[tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Reaction to Italo Vignoli on 3 Jan 10:28 A few reasons to leave writing to OOXML disabled: 1) Nowhere I read a valuable argument to enable writing OOXML, just than adding a feature. (If an option isn't usefull leave it!) 2) Writing in another than native (so ODF) format will give losses. This wi

Re: RE : Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Hello Charles, 2011/1/4 Charles-H. Schulz : > Jesper, > We are not interested in OOXML, a standard that became one only after a > campaign of deception and unacceptable pressures driven by Microsoft.  We > are interested in ODF, an open standard developed by many players including > Microsoft. > >

RE : Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Jesper, We are not interested in OOXML, a standard that became one only after a campaign of deception and unacceptable pressures driven by Microsoft. We are interested in ODF, an open standard developed by many players including Microsoft. We are only offering convenience to our users by letting

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Hello Charles (et al), 2011/1/3 Charles-H. Schulz : > Barbara, > > Le Mon, 03 Jan 2011 10:55:21 -0600, > Barbara Duprey a écrit : > >> On 1/3/2011 3:06 AM, Davide Dozza wrote: >> > Il 02/01/2011 20:41, Charles-H. Schulz ha scritto: >> > [...] > Well, the problem is that it's not that documented.

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

- Original Message > From: Barbara Duprey > On 1/3/2011 11:19 AM, Charles-H. Schulz wrote: > > Barbara, > > > > Le Mon, 03 Jan 2011 10:55:21 -0600, > > Barbara Duprey a écrit : > > > >> On 1/3/2011 3:06 AM, Davide Dozza wrote: > >>> Il 02/01/2011 20:41, Charles-H. Schulz ha scritto:

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/3/2011 11:19 AM, Charles-H. Schulz wrote: Barbara, Le Mon, 03 Jan 2011 10:55:21 -0600, Barbara Duprey a écrit : On 1/3/2011 3:06 AM, Davide Dozza wrote: Il 02/01/2011 20:41, Charles-H. Schulz ha scritto: [...] inconsistencies. However, it's fortunately or unfortunately, should not be

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Hello Johannes, Johannes A. Bodwing wrote (03-01-11 20:31) Hi Cor, ... Or is there a system to save proposals for a later check under new conditions. Not that I am aware of. Eventually it could be helfpul to have a list of such ideas in a common place (TDF or LO) with marks like: later o

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Hi Cor, ... Or is there a system to save proposals for a later check under new conditions. Not that I am aware of. Eventually it could be helfpul to have a list of such ideas in a common place (TDF or LO) with marks like: later on - not practicable - and so on and with short reasons. Bec

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Hi Johannes, Johannes A. Bodwing wrote (03-01-11 18:09) Hi Italo, On 1/3/11 8:43 AM, Johannes A. Bodwing wrote: What's the background (for ESC) to decide what leads to the best software for users? I apologize for repeating myself, but the ESC will decide upon positive contributions, sugges

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Hi Italo, On 1/3/11 8:43 AM, Johannes A. Bodwing wrote: What's the background (for ESC) to decide what leads to the best software for users? I apologize for repeating myself, but the ESC will decide upon positive contributions, suggestions or requests. You suggest a feature, promote a techn

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Barbara, Le Mon, 03 Jan 2011 10:55:21 -0600, Barbara Duprey a écrit : > On 1/3/2011 3:06 AM, Davide Dozza wrote: > > Il 02/01/2011 20:41, Charles-H. Schulz ha scritto: > > [...] > > > >> inconsistencies. However, it's fortunately or unfortunately, > >> should not be a problem: OOo& LibO impleme

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/3/2011 10:26 AM, Italo Vignoli wrote: On 1/3/11 3:40 PM, Barbara Duprey wrote: Unfortunately, this means that most user-created documents going to those with more recent versions of Office will be handled by the MS ODF, which is especially unfortunate for spreadsheets. If we get a complain

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/3/2011 3:06 AM, Davide Dozza wrote: Il 02/01/2011 20:41, Charles-H. Schulz ha scritto: [...] inconsistencies. However, it's fortunately or unfortunately, should not be a problem: OOo& LibO implement the existing and used version of MS *proprietary formats* used in MS Office 2007 and 2010

