On 06/03/2011 02:48 PM, Walter Bright wrote:
In the beginning, God created tabs. Tab stops were 8 spaces
It's 2011. The idea that some character means 8 spaces and should be
used to layout code is ass-backwards, regardless if everybody actually
followed that rule. It was a fine rule for
On 12/04/2011 20:49, Nick Sabalausky wrote:
Can we move along now? This argument was old 30 years ago. Perhaps we
should do VI vs. EMACS while we are at it.
Pico rules them all! ;)
Vi *and* Emacs suck. Argument settled :P
(yes, that was hyperbolic rhetoric)
--
Bruno Medeiros -
On 2011-06-03 05:45, Bruno Medeiros wrote:
On 12/04/2011 20:49, Nick Sabalausky wrote:
Can we move along now? This argument was old 30 years ago. Perhaps we
should do VI vs. EMACS while we are at it.
Pico rules them all! ;)
Vi *and* Emacs suck. Argument settled :P
Yeah, I got sucked
I bet you wrote std.datetime with a call to a single Vim macro.
Just kidding. :P
On 2011-06-03 11:01, Andrej Mitrovic wrote:
I bet you wrote std.datetime with a call to a single Vim macro.
Just kidding. :P
That sort of talk leads to things like this: http://xkcd.com/378/
- Jonathan M Davis
On 4/10/2011 10:58 PM, Daniel Gibson wrote:
Am 11.04.2011 07:51, schrieb Jonathan M Davis:
Yes. Phobos follows the convention of indenting with spaces and that levels of
indentation are 4 spaces. So, anything which goes into Phobos needs to follow
this convention.
the only way that tabs work
On 4/11/2011 8:31 AM, Adam D. Ruppe wrote:
Yeah, that's all that matters in the end. When in Rome...
But it's trivial to do a find and replace all before submitting so
really, it's just not a big deal.
Before I check in, I run tolf and detab on the source files.
On 4/11/2011 1:31 PM, Nick Sabalausky wrote:
In other words, *some* editors handle space-indentation intelligently (and
do so by reinventing *tabs*), while *all* editors handle tab-indentation
intelligently.
There is no way to handle tabs intelligently.
Take a source file that has tab
8 space tabs are the One True Way. All other tabstops are evil.
Am 03.06.2011 20:54, schrieb Walter Bright:
On 4/11/2011 1:31 PM, Nick Sabalausky wrote:
In other words, *some* editors handle space-indentation intelligently
(and
do so by reinventing *tabs*), while *all* editors handle tab-indentation
intelligently.
There is no way to handle tabs
Daniel Gibson wrote:
Am 03.06.2011 20:54, schrieb Walter Bright:
On 4/11/2011 1:31 PM, Nick Sabalausky wrote:
In other words, *some* editors handle space-indentation intelligently
(and
do so by reinventing *tabs*), while *all* editors handle tab-indentation
intelligently.
There is no way
On Fri, Jun 3, 2011 at 3:04 PM, Daniel Gibson metalcae...@gmail.com wrote:
Am 03.06.2011 20:54, schrieb Walter Bright:
On 4/11/2011 1:31 PM, Nick Sabalausky wrote:
In other words, *some* editors handle space-indentation intelligently
(and
do so by reinventing *tabs*), while *all* editors
On 03/06/2011 19:06, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
snip
That sort of talk leads to things like this: http://xkcd.com/378/
I was told that Real Programmers use punch cards. Someone must've found some even realer
programmers
Stewart.
On 03/06/2011 20:15, Timon Gehr wrote:
Daniel Gibson wrote:
snip
If you use tabs for indentation and spaces for alignment the tabsize
doesn't matter.
http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/SmartTabs
Taken the words out of my mouth there. I've been faced with files that are a mishmash of
tabs and
On 6/3/2011 5:14 PM, Stewart Gordon wrote:
On 03/06/2011 20:15, Timon Gehr wrote:
Daniel Gibson wrote:
snip
If you use tabs for indentation and spaces for alignment the tabsize
doesn't matter.
http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/SmartTabs
Taken the words out of my mouth there. I've been faced
On 04/13/2011 11:44 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
On 4/13/11 4:17 PM, Jérôme M. Berger wrote:
Well, standard (printed) typographic practices put spaces outside
the parenthesis and none inside. And as opposed to a lot of
typographic rules, that one is a constant across languages and variants.
