Don wrote:
Nick B wrote:
Nick B wrote:
Bartosz Milewski wrote:
Nick B Wrote:
Could you give us _any_ kind of test case (even if it's enormous)?
Bartosz - are you able to provide a test case as requested by Don ?
Then it might be possible, to get this bug fixed.
Nick B.
I can send you the
Nick B wrote:
Don wrote:
Nick B wrote:
Nick B wrote:
Bartosz Milewski wrote:
Nick B Wrote:
Could you give us _any_ kind of test case (even if it's enormous)?
Bartosz - are you able to provide a test case as requested by Don ?
Then it might be possible, to get this bug fixed.
Nick B.
I
Don wrote:
Nick B wrote:
Don wrote:
Nick B wrote:
Nick B wrote:
Bartosz Milewski wrote:
Nick B Wrote:
Could you give us _any_ kind of test case (even if it's enormous)?
Bartosz - are you able to provide a test case as requested by Don ?
Then it might be possible, to get this bug fixed.
Don:
3423. My patch has already been included in the dmd svn, and Bartosz has
a compiled DMD with the bug fixed.
You are my third hero :-)
(the first is Richard Feynman).
Bye,
bearophile
Leandro Lucarella wrote:
Don, el 21 de octubre a las 09:46 me escribiste:
All my public email addresses are fake. Bugzilla is just spam bait.
It clearly comes from a more innocent age. I once made the mistake
of submitting a bug to gcc. Although the GCC Bugzilla hides the
email in the
Nick B, el 22 de octubre a las 19:35 me escribiste:
Leandro Lucarella wrote:
Don, el 21 de octubre a las 09:46 me escribiste:
All my public email addresses are fake. Bugzilla is just spam bait.
It clearly comes from a more innocent age. I once made the mistake
of submitting a bug to gcc.
On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 17:32:00 +0400, Leandro Lucarella llu...@gmail.com
wrote:
Nick B, el 22 de octubre a las 19:35 me escribiste:
Leandro Lucarella wrote:
Don, el 21 de octubre a las 09:46 me escribiste:
All my public email addresses are fake. Bugzilla is just spam bait.
It clearly comes
On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 09:32:00 -0400, Leandro Lucarella llu...@gmail.com
wrote:
Nick B, el 22 de octubre a las 19:35 me escribiste:
Leandro Lucarella wrote:
Don, el 21 de octubre a las 09:46 me escribiste:
All my public email addresses are fake. Bugzilla is just spam bait.
It clearly comes
Don, el 21 de octubre a las 09:46 me escribiste:
Nick B wrote:
Don wrote:
Don, are you able to contact Bartosz, re the details of this test case.
Nick B
Bartosz has sent it to me. I can reproduce the error. It's my
top priority, but it'll take a while -- it's nasty.
Don - thanks
Nick B wrote:
Nick B wrote:
Bartosz Milewski wrote:
Nick B Wrote:
Could you give us _any_ kind of test case (even if it's enormous)?
Bartosz - are you able to provide a test case as requested by Don ?
Then it might be possible, to get this bug fixed.
Nick B.
I can send you the files I
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
Speaking of switch, I have tried to convince Walter to require either a
break; or a goto case xxx; at the end of each snippet inside a switch. I
was surprised by his answer: but I use fall through all the time! :o)
I personally think requiring a goto case xxx; is
Don, el 20 de octubre a las 09:00 me escribiste:
Unfortunately, I have undone some of my changes trying to
bypass the bug, so at the moment I don't even have the buggy
version, but it can be reconstructed. We can discuss it
off-line, if you want. Use my email address with -nospam
removed.
Don wrote:
Don, are you able to contact Bartosz, re the details of this test case.
Nick B
Bartosz has sent it to me. I can reproduce the error. It's my top
priority, but it'll take a while -- it's nasty.
Don - thanks for filing this. I did try to contact you, via bugzilla
email (which
Bill Baxter wrote:
case 1:
case 3:
break;
should still be allowed.
--bb
Or replace with:
case 1, 3:
break;
-- Chris Nicholson-Sauls
Bartosz Milewski:
With every release of D we are narrowing our options. After D2 and TDPL,
backward compatibility will become a major thing, so every ad-hoc feature in
D2 will have to be carried over.
D is a bit compatible with the C language, but one of the main selling points
of D (D1, D2,
bearophile wrote:
Bartosz Milewski:
With every release of D we are narrowing our options. After D2 and TDPL, backward
compatibility will become a major thing, so every ad-hoc feature in D2 will have
to be carried over.