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/3/2011 4:55 AM, Zaphod Feeblejocks wrote: It may be that without explicity aiming to remove users from our sister, OOo, aiming to take the other 20% who do not use MSO 07 (plus those who do!) may be a more effective way to spread the file format. If we can get ODT used enough - through u

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/3/11 3:40 PM, Barbara Duprey wrote: Unfortunately, this means that most user-created documents going to those with more recent versions of Office will be handled by the MS ODF, which is especially unfortunate for spreadsheets. If we get a complaint about compatibility, we can (as usual) rec

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/3/11 8:43 AM, Johannes A. Bodwing wrote: What's the background (for ESC) to decide what leads to the best software for users? I apologize for repeating myself, but the ESC will decide upon positive contributions, suggestions or requests. You suggest a feature, promote a technology, cont

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/2/2011 6:34 PM, Italo Vignoli wrote: On 1/3/11 1:12 AM, Barbara Duprey wrote: I was under the impression that the vanilla versions of Office since 2007 SP2 could read and write ODF formats, with no need to install any plugins (but with their own special twist on ODF). From what you say her

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 02/01/2011 18:29, Charles Marcus wrote: > On 2011-01-02 12:07 PM, Mark Preston wrote: >> Please remember that both LibO and OpenO can already *read* the >> formats and the issue is whether or not it is practical or pragmatic >> to put effort into developing something to *write* the OOXML form. >

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

I actually agree wholeheartedly with Italo here - please do not try to hamstring the developers with your (or our) own preferences! The idea of community discussion is to guide developers, not to instruct them to do the impractical or impossible and equally not to instruct them (for whatever reason

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

> On 03/01/11 04:10, Larry Gusaas wrote: > > Including the ability to write OOXML format is a political decision > > driven by the Novell and Microsoft marketing agreement. User experience? > > Ask that question of any user of older versions of Word after they > > receive a .docx document and are u

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

> perhaps strict OOXML) which should (eventually) become strict OOXML. Now > I assume nobody has an issue with strict OOXML (which is, as I It's not open, that's the problem. In the 4,000 page document that members of ISO somehow accepted, there's a lot of reference to proprietary stuff. See:

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/3/11 8:03 AM, Larry Gusaas wrote: So pointing out the Novell/Microsoft marketing agreement that led to the inclusion of writing to OOXML would not be a positive contribution? I will repeat the concept for the last time, as it looks like you have real problem in understanding it. It might

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Il 02/01/2011 20:41, Charles-H. Schulz ha scritto: [...] > inconsistencies. However, it's fortunately or unfortunately, should not be a > problem: OOo & LibO implement the existing and used version of MS > *proprietary formats* used in MS Office 2007 and 2010 that are called OOXML. > They're not e

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Hello Johannes 2011/1/3 Johannes A. Bodwing > Hi, > >> ... >> >> >> But ultimately someone or some group has to make the final decision >> about what is and is not going to be included. In the case of TDF, it >> is the ESC. The people in that group have the authority to make a >> final decisio

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Hi, ... But ultimately someone or some group has to make the final decision about what is and is not going to be included. In the case of TDF, it is the ESC. The people in that group have the authority to make a final decision. ... OK for that. Where can I find the criteria for this decisions

[tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 2011/01/02 4:15 PM Italo Vignoli wrote: Emails where people say that LibreOffice should not support a document format because it is backed by Microsoft or because is a Go-OO heritage are not a positive contribution. So pointing out the Novell/Microsoft marketing agreement that led to the

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 3/1/2011 11:10, Larry Gusaas wrote: ... Ask that question of any user of older versions of Word after they receive a .docx document and are unable to open it. ... Larry The older versions of MSO can open and write docx by downloading a compatibility pack from MS. This pack has been contin

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 03/01/11 04:10, Larry Gusaas wrote: > Yes it is a statement of fact. A perfect example of the condescension > shown towards anyone who is not a programmer. I see from this statement that I'm not going to be able reason with you, but I'll give it a go anyway. ;) On 03/01/11 04:10, Larry Gusaas

[tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 2011/01/02 9:42 PM Lee Hyde wrote: On 03/01/11 03:17, Larry Gusaas wrote: That is pure condescension. He is saying that because I do not write code my opinion is worthless and nobody will listen to me. That is hardly condescension, merely a statement of fact. Yes it is a statement of fact

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 03/01/11 03:17, Larry Gusaas wrote: > That is pure condescension. He is saying that because I do not write > code my opinion is worthless and nobody will listen to me. That is hardly condescension, merely a statement of fact. The reality is, that if you or I want a greater say on matters such a

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On Sun, Jan 2, 2011 at 10:17 PM, Larry Gusaas wrote: > > On 2011/01/02 8:51 PM  Lee Hyde wrote: >> >> I haven't >> read anything from Italo that could be construed as condescension. > > Italo wrote: > >   "If you want to have a say in software development you are welcome to > contribute to the >  

[tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 2011/01/02 8:51 PM Lee Hyde wrote: I haven't read anything from Italo that could be construed as condescension. Italo wrote: "If you want to have a say in software development you are welcome to contribute to the code and you will soon be able to talk to the ESC, or maybe become a

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 03/01/11 02:00, Larry Gusaas wrote: > And the condescending comment that led to my response sure wasn't very > positive. I have no patience with people who say you have to "contribute > to the code" in order to have a say in the project. Or that you should > "contribute code yourself" if you wan

[tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 2011/01/02 7:35 PM Bernhard Dippold wrote: You can take your elitist developer attitude and stuff it. Pleas stop such comments, they don't lead to any positive result. And the condescending comment that led to my response sure wasn't very positive. I have no patience with people who sa

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Hi Larry, all, Larry Gusaas schrieb: On 2011/01/02 12:47 PM Italo Vignoli wrote: If you want to have a say in software development you are welcome to contribute to the code As I know Italo (not being a programmer himself) quite well, I know that his reply could have been easier for you to u

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/3/11 1:12 AM, Barbara Duprey wrote: I was under the impression that the vanilla versions of Office since 2007 SP2 could read and write ODF formats, with no need to install any plugins (but with their own special twist on ODF). From what you say here, that is not true; I haven't installed Of

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/2/2011 4:56 PM, Bruno Girin wrote: On 2 January 2011 17:19, Barbara Duprey wrote: On 1/2/2011 2:29 PM, Italo Vignoli wrote: On 1/2/11 8:15 PM, Barbara Duprey wrote: [snip] It would be good to know which works better for interoperability when sent to an MS-only shop -- ODF or the curren

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 2 January 2011 17:19, Barbara Duprey wrote: > On 1/2/2011 2:29 PM, Italo Vignoli wrote: >> >> On 1/2/11 8:15 PM, Barbara Duprey wrote: >> [snip] > > It would be good to know which works better for interoperability when sent > to an MS-only shop -- ODF or the current OOXML. In other words, is th

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 02/01/2011 19:09, Larry Gusaas wrote: On 2011/01/02 12:47 PM Italo Vignoli wrote: If you want to have a say in software development you are welcome to contribute to the code So only people who write code have a say in the development of LibreOffice? What about people who do the QA? Or the

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/2/2011 2:29 PM, Italo Vignoli wrote: On 1/2/11 8:15 PM, Barbara Duprey wrote: Italo, one of the things that would make me (and maybe others here) feel better about OOXML support is if writing to the XP formats causes LibO to make compromises that do not have to be made going to OOXML. That

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

HI Em 02-01-2011 15:48, Larry Gusaas escreveu: On 2011/01/02 11:24 AM Italo Vignoli wrote: On 1/2/11 6:20 PM, Craig A. Eddy wrote: (snip) LibreOffice should not write OOXML. That is under discussion in this thread. Who gave you the right to say it is not under discussion? Isn't this a co

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/2/11 8:15 PM, Barbara Duprey wrote: Italo, one of the things that would make me (and maybe others here) feel better about OOXML support is if writing to the XP formats causes LibO to make compromises that do not have to be made going to OOXML. That is, if documents developed under an ODF ap