spir wrote:
Actually, I have never been pleased that func defs (1) look like func
calls (2) have an exceptional syntax compared to other definitions. I'd
like instead eg:
square = function (int n) int {
return n * n;
}
That is still different from other
On 04/14/2011 07:58 PM, Jérôme M. Berger wrote:
spir wrote:
Actually, I have never been pleased that func defs (1) look like func
calls (2) have an exceptional syntax compared to other definitions. I'd
like instead eg:
square = function (int n) int {
return n * n;
}
On 11/04/2011 20:54, Steven Schveighoffer wrote:
In most of the editors I use, the default is to use spaces for
indentation. So what happens is someone opens a file that uses tabs for
indentation, then adds some lines. However, their editor only uses
spaces *for those lines they added*, which
On 11/04/2011 22:03, David Gileadi wrote:
On 4/11/11 1:51 PM, Jérôme M. Berger wrote:
Nick Sabalausky wrote:
Andrej Mitrovicandrej.mitrov...@gmail.com wrote in message
news:mailman.3396.1302548836.4748.digitalmar...@puremagic.com...
Smart editors also allow you to unindent with a single
On 12/04/2011 21:08, Nick Sabalausky wrote:
Jérôme M. Bergerjeber...@free.fr wrote in message
news:io2396$1nuo$1...@digitalmars.com...
spir wrote:
A drawback is one cannot directly have different indent levels, for
instance to indent collection contents more, or less, than blocks of
code.
Nick Sabalausky wrote:
J�r�me M. Berger jeber...@free.fr wrote in message
news:io230l$1ldc$3...@digitalmars.com...
Well, I have worked in both environments, and I have seen a lot
more mess ups with tabs than with spaces... Other than that (and the
fact that almost *no* editors are able to do
Jérôme M. Berger jeber...@free.fr wrote in message
news:io4sng$1p9b$1...@digitalmars.com...
Nick Sabalausky wrote:
J?r?me M. Berger jeber...@free.fr wrote in message
news:io230l$1ldc$3...@digitalmars.com...
Well, I have worked in both environments, and I have seen a lot
more mess ups with
Nick Sabalausky wrote:
J�r�me M. Berger jeber...@free.fr wrote in message
news:io4sng$1p9b$1...@digitalmars.com...
Nick Sabalausky wrote:
J?r?me M. Berger jeber...@free.fr wrote in message
news:io230l$1ldc$3...@digitalmars.com...
Well, I have worked in both environments, and I have seen a
On 4/13/11 4:17 PM, Jérôme M. Berger wrote:
Nick Sabalausky wrote:
J�r�me M. Bergerjeber...@free.fr wrote in message
news:io4sng$1p9b$1...@digitalmars.com...
Nick Sabalausky wrote:
J?r?me M. Bergerjeber...@free.fr wrote in message
news:io230l$1ldc$3...@digitalmars.com...
Well, I have
On 2011-04-11 22:09, Nick Sabalausky wrote:
Jonathan M Davisjmdavisp...@gmx.com wrote in message
news:mailman.3371.1302508910.4748.digitalmar...@puremagic.com...
Jonathan M Davis Wrote:
Personally, I think that it's _horrible_ to use tabs
Why would one fear tabs?
They change depending on
On 04/12/2011 05:15 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
So, how you format
your code matters. Using tabs screws with that unless you're completely
consistent, and while a single developer may be consistent, groups of
developers rarely are.
This is as true in the case of spaces. With the additional
On 04/12/2011 05:19 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
Using only spaces and no tabs avoids the entire issue
spaces -- tabs works as fine
Why are programmers so blindly unfair when discussing this point?
and is one of the major reasons (if not _the_ major reason) why it is
incredibly common for
On 04/12/2011 07:13 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
It's true that people occasionally end up inserting tabs in space-only
environments, but in my experience, it's fairly rare. It's pretty much a
guarantee, however, that _someone_ will insert spaces in an environment where
it's supposed to be tabs.
On 04/12/2011 09:24 AM, Jacob Carlborg wrote:
Well, IMO, using spaces for indentation serves no useful purpose. At least
tabs actually *mean* alignment and indentation. Spaces don't and never have.
