Re: [Library Release] dproto

2013-10-09 Thread Jesse Phillips
On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 08:11:34 UTC, Kagamin wrote: On Saturday, 5 October 2013 at 20:56:21 UTC, Matt Soucy wrote: message Point { optional int32 x = 1 [default=166]; required int32 y = 2; optional string label = 3; message Coord { required

Re: Pragmatic D Tutorial

2013-10-09 Thread Kagamin
http://beza1e1.tuxen.de/d-tut-0.1/documentation.html Are doxygen comments still endorsed? http://beza1e1.tuxen.de/d-tut-0.1/idiomatic.html Describing a range as a pair of iterators requires a reader with C++ background; the beginning of the tutorial implied wider audience. For other people it

Re: Pragmatic D Tutorial

2013-10-09 Thread Rory McGuire
I used the QT bindings to make a transparent desktop widget once. So they have worked but I'm not sure if they do with the current compiler. I'll see if I can find my old code and see what I have to do to get it to work. On Wed, Oct 9, 2013 at 9:04 AM, Kagamin s...@here.lot wrote:

Re: Pragmatic D Tutorial

2013-10-09 Thread qznc
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 07:04:07 UTC, Kagamin wrote: http://beza1e1.tuxen.de/d-tut-0.1/documentation.html Are doxygen comments still endorsed? I am not aware about any counter arguments. Are there some downsides? I noticed that Returns: is rarely used in Phobos.

Re: Pragmatic D Tutorial

2013-10-09 Thread Jacob Carlborg
On 2013-10-09 10:37, qznc wrote: I am not aware about any counter arguments. Are there some downsides? I noticed that Returns: is rarely used in Phobos. D has built-in support for documentation comments, called ddoc: http://dlang.org/ddoc -- /Jacob Carlborg

Re: Pragmatic D Tutorial

2013-10-09 Thread Kagamin
On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 13:59:22 UTC, Meta wrote: I haven't really thought about this before, but it's becoming increasingly difficult for me to come up with a contemporary simple language. It seems most modern languages are creeping towards more complexity. I heard, Lua interpreter

Re: Pragmatic D Tutorial

2013-10-09 Thread Iain Buclaw
On Oct 9, 2013 12:31 PM, Kagamin s...@here.lot wrote: On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 13:59:22 UTC, Meta wrote: I haven't really thought about this before, but it's becoming increasingly difficult for me to come up with a contemporary simple language. It seems most modern languages are creeping

Re: [Library Release] dproto

2013-10-09 Thread Jesse Phillips
On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 20:50:22 UTC, Matt Soucy wrote: Thanks for the tip - I actually did find this one when I started using this, however I found it on another page that hadn't been updated (that I ironically can't find now), so I wrongfully assumed that it was abandoned. I did find

Re: [Library Release] dproto

2013-10-09 Thread Matt Soucy
On 10/09/2013 01:55 AM, Jesse Phillips wrote: Groups are a way to combine this, but they are deprecated so who'd want to support that. Exactly, I didn't even bother planning out support for them. -- Matt Soucy http://msoucy.me/ signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature

Re: [Library Release] dproto

2013-10-09 Thread Matt Soucy
On 10/09/2013 10:38 AM, Jesse Phillips wrote: On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 20:50:22 UTC, Matt Soucy wrote: Thanks for the tip - I actually did find this one when I started using this, however I found it on another page that hadn't been updated (that I ironically can't find now), so I

Re: Pragmatic D Tutorial

2013-10-09 Thread Dejan Lekic
On Mon, 07 Oct 2013 21:18:38 +0200, qznc wrote: I believe one of the things D needs right now is more documentation. Therefore, I started writing a tutorial. It is aimed at people who can already program well in other languages. This means nothing about loops or structs, because I expect

Re: Pragmatic D Tutorial

2013-10-09 Thread qznc
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 20:22:39 UTC, Dejan Lekic wrote: It is a very nice web-site, but the main column should be wider. Sometimes the source code floats over to the second column... Hm, not here. I suspect a weird font selection for the code. I plan to redesign it at some point

Re: GSoC 2014 is on

2013-10-09 Thread Adam Wilson
On Tue, 08 Oct 2013 20:58:01 -0700, Andrei Alexandrescu seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org wrote: http://google-opensource.blogspot.de/2013/10/google-code-in-2013-and-google-summer.html Andrei Do you think they'll let us in this year? -- Adam Wilson IRC: LightBender Project Coordinator The