D is a bit compatible with the C language, but one of the main selling
bearophile Wrote:
Jeremie Pelletier:
I vote for a 'lent' qualifier to be implemented in the compiler.
You may be right, and Bartosz has explained me why and how to use lent. It
sounds like a nice idea, but it has some costs too (in language complexity,
for example). But I need to use
On Thu, Oct 15, 2009 at 12:47 PM, Andrei Alexandrescu
seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org wrote:
bearophile wrote:
Bartosz Milewski:
With every release of D we are narrowing our options. After D2 and TDPL,
backward compatibility will become a major thing, so every ad-hoc feature in
D2 will have
On 2009-10-15 21:47:05 +0200, Andrei Alexandrescu
seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org said:
Speaking of switch, I have tried to convince Walter to require either a
break; or a goto case xxx; at the end of each snippet inside a switch.
I was surprised by his answer: but I use fall through all the
Nick B wrote:
Bartosz Milewski wrote:
Nick B Wrote:
Could you give us _any_ kind of test case (even if it's enormous)?
Bartosz - are you able to provide a test case as requested by Don ?
Then it might be possible, to get this bug fixed.
Nick B.
I can send you the files I have checked out.
Bartosz Milewski:
It's good to know that my ideas are still circulating in the D community.
Thanks, guys!
They will keep circulating! And there's not just D in computer science, future
computer languages may use your ideas. Someday I'll design my own C-like
language, simpler (and more limited
Bartosz Milewski wrote:
Nick B Wrote:
Nick B wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
bearophile wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu:
Unfortunately, Bartosz has declined to contribute.
I have read a good amount of his interesting blog posts, he has shown
me many things I didn't know about. And he was
bearophile wrote:
Bartosz Milewski:
It's good to know that my ideas are still circulating in the D community. Thanks,
guys!
They will keep circulating! And there's not just D in computer science, future
computer languages may use your ideas. Someday I'll design my own C-like
language,
Jeremie Pelletier wrote:
Jeremie Pelletier wrote:
I agree here, while I think Andrei's book is a must for the community
to grow, it should rush the compiler. I strongly believe D2 needs
proper shared and lent semantics, or else we're just creating a
stepping stone for D3, leaving D2 in a
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
For the record, I delayed signing for the book for quite a few months.
Before I did sign, there was solemn agreement in the D team that we can
commit. [snip]
Commit to what, exactly ?
Nick B
Nick B wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
For the record, I delayed signing for the book for quite a few months.
Before I did sign, there was solemn agreement in the D team that we
can commit. [snip]
Commit to what, exactly ?
Nick B
Commit to delivering the book and the language
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
Commit to what, exactly ?
Nick B
Commit to delivering the book and the language matching it.
Andrei
To meet a final release of D 2.0 ?
Nick B
Nick B wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
Commit to what, exactly ?
Nick B
Commit to delivering the book and the language matching it.
Andrei
To meet a final release of D 2.0 ?
Nick B
Yes, that's the plan. D2 final release begets TDPL, and TDPL describes
the final release of D2.
bearophile Wrote:
it's hard for me to subscribe to the good enough philosophy (as long as
it's better that C++, it's fine for D).
D language is largely grown, and not designed. D is not Scala or Haskell.
...
So I think some of the design mistakes of D2 will be fixed in D3 :-)
With
Don wrote:
Bartosz Milewski wrote:
[snip]
Please stay in touch, we will try to win you back...
Of the issues you mention, this one seems the easiest to address:
As far as my thread work went, I had an almost working implementation
of spawn, except for a nasty compiler bug which resisted
Nick B Wrote:
Could you give us _any_ kind of test case (even if it's enormous)?
Bartosz - are you able to provide a test case as requested by Don ?
Then it might be possible, to get this bug fixed.
Nick B.
I can send you the files I have checked out.
The problem was in core.thread.
On Wed, Oct 14, 2009 at 05:56:10PM -0400, Bartosz Milewski wrote:
The problem was in core.thread. I tried to implement a struct Tid (thread ID)
with reference-counting semantics and deterministic destruction. It passed
all the tests, but when it was used in one particular place in druntime it
Leandro Lucarella wrote:
Jeremie Pelletier, el 12 de octubre a las 22:45 me escribiste:
I agree. Particularly about lent. Immutable and mutable weren't
considered complete without const, so I'm surprised that local and
shared are considered complete without lent. You can even
implement it
On 2009-10-13 03:17:13 +0200, Robert Jacques sandf...@jhu.edu said:
On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 18:21:37 -0400, Fawzi Mohamed fmoha...@mac.com wrote:
If anyone has ideas, suggestions, and code to help defining a new
concurrency API for D, please post.