Plus, what's the use of being able place the cursor at arbtrary points
within the 4 spaces (or 8
On 2011-04-12 05:19, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
On 04/11/2011 08:13 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
They mix tabs and spaces. On some lines, they use spaces and on others
they use tabs.
Never seen this, not even once. Messing can only happen when one
copy-pastes from modules using spaces.
As Steve
Jérôme M. Berger wrote:
Nick Sabalausky wrote:
Andrej Mitrovic andrej.mitrov...@gmail.com wrote in message
news:mailman.3396.1302548836.4748.digitalmar...@puremagic.com...
Smart editors also allow you to unindent with a single backspace
regardless if you're using tabs or spaces.
In other
spir wrote:
On 04/12/2011 07:13 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
It's true that people occasionally end up inserting tabs in space-only
environments, but in my experience, it's fairly rare. It's pretty much a
guarantee, however, that _someone_ will insert spaces in an
environment where
it's
spir wrote:
In addition to those main reasons, they have a few nice side-effects:
* No indent width issue (!),
True
* 1 tab -- 1 indent level conceptually,
True
* deletion is 1 key press, even with stupid editors.
False, not with some *really* stupid editors I have
Cliff Hudson cliff.s.hud...@gmail.com wrote in message
news:mailman.3414.1302586393.4748.digitalmar...@puremagic.com...
Spaces *should* only be used within string constants (as needed), or when
the language otherwise requires them. The editor should format the code
according to user
Jérôme M. Berger jeber...@free.fr wrote in message
news:io230l$1ldc$3...@digitalmars.com...
Well, I have worked in both environments, and I have seen a lot
more mess ups with tabs than with spaces... Other than that (and the
fact that almost *no* editors are able to do it properly), I would
Jérôme M. Berger jeber...@free.fr wrote in message
news:io2396$1nuo$1...@digitalmars.com...
spir wrote:
A drawback is one cannot directly have different indent levels, for
instance to indent collection contents more, or less, than blocks of
code. This can also be considered an advantage; and
Nick Sabalausky wrote:
So I've changed my style to this:
if(blah)
{
- foo(
- - bigLongArg1,
- - bigLongArg2,
- - bigLongArg3
- );
}
That's something I've started doing too. It's not just a matter
of alignment either - I think the first argument on the same
line as the function
Nick Sabalausky Wrote:
So I've changed my style to this:
if(blah)
{
- foo(
- - bigLongArg1,
- - bigLongArg2,
- - bigLongArg3
- );
}
Much better. Of course, it would be even better still if Scintilla would be
willing to add elastic tabstops (I'm getting increasingly annoyed
On 04/12/2011 10:08 PM, Nick Sabalausky wrote:
Jérôme M. Bergerjeber...@free.fr wrote in message
news:io2396$1nuo$1...@digitalmars.com...
spir wrote:
A drawback is one cannot directly have different indent levels, for
instance to indent collection contents more, or less, than blocks of
code.
On 2011-04-12 05:19, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
On 04/11/2011 08:13 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
They mix tabs and spaces. On some lines, they use spaces and on others
they use tabs.
Never seen this, not even once. Messing can only happen when one
copy-pastes from modules using spaces.
Am 11.04.2011 07:51, schrieb Jonathan M Davis:
Nick Sabalausky:
What, so that he can force his indentation size on everyone else that
works on the code? Or so that using the left/right arrow keys within the
indentation zone requires an unnessesaraly large number of keypresses?
It's a module
Am 11.04.2011 07:51, schrieb Jonathan M Davis:
Nick Sabalausky:
What, so that he can force his indentation size on everyone else that
works on the code? Or so that using the left/right arrow keys within
the indentation zone requires an unnessesaraly large number of
keypresses?
It's
Jonathan M Davis:
Yes. Phobos follows the convention of indenting with spaces and that levels
of
indentation are 4 spaces. So, anything which goes into Phobos needs to follow
this convention.
...
Regardless, Phobos doesn't use tabs. So, whatever someone may prefer in their
own code,
Jonathan M Davis Wrote:
Personally, I think that it's _horrible_ to use tabs
Why would one fear tabs?
Jonathan M Davis Wrote:
Personally, I think that it's _horrible_ to use tabs
Why would one fear tabs?
