eing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | It is a folly to expect men to do
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | all that they may reasonably be
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee | expected to do.--Archbishop Whately
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but never been
motivated to work out the details as you have.
What I can't tell is if the best way to do that would be to add new
attributes: @type, @autostart, @classid or to add a more general
mechanism.
(I suppose we could allow html:param inside audiodata and
videodata...)
pass it along!
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | Part of thinking is its cruelty,
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | aside from its contents. It is the
Chair, DocBook T
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | Nothing is worth more than this
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | day.-- Goethe
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee |
pgpMVcoJftBrH.pgp
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and start
a new list?
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | The voice of the intellect is a
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | soft one, but it does not rest
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee | until it h
with enough work,
maybe one can be constructed. I'll give it some thought.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | No victor believes in chance.--
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | Nietzsche
Chair, DocBook Te
One more reason why y'all ought to be
pressuring your tool vendors for RELAX NG support!
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | There is always some accident in
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | the
that for poetry or other
prose-ish sorts of things that happen to need specific line breaks.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | Science is organized knowledge.
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | Wisdom is
bout an XML technology, there's almost guaranteed to be at
least two or three experts there.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | Wink at small faults; for thou has
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | gre
ook assembly.
>
> Larry and Norm discussed and settled the last issues.
>
> ACTION: Norm to post DocBook 5.1 beta to docbook.org with
> the latest changes.
Also on my list.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norma
nvey that
in any general sense.
> If
> it might be widely used, perhaps it should be under consideration as
> an additional attribute in a future version of DocBook.
Yes, that wouldn't be unreasonable for @rel.
Be seeing you,
the other, it's terribly
convenient.
I suppose a cleaner alternative would be to use PIs:
...
and
but it's not obvious to me that the extra complexity is worth the
marginal improvement in markup "purity".
What do you think?
Be
Norman Walsh writes:
> I'm not unwilling, I suppose, if there is strong sentiment in favor of
> something else.
Twenty minutes of poking about has convinced me that MediaWiki is a
viable alternative. (The principle concern is being able to limit
editing to "registered"
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | For the mental patient's family
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | and society, mental illness is a
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee | 'problem'; for the patient himself
course is to commit the English
figures and edit them appropriately.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | All generalizations are dangerous, even
http://nwalsh.com/| this one.--Alexandre Dumas
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the list item with no markup is this one:
The stylesheets are in the repository in /defguide5/en/stylesheets/
Hope that helps.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | If you understand: things a
version of the book now reflects the actual V5.0 schema.
If you find any leftover 5.1 bits, that's a bug.
The /tdg51/ version will continue to track the development of V5.1.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh
low in
* Fixed RFE 2964576 Fix the bug that allowed to appear inside
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | Time is a great teacher, but
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | unfortunat
ase let me know.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | If you are losing your leisure,
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | look out! You may be losing your
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee | soul.--Logan
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | You look wise. Pray correct that
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | error.--Charles Lamb
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee |
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Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | I am a sinner who does not expect
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | to be forgiven, but I am not a
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee | government official.--Wolcott
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r patience.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | On the other hand, you have
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | different fingers.
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee |
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gt; the last DocBook committee meeting. It's in the plans for it to be removed
> from the Schematron rules, too, right?
Yes.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | It does not do harm to the mys
Norman Walsh writes:
> Just FYI, I am aware of the problems on wiki.docbook.org. I don't know
> what caused them and I'm just as locked out as everyone else. We're
> several revisions of MoinMoin behind, so my guess is that upgrading is
> the shortest path to victory.
ase--the '"ubiquitous" inlines
> isn't mentioned in the same way.)
It didn't occur before because it wasn't possible to do this sort of
thing with DTDs.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman W
a long, winding path bordered by sharp brambles,
AFAICT.
Anyone want to argue for a change to some other Wiki platform before I
begin?
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | To what excesses will men not go
http:
upport?
What other requirements are there?
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | Wink at small faults; for thou has
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | great ones.--Thomas Fuller (II)
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee |
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Norman Walsh writes:
> My current thinking is that we should treat the inlines in groups. If
> you're going to allow some elements of a group, you might just as well
> allow all the elements.
[...]
> I think the natural proposal at this point is to say that we should
>
norm
P.S. I'm not sure that coref belongs in publishing inlines, but if I
was going to move it, I'd move it to the linking inlines which are
already part of the ubiquitious inlines, so it makes no difference to
the issue at hand.
[1]
https://sourceforg
in the long
run.
> 10. Add topic element (RFE #2820190).
We have a design, but we're leaving this open until we're a little
farther along.
> 11. Review of Requests for Enhancement
Postponed until next meetings.
> [1] http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/docbook-tc/200909
Listing all 20 common attributes on every page would be confusing, I
think, and it would really hide the "unique" attributes on those
elements that have them.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh
ry least, it's not very clear :-)
http://docbook.org/tdg5/en/html/ch05.html#ch05-classrole
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | Men are more like the times they live
http://nwalsh.com/|
e a backwards incompatible change in V6.0. Then, in V6.0, if it's
been at least six months since V5.1 was released, it can make that
change.