I think that the correct way to handle
bearophile wrote:
Jeremie Pelletier:
I vote for a 'lent' qualifier to be implemented in the compiler.
You may be right, and Bartosz has explained me why and how to use lent. It
sounds like a nice idea, but it has some costs too (in language complexity, for
example). But I need to use such
On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 01:59:57 -0400, Jeremie Pelletier jerem...@gmail.com
wrote:
Leandro Lucarella wrote:
Jeremie Pelletier, el 12 de octubre a las 22:45 me escribiste:
I agree. Particularly about lent. Immutable and mutable weren't
considered complete without const, so I'm surprised that
Jeremie Pelletier wrote:
Leandro Lucarella wrote:
Jeremie Pelletier, el 12 de octubre a las 22:45 me escribiste:
I agree. Particularly about lent. Immutable and mutable weren't
considered complete without const, so I'm surprised that local and
shared are considered complete without lent. You
bearophile wrote:
Sean Kelly:
For what it's worth, I've been experimenting with message-passing for
one leg of the API. I decided to copy the Erlang API because it's very
simple and easy to build fancier stuff on top of.
You may also want to take a look at how actors are in Scala (I think
Jeremie Pelletier wrote:
bearophile wrote:
Sean Kelly:
For what it's worth, I've been experimenting with message-passing for
one leg of the API. I decided to copy the Erlang API because it's very
simple and easy to build fancier stuff on top of.
You may also want to take a look at how
Fawzi Mohamed wrote:
On 2009-10-13 03:17:13 +0200, Robert Jacques sandf...@jhu.edu said:
On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 18:21:37 -0400, Fawzi Mohamed fmoha...@mac.com
wrote:
If anyone has ideas, suggestions, and code to help defining a new
concurrency API for D, please post.
I think that the
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
Jeremie Pelletier wrote:
Leandro Lucarella wrote:
Jeremie Pelletier, el 12 de octubre a las 22:45 me escribiste:
I agree. Particularly about lent. Immutable and mutable weren't
considered complete without const, so I'm surprised that local and
shared are considered
Andrei Alexandrescu Wrote:
MIURA Masahiro wrote:
Sean Kelly wrote:
void sendmsg(T)( Pid pid, T val );
final void recvmsg(T...)( Pid pid, T ops );
Pid spawn(T)( T fun );
spawn() is pretty limited so far in that it only spawns threads--I'd
expect that function to end up with multiple
On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 02:25:07 -0400, Jeremie Pelletier jerem...@gmail.com
wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
[snip]
to lend
loan
lending
are all of the same root. lent is the passive/simple past/past
participle form of to lend.
I guess is the French word is one of confer\'e or pr\^et\'e.
Robert Jacques wrote:
On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 02:25:07 -0400, Jeremie Pelletier
jerem...@gmail.com wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
[snip]
to lend
loan
lending
are all of the same root. lent is the passive/simple past/past
participle form of to lend.
I guess is the French word is one of
On 2009-10-13 07:45:41 +0200, Andrei Alexandrescu
seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org said:
MIURA Masahiro wrote:
Sean Kelly wrote:
void sendmsg(T)( Pid pid, T val );
final void recvmsg(T...)( Pid pid, T ops );
Pid spawn(T)( T fun );
spawn() is pretty limited so far in that it only spawns
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
MIURA Masahiro wrote:
Sean Kelly wrote:
void sendmsg(T)( Pid pid, T val );
final void recvmsg(T...)( Pid pid, T ops );
Pid spawn(T)( T fun );
spawn() is pretty limited so far in that it only spawns threads--I'd
expect that function to end up with multiple
On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 02:50:41 -0400, Jeremie Pelletier jerem...@gmail.com
wrote:
Robert Jacques wrote:
On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 02:25:07 -0400, Jeremie Pelletier
jerem...@gmail.com wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
[snip]
to lend
loan
lending
are all of the same root. lent is the
Fawzi Mohamed wrote:
On 2009-10-13 07:45:41 +0200, Andrei Alexandrescu
seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org said:
MIURA Masahiro wrote:
Sean Kelly wrote:
void sendmsg(T)( Pid pid, T val );
final void recvmsg(T...)( Pid pid, T ops );
Pid spawn(T)( T fun );
spawn() is pretty limited so far in that
Robert Jacques wrote:
On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 02:50:41 -0400, Jeremie Pelletier
jerem...@gmail.com wrote:
Robert Jacques wrote:
On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 02:25:07 -0400, Jeremie Pelletier
jerem...@gmail.com wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
[snip]
to lend
loan
lending
are all of the same root.