They change depending on your editor settings. Indenting gets screwed up if
tabs and spaces are mixed. It's just plain annoying to have an indentation of
multiple spaces which isn't
Am 11.04.2011 10:01, schrieb Jonathan M Davis:
Jonathan M Davis Wrote:
Personally, I think that it's _horrible_ to use tabs
Why would one fear tabs?
They change depending on your editor settings. Indenting gets screwed up if
tabs and spaces are mixed. It's just plain annoying to have an
Am 11.04.2011 10:01, schrieb Jonathan M Davis:
Jonathan M Davis Wrote:
Personally, I think that it's _horrible_ to use tabs
Why would one fear tabs?
They change depending on your editor settings. Indenting gets screwed up
if tabs and spaces are mixed. It's just plain annoying to
On 04/11/2011 07:51 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
the only way that tabs work is if you use them consistently, which in my
experience almost never happens. And
How so? If you probably set your editor, inconsistency simply cannot happen...
The same is true for using spaces, anyway.
Denis
--
On 04/11/2011 08:13 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
They mix tabs and spaces. On some lines, they use spaces and on others they
use tabs.
Never seen this, not even once. Messing can only happen when one copy-pastes
from modules using spaces.
Denis
--
_
vita es estrany
On 04/11/2011 10:01 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
Jonathan M Davis Wrote:
Personally, I think that it's _horrible_ to use tabs
Why would one fear tabs?
They change depending on your editor settings.
That's precisely what they are meant for... unlike space-indentation,
tab-indentation
Jonathan M Davis Wrote:
So, if
you do use tabs, you will end up with mixed tabs and spaces unless everyone
involved is very careful, which isn't going to happen.
If no one is careful, you end up with mixed tabs and spaces, no matter what
policies you're trying to enforce.
Jonathan M Davis Wrote:
Every place that I've ever worked
at has gone for spaces only, and I've only ever heard of one place where it
was required that tabs be used for indentation. I'm sure that there are
others, but it's rare that I've heard of anyone thinking that using tabs in
code
bearophile:
It's a module theoretically meant for Phobos, and the Phobos coding
standard are spaces.
Yeah, that's all that matters in the end. When in Rome...
But it's trivial to do a find and replace all before submitting so
really, it's just not a big deal.
On 4/11/11 10:30 AM, Kagamin wrote:
Jonathan M Davis Wrote:
Every place that I've ever worked
at has gone for spaces only, and I've only ever heard of one place where it
was required that tabs be used for indentation. I'm sure that there are
others, but it's rare that I've heard of anyone
On 04/11/2011 05:31 PM, Adam D. Ruppe wrote:
bearophile:
It's a module theoretically meant for Phobos, and the Phobos coding
standard are spaces.
Yeah, that's all that matters in the end. When in Rome...
But it's trivial to do a find and replace all before submitting so
really, it's just not
Smart editors also allow you to unindent with a single backspace
regardless if you're using tabs or spaces.
On Mon, 11 Apr 2011 06:17:58 -0400, spir denis.s...@gmail.com wrote:
On 04/11/2011 07:51 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
the only way that tabs work is if you use them consistently, which in my
experience almost never happens. And
How so? If you probably set your editor, inconsistency simply
Jonathan M Davis jmdavisp...@gmx.com wrote in message
news:mailman.3371.1302508910.4748.digitalmar...@puremagic.com...
Jonathan M Davis Wrote:
Personally, I think that it's _horrible_ to use tabs
Why would one fear tabs?
They change depending on your editor settings. Indenting gets screwed
Kagamin s...@here.lot wrote in message
news:inv6q0$1hmi$1...@digitalmars.com...
Jonathan M Davis Wrote:
Every place that I've ever worked
at has gone for spaces only, and I've only ever heard of one place where
it
was required that tabs be used for indentation. I'm sure that there are
Andrej Mitrovic andrej.mitrov...@gmail.com wrote in message
news:mailman.3396.1302548836.4748.digitalmar...@puremagic.com...
Smart editors also allow you to unindent with a single backspace
regardless if you're using tabs or spaces.
In other words, *some* editors handle space-indentation
Nick Sabalausky wrote:
Andrej Mitrovic andrej.mitrov...@gmail.com wrote in message
news:mailman.3396.1302548836.4748.digitalmar...@puremagic.com...