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread dennis luehring
Am 09.10.2013 07:23, schrieb PauloPinto: Apple dropped the GC and went ARC instead, because they never managed to make it work properly. It was full of corner cases, and the application could crash if those cases were not fully taken care of. Or course the PR message is We dropped GC because

Re: std.d.lexer : voting thread

2013-10-09 Thread ilya-stromberg
On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 00:16:45 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: To put my money where my mouth is, I have a proof-of-concept tokenizer for C++ in working state. http://dpaste.dzfl.pl/d07dd46d Why do you use \0 as end-of-stream token: /** * All token types include regular and

Re: Improvements to std.typecons.Nullable

2013-10-09 Thread monarch_dodra
On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 19:04:33 UTC, BLM768 wrote: I've been working on a project that makes relatively heavy use of nullable values. I've been using std.typecons.Nullable, and it mostly works well, but there are some improvements that could be made to the implementation: * A

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Mehrdad
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 03:39:38 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: On 10/8/13 4:45 PM, Jonathan M Davis wrote: On Wednesday, October 09, 2013 01:04:39 Tourist wrote: I thought about an alternative approach: Instead of using a (yet another) annotation, how about introducing a flag similar

Re: [RFC] - mysql-native rewrite

2013-10-09 Thread simendsjo
On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 17:47:02 UTC, ollie wrote: On Sat, 28 Sep 2013 18:38:47 +0200, simendsjo wrote: I've been working on a more or less complete rewrite of the mysql-native module. I think this is a great first step. Code is more readable, easier to follow (compared to the

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Elvis Zhou
On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 23:05:37 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: On 10/8/2013 12:34 PM, Jonathan M Davis wrote: I think that it's clear that for some projects, it's critical to minimize the GC, and I think that it's clear that we need to do a better job of supporting the folks who want to

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Manu
On 9 October 2013 15:23, PauloPinto pj...@progtools.org wrote: On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 05:15:53 UTC, Manu wrote: On 9 October 2013 08:58, ponce cont...@gmsfrommars.fr wrote: On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 22:45:51 UTC, Adam D. Ruppe wrote: Eh, not necessarily. If it expands to

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Manu
On 9 October 2013 16:05, dennis luehring dl.so...@gmx.net wrote: Am 09.10.2013 07:23, schrieb PauloPinto: Apple dropped the GC and went ARC instead, because they never managed to make it work properly. It was full of corner cases, and the application could crash if those cases were not

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread PauloPinto
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 06:05:52 UTC, dennis luehring wrote: Am 09.10.2013 07:23, schrieb PauloPinto: Apple dropped the GC and went ARC instead, because they never managed to make it work properly. It was full of corner cases, and the application could crash if those cases were not

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Walter Bright
On 10/9/2013 12:29 AM, Manu wrote: Does anyone here REALLY believe that a bunch of volunteer contributors can possibly do what apple failed to do with their squillions of dollars and engineers? I haven't heard anybody around here propose the path to an acceptable solution. It's perpetually in

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Froglegs
GC works for some cases, but the global one size fits all GC that D uses is no good.

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Benjamin Thaut
Am 09.10.2013 01:29, schrieb Adam D. Ruppe: It is nice to have stdlib functions available that can be used anywhere. For std.algorithm, Andrei has said if you ever implement an algorithm by hand, it means the library has failed. But there's two places where that falls short (IMO at least):

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread PauloPinto
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 07:29:30 UTC, Manu wrote: On 9 October 2013 15:23, PauloPinto pj...@progtools.org wrote: On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 05:15:53 UTC, Manu wrote: On 9 October 2013 08:58, ponce cont...@gmsfrommars.fr wrote: On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 22:45:51 UTC, Adam

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Don
On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 17:47:54 UTC, Brad Anderson wrote: On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 16:29:38 UTC, ponce wrote: On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 16:22:25 UTC, Dicebot wrote: It is not overblown. It is simply @nogc which is lacking but absolutely mandatory. Amount of hidden language

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread ponce
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 07:33:38 UTC, Manu wrote: Is there more to it? Cleaning up circular references I guess... what does Apple do? It's an uncommon edge case, so there's gotta be heaps of room for efficient solutions to that (afaik) one edge case. Are there others? There is a