Jeremie Pelletier wrote:
I also don't believe one model is ruling them all.
Let me clarity this, just in case I have caused an unnecessary
confusion: I think Sean's Erlang-like API is meant to coexist
with the current core.thread, and that you can use one or both
of them to build higher-level
Jeremie Pelletier wrote:
bearophile wrote:
Jeremie Pelletier:
I vote for a 'lent' qualifier to be implemented in the compiler.
You may be right, and Bartosz has explained me why and how to use
lent. It sounds like a nice idea, but it has some costs too (in
language complexity, for
On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 10:10:31 +0400, Jeremie Pelletier jerem...@gmail.com
wrote:
I never liked the Object vs Object? syntax, that would just create
ambiguity with the ternary conditional. D already dropped the template
syntax from C++ to drop the ambiguity with and comparison operators.
On 2009-10-13 02:16:30 -0400, Andrei Alexandrescu
seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org said:
P.S. Beer? Coffee? Marriage? I'll be in Quebec City on Dec 10th and
11th for a talk.
So you'll be in my city too. :-) How many of us are in Quebec City?
--
Michel Fortin
michel.for...@michelf.com
Jeremie Pelletier, el 13 de octubre a las 01:59 me escribiste:
Leandro Lucarella wrote:
Jeremie Pelletier, el 12 de octubre a las 22:45 me escribiste:
I agree. Particularly about lent. Immutable and mutable weren't
considered complete without const, so I'm surprised that local and
shared are
MIURA Masahiro wrote:
Jeremie Pelletier wrote:
I also don't believe one model is ruling them all.
Let me clarity this, just in case I have caused an unnecessary
confusion: I think Sean's Erlang-like API is meant to coexist
with the current core.thread, and that you can use one or both
of
MIURA Masahiro Wrote:
Jeremie Pelletier wrote:
I also don't believe one model is ruling them all.
Let me clarity this, just in case I have caused an unnecessary
confusion: I think Sean's Erlang-like API is meant to coexist
with the current core.thread, and that you can use one or both
On 2009-10-13 11:39:21 -0400, Sean Kelly s...@invisibleduck.org said:
I disagree about poor performance though. With unique references or
move semantics, a copy of even complex data isn't necessary to ensure
that a message is passed safely.
Yeah, but for unique reference to be usable you
On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 11:19:30 -0400, Andrei Alexandrescu
seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org wrote:
MIURA Masahiro wrote:
Jeremie Pelletier wrote:
I also don't believe one model is ruling them all.
Let me clarity this, just in case I have caused an unnecessary
confusion: I think Sean's
Robert Jacques wrote:
On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 11:19:30 -0400, Andrei Alexandrescu
seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org wrote:
MIURA Masahiro wrote:
Jeremie Pelletier wrote:
I also don't believe one model is ruling them all.
Let me clarity this, just in case I have caused an unnecessary
confusion: I
Robert Jacques wrote:
On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 11:19:30 -0400, Andrei Alexandrescu
seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org wrote:
MIURA Masahiro wrote:
Jeremie Pelletier wrote:
I also don't believe one model is ruling them all.
Let me clarity this, just in case I have caused an unnecessary
confusion: I
Michel Fortin Wrote:
On 2009-10-13 11:39:21 -0400, Sean Kelly s...@invisibleduck.org said:
I disagree about poor performance though. With unique references or
move semantics, a copy of even complex data isn't necessary to ensure
that a message is passed safely.
Yeah, but for unique
Nick B Wrote:
Nick B wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
bearophile wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu:
Unfortunately, Bartosz has declined to contribute.
I have read a good amount of his interesting blog posts, he has shown
me many things I didn't know about. And he was very happy about
On 2009-10-13 18:26:04 -0400, Bartosz Milewski
bartosz-nos...@relisoft.com said:
I didn't so much decline to contribute as hit a wall. I'm a bit of a
perfectionist and it's hard for me to subscribe to the good enough
philosophy (as long as it's better that C++, it's fine for D). My
Occasionally people here ask for ways in which they can help D. One
thing that would be extremely helpful at this point would be to help
defining and implementing D's new concurrency API. Unfortunately,
Bartosz has declined to contribute. That leaves Walter, Sean, Don, and
participants to this
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
Occasionally people here ask for ways in which they can help D. One
thing that would be extremely helpful at this point would be to help
defining and implementing D's new concurrency API. Unfortunately,
Bartosz has declined to contribute. That leaves Walter, Sean,
== Quote from Andrei Alexandrescu (seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org)'s article
Occasionally people here ask for ways in which they can help D. One
thing that would be extremely helpful at this point would be to help
defining and implementing D's new concurrency API. Unfortunately,
Bartosz has
Sean Kelly Wrote:
void sendmsg(T)( Pid pid, T val );
final void recvmsg(T...)( Pid pid, T ops );
Oops, I should mention that 'pid' shouldn't be in recvmsg. I just have it in
there for now for testing purposes.