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Larry Gusaas wrote (02-01-11 20:09) On 2011/01/02 12:47 PM Italo Vignoli wrote: If you want to have a say in software development you are welcome to contribute to the code So only people who write code have a say in the development of LibreOffice? What about people who do the QA? Or the people

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Hello everyone, 2011/1/2 M. Fioretti > On Sun, Jan 02, 2011 19:58:41 PM +0100, Italo Vignoli > (italo.vign...@gmail.com) wrote: > > > OOXML has been cleared from copyright and patent issues by Microsoft > > itself before entering into the standardization process, as this is > > a pre-condition

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On Sun, Jan 02, 2011 19:58:41 PM +0100, Italo Vignoli (italo.vign...@gmail.com) wrote: > OOXML has been cleared from copyright and patent issues by Microsoft > itself before entering into the standardization process, as this is > a pre-condition of ISO standards. In addition, all Microsoft > docum

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 02/01/11 19:01, Larry Gusaas wrote: > No. What is included is a community decision, not just the developers. My interpretation is that *The Document Foundation* and *LibreOffice* projects are driven more by informal consensus rather than democracy per se. That is to say that the various steerin

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/2/2011 12:47 PM, Italo Vignoli wrote: On 1/2/11 7:15 PM, Larry Gusaas wrote: No, that was not the point. Italo Vignoli wrote: "LibreOffice writes OOXML and will write OOXML, and this is not under discussion." That is the point I objected to. I might have been too harsh, but I reiterate t

[tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 2011/01/02 12:49 PM Charles Marcus wrote: No, the discussion is long over because the decision was made long ago. Where? When? Who made it? By Go-OO and Novell? Obviously, some people think it should, others think it shouldn't, and there is nothing wrong with that. Thankfully, just becau

[tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 2011/01/02 12:47 PM Italo Vignoli wrote: If you want to have a say in software development you are welcome to contribute to the code So only people who write code have a say in the development of LibreOffice? What about people who do the QA? Or the people providing support? (I mainly prov

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 02/01/11 18:49, Craig A. Eddy wrote: > I'm trying to get you to understand that there are copyright and patent > issues here that could embroil LO in legal battles that it really > doesn't need. Just out of curiosity, were Microsoft to enforce their copyright over their version of OOXML, is it

[tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 2011/01/02 12:29 PM Robert Parker wrote: On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 1:15 AM, Larry Gusaas wrote: It is a community decision, not a developer decision. The developers, that is the people doing the work, will decide what LO does and does not do. I'm sure those good hard working folk will take

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/2/2011 12:01 PM, Craig A. Eddy wrote: On 01/02/2011 10:46 AM, Lee Hyde wrote: SNIP My understanding is that Microsoft intends to implement strict OOXML gradually, with each successive release of Microsoft Office using an increasingly 'strict' form of transitional OOXML. Assuming t

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/2/11 7:49 PM, Craig A. Eddy wrote: Does it? And to what degree of compatibility? Also, this was code that was brought in from GO-OO which, as you may be aware, was developed by Novell UNDER CONTRACT TO MS. No, I'm not hollering FLOSS, here. I'm trying to get you to understand that there

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 2 January 2011 10:50, James Wilde wrote: > Is anyone else getting the impression that this thread is polarising into US > v rest of world? > > We've seen several people say that they have to accept what their customers > provide and can't go back to the customer and say "can you provide this

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On Fri, Dec 31, 2010 13:39:19 PM +0100, yahoo-pier_andreit (pier_andr...@yahoo.it) wrote: > Il 31/12/2010 11:32, M. Fioretti ha scritto: > >> 1. It is arrogant to return a document in a format different to > >> that which was sent to you. > > > > arrogant my foot. If somebody smokes in my face i

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 01/02/2011 11:35 AM, Charles Marcus wrote: > On 2011-01-02 12:20 PM, Craig A. Eddy wrote: >> I don't think LO could implement the writing of OOXML in ANY format that >> would be compatible to MS. And to try to do so would simply imply that >> LO was broken (in MS's words, anyway). > > What a

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 2011-01-02 12:48 PM, Larry Gusaas wrote: > On 2011/01/02 11:24 AM Italo Vignoli wrote: >> On 1/2/11 6:20 PM, Craig A. Eddy wrote: >>> Nope, writing back as doc is good enough at this point. >> Definitely not. LibreOffice writes OOXML and will write OOXML, and >> this is not under discussion. O

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/2/11 7:15 PM, Larry Gusaas wrote: No, that was not the point. Italo Vignoli wrote: "LibreOffice writes OOXML and will write OOXML, and this is not under discussion." That is the point I objected to. I might have been too harsh, but I reiterate the fact that this is not under discussion.