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread PauloPinto
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 07:33:38 UTC, Manu wrote: On 9 October 2013 16:05, dennis luehring dl.so...@gmx.net wrote: Am 09.10.2013 07:23, schrieb PauloPinto: Apple dropped the GC and went ARC instead, because they never managed to make it work properly. It was full of corner cases,

Re: std.d.lexer : voting thread

2013-10-09 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 10/8/13 11:11 PM, ilya-stromberg wrote: On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 00:16:45 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: To put my money where my mouth is, I have a proof-of-concept tokenizer for C++ in working state. http://dpaste.dzfl.pl/d07dd46d Why do you use \0 as end-of-stream token: /**

Re: GSoC 2014 is on

2013-10-09 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 10/8/13 11:04 PM, Adam Wilson wrote: On Tue, 08 Oct 2013 20:58:01 -0700, Andrei Alexandrescu seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org wrote: http://google-opensource.blogspot.de/2013/10/google-code-in-2013-and-google-summer.html Andrei Do you think they'll let us in this year? Depends on the

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Benjamin Thaut
Am 09.10.2013 07:15, schrieb Manu: I've had a lot of conversations with a lot of experts, plenty of conversations at dconf, and nobody could even offer me a vision for a GC that is acceptable. As far as I can tell, nobody I talked to really thinks a GC that doesn't stop the world, which can be

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 10/9/13 12:01 AM, Mehrdad wrote: On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 03:39:38 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: On 10/8/13 4:45 PM, Jonathan M Davis wrote: On Wednesday, October 09, 2013 01:04:39 Tourist wrote: I thought about an alternative approach: Instead of using a (yet another) annotation,

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread dennis luehring
Am 09.10.2013 09:51, schrieb Andrei Alexandrescu: On 10/9/13 12:01 AM, Mehrdad wrote: On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 03:39:38 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: On 10/8/13 4:45 PM, Jonathan M Davis wrote: On Wednesday, October 09, 2013 01:04:39 Tourist wrote: I thought about an alternative

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 10/9/13 12:58 AM, dennis luehring wrote: Am 09.10.2013 09:51, schrieb Andrei Alexandrescu: On 10/9/13 12:01 AM, Mehrdad wrote: On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 03:39:38 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: On 10/8/13 4:45 PM, Jonathan M Davis wrote: On Wednesday, October 09, 2013 01:04:39

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread dennis luehring
Am 09.10.2013 10:05, schrieb Andrei Alexandrescu: On 10/9/13 12:58 AM, dennis luehring wrote: Am 09.10.2013 09:51, schrieb Andrei Alexandrescu: On 10/9/13 12:01 AM, Mehrdad wrote: On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 03:39:38 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: On 10/8/13 4:45 PM, Jonathan M Davis

Re: std.d.lexer : voting thread

2013-10-09 Thread ilya-stromberg
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 07:49:55 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: On 10/8/13 11:11 PM, ilya-stromberg wrote: On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 00:16:45 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: To put my money where my mouth is, I have a proof-of-concept tokenizer for C++ in working state.

Re: Rectangular multidimensional arrays for D

2013-10-09 Thread Denis Shelomovskij
09.10.2013 7:55, Nick B пишет: On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 17:26:46 UTC, Stefan Frijters wrote: andrei wrote: I too are interesteed in this area as well. Dennis do you only plan to focus on multidimensional arrays only, or will you incorporate the above matrices as well ?? What features are

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread JR
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 02:22:35 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: * Get Robert Schadek's precise GC in. Walter and I have become 101% convinced a precise GC is the one way to go about GC. An orthogonal question, but is Lucarella's CDGC (still) being ported? There's nothing mutually

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Walter Bright
On 10/9/2013 1:59 AM, JR wrote: On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 02:22:35 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: * Get Robert Schadek's precise GC in. Walter and I have become 101% convinced a precise GC is the one way to go about GC. An orthogonal question, but is Lucarella's CDGC (still) being

Re: [OT] Liability of Moderator

2013-10-09 Thread Chris
On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 22:27:27 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: On 10/8/2013 1:38 PM, Chris wrote: Was just wondering if anyone on this forum has any experience with these things. After a little bit of research I've come to the conclusion that it's a minefield. The old Windows slogan

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Robert Schadek
On 10/09/2013 04:22 AM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: * Get Robert Schadek's precise GC in. Walter and I have become 101% convinced a precise GC is the one way to go about GC. I would like to claim that work, but the Rainer Schütze wrote that. I know, both german, same initials.