Andrei Alexandrescu:
Unfortunately, Bartosz has declined to contribute.
I have read a good amount of his interesting blog posts, he has shown me many
things I didn't know about. And he was very happy about the idea of helping D
concurrency. Do you know why he has changed his mind regarding
bearophile wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu:
Unfortunately, Bartosz has declined to contribute.
I have read a good amount of his interesting blog posts, he has shown
me many things I didn't know about. And he was very happy about the
idea of helping D concurrency. Do you know why he has changed
bearophile wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu:
Unfortunately, Bartosz has declined to contribute.
I have read a good amount of his interesting blog posts, he has shown me many
things I didn't know about. And he was very happy about the idea of helping D
concurrency. Do you know why he has changed
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
bearophile wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu:
Unfortunately, Bartosz has declined to contribute.
I have read a good amount of his interesting blog posts, he has shown
me many things I didn't know about. And he was very happy about the
idea of helping D concurrency. Do
Nick B wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
bearophile wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu:
Unfortunately, Bartosz has declined to contribute.
I have read a good amount of his interesting blog posts, he has shown
me many things I didn't know about. And he was very happy about the
idea of helping D
Nick B wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote:
bearophile wrote:
Andrei Alexandrescu:
Unfortunately, Bartosz has declined to contribute.
I have read a good amount of his interesting blog posts, he has shown
me many things I didn't know about. And he was very happy about the
idea of helping D
If anyone has ideas, suggestions, and code to help defining a new
concurrency API for D, please post.
I think that the correct way to handle concurrency is through a
library, D is flexible enough, so that a library can be used, and then
one can even write special handlers for special cases.
On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 18:21:37 -0400, Fawzi Mohamed fmoha...@mac.com wrote:
If anyone has ideas, suggestions, and code to help defining a new
concurrency API for D, please post.
I think that the correct way to handle concurrency is through a library,
D is flexible enough, so that a library
Nick B Wrote:
Is this the way serious architecture decisions should be made ?
Would Walter/Bartosz/Andrei like to comment further
Nick B
Good point.
On 2009-10-12 11:45:55 -0400, Andrei Alexandrescu
seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org said:
Occasionally people here ask for ways in which they can help D. One
thing that would be extremely helpful at this point would be to help
defining and implementing D's new concurrency API. Unfortunately,
On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 21:45:20 -0400, Michel Fortin
michel.for...@michelf.com wrote:
On 2009-10-12 11:45:55 -0400, Andrei Alexandrescu
seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org said:
Occasionally people here ask for ways in which they can help D. One
thing that would be extremely helpful at this point
Robert Jacques wrote:
On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 21:45:20 -0400, Michel Fortin
michel.for...@michelf.com wrote:
On 2009-10-12 11:45:55 -0400, Andrei Alexandrescu
seewebsiteforem...@erdani.org said:
Occasionally people here ask for ways in which they can help D. One
thing that would be extremely
Jeremie Pelletier, el 12 de octubre a las 22:45 me escribiste:
I agree. Particularly about lent. Immutable and mutable weren't
considered complete without const, so I'm surprised that local and
shared are considered complete without lent. You can even
implement it without escape analysis.
Jeremie Pelletier:
I vote for a 'lent' qualifier to be implemented in the compiler.
You may be right, and Bartosz has explained me why and how to use lent. It
sounds like a nice idea, but it has some costs too (in language complexity, for
example). But I need to use such things in practice,
Sean Kelly wrote:
void sendmsg(T)( Pid pid, T val );
final void recvmsg(T...)( Pid pid, T ops );
Pid spawn(T)( T fun );
spawn() is pretty limited so far in that it only spawns threads--I'd
expect that function to end up with multiple overloads at some point.
Interesting. Future spawn()
MIURA Masahiro wrote:
Sean Kelly wrote:
void sendmsg(T)( Pid pid, T val );
final void recvmsg(T...)( Pid pid, T ops );
Pid spawn(T)( T fun );
spawn() is pretty limited so far in that it only spawns threads--I'd
expect that function to end up with multiple overloads at some point.
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