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On Fri, Dec 31, 2010 11:35:24 AM +, Gordon Burgess-Parker (gbpli...@gmail.com) wrote: > On 31/12/10 10:32, M. Fioretti wrote: > > > >wrong. Mine (mutt) doesn't for example, > > Then I would plonk you immediately. How do you not see that that is > TOTALLY ARROGANT? Uh??? In that part of your

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 2011-01-02 12:20 PM, Craig A. Eddy wrote: > I don't think LO could implement the writing of OOXML in ANY format that > would be compatible to MS. And to try to do so would simply imply that > LO was broken (in MS's words, anyway). What are you talking about? As has been pointed out numerous ti

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 1:15 AM, Larry Gusaas wrote: > > > It is a community decision, not a developer decision. The developers, that is the people doing the work, will decide what LO does and does not do. I'm sure those good hard working folk will take into account discussions here and no doubt e

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 2011-01-02 12:07 PM, Mark Preston wrote: > Please remember that both LibO and OpenO can already *read* the > formats and the issue is whether or not it is practical or pragmatic > to put effort into developing something to *write* the OOXML form. Eh? It already can write them. Why go backwards?

[tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 2011/01/02 11:55 AM Robert Parker wrote: On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 12:48 AM, Larry Gusaas wrote: On 2011/01/02 11:24 AM Italo Vignoli wrote: On 1/2/11 6:20 PM, Craig A. Eddy wrote: Nope, writing back as doc is good enough at this point. Definitely not. LibreOffice writes OOXML and will

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 01/02/2011 10:46 AM, Lee Hyde wrote: > SNIP > > My understanding is that Microsoft intends to implement strict OOXML > gradually, with each successive release of Microsoft Office using an > increasingly 'strict' form of transitional OOXML. Assuming that I am > correct in this assump

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 12:48 AM, Larry Gusaas wrote: > > On 2011/01/02 11:24 AM  Italo Vignoli wrote: >> >> On 1/2/11 6:20 PM, Craig A. Eddy wrote: >> >>>  Nope, writing back as doc is good enough at this point. >> >> Definitely not. LibreOffice writes OOXML and will write OOXML, and this is >> no

[tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 2011/01/02 11:24 AM Italo Vignoli wrote: On 1/2/11 6:20 PM, Craig A. Eddy wrote: Nope, writing back as doc is good enough at this point. Definitely not. LibreOffice writes OOXML and will write OOXML, and this is not under discussion. Our developers have the right skills to decide abou

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 02/01/11 17:07, Mark Preston wrote: > Please remember that both LibO and OpenO can already *read* the > formats and the issue is whether or not it is practical or pragmatic > to put effort into developing something to *write* the OOXML form. My understanding is that Microsoft intends to impleme

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/2/11 6:20 PM, Craig A. Eddy wrote: Nope, writing back as doc is good enough at this point. Definitely not. LibreOffice writes OOXML and will write OOXML, and this is not under discussion. Our developers have the right skills to decide about the quality and the features of the filter.

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 01/02/2011 09:08 AM, Barbara Duprey wrote: --- SNIP --- > > Is that what you think it would be to implement the OOXML "Strict" > formats? I sure don't see it that way -- we would simply be supporting > an ISO standard, however it was arrived at. The fact that we could > possibly do it before

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Craig, Please remember that both LibO and OpenO can already *read* the formats and the issue is whether or not it is practical or pragmatic to put effort into developing something to *write* the OOXML form. On 02/01/2011 00:50, Craig A. Eddy wrote: > Barbara, > > First, ODF IS the ISO standard -

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

I agree with your premises. Having been a CAD operator who, at times, had to send drawing files to others, I felt it was MY responsibility to find out what the other person could read, or at least provide him/her with a way to contact me if there were problems opening the file. This carried over