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread ponce
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 09:29:53 UTC, Robert Schadek wrote: On 10/09/2013 04:22 AM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: * Get Robert Schadek's precise GC in. Walter and I have become 101% convinced a precise GC is the one way to go about GC. I would like to claim that work, but the Rainer

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread dennis luehring
Am 09.10.2013 10:17, schrieb dennis luehring: Am 09.10.2013 10:05, schrieb Andrei Alexandrescu: On 10/9/13 12:58 AM, dennis luehring wrote: Am 09.10.2013 09:51, schrieb Andrei Alexandrescu: On 10/9/13 12:01 AM, Mehrdad wrote: On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 03:39:38 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Jacob Carlborg
On 2013-10-09 05:31, Walter Bright wrote: Making this work is fraught with difficulty. It is normal behavior in D to create local data with new(), build a data structure, and then cast it to shared so it can be transferred to another thread. This will fail miserably if the data is allocated on

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Jacob Carlborg
On 2013-10-09 07:15, Manu wrote: What I want is an option to replace the GC with ARC, We had an email conversation about ARC when I announced the updated Objective-C support for D. Perhaps it's time make it public. I don't think we came to a conclusion. I had some trouble following it. It

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Jacob Carlborg
On 2013-10-09 09:31, Walter Bright wrote: What do you propose? He wants ARC. -- /Jacob Carlborg

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Jacob Carlborg
On 2013-10-09 09:33, Manu wrote: It sounds pretty easy to reach to me. Compiler generating inc/dec ref calls can't possibly be difficult. An optimisation that simplifies redundant inc/dec sequences doesn't sound hard either... :/ Is there more to it? Cleaning up circular references I guess...

Re: Improvements to std.typecons.Nullable

2013-10-09 Thread Paolo Invernizzi
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 06:48:31 UTC, monarch_dodra wrote: On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 19:04:33 UTC, BLM768 wrote: I've been working on a project that makes relatively heavy use of nullable values. I've been using std.typecons.Nullable, and it mostly works well, but there are some

Re: Type of a missing actual parameter

2013-10-09 Thread Dicebot
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 12:33:07 UTC, Manfred Nowak wrote: The compiler accepts a dangling comma in a comma separated list of actual parameters. What is the type of this missing actual parameter? -manfred There is no missing parameter. It is just a convenience syntax to avoid

Type of a missing actual parameter

2013-10-09 Thread Manfred Nowak
The compiler accepts a dangling comma in a comma separated list of actual parameters. What is the type of this missing actual parameter? -manfred

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Dicebot
On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 22:02:07 UTC, Peter Alexander wrote: Just learn where allocations occur and avoid them during development. This leaves you only with accidental or otherwise unexpected allocations. D is not expected to be a single man project language, isn't it? As I have

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Dicebot
On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 22:37:28 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: On 10/8/2013 9:22 AM, Dicebot wrote: It is simply @nogc which is lacking but absolutely mandatory. Adding @nogc is fairly simple. The trouble, though, is (like purity) it is transitive. Every function an @nogc function calls

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Dicebot
On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 23:22:54 UTC, Sean Kelly wrote: On Oct 8, 2013, at 3:38 PM, Walter Bright This, of course, is the other problem with @nogc. Having a forest of attributes on otherwise ordinary functions is awfully ugly. And we already have a forest of attributes on otherwise

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Piotr Szturmaj
On 09.10.2013 14:41, Dicebot wrote: On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 22:02:07 UTC, Peter Alexander wrote: Just learn where allocations occur and avoid them during development. This leaves you only with accidental or otherwise unexpected allocations. D is not expected to be a single man project

Re: Type of a missing actual parameter

2013-10-09 Thread Manfred Nowak
Dicebot wrote: Those two are equivalent: Maybe right for functions, but is currently wrong for templated functions `this( T ...)( T param)' I got a Range violation on accessing the last parameter of `param'. Maybe the parameters are wongly counted? -manfred

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Michel Fortin
On 2013-10-09 04:07:53 +, deadalnix deadal...@gmail.com said: That being said, isolated is probably something we want to add in the future. You'll hit a problem with immutable though. Immutable is implicitly shared, and immutable strings are everywhere! -- Michel Fortin

Re: Type of a missing actual parameter

2013-10-09 Thread Andrej Mitrovic
On 10/9/13, Manfred Nowak svv1...@hotmail.com wrote: Maybe the parameters are wongly counted? I doubt it. Do you have a test-case?

