Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-17 Thread Lisi Reisz
On Saturday 17 October 2015 00:39:18 tom arnall wrote: > what prevents Debian from providing an alternate boot option in Jessie > which does not use systemd? My Wheezy system seems to do this. Nothing. It provides one. Lisi

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-17 Thread Lisi Reisz
On Saturday 17 October 2015 01:33:42 David Wright wrote: > Quoting tom arnall (kloro2...@gmail.com): > > what prevents Debian from providing an alternate boot option in Jessie > > which does not use systemd? My Wheezy system seems to do this. > > (Yes, this is the correct thread for this

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-16 Thread tom arnall
what prevents Debian from providing an alternate boot option in Jessie which does not use systemd? My Wheezy system seems to do this.

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-16 Thread David Wright
Quoting tom arnall (kloro2...@gmail.com): > what prevents Debian from providing an alternate boot option in Jessie > which does not use systemd? My Wheezy system seems to do this. (Yes, this is the correct thread for this question.) Wheezy had systemd included as a "technology preview". I don't

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-15 Thread Dan Ritter
On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 10:47:48PM +0200, Arno Schuring wrote: > > > Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 22:26:53 +0200 > > From: geo...@nsup.org > > > > Le tridi 23 vendémiaire, an CCXXIV, Arno Schuring a écrit : > >> It's been years since I've seen a system where the OS boot took longer > >> than the BIOS

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-15 Thread Mart van de Wege
Alex Moonshine writes: > On Wed, 14 Oct 2015 07:49:08 -0500 > Richard Owlett wrote: > >> What has the end-user, with a single machine, gained today from >> the adoption of systemd? > > Speaking for myself: > 1. It took me an hour of googling to

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-15 Thread Joel Rees
You say potato, I say, potato, ... On Thu, Oct 15, 2015 at 2:56 PM, Mart van de Wege wrote: > Alex Moonshine writes: > >> On Wed, 14 Oct 2015 07:49:08 -0500 >> Richard Owlett wrote: >> >>> What has the end-user, with a single

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Lisi Reisz
On Wednesday 14 October 2015 13:49:08 Richard Owlett wrote: > Ansgar Burchardt wrote: > > Hi, > > > > tom arnall writes: > >>[SNIP] > >> > >> what did they do to poll the views of the user community on the > >> question? > > > > If you want to know how Debian's technical

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Lisi Reisz
On Wednesday 14 October 2015 10:33:48 to...@tuxteam.de wrote: > That depends on your expectations wrt desktop. If you target a fat DE, > it'll be difficult (for Gnome perhaps nigh impossible dunno). I understood that Gnome3 depends on systemd. Lisi

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Richard Owlett
Lisi Reisz wrote: On Wednesday 14 October 2015 13:49:08 Richard Owlett wrote: Ansgar Burchardt wrote: Hi, tom arnall writes: [SNIP] what did they do to poll the views of the user community on the question? If you want to know how Debian's technical committee came to

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Ric Moore
On 10/14/2015 03:55 AM, tom arnall wrote: i read the piece on installing without systemd. i get the feeling that the bottom line of it is: good luck. or am i missing something? Yes, you failed to google on month's worth of hundreds of old posts concerning this or you just happen to enjoy

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Joel Rees
2015/10/15 0:15 "Ric Moore" : > > On 10/14/2015 03:55 AM, tom arnall wrote: >> >> i read the piece on installing without systemd. i get the feeling >> that the bottom line of it is: good luck. or am i missing something? > > > Yes, you failed to google on month's worth of

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Alex Moonshine
On Wed, 14 Oct 2015 07:49:08 -0500 Richard Owlett wrote: > What has the end-user, with a single machine, gained today from > the adoption of systemd? Speaking for myself: 1. It took me an hour of googling to write my own working init script. It takes me 10 minutes to write

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread tomas
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 07:49:08AM -0500, Richard Owlett wrote: > Ansgar Burchardt wrote: [...] > > [2] > > > > That page explicitly answers "How?" [with a emphasis perhaps on the > mechanics on how the formal

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Lisi Reisz
On Wednesday 14 October 2015 17:06:09 Reco wrote: > Hi. > > On Wed, 14 Oct 2015 15:18:23 +0100 > > Lisi Reisz wrote: > > On Wednesday 14 October 2015 10:33:48 to...@tuxteam.de wrote: > > > That depends on your expectations wrt desktop. If you target a fat DE, > > >

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Reco
Hi. On Wed, 14 Oct 2015 15:18:23 +0100 Lisi Reisz wrote: > On Wednesday 14 October 2015 10:33:48 to...@tuxteam.de wrote: > > That depends on your expectations wrt desktop. If you target a fat DE, > > it'll be difficult (for Gnome perhaps nigh impossible dunno). >