Be seeing you,
norm
[1] http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/docbook/2
.attlist,
+ db._text
+ }
+}
+
+# ==
+
+[
db:refname [ "surname" ]
db:refpurpose [ "A family name; in western cultures the last name" ]
]
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman
Norman Walsh writes:
> I took an action a while back to make a specific proposal for this RFE.
Today, the TC discussed this proposal.
> I think the most straightforward thing to do is to allow initializer
> to contain the db.markup.inlines:
>
> db.markup.inlines =
>db.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | It is a general error to imagine
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | the loudest complainers for the
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee | public to be the most anxious for
Norman Walsh writes:
> I just noticed that methodparam has @rep. Does this make any sense, or
> is it an editorial accident? I can't think of any languages for which
> it makes sense.
Ok, if no one can think of any reason, I'm going to assume it was an
perhaps).
Maybe, just maybe, the funny name has such important political and
psychological overtones that it's important to have it.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh | A hen is only an egg's way of
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | making another egg.--Samuel Butler
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee | (II)
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Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> In order to get DocBook V5.0 promulgated as an OASIS Standard, we need
> testimonials from three OASIS member organizations (not individuals)
> that say they're successfully using DocBook V5.0.
>
> If you can provide such a test
y way.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Life is a great bundle of little
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | things.--Oliver Wendell Holmes
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee |
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Description: PGP signature
t in which it is
used.
Comments?
Be seeing you,
norm
[1]
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1998852&group_id=21935&atid=384107
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> |
r
versions over time, so not upgrading becomes harder and harder.
But stagnating development isn't the answer either. It's just about
balance.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
update prior to a major release, you'd be stuck
| making a point release just to make the announcement.
That's a good point.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Throughout
organizations with
huge amounts of legacy DocBook content that don't move at internet
speed. It would be rude, to say the least, if we moved so fast that
they didn't have an opportunity to upgrade in an organized manner.
Be seeing you,
es in
processing expectations will need to be made.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | During the first period of a man's
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | life the greatest da
)
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Well-being is attained by little
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | and little, and nevertheless it is
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee | no little thi
yond what I was doing when I made the proposal.
| Sorry.
Nor at my customization layer apparently ;-)
Yes, I'm proposing that we do all of those cases in the same way.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <
/ "Richard Quadling" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> was heard to say:
| 2008/7/18 Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
|
|> I just noticed that methodparam has @rep. Does this make any sense, or
|> is it an editorial accident? I can't think of any languages for which
|> it ma
I just noticed that methodparam has @rep. Does this make any sense, or
is it an editorial accident? I can't think of any languages for which
it makes sense.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL P
tax and,
though it could be represented in XSD, our current method of
generating the XSD would not be able to cope. But I'm inclined to
think that we shouldn't feel constrained by the limitations of DTDs
and perhaps we need to build a better XSD in any event.
ackwards incompatible change in V6.0. Then, in V6.0, if it's been at
least six months since V5.1 was released, we can make the change.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | If you a
index in the
back of each individual volume just collects the local terms.
I think the combination of index and setindex is entirely sufficient.
I withdraw this RFE.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROT
Be seeing you,
norm
[1] http://www.w3.org/International/its/
[2] http://www.w3.org/International/
[3] http://www.w3.org/TR/2008/NOTE-xml-i18n-bp-20080213/#docbook-plus-its
[4] http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/docbook-comment/200805/msg0
sted.)
In my opinion, this comment must be addressed immediately and I will
endeavor to make sure that it is.
| sincerely, but in the meantime actively looking for an alternative to
| docbook,
Well, I do hope that we can react quickly enough to avoid that outcome :-)
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | We dance around in a ring and
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | suppose, but the Secret sits in
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee | the middle and knows.--Robert Frost
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ness?
None. Adjourned.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Everything should be made as
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | simple as possible, but no simpler.
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee |
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name or a given name? Surely what
matters is the cultural role that the name plays.)"
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | In the life of saints, technically
http://www.oasis-ope
nd every day.
(And sorry for the late notice; I blame my cold and too much work.
Thanks to Keith Fahlgren for the just-in-time reminder!)
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Oh wel
purely documentation so I'm not going
to generate another release for it.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Everything should be made as
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ |
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Everything should be made as
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | simple as possible, but no simpler.
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee |
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f all goes well, *this* will become the standard on 7 November. That
is if no one reports any bugs :-)
Weblog posts and an updated TDG (still) to follow...
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EM
g you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | A wonder is often expressed that
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | the greatest criminals look like
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee | other men. The rea
seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | A moment's insight is sometimes
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | worth a life's experience.--Oliver
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee | Wendell Holmes
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docbook";
So that's probably just a bug in the conversion script. Can you send
us the original ToC?
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | In every work of genius we
http://www.oasis
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | The Future is something which
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | everyone reaches at the rate of
Chair, DocBook Technical Committe
event, I don't think surname->lastname would be a step in
the right direction.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Extinction, n. The raw material
http://www.oasis-open.o
/ Camille Bégnis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> was heard to say:
| Hi,
|
| makes sense in French, wondering about other cultures...