Re: Type of a missing actual parameter

2013-10-09 Thread Dicebot
Works for me: http://dpaste.dzfl.pl/86d226b1

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Michel Fortin
On 2013-10-09 07:33:29 +, Manu turkey...@gmail.com said: Is there more to it? Cleaning up circular references I guess... what does Apple do? Apple implemented auto-nulling weak pointers for ARC (as well as __unsafe_unretained ones if you are not afraid of dangling pointers). It's an

Re: Thread-Multiplexing for D

2013-10-09 Thread Bienlein
The thread-multiplexing in Go is described here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1TTj4T2JO42uD5ID9e89oa0sLKhJYD0Y_kqxDv3I3XMw/edit The sources are here: http://code.google.com/p/go/source/browse/src/pkg/runtime/proc.c?r=01acf1dbe91f673f6308248b8f45ec0564b1d751 It should be possible to

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Michel Fortin
On 2013-10-09 11:58:33 +, Jacob Carlborg d...@me.com said: On 2013-10-09 09:33, Manu wrote: It sounds pretty easy to reach to me. Compiler generating inc/dec ref calls can't possibly be difficult. An optimisation that simplifies redundant inc/dec sequences doesn't sound hard either... :/

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Sean Kelly
On Oct 9, 2013, at 5:48 AM, Dicebot pub...@dicebot.lv wrote: On Tuesday, 8 October 2013 at 23:22:54 UTC, Sean Kelly wrote: On Oct 8, 2013, at 3:38 PM, Walter Bright This, of course, is the other problem with @nogc. Having a forest of attributes on otherwise ordinary functions is awfully

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Johannes Pfau
Am Wed, 9 Oct 2013 09:38:12 -0400 schrieb Michel Fortin michel.for...@michelf.ca: I think the only way to make that work sanely is to create another root object for ref-counted classes. The problem here is we need a way to know that type X is refcounted, right? Couldn't we just use an

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Dicebot
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 13:57:03 UTC, Sean Kelly wrote: They aren't opt-out for really any reasonable project though, because code is reused and those people may want at least the standard attributes to be set. Personally, the array of attributes that can be applied to a D function is

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Sean Kelly
On Oct 9, 2013, at 4:30 AM, Jacob Carlborg d...@me.com wrote: On 2013-10-09 05:31, Walter Bright wrote: Making this work is fraught with difficulty. It is normal behavior in D to create local data with new(), build a data structure, and then cast it to shared so it can be transferred to

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Tourist
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 14:11:46 UTC, Dicebot wrote: On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 13:57:03 UTC, Sean Kelly wrote: They aren't opt-out for really any reasonable project though, because code is reused and those people may want at least the standard attributes to be set. Personally,

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Michel Fortin
On 2013-10-09 14:06:51 +, Johannes Pfau nos...@example.com said: Am Wed, 9 Oct 2013 09:38:12 -0400 schrieb Michel Fortin michel.for...@michelf.ca: I think the only way to make that work sanely is to create another root object for ref-counted classes. The problem here is we need a way to

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Jacob Carlborg
On 2013-10-09 15:51, Sean Kelly wrote: Generally not, since even D's precise GC is partially conservative. It's also way more expensive than any cast should be. For better or worse, I think being able to cast data to shared means that we can't have thread-local pools. Unless a new attribute

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Manu
On 9 October 2013 23:06, Michel Fortin michel.for...@michelf.ca wrote: On 2013-10-09 07:33:29 +, Manu turkey...@gmail.com said: Is there more to it? Cleaning up circular references I guess... what does Apple do? Apple implemented auto-nulling weak pointers for ARC (as well as

Re: Type of a missing actual parameter

2013-10-09 Thread Manfred Nowak
Andrej Mitrovic wrote: Do you have a test-case? On reducing the case it turned out, that the error message blaimed the wrong file for a really existing Range violation. By pure chance the lines in the wrongly given file were these: AST[] astStar= visit( data.ast[0]); foreach(

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread deadalnix
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 13:03:33 UTC, Michel Fortin wrote: On 2013-10-09 04:07:53 +, deadalnix deadal...@gmail.com said: That being said, isolated is probably something we want to add in the future. You'll hit a problem with immutable though. Immutable is implicitly shared, and