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Reco
Hi. On Wed, 14 Oct 2015 17:36:40 +0100 Lisi Reisz wrote: > On Wednesday 14 October 2015 17:06:09 Reco wrote: > > Hi. > > > > On Wed, 14 Oct 2015 15:18:23 +0100 > > > > Lisi Reisz wrote: > > > On Wednesday 14 October 2015 10:33:48

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Joel Rees
2015/10/14 13:24 "Ric Moore" : > > On 10/13/2015 11:20 PM, tom arnall wrote: >> >> I am running Wheezy and notice that the boot options include but >> aren't limited to systemd. Is it possible to have this arrangement >> with Jessie? > > > No. :) Ric I tend to be wandering

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread tom arnall
i read the piece on installing without systemd. i get the feeling that the bottom line of it is: good luck. or am i missing something? who decided that Debian shd be locked to systemd? what did they do to poll the views of the user community on the question? is it true that Red Hat had a

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Ansgar Burchardt
Hi, tom arnall writes: > i read the piece on installing without systemd. i get the feeling > that the bottom line of it is: good luck. or am i missing something? > On 10/13/15, Joel Rees wrote: >> I tend to be wandering around way out in left field a

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Darac Marjal
On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 12:55:36AM -0700, tom arnall wrote: > i read the piece on installing without systemd. i get the feeling > that the bottom line of it is: good luck. or am i missing something? > > who decided that Debian shd be locked to systemd? The Debian Technical Committee

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Liam O'Toole
On 2015-10-14, tom arnall wrote: > i read the piece on installing without systemd. i get the feeling > that the bottom line of it is: good luck. or am i missing something? > > who decided that Debian shd be locked to systemd? > > what did they do to poll the views of the

RE: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Arno Schuring
> Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 17:05:16 +0300 > From: moonsh...@openmailbox.org > > On Wed, 14 Oct 2015 07:49:08 -0500 > Richard Owlett wrote: > >> What has the end-user, with a single machine, gained today from >> the adoption of systemd? > > Speaking for myself: > 1. It took me

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Nicolas George
Le tridi 23 vendémiaire, an CCXXIV, Arno Schuring a écrit : > It's been years since I've seen a system where the OS boot took longer > than the BIOS boot. Linux or Windows alike. You may have noticed that the operator between the time for the POST and the time for the OS boot is +, not max().

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Alex Moonshine
On Wed, 14 Oct 2015 21:51:17 +0200 Arno Schuring wrote: > The last time I wrote an init script: > > - copy /etc/init.d/skeleton > - edit the DAEMON= and DESC= lines I'll be completely honest, I just never understood sysvinit. I'm alright with bsd-style Slackware

RE: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Arno Schuring
> Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 22:26:53 +0200 > From: geo...@nsup.org > > Le tridi 23 vendémiaire, an CCXXIV, Arno Schuring a écrit : >> It's been years since I've seen a system where the OS boot took longer >> than the BIOS boot. Linux or Windows alike. > > You may have noticed that the operator

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Nicolas George
Le tridi 23 vendémiaire, an CCXXIV, Arno Schuring a écrit : > Of course. But when your BIOS boot time is 15 seconds, it hardly makes > any difference if your OS boots in 3 seconds or in 2.1 seconds, does it? Five percent: small but not negligible. For low-end laptops, the difference is more

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread tomas
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 12:55:36AM -0700, tom arnall wrote: > i read the piece on installing without systemd. i get the feeling > that the bottom line of it is: good luck. or am i missing something? That depends on your expectations wrt desktop. If

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Alex Moonshine
On Wed, 14 Oct 2015 00:55:36 -0700 tom arnall wrote: > i read the piece on installing without systemd. i get the feeling > that the bottom line of it is: good luck. or am i missing something?

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-14 Thread Richard Owlett
Ansgar Burchardt wrote: Hi, tom arnall writes: [SNIP] what did they do to poll the views of the user community on the question? If you want to know how Debian's technical committee came to choose systemd as the default init, see [2]. [2]

systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-13 Thread tom arnall
I am running Wheezy and notice that the boot options include but aren't limited to systemd. Is it possible to have this arrangement with Jessie?

Re: systemd alternative for Jessie?

2015-10-13 Thread Ric Moore
On 10/13/2015 11:20 PM, tom arnall wrote: I am running Wheezy and notice that the boot options include but aren't limited to systemd. Is it possible to have this arrangement with Jessie? No. :) Ric