I think one of the objections to 'firstname' and 'surname' is that
they're deeply anglo-centric.
I write my name "Norman Walsh"
Thoughts?
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | We cannot put off living until we
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | are ready. The most salient
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee | charac
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Everything the same; everything
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | distinct.
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee |
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I don't know when it went live, but it's live now.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-walsh-app-docbook-xml-00.txt
(We need an RFC in order to get a non-vendor media type.)
Be seeing you,
norm
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Everything should be made as
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | simple as possible, but no simpler.
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee |
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Description: PGP signature
w.oasis-open.org/docbook/
[3] http://docbook.org/xml/5.0CR5/
[4]
http://docbook.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/docbook/trunk/defguide5/en/src/ch05.xml?r1=7082&r2=7081&pathrev=7082
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman
DocBook Technical Committee Meeting Minutes: 23 May 2007
=
The DocBook Technical Committee met on Wednesday, 23 May 2007 at
05:00p EDT (02:00p PDT, 21:00GMT, 22:00BST, 23:00CEST, 06:00JST+,
02:30a India+).
Minutes
| 1. Roll call
Present
t to termdef so that inline glossaries have the same support.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Nothing can exceed the vanity of
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | our existence
soon)?
Uhm. I guess that would be ok with me.
Be seeing you,
norm
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | The sense of existence is the
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | greatest happiness.--Benjamin
Chair, DocBoo
ibute) value to identify OLinks
expressed using XLink attributes.
Share and enjoy.
Be seeing you,
norm
[1] http://docbook.org/xml/5.0CR3
[2] http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=21935&atid=384107
--
N
rns out that a MIME type in the
application tree has to be registered with an RFC. I've started to
draft it and I'll look up the rest of the submission process after the
next TC meeting.
Be seeing you,
enjoy.
Be seeing you,
norm
[1] http://docbook.org/specs/docbook-5.0CR2-spec-wd-01.html
[2] http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=21935&atid=384107
--
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Computer Science is
I'm working on a document so
that I don't have to go lookup the ID when I want to xref to it.
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Next to knowing when to seize an
h
itten for different audiences or security levels
or something.
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | All our foes are mortal.--Valéry
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ |
Chair, DocBook Te
d some other files besides "fulltext.sgm" and the other file with
| entity definitions that came in the zip?
Start with the XML version instead. You can get it from CVS at
sf.net/projects/docbook/
Be seeing you,
fficial (which is most
likely to occur at the next release) but I don't think it's going to
change in any dramatic way.
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Never interrup
t model defines in
the RELAX NG.
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | As the old hermit of Prague, that
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | never saw pen and ink, very
Chair, DocBook Technical Committe
| element logically belongs within the paragraph.
|
| *note*: i'm not saying that procedures *must* be children of
| paragraphs, obviously. only that, to be consistent with the
| other lists, it should have the option.
|
| rday
Be seeing you,
this week and I
plan to do some serious stylesheet hacking this weekend.
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | A man is not necessarily
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | intelligen
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | The average man, who does not know
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | what to do with his life, wants
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee | another one which will last
looks fine to me.
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | It does not do harm to the mystery
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | to know a little about it. For far
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee | more marve
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
/ Elliotte Rusty Harold <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> was heard to say:
| At 7:51 AM -0500 3/12/03, Norman Walsh wrote:
|
|>No. The base URI in both cases is: http://www.example.com/docs/
|>
|>The base URI is not the same as the "document UR
much introductory documentation, but the place to start is probably
the description of classsynopsis:
http://docbook.org/tdg/en/html/classsynopsis.html
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]&
orget what I said a moment ago :-)
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Life is pain...anyone who tells
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | you differently is selling
Chair, DocBook Technical Committe
works fine to change language file, but that doesn't work for toc.
That sounds like a bug. Uhm. Can you file a bug report?
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | A life, a
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | All our foes are mortal.--Valéry
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ |
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee |
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.0.6
norm
- --
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | The perfect man has no method; or
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | rather the best of methods, which
Chair, DocBook Technical Committee | is the method of
| no-method.--Shih-T'ao
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE---
And a longstanding action
item on me to investigate. The problem is that there many different,
conflicting notions about what a package is.
Examples of what you have in mind would be useful.
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman
ld be considered
| part of its enclosing paragraph. just curious.
I don't recall consciously deciding to exclude it. File an RFE, I guess.
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
it'd be now.
|
| Comments?
Switch to XML. If you avoid XML-only features, you get access to all
the XML tools this way and all the legacy SGML tools will still work
if you need them.
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman Walsh &
fits squarely in DocBook's problem domain. If
DocBook's not rich enough to document CLOS (or CLisp, or maybe I
misunderstand something), please tell us how and why.
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norm
iate/";>
and then things should work better.
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Reason's last step is the
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | recognition that there are an
Chair
What's the right
markup in this proposal for "Ctrl-Alt-Backspace" and "Alt-Shift-I"?
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | To the man who is afraid
http://www
t there's a constant tension between ease of markup and
granularity of information.
Be seeing you,
norm
- --
Norman Walsh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | You cannot step twice into the
http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/ | same riv
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