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Manu
On 9 October 2013 17:31, Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote: On 10/9/2013 12:29 AM, Manu wrote: Does anyone here REALLY believe that a bunch of volunteer contributors can possibly do what apple failed to do with their squillions of dollars and engineers? I haven't heard anybody

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread deadalnix
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 14:17:44 UTC, Sean Kelly wrote: On Oct 9, 2013, at 4:30 AM, Jacob Carlborg d...@me.com wrote: On 2013-10-09 05:31, Walter Bright wrote: Making this work is fraught with difficulty. It is normal behavior in D to create local data with new(), build a data

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Paulo Pinto
Am 09.10.2013 16:52, schrieb Manu: On 9 October 2013 23:06, Michel Fortin michel.for...@michelf.ca mailto:michel.for...@michelf.ca wrote: On 2013-10-09 07:33:29 +, Manu turkey...@gmail.com mailto:turkey...@gmail.com said: Is there more to it? Cleaning up circular references

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread dennis luehring
Am 09.10.2013 16:30, schrieb Manu: On 9 October 2013 17:31, Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote: On 10/9/2013 12:29 AM, Manu wrote: Does anyone here REALLY believe that a bunch of volunteer contributors can possibly do what apple failed to do with their squillions of dollars and

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Johannes Pfau
Am Wed, 9 Oct 2013 10:36:36 -0400 schrieb Michel Fortin michel.for...@michelf.ca: @refcounted interface X{}; @refcounted class Y {}; class X1 : X; class Y1 : Y; Now we know for sure that all these classes and SubClasses are refcounted. The problem is that you can't cast Y to

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Sean Kelly
On Oct 9, 2013, at 7:35 AM, Jacob Carlborg d...@me.com wrote: On 2013-10-09 15:51, Sean Kelly wrote: Generally not, since even D's precise GC is partially conservative. It's also way more expensive than any cast should be. For better or worse, I think being able to cast data to shared

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread dennis luehring
Am 09.10.2013 17:46, schrieb Paulo Pinto: Am 09.10.2013 16:30, schrieb Manu: On 9 October 2013 17:31, Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com mailto:newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote: On 10/9/2013 12:29 AM, Manu wrote: Does anyone here REALLY believe that a bunch of volunteer

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Paulo Pinto
Am 09.10.2013 16:30, schrieb Manu: On 9 October 2013 17:31, Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com mailto:newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote: On 10/9/2013 12:29 AM, Manu wrote: Does anyone here REALLY believe that a bunch of volunteer contributors can possibly do

Re: Thread-Multiplexing for D

2013-10-09 Thread qznc
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 13:36:41 UTC, Bienlein wrote: The thread-multiplexing in Go is described here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1TTj4T2JO42uD5ID9e89oa0sLKhJYD0Y_kqxDv3I3XMw/edit The sources are here:

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Sean Kelly
On Oct 9, 2013, at 8:23 AM, deadalnix deadal...@gmail.com wrote: On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 14:17:44 UTC, Sean Kelly wrote: On Oct 9, 2013, at 4:30 AM, Jacob Carlborg d...@me.com wrote: On 2013-10-09 05:31, Walter Bright wrote: Making this work is fraught with difficulty. It is normal

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Michel Fortin
On 2013-10-09 15:18:23 +, deadalnix deadal...@gmail.com said: On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 13:03:33 UTC, Michel Fortin wrote: On 2013-10-09 04:07:53 +, deadalnix deadal...@gmail.com said: That being said, isolated is probably something we want to add in the future. You'll hit a

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Paulo Pinto
Am 09.10.2013 17:49, schrieb dennis luehring: Am 09.10.2013 17:46, schrieb Paulo Pinto: Am 09.10.2013 16:30, schrieb Manu: On 9 October 2013 17:31, Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com mailto:newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote: On 10/9/2013 12:29 AM, Manu wrote: Does anyone

Re: Thread-Multiplexing for D

2013-10-09 Thread Bienlein
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 15:47:11 UTC, qznc wrote: On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 13:36:41 UTC, Bienlein wrote: The thread-multiplexing in Go is described here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1TTj4T2JO42uD5ID9e89oa0sLKhJYD0Y_kqxDv3I3XMw/edit The sources are here:

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Sean Kelly
On Oct 9, 2013, at 8:35 AM, Paulo Pinto pj...@progtools.org wrote: The Azul VM does not have a problem with it, as it does pauseless concurrent GC, while being used on online trading systems. Incremental GCs are awesome. Have you looked at IBM's Metronome for Java? Maybe this would work