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/1/2011 7:53 PM, Italo Vignoli wrote: On 01/01/2011 11:29 PM, Barbara Duprey wrote: Several of the comments here suggest a middle road, allowing the save but with a message clarifying the limitations of the format (and perhaps recommending use of the XP formats if interoperating with an MS-

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/1/2011 6:50 PM, Craig A. Eddy wrote: Barbara, First, ODF IS the ISO standard - honestly made so without the dirty tricks that MS used to stuff the committee and force it to approve something that wasn't ready to be used by anyone. I recognize that, of course. But like it or not (and I'm d

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

IMO, to put the write part on an external extension is a good idea. There are other extensions for import export (like OpenOffice.org2GoogleDocs that gives export capabilities to GoogleDocs, Zoho and WebDAV) I still think that there are too many thing on "save as" dialogue that should go on "export

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/2/11 4:50 PM, James Wilde wrote: LibO comes with support to read docx (which it converts to ODT), but not to write it. When someone tries to write it, a notice comes up saying in effect that docx is a broken format which even MS doesn't think much of, and that LibO, in the interests of

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Is anyone else getting the impression that this thread is polarising into US v rest of world? We've seen several people say that they have to accept what their customers provide and can't go back to the customer and say "can you provide this in another format?". To me that's an attitude whic

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Þann sun 2.jan 2011 10:03, skrifaði Olivier Hallot: Hi Em 01-01-2011 18:58, Sveinn í Felli escreveu: Þann lau 1.jan 2011 19:57, skrifaði NoOp: On 12/31/2010 02:18 AM, Sveinn í Felli wrote: (snip) I'm more interested in something like the mso2ooo:

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

> Supporting OOXML Strict today would make LO not compatible with MS > Office, and users do want interoperability and not just standard compliance. > Anyone remember Netscape? It supported the W3C standards, Internet Explorer did not. But, MS, through Frontpage etc., flooded the market with

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Hi Em 01-01-2011 18:58, Sveinn í Felli escreveu: Þann lau 1.jan 2011 19:57, skrifaði NoOp: On 12/31/2010 02:18 AM, Sveinn í Felli wrote: (snip) I'm more interested in something like the mso2ooo:

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 01/01/2011 11:29 PM, Barbara Duprey wrote: Several of the comments here suggest a middle road, allowing the save but with a message clarifying the limitations of the format (and perhaps recommending use of the XP formats if interoperating with an MS-only shop; their ODF support is not truly i

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Barbara, First, ODF IS the ISO standard - honestly made so without the dirty tricks that MS used to stuff the committee and force it to approve something that wasn't ready to be used by anyone. Second, MS refuses to support any ODF except the one that is actually an ISO standard. That makes thei

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

OOo and LibO already do read those formats -- it's only the capability to write them that's an issue. The Go-OO version and its derivatives, and as a consequence now LibO, write them, and objecting to that is what started this whole (enormous) thread. The standard as written already deprecates t

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Larry Gusaas wrote: > >They will instead see an 'office suite' that > >doesn't support the formats they have and will go "Well thats USELESS" and > >delete it from their system and install an office suite which DOES have > >support, > > MS Office still can read and write to .doc format. LibO abili

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Well, we need to be able to import those transitional OOXML (2007-2010) formats. If we can save to them, is not really necessary, (since MS office suites 2007 & 2010 support MS-Office 2003 FF too), but is a nice to have feature. The real ISO OOXML will be implemented by MS first on MS Office 2014.

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On Sat Jan 01 2011 10:27:02 GMT-0800 (PST) Ian Lynch wrote: Another consideration is that if we ignore docx until MS do drop .doc which is long term inevitable, we could end up playing catch up in order to get filter that are good enough to be credible. Better to start now and incrementally

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 1/1/2011 11:07 AM, Zaphod Feeblejocks wrote: Hi Sveinn, Sure, but how about conservation and readability by future generations (when there's no more Microsoft knowledge around and nobody knows anymore how to decrypt all the nuances of.doc + .docx files) ? Fair point. But: most users do not

[tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 01/01/2011 12:58 PM, Sveinn í Felli wrote: > Þann lau 1.jan 2011 19:57, skrifaði NoOp: >> On 12/31/2010 02:18 AM, Sveinn í Felli wrote: >>> But I think that in a corporate context, a batch program for converting >>> .doc and .docx to ODF would get some support and would/could ease the >>> conve

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Þann lau 1.jan 2011 19:57, skrifaði NoOp: On 12/31/2010 02:18 AM, Sveinn í Felli wrote: But I think that in a corporate context, a batch program for converting .doc and .docx to ODF would get some support and would/could ease the conversion. After all those years, there's a pile of .docs sittin

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

> > > Office on-the-web only saves in docx. Office 2013/4 will quite possibly > drop .doc export, > just as Word 6/95 export was dropped from Word 2003 - after a failed > attempt to drop it > from 2000. MS can do this because they are the market leader. To fail to > offer even > rudimentary docx

[tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 12/31/2010 02:18 AM, Sveinn í Felli wrote: > But I think that in a corporate context, a batch program for converting > .doc and .docx to ODF would get some support and would/could ease the > conversion. After all those years, there's a pile of .docs sitting on > most PCs in this world. And ha

[tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 12/31/2010 08:14 AM, Steven Shelton wrote: > > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- > Hash: SHA1 > > On 12/31/2010 10:03 AM, Kevin André wrote: >> I would suggest the following instead. Support OOXML completely, >> but when the user saves his/her document in a proprietary format >> display a co

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

LibOffice on the web would be able to export in almost any format. We are often saying "ms doesn't play well with others, and one of the benefits of open source and open standards DO play well with others" , so let's commit to playing well with others. Wolf Halton PS happy new year. On Jan 1, 201

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On 2011-01-01 12:07 PM, Zaphod Feeblejocks wrote: > Office 2013/4 will quite possibly drop .doc export, just as Word > 6/95 export was dropped from Word 2003 - after a failed attempt to > drop it from 2000. MS can do this because they are the market leader. > To fail to offer even rudimentary docx

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Hi Sveinn, > Sure, but how about conservation and readability by future generations > (when there's no more Microsoft knowledge around and nobody knows > anymore how to decrypt all the nuances of.doc + .docx files) ? Fair point. But: most users do not care. Not exporting to Word will make it

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On Fri, Dec 31, 2010 at 10:51:48AM +, Ian Lynch wrote: > School systems don't teach word processing, they teach MS Word. > It's why we need better education and a certification programme for users > that covers stuff like file formats and the principles of WP not just one > product. What's rea

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Sorry to get into the discussion, but what are your goals, to be arrogant, or not? Or to make ODF the defacto standard which saddly is still NOT? The important thing is to fulfill the needs from potential users, specially in the enterprise. *e.g. *E-mail composers in the enterprise usually support

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On Fri, Dec 31, 2010 at 11:35:24AM +, Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote: > On 31/12/10 10:32, M. Fioretti wrote: > > > >wrong. Mine (mutt) doesn't for example, > > Then I would plonk you immediately. How do you not see that that is > TOTALLY ARROGANT? > If I send you an email in plain text and you r

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On Fri, Dec 31, 2010 at 11:35:24AM +, Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote: > On 31/12/10 10:32, M. Fioretti wrote: > > > >wrong. Mine (mutt) doesn't for example, > > Then I would plonk you immediately. How do you not see that that is > TOTALLY ARROGANT? > If I send you an email in plain text and you r

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

On Fri, Dec 31, 2010 at 11:35:24AM +, Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote: > On 31/12/10 10:32, M. Fioretti wrote: > > > >wrong. Mine (mutt) doesn't for example, > > Then I would plonk you immediately. How do you not see that that is > TOTALLY ARROGANT? > If I send you an email in plain text and you r

Re: [tdf-discuss] Re: Do not support writing to OOXML format

Þann fös 31.des 2010 17:04, skrifaði Paul Gress: On 12/31/10 05:07 AM, Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote: On 30/12/10 20:41, Larry Gusaas wrote: On 2010/12/30 2:19 PM Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote: OOXML will spread anyway because MS Office 2007 and 2010 use this format by default. Nothing you can do

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