are talking about install images to download (where you usually
don't want to
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 01:29:34PM +0200, Pau Garcia i Quiles wrote:
Why are we still talking about CDs? Didn't everybody move to DVDs a
century
ago?
And then they moved away from DVDs too.
I guess we are talking about install images to download (where you usually
don't want to
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 01:13:48PM +0200, Dominik George wrote:
Wasn’t there some mention of xfce needing gnome-settings-daemon as well,
which would kinda defeat the point?
Not as far as I can tell:
nik@keks:~ $ apt-rdepends xfce4 | grep gnome
On 2013-10-25, Josselin Mouette j...@debian.org wrote:
What are the reasons exactly for deliberately depriving the default
installation’s users of a more complete and featureful desktop?
I've said that for years, but we still haven't changed to KDE Plasma
Desktop as the default.
/troll
/Sune
On 25/10/13 at 12:33 +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote:
Le jeudi 24 octobre 2013 à 18:50 +0200, Lucas Nussbaum a écrit :
An even stronger reason to move away from Gnome if the classic mode
disappears.
I just wanted to point out that this quote is not mine, but Svante's.
Quoting Adam Borowski (2013-10-25 13:42:48)
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 01:13:48PM +0200, Dominik George wrote:
Wasn’t there some mention of xfce needing gnome-settings-daemon as well,
which would kinda defeat the point?
Not as far as I can tell:
nik@keks:~ $ apt-rdepends xfce4 | grep gnome
xfswitch-plugin - gdm3 - gnome-settings-daemon
xfswitch-plugin is suggested by xfce4-goodies, so irrelevant for this
discussion.
However, I must admit that even if the standard XFCE installation does
not depend on systemd, it would be even worse if a user came along and
wanted to extend
Jonas Smedegaard dr at jones.dk writes:
xfswitch-plugin is suggested by xfce4-goodies, so irrelevant for this
discussion.
Fair enough, but
http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.debian.devel.general/187596
suggests that, given a ConsoleKit removal, xfce still depends
on systemd just like GNOME.
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 02:02:48PM +0200, Dominik George wrote:
However, I must admit that even if the standard XFCE installation does
not depend on systemd, it would be even worse if a user came along and
wanted to extend their user experience by installing some XFCE addon and
*that* would
On 2013-10-25, Dominik George n...@naturalnet.de wrote:
However, I must admit that even if the standard XFCE installation does
not depend on systemd, it would be even worse if a user came along and
wanted to extend their user experience by installing some XFCE addon and
*that* would magically
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 12:40:35PM +0200, Christoph Anton Mitterer wrote:
So to me the classc/fallback frontier seems to be a rather dark field...
it's nice that you guys try to keep it working in Debian, but quite
apparently GNOME upstream wants to ultimately get rid of it, and that
*will*
Jonathan Dowland jmtd at debian.org writes:
Installing systemd does not magically switch your init system.
Not *yet*. But it will, shortly.
http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.debian.devel.general/187556
bye,
//mirabilos, explicitly omitting his own guesses on the timeframe
--
To
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 01:06:02PM +0100, Jonathan Dowland wrote:
On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 02:02:48PM +0200, Dominik George wrote:
However, I must admit that even if the standard XFCE installation does
not depend on systemd, it would be even worse if a user came along and
wanted to extend
Thorsten Glaser tg at mirbsd.de writes:
• Your primary use case appears to be “the desktop”, whereas Debian, as
opposed to some of its downstreams and Pure Blends, is a Universal OS,
which means it’s got much more servers in use, which don’t benefit from
systemd either at all or at least
Pau Garcia i Quiles wrote:
On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 6:52 PM, Andrei POPESCU
andreimpope...@gmail.comwrote:
Would LXDE still fit on the same CD? I'm guessing yes, but I'd rather
have it explicit.
Why are we still talking about CDs? Didn't everybody move to DVDs a century
ago? People who want to
On Fri, 25 Oct 2013 12:41:26 +0200
Josselin Mouette j...@debian.org wrote:
Le jeudi 24 octobre 2013 à 16:40 +0100, Steve McIntyre a écrit :
This goes back to during the wheezy release cycle. There was a
little discussion around a change in tasksel [1], but rather too
late in the day for
On Oct 25, Steve McIntyre st...@einval.com wrote:
We've had this discussion multiple times over the years. I've been
told multiple times that we still have a non-negligible set of users
owning/running hardware that can't do DVDs. I'm not 100% convinced
I can pull random statistics out of my
On Fri, 2013-10-25 at 13:31 +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
We've had this discussion multiple times over the years. I've been
told multiple times that we still have a non-negligible set of users
owning/running hardware that can't do DVDs. I'm not 100% convinced
myself of how large or critical
On 2013-10-25, Steve McIntyre st...@einval.com wrote:
We've had this discussion multiple times over the years. I've been
told multiple times that we still have a non-negligible set of users
owning/running hardware that can't do DVDs. I'm not 100% convinced
myself of how large or critical this
On Fri, 25 Oct 2013 12:34:34 +0200
Josselin Mouette j...@debian.org wrote:
Le vendredi 25 octobre 2013 à 00:57 +0100, Steve McIntyre a écrit :
That may be the case today, but I personally think it's abundantly
clear from the current path of Gnome development that sooner or
later it's
On Oct 25, Neil Williams codeh...@debian.org wrote:
If someone comes up with good reasons to consider systemd on it's own
merit, I'm willing to consider it. With the current approach of a
The arguments for a modern init system have been discussed over and
over.
I do not mind replacing gnome
On Oct 25, Thorsten Glaser t...@mirbsd.de wrote:
• Your primary use case appears to be “the desktop”, whereas Debian, as
opposed to some of its downstreams and Pure Blends, is a Universal OS,
which means it’s got much more servers in use, which don’t benefit from
systemd either at all
On Oct 25, Christoph Anton Mitterer cales...@scientia.net wrote:
Why? “Multiple init systems” is not a feature that any of our users
should care of. It is not a functional goal.
Well I guess users *do* care... just look at the posts from the last few
days.
Just because some people have
]] Thorsten Glaser
Jonathan Dowland jmtd at debian.org writes:
Installing systemd does not magically switch your init system.
Not *yet*. But it will, shortly.
No, it won't.
http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.debian.devel.general/187556
I'm not saying that in that article. Please
On Fri, 2013-10-25 at 13:31 +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
We've had this discussion multiple times over the years. I've been
told multiple times that we still have a non-negligible set of users
owning/running hardware that can't do DVDs.
The set of hardware which can't boot from DVDs *or* boot
Hi Steve, thanks for starting this discussion.
I was quite intrigued by the responses which challenged whether we need
a default at all, but if we accept that a default is required (as you
outline and as others have said), I have two separate thoughts to
ponder about proceeding:
• we define
That looked unintentionally *great* in my mutt, half of it got
interpreted and coloured as quotes, giving a chrome feel.
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org
with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive:
Steve McIntyre st...@einval.com writes:
We *could* just drop all the CD sets and be done with it, just keeping
the netinst CD and the DVDs. Is that what people really want?
As a longtime Debian user, that would suit me fine -- I've not done a
Debian installation using anything other than
Ole Laursen olau at hardworking.dk writes:
For instance: I have in the past had downtime on servers I maintain
because
Debian out of the box doesn't babysit processes. Apache or MySQL hit by a
random once-in-a-year irreproducible crash? Boom.
Hm, fun. I don’t usually run into those, but then
1 - 100 of 187 matches
Mail list logo