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread deadalnix
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 15:48:58 UTC, Sean Kelly wrote: On Oct 9, 2013, at 7:35 AM, Jacob Carlborg d...@me.com wrote: On 2013-10-09 15:51, Sean Kelly wrote: Generally not, since even D's precise GC is partially conservative. It's also way more expensive than any cast should be. For

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread deadalnix
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 15:53:13 UTC, Sean Kelly wrote: If the GC can determine whether a block is shared at allocation time, it can allocate the block from a thread-local pool in the unshared case. So if a collection is necessary, no global stop the world need occur. Only the

Re: Improvements to std.typecons.Nullable

2013-10-09 Thread BLM768
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 06:48:31 UTC, monarch_dodra wrote: OK, so that's two functions already. What about opCmp? What about toHash? Since ordered comparisons make no sense with null values, opCmp would need to throw an exception when working with null values anyway. That's exactly

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Jacob Carlborg
On 2013-10-09 17:48, Sean Kelly wrote: Okay so following that… it might be reasonable if the location of data keyed off the attribute set at construction. So new shared(X) puts it in the shared pool. I thought that was obvious. Is there a problem with that approach? -- /Jacob Carlborg

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread qznc
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 13:38:12 UTC, Michel Fortin wrote: On 2013-10-09 11:58:33 +, Jacob Carlborg d...@me.com said: On 2013-10-09 09:33, Manu wrote: It sounds pretty easy to reach to me. Compiler generating inc/dec ref calls can't possibly be difficult. An optimisation that

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Manu
On 10 October 2013 01:40, Johannes Pfau nos...@example.com wrote: Am Wed, 9 Oct 2013 10:36:36 -0400 schrieb Michel Fortin michel.for...@michelf.ca: @refcounted interface X{}; @refcounted class Y {}; class X1 : X; class Y1 : Y; Now we know for sure that all these classes

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Manu
On 10 October 2013 01:46, Paulo Pinto pj...@progtools.org wrote: Am 09.10.2013 16:30, schrieb Manu: On 9 October 2013 17:31, Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com mailto:newshound2@**digitalmars.com newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote: On 10/9/2013 12:29 AM, Manu wrote: Does

Re: Improvements to std.typecons.Nullable

2013-10-09 Thread monarch_dodra
On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 16:34:52 UTC, BLM768 wrote: On Wednesday, 9 October 2013 at 06:48:31 UTC, monarch_dodra wrote: OK, so that's two functions already. What about opCmp? What about toHash? Since ordered comparisons make no sense with null values, opCmp would need to throw an

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 10/9/13 4:30 AM, Jacob Carlborg wrote: On 2013-10-09 05:31, Walter Bright wrote: Making this work is fraught with difficulty. It is normal behavior in D to create local data with new(), build a data structure, and then cast it to shared so it can be transferred to another thread. This will

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 10/9/13 2:29 AM, Robert Schadek wrote: On 10/09/2013 04:22 AM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: * Get Robert Schadek's precise GC in. Walter and I have become 101% convinced a precise GC is the one way to go about GC. I would like to claim that work, but the Rainer Schütze wrote that. I know,

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Michel Fortin
On 2013-10-09 16:51:03 +, Manu turkey...@gmail.com said: On 10 October 2013 01:40, Johannes Pfau nos...@example.com wrote: But if someone really wants to strip the GC _completely_ there's a huge issue with memory management of Exceptions. Exceptions have a pretty well defined

dub repository for a C binding

2013-10-09 Thread Sebastian Graf
Hi, how would I create a dub repository for a ready-to-use C binding + pre-compiled binaries? Doesn't have to distinguish between platforms for now, but I would appreciate it nonetheless. I aim to then simply reference it in my actual D project, preferably using dub ofc. Thanks!

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 10/9/13 6:06 AM, Michel Fortin wrote: On 2013-10-09 07:33:29 +, Manu turkey...@gmail.com said: Is there more to it? Cleaning up circular references I guess... what does Apple do? Apple implemented auto-nulling weak pointers for ARC (as well as __unsafe_unretained ones if you are not

Re: The no gc crowd

2013-10-09 Thread John Joyus
On 10/09/2013 12:40 PM, qznc wrote: I found no summary and stuff seems to get lost, so I created a page on the wiki. http://wiki.dlang.org/Versus_the_garbage_collector +1

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