RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-20 Thread Bruce . Bannerman
IMO: Hi Randy, Ivan and Arnulf, I seem to have spawned another thread, moving away from my original post and Randy's excellent response. Sorry. I've renamed this thread accordingly. more below... [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 21/02/2008 02:38:13 AM: > Hi Ivan and Bruce, > > >I am curi

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-20 Thread Chris Holmes
- When you consider the complexities that Google must be facing with GE in trying to manage 256x256k tiles of imagery over the entire world, at multiple pyramid layers and with constant revision of imagery, you can soon see that a file based approach would lead to a major headache. He he, I

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-20 Thread Tyler Mitchell (OSGeo)
On 20-Feb-08, at 4:29 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - When you consider the complexities that Google must be facing with GE in trying to manage 256x256k tiles of imagery over the entire world, at multiple pyramid layers and with constant revision of imagery, you can soon see that a file base

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-21 Thread Bruce . Bannerman
IMO: Hi Tyler, Thanks for the reply. > Am I correct in believing that the two things people desire with > images in an RDB, is having an abstract 1) storage framework > (tables) and > 2) a common access language (SQL) for managing the > framework. You could have the most complex storag

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-21 Thread Arnulf Christl
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: IMO: Hi Tyler, Thanks for the reply. Am I correct in believing that the two things people desire with images in an RDB, is having an abstract 1) storage framework (tables) and 2) a common access language (SQL) for managing the framework. You could have the mo

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-21 Thread Paul Ramsey
All too often, the "benefits" touted for raster-in-database have nothing to do with the database, and everything to do with the data preparation tools that the vendor is including with their raster-in- database solution. To store rasters in a database, you need a set of tools that will (a)

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-21 Thread Bruce . Bannerman
IMO: Hi Paul, > All too often, the "benefits" touted for raster-in-database have > nothing to do with the database, and everything to do with the data > preparation tools that the vendor is including with their raster-in- > database solution. > > To store rasters in a database, you need a s

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-21 Thread Bruce . Bannerman
IMO: Thanks for the reply Arnulf. > > I tell > her that she has been brain washed by certain creative minds who > "sell things" (instead of develop software) into thinking that files > based systems are stone age. She hates me for it and curses her > vendors at the same time now... There a

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-21 Thread Paul Ramsey
On Feb 21, 2008, at 4:19 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What it comes down to is what is appropriate for your use case. Indeed! However, there seem to be vanishingly few use cases for which raster-in-database is actually the more appropriate solution. (BTW, point-in-time recovery, a nice ex

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-21 Thread Tim Bowden
On Thu, 2008-02-21 at 16:24 -0800, Paul Ramsey wrote: > On Feb 21, 2008, at 4:19 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > > What it comes down to is what is appropriate for your use case. > > Indeed! However, there seem to be vanishingly few use cases for which > raster-in-database is actually the mo

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-21 Thread Bruce . Bannerman
IMO: Paul, > > On Feb 21, 2008, at 4:19 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > > What it comes down to is what is appropriate for your use case. > > Indeed! However, there seem to be vanishingly few use cases for which > raster-in-database is actually the more appropriate solution. > ;-) I beg

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-21 Thread Bruce . Bannerman
IMO: Tim, Would you like to expand on this? Bruce > > Completely off the wall thought, but what about using git? > > Tim Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reprodu

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-21 Thread Tim Bowden
Bruce, Note: I've never tried this, and I'm making it up as I go. Others more informed than me may well kill the idea (Paul?). Use a file based approach to managing your image data, and back up to git. That way you can recover to any point. New files are put on the file system and pushed into g

RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-21 Thread Bruce . Bannerman
IMO: Thanks for the comments Randy, I'll follow up later on some of the details. > > “What approaches are people using with large Lidar datasets?” > > Beyond that I would like to see at least some lidar sets treated > like the JPL srtm which is made accessible via WMS with pixel coded > el

RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-21 Thread Randy George
21, 2008 6:25 PM To: OSGeo Discussions Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing') IMO: Paul, > > On Feb 21, 2008, at 4:19 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > > What it comes down to is what is appropriate for

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-21 Thread Paul Ramsey
Bruce, I am not taking issue with database management of vector data sets, but with the stuffing of raster data into databases. I still have not heard a compelling use case for raster in the database. 12 million records is teensy. Stuff it into PostGIS. It's the billion- point LIDAR sets t

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-21 Thread Bruce . Bannerman
IMO > > 12 million records is teensy. Stuff it into PostGIS. It's the billion- > point LIDAR sets that leave me queasy, but I can't begin to think of a > reasonable architecture for that without learning more about how the > points are actually USED, which I really am not clear on at the momen

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-22 Thread Arnulf Christl
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: IMO: [...] I am probably too vector oriented to understand the problems involved here but my experience is that there should be no issue if you have your services configured all right. I don't agree. But then my requirements are for spatial data that covers a la

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-22 Thread Arnulf Christl
day, February 21, 2008 6:25 PM To: OSGeo Discussions Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing') IMO: Paul, On Feb 21, 2008, at 4:19 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What it comes down to is what is appropriate for your use case. Ind

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')

2008-02-22 Thread Tim Bowden
On Fri, 2008-02-22 at 10:49 +0900, Tim Bowden wrote: > Bruce, > Note: I've never tried this, and I'm making it up as I go. Others more > informed than me may well kill the idea (Paul?). Ok, kill this one. Tried it and it doesn't work. Tim ___ Discus