Smart editors also allow you to unindent with a single backspace
regardless if you're using tabs or spaces.
In other words, *some* editors
On 4/11/11 1:51 PM, Jérôme M. Berger wrote:
Nick Sabalausky wrote:
Andrej Mitrovicandrej.mitrov...@gmail.com wrote in message
news:mailman.3396.1302548836.4748.digitalmar...@puremagic.com...
Smart editors also allow you to unindent with a single backspace
regardless if you're using tabs or
Am 11.04.2011 17:25, schrieb Kagamin:
Jonathan M Davis Wrote:
So, if
you do use tabs, you will end up with mixed tabs and spaces unless everyone
involved is very careful, which isn't going to happen.
If no one is careful, you end up with mixed tabs and spaces, no matter what
policies
Am 11.04.2011 23:03, schrieb David Gileadi:
On 4/11/11 1:51 PM, Jérôme M. Berger wrote:
Nick Sabalausky wrote:
Andrej Mitrovicandrej.mitrov...@gmail.com wrote in message
news:mailman.3396.1302548836.4748.digitalmar...@puremagic.com...
Smart editors also allow you to unindent with a single
DigitalMarsTV Headlines:
Newlines: Why is Microsoft still ignoring the public's demand to
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Breaking News: Police investigators are on the lookout for the
monster lunatic who originally designed the number system layout for
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On 04/11/2011 10:01 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
Jonathan M Davis Wrote:
Personally, I think that it's _horrible_ to use tabs
Why would one fear tabs?
They change depending on your editor settings.
That's precisely what they are meant for... unlike space-indentation,
On 04/11/2011 08:13 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
They mix tabs and spaces. On some lines, they use spaces and on others
they use tabs.
Never seen this, not even once. Messing can only happen when one
copy-pastes from modules using spaces.
As Steve pointed out, it frequently happens when
Am 12.04.2011 05:15, schrieb Jonathan M Davis:
Using tabs screws with that unless you're completely
consistent, and while a single developer may be consistent, groups of
developers rarely are.
- Jonathan M Davis
Yeah that is why using spaces screws with that: While a single developer
may
Jonathan M Davis jmdavisp...@gmx.com wrote in message
news:mailman.3412.1302578409.4748.digitalmar...@puremagic.com...
On 04/11/2011 08:13 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
They mix tabs and spaces. On some lines, they use spaces and on others
they use tabs.
Never seen this, not even once.
Jonathan M Davis jmdavisp...@gmx.com wrote in message
news:mailman.3412.1302578409.4748.digitalmar...@puremagic.com...
On 04/11/2011 08:13 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
They mix tabs and spaces. On some lines, they use spaces and on others
they use tabs.
Never seen this, not even
Spaces *should* only be used within string constants (as needed), or when
the language otherwise requires them. The editor should format the code
according to user preferences.
Absent that, spaces represent the lowest common denominator of formatting,
so we can all use them and our text shows up
On 4/12/11, Cliff Hudson cliff.s.hud...@gmail.com wrote:
Perhaps we
should do VI vs. EMACS while we are at it.
Don't bring operating systems into this...
... just kidding. :P
KennyTM~ kenn...@gmail.com wrote in message
news:int88l$uaf$1...@digitalmars.com...
On Apr 9, 11 04:26, Adam D. Ruppe wrote:
We discussed this first in the GUI library thread, but since it
meandered so much, I decided to split off into a new subject. Much
of what I say here will be old to
Am 11.04.2011 07:00, schrieb Nick Sabalausky:
KennyTM~ kenn...@gmail.com wrote in message
news:int88l$uaf$1...@digitalmars.com...
On Apr 9, 11 04:26, Adam D. Ruppe wrote:
We discussed this first in the GUI library thread, but since it
meandered so much, I decided to split off into a new
Nick Sabalausky:
What, so that he can force his indentation size on everyone else that works
on the code? Or so that using the left/right arrow keys within the
indentation zone requires an unnessesaraly large number of keypresses?
It's a module theoretically meant for Phobos, and the Phobos
Nick Sabalausky:
What, so that he can force his indentation size on everyone else that
works on the code? Or so that using the left/right arrow keys within the
indentation zone requires an unnessesaraly large number of keypresses?
It's a module theoretically meant for Phobos, and the
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